|| *Comments on the 2009 Ford 400:* View the most recent comment <#190> | Post a comment <#post> 1. Anonymous posted: 11.22.2009 - 8:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) So why was Hamlin penalized yesterday and not Stewart today? And I want a better reason than Keselowski is awesome!!!11 or Hamlin sucks!!!!1 Great job by JPM winning that battle. Pwned! 2. DaleSrFanForever posted: 11.22.2009 - 8:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) I don't like JPM, but I'm glad he didn't put up with Tony's shit. Tony really thinks he is the sheriff out there, so it was nice to see him taken down a few pegs. I just hope Diva Hamlin watches a replay of it. THAT is how you retaliate. (And yes I'm aware Diva won this race, his fourth of the year. HE now has as many career wins as teammate Kyle Busch had 2008. I never said he wasn't talented. Maybe now he'll say to himself "Hey, I have a real shot driving a JGR Toyota to win a CUP championship and stop JJ's streak, maybe I should focus solely on that and not get sidetracked by getting into fueds with up and comers in Nationwide races and should maybe avoid the Nationwide Series all together next year. But he won't, like Kyle didn't after 2008.) Dale Jr has a rocket ship for a race car but decides to run the extreme high line and ends up hitting the wall 4 or 5 times, has to have his team fix the tow, and ends up getting his tire cut in one of those back of the pack incidents. He really needs to take this summer to re-evaluate everything about himself if he truly wants to be great in NASCAR, which he has the driving talent to do. I wouldn't take it for granted that Rick won't fire him if he keeps this up. Does HMS really need his souvineir sales THAT bad? They already have a ton of $$$ coming in. His other three drivers finished 1-2-3 in the points. Brad K anyone? Nice job by RCR finishing out there season very strong. The first 2/3 of this season flat out sucked, but they didn't quit or mope (except Harvick) and came on strong at the end. That showed a lot of character. 3. Bronco posted: 11.22.2009 - 8:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Congrats to Jimmie Johnson on a well deserved championship, and to Denny Hamlin on his first "cookie cutter" win and a top 5 points finish. I look for big things out of the #11 team next year. This also puts an end to Ford's 5 straight wins at Homestead. I laughed when JPM came back onto the track put Tony in the wall. Tony should have never tried to pull up in front of JPM when he had a run off the corner, and shouldn't have slammed into him down the backstretch. Bill Elliott finishes 16th in what could be his final Cup start of his illustrious career, while Michael Waltrip's full time driving career comes to a close as well. Another heartbreak for Dale Jr. Qualified like crap, cracked the top 10 in 30 laps, scraped the wall, then lost the handle on the car and had another shitty race and finished 25th in points, behind AJ who just finished his first full season. I'm so glad 2009 is over for him and that he can relax and focus on coming out of the box strong at Daytona, like 2004 and 2008. I can't wait for Speedweeks 2010. Carl Edwards dominated this race last year, and was never a factor in this race and had to settle for 7th. Final race for the 07, 26, and 44 cars, and final race for Jack Daniels and the famous Dewalt-Kenseth sponsorship. Final ride for Jamie McMurray with Roush, and he once again outperforms the driver who Roush stupidly held on to. Reed Sorenson's final race for RPM ends with a strange pit road crash. 4. Mike posted: 11.22.2009 - 9:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Dale Jr has a rocket ship for a race car but decides to run the extreme high line and ends up hitting the wall 4 or 5 times, has to have his team fix the tow, and ends up getting his tire cut in one of those back of the pack incidents. He really needs to take this summer to re-evaluate everything about himself if he truly wants to be great in NASCAR, which he has the driving talent to do. I wouldn't take it for granted that Rick won't fire him if he keeps this up. Does HMS really need his souvineir sales THAT bad? They already have a ton of $$$ coming in. His other three drivers finished 1-2-3 in the points. Brad K anyone?" Jr's had a lot of bad luck this year but I agree he has no one to blame but himself for the 28th place finish he got today. I really believe if Jr doesn't pick it up next year Rick is gonna put Kasey Kahne in the 88 car, but I think Jr will win next year. Rick is gonna sit Jr down and get things straightened out because the cars are definitely getting better. Dale Jr had the car to beat today if he didn't hit the wall. As a fan it was a mixed season. Gordon had a consistent season and of course Dale had a miserable season.. so it was up and down. As far as the racing aspect goes it was a decent year, some good races and some bad races as there is every year. Looking forward to a great 2010 season, in which HOPEFULLY the 24 or 88 can win the championship. 5. Anonymous posted: 11.22.2009 - 9:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) What was Hamlin on with him, congratulating Micheal Waltrip on a legendary Career after the race? 6. DaleSrFanForever posted: 11.22.2009 - 9:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "What was Hamlin on with him, congratulating Micheal Waltrip on a legendary Career after the race?" I have no idea. I'm telling ya, something is up with him. He said something along the lines of not wanting to lap him to preserve his dignity. I got news for ya Diva: That ship sailed a LONG time ago. But then again this is the same guy who thinks he is a conquering hero for stepping down into the NWide Series and spinning out a NWide driver (who totally saved it, unlike Stewart). His rationale? The crowd cheered loudly. More news: Fans make a loud noise EVERYTIME ANYONE spins or crashes at a race. It isn't so much a cheer as just a loud noise you make when you see a wreck in person. I can't explain it, but I've been to over 30 Cup races from 1990 to present and it happens EVERY SINGLE TIME! 7. DaleJrFan18 posted: 11.22.2009 - 9:48 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) Grats to Johnson on his 2nd deserved championship 2009 happened...now lets never speak of it again... 8. Kit posted: 11.22.2009 - 10:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) I'm on JPM's side. He has a history of putting some real bonehead moves, but this time wasn't really his fault. Even if it were JPM's fault, Rick Hendrick's Puppet had no business retaliating the way he did by cutting down the #42's tire. RHP should have been penalized for that. JPM had every reason to spin RHP out later on. All JPM did was penalize RHP because NASCAR neglected to do so. JPM should not have been penalized. RHP just needs a good ass kicking. "I'm so glad 2009 is over for him and that he can relax and focus on coming out of the box strong at Daytona, like 2004 and 2008. I can't wait for Speedweeks 2010." You can no longer make any excuses for Dale Jr. His shit season has been predominantly a result of his shit driving and today was no different. He's turned into a joke, taking a decent Hendrick car and finishing anywhere from 25th to 30th in any given race. "Looking forward to a great 2010 season, in which HOPEFULLY the 24 or 88 can win the championship." Haha, what a pipe dream. The #24, maybe. The #88? Only if Kahne is in the car. "congratulating Michael Waltrip on a legendary Career" Legendarily sucked. 9. Anonymous posted: 11.22.2009 - 10:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kevin Harvick finally leads over 3,000 laps in his career. Denny Hamlin wins the first time at a Cookie Cutter track. Tony Stewart has the least amount of laps he leads in a season in his career so far. 10. CFob posted: 11.22.2009 - 10:40 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) How is Homestead a "cookie cutter"? It's a true oval, not a tri-oval like the actual cookie cutter tracks are. The only similarities is the fact that they're all 1.5 miles long. Congratulations to Denny Hamlin on winning a race he shouldn't have been allowed to compete in. The guy has a ton of talent, but I think Brad was right when saying Denny has issues On AND off the track, something wasn't quite right there during that interview. Jimmie Johnson's four-pete is an insane feat, and an amazing run for him. Just when you start to think a streak like that was impossible in this day and age, Jimmie proves us wrong. Love or hate him, he is in the history books. Juan Pablo Montoya's Brad Keselowski impression was awesome, treating Tony Stewart like his own personal Diva Hamlin. Speaking of Brad, nice to see things go well enough for him he is finally allowed to FINISH a Cup race in the 12. Once this team gets a chance to gel, I hope they're able to take that team back to the way it was when they could win 8 races a year (or finish top ten consistently). Brad has the talent to bring them back to Chase contention, probably by 2011. 11. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 11.22.2009 - 11:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If Brad doesn't perform well at Penske during the three years he will be there, it certainly won't be because of a lack of talent from the driver. Brad has shown he has plenty of that. Judging by these three races he has been with them, the #12 team hasn't exactly recovered their momentum from Newman's struggles his last couple of seasons and Stremme's pitiful performance this year. I definitely expect a top-20 points finish out of Brad next season, and maybe they can build even more from that momentum. 12. CFob posted: 11.22.2009 - 11:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm hoping RCRAndPenskeGuy. He's one of the drivers I watched get their start, and seeing him in the Cup Series makes all of us from around here proud. 13. Kit posted: 11.22.2009 - 11:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Just when you start to think a streak like that was impossible in this day and age" How? This is the Cha$e we are talking about. I like Brad, too. 14. Timmy Quivy posted: 11.23.2009 - 12:39 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Actually, not a bad race. I'm surprised what a rap H-Miami gets from some fans. The side-by-side racing here is about the best on the circuit and only late in the race did the leaders begin to pull away. Most of the race, first-third were within a second of each other. 15. Timmy Quivy posted: 11.23.2009 - 12:40 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Also, based on the way A.J. Allmendinger finished the year (two 10ths and a 13th), I'd say he might be a guy to watch for a Chase underdog in '10. 16. DaleJrFan18 posted: 11.23.2009 - 12:59 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "You can no longer make any excuses for Dale Jr. His shit season has been predominantly a result of his shit driving and today was no different. He's turned into a joke, taking a decent Hendrick car and finishing anywhere from 25th to 30th in any given race." I've been fairly quiet about your ranting on about Jr, but today I feel like you are wrong. Lets take a look at it. He started 32nd, and blasted his way into the top 10 in 25 laps and running laps faster than the leader. I recall during the time between coming back to a commercial break and the next break, Jr gained 3 seconds on the leaders. Yeah, that's not shit driving, thats EFFORT you ignorant f**k. Had he not blown a tire, he could have easilly finished in the top ten. Or did you not see the blown tire? That's a valid reason for his finish. Let's see you blow a tire, get your laps back and finish decently. Okay, now that I'm done with that, could somebody tell me what happened with the JPM incident. I turned the broadcast off around midway and came back for the final 20 laps. I mean, cutting tires and whatnot? 17. Kit posted: 11.23.2009 - 1:56 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) "I've been fairly quiet about your ranting on about Jr, but today I feel like you are wrong." You've been quiet all season long because I've been right about it. You finally piped up because the truth hurts. There is absolutely no way in hell that Hendrick is continuously fielding shit cars for Dale Jr. weekend in and out. He might not be getting the best quality stuff in the shop (which is only due to his lack of performance) but it's still a hell of a lot better than a 30th place car. Today he had a car he could have won with. Dale Jr. is not driving the cars to the finishes they are capable of. "Lets take a look at it. He started 32nd" WTF is he doing starting 32nd in a Hendrick car? His qualifying all season long has been shit. If he wants to minimize getting caught up in other people's crap, he needs to start in the front. His qualifying average is way, way lower than the rest of the Hendrick camp. I think the fact that he's been qualifying so poorly further reflects on the driver. "and blasted his way into the top 10" Did he finish there? No. Has he finished there a lot all season? Not at all. Michael freaking Waltrip can put together a better season than that. "Yeah, that's not shit driving, thats EFFORT you ignorant f**k." Oh, excuse me, Dale Jr has really put in some effort. That's why this entire season he's mimicked Michael Waltrip and Casey Mears rather than his own father. That's also why he caused a nine car wreck last week and TOOK HIMSELF out of contention for a win today in a car capable of doing so. That's why he kept missing his pit stall. That's also why after coming to Hendrick, a team second to none, and being pampered with new cars, new equipment, a new crew chief, and plenty of resources and money, he only has 12 top fives and 21 top 10s in 71 starts. Yeah, he's putting in 110% effort. He ought to just change his last name from Earnhardt to Mears if it'll help him relieve the pressure. "Had he not blown a tire, he could have easilly finished in the top ten" HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Okay, let's play this game. It sounds fun: "Had he not wrecked last weekend, he could have easily won." "Had he not missed his pit stall, he could have easily won." "Had 42 other cars wrecked and DNF, he could have easily won." HAHAHAHAHA "Or did you not see the blown tire? That's a valid reason for his finish. Let's see you blow a tire, get your laps back and finish decently." He drove the car INTO THE WALL, numbnuts. "Let's see you blow a tire, get your laps back and finish decently." Jimmie Johnson can do this and he's in a Hendrick car as well. 18. Kit posted: 11.23.2009 - 2:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I turned the broadcast off around midway and came back for the final 20 laps." Well, no wonder you were so clueless about Dale Jr. today. Before he had a flat tire, he smacked the wall several times, which totally threw off the handling of his car. There was little chance he would have finished in the top 10, regardless of the flat tire. 19. Brock Beard posted: 11.23.2009 - 2:13 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) BIG congratulations to Jimmie and Chad. Chase or no Chase, I've gotta admit I'm so impressed the 48 team was able to not only win that fourth-straight title, but do it in a season where Jeff Gordon, Mark Martin, Juan Pablo Montoya, and Tony Stewart (among others) all had such incredible seasons at the same time. --Brock, BSGN 20. SoxFan24 posted: 11.23.2009 - 2:27 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Congrats on Jeff Burton on winning the Ford 400 Now before people freak out I say this because Denny Hamlin should've not been in this race. If you'd seen my posts on the Ford 300 page you'll know why. Hamlin flat out said that he was going to take out Brad Keselowski and he did it. A suspension should have been in line for this if Harvick was suspended and Robby Gordon was suspended in past races. Hamlin didn't even get penalized for this. This leads me to today. Juan Pablo Montoya and Tony Stewart had an incident today. The two got together on the frontstretch. Montoya had a run on Stewart and didn't quite clear him to pass and got into the back of Stewart. Stewart of course didn't like this and proceeded to run him all the way almost into the grass (similar to what he did to Kenseth in the 2006 Daytona 500) cutting Montoya's tire. Montoya spent many laps in the garage area and came out and blatantly spun Stewart on the front stretch. What does NASCAR do? Penalize Montoya 2 laps. The penalty was probably justified but Hamlin did the SAME THING in the Nationwide race and nothing was done. Great run once again for Jeff Burton. A longer green flag run he would have been on Hamlin's back bumper but nevertheless what a great run for him to finish the season. All of RCR is getting better with Kevin Harvick finishing 3rd and Clint Bowyer finishing 11th after running in the top 10 most of the race. Richard Childress stated in an interview that late last year they built 30 new cars for 2009 and admitted that they werent' that good. They went back to work on building new ones, shuffled some people around and the difference is showing. Gotta give it to them. They could have given up or bitched about it (Harvick did a few times but thats to be expected) but they got better and the results are showing A couple of stats now that the season is over with Most wins: Jimmie Johnson: 7 Top 5's Jimmie Johnson & Jeff Gordon: 16 Poles Mark Martin: 7 Top 10's Jeff Gordon: 25 Laps Led: Jimmie Johnson: 2238 Most DNF's that weren't start and parks: Sam Hornish & Scott Speed: 8 Drivers that started every race: 31 Driver that started every race and didn't get a top 10: Paul Menard Drivers that started every race and didn't get a top 5: Casey Mears, David Ragan, Reed Sorenson, Paul Menard Milestones: Last race for Pat Tryson as Kurt Busch's crew chief as he moves to MWR with Martin Truex jr. Last race for Dewalt as a primary sponsor. Dewalt had been with Kenseth since 1998 in some capacity, won many races and the 2003 championship Possibly the last race for Kellogg's sponsoring the 5 car. They haven't re-signed yet for 2010 and has been with Hendrick since 1994 Last race for Jamie McMurray driving for Roush Fenway as he goes BACK to Earnhardt Ganassi Racing for 2010. McMurray drove for Ganassi from 2002-2005 Last race for Yates Racing as we know it. Team had been around since the 80's and has merged with Richard Petty Motorsports in 2010 Last race for Jack Daniels as a primary sponsor. Won a race with Clint Bowyer in 2007 Possibly the last race for Casey Mears driving for RCR and possibly the last race for the 07 team as they don't have sponsorship for 2010 First time in NASCAR history the driver that had the most wins the previous season failed to go to victory lane the next. Carl Edwards won 9 races in 2008 and none in 2009 Last race for Martin Truex Jr. driving the 1 car. Truex began his Cup career in this car, won a race in 2007 and made the chase the same year Possibly the last race for Hall of Fame Racing as they have no driver, no alliance or sponsor for 2010 Last race for Reed Sorenson driving for Richard Petty Motorsports Last race the 9 car driving a dodge. It had been since 2001 Last race for Michael Waltrip as a full time competitor in the Cup Series. He moves to part time starting in 2010 And I guess I should say this too. The last race that there wasn't a driver that hadn't won 4 straight Sprint Cups See you in Daytona! 21. Anonymous posted: 11.23.2009 - 2:34 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Most of Jr's poor finishes in the 2nd half of this season were of no fault of his own. Can you really blame Jr for over driving his car today trying to make something happen? Really??!! What did he have to lose? Today was just a hail mary attempt by him. 22. John Royal posted: 11.23.2009 - 2:41 am Rate this comment: (0) (1) Best team won. #48 gave opportunities for #24 and #5 to step up their game when #48 had issues, but these teams didn't do anything. Actually they sucked (when you need to win titles) all year long more or less (compared to #48). Other teams just sucked even more. I don't know how good or bad driver Johnson really is, but supposedly he is at least good enough. I'm not sad because Martin or Gordon didn't won it, they simply weren't good enough. JPM, Kurt Busch and Ambrose triumphs were nice to see this season. After thinking this thing for while, I am happy that Johnson won. It just showed how much these other fellows suck :D They have to be better. 23. CFob posted: 11.23.2009 - 3:19 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "How? This is the Cha$e we are talking about." I still never expected four straight to be possible. And still no one has answered my question as to how Homestead is a "cookie cutter" track... 24. Anonymous posted: 11.23.2009 - 3:27 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) The new Homestead really is a good stock car track (terrible for IndyCar though) and I'm not sure why some people don't like it. The problem with any track this wide and long is that the cars can get spread out really quickly. It's cookie cutter because it's another moderately banked 1.5 miler, though I think it's the best of the bunch. Its infield road course isn't bad compared to others either. Maybe that's what IndyCar should use instead of the full oval. 25. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 11.23.2009 - 4:17 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "All of RCR is getting better" Yeah, thanks to Jeff Burton and Clint Bowyer. Harvick just cried as usual about it. Remember his radio communication with RC at Michigan? I have no idea why Richard still wants him around, he complains and yet he hasn't done much. Jeff and Clint just plowed thru and got the best results they possibly could. If RCR runs better next season, I expect Burton and Bowyer to both win a race while Harvick goes winless again. As for Mears, I bet RC is glad to be rid of him. 26. Art D posted: 11.23.2009 - 5:33 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Excellent play, Jimmie Johnson deals four aces. Why does it seem like Kit has to quote every response from every race? 27. Nascarfan85 posted: 11.23.2009 - 8:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Who would have bet on AJ Allmendinger finishing above Jr. in the points standings? 28. RLewis9 posted: 11.23.2009 - 11:02 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Pat Tryson sure went out with a bang in his last race at Kurt Busch's crew chief. They may have won the race if it weren't for that terrible two tire call on the last pit stop with 50 to go. RCR looks a lot better than they have all year. Maybe they are ready to compete in 2010. 29. DaleJrFan18 posted: 11.23.2009 - 11:31 am Rate this comment: (0) (1) Okay, I spent 20 minutes on making a reply and the window froze up, so I'm going to simply reply to your statements with something you said: "Today he had a car he could have won with. Dale Jr. is not driving the cars to the finishes they are capable of." Stole the words out of my mouth. Thank you very much. And in fact, that statement alone can be used as a reply to some of your other answers as well. And yes, I saw Jr hit the wall a few times (during his surge) I actually turned the TV off shortly after he pitted for the blown tire because that was pretty much the only reason I was watching it (We already knew what was going to happen anyway) One last thing, why waste your time ragging on a driver? Nothing will come out of it. They won't hear your voice and say "Hmm, he's right. I suck ass, I guess I should quit..." I'm not saying that just for Jr, but for Waltrip and whoever else you rag on. And by the way: The truth really doesn't hurt, especially when it comes from the likes of you. The condescending attitude that radiates off of your comment actually makes me laugh. 30. DaleJrFan18 posted: 11.23.2009 - 11:34 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Can you really blame Jr for over driving his car today trying to make something happen? Really??!! What did he have to lose? Today was just a hail mary attempt by him." Also took the words out of my mouth. 31. CL46 posted: 11.23.2009 - 12:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) What an insane career Jimmie Johnson has had thus far. 8 years, 4 championships, and has never finished outside the top 5 in points. RCR seems to be picking up steam, but it's a shame how they were giving Casey Mears the shaft. Heck, even at Homestead, his race was an obvious after thought while none of the other cars were in the Chase, let alone had a shot at finishing 13th in points. " "We kind of got screwed, really," Mears said. "A crew guy on one of the other teams had a problem and they took [one of] ours. I lost five, six spots in the pits every time I came in and basically it determined our fate. We took a top-10 car and [didn't finish there]. You always like getting the opportunity. The bottom line is, all year long, every time I turned around, they changed something. And I had a chance to have a decent finish here and they took it again. I don't know what to say, to be honest." " And as far as Juan Montoya, he showed why I'm not a fan of him. He started it, Tony overreacted, and Juan overreacted again. True colors for cash. Back to missing the Chase next year for Juan. 32. CL46 posted: 11.23.2009 - 12:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Oh, I forgot to mention.. how about AJ Allmendinger? Surely those cars will be #9 Budweiser machines next season, but hopefully his good runs can continue and he can have a great 2010. Shame seeing Mark Martin finish 2nd again, but it just goes to show you that he's the man no matter what he's driving. I truly hope he gets a title before he actually steps away from the sport. 33. CL46 posted: 11.23.2009 - 1:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "WTF is he doing starting 32nd in a Hendrick car?" -Kit What was Denny Hamlin doing qualifying WORSE than Jr with a Gibbs car? Well, apparently about to win the race. Qualifying doesn't mean much. No need to nitpick. 34. Kit posted: 11.23.2009 - 1:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "What was Denny Hamlin doing qualifying WORSE than Jr with a Gibbs car? Well, apparently about to win the race. Qualifying doesn't mean much. No need to nitpick." Yes, Hamlin accomplished much more than Dale Jr. in lesser equipment. Thank you for backing up my point about Dale Jr. above. 35. Kit posted: 11.23.2009 - 1:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "And as far as Juan Montoya, he showed why I'm not a fan of him. He started it, Tony overreacted, and Juan overreacted again. True colors for cash. Back to missing the Chase next year for Juan." I'm not a fan of him either (obvious I know), but Juan did not overreact to Rick Hendrick's Puppet. RHP pretty much took Juan out of the race just because Juan bumped into him with no harm done. It's nice to see someone won't put up with RHP's shit. Juan might miss the cha$e next year but it won't be because RHP is banging on his car. 36. Kit posted: 11.23.2009 - 1:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Can you really blame Jr for over driving his car today trying to make something happen? Really??!! What did he have to lose?" Respect. If he's at the point where he's over driving his car because he's so desperate for a top 20 finish, maybe he should move back down to the Nationwide series until he gets his shit together. 37. Kit posted: 11.23.2009 - 1:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Most of Jr's poor finishes in the 2nd half of this season were of no fault of his own." He even qualified poorly this season AND he hung on to Eury Jr. for way too long. All the races he got wrecked out of, he probably would have at best finished 15th-20th for most of them. 38. Kit posted: 11.23.2009 - 1:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Okay, I spent 20 minutes on making a reply and the window froze up" That should be an indication that he sucks and you need to quit defending him so much. He sucks. His 2008 season wasn't even that great, either. "One last thing, why waste your time ragging on a driver? Nothing will come out of it." Okay, why don't you forward this to the webmaster then? In this case, he can shut down the web site and save money. Hell, I could flip that around, why waste your time supporting a driver who obviously doesn't give as much of a shit about racing as other drivers? "The condescending attitude that radiates off of your comment actually makes me laugh." Yeah, I'm really condescending because I expect the son of a seven-time champion to finish in the top 10 more than 21 times in 72 seasons with the best team in the sport. Excuse me all to hell. 39. Smokefan05 posted: 11.23.2009 - 2:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "And still no one has answered my question as to how Homestead is a "cookie cutter" track..." It's like the old atlanta, a true OVAL. Any D-oval looks the same, Homestead doesn't like Michigan, Cali, or Texas. 40. CL46 posted: 11.23.2009 - 2:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Really Kit? Gibbs is second-rate to Hendrick? Give me a break. I didn't back up your point at all. There are phenomenal drivers who qualify in the back all the time. Sometimes the trade-off of a great race setup is not going fast in qualifying. The 31 of Jeff Burton was probably the fastest car in the race, and he came from 26th. Qualifying doesn't really mean anything. Dale Jr raced a ton better than he qualified, like usual. I've never seen somebody have as unlucky as a season as he did. He'll do better next year. 41. DaleSrFanForever posted: 11.23.2009 - 2:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I see a downturn in competitiveness in SHR next year. You know Tony will stew about this all winter. It will mess up his mindset plus SHR slipped quite a bit in the cha$e anyways. Even though SHR is just a Hendrick Puppet team, I see futile attempts early in the season by Tony to retaliate and end up screwing himself up (which always seems to happen when he tries to retaliate). Add that to the fact that Ryan Newman has about as much fire in him as an icecap, and that SHR will probably be spending time getting ready for the 2011 arrival of Kevin Harvick, washed up and overrated to begin with, and I see morale being pretty bad around there. Something that could be helped by a certain hungry hard driving up and comer who has already won on the Cup circuit who knows how to control his emotions and aggressive driving. He would have boosted team morale. 42. DaleSrFanForever posted: 11.23.2009 - 2:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) All Dale Jr apologists can make all the excuses they want, but way more problems have been created by the driver than outside circumstances. His teammates finished 1-2-3 in points. Bad luck can't quantify being THAT far behind. Even his SHR teammates did much better, including Ryan Newman who may or may not have a pulse. Honestly, if he doesn't improve quite a bit by May of next year, he just might get the boot from Rick. With Kasey Kahne up for grabs for 2011, and Budweiser probably wanting to stay with Kasey and throw some pretty big $$$ in themselves, he needs to get his shit together. 43. DaleSrFanForever posted: 11.23.2009 - 2:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Driver that started every race and didn't get a top 10: Paul Menard" Why am I not surprised? 44. DaleJrFan18 posted: 11.23.2009 - 3:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "That should be an indication that he sucks and you need to quit defending him so much. He sucks. His 2008 season wasn't even that great, either." Not really, its an indication that I went through every statement you made. 2008 was basically 2006 for him, but a few issues in the chase stopped him from getting a better finish. Look at the stats. "Okay, why don't you forward this to the webmaster then? In this case, he can shut down the web site and save money." Ummm...okay...random... "Hell, I could flip that around, why waste your time supporting a driver who obviously doesn't give as much of a shit about racing as other drivers?" Because thats what a fan does asshole, he sticks with his (insert role model here) even in the toughest of times. I can assume that whenever your favorite driver has a shitty season, you'll drop him like a hot potatoe. And I highly doubt the last part. "Yeah, I'm really condescending because I expect the son of a seven-time champion to finish in the top 10 more than 21 times in 72 seasons with the best team in the sport. Excuse me all to hell." Typo: 2 seasons. Otherwise, I'm not going to touch this because it proves what I was saying. You think you can do better? Go ahead, make my day. 45. Billy posted: 11.23.2009 - 3:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The #37 of Travis Kvapil was sponsored by Miccosukee Resort & Gaming. 46. The Zeusian posted: 11.23.2009 - 3:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Only 1 start-&-park. 47. CFob posted: 11.23.2009 - 3:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) " It's cookie cutter because it's another moderately banked 1.5 miler, though I think it's the best of the bunch" But all the other "cookie cutter" tracks are 1.5 mile TRI-OVALS. Homestead is a true oval. If it were made from the same cookie cutter, someone broke it by the end of the year... 48. jr88fan posted: 11.23.2009 - 4:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 46. The Zeusian posted: 11.23.09 - 3:59 pm Only 1 start-&-park. no, 2 start-and-parks 49. RR posted: 11.23.2009 - 5:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) As a supporter of both Stewart and Montoya, I'm putting 100% of the blame to Smoke. When you drift up to block a guy who has a ton of momentum coming off the corner, you better expect to be rammed coming down the straight. And, if Tony says "he should have slowed down" perhaps Stewart should have slowed down in the 1996 Hut Hundred (yeah, I'm going back that far). Stewart rammed Kenny Irwin (RIP) after he put the slide job on him, and took both cars out. Good job Montoya for getting retaliation. That being said, I can't help but laugh at the doom and gloom predictions for SHR. It's coming from the same people who said statements like "Stewart is heading toward the downfall of his career" after he started SHR. And, for the millionth time, it makes absolutely no sense to whip up a third team for 2010 when you don't even have full sponsorship for the second car. A third car would just divert attention away for the other two cars (which aren't where they need to be at this moment). Keselowski's a decent driver, but God you people make him out to be the second coming. I want to see how he does at the Cup level (full-time, I don't care about what he did at Talladega with half the field out of contention). I'm sure Stewart can do an adequate job in making sure his team is motivated, as he did with JGR (they did win two championships). Then again, he gets ripped for not "being mature" even though he's the only driver to win championships in both formats, which would require optimum mental strength. Not to mention that he runs successful teams in the WoO and USAC, runs one of the most successful race tracks in the nation (Eldora), has more financial and market savvy than perhaps any driver in the garage right now, and put on one of the biggest charity events in sports. Yet, somehow, he's an idiot. Frankly, he's pretty much done it all in racing, and doesn't really have to prove a damn thing to anyone anymore. Although I'm sure the haters will try and come up with more feeble attempts to criticize. 50. Talon64 posted: 11.23.2009 - 6:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hamlin's 4 wins this season is as many as he had in his first 3 seasons. The 4 wins, 15 top fives and 1380 laps led are career highs and 20 top tens ties the career high set in his rookie year in 2006. Hamlin and Johnson combined to win 8 of the last 16 races of the season, with all 4 of Jimmie's wins in the Chase while Hamlin had 2 Chase wins. This is the first time Jeff Burton's had back-to-back 2nd place finishes since Texas and Martinsville in April 2000. This was his 122nd career top five and 222nd career top ten. Harvick came into Homestead 21st in points, which would've tied his worst ever points finish in Cup, but his 3rd place finish moved him up to 19th and bumped his teammate Casey Mears to 21st. Kurt's 10 top fives this year is the most he's had since 2004, and 21 top tens ties the career high he set that year. 10334 laps completed is also a career high. Jimmie's 7 wins this year makes it 3 of his 8 seasons in Cup that he's led the series in wins (8 in 2004, 10 in 2007). It's also the 3rd straight year that he's led the series in average qualifying among full time drivers. Jeff Gordon's 25 top tens this year makes it the 2nd time in the last 3 years that he's led the series in top tens (modern era record 30 top tens in 2007). To quote Sean about Carl going from most wins to winless: "Nope. There were a few more. Red Byron & Bob Flock: 2 wins in 1949 each, both winless in 1950 Junior Johnson: 13 wins in 1965 each, both winless in 1966 Darrell Waltrip: 6 wins in 1989, winless in 1990 Bill Elliott: 5 wins in 1992, winless in 1993 Kasey Kahne: 6 wins in 2006, winless in 2007 Johnson, Waltrip, and Elliott only shared the lead in wins with Ned Jarrett, Wallace and Davey Allison, respectively, who did both win in the following season, but still..." 7 top fives, 14 top tens, 164 laps led and 19.7 average start are all career lows for Carl. His average finish of 15.1 is only a point ahead of his career low average finish of 15.2 in 2006. It's also the 2nd time in 5 seasons that he's failed to finish in the top 10 in points, both coming after top 3 points finishes. With a 7th place finish Kyle managed to tie his career lows of 9 top fives and 13 top tens set in his rookie year of 2005. This was also his 2nd straight season with just 2 DNF's after 8 in his rookie year alone. Martin Truex Jr. has back-to-back top tens for the first time since 2007 when he ended the year with 3 straight top tens. AJ Allmendinger had a 13th and two 10th's in his 3 races in a Ford to close out 2009. He managed to finish the year as the 2nd highest RPM driver in points for a scrapped-together 4th team that wasn't supposed to run the full season. Clint Bowyer was the "best of the rest" during the Chase, scoring the 6th most points of any driver with 5 top tens in 10 races and an average finish of 11.7 which was 5th best. Mark Martin finishes 2nd in the standings for a 5th time, tying Richard Petty's record. 7 poles were a career high and he was the 3rd different HMS driver in the last 3 seasons to lead the series in poles. 7 top fives, 12 top tens and 245 laps led are the lowest for Matt Kenseth since his 2nd year in Cup in 2001 when he only had 4, 9 and 100 respectively. 14th in the points ties his career low set in his rookie year in 2000. Greg Biffle went winless in a season for the first time in his Cup career, but he finished in the top 10 in points in back-to-back seasons for the first time. He led all Roush drivers in virtually every category. The Daytona 500 will be David Reutimann's 100th career Cup start. He was one of 3 drivers to get their first career win this year and got MWR their first ever Cup win. Bill Elliott's average finish of 23.9 in 12 starts for the Wood Brothers would've been good enough to put him in the top 30 in points if he'd run the full season. Kahne finishes in the top 10 in points for just the 2nd time in his 6 seasons of Cup. An 11.8 average start and 15.3 average finish are new career highs, but Kahne failed to win a pole in a season for the first time. Jamie McMurray closes out his career with Roush Racing with 2 wins, 11 top fives, 32 top tens, 424 laps led and a 21.8 average finish in 144 races with a best points finish of 16th. Casey Mears' 19th place finish blows his chance of finishing in the top 20 in points for the 4th straight season and makes it the 3rd straight year he's dropped in points from one year to the next. It's the 3rd time in the last 4 years his average finish has been better than 20.0. 4 top tens are the least he's had in a year since he had 0 in his rookie season which was also the last time he failed to have a top five finish before this season. Although Brian Vickers made the Chase for the first time in his career, he was 26th in the Chase in points scored and became the first Chase driver to go an entire Chase without a top ten finish. Withou the Chase he would've finished 16th in points, 267 points behind 12th. Sam Hornish Jr. finishes the year with 2 top fives, 7 top tens and 18 finishes of 30th or worse. Thanks to his problems with JPM, Tony Stewart finishes outside the top five in points for the 4th straight season since his 2005 championship. But it's the 4th time in 11 seasons that he's finished 6th in the standings. 4 wins, 15 top fives, 23 top tens and a 10.4 average finish are all the most he's had in a year since his 2005 championship. He led the season in average finish among full time competitors at 10.4, the 2nd time in his career he's done it. Ryan Newman finishes in the top 10 in points for the first time since 2005, and 10468 laps completed are a new career high. A 14.7 average finish is his best since 2003. Joey Logano's 24th was just enough to hold on to 20th in points with an even 20.0 average finish. He's the youngest ROTY ever, a given since he was the youngest full time Cup driver ever and had absolutely no competition from Scott Speed. Paul Menard went the entire 2009 season without a top ten finish; the last driver to do so was Jeff Green in 2005; it's also the 2nd time in his 3 seasons in Cup that he's went a season without a top ten. He was also the worst driver in the standings, 31st, who started every single race. Scott Speed ends his rookie campaign with a single top ten, a 5th at Talledega, 3 DNQ's (but only one race he didn't run), and 35th in points with an average finish of 29.0. The 82 team ends up 36th in the owners standings but teams shutting down will put them in the top 35 for the start of 2010. The worst season of Dale Jr.'s career ends with a career low in top fives, ties his career low of top tens set in his rookie year, career low of laps led, career low points finish, worst average qualifying since 2005, career worst in average finish and his lowest number of lead lap finishes since 2005. Bobby Labonte's 17 year in Cup was his worst ever in points finish (30th) and average finish (25.7) between HoF/Yates and TRG. He did get his first top five finish since 2006, a 5th at Vegas. In just his 3rd season in Cup, David Ragan has a career low in top fives (0), top tens (2) and points finish (27th). 16 lead lap finishes ties his career low set in his rookie year in 2007. Marcos Ambrose finishes the year as the highest first-year driver in points in 18th. 4 top fives and 7 top tens this year is more than he ever had in a season in Nationwide. JPM blew away all previous career highs this year after making the Chase and finished 8th in the standings. He went without a win for the 2nd straight season with a best finish of 2nd at Pocono. In what might be the last season of Robby Gordon's full time Cup career if he can't find more sponsorship for his team, his only top ten was a 3rd in the Coke 600 that was due to the race being called due to rain, he had a 28.5 average finish and finished 34th in the standings. He'll probably be the last single car driver/owner ever in Cup. Although Sorenson's 2009 season wasn't as bad overall as 2008, his only top ten finish all year was a 9th in the season-opening Daytona 500. His best bet for a ride next year might be with Braun in Nationwide and a few Cup starts; In 5 starts with Braun in Nationwide this year he had 2 top fives including a runner up at Gateway, 3 top tens and an average finish of 7.6. 26th in points is the worst for Elliott Sadler since 2000, although it's the 4th straight year he's finished outside the top 20. Max Papis attempted to qualify for 21 races in 2009, making 15 of them. His best finish was an 8th at Watkins Glen, his best oval finish was 18th at Talledega. He finished 3rd in the ROTY standings. 51. Mike posted: 11.23.2009 - 6:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think Stewart will make the chase next season, but I don't think Newman will. Ryan was inconsistent all year and much like Montoya, was able to benefit from a lot of top tier drivers struggling. 52. Willy on Wheels posted: 11.23.2009 - 6:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think Montoya will make the Chase next year. For a while, he was finishing 2nd and 3rd behind only the Hendrick cars and could have easily finished 3rd in points if not for wrecks and mechanical failures in the 2nd half of the chase. 53. Kit posted: 11.23.2009 - 6:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "For a while, he was finishing 2nd and 3rd behind only the Hendrick cars" That's because like Mike said, the top tier drivers from Roush and RCR were struggling. I agree with Newman; back in '03 you'd expect him to take the series by storm but now he's turned into a paycheck driver. "Really Kit? Gibbs is second-rate to Hendrick?" Who just won four Cha$e championships in a row? I'll give you a hint: it isn't Gibbs. "I see futile attempts early in the season by Tony to retaliate and end up screwing himself up (which always seems to happen when he tries to retaliate). Add that to the fact that Ryan Newman has about as much fire in him as an icecap, and that SHR will probably be spending time getting ready for the 2011 arrival of Kevin Harvick, washed up and overrated to begin with, and I see morale being pretty bad around there." You know, besides Gordon and Martin and possibly Kahne (it's early in his career still), Stewart probably has the most sheer talent of all the full-time drivers. Yet because of crap like that, he exists in the shadow of a 6th to 10th place driver like Johnson who has an excellent team and knows how to handle shit. Ryan Newman is pretty much a done deal. Those eight wins in 2003 must have been engineering marvels because he hasn't drove like that since. Harvick's a joke. When a driver has a bad year and is in subpar equipment, at least he should grind some finishes out instead of complaining so much. 54. Talon64 posted: 11.23.2009 - 7:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) As many as 4 full time teams (07, 26, 44, 96) who are in the top 35 in owners points could be shutting down, and another in the 7 likely won't be full time. The RBR 82, TRG 71, Finch 09, and Nemechek 87 are all 36th through 39th in the owners standings and all of them could have secure spots in the first 5 races of 2010. The 78 Furniture Row team is 40th but if they can make the 500 next year then they'll probably replace the 7 team if Robby can't find any more sponsorship. 55. potatosalad48 posted: 11.23.2009 - 8:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) congrats to jimmie 56. Spen posted: 11.23.2009 - 9:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Actually, Jeff Gordon had the best average finish this year. 57. Anonymous posted: 11.23.2009 - 9:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I see the following in 2010 for cup to happen: Jeff Gordon will be back for 2011 and will finish 4th in points. Jeff Burton will win at least 1 race next year will be 3rd in points. Sadler will not be back with Richard Petty Motorsports in 2011 Harvick will be going to Stewart Haas Racing Kasey Khane will be headed to Stewart Haas Racing Dale Jr. will get anywhere from 6 to 14 top 10's next year with a possible plate win. Scott Slow will not be back with Red Bull Racing after next year. Joey Logano will have 10 top 10's next year with a win. Jamie McMurray will finish in the top 17 next year. Jimmie Johnson will win the Brickyard 400 and his 5th title. Sam Hornish Jr. will bring out the most caution flags next year with Sadler bring the 2nd most. Brad Keselowski will be in the top 22 in points. There will be more start and parks in cup next year. The average of cautions in a cup race next year will go down somewhat since Micheal Waltrip and Robby Gordon will not be racing full time in cup next year. There will be more fuel mileage races next year. Kyle Busch will win the Coco cola 600. Joe Gibbs Racing will win at least 12 races next, but Kyle Busch and Hamlin will not finish in top 3 in points due to maturity. Ford will win 5 times next year with 2 of them from Matt Kenseth. Ambrouse will be a first time winner next year. Daytona 500 will be won by one of the following Drivers: Kevin Harvick, Dale Jr., Jamie McMurray, Tony Stewart, Kyle Busch, Kurt Busch,and Brad Keselowski. One of the two Talladega races will have a fluke winner. Jimmie Johnson's stats will fall down next year a little bit, since there will be more fuel Mileage races. Kurt Busch will have more than 1 fuel mileage win in 2010. A Nascar driver will be in trouble with the law next year. It will be either for drugs or DUI. Mark Martin will finish 2nd again in points. Tony Stewart will reach the 40 win mark next year. 58. 18fan posted: 11.23.2009 - 10:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle Busch has had as many DNFs in the last four seasons as he did in his rookie year, 8. He also failed to have 10 top fives and 15 top tens for the first time since his rookie year and also his first points finish outside the top 10 since that year. On the bright side, he recorded his first top ten at Homestead, and should be better next year if Dave Rogers gets along with him and he doesn't self destruct, as Gibbs has the cars to have Kyle and Denny compete for the title. Denny Hamlin sets a career high in terms of banking on a track he won at, 18-20. Previous was 14 at Richmond. Denny also was penalized one lap on Saturday after the contact with Keselowski. Most laps Jeff Burton has led since 61 at Las Vegas 59. petty43 posted: 11.23.2009 - 10:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) congrats to the best driver by far in cup right now. Jimmie has no peer, in fact he has no rival for that matter, in three fewer seasons , he has 10 more wins and 2 more cups than even tony has. and tony is supposedly a better wheelman who has piloted equal equipment with a cc just about as good and even a silmilar sponsor, until this year. JJ is the best and i think he has a real shot at 5 in a row and dare i say maybe breaking richards and dales record of 7 cups. 60. Anonymous posted: 11.23.2009 - 10:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "If he's at the point where he's over driving his car because he's so desperate for a top 20 finish, maybe he should move back down to the Nationwide series until he gets his shit together." He moved from 32nd to 7th and was gaining big on the leaders. If he felt desperate for a top 20 he probably would of just rode around. "All the races he got wrecked out of, he probably would have at best finished 15th-20th for most of them." It's obvious you don't even watch the races. His problems during the last 10 races have come while leading at Kansas, running 5th at New Hampshire, about 4th at Texas, and between 10-15th in most of the others. Phoenix and Charlotte were the only races that he ran worse then 15th. Given how his season started that was a huge improvement. Rome wasn't built in a day. 61. Frank posted: 11.23.2009 - 11:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Don't forget the strong top 10 runs he had going at Sonoma, Indy, and California last month. 62. DaleJrFan18 posted: 11.23.2009 - 11:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Damn Talon, you went to town on stats :P 63. DaleJrFan18 posted: 11.23.2009 - 11:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And anonymous, give up, they're too ignorant realize that the finishing position does not always reflect how the driver was really doing. 64. Mike posted: 11.24.2009 - 12:37 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Had he not blown a tire, he could have easilly finished in the top ten. Or did you not see the blown tire? That's a valid reason for his finish. Let's see you blow a tire, get your laps back and finish decently." First off, he blew the tire because he screwed up the car via hitting the wall and put himself in the back, which your always prone to that sort of stuff when your running in the back. I've defended Dale Jr more than anyone on here, but even Dale Jr fans have to admit his 28th place finish in this race was his fault. He had a car capable of winning but he chose to rim ride the wall which was a poor choice. I was listening to their radio and after he hit the wall the 3rd time his car began to plow and things went downhill from there. Running the high line is good and all, but running right next to the wall like Jr does is asking for trouble. Dale Jr has access to 3 of the greatest drivers in NASCAR history as teammates. He needs to use them and find out what their doing that he's not. There's a reason Jimmie Johnson is so lucky all of the time, because he creates it. Maybe we need to realize Dale Jr creates his own bad luck more than anything. It's obvious Rick has fixed the performance on his race car. The car Dale ran at Homestead was the best race car they have EVER had since Jr joined Hendrick. Now it's time for the driver to get the job done. 65. Mike posted: 11.24.2009 - 12:50 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I think Montoya will make the Chase next year. For a while, he was finishing 2nd and 3rd behind only the Hendrick cars and could have easily finished 3rd in points if not for wrecks and mechanical failures in the 2nd half of the chase." True, but my point is it depends on how much other teams catch up. Like I said in my previous post the 88 car was by far the class of the field until he hit the wall so we know they are catching up. RCR showed signs they are catching up, and I think Edwards and Kenseth will be contenders. Of course you have the usual every year contenders that should get in as well, so it may be much tougher for Montoya to get in. Honestly, not dissing Juan in anyway, I think this season was a fluke and he will return to earth next season. If I'm wrong I stand corrected. 66. RR posted: 11.24.2009 - 1:17 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, the ratings are in. Look's like people didn't "apprerciate" the history-making moment. "Overnight ratings from the Nielsen Media Research company were down 11.1 percent when compared to last year??s ratings for the Ford 400 on ABC, according to a Street and Smith??s SportsBusiness Daily report. The broadcast earned a 3.2 rating, which means roughly 1.4 million people watched the race. The Ford 400 drew a 3.6 rating last year. The 3.2 rating is the lowest TV rating of the entire 2009 Chase for the Sprint Cup Series. TV ratings for the NASCAR Sprint Cup Series have been on a steep decline since 2004. In fact, ratings for the Ford 400 have dropped 43% percent from the 2004 rating of 5.2 during that time period." A few days ago, I ventured onto pravda.c... nascar,com. One of the main stories was about Brian France's assessment of NASCAR. The headline was "Ratings, attendance aside, NASCAR looking good." Hey, last time I checked ratings and attendance are the two biggest barometers of interest and health of the sport, idiots. But answer me this. Can you point to anything positive right now, Brian? Car counts? Nope. Sponsorship? Nope. Costs? Next. Parity? Moving on. Quality of racing? Nuh-uh. TV Coverage? Haha. I??m excited to see how NASCAR will try and blame this on the economy. 67. RR posted: 11.24.2009 - 1:19 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Damn it, two errors in the first sentence. "Looks like people didn't "appreciate" the history-making moment." 68. DaleJrFan18 posted: 11.24.2009 - 2:26 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'll give Asscar 2 more years before these corperate f**ks drive it into the ground for good. 69. Ryan posted: 11.24.2009 - 4:01 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) So long to the most-overated and worst driver ever to step foot into Nascar... Initials, MW 70. Smokefan05 posted: 11.24.2009 - 1:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I'll give Asscar 2 more years before these corperate f**ks drive it into the ground for good." People have been saying that for 5 years now, and it hasn't happen. So much for the "dooms day NASCAR mayan calendar." 71. Talon64 posted: 11.24.2009 - 5:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The final national rating for the race was a 3.7 with about 5.6 million viewers, down from the 4.0 last year. Back in 2004 it was a 6.2 with 9.9 million viewers so it's an identical percentage drop compared to the overnight ratings. 72. SoxFan24 posted: 11.25.2009 - 3:23 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Anonymous, not only should Elliott Sadler should be released from RPM after 2010, he should be released in 2009. I would rather have Casey Mears at this point 73. SoxFan24 posted: 11.25.2009 - 4:11 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's sad in a way to end the NASCAR season. What to do for 3 months? LOL So if you don't mind I'd like to give my season in review on those that finished in the top 30 in points this year 1.Jimmie Johnson: What can you say that hasn't already. 4 straight championships. Chase or no Chase, he still would have won the championship. This is the best team in the Cup Series. They have the best owner, best crew chief and arguably the best driver. Jimmie led the series in wins (7) and laps led. (2238) That stat is the one that is most intriguing. With all those laps lead that means he's getting a ton of bonus points. Jimmie was also running at the end of 35 out of 36 races. That is consistency like him or not. Johnson obviously gets an A+ 2.Mark Martin: Nice year for a driver that ran part-time for 2 years. Mark led the series in poles (7) and was second in wins.(5) In fact Mark won more races in a season since he won 7 in 1998. Mark was rejuvenated and at over 50 years old did remarkable things this year. Him and Alan Gustafson clicked immedidiately and there is no reason why he wouldn't be a favorite for 2010. The only reason he didn't win a championship I think was bonus points. He only led 805 laps compared to over 2000 by Johnson. Also Mark had the 4 DNF's compared to Johnson's one. I give Mark's season a A 3.Jeff Gordon: Quietly, Gordon had 25 Top 10's and led the series with that stat. Gordon only had the one win but that was better than 2008's winless season he had. Remarkably as well Gordon had 8 second place finishes. Gordon led the points for a bit coming into the Summer and was in the top 5 most of the season. Gordon's back was an issue all year and will be the rest of his career. Gordon is still one of the best in the game and will contend once again. I give his season an -A 4.Kurt Busch: Kurt Busch improved 14 spots in the standings from 18th in 2008 to 4th in 2009. Kurt got 2 wins this year and his top 10's improved by 11 from 10 to 21 this year. Kurt battled through a rough stretch during the first part of the chase when crew chief Pat Tryson suddenly announced he was leaving at the end of 2009 to go to MWR in 2010. I give Busch an -A because of the improvement and overall consistency showed by Busch for the majority of the season. He will have to back this up once agin in 2010 for me to give this same grade next year. 2006 he missed the chase, 2007 he made it, 2008 missed it and of course 2009 he made. Does this pattern of missing the chase in even years continue? 5.Denny Hamlin: Denny Hamlin was in danger of missing the chase in the early summer months. 2nd place finishes and frustration was starting to mount with the Fedex team. Starting with the July race in Pocono (which he won, this team gained fire entering the chase with that win and one in the final regular season race at Richmond. 3 DNF's including back to back at Lowes and Fontana ended his Chase hopes but came back to win at Martinsville and in the last race at Homestead to give him 4 wins on the season. If there was a team that had bad luck it was Hamlin. Hamlin made his way all the way up to 5th in the final standings. Overall I'd give Hamlin's season a B with room to improve on personal composure, reliability in the Engine shop and making less driver errors. 6-10 will be on the next post 74. DaleSrFanForever posted: 11.25.2009 - 11:26 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I'm sure Stewart can do an adequate job in making sure his team is motivated, as he did with JGR" Actually it was Zippy that held that team together. Before the 2005 season the #20 team members damn near revolted leading Zippy to bring in Tony and everyone else on the team in for a meeting so they could get everything off their chest's about how Stewart was making their lives miserable. That calmed Tony down for exactly one year were he showed his true potential. Despite driving mid pack cars for the first 1/3 of the season he kept his head on straight, and once JGR figured out and perfected the new coil binding setups he was unstoppable. He didn't let adversity or small shit affect him the way it has in every other year of his career. Were it not for the cha$e he would have clinched the title with two races still to go. This despite barely being in the Top 10 at the end of May. But come 2006 it was same ol' Tony again. He ran Kenseth into the grass at 200 MPH even though Matt never touched him (this after declaring Kyle Busch and others would kill somebody if they didn't settle down), threw away a Top 5 at Vegas trying to crash Kyle Busch cause he wouldn't roll over and let him pass, got wrecked trying to race Ryan Newman (who had just pitted and had tires 70 laps fresher) at Loudon because he was mad at Ryan for racing him too hard in the past, and crashed out Carl Edwards and Clint Bowyer at Pocono for no good reason. He had the fastest car that year and dominated the cha$e: EXCEPT FOR THE FACT HE MISSED IT!!! That allowed the #48 team to finally get the monkey off their backs and they haven't lost since. THAT is why we bash Tony. We know how talented he is. I think he is the most naturally gifted DRIVER in the field, even ahead of Kyle Busch and Jeff Gordon. And yes he has two championships, and a ton of wins, but I still look at him as somebody who has underachieved. To me, he is the Wilt Chamberlain of NASCAR. And Jimmie Johnson is Bill Russell. Less gifted, but with only focused on winning. Like Wilt is to Russell, Tony will go down in history in JJ's shadow despite being more talented. 75. DaleSrFanForever posted: 11.25.2009 - 11:32 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Again, you can make all the excuses in the world for Dale Jr, but his teammates finished ONE-TWO-THREE in points. Dale Mears (thanks Kit) couldn't even crack the Top 20. And Rick threw everything he could at that #88 car. Bad luck alone can't explain that. And he had the same equipment as 5 other people who made the cha$e, including one driver that I think died 4 years ago and we just don't realize it (Newman). 76. Kit posted: 11.25.2009 - 11:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Chase or no Chase, he still would have won the championship." You don't know that. The reality is, under the old points system, the drivers would have raced A LOT different. Every race would have more weight attached to the championship, unlike today where the last 10 races are weighed far more heavily compared to the first 26. 77. Kit posted: 11.25.2009 - 11:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Like I said in my previous post the 88 car was by far the class of the field until he hit the wall so we know they are catching up." The team doesn't need to catch up. The team by itself has been competitive this year. The driver, on the other hand, has not. If anything, putting a top five car in the wall is going backwards. 78. Kit posted: 11.25.2009 - 11:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Dale Jr has access to 3 of the greatest drivers in NASCAR history as teammates. He needs to use them and find out what their doing that he's not." Easy, they are actually doing work and he's not. It's not that hard. Dale Jr. is like a frat boy who isn't studying because he's too busy hitting the bong to enter the spirit world like the Native Americans before. He'd rather dual with the magical dragon than get any sort of work done in reality. 79. petty43 posted: 11.25.2009 - 11:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) actually the chase is kind of a good thing, because with 36 races, every race would carry less importance towards the cup. Bad races can be absorbed more easily with 36 races. if nascar is not going back to 29 races a year(they won't), then they should keep the chase so people cant win cups like jarret, bobby, and kenseth did. the negative is with the chase you can get cheap champs like kurt busch, (who was probably not in the top 5 of drivers that year). damn we are all just screwed to year after year of frustration with the chase. or you can just stop bitching about it, because its been 6 years, and it is not going anywhere. 80. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 11.26.2009 - 12:16 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) When you are on the best team in NASCAR and you have shown in the past that you can win races, people expect you to finish better than freakin' 25th in points while all of your other teammates make the Chase. Especially when Hendrick is giving you the best stuff and trying everything to help you win. I would be saying all of this even if I WERE a Dale Jr fan! 81. Smokefan05 posted: 11.26.2009 - 12:40 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "damn we are all just screwed to year after year of frustration with the chase. or you can just stop bitching about it, because its been 6 years, and it is not going anywhere." People complain for the sake of complaining. It's what NASCAR fans do now a days. The Chase is here too stay. (thanks petty43) 82. Mike posted: 11.26.2009 - 3:47 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Easy, they are actually doing work and he's not. It's not that hard." Sorry, I trust Dale Jr's friends and colleagues who actually work with him on a daily basis over a fan who thinks he knows everything but in reality he knows very little. Funny thing is his friends and colleagues say the complete opposite of what you claim. Gee, I wonder who is the more reliable source. 83. DaleSrFanForever posted: 11.27.2009 - 10:27 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Funny thing is his friends and colleagues say the complete opposite of what you claim. Gee, I wonder who is the more reliable source." Well of course his cronies are gonna say that! What are they gonna say? "This guy is having a serious emotional breakdown and is handling it the wrong way which is leading to him finishing 20 spots behind his teammates." Of course they are going to cover his ass. That's what friends do. Remember that Coors Light commercial (at least I think it was Coors)? "I have told a ridiculous lie to back up a friend's ridiculous lie." And we all laughed. The bottom line is something is seriously wrong with Dale Jr, not his team. And his friends would be complete idiots if they said anything any differently. They know the drill. They aren't going to spill the beans on whatever is affecting him. 84. Mike posted: 11.27.2009 - 2:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "The bottom line is something is seriously wrong with Dale Jr" I don't see it. He sounds depressed and not into it in his interviews, but that is a false alarm more than anything. The way I look at it he looks focused and doesn't feel like talking to anybody because he's 100% focused on the task at hand. We can interpret people's attitude and style in a lot of ways. 85. Bronco posted: 11.27.2009 - 11:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Well of course his cronies are gonna say that! What are they gonna say? "This guy is having a serious emotional breakdown and is handling it the wrong way which is leading to him finishing 20 spots behind his teammates." Maybe so, but anything they say is a lot more credible than what you or I say since they are the ones who know him. "The bottom line is something is seriously wrong with Dale Jr, not his team." Again, I'm guessing you know this because of your close friendship with Dale Jr right? You don't know what goes on in his personal life, or anyone else's personal life, and neither do I or anyone else on this website. Let's just stop buying into the shit that these trashy tabloids continue to spew out. And I just wanted to say, that his teammates did not finish 1-2-3 in points, they actually finished 1-2-5. That is, unless you believe in the farce that are the cha$e standings, which also allows a driver to finish 12th in points despite not having a single top 10 in a 10 race stretch (Vickers). Hopefully this will be the last race for Hall of Shame Racing, a team that doesn't seem to realize that going through a revolving door of drivers is not going to change the fact that they are nothing but a 30th place team. 86. DaleSrFanForever posted: 11.28.2009 - 9:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Maybe so, but anything they say is a lot more credible than what you or I say since they are the ones who know him." I disagree. They are not objective. As friends of his, they would do exactly what I would do, cover his ass. I will freely admit I've done that for friends before. I'm just looking at the numbers and the performance and comparing it to 6 other drivers in the same equipment (including Brad's part time rides). Throw in the fact he has the biggest sponsorship deal in the entire garage, and there in no way should be such a disparity between himself and the others. "And I just wanted to say, that his teammates did not finish 1-2-3 in points, they actually finished 1-2-5." Oh. I sincerly apologize for making it sound like his teammates had really good years. If you are tallying up the final numbers of drivers in HMS equipment it is 1-2-3-5-10, with his "official" teammates all in the Top 5. Dale Mears finished 25th. Hell, Keselowski managed to get a win in a borrowed Hendrick car, something Dale Mears couldn't do. 87. Kit posted: 11.29.2009 - 4:23 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Funny thing is his friends and colleagues say the complete opposite of what you claim." What the hell makes you think that his friends and colleagues are going to openly criticize Dale Mears? His record the past two seasons speaks for itself. "damn we are all just screwed to year after year of frustration with the chase. or you can just stop bitching about it, because its been 6 years, and it is not going anywhere." I'm not going anywhere either so you might as well quit bitching about people who dislike the Cha$e. "actually the chase is kind of a good thing, because with 36 races, every race would carry less importance towards the cup. Bad races can be absorbed more easily with 36 races. if nascar is not going back to 29 races a year(they won't), then they should keep the chase so people cant win cups like jarret, bobby, and kenseth did." That's true but the Cha$e does not solve an issue between 1/30th and 1/36th (which fractionally are a very small difference). All the Cha$e has done is thrown the majority of the weight at the last 10 races and little of it on the first 26. "When you are on the best team in NASCAR and you have shown in the past that you can win races, people expect you to finish better than freakin' 25th in points while all of your other teammates make the Chase." No kidding. Forget the points, Dale Mears should have finished in the top 10 more than five times this season. 88. Kit posted: 11.29.2009 - 4:34 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "that his teammates did not finish 1-2-3 in points, they actually finished 1-2-5." What is your f**king point? Do you really think that makes Dale Mears look good with a 25th points finish? 89. Talon64 posted: 11.30.2009 - 4:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) some facts about this year's race winners: The last two years the top 4 teams, HMS, JGR, RFR and RCR, combined for 32 wins in each season, with 7 different teams winning in 2007 and just 6 in 2008. This year the top 4 won 25 races with RCR going winless, while 9 different teams (HMS, JGR, Roush, SHR, MWR, RBR, Finch, Penske, RPM) went to victory lane, the most since 2004. 8 different drivers won multiple races in 2009, the most in the last 3 years (8 in 2006). 15 different winners total is up from just 12 last year. But in 2007, despite HMS winning 18 of 36 races, there were 16 different winners. 90. Talon64 posted: 12.03.2009 - 4:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Dale Earnhardt Jr. won Most Popular Driver for the 7th consecutive year. I thought Mark Martin had a good chance of winning it after the great year he had but Jr. Nation stood up and said "We're okay with mediocrity! GO JUNIOR!" 91. Smokefan05 posted: 12.03.2009 - 5:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Jr. Nation proves that once again they are blind and stupid. And this is what happen when ONE GUY hold about 80% of the fan base. 92. Eric posted: 12.03.2009 - 9:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Smokefan05, Why you weren't bad mouthing the Bill Elliott fans back from 1995 to 2000, when Bill Elliott Didn't win a single race and finished 21st in points in back to back years before 2001? Bill Elliott in his time was the Dale Earnhardt Jr for Nascar in popularity in his era and won 10 straight Most popular driver awards from 1991 to 2000 despite the fact he really struggled on the track for some of seasons. Bill Won the most Popular Driver of the year award in 1999 despite having only 2 top 10's that year and finished 21st in points. 93. Eric posted: 12.03.2009 - 9:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The most popular diver of the year never was about performance at first place before Dale Earnhardt Jr. fans voted for him. Bill Elliott had some bad seasons as a driver owner, but fans still voted for Bill Elliott and he won Driver of the year as a result like 1999. Some people had problems with Bill winning the award so many times despite the fact Bill didn't perform well on the track in some the years he won the award. Nascar fans even accused Bill Elliott fans of Ballot stuffing back in the day. 94. Mike posted: 12.03.2009 - 9:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Jr. Nation proves that once again they are blind and stupid." I think Jr Nation proved they are the most loyal fans in sports and don't jump on bandwagons like most fans do today. 95. Smokefan05 posted: 12.03.2009 - 10:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Eric you make good points. When i sit back view the situation, i'm upset with what Jr. has become. I liked the Jr. of old (2000-2004) that Jr. i could get beyhond because he reminded me of his dad. Know i don't know what too think of him. My defination of a MPD is a winner and a champion. Jr. hasn't acted like that in a while from my view. "I think Jr Nation proved they are the most loyal fans in sports and don't jump on bandwagons like most fans do today." Kyle Busch Nation comes too mind. :) 96. Spen posted: 12.04.2009 - 4:03 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Eric : "Why you weren't bad mouthing the Bill Elliott fans back from 1995 to 2000?" Possibly because Bill was running as an independent owner/driver in an era that was being increasingly dominated by multi-car teams. The fact that he even managed to be slightly competitive at times was an accomplishment. Junior on the other hand, is driving a fully-funded *Hendrick Motorsports* car. If he can't even finish as high as Bill did in his worst season (not counting his injury-shortened '96 season), then there is definately a problem. (Now granted, I'm probably biased in this debate, as I've been a fan of Bill's since 1979.) 97. Eric posted: 12.05.2009 - 12:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I am a Matt Kenseth fan, not a Dale Jr. fan. I am fan of Brad Keselowski though. Brad has some the same characteristics as Dale Earnhardt Sr did as a driver. Kevin Harvick, Denny Hamlin, and Kyle Busch don't have the calmness about them when they wrecked someone like Dale Sr. did. Brad has that calmness about him that the drivers I mentioned don't. I was a fan of Dale Jr. going to back to when he used to be a full time series until he changed a driver. Dale hasn't been committed to win in a long time. Dale Earnhardt Sr. was the reason I still followed Nascar after Alan Kulwicki died, but I haven't been big on his son for a few years. He is not the same driver that I remembered seeing winning at the Milwaukee Mile in 1998. Matt Kenseth is one of the drivers I am fan of for cup drivers. The other drivers I am a fan of is Tony Stewart, Brad Keselowski, Marcos Ambrose and Bobby Labonte. Bobby Labonte is last of the old favorite cup drivers back in the 1990's beside Dale Earnhardt Sr. Rest of the drivers that I was of back than in the cup series died, part time or retired. 98. Eric posted: 12.05.2009 - 12:35 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) My view always been the Nascar popularity contest doesn't exactly mean the driver had a good year, or is talented. Buckshot Jones won the 1998 Busch series most popular driver. Buckshot wasn't exactly known as a talented driver and that is a fact despite the fact Buchshot won races, wasn't really a good driver and I saw him race in the Busch series. Ricky Carmichael won the most popular driver of the year in the truck series this year is another prime example. Ricky didn't embarrassed himself, but he wasn't outstanding either. 2 top 10's in 18 races for a truck series rookie isn't bad considering he lacks stock car experience, but didn't do nothing to become the series most popular driver in 2009 on the track. Ricky only got the most popular of the year award because his motocross fans followed him over to the truck series. Ricky is a legend in Motocross, but that is it. I know the truck series and the Nationwide/Busch series is weaker than cup series, but those series proved you don't have to be great on the track. 99. DaleSrFanForever posted: 12.05.2009 - 11:28 am Rate this comment: (0) (1) "I am fan of Brad Keselowski though. Brad has some the same characteristics as Dale Earnhardt Sr did as a driver. Kevin Harvick, Denny Hamlin, and Kyle Busch don't have the calmness about them when they wrecked someone like Dale Sr. did. Brad has that calmness about him that the drivers I mentioned don't." Bingo. Those three have to make a big commotion about it and TRY to act like badasses. Brad just brushes it off like its nothing. He isn't trying to be anything other than who he is. Harvick and Kyle try to act like they are the successors to Dale Sr's throne of the King of Badassness (or at least Harvick did before he fell off the face of the Earth), but they are so pathetic it isn't even funny. And hell, look at Diva Hamlin. He just had a career year in the CUP Series and he's more worried about a full time Nationwide driver. That shows you how easily he can be rattled. He made a joke at the awards banquet about always having to congratulate JJ on winning the championship, but there is a reason for that. Do you ever see JJ getting into it with people that don't ultimately matter at the time for the championship? Nope. I think Brad being a full time Cup driver next year will get in Denny's head and derail his focus. He will be more worried about him than achieving the ultimate goal. So here is my prediction for the future. Denny's 2009 season will go down like Kevin Harvick's 2006 season: an aberration. I see so many similarities between those two as it is, and I think this will be no different. Man I wish Rick would have fired Dale Jr and put Brad in the #88 car after Tony turned him down so he could really make Diva Hamlin and Baby Busch eat their words. 100. Willy on Wheels posted: 12.07.2009 - 2:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brad is going to be successful next year. Kurt Busch proved that Stremme and Sideways's badness was caused by the drivers, not the cars. 101. Talon64 posted: 12.07.2009 - 7:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Brad is going to be successful next year. Kurt Busch proved that Stremme and Sideways's badness was caused by the drivers, not the cars." Then why did Keselowski run about 25th in his first 3 races with the 12 team despite running top 15 all the time in the 25 Hendrick car? The 12 team's going to have a new crew chief for next year, Jay Guy, so hopefully this new combination will work out well for Kez. 102. Kit posted: 12.08.2009 - 6:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Three races isn't enough to make a comparison. 103. DaleSrFanForever posted: 12.12.2009 - 11:19 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Matt Kenseth will be sponsored by Valvoline in a few races next year in a car that looks a lot like the one Mark drove for so many years. I can't think of a better person to drive that scheme (other than Mark) than Matt. Mark is the one who recommended Matt to Roush and mentored him, and Matt never forgot that, giving much of his credit to Mark any chance he gets. 104. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 12.12.2009 - 9:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think that's very fitting also. I'm not a Matt fan, but I've always had respect for him. I like how the paint scheme throws back to Martin's early Valvoline days there. 105. Bronco posted: 12.16.2009 - 7:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Looks like this will be the last Cup race with Dr. Jerry Punch doing play-by-play. He will be a pit reporter next year with Marty Reid taking over play-by-play duties for all of the ESPN Cup races. You could tell it was coming from when Marty starting doing more Nationwide races this year. I think it's a good move, Jerry Punch is an AWESOME pit reporter and was one of the voices of ESPN's NASCAR pits coverage throughout the 80s and 90s. But somehow, that didn't translate over to the broadcast booth. Marty did a good job with the Nationwide and Indycar races this year. With that being said, I would rather have Allen Bestwick over anyone else. No one else adds excitement to calling a race like he does. 106. DaleSrFanForever posted: 12.24.2009 - 7:33 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) HA! I knew it. They changed the format of the Bud Shootout yet again to make sure Dale Mears could get in. They are letting all past shootout winners in (I call this the Dale Sr Memorial Exemption), anyone who has won anything at Daytona even if they haven't done jack shit since (Harvick, Newman), and the reigning Rookie of the year. Cause it just wouldn't be an event without the phenom himself, Joey Logano, the greatest thing to happen to NASCAR since Fireball Roberts, in it. Merry Christmas NASCAR fans, the suits in Daytona just wanted you to know that they still don't take you seriously. 107. Talon64 posted: 12.28.2009 - 5:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think NASCAR did more because of the fact that the 3 Penske teams are the only full time Dodge teams left and they didn't want crappy S&P teams filling up the 3 remaining spots. Getting Dale Jr. in there is just a bonus, and former Shootout winners were eligible before last year's change. BTW, Harvick won the 2009 Shootout, Newman gets in as a Chase driver and Logano was the 6th best Toyota driver in the standings so he would've gotten in without the rule change. But this screws over David Reutimann and Marcos Ambrose who would've been in the Shootout under the manufacturer rules as 4th and 5th of the Toyota drivers. When does Budweiser's sponsorship of the Shootout end? I hope NASCAR doesn't re-sign them and get Coors to sponsor it so it can go back to the previous year's pole winners. 108. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 12.28.2009 - 11:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I hope NASCAR doesn't re-sign them and get Coors to sponsor it so it can go back to the previous year's pole winners." Ain't that the truth. That's what that race is supposed to be all about, who was fastest in time trials the previous season. And being somebody who is all about tradition, I was disgusted to see the rule change last season. I'm not sure how long Budweiser is onboard for this, but I can imagine they won't be back once their contract is up. I am sure that NASCAR doesn't want two conflicting liquor companies (one sponsoring the Shootout, the other sponsoring the Pole award) sponsoring two seperate functions of their sport. 109. Kit posted: 12.29.2009 - 11:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think that's the nail in the coffin for me, DSFF. I can't follow a "sport" that rewards mediocrity and, in Joey Logano's case, rewards doing next-to-nothing. Combined with too much media attention towards a driver who can't even lead laps in the IRL and has yet to start a Nationwide race, it's apparently obvious to me that popularity is far more important than actually being able to competitively drive a stock car. I even saw this to a lesser extent with Juan Pablo Montoya, when several of the open-wheel fans came on the board, prematurely declaring him to be the next great legendary Cup driver when he just had a competitive season that would be average for Greg Biffle. He had a good start, but that's not even a blip compared to what several drivers did 20 years ago. That's insulting to the drivers who DO have talent and don't get enough chances to show it off. Unfortunately, the high cost of the sport has turned it into just another marketing toy by corporations willing to foot the bill. It's a huge problem when you can have a totally talentless driver like Michael Waltrip stay in a Cup car ONLY because he's good at marketing. That's all NAPA is paying for; they don't actually really care if he can win a race or not. Some of my favorite drivers had bad years that I had to weather through and they didn't get opportunities thrown into their laps like Dale Mears just did. Why should I care anymore? I followed several talented drivers who didn't catch a break at all during tough times, yet we're giving a break to a guy who can't even finish in the top 20 with the best team in the sport. I'm at the point where I no longer follow the races unless it's a truck race. I'll make comments when I feel a driver or a situation is a joke compared to NASCAR of past. 110. DaleSrFanForever posted: 12.30.2009 - 4:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I hear ya Kit. This off season can't last long enough. At first I was bummed a little bit about the career I'm getting into (EMS) because I would have to work some weekends, now I hope I work all of them. And this is a sport that I followed with a borderline religious devotion for the past 20+ years, since I was 4 or 5. Now I just don't care. If it wasn't for the fact that I enter racing pools with my buddies, I probably would have quit a while ago. It's pretty sad that I have to have money on the line to stay interested. If this were truly a sport, Drunktrip would have disappeared a long time ago and Dale Mears would get fired and replaced by Brad K. THAT would be an interesting thing to follow. Brad in the best equipment running circles around Diva Hamlin, making him look even dumber than he already looks. 111. Talon64 posted: 12.30.2009 - 5:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) See, I'd argue that letting the ROTY in the race is alright because it's a worthy accomplishment (most seasons) but this is still probably just a way to get Joey Logano and Home Depot in the race. Especially since there probably won't be any rookies in Cup next year so no ROTY Shootout driver in 2011 barring they don't change the rules AGAIN, including whenever Budweiser's gone so it'll go back to pole awards. But they've allowed former Shootout winners in the race before so I don't see the problem with that. Allowing ANY former Daytona winner in the race is a bit much but it's still a million times better than last year's format that pandered to the manufacturers coughcoughDODGEcoughcough. I'm more of a new fan, only started watching all the races in 2001. So I can live with this stuff better than older fans that have seen so much change that it isn't the same thing they fell in love with in the first place; I've only experienced for myself what NASCAR's been as of late so I'm still going to watch all the races I can in 2010. 112. Loop Data Fan posted: 12.31.2009 - 2:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Denny Hamlin didn't win the race, Kevin Harvick did. Kevin had a better driver rating than Denny did. 113. Kit posted: 01.01.2010 - 7:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "See, I'd argue that letting the ROTY in the race is alright because it's a worthy accomplishment (most seasons) but this is still probably just a way to get Joey Logano and Home Depot in the race." That's the #1 problem with NASCAR allowing the sport to get as expensive as it is; now the sponsors footing the bill are meddling in the rules and regulations. Twenty years ago a racing genius like Alan Kulwicki could set up his own team and secure sponsorship (it wasn't easy then) and still be somewhat competitive. Not anymore; you're not really competitive unless you're with Hendrick. "So I can live with this stuff better than older fans that have seen so much change that it isn't the same thing they fell in love with in the first place; I've only experienced for myself what NASCAR's been as of late so I'm still going to watch all the races I can in 2010." Haha, you have NO CLUE what you're missing. If the current state of NASCAR existed 20 years ago, there is no way I would have followed the sport then. 114. Talon64 posted: 01.04.2010 - 4:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Unless another rookie driver can find a ride, Kevin Conway will be the Cup ROTY in 2010. He's going to drive the #37 Front Row Motorsports car full time and nailed the ride with the help of his Extenze sponsorship. 115. Spen posted: 01.04.2010 - 6:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'd say that Regan Smith's record for worst average finish for a ROTY winner is going to be in serious jepordy. 116. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 01.04.2010 - 6:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Either that, or most DNQ's by a rookie. Conway struggled in 2007 with Gibbs' #18 team in Nationwide, so I don't look for much. 117. Santa Baby posted: 01.06.2010 - 2:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NA$caraint even gonna exist in 5 years. Who careabout debating about it. 3 words BFrance3: World Championship Wrestling 118. Talon64 posted: 01.06.2010 - 4:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Teams are already taking advantage of the new Shootout rules, since it's the DRIVERS who are eligible so it doesn't matter what team they drive for. It's being rumored that Bill Elliott will drive the #6 Roush Ford and Ken Schrader will drive the #82 Red Bull Racing Toyota in the Shootout. They're both Shootout eligible but the Wood Brothers don't intend on running the race and Schrader didn't have a ride in the first place. Schrader is a former Shootout winner while Bill Elliott is Bill Elliott. 119. Billy posted: 01.07.2010 - 3:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Speaking of Ken Schrader, 2009 was the first year since 1984 where Ken did not compete in a Cup race. 120. Talon64 posted: 01.07.2010 - 5:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Looks like NASCAR is going to get rid of the wings on the COT and go back to spoilers, possibly as early as the Bristol or Martinsville race. http://msn.foxsports.com/nascar/story/NASCAR-considers-getting-rid-of-wing-on-Cup-car-010710 121. Talon64 posted: 01.08.2010 - 4:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Terry Cook could be driving full time in 2010 in Cup with Whitney Motorsports, running for ROTY. http://jayski.com/cupnews.htm#news46fri I KNEW IT! I KNEW HE'D DO IT! And losing his Truck ride gave him the perfect opportunity to do it. Terry Cook versus Kevin Conway for ROTY? Son of a bitch. 122. Spen posted: 01.08.2010 - 6:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Even with a start up team, my money's on Cook. 123. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 01.08.2010 - 9:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If Terry Cook finishes the races, I'd have to give him the edge. 124. RR posted: 01.11.2010 - 1:25 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Alright, I know you posted this a month and a half ago, but I just now read it, and I like debating with you... "Actually it was Zippy that held that team together. Before the 2005 season the #20 team members damn near revolted leading Zippy to bring in Tony and everyone else on the team in for a meeting so they could get everything off their chest's about how Stewart was making their lives miserable. That calmed Tony down for exactly one year were he showed his true potential. Despite driving mid pack cars for the first 1/3 of the season he kept his head on straight, and once JGR figured out and perfected the new coil binding setups he was unstoppable. He didn't let adversity or small shit affect him the way it has in every other year of his career. Were it not for the cha$e he would have clinched the title with two races still to go. This despite barely being in the Top 10 at the end of May." I've never heard about this therapy session or whatever, but I'll assume for a moment that it did happen. I'll just say that Zipadelli was no doubt a key factor in Tony success that year (and every year for that matter). Yet, you could also use similar statements to describe the role that Ray Evernham played in Jeff Gordon's accent to the top. Yes, Evernham was a setup wizard, but he was also vital in keeping Gordon's emotions focused, and not letting them get the best of him. In the end, it's up to the driver to use this, as Gordon and Stewart did. I'd also like to remind you about Stewart's 2002 season. He started that year with a 43rd place run at the 500, and was struggling throughout the first 1/3 of the season. I think he was running around 8th. In addition, there were several off-track incidents (including an investigation into claims that Stewart assaulted a woman) that could have derailed the season. Instead, Stewart kept his composure, and dominated the last part of the season, with one exception. At the Rockingham race, Stewart had an absolutely atrocious car, and was trying to stay on the lead lap. Yet, he kept the car out of the fence, and left with a decent finish (14th) which would allow him to "survive and advance". "But come 2006 it was same ol' Tony again. He ran Kenseth into the grass at 200 MPH even though Matt never touched him (this after declaring Kyle Busch and others would kill somebody if they didn't settle down), threw away a Top 5 at Vegas trying to crash Kyle Busch cause he wouldn't roll over and let him pass, got wrecked trying to race Ryan Newman (who had just pitted and had tires 70 laps fresher) at Loudon because he was mad at Ryan for racing him too hard in the past, and crashed out Carl Edwards and Clint Bowyer at Pocono for no good reason. He had the fastest car that year and dominated the cha$e: EXCEPT FOR THE FACT HE MISSED IT!!! That allowed the #48 team to finally get the monkey off their backs and they haven't lost since." Every driver has bonehead moments during a 36 race season; it comes with the territory. And there's defiantly a "coulda, shoulda, woulda" factor that accompanies this season. If Johnson doesn't lose it at Kansas in 2004, he's a five time champ. That said, I don't think that one season defines an entire career. "THAT is why we bash Tony. We know how talented he is. I think he is the most naturally gifted DRIVER in the field, even ahead of Kyle Busch and Jeff Gordon. And yes he has two championships, and a ton of wins, but I still look at him as somebody who has underachieved. To me, he is the Wilt Chamberlain of NASCAR. And Jimmie Johnson is Bill Russell. Less gifted, but with only focused on winning. Like Wilt is to Russell, Tony will go down in history in JJ's shadow despite being more talented. " First, I think the Russell/Chamberlain comparison is flawed. While Russell has more titles than Will, the fact that there's such a heated debate on who was better suggests that Wilt isn't in Russell's shadow. In fact, I would say it is more the reverse, as Chamberlain is regard as the most dominant player in history. But that's a whole other debate. Bottom line, I just don??t; think that any driver, any team, any crew could take down the Hendrick juggernaut. No matter what Stewart (or anybody else for that matter) could do, the title would always be Johnson's to lose. JGR has, for all intents and purposes, played second fiddle to HMS. Thus, I really don't think that Stewart will live in Johnson's shadow. Instead, I think Stewart will be classified in the same regards as Foyt, Andretti, Gurney, etc. as drivers who could win in anything, anytime, anywhere. That, IMO, is the ultimate compliment. Look, I won't contest the point that Stewart is, shall we say, less than likeable at times. But, I think that the chip on his shoulder is what drives him to his greatest heights. The intensity that he brings is what makes him a "talented" driver. Yes, that can sometimes be detrimental, but it's also what "brought him to the dance." To paraphrase Leo McGarry, sometime you got to let Stewart be Stewart, even if it means losing a few battles. 125. Kit posted: 01.11.2010 - 2:15 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Yet, you could also use similar statements to describe the role that Ray Evernham played in Jeff Gordon's accent to the top. Yes, Evernham was a setup wizard, but he was also vital in keeping Gordon's emotions focused, and not letting them get the best of him. In the end, it's up to the driver to use this, as Gordon and Stewart did." To be honest, I think you are giving the crew chiefs too much credit for keeping their driver's emotions in check. One must remember that these drivers are adults and have to be responsible for their own emotions. Jeff Gordon has been pissed off on the track a few times but he's NEVER done anything on the track as boneheaded as some of the crap Tony Stewart pulled. After Gordon and Evernham split, you didn't see Gordon throwing fits and getting into all these little push and shove matches like Stewart has. I think Tony Stewart is probably a better driver than Jimmie Johnson, but he doesn't have the same amount of wins. This is largely because Johnson can see the big picture. Not only can Stewart not see this, but he also used to get caught up in a bunch of controversy with the media and Goodyear. This is not something you want to be involved with if you want to focus on winning consistently. So yes, crew chiefs do keep driver's emotions in check, but there is a limit. Drivers have a maturity level that only they control. "He started that year with a 43rd place run at the 500, and was struggling throughout the first 1/3 of the season" Every season of his career except for 2009, Stewart is usually struggling for the first 1/3 of the season and doesn't pick up steam until later on. Actually if he kept this pattern last year, he might have won the '09 Cha$e. "In addition, there were several off-track incidents (including an investigation into claims that Stewart assaulted a woman) that could have derailed the season." These incidents happen to him just about every season and he's largely to blame. "At the Rockingham race, Stewart had an absolutely atrocious car, and was trying to stay on the lead lap. Yet, he kept the car out of the fence, and left with a decent finish (14th) which would allow him to "survive and advance"." See? If he drove with his head more instead of his emotions, he'd rival Johnson's career. "Every driver has bonehead moments during a 36 race season; it comes with the territory." Stewart has had more boneheaded moments compared to other active drivers; that has been the proble with his career. I mean, hell, look at the fits he threw this year against David Reutimann, who hadn't even won a race at that point, and JPM, who only one one race a few seasons ago. Just saying that every driver has their moments doesn't prove or disprove anything. "Bottom line, I just don??t; think that any driver, any team, any crew could take down the Hendrick juggernaut. No matter what Stewart (or anybody else for that matter) could do, the title would always be Johnson's to lose." Problem is that Stewart is in a Hendrick car and the fact is he did dominate the first 26 races of the year (although Johnson may not have been racing as hard then.) Now, Stewart might not be getting quite the same quality of equipment as Johnson is but I believe that Stewart has enough talent to overcome that. I've seen plenty of drivers who won races with top 10 cars. If Stewart COULD take down the Johnson juggernaut, he's not doing it by trying to put JPM in the wall. Those types of incidents, if they go Stewart's way, they only indirectly help him, but if they don't go his way, they directly hurt him. "Thus, I really don't think that Stewart will live in Johnson's shadow." He already does live in Johnson's shadow. He has over 30 wins and two championships yet Johnson gets the attention. "Instead, I think Stewart will be classified in the same regards as Foyt, Andretti, Gurney, etc. as drivers who could win in anything, anytime, anywhere. That, IMO, is the ultimate compliment." I always find it amusing that you always bring up open-wheel racing when it comes to discussing things that occur inside of NASCAR. I'm a huge Dan Gurney fan. He's one of my favorite all-time drivers. But I also realize that damn near every single NASCAR fan I have ever spoken to do not care about open-wheel racing. Guys like Foyt, Andretti, and Gurney might have done well in NASCAR but as far as a NASCAR fan is concerned, their NASCAR accomplishments are largely overshadowed by the mainstay NASCAR drivers who not only won but won a lot. Their non-NASCAR accomplishments are almost unknown to most NASCAR fans. I'm fine with that. I have friends who are huge into motorcycle racing. Me, I ride a motorcycle every day but I'm a fan of stock car racing. There's nothing wrong with that. But in Stewart wants his NASCAR career to not be overshadowed by Johnson, then iit would be wise to give NASCAR fans a reason to believe that it's not, not just rely primarily on open-wheel fans or whomever who will look at him as being someone who can win everywhere. People are going to look at his racing career primarily through his NASCAR accomplishments. Just because you can win everywhere doesn't mean you won't be overshadowed by those who can win more somewhere. "The intensity that he brings is what makes him a "talented" driver. Yes, that can sometimes be detrimental, but it's also what "brought him to the dance." To paraphrase Leo McGarry, sometime you got to let Stewart be Stewart, even if it means losing a few battles." By that argument, you're implying that Stewart already hit his peak as a driver even though he has potential to do more. If we let Stewart be a man sometimes instead of typical Stewart, and combine that with his talent, there's no reason why he can't surpass Johnson in a Hendrick franchise car. 126. Spen posted: 01.12.2010 - 3:25 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hi, I'm Spen. I'm vaguely insulted by the fact that nobody has ever bothered to impersonate me, even though I've been here longer than almost everyone. I feel left out. 127. Rad83 posted: 01.12.2010 - 9:19 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) This race was very enertaining. Hamlin, that guy is tealented. Good run by Jeff Burton and good top-10 by AJ Allmindinger, Hes no good but nice anyway. I liked this race and I sincerely believe it is a signal that NASCAR is on an uptick. NASCAR is at its healthiest position ever. Economic facts prove that. Jimmie Johnson is the greatest driver of al time. And Dale JR> is gonna win it all next year. He is the second most talented driver ever. Go JR, Go Johnson. Brad K has no talent. Michael Waltrip is a respected veteran and he concluded his fine career. 55, you'll be missed bro.. I miss ya! 128. Talon64 posted: 01.13.2010 - 4:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Canadians and those without cable: Prepared to be royally screwed! ESPN/ABC has changed up their broadcast schedule so that 9 of the 10 Chase races will be shoved over to ESPN, with only 3 of their 17 races being broadcast on ABC (Bristol, Richmond and then the only Chase race will be Charlotte). I'm in the Canadian category so... shit! 129. Talon64 posted: 01.13.2010 - 4:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Andy Hall from ESPN said that the ratings on ESPN were better than ABC. It's true, ABC's races were 3.5 while ESPN was 4.2. And he said that 90% of homes get cable now. So really it's mostly Canadians who will get screwed by TSN. 130. RR posted: 01.14.2010 - 4:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm too lazy to go quote by quote, so I'll just make a few points. - I consider a crew chief to be very similar to a head coach in football. They don't do a whole lot on race/game days, yet they are perhaps the single most important factor in preparations before the game/race and set the tone during the event itself. The best crew chiefs and head coaches are the ones who don't panic, yet can figure out a way to motivate the actual participants. I think Evernham, Zipadelli, Knaus, etc. are all masters at this feat. Yet in the end, the drivers/players are the ones responsible. - Stewart was out of the championship race by the time he had his deal with JPM, so I really don't see how that was detrimental. As for the Reutimann deal, that was mostly brought about by the rain delay. Conflicts happen all the time during a race, but most are usually put on the back-burner. Stewart just happened to have the opportunity to confront him right then. It was pretty much over after that. Stewart called him after he won to congratulate him. As a matter of fact, here's what Reutimann said afterwards: "Tony and I are cool. He gave me a phone call on the way in [to the media center]. Tony Stewart in many ways is one of the guys who has helped me out the most -- because there have been many, many times when I've gotten in his way, especially during my rookie [Cup] year, and he never came down and chewed me out or got all over me or anything like that. He always tried to help me." - What's so hilarious about me drivers for their overall abilities (and that's more that open-wheel, BTW) instead of what they do in a single sport? Is it so wrong that I hold guys who have excelled in all forms of motorsport in higher regard than others? That's just my personal feelings on the issue, and I don't see what is necessarily wrong with that. Frankly, I think it's sad that many fans don't realize the significance that men like Gurney had on auto racing (which is much more than open wheel). The fact is, he was one of the greatest drivers to step in to a stock car, and he is a part of the sports history. That being said, if someone asked me who the best stock car drivers of that era were, I would say Pearson, Petty, etc. Today I would say Johnson, Stewart, and Gordon. Yes, Johnson has all of the spotlight. That's because he's the reigning champ. If Martin won the championship, everyone would be in his shadow. Every baseball team's under the Yankees shadow, etc. Looking back, I think Stewart will certainly be considered one of the top NASCAR drivers of his era. Really, I'd say that Stewart was the best in the first half of the 00s, and Johnson the best of the second half. 131. Rad83 posted: 01.15.2010 - 11:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Uh, someone is impersonating me, I hate Michael Waltrip... oh well. NASCAR has taken a backseat to other sports for me, so I dont care. What a boring race, and Kit I loved your "wiping his own ass" comment about Hamlin. Pearls of wisdom right there! 132. DaleSrFanForever posted: 01.17.2010 - 9:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Ok RR, I'm back. First of all, thanks for not devolving into personal insults and childish name calling. I respect for that, and I will respond with appropriate respect. Here is my response: - Yes, Ray Evernham definitely pushed Jeff Gordon into the stratosphere. I will never doubt that. But at the same time, he could have preached and preached all day about patience and how to run a race and keep his emotions in check, but at some point Jeff had to make the decision to listenand do things the right way. Plus, Jeff never caused a full blown crisis the way Tony has. - The 2002 season was sort of an outlier. Yes Tony was involved in a TON of controversy and issues, but nobody really had a dominant season that year. Sterling looked like the favorite for the first half, but that team started falling off the map even before Sterling got hurt, and the second half of the year drivers played hot potato with the point lead. So I'd argue he really didn't keep his composure, it just sort of fell in his lap. From an average finish standpoint it is one of the weakest championships ever. Overall it was just an uneven year. The #40 team was real good, then real bad. Hendrick wasn't a dominator like they are now, Kenseth won 5 races but wrecked or blew up about 7 other times. DEI had good cars but their drivers were Dale Jr (who battled concussion issues most of the year), Steve Park (still badly messed up from his Darlington crash one year earlier), and Michael Waltrip (who is Michael Waltrip). Ward Burton won twice and finished 25th in points. It was just an odd year (kinda reminds me of '91). If Tony had JJ's temperment (and wasn't a rookie like JJ was that year) he would have won the title easily. - Yes, one season doesn't make a career. But 2006 was a perfect microcasm of Tony's career. A lot of really good moments, and a lot of really ugly moments. Ultimately not being as good as it should have been. And yes, every driver has a few bonehead moves every year, but Tony has had way more than his share. Especially in '06. The only year he reached his true potential was '05. And he blew everyone out of the water that year. - As far as the Wilt/Russell debate, I think it is relevant to Tony vs JJ. Yes, Wilt was dominant statistically, but he didn't give his teams the best chance to win. He got so many points by hogging the ball and in the process took his teammates out of the game. So if he came across someone who could somewhat keep him in check like Russell or Willis Reed, he was sunk. And if anyone really studies their rivalry, they will realize Wilt is definitely in Russell's shadow. They played against each other in the playoffs 7 times with Russell winning 6 of those. (BTW, I hate the NBA nowadays, I just like the older stuff, kinda like NASCAR!!!) Same for Tony vs JJ. Yes, Tony is way more talented, but isn't as good at winning as JJ. And he will go down in JJ's shadow unless Tony does something really spectacular soon. Somehow 2 championships in 4 years just doesn't look as good when somebody who entered the sport 3 years after you to MUCH less fanfare has 4 championships in a row and 10 more wins. - I understand your "chip on the shoulder" argument, but he has to be able to control it a little better. Yes, it got him here, but it has also held him back. 133. Kit posted: 01.17.2010 - 10:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Sterling looked like the favorite for the first half, but that team started falling off the map even before Sterling got hurt" Actually, they started falling off pace two or three races before he got hurt and chances are, they would have rebounded at the end of the season, if you look at how McMurray did at Charlotte among other things. If you're going to fall off-pace for a short while during a championship run, that was the time to do it. "If Tony had JJ's temperment (and wasn't a rookie like JJ was that year) he would have won the title easily." Sterling HAD JJ's temperment and had he not gotten injured, chances are he would have won. He did lead the points for 25 weeks straight. It's amusing how guys like Stewart and Harvick take their rides for granted and they either make boneheaded moves or they underperform, as in Harvick's case. If guys like Sterling and Ricky Rudd had those kind of rides in the early 80s, the sky would have been the limit for their careers. That's why quite a few of the drivers give me such a bad vibe. We went from guys who could bust their asses to win like Harry Gant to prima donnas like Denny Hamlin. 134. DaleSrFanForever posted: 01.18.2010 - 7:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Actually, they started falling off pace two or three races before he got hurt and chances are, they would have rebounded at the end of the season, if you look at how McMurray did at Charlotte among other things." That is true. That is something that is really a shame to me, that Sterling didn't get that championship. It would have been so cool to watch him be toured around New York as the main attraction with that Tennessee drawl. Talk about scoring one for the Southerners! (BTW, if Sterling was given 5 minutes alone with Lane Kiffin right now, how bad would he f**k him up?) "It's amusing how guys like Stewart and Harvick take their rides for granted and they either make boneheaded moves or they underperform, as in Harvick's case. If guys like Sterling and Ricky Rudd had those kind of rides in the early 80s, the sky would have been the limit for their careers." I agree 100%. That is why I take Gordon's and JJ's numbers with a grain of salt. Don't get me wrong, they are both great drivers who thrive in the face of adversity rather than making things worse like Tony, Harvick, and Hamlin, but you have to considet their situations. 135. Sultan posted: 01.19.2010 - 9:27 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) My Preseason Top-12: 1. Jimmie Johnson 2. Denny Hamlin 3. Jeff Gordon 4. Kyle Busch 5. Tony Stewart 6. Carl Edwards 7. Mark Martin 8. Ryan Newman 9. Kurt Busch 10. Greg Biffle 11. Clint Bowyer 12. Jeff Burton What is your opinions on my rankings? What is YOUR top-12? 136. Kit posted: 01.20.2010 - 6:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) To be honest, I don't see Johnson as a "great" driver, I see him as a good driver with a great, dominant team. A team so great that all Johnson has to do is not get flustered during problems (which Stewart needs to learn) and he'll be fine. If Johnson had been in Kahne's ride his entire career, I think his seasons would parallel Kahne's. 137. Talon64 posted: 01.20.2010 - 7:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I don't think only a "good" driver can win 4 consecutive Cup championships. Every piece of the puzzle has to be great in order to accomplish it and I think Jimmie's deserving of his success. He came out of a similar background as Robby Gordon with off-road trucks so he's got the car control. "If Johnson had been in Kahne's ride his entire career, I think his seasons would parallel Kahne's." Wait, so based on that Kahne is ONLY as good as Johnson since apparently Johnson isn't that great? Or in order for Kahne to be so great as to be touted as the successor to Gordon around here, Johnson has to be great too? 138. RR posted: 01.20.2010 - 8:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I agree with you on most of this. I'm just saying that there are some crew chiefs that are better than others at being able to check their driver??s emotions. Evernham succeeded where many others might have failed. Really, I think this is what led to Addington being released from the #18. The cars were great, but Addington wasn't able to control his driver's emotions. I think Rodgers might be able to do a better job at this. I do agree, at the end of the day it's the driver's choice. 2002 was indeed a strange year, though I think 2001 was even weirder. Both those years rank very high among my favorites. In regards to the points battle, 2002 is a good example of Stewart being able to perform under pressure. There were several guys who had a shot at the title that year, and Stewart outperformed them all. Over the last 1/3rd of the season, Stewart was the man. When his car did suck (like at Rockingham) Stewart kept his composure and salvaged a decent finish. I really don't think Marlin could have matched Stewart's performance over the final ten races. Martin, Gordon, Johnson, and Wallace couldn't do it, so I don't think Sterling could either. Besides his win, McMurray had only one other top ten finish. The "good ol' days" are long gone in every sport, not just NASCAR. That's just the world. Gordon, Johnson, Stewart, etc. can't determine when they were born. It's hard to compare today's drivers to Earnhardt, Gant, Rudd, etc., just like it would be hard to compare those guys to Roberts, Weatherly, Petty, etc. It doesn't affect the way I perceive them talent-wise. All drivers at the top get there because they have talent. It might be easier to get into the sport, but it still takes the same variables to actually win big. 139. Smokefan05 posted: 01.20.2010 - 9:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I don't think only a "good" driver can win 4 consecutive Cup championships. Every piece of the puzzle has to be great in order to accomplish it and I think Jimmie's deserving of his success. He came out of a similar background as Robby Gordon with off-road trucks so he's got the car control." I concider Jimmie a 6-10th place driver. But those drivers can win races and championships. By my standards, Jimmie has two Cups not four of them. 08 and 09 are too me the years he has "earned" them. 06 and 07 no he didn't win them. Chad and crew cheated in those years, so in my mind they don't count. But that is just me. "The "good ol' days" are long gone in every sport, not just NASCAR." Thank you, i wish some fans would realize that and come back down too earth. 140. Kit posted: 01.20.2010 - 10:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "The "good ol' days" are long gone in every sport, not just NASCAR. That's just the world." RR, it's funny how you try to come off as this motorsports connoisseur yet you know next to nothing about NASCAR and it wouldn't surprise me that you know little in-depth about other sports. You remind me of a guy I knew who thought of himself as a cigar aficionado yet he couldn't tell you shit about any particular cigar brand. That's not "just the world." NFL football has been as enjoyable to me as it was in 1990. Sure, there's been a few rule changes here and there but nothing ever too dramatic. I don't long for the "good ol' days" of football because there really isn't any. I have as much fun watching it now as I did 10, 15, whatever years ago. If people want to go back to the "good ol' days" of NASCAR, it would be back to where the focus was actually on racing with actual stock cars and not dominant, multiple car teams with NASCAR in their pocket, yellow line rules to determine the winner, changing the points format so the most popular driver at the time can get in, etc. I don't see any problem with moving a racing series back to racing and less staging. "Thank you, i wish some fans would realize that and come back down too earth." That's like saying a guy who lost his hotass wife in a car accident should just settle down with a fat chick. No thanks. There's plenty of avenues of entertainment for me... I'm not that desperate as you seem to be. "I concider Jimmie a 6-10th place driver. But those drivers can win races and championships. By my standards, Jimmie has two Cups not four of them." Personally, I could care less how many championships he has because the Cha$e championship just isn't the same competitive-wise as the old points system. Yeah, I agree, he's more of a 6th-10th place driver and the #48 team just knows how to make the best out of the Cha$e format. With the old points system, you just raced and hoped for the best. 141. Kit posted: 01.20.2010 - 10:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I really don't think Marlin could have matched Stewart's performance over the final ten races. Martin, Gordon, Johnson, and Wallace couldn't do it, so I don't think Sterling could either. Besides his win, McMurray had only one other top ten finish." Damn dude, do you even watch NASCAR at all? Sterling Marlin and the #40 team had been the best driver/team at those particular tracks at the end of the season. If you actually apply the Cha$e system back to 2001 (which is only a ballpark because of changes in driving style), Sterling would have won the 2001 championship. Besides, why in the hell are Martin, Gordon, Johnson, and Wallace even relevant to this discussion? They weren't really even factors in the championship. None of them lead like 25 weeks straight in the points like Marlin did. Johnson was a ROOKIE at the time and showed potential but wasn't too much of a factor... he lost the ROTY to Newman. Jeff Gordon was going to a divorce at the time and went like 30 races without a win... he wasn't in the hunt at all. Wallace stopped his "consecutive seasons with a win" streak in 2002... he was more or less a mid fielder that year. Sounds like you just threw Wallace's name in there because he's a NASCAR driver you are familiar with and that's it. Just a namedrop. And as far as McMurray only having one other top 10 finish, dude, he was a ROOKIE driver. He wasn't Sterling Marlin. Hell, he still isn't Sterling Marlin. Yes, he won at Charlotte but that's because the car was PERFECT. He almost lost that race to Bobby Labonte due to rookie mistakes anyway. I mean, wow, I'd feel like an ass if I went over to the open wheel boards and started spewing off nonsense about the 2002 IRL season that I know nothing about nor do I follow regularly. You should feel the same way. 142. Kit posted: 01.20.2010 - 10:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I don't think only a "good" driver can win 4 consecutive Cup championships. Every piece of the puzzle has to be great in order to accomplish it and I think Jimmie's deserving of his success." Hahaha, you really understate how well a first-tier Hendrick car can run. Why do you think Stewart left Gibbs? Here's a hint, it wasn't so much because he wanted to be a team owner... 143. Rad83 posted: 01.20.2010 - 11:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kit, Bobby Labonte and Dale jarrett are overrated. Do you agree? Please don't ignore me like everybody else does 144. RR posted: 01.21.2010 - 12:19 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) My God do you think you're the only one who should have an opinion on NASCAR? God forbid someone actually disagree with what the almighty Kit speaketh. Stop trying to be some Internet tough guy and actually read what the hell you just said. "Sterling Marlin and the #40 team had been the best driver/team at those particular tracks at the end of the season. If you actually apply the Cha$e system back to 2001 (which is only a ballpark because of changes in driving style), Sterling would have won the 2001 championship." Wahat does this have to do with the price of tea in China? First, 2001 is in many ways irrelevant to 2002. Gordon ran away with the title in 2001, but was winless through most of 2002. Mark Martin had one of the worst seasons of his career in 2001, but finshed 2nd in the points in 2002. Kenseth and Busch sucked in '01, but won a combined nine races in 2002. That's racing; things change from one year to the next. Carl Edwards was the hottest driver at the end of 2008, but did nothing in '09. But I'll entertain you with your ludicrous example. Marlin's Avg. Finish in the final seven races of 2001 (I removed the Loudon race, since it had already been run in 2002): 11.42 Stewart's Avg. Finish: 12.14 Not really that much of a difference over seven races. Stewart's average finish actually includes his 41st place finish (as a result of an engine failure at Martinsville). If you take that out, his average would be ninth. "Besides, why in the hell are Martin, Gordon, Johnson, and Wallace even relevant to this discussion?" Point Standings after 2002 Protection One 400: 1 Jimmie Johnson 3824 2 Mark Martin 3813 -11 3 Tony Stewart 3788 -36 4 Jeff Gordon 3715 -109 5 Sterling Marlin 3703 -121 6 Rusty Wallace 3687 -137 Perhaps you should brush up on what happened that year. To put it simply, it means that FOUR DRIVERS WERE AHEAD OF STERLING MARLIN at the time of Marlin??s last race!! They would have been relevant at that point. The "mid pack" driver was just sixteen points behind Marlin at this point. Like DSFF, this was a weird year in which several different drivers actually had a chance of taking the title well into the year. Holy hell, this isn't rocket science. Marlin might have had a shot, but he would've had a hard time beating Stewart. Stewart had the momentum, Marlin didn't. BTW, I have many of the races from 2002, and I??ve watched them on numerous occasions, in addition to watching them as they happened. "That's not 'just the world.' NFL football has been as enjoyable to me as it was in 1990. Sure, there's been a few rule changes here and there but nothing ever too dramatic. I don't long for the "good ol' days" of football because there really isn't any. I have as much fun watching it now as I did 10, 15, whatever years ago." Did you even get what I was saying? I??ll ignore your straw man and go to your original statement, in which you remarked that ??we went from guys who could bust their asses to win like Harry Gant to prima donnas like Denny Hamlin.? The backlash against so-called ??prima-donnas? is a common occurrence in all sports ?? baseball (with the 1994 strike and the ginourmous guaranteed contracts), football (with guys like T.O. who won??t stretch out for a catch), and basketball (Latrell Sprewell??s infamous ??I have a family to feed? comment). I then added that the "good ol?? days" of sports in this respect are over (money kind of does that), but that it doesn??t diminish their talents. Yet you managed to misunderstand that statement as well. You remind me of some 6th rate Howard Stern wannabe imitator who can??t actually be entertaining without trying to be a blowhard. When he tries to do anything else, he sucks at it, because his cognitive abilities are limited at best. The only way he can get people to listen is when he says something ??controversial.? In the end, he adds nothing to the political, social, or sporting discourse. I disagree with many people??s opinions (like DaleSrFanForever) on here all the time. Yet I'm able to have debates and discussions with them because they act like mature adults who don??t resort to ad hominems all the time. 145. Bronco posted: 01.21.2010 - 9:57 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "My God do you think you're the only one who should have an opinion on NASCAR? God forbid someone actually disagree with what the almighty Kit speaketh. Stop trying to be some Internet tough guy and actually read what the hell you just said." Well said. I love how Kit acts like he runs this site, how we're all supposed to stay on topic and never bring up a driver's open wheel success, and how he acts like his holy opinion is the definitive truth, and anyone who disagrees with him apparently doesn't watch NASCAR at all. Pretty funny. And if you hate Denny Hamlin so much, then no one is forcing you to buy his gear, no one is forcing you to root for him, and no one is forcing you to watch him or his car on TV. You don't like him because he doesn't fit the mold of what a NASCAR driver was 20 years ago, which is fine, but don't come here crying about it. Take your "bad vibes" and lump it. Go watch reruns of the Tyson Holly Farms 400 and Goody's 500 and leave everyone else alone. 146. DaleSrFanForever posted: 01.21.2010 - 1:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I'm just saying that there are some crew chiefs that are better than others at being able to check their driver??s emotions. Evernham succeeded where many others might have failed. Really, I think this is what led to Addington being released from the #18. The cars were great, but Addington wasn't able to control his driver's emotions. I think Rodgers might be able to do a better job at this. I do agree, at the end of the day it's the driver's choice." I agree with the first part. Like I said earlier, the driver/crew chief relationship is a two way street. If they had just let Gordon keep driving the way he did in 1993, his career would have been similar to Ernie Irvan's (without the awful crash). 3-4 wins a year, and a LOT of crashes. Now as far as Kyle Busch, I don't think he'll listen to anyone. It just seems like it is bred into the Busch Boys. "Over the last 1/3rd of the season, Stewart was the man. When his car did suck (like at Rockingham) Stewart kept his composure and salvaged a decent finish." That is true, but it took an extremely turbulent first 2/3 of the year to get him to focus and realize how bad he was getting. He finally had to snap and punch a photographer for him to say "Hey wait, I've got a problem". Luckily it was 2002, and nobody had run off with the points at that point like they did in 2001 (Gordon) and 2003 (Kenseth) so he had a chance to make up for his deficit. The only other year that he could have gone through all that and still had a shot at the title was 1991, when Earnhardt and Ricky Rudd ran away from everyone in the points, then spending the 2nd half of the year taking turns inventing new ways to screw up races. (I'm excluding cha$e years. Just look at Krt Busch's numbers from 2004 and then think about fact that he is that year's CHAMPION! Somebody please hand me a bucket.) "The "good ol' days" are long gone in every sport, not just NASCAR. That's just the world." The problem is that all of NASCAR's problems that have caused them to be so much less fun to keep up with have been self inflicted, short sighted changes that didn't need to be made. There was no need for a new points system, no need for the Lucky Dog, no need for debris cautions every 50 laps, no need to try to go Hollywood, and no need for them to try to control every aspect of the sport instead of just allowing them to RACE!! Yes, there was a need to overhaul the car they were using (the quality of racing had been slowly declining since 1995), but what they came up with was an absolute abomination. Thank you Brett Bodine. 147. DaleSrFanForever posted: 01.21.2010 - 1:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Go watch reruns of the Tyson Holly Farms 400 and Goody's 500 and leave everyone else alone." I don't think we can do that, they didn't have loop data and driver ratings back then, so we couldn't properly put a race and its drivers in perspective. I mean look at us now, if it wasn't for the driver rating, we'd think that Dale Mears had a REALLY bad year. Can you believe how primitive things used to be? 148. RR posted: 01.21.2010 - 1:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hell Kit, I??ll throw some more facts out there? Average Finish from race 20-29 (the last races in which Marlin raced that season) Marlin: 19.5 (This includes two DNFs [crashes]. If I remove his two crashes, his average would be 14.8) Stewart: 10.0 Gordon: 15.3 (Three wins during this period, but two engine failures and a crash. Removing those three DNFs, and his average would be 10.8) Martin: 13.9 Johnson: 12.3 Wallace: 15.9 So, at the very least, it is clear that Marlin??s competition had caught up with him, and in some cases passed him. But was Marlin??s season actually that dominant? Yes, he did have the points lead for a very long period of time, but was he actually head and shoulders above the rest of the field? From twelfth race of the season (the Coca-Cola 600) until the twenty-sixth race of 2002 (Chevy Monte Carlo 400, which was Marlin??s final race where he had the points lead) Marlin??s biggest gap between himself and second place was 136 points (after race 13). In eleven of those fifteen races, Marlin left the track with a point lead of less than 100 points. His average points margin over second place was 71. Not a formidable gap by any means. From the Pennsylvania 500 to the Protection One 400, Marlin lost the point lead, and a ton of points to many of his competitors? To Martin: 216 To Stewart: 341 To Gordon: 200 To Johnson: 265 To Wallace: 243 To be brief, Marlin was struggling mightily during the homestretch, while the other contenders were peaking (especially Stewart). Also, Marlin really didn??t run out front all that much. He led 451 laps in the 29 races he ran. After 29 races, Johnson (744), Stewart (685), and Gordon (905) had all led more laps than Marlin. As had Dale Earnhardt Jr. (851), Ryan Newman (633), and Matt Kenseth (595). Marlin didn??t lead any laps at the Spring Martinsville, Charlotte, and Atlanta races, and led only two laps at the Talladega race. Look, Marlin had a great season in 2002, probably his best of his career (along with 2001 and 1995). His streak of leading the points is certainly a great accomplishment. Yet, it doesn??t prove that Marlin was the ??dominant? car of the year, nor does it state that Marlin was a shoo-in for the Cup. The fact is, Stewart had a great second half, which would have been hard to beat, especially considering Marlin??s cold streak. Belittle me however you want, but I actually know what the hell I??m talking about. 149. RR posted: 01.21.2010 - 1:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I agree with the first part. Like I said earlier, the driver/crew chief relationship is a two way street. If they had just let Gordon keep driving the way he did in 1993, his career would have been similar to Ernie Irvan's (without the awful crash). 3-4 wins a year, and a LOT of crashes. Now as far as Kyle Busch, I don't think he'll listen to anyone. It just seems like it is bred into the Busch Boys." Good point. If your look at his 1992 Busch season, that's pretty much how it went. He won three times, and led a ton of laps, yet crashed a lot and wasn't a factor in the title chase. I think the jury's still out on Kyle Busch. If he wants to actually hunker down and try to win a Cup Title, there's really no stopping him. He's still young enough to where he might actually reexamine himself in this regard. It'll be an uphill battle for sure. "That is true, but it took an extremely turbulent first 2/3 of the year to get him to focus and realize how bad he was getting. He finally had to snap and punch a photographer for him to say "Hey wait, I've got a problem". Luckily it was 2002, and nobody had run off with the points at that point like they did in 2001 (Gordon) and 2003 (Kenseth) so he had a chance to make up for his deficit. The only other year that he could have gone through all that and still had a shot at the title was 1991, when Earnhardt and Ricky Rudd ran away from everyone in the points, then spending the 2nd half of the year taking turns inventing new ways to screw up races." Agreed, he did benefit from the fact that it was a wild battle all year. Yet, even he had a "good" season in '01 and '03, I don't think he could have beaten Gordon and Kenseth. For a few years (1998-2003), it seemed like one guy would have a "perfect" year in which it was impossible to catch them (Gordon in 1998 and 2001, Jarrett in 1999, Labonte in 2000, and Kenseth in 2003). It seemed like Stewart was the "best of the rest" in all of those years (from 199 on of course). It's wasn't so much that Stewart was throwing it away, but rather that drivers would have insanely successful years. "The problem is that all of NASCAR's problems that have caused them to be so much less fun to keep up with have been self inflicted, short sighted changes that didn't need to be made" The "good ol' days" comment was in reference to the drivers, in that the days of the Earnhardts, Pettys, etc. are over. It's just a different world. In terms of on the track stuff, I couldn't agree with you more. The head honchos of NASCAR must have went to the Jeff Zucker School of Business, in that they really had no idea how to adapt their product. They had to rely on things that would work in the short term, but would be detrimental in the long run. 150. Smokefan05 posted: 01.21.2010 - 3:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "There's plenty of avenues of entertainment for me... I'm not that desperate as you seem to be." I've actually excepted what NASCAR has become. Real fans don't leave just because their favorite sport changes. If "NASCAR car" fans hate what it has become so much, they wouldn't be hear complaining about it, they would be gone. I'm not just a NASCAR fan, i'll most forms of racing from BTCC too Late Model Dirt cars. As long as it's fast and makes alot of noise. I'm excluding IRL and F1, they are B-O-R-I-N-G too me. No offense too you open wheel fans. 151. Talon64 posted: 01.21.2010 - 8:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) RR hit the nail on the head regarding 2002. It's a shame that Marlin got injured so we'll never know for sure if could've made a run in the last 7 races but the odds didn't look good at that point. Of the four drivers ahead of Marlin in the standings at the time (Johnson, Stewart, Martin and Gordon) here's how they did in the last 7 races. Stewart: 8.57 avg finish, with 3 top fives, 4 top tens, and didn't finish worse than 18th. Averaged 145 points per race. Martin: 10.57, with 3 top fives, 5 top tens and a worst finish of 30th. 136 points per race. Gordon: 14.43, with 4 top fives, 5 top tens and finishes of 36th and 42nd. Johnson: 18.71, with 3 top tens and finishes of 22nd, 37th and 37th. Gordon and Johnson didn't do well enough in the last 7 races to stay in contention so it was down to Martin and Stewart who were both averaging in the top 10. Marlin was 85 points behind Stewart with 7 races to go so he would've needed to average 13 points a race more in order to beat him which would be about 158 points a race. Without bonus points, that translates to an average finish of around 4.5. To even beat Martin, Sterling would've needed 15 points more points a race which means averaging 151 points per race which would put his average finish, without bonus points, at 6th. Regarding bonus points, Marlin led 12 of the 29 races he ran so he averaged so he averaged at least 2 bonus points a race. Even including that the average finish to beat Stewart is still 5th-6th and Martin is probably 7th. Considering Marlin's performance up to that point, it's pretty unrealistic. 152. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 01.22.2010 - 10:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's just a shame that Sterling's career went from good to the junkyard after that 2002 Kansas crash. A guy like him deserves better than the card he was dealt. 153. DaleSrFanForever posted: 01.25.2010 - 5:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Alright, let's start a debate: Whose choke was more epic? Juan Pablo Montoya at Indy or Brett Favre in New Orleans. 154. Talon64 posted: 01.25.2010 - 6:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Favre in New Orleans because it cost the Vikings a shot at the Super Bowl. JPM's Indy loss is closer to the Saints' loss against the Bucs in the regular season, really disappointing but not a factor in terms of the big picture. 155. Smokefan05 posted: 01.26.2010 - 4:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I watched the Saints-Vikings game, Brett should have run with it. But who i'm i kidding, he has done stupid things before and screw things up. JPMs loss didn't affect the big picture, he made the Chase and finished top 10 in points. 156. DaleSrFanForever posted: 01.26.2010 - 8:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That is true, but here is my counter point: JPM could have doubled his Cup win total and won the second most prestigious race of the year at Indy. Plus JPM and his team were in complete control of that entire race. The Vikes were lucky to even have a shot to win after they fumbled the ball 47 times and Favre got beaten up worse than Michael Waltrip's Land Rover two years ago. But I have to admit, Brett's choke was pretty damn epic. 157. Anonymous posted: 01.27.2010 - 12:49 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) DaleSrFanForever, Don't put Brett and JPM in the same Sentence for choking. JPM doesn't have the history of Choking like Brett does. I can say that as Packer fan since the 1980's. JPM hasn't been the position to win a lot of races in cup. It is better to compare Brett to Dale Jr or even Denny Hamlin for that matter. Dale Jr. had the car to beat during a race many times in his career and his team chokes including the driver. It is either Jr. or Denny Hamlin for choking. I brought up Hamlin because the driver or the pit crew gave up at least 5 or 6 wins since 2006. Brett even has "Mental issues" against playing the Dallas Cowboys in Dallas like Dale Jr has "mental issues" at times during career so far and Brett is also known to be an emotionally player on the field. A quarterback is supposed to calm and collective and Brett never has been that unlike Joe Montana. Denny's "Mental issues" as well known also. Those 3 are mentally weak at times despite being very talented. Denny also has problems keeping his emotions in check like Brett does. 158. Smokefan05 posted: 01.27.2010 - 2:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) There is a single difference between Brett and Diva, Brett has a championship, Diva doesn't. 159. Talon64 posted: 01.27.2010 - 7:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Tony Stewart is probably the most like Brett Favre; both are among the best ever at doing what they do, both have had issues with their emotions and making mistakes but both wouldn't have the highs either if they didn't wear their hearts on their sleeves. But Tony's had more highs than lows. There's probably only been 4 seasons that Tony's had a shot at winning the championship and he's made good on two of them in 2002 and 2005; 2006 was probably his worst season in terms of letting himself down while 2009 was just a mostly new team suffering a valley at a bad time and wasn't his fault. If Brett Favre retires then he'll have thrown an INT in his last pass attempt with his last 3 teams: The Packers, Jets and Vikings. With the Packers and Vikings it was in the NFC championship game. 160. Anonymous posted: 01.31.2010 - 4:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Smokefan05, It is true that Hamlin doesn't have a championship, but Brett Farve didn't win a Championship after becoming a diva. Brett didn't become a diva before Ray Rhodes or Mike Sherman became the head coach of the Packers. That means Brett didn't become a diva before he was in his early 30's. One of those two coaches handled Brett differently than rest of the players of the Packers. Brett got a big head from the special treatment from the head coach of the Packers as a result. 161. JeffGordonFan posted: 02.04.2010 - 8:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This was Matt Kenseth's last race with DeWalt sponsorship after 10 seasons of success. It was the #5's last race with Kellogg's sponsorship. 162. Kit posted: 02.07.2010 - 4:32 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I don't see any resemblance between Farve and Stewart. I don't like Farve... he's an attention whore and prima donna. I LOVED how the asshole threw that interception in the Saints game; Farve is always good for a pick when it matters most. I also didn't like how he isolated himself away from his teammates when he played for the Jets, as he had his own office and didn't even sit with them at lunch. But Farve hasn't thrown these little hissy fits like Stewart as far as I can tell. At least Farve acts like a man. "RR hit the nail on the head regarding 2002. It's a shame that Marlin got injured so we'll never know for sure if could've made a run in the last 7 races but the odds didn't look good at that point." Marlin's team had a top 3 team if not the best team for the final seven races in 2001. Why in the hell do you think Jamie McMurray won a race in the #40 car? It sure wasn't for driving talent, no offense to McMurray. The car was so good that all he had to do was limit the amount of rookies mistakes he made and he won a race. The team was dialed in. Marlin is also a good clutch driver so more than likely he would have won '02 had he not been injured. "So, at the very least, it is clear that Marlin??s competition had caught up with him, and in some cases passed him." Wow, RR, you needed stats for that? It was never under debate that Marlin and the #40 team were slipping during those races. What we were discussing is whether Marlin would have rebounded after the Kansas race had he not wrecked. There is a very good possibility that he would have because: Race number #30 Talladega #31 Charlotte #32 Martinsville #33 Atlanta #34 Rockingham #35 Phoenix #36 Homestead He won at Talladega and Charlotte and he would have probably won the fall Charlotte race instead of McMurray had he not got injured. Rockingham was one of his best tracks and he probably would have won there at least twice had he drove better cars most of his career. He got beat by Matt Kenseth that year at the Rock only because Marlin drove through an oil spill on the track. He was also really good at Atlanta and Martinsville. Under the Cha$e format, he would have won the 2001 championship, which doesn't mean anything except that his team was dominant at the end of the season. That's all I have to say about that. Marlin was definitely a driver capable of winning a championship under the old points system, something that can't be said with quite a few active full-time drivers. 163. Kit posted: 02.07.2010 - 4:38 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Don't put Brett and JPM in the same Sentence for choking. JPM doesn't have the history of Choking like Brett does. I can say that as Packer fan since the 1980's. JPM hasn't been the position to win a lot of races in cup." I agree to an extent because Farve is a flawed quarterback who could have been a lot better than he was had he extinguished the gunslinging mentality he had (which Romo successfully did this past season). BUT JPM could have won Indy at least had he not choked. I also don't see him having that good of a run this year because chances are, the better teams will rebound from sucking it up last year. He probably could have won two races last year had he not been such a choke artist who can't see the big picture. 164. Kit posted: 02.07.2010 - 4:49 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Well said. I love how Kit acts like he runs this site, how we're all supposed to stay on topic and never bring up a driver's open wheel success, and how he acts like his holy opinion is the definitive truth, and anyone who disagrees with him apparently doesn't watch NASCAR at all. Pretty funny." Considering I haven't even been on here for several weeks, that kinda goes against your argument that I think I run the site. IF I ran the site, I wouldn't spend so much time posting because I'd be busy setting up all the stat tables and everything. But anyway, Bronco, it's a common opinion on here that you're just some 20-year-old with the maturity level of a 14-year-old girl who wants to throw a fit every time someone disagrees with you instead of actually debating them using sources and figures. Your unbalanced emotions eclipses even Dale Mears, a guy who can't even win a f***ing race unless he's got a crew chief busting his ass like a father figure. He can't even contend consistently with the best team in the sport. BTW, I used to go on message boards over ten years ago for the sole purpose of trolling, and my friends and I did a hell of a lot better job than you ever could. At least we were getting death threats. On here, everyone just reads your posts like a madman who just wrote on the wall of his padded room. 165. Kit posted: 02.07.2010 - 4:59 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "how we're all supposed to stay on topic and never bring up a driver's open wheel success" Another thing, if it's a NASCAR board, then yes, it's a good idea to stay on topic regarding NASCAR. That's Internet etiquette that has existed since the late 70s. I'm also not going to analyze Bo Jackson's entire baseball career during an Oakland Raiders discussion regarding how good of a running back he was even though football and baseball both required athletic skill (but different rules) from Jackson. 166. Kit posted: 02.07.2010 - 5:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Kit, Bobby Labonte and Dale jarrett are overrated. Do you agree? Please don't ignore me like everybody else does" Of course not. They are both champions and Jarrett was the most competitive driver in his era who wasn't named Gordon. 167. reffy posted: 09.09.2010 - 4:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If NASCAR used an elimination style chase, eliminating the bottom five, five races in, and than reset the points for the top 5 (ie, for this experiment, 1=25, 2=20 etc...) this would be the standings. Jimmie Johnson - 8754 Kurt Busch - 8705 -49 Jeff Gordon - 8700 -54 Mark Martin - 8698 -56 Tony Stewart - 8551 -203 168. ii posted: 09.29.2010 - 6:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jimmie deserves 2 championships. Just look at the traditional points since '06. 169. Cooper posted: 05.04.2011 - 2:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 2009 Final Standings by Driver Rating --Driver rating essentially takes all luck out of the equation and depicts who were the best drivers in each race. I sorted every race of the chase by driver rating and assigned the points accordingly to where they finished in driver rating. 1. Jimmie Johnson 6627 2. Jeff Gordon -79 3. Mark Martin -90 4. Denny Hamlin -102 5. Kurt Busch -124 6. Juan Montoya -171 7. Tony Stewart -243 8. Greg Biffle -399 9. Kasey Kahne -412 10. Ryan Newman -421 11. Carl Edwards -498 12. Brian Vickers -643 The point battle was closer than it actually was. Jeff Gordon ran really well in the chase but failed to close some races. He should've been second but finished 3rd. Loudon where he finished 15th he should've gotten a 7th and at Talladega he should've pulled off a Top 5 but instead finished 20th and lost ground to the point leaders. 170. Bob posted: 01.24.2012 - 6:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) almost no start and park 171. Daniel posted: 05.22.2012 - 11:03 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) In using fastest 43: #87 Joe Nemechek Out using fastest 43: #08 Terry Labonte 172. kup posted: 05.24.2012 - 1:03 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) UPS - Universal Points System - after all races of 2009 Cup Points for a driver = His Distance /devided/ His Average Finish Dis/AvFn = Driver = KM-Miles / AV-FN 1360 Jeff Gordon 13872 / 10,2 1353 Tony Stewart 14075 / 10,4 1246 Jimmie Johnson 13829 / 11,1 1080 Kurt Busch 13819 / 12,8 1013 Denny Hamlin 13373 / 13,2 173. CBASS posted: 02.04.2013 - 8:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sponsor updates #42 Target/ Polaroid #47 Little Debbie Chocolate Cupcakes #82 Red Bull Cola #34 ETA Shuttle/ Taco Bell http://archives.ciastockphoto.com/cgi/images.php?group=w0940 174. LASTCAR posted: 04.24.2013 - 12:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Michael McDowell picked up the 2nd last-place finish of his career in Sunday's Ford 400 at the Homestead-Miami Speedway when his #36 Wave Energy Drink Toyota fell out with overheating problems after completing 35 of the race's 267 laps. McDowell was one of the biggest surprises in qualifying, securing the 18th spot at a speed of 171.434 mph. The run marked the best start for Tommy Baldwin Racing since the Daytona 500 with Scott Riggs. On race day, Marcos Ambrose led four laps, slipped to fourth, then fell to last when he had to make a pair of unscheduled stops for a cut tire, a dead battery, and a faulty carburetor. McDowell went behind the wall on lap 35 and Ambrose returned to the track on lap 42, moving McDowell to the 43rd spot. It is McDowell's first last-place finish of 2009; his only other finish came in the 2008 Lifelock.com 400 at Chicagoland while driving for Michael Waltrip Racing. It is the third last-place finish for Tommy Baldwin Racing; the other two finishes came with Patrick Carpentier at the Pocono 500 at Pocono and the Lenox Industrial Tools 301 at New Hampshire. 2009 last-place champion Dave Blaney failed to qualify for the season-ending race, as did third-ranked Joe Nemechek. Neither second-ranked Tony Raines nor fourth-ranked Mike Bliss had a ride for Homestead. Travis Kvapil qualified Bob Jenkins' #37 car 28th, but was unable to tie Phil Parsons' #66 team for the most last-place finishes in 2009. After David Stremme spun James Finch's #09 during qualifying and missed the show, the #37 team acquired the #09's Miccosukee Resort & Gaming sponsorship and was able to run the entire race for only the second time in 2009. 2009 RANKINGS - FINAL 1st) Dave Blaney (8) 2nd) Tony Raines (5) 3rd) Joe Nemechek (4) 4th) Mike Bliss (3) 5th) Patrick Carpentier, David Gilliland, Bobby Labonte (2) 6th) Tony Ave, Todd Bodine, P.J. Jones, Matt Kenseth, Travis Kvapil, Joey Logano, Mark Martin, Michael McDowell, Mike Skinner, Mike Wallace (1) Visit http://brockbeard.blogspot.com/ for more. 175. 88&4Fan posted: 10.12.2015 - 11:14 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Man I would REALLY like to see some certain people eat their words about Dale Jr right now. 176. Nascar Lead Lap Points posted: 10.01.2016 - 10:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Driver Change DC 7 Matt Crafton Menards/Mapei Robby Gordon Toyota 177. kup posted: 11.16.2017 - 2:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) * Tony started 5th and finished 22nd in the final race. IF he'd finish 19or18th he'd clinch with AF 10.3 Even if Jeff'd won final race (finished 1st, not 6th) AND Tony'd finish 14or13th he'd clinch it. UPS: universal points system. Driver's UPoints = Miles / Aver.Finish 2009 UPS _ Driver = Miles / AF 1360 Jeff Gordon 13872 / 10.2 1353 Tony Stewart 14075 / 10.4 1246 Jimmie Johnson 13829 / 11.1 & TOTAL: UPS! 61 years 1949-2009: Dale Earnhardt 8 in: '80, '86, '87, '89, '91, '93, '94, '95. Richard Petty 7 in: '63, '64, '67, '71, '72, '75, '79. Lee Petty 5 in: '50, '52, '54, '58, '59. Jeff Gordon 5 in: '98, '01, '04, '07, '09. David Pearson 4 in: '66, '68, '69, '76. Cale Yarborough 3 in: '74, '77, '78. Bobby Allison 3 in: '81, '82, '83. Mark Martin 3 in: '90, '97, '02. Buck Baker 2 in: '56, '57. Rex White 2 in: '60, '61. Terry Labonte 2 in: '84, '96. Bill Blair 1 in: '49. Fonty Flock 1 in: '51. Herb Thomas 1 in: '53. Tim Flock 1 in: '55. Joe Weatherly 1 in: '62. Ned Jarrett 1 in: '65. Bobby Isaac 1 in: '70. Benny Parsons 1 in: '73. Darrell Waltrip 1 in: '85. Bill Elliott 1 in: '88. Alan Kulwicki 1 in: '92. Dale Jarrett 1 in: '99. Bobby Labonte 1 in: '00. Matt Kenseth 1 in: '03. Tony Stewart 1 in: '05. Jimmie Johnson 1 in: '06. Carl Edwards 1 in: '08. 178. Minnowfur posted: 05.12.2018 - 4:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) My top 10 favourite races in 2009 1.Talladega first one 2.Southern 500/Darlington 3.Atlanta first one 4.Texas chase race 5.New Hampshire first one 6.Daytona 500 7.Richmond first one 8.Daytona 400 9.Road Course 10.Martinsville first one 179. Anonymous posted: 04.19.2020 - 7:57 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) To Date the Last Time someone ran car 08 in a cup race. 180. SweetRich posted: 07.09.2020 - 9:01 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) The final race for Robert Yates Racing. The remnants of the legendary team would go to Richard Petty Motorsports in 2010 with driver Paul Menard and the #98 car going to the multi-car team. 181. SweetRich posted: 07.09.2020 - 9:28 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) The final race for Martin Truex Jr. competing for Dale Earnhardt Inc., later named Earnhardt Ganassi Racing. 182. SweetRich posted: 07.09.2020 - 9:30 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) The final race for Michael Waltrip competing on a full-time level, which Mikey had been since his rookie year back in 1986. 183. SweetRich posted: 07.09.2020 - 9:32 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) The final career race for Hall Of Fame Racing. 184. SweetRich posted: 07.09.2020 - 8:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The final career race for John Carter, the owner of R & J Racing. 185. Rich posted: 11.27.2020 - 10:33 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) After airing every single chase for the sprint cup series championship race from 2007 to 2009, ABC would air their last race in their second run with the cup series minus the Charlotte and Richmond night races until the 2nd ESPN NASCAR run ended in 2014. Homestead's cup race would air on ESPN from 2010 to 2014. 186. JSPorts posted: 11.27.2020 - 10:53 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I hope ABC/ESPN get back into NASCAR when the new TV contract comes up. I'd love to see them do about 1/4 of the races. 187. Rich posted: 11.27.2020 - 11:21 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) 2023 will be when the wheels will start to turn about what new networks will air NASCAR's cup series. It probably will not happen, but I would love to see CBS return to the sport after an absence of over 20 years. The turner network duo of TNT and TBS I don't see happening, either, but one can only dream. Maybe when the announcement is made and one or the other does happen, I would love it. We shall see what happens. 188. Pacer posted: 11.27.2020 - 1:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) For years there was a general push at Disney to move as much desirable sports coverage as possible off free to air ABC and onto paid cable channel ESPN. ABC tends to air the bare minimum of sports to meet TV carriage contracts (and usually fills the time with "World of X-Games" documentaries on the weekend and the like). If ESPN/ABC comes back into the NASCAR fold don't expect many of those races to be on ABC. 189. Rich posted: 11.27.2020 - 2:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sad but true. 190. possum posted: 11.27.2020 - 6:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @186 - 1/4 on ESPN implies at least 3 and perhaps 4 networks sharing the coverage? That would be significant change of philosophy for NASCAR. Back when they took over TV rights back in 1999 their stated goal was to put all the races on one network, a plan which had to be revised when no network was willing to pony up the requested money. Thus since the new contracts started in 2001 NASCAR has always split between just 2 networks (technically 4, 2 broadcast and 2 cable, but no-one differentiates between FOX/FS1 or NBC/NBCSN now-a-days). ------------------------------------------------------------------------ *Post a comment:* Your comment may not appear immediately - all comments must be approved by the moderator. Name: Comment: