|| *Comments on the 2011 Good Sam Club 500:* View the most recent comment <#299> | Post a comment <#post> 1. LordLowe posted: 10.22.2011 - 9:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) I wonder what will happen tomorrow 2. Anonymous posted: 10.22.2011 - 9:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Clint Bowyer should be regretting his decision to sign with MWR after the 00, 55,47 had their windshields confiscated by Nascar. The 47 car is part of MWR by being a satellite team. 3. 00andJoe posted: 10.22.2011 - 10:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #46 sponsor: Red Line Synthetic Oil/Green Stuff Absorbent 4. potatosalad48 posted: 10.22.2011 - 11:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Unfortunate that the 77 car failed to qualify. T.J. Bell was running Dan Wheldon's name above the door in honor of the fallen Indycar Champion. 5. LordLowe posted: 10.22.2011 - 11:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hey where is DaleSrFanForever 6. NicoRosbergFan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:40 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) RIP Marco Simoncelli 7. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 9:51 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) This week, I will preview the cha$e guys and what they need to have happen, and the chances that will actually happen. First off, a thought about this year's championship "fight" as a whole. It is starting to look a lot like 1991 and 2002. Nobody has really stepped up for an extended amount of time. Nobody has really looked like a champion yet. Just like those previous two years I mentioned, I am thinking "does anyone actually want this?". Carl: has run deceptively well at the plate tracks. He hasn't won yet, but he is usually there at the end. Needs to finish this one and get a good finish next week at Martinsville (where he is also better than people realize). The last three look good for him. Harvick: has to be the favorite for this one. The closest thing to a sure bet you will get in this era of plate racing. Has 3 teammates that will do whatever it takes to help him. He can get a big lead here and next week. But again, it is so hard to predict this team. Just when you think they will run bad, they run great and vice versa. Like Carl, he needs to take advantage of this year. This may be their best chance to be Cup champions with the 48 way behind the 8 ball and nobody else stepping up. Matt: crucial weekend for him. He has looked the most like a champion this year, but is behind due to the Chicago gaffe. Even with that, he is just 7 back. Needs to survive here and MVille. If he can, then he has a great shot. KyBu: look who is actually still not too far out of the hunt this late in the game for once. His team has really let him down so far. And with the coming switch to TRD motors, they have really damaged his best chance thus far at the Cup. Has really struggled with this 2x2 deal. But if they can survive this and regain their mid summer form, he could take this. Smoke: closer than people realize. With his talent, he is certainly somebody who can't be counted out. Really good plate racer. If he can get back near the front, look out. Brad: make or break for him. If he gets in trouble as he always does in 2x2 plate racing, his Cup hopes are done. If they can gain points here and continue their performances from summer before last weeks Charlotte stinker, they can do it due to nobody stepping up. KuBu: a good pick to win this one, but way too inconsistent for the Cup. Always seems to invite turmoil, now they have the possibility of Addington leaving hanging over their heads. Who would have thought his younger brother, 7 years younger, would mature before he did. JJ: i'm not counting him out yet, but that is a tall mountain to climb. The good news for them is that nobody is stepping up yet. But they can't wait around. They need to start gaining ground now. One of the biggest things is for them to maintain their streak of always being Top 5 in points. That is in jeopardy. June: his best shot at ending his famous winless streak. He is done in the points, needs to finally win again. With Danica on the horizon and other drivers gaining fans, he is in danger of becoming irrelevant and losing his meal ticket status. Sponsors won't pay for irrelevant. Newman: just needs to hope he stays on all 4 wheels the whole race. Gordon: racing for pride at this point. He needs to remind everyone agin just who the hell Jeff Gordon is. I say watch for this team next year. Denny: needs to get these TRD shitboxes up to speed. 8. 18fan posted: 10.23.2011 - 12:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think Kyle's biggest problem with the 2x2 is that he always drafts with Joey Logano and Joey doesn't seem to push very well without screwing up at least once. 9. cjs3872 posted: 10.23.2011 - 1:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) A couple of notes. First, even though he qualified fourth, it's almost certain that Trevor Bayne will drop straight to the back, simply because he doesn't have a drafting partner. He was to have Carl Edwards in that role, but Jack Roush apparently told Edwards to work with Greg Biffle, and not Bayne, and Bayna and the other non-RFR Ford drivers were told by Roush and Jamie Allison not to draft with non-Ford drivers. Frankly, I think they should keep out of who the drivers want to draft with. Now one of the fastest cars in the field has no hope of a good day, simply because it (the #21 car) has no drafting partner. After all, that's what eventually led to Bayne crashing in the Firecracker, because he had no drafting partner. Eventually, after dropping halfway through the field, he found Brad Keselowski, who wrecked him. But now something far more serious. In an occurrence that harkens back to the infamous tire sabotage incident prior to the 1974 Talladega 500 (won by Richard Petty), Jimmie Johnson's team discovered a flat right front tire in the garage this morning. They were allowed to change it without penalty, of course. Normally when a driver qualifies in the top ten, he has to start the race on the tires he qualified on, but obviously, this is a safety situation, so the team was allowed to change the right front tire without any kind of a penalty. Now there's no proof of sabotage in this case, but in light of Johnson's crash at Charlotte eight days ago, along with the tragic deaths of Dan Wheldon last week and Moto GP rider Marco Simoncelli this morning, this must be brought up. Also, does anybody else think that something terrible may happen today? After all, my father always told me that good things and bad things always come in threes. Motorsports has has two racing-related deaths in the past week, so is a third coming, and if so when and where? 10. cjs3872 posted: 10.23.2011 - 1:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 18fan, seems like Joey Logano and Greg Biffle may have something in common there. Remember that in the Daytona 500 that Biffle caused Kenseth to crash head on at the start-finish line, and in the Firecracker 400, Biffle, making the same mistake that Brad Keselowski made which caused Trevor Bayne to crash, Biffle caused Carl Edwards to crash making the same mistake. That means that in two of the three plate races this year, Biffle has caused a TEAMMATE to crash, which may be one reason that Edwards originally wanted to partner with Bayne, but Roush, fearing that Bayne's slow pit crew (and pit equipment?) might hold Edwards back, told Edwards to draft with Biffle for today's race. And let's not forget that the Logano-Busch combination was good enough to win the Nationwide race for Logano this past July. 11. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 1:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The look on Matt's face when they went to the studio was priceless. It was "what the hell am I doing here?". Jack's decision was dumb. That is just his classic way of micromanaging. Why limit who can draft with who? Those limitations will hurt them. Just dumb. That is why, despite having tons of extremely talented drivers since 1988 and top notch support from Ford, he has only won 2 championships. Then he had the gall to trash talk JJ after Charlotte. I still hope Matt wins it (unless Brad gets back in it) mainly because I like Matt, but also because he is more Robbie Reiser's driver than Jack's. 12. Cooper posted: 10.23.2011 - 1:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "9. cjs3872 posted: 10.23.11 - 1:01 pm" I believe we've already had three. Wheldon, Huseman, Simoncelli Everything will be okay. I trust the safety devices that NASCAR has developed over the years. 13. Spen posted: 10.23.2011 - 1:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF: "I am thinking "does anyone actually want this?"." Quite true. And it's not just Cup. Across the board this year, with the exceptions of Vettel in F1, and Pursley in Winston West, pretty much every series has had people more or less trying to lose the title: Cup: You've pretty well documented the shortcomings of virtually every driver this year. Busch: It's finally settled down somewhat, but ESad and Stenhouse certainly gave away more than their fair share of points this year. Enough so that Almirola, who's had a terribly invisible year, is sitting third in points. Trucks: Sauter and Dillon have been taking turns at screwing up races. To the extent that a driver who was penalized the equivilant of 104 points, and a driver who's both winless, and has DNQ'd for a race both have a serious shot at it. Busch North: Brett Moffit had the championship in hand, then blew a tire with three laps to go, handing the championship to Max Gresham. Modifieds: Similar situation. Todd Szegedy wrecks with two to go, and gives the title to Ronnie Silk, who was running nineteenth. IRL: Franchitti tries to give the title to Power, who promptly gives it back. ARCA: While it never cost him much point-wise due to the overall lack of competition, virtually every race that Ty didn't win was because he messed up at some point. TMMC: I'm stretching by including this, but it's so ludicris I have to mention it. While it's partially caused by their absurd points system, Alexis Rainsford, who's sat out half the races this year, still has a good shot at winning the championship. Adrian Devereoux, the point leader, has an average finish of *17.9*. And he's seriously done the best job among the full-timers. Every time he has a bad race, everyone else in the top ten in points does too. 14. jabber1990 posted: 10.23.2011 - 2:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) why would you want to hide in the back during plate races? so you hide in the back to avoid wrecks, why not hide in the front? if you get mid-pack you take a huge risk of getting involved in the wreck your trying to avoid am I right? 15. cjs3872 posted: 10.23.2011 - 2:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Alright, Cooper, I must have missed the other one. And jabber1990, there's more of a chance of getting in a wreck at the front of the field at Talladega than you might think. In fact, some of the worst wrecks in Talladega history have been started by the leaders, and not just because of driver error. You think of the 1979 Winston 500 (caused by a blown tire), the 1987 Winston 500 (blown engine, which led to a blown tire), the 1996 DieHard 500 (contact between cars), the 1997 DieHard 500 (blown tire), 2003 spring Talladega race (blown tire), etc., and you'll find that hanging out in the back is sometimes safer than running up front. (I didn't include the 1973 Winston 500 because, even though that involved most of the leaders, it actually started with a couple of slower cars.) Sure there have been crashes at the back, too, but I'd rather hang in the back than race all day at Talladega, since unlike Daytona, you have room to make your move. The only question if you're running in the back would then be when to make your move. 16. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 2:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeez NASCAR, these 2x2 races are laborious enough to watch, don't prolong it with debris cautions. 17. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 10.23.2011 - 2:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "TMMC: I'm stretching by including this, but it's so ludicris I have to mention it. While it's partially caused by their absurd points system, Alexis Rainsford, who's sat out half the races this year, still has a good shot at winning the championship. Adrian Devereoux, the point leader, has an average finish of *17.9*. And he's seriously done the best job among the full-timers. Every time he has a bad race, everyone else in the top ten in points does too." I LOL'd hard when i saw this. A series that isn't even real (even tho i highly recommend to anyone who has a youtube account to sub to the guy who does this, he is very good) has good racing based on a computer simulation of a video game (NR2003 for those how don't know). But its a mix of F1 and NASCAR or as someone who did a rant on it (it is F1 rules with NASCAR bodies). 18. cjs3872 posted: 10.23.2011 - 2:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yes, DSFF, two championships (and one of those was because of the stupid Chase format in 2004), and just one win in the Daytona 500 (with Kenseth in 2009), no wins at all at Indianapolis, though he has been close with a number of drivers. Roush has also never won a qualifying race at Daytona. Not to mention that his personality hasn't exactly sat well with all of his drivers, as well as his stinginess where sponsorship is concerned. (Roush ran Kurt Busch for part of the 2001 Cup season and the #99 car for most of the 2004 season without sponsorship, and his ineptitude for finding sponsors for his Nationwide program for the last couple of years, including for this year's Daytona 500 winner, who happens to be one of Roush's Nationwide drivers, has been well documented.) He's also made some pretty dumb driver decisions, most notably letting go of Jamie McMurray in favor of David Ragan, over the years, as well as not letting potential talent flourish with a hook quicker than that of the late Sparky Anderson (who was known in the baseball world as Captain Hook becuase of how often he removed pitchers from the game). 19. Mr X posted: 10.23.2011 - 3:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Talladega is wasted on NASCAR. I can't stand superspeedway racing anymore. Thank god Martinsville is in 7 days. Hopefully Good Year brings a similar tire to what they had in the spring. 20. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 3:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Ol' Sparky, a true character and legend. Is it just me, or are the front guys not having to switch at all? So much for NASCAR's new rules. 21. jabber1990 posted: 10.23.2011 - 3:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) they dont have to switch, all they have to do is get enough air into the grille, and those cars have 3 grille openings, 22. 18fan posted: 10.23.2011 - 3:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Is it just me or do Kyle and Joey separate more than anybody else and for a lot longer than anybody else? 23. Cooper posted: 10.23.2011 - 3:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Much like Joseph's career, the tire blows. Caution. Average race so far. Go Robby G. Brad stinks at this type of racing. That is all. 24. Mr X posted: 10.23.2011 - 3:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I noticed that too 18fan, and Trevor Bayne should've been on the other side of the yellow line. Another disaster of a day for Joey. 25. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 3:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Good job Joseph. Not. 26. Cooper posted: 10.23.2011 - 3:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) June Bug, to the lead, and the State of Alabama celebrates! 27. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 3:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I know he won a Daytona 500, but Newman has to be the most snakebit plate driver ever. 28. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 10.23.2011 - 3:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Talladega is wasted on NASCAR. I can't stand superspeedway racing anymore. Thank god Martinsville is in 7 days. Hopefully Good Year brings a similar tire to what they had in the spring." well no one has a gun to your head forcing you to watch it. 2 car drafts to watch for: 7 and 21: Robbys experience and Baynes good pushing could lead to either one of them getting to VL. 51 and 13: james finch has good plate eqiupment and casey helped Robby in the spring. 22 and 78: obvious. 9 and 43: ford power 34 and 38: same as above last but certainly not least, 71 and 32: Texas has the experience and help Lally get to the front. 29. 18fan posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Now I'm starting to think the Gibbs cars can't stay tucked up for very long because now Kyle and Denny keep separating. Or maybe it's something that Kyle is doing, but it's impossible to know. 30. LordLowe posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) and there goes harvick's chance for the title 31. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That looked like 2003 Matt Kenseth getting through that mess. 32. Spen posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Top five: Robby Gordon, Tony Stewart, Mark Martin, Jeff Gordon, Bobby Labonte. What is this, 2001? Looks like a Harvick championship won't be happening. 33. jabber1990 posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) damn, alot of the drivers I was rooting for were invoved in that wreck Logano has all that damage and he is Stewart's dance partner, so honestly im not too worried 34. 18fan posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Harvick almost won this race with a damaged car last year, but I don't think he can do it again. That wreck is the story of the year for Montoya and McMurray. They finally have really good runs going and they are minding their own business and are taken out in a crash. 35. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Harvick ain't done inn this race. I wish he was cause I can't stand him, but he ain't done. 36. Mr X posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jimmie may be back in this title fight after today, anything can happen. 37. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If that smoke from the 29 is something serious, I may have to rescind my statement. 38. Cooper posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NASCAR do your job and send some of these damaged cars to the garage. Harvick has been leaking oil for 8 laps straight, Allmendinger has half a car, and there out there dropping debris like it's no ones business. 39. Cooper posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Send him to the god damn garage nascar. He's still blowing freaking oil! Idiots. 40. Cooper posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Thank you, NASCAR! Mike Helton Bravo. #29 to the garage. Championship done. 41. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Statement rescinded. I was wrong about the 29 in this race. All the good luck he has had thus far getting good finishes out of bad runs turned around. 42. jabber1990 posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) screw you ESPN, im tried of this nonstop crap, I think its just an excuse to have commericals and an excuse to not work also, if the economy is so bad how can companies afford these $100,000 commericals every break? 43. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 4:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Ding ding ding. There is the anwser to ending this 2x2 stuff. No lower bumper covers. 44. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dear Mikey: Please stop showing up for these plate races. Whatever you once had here (a blatently dominant car) you have lost and you do nothing but tear our shit up. Sincerely, All The Drivers 45. New 14&88 Fan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bobby Labonte and Kurt Busch both get screwed by Mikey Waltrip, things should get pretty interesting now 46. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Michael Waltrip causes a wreck by stupid bump-drafting every fricking plate race. Dear gawd. Poor Bobby he looked a little shaken up too that was a hard lick. Wreckin' ain't done I got a bad feeling about this. 47. OldSchoolNascarDude posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I would want Bayne pushing me. It's obvious he's not going to pass, but he will push better than anyone in the field. 48. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Regan took a HARD hit. 49. Mr X posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That was a hard crash for Regan. 50. New 14&88 Fan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Regan Smith's car hooked similar to JJ's last week at Charlotte, thank God for the hans device and safer barrier 51. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Regan was inches away from hitting Gordon. Had that happened, we would have a double-digit number of cars wrecking. I feel jumpy about wrecks after last weekend still. I know it's part of the sport but still. 52. 18fan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nasty licks for both Bobby Labonte and Regan Smith. Glad to see both those guys get out under their own power. Definitely a testament to the safety of the cars, the HANS device and the SAFER barriers. 53. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Agreed. I fear more hard licks might be coming though. 54. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Good job RCR. Smart pullaway and great photo finish. 55. Mr X posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Clint should enjoy what could quite possibly be his last victory, or at least his last for a long time. 56. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brad needed that. 57. New 14&88 Fan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm sure RC regrets letting Clint get away now, Great Win for the #33 team.Also awesome run by Dave Blaney and Tommy Baldwin Racing. 58. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Clint and Jeff were fighting for what could be their last win for a while. 59. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Likely the last Top 5 of Vickers's career. 60. Schroeder51 posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think some kids might be eating free on account of who finished 3rd... 61. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @ 60 Awesome! Blaney deserved a good run. 62. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 5:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) So how's Carl gonna choke the Points lead? 63. Bronco posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) JJ is DONE! 64. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @63 #JJISSUPERMAN xD 65. Cooper posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This race ending was weird. None of the two car tandems could hook up with each other, except the #33 and #31. God damn, my heart was beating on the GWC. This racing is just screwed up. One lap I find it exhilarating, next lap I find it irritating. 66. Mr X posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That fire in the #78 hauler was frightening. 67. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @65 #WRONGFOOL xD. RCR got their 100th win. #BIGE 68. jabber1990 posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I dont think Jimmie is done, the next three tracks are some of his best, but hes 50 points out, so if he is still alive, it will show up during the next 3 races 69. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) A big hell yeah to Blaney, the Blaniacs, and TBR for an outstanding run. 70. jabber1990 posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) wow ESPN, not one mention of how many cars were involved in the big crash, nor did you say how many lead changes there were go off the air, 71. jabber1990 posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) and ESPN claims to be all "NASCAR!" but the moment the race ends they are so quick to throw it to ESPN. 72. 18fan posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Great teamwork all day by the #33 and #31. Although I would have preferred Burton to win, I was still happy to see Bowyer win because Clint and Jeff both tried to run up front all day. The EGR and RCR cars were the best all day. Bowyer and Burton were the class of the field in terms of hooking up on restarts and that was evident on the last restart. 73. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm happy to see Burton have a nice run. It was his first real good race all year. 74. . posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jimmie Johnson and Dale Earnhardt Jr. failed to come to the front at the end of Daytona after spending the entire day in the back. So what do they do? Sit at the back until the very end and fail to move forward again! Good win for Clint Bowyer. He and Burton led 51 laps between the 2 of them. They were about the best group all day and deserved to fight out the win. 75. Bronco posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The leaderboard shows unofficially 72 lead changes among 26 drivers. 76. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, I want a full race report on all 43 drivers. Start...... NOW #SARCASM. But analyze the Chase guys right now tho lol. I say JJ wins STILL. 77. Spen posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Congrats to Clint, I guess. Would have rather seen Burton win, but I don't mind Clint. I wonder if Ragan lost Matt on purpose. I think Carl's got this one now. But a big yay for Blaney! Happy birthday, Dave! 78. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @Bronco tell me a story about the good ole days. 79. Cooper posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The chase is a 5 man race. Simple as that. 80. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Thank god they didn't wreck or other wise i would have screamed. Congrats to Clint, pulled off a great move to get by Burton. Jimmie is farther back in the points now then when the race started. 50 points is a full race and 7 postions on track, not done but on life support. Robby why in the hell can't you finish a plate race? I guess kids are going to be eating free tonight, way to go dave. :-D 81. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @Michael Waltrip please stop driving. @Mark Martin- yet another bad plate race for Mark. 82. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @Cooper analyze the Chase Son. 83. AlmirolaFan88 posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I actually feel bad for Jeff Gordon, he got royally screwed over by T-Bayne. He should have went with Mears! 84. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @83- I thought Bayne was supposed to help Gordon win the race? That's what ESPN tried to brainwash us with. #BULLSHIT 85. LordLowe posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The guy who lead the most laps today was pace car driver Brett Bodine 86. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) @85 Cool story bro. 87. Spen posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Japan: That was the original plan, but when your sort-of teamate who's contending for a championship loses his draft partner, you kinda have to go with him. Didn't really work out for either of them, but he didn't have much of a choice. 88. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @87:I actually agree with you. I just feel that the association was too little, too late and a dumbass commentator was kissing their ass. That's all. 89. I Love Japan posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @ Everybody: It's been nice chatting with y'all I got a WWE PPV to go watch. Final thoughts on today's race: The Chase is gonna get more exciting, Tandem racing still sucks, and Tony Stewart's still got it. Peace out boys and girls :) 90. Brad24 posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Both races this weekend were won by the #33. Great race and finish. There were some hard hits today. Mainly by Smith and Bobby Labonte. Glad they walked away. As for Trevor Bayne...Wow. So much for remembering what Jeff Gordon did for him during Speedweeks. Using techniques taught by Gordon to win the 500. I have officially lost respect for him. What goes around, comes around. 91. Mr X posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I have a feeling that when Jeff and Trevor were drafting and Matt came up from behind and bump drafted Trevor, the bump got passed through to Jeff Gordon, Jeff then lost it, and had to move up to save it, and by that point Trevor was starting to go past Jeff. This is just my speculation however. 92. Anonymous posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I thought that was a scumbag move by Clint Bowyer. Burton NEEDED this win 30x more than Bowyer because Jeff has to fight age. Bowyer will drive for MWR for a few years, stink, and then find a good team like Ambrose did. 93. Cooper posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @ILoveJapan, follow me on twitter @Cooperfect.... Edwards: He's the man, he was my pick to win it, and so far it looks good. Too bad he sucks at Martinsville. Martinsville Finish: 17th Probability of Winning Championship: 39.5% Kenseth: He'll be consistent down the stretch, unfortunately he sucks at Martinsville as well. Martinsville Finish: 21st Probability of Winning Championship: 20% Keselowski: Coolest dude since Earnhardt. Martinsville Finish: 11th Probability of Winning Championship: 15% Stewart: Short track program stinks to high heaven. Martinsville Finish: 24th Probability of Winning Championship: 12.5% Harvick: He's the man to beat next week. Martinsville Finish: 1st Probability of Winning Championship: 10% Busch: He's jinxed. Out of it. Probability of Winning Championship: 2% Johnson: Please try again Probability of winning championship: 1% 94. 00andJoe posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That was cool. I can't help but wonder What If, though...the 36 and 2 hadn't come "unstuck" briefly on that final restart... In the spirit of all the Twitterish comments here, all I have to say is: Jimmie Johnson, THAT is why you don't do the "hang in the back" thing, because that is based on the assumption you'll have enough laps to come to the front. And you know what they say about assuming. #STICKAFORKINHIMHESDONE. "and ESPN claims to be all "NASCAR!" but the moment the race ends they are so quick to throw it to ESPN. " I presume you mean SportsCenter? And yes. But that's because SportsCenter is their cash cow - all the acutal sports are just sidelines... 84/87/91: From what I saw, Bayne didn't have a choice. He was pushing Jeff, then Matt came up to push him, and before Jeff could recover from the shove, Kenseth was already pushing Bayne past the 24. 92: Oh, really, so there should be...wait...TEAM ORDERS DICTATING RESULTS? Instead of drivers doing everything they can to win? I think the Ferrari F1 team might have a position open for you. 95. potatosalad48 posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Great run for Blaney ending up 3rd. I was hoping Jeff Burton could hold on to win, but 2nd is great for that team considering the bad luck they've had all year. As far as the championship is concerned, Jimmie has 1 last chance to make something happen, and that's Martinsville. 96. 00andJoe posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #66 sponsor should just read "HP Racing" for consistency with all the other races in the database. 97. 00andJoe posted: 10.23.2011 - 6:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Also: #87 is "AM FM Energy", not "AMFM" 98. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 7:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @I Love Japan, be careful what you wish for, I just might analyze all 43 drivers :) The #33 car gets RCR's 33rd non-Earnhardt victory #yeahBigE 99. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 10.23.2011 - 7:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Possibly Bowyer's last win for a while (assuming he comes to his senses and eventually leaves MWR). 100. cjs3872 posted: 10.23.2011 - 7:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brad24 (#90) and Mr X (#91), need I remind you that the Ford drivers were strictly instructed by Jack Roush and Jamie Allison, the head of Ford Racing not to, in any way, aid the non-Ford drivers in the Chase. If this had been earlier in the year, Bayne may very well have helped Jeff Gordon the way he aided Robby in this race, and Bayne was, of course, in a Ford. Bayne was also getting assistance from Denny Hamlin early in the race before drafting with Robby much of the race. And also remember that it was reported that Bayne was to have had Carl Edwards as a partner, but Roush apparently nixed that as well, though that was never confirmed. but please get the facts stright when it comes to why Bayne didn't help Jeff Gordon late in the race. In fact, I believe Bayne wanted to help Jeff late, but remembered, or was told that he couldn't, due to the politics of the situation. And speaking of Bayne, what happened during the Joey Logano again proved to me that Bayne has the one thing that can't be taught, and that is instinct. How he wasn't involved in that is beyond me. When Logano soun behind him, but at a greater speed, Bayne, who had committed himself to making a pit stop, quickly moved his car one to one and a half lanes to the left to avoid an incident he couldn't see. And how he never spun Robby Gordon out when Robby's bumper cover was coming off may be no less remarkable. And while there are some that are criticizing Michael Waltrip for his late-race incident with Bobby Labonte, that was far from the only case of a driver spinning another out because of being on the left rear corner, instead of the right rear, such as the incident where tony Stewart spun Ryan Newman out in the tri-oval, or where Brian Vickers duid the same to Kasey Kahne at the same point on the track. I don't see anyone criticizing either Stewart or Vickers. And even Terry Labonte, who has probably caused fewer incidents than anyone else in the modern history of the sport, given how long he's been racing, was even guilty of the same thing when he spun Andy Ally in turn three late in the race, an incident that also involved Jimmie Johnson, who's title aspirations are officially done. 101. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 7:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Clint was 2 inches from winning 3 in a row at Dega. RCR never won 3 in a row here, not even with Dale, but they would have had Harry Gant and Darrell Waltrip not cheated at the 1991 Winston 500 (just kidding, only Darrell cheated). But they have won 3 of the last 4 at Dega with Clint and Kevin. That is the 3rd time RCR has done that along with '90-'91 and '99-'00. Ironically, the non win both times was a 3rd in the Spring race. 102. Mr X posted: 10.23.2011 - 7:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm not completely denying that the Ford drivers were strickly helping other Ford drivers however, I believe that Jeff getting loose did have a bit to do with him being left completely without drafting help, not to mention according to a roof cam on Dale Jr's car it looks as if David Ragan missed a gear on the final restart, and set up the situation with Matt Kenseth needing help in the first place. 103. Benny posted: 10.23.2011 - 7:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) well I guess it's safe to say that jimmie johnson will not win #6 104. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 10.23.2011 - 7:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "And while there are some that are criticizing Michael Waltrip for his late-race incident with Bobby Labonte, that was far from the only case of a driver spinning another out because of being on the left rear corner, instead of the right rear, such as the incident where tony Stewart spun Ryan Newman out in the tri-oval, or where Brian Vickers duid the same to Kasey Kahne at the same point on the track. I don't see anyone criticizing either Stewart or Vickers. And even Terry Labonte, who has probably caused fewer incidents than anyone else in the modern history of the sport, given how long he's been racing, was even guilty of the same thing when he spun Andy Ally in turn three late in the race, an incident that also involved Jimmie Johnson, who's title aspirations are officially done." You bash one person for doing it, you bash the others for doing it but sadly hypocracy happened. 105. irony posted: 10.23.2011 - 7:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Glad Dave Blaney got the finish he deserved in the spring. With that said ... I demand JJ be stripped of all 5 of his titles, Dale Jr to change his last name, and JJ give his lucky horseshoe to Robby Gordon. Not only that, I demand he transplant it into Robby's butt himself. That is all. 106. OldSchoolNascarDude posted: 10.23.2011 - 7:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I hate to see Bayne become the villain in all of this. Obviously he wouldn't blatently lie to Gordon on his plans. Circumstances changed once Ragan couldn't get up to speed on the start. If anyone needs to be ridiculed, it should be Ford for how they've handled the entire weekend. 107. cjs3872 posted: 10.23.2011 - 7:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And I forgot to mention that Marcos ambrose did the same thing to A.J Allmendinger, igniting the crash that involved among others, Kevin Harvick and Juan Montoya. And it's also interesting when Robby Gordon, Bayne's drafting partner, fell out that Bayne began to push Ambrose toward the front. The Wood Brothers helping Richard Petty's team. Somehow, even though they're both Ford teams now, that just doesn't make sense, and never will make sense. That would really have been more ironic if it was Allmendinger that Bayne was pushing toward the front, though. Could you imagine the #21 pushing ever the #43 car to victory, or vice versa. And if Bayne did break his promise to help Jeff, it would also prove that Bayne has what Darrell Waltrip referred to Richard Petty's teeth, as fangs. Bayne may have those "petty fangs" in his teeht at the end of races, which you need to have to succeed in the sport. Let's remember that Dale Jarrett won two of his three Daytona 500s by breaking promises to Mark Martin. And Jarrett was as nice as they got, but when he was competing, there wasn't a tougher driver to beat, especially in the sport's biggest races, with the exception of Jeff Gordon. And by the way, even though Gordon was complainig about Bayne's broken promise after race, Gordon should never have been in that position because he should have, by all rights, been eliminated in Regan Smith's crash. In fact, Smith left front may have ticked Gordon's left rear as he headed straight into the wall in undoubtedly the scariest incident of the day, if not the season. and by the way that incindet was cause by another mistake made by the once mistake-free Mark Martin, who has probably made about six to eight driving mistakes on the track that have resulted in wrecks this year, and today's was the scariest of them all. 108. Texas Terry posted: 10.23.2011 - 7:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I will not say Johnson is out of it. 50 points is a pretty damn big deficit, but I will not start believing anyone else is going to win this championship until Johnson is mathematically eliminated. 109. cjs3872 posted: 10.23.2011 - 8:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Right, OldSchoolNascarDude, which is why I commented earlier this year that if Bayne doesn't get a full-time ride by the start of the 2013 season, that he should start looking at a Chevrolet team (maybe Ganassi?). Remember that Jack Roush really runs things for Ford. I believe his edict to the Ford teams to not help the non-Ford teams was a ploy to make sure that no Ford other than a Roush Racing Ford would win today. Remember that Trevor Bayne can push anyone to the front. His pushing Robby Gordon and helping him lead ten laps is proof of that. And the Petty teams were helping each other before one wrecked the other. And let's not forget how Roush was, almost single-handily responsible for the demise of Robert Yates Racing because he was sick of being beaten by Yates. I really believe Roush orchestrated this whole thing to make sure that no other Ford team other than his had a chance to win. I also believe that, while Roush was outwardly happy that Trevor Bayne and the Wood Brothers won the Daytona 500, he was incensed inside, not because one of his drivers (David Ragan) was penalized, but rather that another Ford team won the race over his. 110. Eric posted: 10.23.2011 - 8:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This might be Clint's last cup win in a while. Here is my take the chase drivers for Martinsville: Edwards: nothing special, but he left dega in great shape. Martinsville isn't a good track for him. If he gets in trouble there, it opens up who is in title contention. After Martinsville, he is in great shape with Texas coming up after Martinsville. Matt Kenseth: faded late, but got a top 20 finish. He is not that great at Martinsville. If he gets a top 10 at Martinsville, he will be in great shape going to one his better tracks at Texas. Brad: great finish and gained points on Edwards. I don't trust Brad at Martinsville. Martinsville is going to a big test to see where the team is at for the chase. Tony Stewart: faded late at dega, made up points on Edwards with most laps led besides finishing in the top 10. Martinsville hasn't been a good track for him for the last 3 times for him with his best finish being 24th during that span. Kevin Harvick - got luck that Carl finished 11th. Kevin had bad luck at Dega today, but still in it. Martinsville is a decent track for Kevin. He could gain ground on Carl, Matt, and Brad there. Kyle Busch - got in same wreck as Kevin did. He has a slim chase at Martinsville to get back in it. He figured out the track out during the spring. If finishes in the top 5, he should gain ground on Carl. Jimmie Johnson - Worst finish here for the fall race since he got a 24th place finish in 2006. Martinsville is a great track for him. He could get back into points contention. Kurt Busch - victim of the crash that Micheal Waltrip caused. Kurt has no chance at the championship. Kurt's last top 10 at Martinsville was when he was at Roush and that is why I don't think has a chance to gain points next week. Dale Jr. - he had the best finishing Hendrick car in the chase. No chance for the championship despite being good at Martinsville. Jeff Gordon - he a good car, but no drafting help caused his finish. He is great at Martinsville, but it will not be enough to get him back into the chase. Denny Hamlin - He might not finish last in points after all. Ryan Newman - he has bad luck at plate races. He can't win the chase. 111. OldSchoolNascarDude posted: 10.23.2011 - 8:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #109- I can agree with that. Jack is a great owner, but he's proven to be very full of himself at times when it comes to business. 112. cjs3872 posted: 10.23.2011 - 8:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And trust me, Dale Earnhardt, Sr. never would have gone along with such a plan as the one Roush employed this week. Let's not forget that it was Dale Earnhardt, Sr., of all people, that puushed Jeff Gordon to his second Daytona 500 win in 1999. Earnhardt only cared about getting to the front, and in restrictor plate races, he never once cared who he aided in getting there. If it was a Ford driver he helped get to the front so that he would get to the front, so be it. Three-time Indy winner Bobby Unser once said on an IROC telecast that sometimes you have to help someone else win the race in order to get second for yourself, and he was, and still is, so right about that. Not of of the legendary drivers that helped build this sport would ever have gone along with such a plan. He wouldn't have, and neither would any of the other legends who helped build the popularity of auto racing in this country would have, either. Not Petty, the Allison brothers, Yarborough, Foyt, Mario Andretti, Baker, Benny Parsons, Waltrip, Elliott. None of them would have. I know that if I was in Bayne's position, I might have aided Gordon just to spite Roush, even though he's contracted with him in the Nationwide Series. 113. OldSchoolNascarDude posted: 10.23.2011 - 8:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) But Bayne isn't in the position to tick off the only owner who can afford to stick with him. He hasn't built up a big enough resume to do that yet. In this state of the racing economy, it's important to be the "yes man" when told to do something. 114. Eric posted: 10.23.2011 - 8:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs3872, I disagree with you partly with Jack Roush almost being single-handily responsible for the demise of Robert Yates Racing. While Roush and Yates had an agreement that included engines, it was more than that for demise of Robert Yates racing. The sign of Robert Yates Racing starting to decline started in 2002 despite both teams being in the top in points. Jarrett and Rudd were 45 when the 2002 got started. Dale Jarrett got old and Elliott Sadler was not a great driver to begin with. Cup drivers usually don't win multiple times in a year when there were 46 years old or past that age and Yates was playing the odds with Dale Jarrett. The only cup drivers that win multiple times over the age 46 are very good or legends of NASCAR in Lee Petty, Richard Petty, Bobby Allison, Cale, Harry Gant, Dale Earnhardt and Mark Martin. 2003 was when Yates was off and that was prior to Yates having an agreement with Jack Roush in 2004. 115. 18fan posted: 10.23.2011 - 8:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Series leading 6th win of the year for Richard Childress Racing is also the 100th win in the history of RCR. They broke their tie with JGR, Penske, Hendrick, and Roush for wins this year. Overall wins by team this year: Richard Childress 6 Joe Gibbs 5 Penske 5 Hendrick 5 Roush-Fenway 5 Stewart-Haas 3 Richard Petty 1 Furniture Row 1 Wood Brothers 1 116. cjs3872 posted: 10.23.2011 - 9:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Eric, Elliott Sadler made the first Chase in 2004 driving for Robert Yates and won two 500-mile races that year (Texas and California 2), so that argument just doesn't fly. Yes they were doubtlessly in decline in 2003, but they seemed to be pulling out of it in 2004. Sadler's 2004 season was proof of that. Let's also not forget that Yates finished 2-3 (led by Dale Jarrett) in the 2004 Brickyard 400. But when Yates made the Chase in 2004 with Sadler, I believe Roush then decided to cut off the support for Yates. Roush just can't stand getting beat by others within the same brand, and I think what happened this weekend was another case of it. He knew that another Ford team might win if they teamed up with a team from another manufacturer (i.e. the 7 and 21 cars teaming up today), so he put a stop to it because he wants to be the only Ford team to win. It's just that simple. And I don't think it's any big surprise that Trevor Bayne's Nationwide season began falling apart shortly after his Daytona 500 win, driving a Ford for another team and beating Roush's top team in doing so. I think Roush wanted to send a message to Bayne for beating one of his cars in the Daytona 500 in another Ford. He may have wanted to make Bayne pay for that Daytona 500 win by making sure that he lagged behind Ricky Stenhouse, Jr., even though I think Stenhouse does have a higher ceiling than Bayne may have. And that goes back to well before Bayne got ill. Let's not forget all the pit road, pit crew, and communication problems that Bayne has had in his Nationwide car this year. (Remember Montreal?) And when Bayne was forced out of his Nationwide ride from his illness, he withdraws the car for a race so it has to qualify on time. Again, making sure that Bayne can't truly compete with Stenhouse on the track. It's my belief that a lot of Bayne's problems in the Nationwide Series this year can be traced back to his Daytona 500 win with the Wood Brothers, and who he beat in doing so, given Roush's vindictive nature, which may also be why Roush hasn't even attempted to find Bayne a sponsor, in my opinion. In fact, Bayne's Daytona 500 win was the first win by a Ford not owned by Roush since Dale Jarrett's final victory at Talladega. And that was in the fall of 2005. 117. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.23.2011 - 9:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It really sucks to see somebody with the last name "Allison" (Jamie) and that works for Ford be in the center of such an embarrassing deal. For those who remember the early 90s, that names "Allison" and "Ford" was no joke. What Davey did in that red and black Thunderbird made this Earnhardt fan nervous. And if you want to go back further, Bobby Allison resurreccted his career in Bud Moore's Fords from '78 thru '80 after a few winless seasons where it looked like he might be too old and washed up. With Bud, although the equipment was inconsistent, they won a ton of races including Bobby's first Daytona 500 (of 3) and would lead to top rides at Ranier and DiGard with many more wins coming and finally a championship. 118. Ivan Balakhonov posted: 10.23.2011 - 9:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Another restrictor-plate race, another mistake by Mark Martin, another crash caused by him. Old Man, it's time to retire. It was funny how ESPN had been building the story of Gordon/Bayne reunion until after the restart Jeff was left without any support. 119. Bronco posted: 10.23.2011 - 9:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The #33 wins both the Truck and Cup races at Talladega this weekend. Dave Blaney gets the kind of finish that he deserved in the spring before Kurt turned him around. First ever top 10 and top 5 for TBR. Regan Smith's transporter caught on fire after the race, but it was quickly put out before it could spread. Kevin Harvick should never have been allowed to even take the green on that restart, his car was smoking way before he got black flagged. Because the Fords refused to cooperate with others, not one of them finished in the top 10. Dale Jr and JJ obviously didn't learn their lesson from Daytona. Yet again they hung around the back the whole day (based on Chad's orders), and lost touch with the lead when it counted most. Its disappointing as a fan to see Dale Jr's wishes to run up front being "overruled" and being made to help the #48. You can't wait until the last 10 laps to make your move, because any caution that comes out reduces the number of laps that you have to race to the front. Which brings me to my next point. 9 of the final 13 laps today were run under caution, leading to a final 2 lap sprint, which is why the finish didn't play out naturally like in the spring race here where we had the 3 way photo finish. In the future, I would like to see NASCAR red flag the race and stop the cars away from where the safety workers are and let them clean up the track, and then restart the race. This way we don't have cars running out of fuel under caution or coming to take the green. The same thing happened in the truck race yesterday, the caution came out for the #84's crash, they restarted and immediately a debris caution fell, which led to Hornaday and Wallace being able to drive away in a 2 lap sprint. Nice touch by NASCAR to honor Dan Wheldon with the B-pillar decals and the moment of silence. ESPN made the wrong move with picking the wife of an IndyCar driver to narrate the tribute to Wheldon, which was definitely hard on her. Carl comes from almost nowhere to finish 11th, which means he increases his point lead. Martinsville is a question mark for him, Phoenix is a wild card, but Texas and Homestead are some of his strongest tracks. This is Burton's first top 5 since a runner up at last fall at Dover. If he was a little more aggressive on that last lap, he would have won. 120. dUDE gUY posted: 10.23.2011 - 9:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Heh, I like RCR, but I find it somewhat amusing that RCR's 100th was earned by a driver who is on his way out after the year. I understand that these things can't be planned, but it is what it is. I would have loved to see Burton get RCR's 100th instead. He had a huge part to play in RCR's resurgence a few years back. 121. Brad24 posted: 10.23.2011 - 9:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs3872: You make a valid point. It was just one those things and I hate that Trevor had to be the victim of politics. 122. Mr X posted: 10.23.2011 - 9:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I would much rather take my chances running up front all day like the RCR boys, and most likely being in front of the big one IF it happens, then to have to fight my way through that clusterf**k in the late laps, when the big crash usually happens. Its stupid to stay in the back. 123. Matt L posted: 10.23.2011 - 9:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The driver combo of Travis Kvapil & JJ Yeley pull off the near impossible and break the Front Row Motorsports #38 into the top 35. They overcame Kvapil's season of disaster and struggles. It was fitting to see Kvapil earn his way back into safety. The #38 takes the TRG Motorsports #71 out of the top 35 by two points. I believe Hermie Sadler will be driving at Martinsville. He will now face the additional task of qualifying on time. 124. Evan posted: 10.23.2011 - 9:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) *4th driver to win the fall race at Talladega with a team that he was leaving the year before. * 20 Tony Stewart 2008-2009:14 car at Stewart Haas * 25 Brian Vickers 2006-2008:Drove for Team Red Bull #83 * 26 Jamie Mcmurray 2009-2010 Ride-1 Earnhardt Ganassi Racing BONUS! 2009-09 Brad Keselowski-2 Penske Racing(spring race) Keselowski would join Penske Racing. Bonus 2! 1989 Terry Labonte(one of two wins)Labonte would join Leo Jackson in 1990. $$Random Comments * Probably Clint's last win for RCR and in a Chevy, though there are 4 races remaining. Most likely last for a while, bad move to MWR, Clint. * Johnson's finish will most likely make it harder or all but eliminate his chance to get a 6th straight title. * Great finish for Dave Blaney and free eats for kids at Golden Corral! * Also good run by Michael Waltrip in the DW Tribute 15 even though he caused a crash that took out Harvick. * The Gibbs guys once again fall out as victims of circumstances, they need a lot of help to get the trophy now. * Looks like Harvick won't win a championship this year w/o help even though he got several big wins this year. * Tandem drafting NEEDS TO GO and die, I hate the tandem drafting and people positioning themselves, I prefer a big pack. Two car drafts are a joke. * Really sick of drivers lagging back and trying to save stuff, its racing not dancing. Lets go all out and make it a show, not wait back in the pack. To me no place is safe. Conservation works for fuel mileage, not racing. * I hate how Roush is trying to order Ford driver to draft with Ford drivers, leave the owners out and let the drivers draft with who they want not certain manufacturers. This is what ruins it. * Team red bull had a great 5 and 6th place run, considering it will be shutting down at the end of the year... 125. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 10.23.2011 - 10:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brad Keselowski needed the good finish he got today to help his title hopes. There's a chance he may be a little far behind to contend, but he's still closer to the points lead than anyone else not named Edwards or Kenseth (is this going to be like 2009, when the #2 Penske team was the highest finishing team that ends up behind the juggernauts, or will this be the year Penske wins his first Cup title?). Dave Blaney gets his first top 5 since this race in 2007. 126. dUDE gUY posted: 10.23.2011 - 10:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @123, it's not that stupid to stay in the back for the first 3/4 or so of the race, but it is VERY stupid to stay in the back until 10 laps to go. You just don't know how many of the last 10 laps will be run under green or yellow flag condidtions, so immediately after the 3/4 mark you need to do your best to get to the front. Chad should have known MUCH better than that, especially after the Daytona race where they also hung back too late and failed to get to the front in time. 127. dUDE gUY posted: 10.23.2011 - 10:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sorry, I meant to reply to post 122 in my last comment. 128. cjs3872 posted: 10.23.2011 - 10:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And let's not forget, DSFF, that Donnie Allison may have had his best success in Fords, including in 1970, when he won both the World 600 and Firecracker 400 in Fords owned and prepared by Banjo Matthews. And I believe that even Donnie's Indy 500 success with A.J. Foyt in 1970 and '71 were with Ford engines, though obviously, completely different kind of engines. Brad24, Trevor has been the victim of politics all year since winning the Daytona 500, whether it has to do with Roush not attempting to find sponsorship, or even possibly preventing the Wood Brothers from doing so, or Roush making sure in every possible way that Bayne would be unable to adequately compete with Ricky Stenhouse, Jr. on the track after his Daytona 500 win. Roush has wanted to make Bayne pay for winning the Daytona 500 with another Ford team over his team. If I was Ganassi, I'd dump Juan Montoya and put Trevor in the #42 car within the next two years, because Trevor's already accomplished more in NASCAR this year than Montoya has accomplished in five, given all the circumstances involved. And remember that, in the same equipment, Jamie McMurray, another driver that didn't exactly mesh with Roush, won the Daytona 500, Brickyard 400, and fall Charlotte race last year, while finishing second in the spring Talladega race, the Southern 500, and the Coca-Cola 600. And as I mentioned, Bayne has that sixth sense that allows him to avoid trouble, which he displayed about four or five times today. He did so in the Logano incident at the pit entrance, as well as somehow avoiding crashes involving Regan Smith, as well as not wrecking Robby Gordon as he was pyushing him, even as the rear bumper was really trying to come off. And the fact the Robby Gordon, who has been a start-and-park driver for much of the second half of the season, actually led ten laps with Bayne pushing him, as well as the fact that Denny Hamlin was going to assist him, may tell you all you need to know about Bayne's ability at the fastest tracks in NASCAR. And OldSchoolNascarDude, I agree that Bayne isn't entrenched enough to go against the one the owner that currently has him as one of his drivers, but what has Roush done for him since his Daytona 500 win, but try to undermine his progress? That's why I made that comment about how, if I was Bayne, I would have aided Gordon to spite Roush somewhat. Evan, drivers laying back, especially at Daytona and Talladega has been around since those tracks were first opened. In 1960 Lee Petty developed a strategy that would have both him and Richard lay back, and it worked, as they finished third (Richard) and fourth (Lee). In the 1973 Winston 500, David Pearson was battling with Bobby Allison, Cale Yarborough, and buddy Baker for the lead, but about six laps in, decided to back out of it. A couple of laps later, the big wreck on the backstretch happened, and Pearson was the only car in that race that had the speed to win that wasn't involved in the wreck. And Evan, what you and those that don't like the "lay back and wait" strategy don't seem to understand is that the object is to get to the FINISH first. It doesn't pay to lead 190 laps of a 200 laps race and fall out before it's over. What does that gain you? Guys have made a career out of that for years. Rick Mears was the absolute master of it, as most of his big IndyCar wins, including three of his four Indianapolis 500 victories, were acheived that way. After all, there's only one lap of a race that truly counts, and that's the last one. It doesn't matter how you get there, but only that you do get there. Same with the fuel mileage races. They get tiring if there are too many of them, as there have been this year, but the object is to get to the finish first, and it doesn't matter how you get there. After all, as the old Penske philosophy goes, "to finish first, you must first finish". 129. cjs3872 posted: 10.23.2011 - 10:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Evan, Michael Waltrip did not cause the huge wreck that took out Kevin Harvick and others. Marcos Ambrose caused that wreck. Waltrip caused the wreck that took out Bobby Labonte, his pseudo-teammate. And it looks like that things could get very interesting in the title race next week. After all, Carl Edwards leads Matt Kenseth by 14 points, and Roush is notoriously terrible at Martinsville, as he does not put hardly any focus on the short tracks. But the question is, will the only three other drivers with a legitimate shot at the championship, Brad Keselowski (-18), Tony Stewart (-19), and Kevin Harvick (-26), be able to take advantage, or will 2011 be for Roush what three previous seasons (1996, 2007, 2009) have been for Hendrick, an inter-team battle for the championship? I think that the focus for Edwards and Kenseth for Martinsville will be to just get out of there with the least amount of damage done to them as possible and race at Texas to try to put everyone else away. 130. JAMIE88FAN posted: 10.23.2011 - 11:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Boring race and once again start and park joe puts two cars in the race and they both of them dont even make half a dozen laps . Now last year he did the same thing in this race but he raced and parked the other in april same thing happen like this race except i think they both made a grand total of 6 laps for the both of them nascar needs to do somthing about these teams ... GET RID OF THE TOP 35 RULE ... 131. OldSchoolNascarDude posted: 10.23.2011 - 11:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #128- I agree with you on Roush. He hasn't went out of his way to promote Bayne like one would figure. I've been down to visit the Roush shop/merchandise store two times since February and it's been hard to find as much Bayne stuff as you can for Stenhouse. Both are great drivers, but Jack may favor Ricky. Trevor and I are both from Knoxville, so I've had the luxury of following him since he was in middle school. He's a solid driver, but an even better person. He's a definite candidate to promote sponsorship for. I met Ricky in early 2010 and he seems like a great person and I think maybe a better driver than Trevor. However, I think Bayne has better marketability than Ricky, but Jack must disagree. 132. cjs3872 posted: 10.24.2011 - 1:34 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, OldSchoolNascarDude, having a Daytona 500 win on your record, something that current drivers like Tony Stewart, Carl Edwards, Bobby Labonte, both Busch brothers, Kasey Kahne, and Denny Hamlin do not have, should mean something whne it comes to sponsorship, as well as opportunities, but it hasn't, and I believe Roush is the culprit. And Bayne wouldn't be the first driver that Roush has screwed over. He also did this to drivers such as Jamie McMurray, Johnny Benson, Jr. (who Roush never gave a fair), and even Jeff Burton toward the end of his run there, and Burton won 17 times for Roush, including wins in the Southern 500 (1999), Firecracker 400 (2000), and two wins in the Coca-Cola 600 (1999, 2001), and even he got treated badly in his final year or two there, including 2004, when Roush wouldn't find sponsorship for him. What do all four of those drivers have in common? They are/were known for taking care of their equipment and are all very nice and cordial, and Roush dumped three of them and down the line, may be preparing to do the same with Bayne, and if he does, I hope Ganassi, or some other Chevrolet team, or someone like Penske picks him up, because he's already getting a reputation of staying out of trouble, unless it's unavoidable. And that will carry you far in the sport, because top car owners will give guys who generally don't run into trouble, especially if they don't cause trouble, a shot in their rides. 133. Curran posted: 10.24.2011 - 2:07 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's a shame Kasey Kahne didn't make the Chase. The way he's been running he might have taken the whole thing. 134. Hyperacti posted: 10.24.2011 - 2:28 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bobby Labonte moved up the racetrack putting Waltrip on his left rear. Although there are many drivers who probably wouldn't have ended up causing an accident for it like Michael did, you can't fully blame him. 135. John Royal posted: 10.24.2011 - 2:44 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Who the hell is Jamie Allison? You just can't use correct names can't you? Lally and Smith would have gone to party with Wheldon without SAFER. That was scary as hell. Kurt Busch can't seem to get a break, I would like to see a Dodge winning a championship. But if Keselowski continues to make these kind of days, maybe just... maybe. I am sort of disappointed now that Johnson is out, it is like championship run for second tier dudes. 136. Brother Bear posted: 10.24.2011 - 3:10 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Once again I am surprised that I do agree with DSFF. Spot on that Ford's decision (limitations, post 11) will hurt them. Also, if tandem racing continue Ford drivers will have difficulty finding any driver to ride with - and if they do they should not expect any loyalty from any other driver. 137. Anonymous posted: 10.24.2011 - 5:41 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jamie Allison is a FORD head honcho who told the FORD drivers to draft with FORD drivers only or face the inevitable. 138. Mark O. posted: 10.24.2011 - 7:33 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) @#130--What does the top 35 rule have to do with NEMCO? Neither car is in the top 35--both had to race their way in the field. 139. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.24.2011 - 7:38 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm also glad to see no Fords in the Top 10. Nice to see that backfire, even though the wreck taking out Harvick probably handed the championship to one of the Roush drivers, most likely Carl. I am officially on the "2x2 drafting must go" bandwagon due to the fact it is more politics than racing. Between the Ford debacle which screwed Gordon, and Menard suddenly quit pushing Tony with the two RCR cars up front (REALLY losing respect for Richard), this isn't racing. Remove the bottom back bumper cover for the plate races and end this nonsense. 140. cjs3872 posted: 10.24.2011 - 8:01 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, though Carl Edwards' team has been the best for much of the season, if it does come down to battle of the Roush drivers for the title, who would you trust, two guys who have a track record of not being able to get it done when the money's on the line (Edwards and Bob Osborne) or tow guys who, in their respective capacity, each have a win in the Daytona 500, as well as each having a championship? (Matt Kenseth and Jimmy Fennig) Not to mention that Edwards is likely to make the big mistake behind the wheel that Kenseth is not likely to make. I don't know about you, but give me Kenseth and Fennig until Edwards and Osborne prove otherwise. And I'm not sure racing poilitcs will be such a factor in next year's Daytona 500. The politics that ruled Sunday's race, especially from the Ford perspective, may have had more to do with the championship, which Ford hasn't won since 2004, than anything else. Still, it handcuffed the Ford drivers, particularly Trevor Bayne, who could push ANYONE to the front. And your comment about Menard may go to a bigger point. Let's remember that Stewart was a victim of the very same thing in the Daytona 500 when Mark Martin didn't push him on the final restart when he was alongside Bayne. But Menard also seems to be RCR's lap dog when it comes to team racing. First, the Richmond debacle, and now this. As for those who didn't like the fact that Clint Bowyer passed Jeff Burton at the finish, saying that Burton needed the win more than Bowyer did, I say STOP IT! Bowyer did exactly what he was supposed to do. In fact, he probably made his move too soon, and Burton almost made it bak by at the start-finish line. But I still prefer the 2x2 racing rather than the pack racing of years gone by because it's much safer. Sure it has its own risks, but with the field spread out more, if there is a problem, it's not likely to involve quite as many, though those involved in the nine caution periods may disagree with me on that. 141. cjs3872 posted: 10.24.2011 - 10:47 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) It appears that Trevor Bayne is so unhappy with what went on yesterday, as far as the politics of who went with whom, and who he was, and was not allowed to help, that he's apparently threatened not to run the plate races next year if it continues. Now he might be blowing off steam, but if the guy who is the best at the push-draft says that, and Trevor has proven to be just that, that may be a succinct meesage to Ford not to tell him who he can and can't draft with, as well as the predetermination of drafting partners. After all, I just can't imagine the Daytona 500 winner electing not to even try to defend his title for just such a reason, especially in a car that would be one of the favorites in next year's race, since Roush might only be running three cars, and the #21 car would then have a Roush Racing car, possibly the #17, as a drafting partner. But this story, if it is one, will bear watching over the next couple of months. But if it's true, this might shake things up more than any rule NASCAR could ever come up with. 142. BON GORDON posted: 10.24.2011 - 11:08 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Im upset with Trevor Bayne only because he told Jeff he'd go with him. All Bayne had to do was say no ive got team orders and i cant work with you. I dont care what Ford has to say. If it was me driving in Baynes car id help my hero to the lead and try to pass him on the front stretch on the last lap. But of course not. Gordon got no thanks for his help in the Daytona 500 and Twin Duel race. If Bayne had helped Gordon they wouldve finished a lot better than 15th and 27th. I hope Gordon puts this in his memory box for the future. 143. Scott B posted: 10.24.2011 - 11:43 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Ironic that with all the talk about drafting partners, drivers like Dave Blaney and Robby Gordon go out and have their best races of the season without having an official teammate in the field. That makes a pretty good case for letting drivers draft with who they feel comfortable with regardless of manufacturers, sponsors or team stategy. I agree with the comments about the "lurkers" waiting too late to make their move to the front. I thought it needed to happen on the restart at lap 168. In the big picture, though, an 11th place finish was all Carl Edwards needed to come away with a decent points lead. Which worries me that we'll see even less actual racing by the Chase drivers next October at Dega, especially if he holds on to win the championship. :( 144. OldSchoolNascarDude posted: 10.24.2011 - 12:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Everyone seems to be missing one thing. When Bayne told Gordon he would go with him, I think he meant it. However, once they restarted and Ragan had issues, Bayne had no choice. Kenseth basically made Trevor's decision for him by jumping on his bumper. Put yourself in Bayne's position. He has a deal with a NASCAR legend, but a former champ and teammate jumps on his bumper on the restart. Add that in with who his boss is and his limited experience in a cup car and the decision was pretty obvious. It seems to me that a lot of people think Bayne planned the entire deal just to screw Gordon over. But in reality, the decision wasn't made until the heat of the moment, going down the backstretch, with two laps to go. 145. Scott B posted: 10.24.2011 - 12:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Odd coincidence of the week: Furniture Row Racing, which had the post-race fuel fire, was also involved in an incident late last season where their hauler and team motorhome were both badly damaged in a highway accident returning from a race. 146. BON GORDON posted: 10.24.2011 - 1:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I dont think that Bayne planned to screw Gordon but hes a liar and in my opinion only was sorry cause the move didnt help him or Gordon in the end. He was also getting yelled at by fans on twitter after the race. Its quite simple if you say youre gonna stick someone stick with them. I dont care what Ford says. Whats Ford gonna do fire him?! Even if they do im sure someone else would take him. Hes a Daytona 500 champion. I know Gordon and Bayne would have finished in the Top 5 if they wouldve stuck together. And as a Gordon fan im getting frustrated. This month has been terrible. Gordon has an avg. finish in the last 4 races of around like 24th. 147. cjs3872 posted: 10.24.2011 - 1:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) BON GORDON, I believe Bayne intended to help Gordon, but was ordered not to prior to the final restart, or possibly even after the final restart. And if Bayne would have had his way, he and Gordon might very well have finished third and fourth. Remember that Bayne had no drafting partner after Robby Gordon fell out and Jeff lost his drafting partner when Mark Martin was involved in that crash with Regan Smith and others. Bayne even used the term "strong-armed" when he said he was forced to bail out his intended plan. That to me, is a direct shot across the bow of Jamie Allison (head of Ford racing) and Jack Roush, his Nationwide Series car owner, and a much deserved one. After all, you never see the Penske cars working together, and you see the Toyota teams working with cars of other makes (Denny Hamlin and Ryan Newman teamed up in the other plate races this year), and you never heard a word against that from those organizations. It just shows how selfish Roush is that he only wants his cars to win, if a Ford wins. That, I believe is what this is really about. And I believe he's still mad about Bayne winning the Daytona 500 this year over his car. 148. Anonymous posted: 10.24.2011 - 1:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Whats Ford gonna do fire him?!" - Yes, it's possible. He's part-time anyway, it's not like he's a Carl Edwards, Matt Kenseth or another popular face of Ford. "Even if they do im sure someone else would take him. Hes a Daytona 500 champion." - Are you sure about that? As it is now, he's having troubles securing sponsorship for the Nationwide Series next season. 149. OldSchoolNascarDude posted: 10.24.2011 - 1:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm sorry, post #148 was me, but I'm on a different computer. 150. cjs3872 posted: 10.24.2011 - 1:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) BON GORDON, just winning the Daytona 500 won't help you if you can't find sponsorship, which has been a constant problem for Bayne ever since he came to NASCAR, so he probably wouldn't be able to pick up a ride. And if a driver of Dan Wheldon's calibur couldn't find a ride after winning the Indianapolis 500 (for a second time) earlier this year until late in the season (and we all know the tragic ending to that story), what makes you think that just winning the Daytona 500 would guarantee Bayne a ride. It's not like what Dale Jarrett did in the 1996 Daytona 500, when he made a deal with Mark Martin and threw it out the window as soon as the green flag came out. I think Bayne intended to aid Gordon, maybe to spite Ford and Roush, for not allowing him to have a solid drafting partner (the fact that Robby Gordon was his partner is proof of this) but was strong-armed out of it, in his own words. 151. BON GORDON posted: 10.24.2011 - 1:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I wouldve said F*!k you Ford. Jeff Gordon is my hero and i wouldve never left him hang if I were Trevor. Like i said i wouldnt care what Ford said ill do what i want and if you fire me ill just go somewhere else. My point is that. 152. cjs3872 posted: 10.24.2011 - 1:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Exactly, OldSchoolNascarDude, which is why I hope he (Bayne) winds up with someone like Ganassi or Penske in the future, because they actually care about their drivers, having been drivers themselves. (Penske may have been a champion driver himself if he had pursued ownership.) And Ganassi has a history of close relationships with his drivers, which is what lured Jamie McMurray back to Ganassi, and may also be why he stuck with Sterling Marlin as long as he did. And the same is generally true with Penske. There's a reason they've been at the top for so long. People wnat to drive for guys like that, not just because of the team, but of the relationships that have been built there over the years. After all, Bobby Allison and Penske are still friends, and he last drove for Roger in 1976. And that's why Hendrick and Childress have been the dominant car owners for the 25 years. There's generally a closer relationship between driver and car owner if the car owner was a driver himself, because he knows what's going on, having been a driver himself. 153. cjs3872 posted: 10.24.2011 - 1:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) BON GORDON, exactly. What do you think Bobby Allison, Foyt, Mario Andretti, Dale Earnhardt, or others like them would have done? But Bayne has no solid ride for next year, and he didn't want to lose what little he has in terms of a ride. But I again ask the question. What has Roush done for Bayne since his Daytona 500 win other than try to undermine him at every turn, especially after he got sick? 154. Mike posted: 10.24.2011 - 3:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 153: Roush has run a Nationwide car out-of-pocket for him. 155. BON GORDON posted: 10.24.2011 - 3:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Somone else would take Bayne. If they fire him for helping Gordon then i wouldnt want to drive for Ford anyway. 156. Evan posted: 10.24.2011 - 3:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs3872, I stand corrected on the Waltrip thing, i got that confused. Also, I don't 100% hate laying back to try and win it, its just that it when it works it works(Dale Jarrett in 2005) and when it doesn't well...you saw what happened. My issue was more of the Ford drafting with Ford drivers and not giving Bayne a fair shake. I don't like the tandem drafting more than anything else, its too much politics and not racing. I just want the pack type racing back that ran this place through the years. Agreed to finish first you must first finish is true, so you basically have to find a happy medium in there between aggression and conservatism. 157. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 10.24.2011 - 3:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well here is wishful thinking, Robby (who has worked well with Trevor in the past) puts Trevor in his car in races that Robby doesn't run, so (if by some mircle this happens), he'll have a ride it'll be a POS ride but a ride none the less. And when plate races come along and Robby (if he wants too) fields 2 cars. (if by some miracle this happens) it'll be a big FU to Jack Roush and whole Ford camp. (Robby see the light, PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) Someone send an e-mail to Robby. *like i said before, wishful thinking* Here is my fix for the 2 car draft (and i'm spelling it out): L-E-A-V-E-I-T-A-L-O-N-E 158. cjs3872 posted: 10.24.2011 - 4:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mike, that's because Roush never attempted to find him a sponsor. I also believe he skipped the first Iowa race, knowing that Bayne would have to qualify in time from there on thereby denying him the chance to show what he could truly do. Then there have been the near-constant pit road and communication snafus, including leaving a rear tire loose on three consecutive pit stops, as well as the communication breakdown at Montreal that could've seriously injured either him or someone else. He's only run that car due to a commitment he made to Trevor and that team when Trevor signed last year. But now with what happened Sunday, as well as Trevor's post-race comments (which I agree with 100%, as well as the fact they needed to be made), I believe he's a gone goose at year's end, which would serve him well. And he may now elect not to run in next year's Daytona 500, if his comments are to be believed. Let's not forget that Edwards and Bayne wanted to draft each other originally, but Roush nixed that, as well, leaving Bayne without a partner until he found Robby Gordon. And BON GORDON, I don't think anyone else would take Bayne if he can't find sponsorship, which has been a constant problem for him. Remember, that was the root of his departure from Michael Waltrip's team late last year. And Evan, I believe that if you go back to pack racing, you'd only have about 12-15 cars finish these races, except for rolling wrecks, because everyone else would wind up wrecked. The 2x2 drafting has elimiated two of the root causes of the massive crashes, and that is letting the field separate, and the elimination of blocking. 159. Spen posted: 10.24.2011 - 4:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I don't know about you, but give me Kenseth and Fennig until Edwards and Osborne prove otherwise." I'd agree on general principle, but this is Roush we're talking about, and we all know that Ford holds all the strings at that orginazation. And with the amount of money they spent to keep Edwards, the only outcome they'd accept is an Edwards championship. I honestly think they'd rather see another team win the title rather than have Edwards lose to one of his "lesser teamates". "Exactly, OldSchoolNascarDude, which is why I hope he (Bayne) winds up with someone like Ganassi or Penske in the future" Penske's too high on Kligerman for there to be an opening there in the next decade. And I personally think that Penske will be history (or at least complete non-factors) by 2014. Once Dodge pulls out, they will have nothing. And depending on the seriousness of Will Power's injury (and on how the crash affects him mentally), their IndyCar program isn't looking great either. And Ganassi? I can't see him getting rid of Montoya. It would be a good idea in terms of sheet metal saved, but they've got too long of a history together for the idea to cross his mind. The #1 might be a possibility, depending on how McMurray does next year, but trading one 500 winner for another seems like a lateral move. As far as I can tell, Bayne's best hope is to try and keep Ford happy, and hope for RPM to either open a third team, or get rid of one of their current drivers. Yeah, it's a career dead-end to be driving for Petty, but better that than start-and-parking, or sitting home. When Bobby Labonte retires, JTG-Daugherty might be an option. 160. Scott B posted: 10.24.2011 - 4:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I don't blame Bayne for Jeff Gordon's finish, I believe he was sincere in wanting to help him draft at the moment of the restart, but things change and you have to adapt. Back in the pack-racing days drafting buddies came and went with every lap at a plate race, depending on the situation. Actually, I thought Jeff would team up with Casey Mears in the closing laps. I guess they weren't able to talk to each other on the radio? If that's the case, the #24 team has no one but themselves to blame for not reaching out to the #13 as a possible draft partner before race day, if not as a primary partner at least as a "Plan B" if the need arose. 161. Talon64 posted: 10.24.2011 - 5:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Clint Bowyer picks up his 5th career Sprint Cup Series victory and first of 2011. It's Bowyer's first top 5 in 17 races (last one was 4th at Sonoma). It's his 2nd win in 12 starts at Talledega, both coming during his 3 race top 2 streak at the track (1 top 5 in first 9 starts). Jeff Burton gets his best finish of the season in 2nd, his first top 5 all year and first in 40 races. It ensures he'll at least tie his career worst in top 5's and top 10's in a year, 1 and 2 respectively back in 1995 (for the Stavola Brothers). It's also Burton's best finish in 36 Talladega starts, his previous best being 3rd in 2001 (5 top 5's, 18.5 avg fin). Tommy Baldwin Racing finishes 3rd for their best ever finish in Cup and first top 5 in 87 starts. For Dave Blaney it's just his 4th top 5 in 393 career starts, tying his best career finish (Darlington 2003, Talladega 2007). Brad Keselowski becomes the 6th driver this year to reach 10 top 5's. It's just the 2nd time since 2005 that a Penske driver has had 10+ top 5's in a year (Kurt Busch with 10 in 2009). It's his 4th top 10 in 6 Talladega starts, his most at any track to date (15.0 avg fin). After just 1 top 5 in his last 51 starts, Brian Vickers has 2 in the last 6 (6 straight top 20 finishes, 13.8 avg fin versus 20.3 on the season). It's his first top 5 at Talladega in his last 6 starts, but his 4th in 14 starts overall (20.1 avg fin). Kasey Kahne's 3 race top 5 streak comes to an end, but he extends his top 10 streak to a season-high 4 races which also ties his career high (twice in 2006). He's scored the 2nd most points of anybody in the first 6 Chase races (11 less than current points leader Carl Edwards). It's his first stand-alone top 10 in 16 Talladega starts (2 runner-up finishes were his only previous, 21.9 avg fin). Tony Stewart led a race-high 30 laps, his most at Talladega since the spring race in 2008 where he led 61 (wrecked on lap 146). It's his first top 10 since his win in the fall 2008 races (first in 6 races). But it's his 13th top 10 in 26 career starts there (15.2 avg fin). Denny Hamlin gets his 2nd straight top 10 finish (23.5 avg fin in previous 4 races). It's his 3rd top 10 in the last 4 races at Talladega (5th in 12 career starts, 17.8 avg fin). Michael Waltrip, in just his 7th start over the last 2 seasons, finishes 9th for his 15th top 10 in 51 career Talladega starts (19.9 avg fin). Martin Truex Jr. gets his first top 10 since finishing 2nd at Bristol (23.9 avg fin in the 7 races inbetween). It's his 2nd straight top 10 in the fall Talladega race and 4th in 14 career starts (23.2 avg fin). Carl Edwards' 8 race top 10 streak comes to an end. But now he's scored 15 more points than the next-best Chase driver in the Chase, Brad Keselowski (-15). Trevor Bayne gets just his 5th top 20 finish in 15 starts this year (26.5 avg fin). Landon Cassill gets just his 4th top 20 finish of the season (29 starts, 28.2 avg fin). 162. Talon64 posted: 10.24.2011 - 5:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I don't blame Bayne for Jeff Gordon's finish, I believe he was sincere in wanting to help him draft at the moment of the restart, but things change and you have to adapt. Back in the pack-racing days drafting buddies came and went with every lap at a plate race, depending on the situation." That's what I mostly think too. In the heat of the moment he forgot about the Ford team orders, before the team probably got on the radio to remind him. Gordon should be more angry at the Ford camp than anything, and Bayne should be a bit upset that not going with Gordon might've cost him a better finish. And Bayne's not even guaranteed to be sticking with Roush next year. Just like David Ragan, although he choked big time at the end and cost Kenseth a chance at gaining points on Carl, not losing them like he did. I think the title's going to come down to Carl vs. Matt. They only need top 15 finishes at Martinsville, then they can gap the rest of the Chase field at Texas and Homestead. Phoenix will be a wild card but I'll give Carl the advantage there over Matt. Keselowski, Stewart and especially Harvick will need the both of them to either really screw up or have bad luck in the last 4 races to have a chance and I don't think the chances of that happening to them both are very good. 163. RoushFan posted: 10.24.2011 - 5:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) My username may change to "RoushFan but not for much longer" 164. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.24.2011 - 6:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @153: Bobby, Mario, and Dale would have told them to kiss their ass. Foyt would have knocked the shit out of Jack. That's what would have happened. I agree Trevor needs to find a ride elsewhere. It would be great if Penske could find sponsorship for another team and add Trevor. He would be a great steadying force to counteract KuBu's abrasive grating attitude. 165. cjs3872 posted: 10.24.2011 - 6:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Talon64, I think in the aftermath of what happened at Talladega, Bayne's a gone goose at Roush. There was already talk about him being replaced in the #21 car by Ricky Stenhouse, Jr. anyway. And I think you can count out the JTG-Daugherty Racing car as a possibility for Bayne, as they're aligned with Michael Waltrip, and will continue to be. I only brought up Ganassi and Penske because of the way they have a history of dealing with their drivers as actual people, and not tools. This has always seemed to be true about Ganassi, which is why I mentioned his team, especially. On the other hand, Roush has a history of treating his drivers poorly, even if they've done well for him. Bayne will almost certainly be without a ride next year, and his career, as a result of the aftermath of what happened after the race, may as well be over, especially if Roush is as vindictive toward Bayne as he has been most of the year, stemming from his Daytona 500 triumph over Roush's #99 car. But I disagree with your saying that Kenseth choked. He lost his drafting partner when David Ragan encountered engine trouble in the last 10 laps, so he up the river at the end. But I still like Kenseth to win the title if it comes down to him and Edwards because Kenseth won't make the big mistake. But the guy to really watch out for is Brad Keselowski, who has moved back up to third. And let's not forget that, unlike Roush, Penske, especially the #2 car, has a great history at Martinsville. And with Kurt Busch now out of the running for the championship, and with his own issues with Roush, though in his case, it was his doing, look for Busch to do all he can to aid Keselowski in his bid for the title, which would be the first-ever for Penske in NASCAR's highest series. 166. 18fan posted: 10.24.2011 - 6:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs, but, since Rusty Wallace retired after 2005, Penske only has 2 top 10 finishes at Martinsville as a whole, a 2nd by Ryan Newman in the fall of 2007 and a 10th by Brad Keselowski in the fall of 2010. 167. Talon64 posted: 10.24.2011 - 6:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "But I disagree with your saying that Kenseth choked. He lost his drafting partner when David Ragan encountered engine trouble in the last 10 laps, so he up the river at the end." I said Ragan choked, but I didn't know he had engine troubles at the end. Still, crappy luck for Kenseth. 168. cjs3872 posted: 10.24.2011 - 7:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Still, among the four main championship contenders, I like Keselowski's chances better than the others, especially the Roush cars, since Roush puts no emphasis on the short tracks, and hasn't in years. And Tony Stewart has been terrible at the short tracks all year. This may be a chance for Harvick, Kyle Busch, and Jimmie Johnson to make up some ground, though I think it's too late for those three. And on Race Hub, it was confirmed that Roush was behind the shennaigans that took place as far as the Ford situation was concerned, not that it surprised me, since I pretty much figured he was behind it the entire time to help his drivers in the championship hunt, while not allowing any of the other Ford teams a shot at winning. Remember, he's still incensed over what happened at the Daytona 500 with a satellite team beating his team, and he was, though he never showed ot outwardly. A big part of me thinks he would have preferred a Chevrolet or Toyota win that race than a Ford from outside his organization. After all, Roush was, in my view, behind the collapse of Robert Yates' team because he couldn't handle the way that Yates was making a comeback in '04, so he made a decision to crush his only real competition inside the Ford ranks so that he would be the only competitve Ford team. And I still think he's a bit uneasy about how well the Petty team is capable of running, especially the #9 car with Marcos Ambrose with crew chief Todd Parrott, who was responsible for a lot of Yates' success in the late 90s and early 2000s before Yates' decline started. And it wouldn't surprise me to see the noose around the Wood Brothers' team start to tighten, because I believe they've been a little too competitve to suit Roush, especially the last two weeks. Remember that the #21 car was on pace with some of the Roush cars at Charlotte, and you can bet that Roush didn't like that one bit, as he wants to be the only competitve Ford team, and if the Woods run the way they did at charlotte in their final two races of the year, don't be surprised if the amount of support decreases substantially. 169. Spen posted: 10.24.2011 - 7:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "And I think you can count out the JTG-Daugherty Racing car as a possibility for Bayne, as they're aligned with Michael Waltrip, and will continue to be." I thought they said earlier in the year that with MWR opening up a new team, they were dropping their support of JTG-Daugherty and that JTG was going to be trying to keep going on their own next year. But I could be wrong. 170. Mr X posted: 10.24.2011 - 8:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This huge argument is why I said Talladega is wasted on NASCAR, if somebody told Bill France Sr. back in 1968 and 1969 when he was having Talladega built that dispite the fact that in 2011 the cars are safer then they have ever been, the cars are so terribly restricted that the qualifying speeds hover around 180mph, similar to Darlington, that the drafting speeds in the race were below 200mph, that the cars are so easy to drive that drivers can do 20 laps straight with the bumpers in constant contact, and there was more politics then racing out on the track, I guarentee you he would've cancelled the project, with the repave the same can be said about Daytona. Bill Sr built these places to one day see uncontested velocity, as drivers manhandled their land bound missles at high speed. He built Daytona for the 1959 NASCAR season then 10 years later he built Talladega as Daytona but bigger and faster in every way. He built these places for the superspeedway racing of the 70's and 80's up until 1987. And I am curious as to whether NASCAR thought the plates would be permanent when they slipped them between the carb and the tarantula style intake manifold in 1988? On the Bank of America 500 comments page we got to talking about how to slow these cars down in the corners, other then just taking away downforce, skinnier tires, and less night racing. One more idea, take away the power steering. 171. cjs3872 posted: 10.24.2011 - 8:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) No Spen, Michael Waltrip Racing is still going to support JTG-Daugherty as they have been, even though they are adding a third team of their own. Now the significance of Bowyer's is that I believe that would now automatically qualify the #15 car for every race next year in which qualifying is totally washed out, which is what knocked the #15 car out of the race at Kentucky, since after the top 35 are set, the next three to get in would be past series champions not yet in the field, winning drivers, and winning car owners from that season or the year before. Now Bowyer and the #15 team have protection from qualifying rainouts next year with this win on Sunday. So now there is the possibility of as many as three cars getting in, depending on Trevor Bayne and the #21 car situation on wins in the case of a qualifying rainout. Remember that Bayne would get a spot for any race he enters, as would the Wood Brothers, even if they're not racing together, and now Bowyer and the #15 team. This win also puts Bowyer in next year's All-Star Race, adding still another driver to list of those eligible. I'm going to have to post that list separately once I figure that out, because so many drivers are qualified. Not all of them are likely to compete, but close to 25 are now in the All-Star Race, and we know at least three more are going to be added the night of the All-Star Race, making it possibly the biggest field in All-Star Race history. 172. cjs3872 posted: 10.24.2011 - 8:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Talladega, unlike Daytona, was in my opinion, a folly right from the very beginning. Remember that the very first race at Talladega was boycotted due to unsafe conditions from the excessive speed and unsafe tires, and it has only gotten worse fron there. In fact, the restrictor plates, which were actually first used in 1970, came into being at the request of the drivers for that very reason. The thing about Talladega that separates it from Daytona is that the drivers never really had to have much skill to be successful there. That is due to the turns, which are one car-width wider, have slightly higher banking (the turns at Talladega are banked two degrees more than the turns at Daytona are), and the fact that the turns are sweeping, not to mention 15 feet wider, allowing the drivers to run wide open, even in the era of less aerodynamic cars and 210 MPH speeds. That's why you've had so many "one and done" winners there. Talladega was built for sheer speed, while Daytona was built for a combination of speed and competition, where the competitors were, and still are to a degree, put to the ultimate test, since handling was always a factor at Daytona, and will be again in a couple of years. Handling has NEVER been important at Talladega, nor has car setup. 173. RaceFanX posted: 10.24.2011 - 9:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "The #33 car gets RCR's 33rd non-Earnhardt victory #yeahBigE" Not exactly, while its iconic not all of Big E's victories came driving that #3 for Childress, he won six races and his first title in Rod Osterlund's #2 then won three races in Bud Moore's #15 Ford before he started winning with Childress (he first ran for Childress in the latter half of 1981 but the combination did not win a race at that time). 174. . posted: 10.24.2011 - 9:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Not exactly, while its iconic not all of Big E's victories came driving that #3 for Childress, he won six races and his first title in Rod Osterlund's #2 then won three races in Bud Moore's #15 Ford before he started winning with Childress (he first ran for Childress in the latter half of 1981 but the combination did not win a race at that time)." And he won 76 races. You listed 9, leaving 67 wins with RCR. Which means this would be the 33rd non-Earnhardt victory. 175. BON GORDON posted: 10.24.2011 - 10:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Um Scott B where Jeff Gordon finished is definately not his fault, you are clearly not a Gordon fan because if you were you would say what you did. Look its simple Bayne knew of the team orders before the race. He just had to say look i cant help you and Jeff wouldve worked with Mears. To me Bayne is a two faced liar who clearly isnt as Big as a Gordon fan as he says. I WILL SWEAR ON MY MY LIFE RIGHT NOW THAT IF I WERE BAYNE I WOULDVE IGNORED FORDS ORDERS AND HELPED JEFF. BUT IM A BIG GORDON FAN. 176. BON GORDON posted: 10.24.2011 - 10:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I wouldve called Fords bluff and Ive always hated Jack Roush too. Hes a sore loser and i havent had respect for him since Tire Gate in 1998. The funny thing is that ive always liked his drivers over the years Mark Martin, Jeff Burton, Matt Kenseth, David Ragan, and Greg Biffle not so much Carl Edwards though. 177. cjs3872 posted: 10.24.2011 - 11:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, BON GORDON, Roush has had classy drivers over the years, as you mentioned with Mark Martin, the franchise's standard-bearer to this day, Jeff Burton, Matt Kenseth, Roush's milestone driver (the first Roush driver ever to win a championship and the only one to ever win the Daytona 500), Johnny Benson, Jr. (who never got a fair shot there), Ted Musgrave, Jamie McMurray, and several others. He's also had outspoken drivers like Wally Dallenbach, Jr. and Robby Gordon, who drove for Roush in sports car racing. but he's also had drivers I don't care a lot for, like Greg Biffle and Carl Edwards. But most of his drivers have been class acts, unlike Roush himself. Perhaps McMurray said it best in an interview he did for a national cable show earlier this year when he called Roush "a cold person". And he drove for Roush for four years. 178. CarlEdwards99 posted: 10.25.2011 - 12:14 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) the manufacturers dump million of dollars into the sport to promote their brand, For Jack this is both his lively hood and his life's passion and winning the championship is the ultimate mountain top, to NOT have team orders and risk having one of your own cars push another teams driver to a result that could cost you the championship, would be stupid beyond belief. Why put all of the effort and money all year, than when the championship is on the line turn around and let your own guys help the opposition beat you for the ultimate prize in the sport? 179. BON GORDON posted: 10.25.2011 - 12:47 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yeah CarlEdwards99 but Jack Roush is a dick. Sorry but I can bet Rick Hendrick isnt cold and careless. Yeah Hendrick had his troubles with fraud or whatever in the 1990s but id rather drive for Rick than Jack any day. Helping Jeff Gordon win the race wasnt gonna give Gordon a chance at the titl but it wouldve given them both a better chance of winning. I hope Bayne sticks it to Ford and diesnt race the 500 unless they change. Look its the end of the race and neither driver had a partner, they agreed to work together and thats what shouldve happened. Its just how Talladega is now. Get rid of the two car tandems. Very boring race till 20 to go. I live the Big pack racing. Especially the races from 2000-2004. 180. 00andJoe posted: 10.25.2011 - 1:15 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bon Gordon - Trevor had -no choice- but to hang Jeff out to dry, and that had -nothing- to do with the Ford Team Orders. It had to do with Matt Kenseth getting a much better restart than David Ragan did, and getting into the back of Trevor. Two cars work - three doesn't. Jeff got loose, and by the time he'd recovered the 17 was already freight-training the 21 past Gordon. There was nothing Trevor could do. (Of course, it's entirely possible Roush told Kenseth to try and push Bayne to break up his thing with the 24...) 181. 00andJoe posted: 10.25.2011 - 1:19 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Martinsville entry list is out. 47 cars: -Sorenson in the #7 -Stremme in the #30 -Kenny Schrader in the #32 -Wise in the #37 - from now on we'll count that as normal -Kvapil in the #38, Yeley in the #55 -Hermie in the #71 -Derrike Cope in the #75 -Robby Gordon in the #77 -Andy Lally in...er...the #77 (Robby's is #177, TRG's, #277) -Dennis Setzer in the #92 182. TheTruthâ?¢ posted: 10.25.2011 - 2:06 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I thought that was a scumbag move by Clint Bowyer." Yeah! How dare he try to win the race! "And speaking of Bayne, what happened during the Joey Logano again proved to me that Bayne has the one thing that can't be taught, and that is instinct. How he wasn't involved in that is beyond me. When Logano soun behind him, but at a greater speed, Bayne, who had committed himself to making a pit stop, quickly moved his car one to one and a half lanes to the left to avoid an incident he couldn't see" I think you're looking for reasons to praise Bayne in this situation. He clearly was moving left before there was any notion that Logano was going to spin. Trevor got on the binders IN TRAFFIC for pit road and finally cut it off the track onto the apron. Logano's spin was directly related to Kyle's reaction to Bayne. "And I don't think it's any big surprise that Trevor Bayne's Nationwide season began falling apart shortly after his Daytona 500 win, driving a Ford for another team and beating Roush's top team in doing so. I think Roush wanted to send a message to Bayne for beating one of his cars in the Daytona 500 in another Ford." Funny you say that, considering this year is statistically Trevor's best Nationwide season. You're really reaching. Trevor's season didn't exactly fall apart. He ran about how you'd expect. Wood Brothers have HEAVY ties to Roush at this point, and I don't think Jack is going to screw his own drivers because of, for all intensive purposes, a Roush satellite team winning the Daytona 500 after Ragan's mistake that put Trevor in that position. "And when Bayne was forced out of his Nationwide ride from his illness, he withdraws the car for a race so it has to qualify on time." WEEKS later, with Trevor Bayne's return still unknown. Jack gave Chris Buescher two opportunities and Kevin Swindell an opportunity at Dover. I don't think he just finally decided to make Trevor's life harder for him. If Jack wanted, he could've made Trevor rideless. It's not a conspiracy. "It just shows how selfish Roush is that he only wants his cars to win" Every owner in the entire garage wants their cars to win before anybody else's. "Mike, that's because Roush never attempted to find him a sponsor." Yeah, surely Roush's PR guys do nothing at all to try to find him sponsorship. It's not like Trevor's had Fastenal, Avnet, or 3M on his Nationwide cars or anything. Obviously Roush is just trying to show Trevor Bayne his wrath by funding a Nationwide car out of pocket rather than letting a sponsor do it. Gosh darn, that Jack Roush is one evil man! "since I pretty much figured he was behind it the entire time to help his drivers in the championship hunt, while not allowing any of the other Ford teams a shot at winning." How are the Ford must draft with Ford owners strictly to Jack Roush's advantage? Obviously they want to help each other out, but there's nothing about it that disallows other Ford teams a shot at winning. "the manufacturers dump million of dollars into the sport to promote their brand, For Jack this is both his lively hood and his life's passion and winning the championship is the ultimate mountain top, to NOT have team orders and risk having one of your own cars push another teams driver to a result that could cost you the championship, would be stupid beyond belief. Why put all of the effort and money all year, than when the championship is on the line turn around and let your own guys help the opposition beat you for the ultimate prize in the sport?" EXACTLY. 183. Mike posted: 10.25.2011 - 2:38 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Plus, as for Jack withdrawing the #16 from the Nationwide race at Iowa ... who exactly would have driven it? Chris Buescher was in New Jersey running the ARCA race, Kevin Swindell was apparently scheduled to run a short track race and I doubt any of Roush's Cup drivers would have gone out for a one-off at Iowa, it just wouldn't have been worth it. 184. CarlEdwards99 posted: 10.25.2011 - 3:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Helping Jeff Gordon win the race wasnt gonna give Gordon a chance at the titl but it wouldve given them both a better chance of winning" Your right, Jeff is out of contention, but what Trevor could of done by helping Jeff was assure Jeff finishing ahead of Carl and Matt and cost them each a point in this close points battle. I can't fault a owner or manufacturer for refusing to help their opponents in the middle of a championship battle. 185. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 10.25.2011 - 4:07 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "It would be great if Penske could find sponsorship for another team and add Trevor." Dude, I was thinking this just the other day! It would be a challenge for Penske to find sponsorship for a 3rd car, but it would be awesome to see two of my top 5 favorites driving for the same team. I think Trevor can have a good Cup career if he ever finds himself in the right situation. Judging from his driving style, I can see him driving to good finishes pretty often given that the mix of conservative and steadiness work well in Cup races. At this point, it looks like this season could go one of these ways: One of the drivers from the Roush juggernaut wins it all and the next highest finisher behind the juggernauts is the #2 Penske team, just like '09. Or Brad K could give Roger Penske his first Cup championship, which is NOT out of the question given his good luck. Maybe Tony Stewart can pull off his third championship, but he would have to regain what he had starting off the cha$e. And I'm still not declaring Harvick done either, when he is hot he has so many good breaks fall his way it's not even funny. After Kansas, I predicted Jimmie wasn't out of it by any means and that he would win 6 in a row, but I am not sure about that now. 50 points back is a huge deficit with this new points system (he's MORE THAN A FULL RACE behind!). I really think everyone from 6th on back is eliminated. 186. Scott B posted: 10.25.2011 - 11:36 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) 00andJoe posted -Robby Gordon in the #77 -Andy Lally in...er...the #77 (Robby's is #177, TRG's, #277) ************ Yes, and don't forget Rusty Wallace made a deal to run Stephen in the Daytona 500 using the Penske team's carryover 2010 points from the #77 to seal a starting spot. So we've had 3 separate teams use #77 in 2011 (and all made their plans before Danny Wheldon's death gave that number special significance). 187. BON GORDON posted: 10.25.2011 - 12:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yeah Bayne coulda done something, stick with Gordon. Im still mad about it. I hope no one helps that SOB at Daytona. He should be ashamed to say hes such a Gordon fan and do that. Im sticking with Gordon till the end no matter what run i get from Matt Kenseth. All Bayne had to do was say NO and id be cool. Screw Kenseth. Tell him to find his own partner. 188. 00andJoe posted: 10.25.2011 - 12:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Yeah Bayne coulda done something, stick with Gordon." How? 1. Kenseth gets in the back of Bayne, who (already pushing the 24) gets Jeff loose. 2. the 24's getting loose pushes him up the track; Bayne can't follow because Kenseth is pushing him - if the 21 turns to follow the 24 up the track, the 17 is going to be pushing him off-center and, therefore, will wreck him (and most of the cars behind them, to boot). 3. Jeff's getting loose and going up the track, with Bayne unable to follow, slows the 24 so that the 17 starts pushing the 21 past Jeff. 4. By the time Gordon's straight and level, as it were, again, the 21's already been pushed up to his side door...with the 17 still at full steam against Bayne's back bumper. Unless you want Bayne to start the Big One and wipe out the field, there was no way he could "stick with Gordon", regardless of anything else. 189. cjs3872 posted: 10.25.2011 - 2:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mike, Jack could have found someone to drive the #16 car, much like Joe Gibbs found drivers for both of his cars for that same race, so that argument doesn't fly. As for the incident near the pit entrance, the reason Bayne was down there was that he was going to make a pit stop. When those cars tangled around him, he jerked the car left to avoid the incident. And while it's true that Bayne has had some sponsorship, it has been with team sponsors. whiat I was referring to was that Jack hasn't tried to find him more spnsorship. Remember that Fastenal has sponsored the Natiowide team, not any particular driver, and has sponsored all three cars on occasion. As for the team orders thing, I can understand that for Roush's own drivers, but not for the drivers from the other Ford teams. Roush should just let them work with who they choose to. A prime example of this is that David Gilliland wasn't allowed to work with Tony Stewart, wich has made Stewart none too happy with Roush, who definately made some enemies this past week, possibly even in the Ford camp. Gilliland doesn't drive for Roush, and never has, so that argument doesn't fly, either. And CarlEdwards99, the argument you make about helping Jeff Gordon take points away from Edwards and Kenseth can be made about aiding EVERY other driver in the field, even other Ford drivers, much as Bayne assisted Robby Gordon. Helping Robby Gordon would have taken points away from the other Roush drivers just the same as if it was another Chase driver. And Robby was driving a Dodge. The Truth, while you say this is statistically Trevor's best Nationwide season (and it may be, in that regard), he actually ran better with Michael Waltrip last year, but he didn't have the results to show for it. Bayne has often finished a lot better than he has run when he hasn't been involved in other people's messes. He's run 9th to 12th in most of the races he's finished and has often finished better than that. After all, at least two of his top fives were fuel mileage races. He actually ran poorer than that in those races. As for Roush not wanting other Ford teams to succeed, he actually has a track record of undermining other organizations (Robert Yates, for instance), as well as other drivers inside his own organization (Benson, McMurray, and Burton in his final year or two there), so his undermining of Bayne's season after his Daytona 500 win is not surprising to me, because he's done it before. Let's also remember that Roush once stole sponsorship from the Wood Brothers in 2001 (Citgo, to be exact), so the Roush-Wood Brothers relationship hasn't always been cordial, either. 190. cjs3872 posted: 10.25.2011 - 2:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Also, putting a team as proud as the Wood Brothers in a situation like that may be the worst thing of all in all this. 191. OldSchoolNascarDude posted: 10.25.2011 - 2:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) For those criticizing Bayne's move, who could he have went with at the time? When he made his plans with Gordon, it was assumed that Kenseth and Ragan would work together. 192. cjs3872 posted: 10.25.2011 - 3:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And if what happened directly after the race wasn't bad enough, now not only is Jack Roush telling blatant lies about what happened, but he's now apparently ordered Trevor Bayne to do the same. Bayne knows he was ordered not to aid the #24 car late in the race. The radio communication and chatter tell you that much. And now Bayne, under orders from Roush, is telling lies about as blatant as the ones that Roush has told, simply because of what ramifactions might await Bayne if he doesn't. (Bayne is now saying he wasn't ordered not to aid the #24 car, when even he knows that isn't true. And he's saying that under direct orders from Roush.) But he's too young and inexperienced not to obey orders to tell lies about what happened in the last two laps on Sunday. We all know that he could have finished either third or fourth if he had stuck with his original plan, but he was reminded of the orders from earlier in the week, so he was forced to back off Gordon and finished 15th instead of third or fourth. I think when Bayne is released from his ride at Roush (or walks away from it), possibly at year's end, we'll know what really happened on those last two laps. That is, if the radio communications haven't already told us. 193. OldSchoolNascarDude posted: 10.25.2011 - 4:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It says a lot when the owner isn't willing to go to bat for his driver. How often do you see Childress, Penske, Gibbs or Hendrick leave a driver out to dry? Not often, if ever. 194. cjs3872 posted: 10.25.2011 - 4:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) OldSchoolNascarDude, you forgot to mention Ganassi in that group of car owners. When Jamie McMurray returned to Ganassi's team last year, I beleve he said that he felt more welcome there in the first few weeks after his return there than he ever did in his four years at Roush, which should say something right there. Not only that, but not only has Roush ruined Trevor Bayne's reputation among his fellow drivers as one of the most popular among the competitors, including the one he grew up cheering (Jeff Gordon), but Roush has somehow managed to do something that I didn't think was even possible, and that is to soil the reputation of the most respected team in the history of the sport, Wood Brothers Racing. To my recollection, the Wood Brothers have NEVER been involved in a major controversy until this, so for Roush to bring this upon them shows you all you need to know about the level of his integrity. And in the year that they should be celebrating their return to prominence, no less. (Remember how well they ran at Charlotte?) Not to mention Glen Wood's election and imminent induction into the sport's Hall of Fame. I wonder what he's going to do to Richard Petty in the near future, because if they start conteding for wins, you know he's going to try to do something to soil Petty's reputation as well. Bet on it. Because the one thing Roush can't stand is competition, even and especially in the Ford ranks. 195. Talon64 posted: 10.25.2011 - 5:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) MWR got nailed, big time. 00, 56, 47 CC's and car chiefs suspended for the rest of the season (CC's fined 50k), competition director on probation for the rest of the season, and all drivers/teams penalized 25 driver/owner points. This'll drop Martin Truex Jr. and the #56 team from 22nd to 24th in the standings. It won't drop David Reutimann or Bobby Labonte, they're 28th and 29th in points respectively and will still be 124 and 78 points respectively ahead of 30th (David Gilliland). That's who you'll be driving for next year, Clint Bowyer. lol 196. Anonymous posted: 10.25.2011 - 5:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Will Dale Jr. ever win again? 197. NBC posted: 10.25.2011 - 5:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yes: 2012 Daytona 500 1. Dale Jr 2. Jeff Gordon 3. Kevin Conway 198. Anonymous posted: 10.25.2011 - 6:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Um Gordon never got loose he passed Gordon on the back strecth. Look the point of this whole argument is simple dont lie and say youre gonna help draft and then not do it. Thats all im saying. And that Bayne isnt that big of a Gordon fan after all. Martin stuck with Gordon the entire race granted they are teammates but all Bayne had to do was push him for two laps. Im sure that Gordon wouldve rather been wrecked getting pushed from Bayne than being lied to and dumped. Bayne lied and said he got orders right there on the radio and then today said it was becausr a fellow Ford driver needed help. Stick with your position and dont flip flop John Kerry. I personally have no respect for Bayne and hope no one works with him in the future. At least it wont be Gordon. Thank god. 199. 00andJoe posted: 10.25.2011 - 6:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And why, exactly, do you think he passed Gordon on the back stretck? Because the 17 pushed the 21 while the 21 was pushing the 24. And Gordon got loose as a result. 200. 00andJoe posted: 10.25.2011 - 6:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Owners' standings by best finishing team car 1. Roush, 1294 2. Hendrick, 1284 3. Gibbs, 1268 4. Childress, 1235 5. Penske, 1215 6. Stewart-Haas, 1134 7. Petty, 1036 8. Red Bull, 1021 9. Earnhardt-Ganassi, 969 10. Michael Waltrip, 922 11. Furniture Row, 731 12. JTG-Daughtery, 602 13. Front Row, 596 14. Phoenix, 576 15. Baldwin, 477 16. Germain, 454 17. Stoddard, 410 18. TRG, 410 19. Robby Gordon, 317 20. Wood Brothers, 302 21. Gunselman, 166 22. Whitney, 139 23. Parsons, 130 24. NEMCO, 121 25. Inception, 79 26. Leavine, 47 27. Rusty Wallace, 24 28. Falk, 20 29. Curb, 18 30. Keselowski, 9 201. 00andJoe posted: 10.25.2011 - 6:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Correction: 17. Stoddard, 437 202. TheTruthâ?¢ posted: 10.25.2011 - 6:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "1. Kenseth gets in the back of Bayne, who (already pushing the 24) gets Jeff loose. 2. the 24's getting loose pushes him up the track; Bayne can't follow because Kenseth is pushing him - if the 21 turns to follow the 24 up the track, the 17 is going to be pushing him off-center and, therefore, will wreck him (and most of the cars behind them, to boot). 3. Jeff's getting loose and going up the track, with Bayne unable to follow, slows the 24 so that the 17 starts pushing the 21 past Jeff. 4. By the time Gordon's straight and level, as it were, again, the 21's already been pushed up to his side door...with the 17 still at full steam against Bayne's back bumper." Completely factually inaccurate. Did you even watch the replay? Kenseth is way off Bayne's bumper when Bayne chooses to go low on Gordon. Gordon did not lose any noticeable momentum. What you have there is that when the car pushing chooses to pass the car in front of him, the car in front of him is ALWAYS the lame duck. It's like you're trying to paint that Gordon is trying to save the car halfway down the backstretch. Incredible. The 17 is nowhere near "full steam against Bayne's back bumper". Trevor surely had to work with Kenseth rather than Gordon given the championship implications with Ragan's issues, and he chose to pass Gordon and absolutely wasn't boxed into it. Here's a picture for you to prove that 17 wasn't on his bumper: http://www.hostingbytes.us/images/3/2243955.jpg "he actually ran better with Michael Waltrip last year, but he didn't have the results to show for it." Actually he did have the results. Pretty much every column statistically was better than Michael Waltrip, which isn't exactly saying much. Dude, even if he runs 9th-12th every race, that's still statistically better than he did last year with MWR & his beginning races with Roush because of his lack of consistency. Trevor ran midpack at best in SEVERAL races last year. He also ran great in several. This year, he finds himself in better cars and the numbers prove it. "Bayne knows he was ordered not to aid the #24 car late in the race." Bayne's quote: ""We took the green flag and the 6 car (a Ford driven by David Ragan) blew up. When the 6 car blows up, Matt Kenseth pulls up to our bumper and then there's a Ford in need, which we committed to all week." Once again... that's Jack Roush making him blatantly lie? No. It's common sense. You got a Roush car fighting for the title who's going to be left out to dry or you have a team competitor in Gordon who's gonna be left out to dry. Who do you go for, when you're driving a Roush car for the Wood Brothers? The championship could be decided by his move. They probably didn't say "don't draft the 24" but rather "17 needs a partner go with him". And frankly, I don't see anything wrong with that. Racing at Talladega is A JOKE and it puts the competitors in this box. 203. TheTruthâ?¢ posted: 10.25.2011 - 6:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "1. Kenseth gets in the back of Bayne, who (already pushing the 24) gets Jeff loose. 2. the 24's getting loose pushes him up the track; Bayne can't follow because Kenseth is pushing him - if the 21 turns to follow the 24 up the track, the 17 is going to be pushing him off-center and, therefore, will wreck him (and most of the cars behind them, to boot). 3. Jeff's getting loose and going up the track, with Bayne unable to follow, slows the 24 so that the 17 starts pushing the 21 past Jeff. 4. By the time Gordon's straight and level, as it were, again, the 21's already been pushed up to his side door...with the 17 still at full steam against Bayne's back bumper." Completely factually inaccurate. Did you even watch the replay? Kenseth is way off Bayne's bumper when Bayne chooses to go low on Gordon. Gordon did not lose any noticeable momentum. What you have there is that when the car pushing chooses to pass the car in front of him, the car in front of him is ALWAYS the lame duck. It's like you're trying to paint that Gordon is trying to save the car halfway down the backstretch. Incredible. The 17 is nowhere near "full steam against Bayne's back bumper". Trevor surely had to work with Kenseth rather than Gordon given the championship implications with Ragan's issues, and he chose to pass Gordon and absolutely wasn't boxed into it. Here's a picture for you to prove that 17 wasn't on his bumper: http://www.hostingbytes.us/images/3/2243955.jpg "he actually ran better with Michael Waltrip last year, but he didn't have the results to show for it." Actually he did have the results. Pretty much every column statistically was better than Michael Waltrip, which isn't exactly saying much. Dude, even if he runs 9th-12th every race, that's still statistically better than he did last year with MWR & his beginning races with Roush because of his lack of consistency. Trevor ran midpack at best in SEVERAL races last year. He also ran great in several. This year, he finds himself in better cars and the numbers prove it. "Bayne knows he was ordered not to aid the #24 car late in the race." Bayne's quote: ""We took the green flag and the 6 car (a Ford driven by David Ragan) blew up. When the 6 car blows up, Matt Kenseth pulls up to our bumper and then there's a Ford in need, which we committed to all week." Once again... that's Jack Roush making him blatantly lie? No. It's common sense. You got a Roush car fighting for the title who's going to be left out to dry or you have a team competitor in Gordon who's gonna be left out to dry. Who do you go for, when you're driving a Roush car for the Wood Brothers? The championship could be decided by his move. They probably didn't say "don't draft the 24" but rather "17 needs a partner go with him". And frankly, I don't see anything wrong with that. Racing at Talladega is A JOKE and it puts the competitors in this box. 204. . posted: 10.25.2011 - 6:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "192. cjs3872 posted: 10.25.11 - 3:48 pm And if what happened directly after the race wasn't bad enough, now not only is Jack Roush telling blatant lies about what happened, but he's now apparently ordered Trevor Bayne to do the same. Bayne knows he was ordered not to aid the #24 car late in the race. The radio communication and chatter tell you that much." If you have a link to this radio communication I would love to see it. 205. TheTruth posted: 10.25.2011 - 6:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "1. Kenseth gets in the back of Bayne, who (already pushing the 24) gets Jeff loose. 2. the 24's getting loose pushes him up the track; Bayne can't follow because Kenseth is pushing him - if the 21 turns to follow the 24 up the track, the 17 is going to be pushing him off-center and, therefore, will wreck him (and most of the cars behind them, to boot). 3. Jeff's getting loose and going up the track, with Bayne unable to follow, slows the 24 so that the 17 starts pushing the 21 past Jeff. 4. By the time Gordon's straight and level, as it were, again, the 21's already been pushed up to his side door...with the 17 still at full steam against Bayne's back bumper." Completely factually inaccurate. Did you even watch the replay? Kenseth is way off Bayne's bumper when Bayne chooses to go low on Gordon. Gordon did not lose any noticeable momentum. When the car pushing chooses to pass the car in front of him, the car in front of him is ALWAYS the lame duck. It's like you're trying to paint that Gordon is trying to save the car halfway down the backstretch. Incredible. Jeff's not out of shape at all. The 17 is nowhere near "full steam against Bayne's back bumper". Trevor surely had to work with Kenseth rather than Gordon given the championship implications with Ragan's issues, and he chose to pass Gordon and absolutely wasn't boxed into it. Here's a picture for you to prove that 17 wasn't on his bumper: http://www.hostingbytes.us/images/3/2243955.jpg 206. cjs3872 posted: 10.25.2011 - 8:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #202, while I have no links (I wouldn't even know how to post them), the radio chatter in question has been aired on NASCAR Now last night and Race Hub tonight. At least Jeff Gordon seems to have forgiven him, according to reports, but trust me, he hasn't forgotten, nor will he for a while. Talon64, while MWR and their satellite team, JTG-Daugherty needed to be penalized, I find the punishment harsh. Considering it was just those particular teams, I wonder if it was a particular part that was incorrectly built, because no the team was found to be guilty of such a violation. And Anonymous (#198), Bayne was on Race Hub via phone and explained his side of what happened, and while his explanation seems plausible, it reamins to be seen (and never will be seen) if he would still have gotten the green light to help Gordon if David Ragan hadn't run into engine problems. He also said that, before the race, his main goal, other than winning, was to aid the Roush teams, if he could. However, Roush is lying through his teeth when he said there were no team or manufacturer orders when we all know that there was, and not just with the Roush drivers, but all Ford drivers in that race. Ironically, in trying to aid Matt Kenseth, he unintentionally cost him a better finish, meaning that all three drivers involved in this controversy wound up getting worse finishes due to Ragan's engine trouble than they would have gotten had Ragan not had engine trouble. Meanwhile, Ragan's engine failure, while on a restrictor plate track, could be a bad sign for roush, because when Roush first encountered engine problems with Carl Edwards at Pocono, they ran into a slew of engine problems, so Ragan's engine problem might be a harbinger of bad times, not just for the Cup title hopes of Kenseth and Edwards, but also for the Nationwide title hopes for Ricky Stenhouse, Jr. Just something to watch for. 207. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.25.2011 - 8:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) RaceFanX, I think you misunderstood me. I was saying that was the 33rd time RCR has won without Dale driving, and it was car #33. There were two reasons I mentioned it. One because of the. 33 irony. Two because it is funny they are celebrating an "organizational milestone" that 2/3 of which were accomplished by one driver. 208. Cooper posted: 10.25.2011 - 9:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's actually pretty laughable DSFF. That's right, laughable. Me and Dale Sr. have a combined 76 victories. Does that mean I get to declare half the wins as mine? Me and Bill Gates have over 2 Billion dollars combined. Does that make me a billionaire? The whole organization win thing is dumb, but who am I to talk... 209. LordLowe posted: 10.25.2011 - 9:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) There is a interesting picture by Nascarcasm that pretty well sums up the entire race. Here is the link http://www.sbnation.com/nascar/2011/10/24/2511782/nascar-image-of-the-week-the-flight-home-from-talladega 210. cjs3872 posted: 10.25.2011 - 10:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) He did run better for Waltrip last year, especially in the second half of the season. In 28 starts for MWR last year, Bayne finished in the top five five times, led 94 laps, and won three conseutive pole positions. This year, in what should be better equipent, he has finished in the top five only four times, has 12 top ten finishes, has not even sniffed the pole position (and won't due to the fact that he has to be conservative in qualifications), though he has qualified second three or four times this year, and led just 106 laps in 26 races. The only thing he's doing in the Nationwide Series this year better than he did last year is finish races out. The stats actually show, especially considering the calibur of the team he's driving for this year as compared to last, he actually ran much better last year than he has this year, especially in the second half of the season last year. 211. TheTruth posted: 10.26.2011 - 12:44 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) hey sorry for my multiple posts! my browser was doing all kinds of weird stuff and i didnt think my post went through 212. TheTruth posted: 10.26.2011 - 12:53 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "The stats actually show, especially considering the calibur of the team he's driving for this year as compared to last, he actually ran much better last year than he has this year, especially in the second half of the season last year." The stats show that he's led a few more laps, has 2 more top 10s, and 1 less top 5 in 2 less races than he had with MWR. He also has a significantly better average start and better average finish. People expected Trevor to switch from MWR to Roush and suddenly be a huge standout, but the truth of the matter is that MWR's Nationwide program has been great for years. Just look at how well Martin Truex Jr ran when he hopped in those cars. Also look at how Trevor ran for Roush at the end of 2010, before he won the Daytona 500 and allegedly started getting screwed by Jack. On average, Trevor has run better this year than last by far. Trevor didn't exactly have much bad luck last year. Most of his midpack finishes were indicative of being midpack quality. 213. cjs3872 posted: 10.26.2011 - 1:01 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Cooper, DSFF, why the complaints about RCR celebrating it's 100th win on Sunday at Talladega? Sure, Dale Earnhardt, Sr. got 67 of them, but that means that 33 had to have come from other drivers. Are you going to do the same when Hendrick gets it's 200th win, which I believe will come from Jimmie Johnson at Martinsville this Sunday. Johnson's the only one that can do it, if that 200th win is to come this year. After all, Jeff Gordon's team is still emotionally crushed over what happened at Richmond, Dale, Jr. isn't good enough to win at most tracks (Martinsville is a rare exception, so he could get it this weekend), and Mark Martin is too old. (Frankly, I hope Gordon is the one to get it, as he did HMS' 100th win, but if that is the case, it won't come until next year.) Are the same complaints going to be lodged about HMS getting it's 200th win because they've had two dominant winners, with Jeff Gordon having 85 wins and Jimmie Johnson another 55, because I hope not. If one of those two gets Hendrick's 200th win, that would mean that they would have 141 of them between the two of them. But that means the other 59 would have had to come from drivers other than Jeff and Jimmie. 214. TheTruth posted: 10.26.2011 - 1:02 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) My initial response regarding MWR was weird because I thought you said "better than Michael Waltrip" rather than "better with Michael Waltrip". He had some standout races with Michael Waltrip, but had it not been for his engine failure in the closing laps at IRP, there'd be no question because that one less top 5 (with 2 less starts) is the only thing holding him back... 26 0 4 12 14.5 Roush vs 28 0 5 10 16.4 MWR I guess we'll see how it looks when he gets to 28 races and beyond. Roush is the better team and all, but I think Trevor's performance has a lot to do with Trevor and not to do with the theories about Jack being pissed about the Daytona 500 and screwing with him. There are no excuses. 215. Watto posted: 10.26.2011 - 1:08 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I don't buy the Jeff Gordon Richmond theory. At all. That's overanalyzing it, IMO. They've struggled with inconsistency ALL SEASON LONG. It easily could've been Jeff Gordon in victory lane just this past weekend if it were for different circumstances. cjs I respect you a lot but some of your theories just seem to be reaching to me. I don't mean that with any offense whatsoever 216. cjs3872 posted: 10.26.2011 - 1:16 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) But The Truth, how many races this year has Bayne just been riding in about 9th to 12th place in and finished higher due to other circumstances this year. But you also have to consider the calibur of the organization, and MWR's is, and has always been, light years behind Roush's Nationwide team. Bayne's blase performances with Roush might be a case of the chemistry between driver and car owner just not being there. And it wouldn't be the first time a driver of that calibur struggled with Roush, but was able to flourish elsewhere. Just look at Jamie McMurray. By all counts, he was a disappointment there, but flourished at Ganassi when he returned there. Then there's the situation with Johnny Benson. Benson was a Nationwide Series champion in 1995 and had two pretty good years at Bahari Racing, earning him a ride at Roush. But Roush basically cast Benson aside almost immediately after Benson failed to qualify for the 1998 Daytona 500, and things never got better with him at Roush from there. But he got to Tyler Jet Motorsports in 2000 and was a caution flag away from winning the Daytona 500 and had other good runs. In 2001, Valvoline came aboard the newly named MB2 Motorsports, and Benson looked like a legitimate top 10 points contender until injuries sidelined him. In 2002, he had other great runs, especially late in the season, nearly winning at Martinsville, then finally scoring his only Cup victory at Rockingham, which had to be doubly sweet since he beat roush in the process. Bayne's struggles at Roush may just be a case of the personalities of driver and owner just not going together. you've got Bayne's sunny personaliy trying to mesh with Roush's personality, which in contrast, resembles a thunderstorm, and those two just don't go together. It may be that Bayne prefers the more relazed atmosphere he had at MWR rather than the high-pressure, gloomy situation he now finds himself in with Roush, which may understand why he seems to do better, all things considered in the Wood Brothers' #21 car than he does in Roush's #16 NNS car, because the atmosphere with the Wood Brothers is a more relaxed atmosphere, and he may seem to prefer that over what he's experiancing with Roush now. 217. cjs3872 posted: 10.26.2011 - 1:21 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Watto, I do, and the reason is this. They had been on a tear. They had been the top Chevrolet team for two solid months, had just gotten Gordon his historic 85th win at Atlanta, and they were about to steal a win from Kevin Harvick at Richmond, when RCR had Paul Menard spin out to cause the final caution, knowing what would happen on the restart. Ever since that race, the bottom has fallen out of Gordon's season. Now if they hadn't had problems with the fuleing mechanism at Loudon, they might have been able to turn it around, but the plain truth is that they have been uncompetitve more often since Richmond than they have been competitve. I think what happened at Richmond, considering the effort they put into that race, to lose it the way they did, took all the wind out of their sails, and they were never able to get it back. That's why I think what happened at Richmond had a damaging effect on the #24 team for the Chase. 218. cjs3872 posted: 10.26.2011 - 1:40 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) And going back to what I mentioned about how what happened at Richmond had affected the #24 team for at least the rest of this year to date, and while there are many that disagree with my opinion on that, there's another example of how losing a race negatively affected another driver and team, and that may have been in the most famous NASCAR race of all. Everyone remembers the 1979 Daytona 500 and what happened at the end of the race. What people don't remember about that is how it affected Donnie Allison. Losing that race the way he did affected Allison in such a traumatic way, that he was never the same driver after that race, and he never won again (except for the tragic second Daytona qualifying race of 1980), and his team only won one more time after that, and that was in a race at Darlington that barely made it past half distance with David Pearson driving. And this kind of thing has happened in other sports, as well. In the 1966 U.S. Open, Arnold Palmer had a seven-shot lead over Billy Casper with nine holes to play, golf's equivalent to a driver having a one or two lap lead in the Daytona 500 with 25 laps to go, yet threw it away and was crushed in an 18-hole playoff. Palmer was never the same golfer after that, while Casper went on to win the 1970 Masters. Things like this happen, and sometimes it happens in such a traumatic way that it affects drivers and teams for a long time, possibly the rest of their careers. 219. Spen posted: 10.26.2011 - 2:52 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Donnie was still pretty competitive for the rest of the year. Yeah, he didn't win, but they were definitely still there. It was his injury in '80 that really spelled the end for him. A better comparison from the same year might be DW after crashing out while leading by two laps in the Southern 500. He pretty much gave the year up after that, even though he still had a sizeable point lead. (Then again, having Petty breathing down your neck was bound to make a guy paranoid.) On the subject of Trevor's Busch series performance, I'm agreeing with Cjs here. Yeah, he's been more consistent with Roush, but he seemed to have more "break-out" runs with MWR. He's been mostly under the radar with Roush. 220. Anonymous posted: 10.26.2011 - 5:40 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) What the media ignores is the fact that Childress has been around since the 1960s, and just got his 100th win; Hendrick has been around since 1984, and his next win will be 200. I think Hendrick shifted too much $$ toward Jimmie and Dale after Richmond. It is almost like Hendrick got too excited at the thought of another 1-2-3 points finish, and instead shifted the $$ in such a way that instead of 3 competitive cars, he got three crapheaps. Yeah, Jeff, Jimmie, and Dale have had their runs, but once they fall back, they stay back. Weird stat: Ryan Newman got more $$ for his 38th place finish than Michael Waltrip got for 9th. Newman made more than Dale Jr.!! *faints* 221. Anonymous posted: 10.26.2011 - 5:44 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mathematically and technically, Stewart could win the title even without a top-5 in the last 4 races. If he did, Stewart would win the title with only 5 top-5s in 36, which would be equivalent to Bill Rexford in 1950. Rexford had only 5 top-5s in 17 races... another weird stat. 222. cjs3872 posted: 10.26.2011 - 10:05 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) #220, Richard Childress was an independent when he drove, not not even the top independent, so he couldn't run as hard as he could when he drove the car, but he did have some very good runs, including a fourth in the 1973 Rebel 500 at Darlington (21 laps behind the winner). His best finish as a driver was at Nashville in 1978, where he was third. Childress got his first satart in Cup as a result of the Talladega boycott of 1969, as he was one of the replacement drivers for that race. His team didn't really show what hit could do until about 1981, when Childress himself finished fourth at Riverside for his last top 5 as a drive, no small feat at a road course. That performance opened some eyes and when Dale Earnhardt's team was sold out from under him, he drove for Childress some that year before Childress advised him to go to another team (Bud Moore Engineering) for 1982, and he hired Ricky Rudd for 1982, and they scored their first win at Riverside in 1983. Childress then re-hired Earnhardt for 1984, and the rest, as they say, is history. #221, in the case of Bill Rexford's title in 1950, there was a strange circumstance involved there, as Rexford and Fireball Roberts, who was second in points that year, were the beneficiaries of a number of the top drivers, including Lee Petty, losing the points they had scored through most of the season for driving in other series, which was strictly prohibited then. But the fact that Stewart could win the title this year with as few a five, and no more than nine top five finishes this year shows just what a joke the championship has become in the Chase format, which shows yet again how devalued the championship really is. See, the reason NASCAR, upon creating the Chase, put a five million dollar prize on the championship, is that NASCAR even knew how devalued winning the championship would become, and they hoped the $5,000,000 prize for winning the title would put emphasis on the championship among the teams, and not on the sport's bigger races, which is why you've had so many of the sport's underdogs win the big races in the last few years, not that those teams weren't capable. 223. LordLowe posted: 10.26.2011 - 1:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Spen Donnie got injured in 1981 at the world 600 not 1980 224. cjs3872 posted: 10.26.2011 - 1:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Spen, Donnie Allison was fired shortly after the 1980 Daytona 500 and replaced in Hoss Ellington's #1 car by David Pearson. Donnie spent the time before his horrible accident, which didn't occur until the 1981 World 600, which was on the same day as the horrific and controversial Indianapolis 500 that year, with lower-echelon teams. For instance, Donnie drove in the 1981 Daytona 500 for Kennie Childers (placing a respectable 12th), and then moved to John Rebhan's #77 car, which needed a driver after John Anderson's horrific crash in his Daytona qualifiying race that year. It was driving Rebhan's #77 car (#77 again?) that Allison had his terrible accident with Dick Brooks in the World 600 in 1981, a crash that effectively ended Donnie's career, though he continued to race a for few more years. But it was the after effects of what happened in the 1979 Daytona 500 that effectively ended Donnie Allison's time as a race winning driver in the Cup series, and early in 1980, Hoss Ellington realized it, hence he released Allison shortly after the 1980 Daytona 500. 225. cjs3872 posted: 10.26.2011 - 2:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If you think things weren't fishy enough at Talladega, here something else I just discovered. It turns out that Chad Knaus told Jimmie Johnson to intentionally wreck his car if he had won (he finished 25th, so that plan, fortunately went by the boards) so that the inspectors wouldn't get curious. Sounds like Knaus was up to his usual no good. And Richard Childress and Paul Menard were at it again, as well. While the situation between Trevor Bayne, Jeff Gordon, Matt Kenseth, and Jack Roush grabbed all the headlines, someone inside the Childress camp told Menard not to push Stewart on the final restart to keep him from winning the race, in order to protect Kevin Harvick from losing more ground to Stewart in the championship race, as well as protect the two drivers that eventually battled for the win on the last lap. This is the second time that Childress, or someone high up in his organization, has ordered Menard to do something underhanded to aid other drivers in his team. Remember that Mike Dillon, possibly under orders from Childress, had Paul Menard intentionally spin out to cause the final caution at Richmond to draw a caution flag when it appeared that Jeff Gordon had Harvick beat. This kind of thing, especially ordering drivers to spin or crash on purpose, has to be stopped, though there is virtually no way to police telling a driver in a plate race not to push the car in front on a restart. After all, the team could say that the driver missed a gear, which if he finished back in the pack, would be virtually impossible for NASCAR to prove that he didn't. 226. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.26.2011 - 2:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I am probably being a little too hard on Richard. He was great with Dale, understanding exactly what he had, a once in a lifetime talent that he needed to hang on to. He built that organization around him. He surrounded him with a pit crew that was steady as a rock and built him bulletproof cars cause Dale wouldn't take it easy. He knew where his cornerstone was and built a franchise. He did what Osterlund, JD Stacy, and Bud Moore either couldn't do or didn't have the foresight to do. I guess I've let my opinion of what his organization has become cloud my thoughts. Namely that they are way more talk and self hype than substance. Kinda like Rex Ryan's Jets. Pretty good, but way overhyped by themselves. With Dale, Richard didn't toot his own horn. He didn't have to. Comparing that organization with Dale to it without Dale is night and day. And the results tell the story. 227. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.26.2011 - 2:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And as cjs alluded to, they have now taken to underhanded tactics which is about as low as it gets imo. Paul Menard is nothing but Richard's mule. 228. Cooper posted: 10.26.2011 - 3:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's these situations that make me thankful that my driver has surrounded himself in a small (yet talented) organization like Penske Racing. I could just imagine what he'd have to do at a place like Hendrick to do well. Also, like I had mentioned a long time ago driving a Dodge gives Brad a lot of freedom that he wouldn't have with Chevy and Ford. Overall, Brad looks like a genius for taking the #12 ride. Roger Penske is the definition of class and integrity and I bet Brad is very thankful for making the choices he's made. Jack Roush running his organization like a Chinese Shoe Factory--BS. Richard Childress demanding his driver to do what he says like a slave--BS. Chad Knaus telling his driver to damage his car to avoid inspection--BS. Installing illegal windshields to all of your cars--BS Pushing a single car team to a 3rd place finish, while finishing as the highest chaser and avoiding controversy--NOT BS. I'm telling you, if Brad/Roger Penske/Dodge pull off this championship, it'd basically be a middle finger to the NASCAR world. 229. cjs3872 posted: 10.26.2011 - 3:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, you mentioned Osterlund and Jim Stacy in relations to Earnhardt's early career teams. Actually, that was the same team, which actually began as Roger Penske's first NASCAR organization when it fielded AMC Matadors for Mark Donohue, Dave Marcis, Gary Bettenhausen, and most famously, Bobby Allison. Penske switched to Mercurys in 1976, and released Allison after a Modified accident late in 1976, replacing him with Marcis for 1977. When Penske decided to sell, he sold the team to Rod Osterlund for 1978. When Osterlund made it his desire to run GM cars, Penske sold a lot of the Mercury parts to George Elliott for his son Bill to run. But Marcis and the #2 went with the sale of the team from Penske to Osterlund for 1978. Hence, the foundation for Earnhardt's early success was laid. But when Earnhardt won the championship in 1980 in just his second year, Osterlund tired of racing, having been to the top of the mountain so quickly, so he sold his team to Jim Stacy a third of the way into the 1981 season. Osterlund had bailed Stacy out late in 1978 when Stacy's money went dry, so Osterlund fielded cars not just for Marcis and Earnhardt late in that season, but also Neil Bonnett's #5 was fielded by Osterlund late in the '78 season. After being bounced around in 1981, and having won the btitle in 1980, Earnhardt's desire aslo waned ever so briefly for the same reason, but when Richard Childress advised Earnhardt to join Bud Moore's team for 1982, Earnhardt's fire was relit, and his desire returned to full force and never left again, despite a series of bad crashes, especially in the last five years of his career. Stacy left the sport in 1984, never to return, while Osterlund returned in 1989, but never came close to winning again with drivers such as Jimmy Spencer, Hut Stricklin, and Buddy Baker. Ostelrund left in 1991 for good, ironically the same year that Penske, who sold his team to Osterlund after the 1977 season, returned. It must be noted that Penske made a brief return to NASCAR in 1980 with the driver that is he is most associated with among NASCAR drivers, Rusty Wallace, and finished second right out of the box to Osterlund's car with Dale Earnhardt driving at Atlanta in the best-ever result for a NASCAR debut in modern times. But Penske ran just one more race that year and didn't return to NASCAR until 1991, picking up the pieces for the team originally owned by M.C. Anderson, and changed the number of that car from #27 back to #2, his number in 1976-'77, as well as select races in 1973 when Dave Marcis drove for him then. 230. cjs3872 posted: 10.26.2011 - 3:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Cooper, when has Roger Penske ever run a small racing organization? Sure he's only running two cars in the Cup series, but can you seriously say that his IndyCar team isn't helping his Cup team in any way? I believe the technology he and his organization have been running in IndyCar racing has been bled into his NASCAR cars, which is why they're running better. Too bad for Penske' IndyCar teams that NASCAR technonlogy can't be applied to his IndyCar operation, or they'd be much better on ovals in the IndyCar series. 231. Cooper posted: 10.26.2011 - 3:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I meant their NASCAR team, in which they only field 2 cars. (Kurt Busch and BK). Obviously he's huge in the Indycar Series. Sorry for not declaring my point. 232. LordLowe posted: 10.26.2011 - 4:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) My view on the race at talladega can be summed up in a few simple words. Team orders, Team strategy, Politicking, Backstabbing, and A bunch of Millionaires with hurt feelings. Which along with the 2 car deal led to a Artificial, Manufactured, and completely ridiculous race. 233. 00andJoe posted: 10.26.2011 - 4:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Martinsville entry list update: TRG has withdrawn their second car (#77/277). Andy Lally won't be racing this weekend. 234. cjs3872 posted: 10.26.2011 - 5:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 00andJoe, that means one less start-and-park will try to qualify, but I believe there are only two or three of the cars that have to make it on time, at the most, that actually intend to try to run the full race. And perhaps as few as one will try to go the distance, which will mean, of course, less on-track traffic during the race. That's one reason I really don't have anything against the start-and-parks. Actually, the number of S&P's has, in my view, greatly contributed to the decrease in caution flags across the major NASCAR series this year, because there are fewer cars on the track during the mid-to-latter stages of the race. And with fewer cars means fewer incidents on the track, which in turn, mean fewer caution flags, which may also mean that the start-and-parks may also, though to a small degree, be a reason for the higher number of fule mileage race this year, because there aren't as many cars on the track late in races that could cause caution periods. 235. Cooper posted: 10.26.2011 - 6:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "232. LordLowe posted: 10.26.11 - 4:37 pm" Yep. Pretty comical really. It was basically a soap opera at 200MPH. 236. cjs3872 posted: 10.26.2011 - 7:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) My question is, would you rather have the 2x2 drafting, or would you rather have a situation where you have huge packs where nobody can really go anywhere, excessive blocking, which leads to huge crashes, and only 12-15 healthy cars finishing a race in which 43 start. Given a choice, I'd rather have what we have now. But NASCAR does need to get the team politics and manufacturer out of it, if they can. But the 2x2 racing is much safer. After all, how many cars did we see get airborne at Daytona and Talladega this year? If I remember right, the answer is zero. And how long has it been since we've seen a year in which no car got airborne in any of the plate races? Not only that, but the 2x2 racing actually lets the drivers breathe. If they want to hide in the back, which is much easier to do at Talladega because of how much room you have to maneuver, you can, though they must be careful about how far back they get. And let's not forget that the 2x2 racing has eliminated blocking, and I don't think, except for the end of the Bud Shootout when Denny Hamlin went below the yellow line and passed Ryan Newman, which resulted in a post race one lap penalty to Hamlin, that we ever heard anything about the yellow line rule at all this year. Why? Because under the 2x2 drafting, you can actually pass without trouble, and without risk of being blocked. After all, blocking was the reason drivers went on to the apron to begin with, and NASCAR never once did anything about the vicious blocking that took place. Plate racing is actually safer now than it has been in many years, and we have the 2x2 racing to thank for that. It isn't perfect, nothing is, but the current plate racing is much safer than it ever has been. 237. Mr X posted: 10.26.2011 - 7:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) To me races this year have either been complete crash fests, with lots of caution periods, or a clean and green race. The Daytona 500 had 16 cautions, a record, the World 600 had 14 yellows, Loudon in July and Dover last month both had 10, and Richmond had 15. Regardless of how few cautions there have been in other races this year I really think that the lack of cautions due to on track incidents is strickly because of the aero push. Once the cars get spread out, nobody can make any ground in any of these races. The race will restart, everyone will race like its Need for Speed or Burnout Revenge for a few laps trying to gain every spot they can, if they don't wreck, the field spreads out, and they wont wreck, and even if someone is faster nobody can even get close enough to even make slight contact. Not to mention Good Year appears to be making tires out of forged steel so they never fail. 238. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.26.2011 - 8:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I know JD bought Osterlund's team in the middle of '81 and promptly gutted it. Considering they were the defending champs, that was a smart move. My point is that Osterlund bailed on him right after he won the Winston Cup, the first driver to do so in his second season (and still the only one). If he had any foresight at all or a better knowledge of racing, he would have stuck around and clung tight to Dale. That would have been a better investment than any of his real estate holdings out west. Then JD bought the team and, as I mentioned earlier, dismantled it like a house he wanted to remodel. If he had any brains, he would have made sure to 1) keep the freaking defending champs together (imagine that!) and 2) realized Dale would have carried him into the future and, like Richard would eventually do, mold the organization around him. I think Dale would have stuck with Bud, and Bud certainly understood just how good Dale was, but they had WAY too many mechanical failures to indicate he would ever have a shot at another championship if he stuck around. So he left after his 2 year deal ended, with Bud wanting him to stay, because Bud couldn't put a steady organization behind him. My point is that Richard did what 3 owners before him, two multi millionaires and one racing lifer with a ton of past success, didn't or couldn't do, and that is find a way to keep Dale. And he deserves credit for that. But he has shown in the last 11 seasons that without Dale, he isn't a great owner. 239. 18fan posted: 10.26.2011 - 8:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs, Last time I checked Carl Edwards' nasty flip come when he was in a 2x2 like we see now. I think now it is just way too political now and to me the races are unsatisfying. 240. LordLowe posted: 10.26.2011 - 8:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) at post 237 Yes there have been some improvements with the 2x2 racing on the plate tracks but it doesn't mean that I have to enjoy that style of racing. What annoyed me most about the race was the Team orders, Team strategy, Politics, Backstabbing and a bunch of Millionaires whining like a bunch of spoiled kids. 241. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 10.26.2011 - 8:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) ^ Carl wrecked himself with that one. You get one chance you don't get two. I'm fine with 4 races a year that are like polichickens trying to run for office. Its better then F1 were just about every race has politics involved. If "fans" can't stomach 4 plate races a year then i guess you can't stomach NASCAR period. NASCAR had ZERO clue that the 2x2 draft was going happen, the drivers found that out for themselves in the Bud Shootout. I'm also will to bet that even with the old POSCOY car, they'd be doing the 2x2 draft too. Even when the new car comes out they will still do it because it works. 2 cars are faster then one car, its always been that way. But what do i know, i'm just a computer arm chair quaterback spouting cyber ink. 242. cjs3872 posted: 10.26.2011 - 9:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 18fan, yes, that was in 2009, but you must also remember they were running the rear wing then, not a more conventional spoiler. In fact, A.J. Allmendinger flipped at the end of the fall Talladega race last year. But you must also remember, Edwards only turned over because of where he crashed. He crashed in the middle of the tri-oval, where air could get under the entire car, much as it did in Rick Mast's crash there in 1991. Edwards' car would have turned over, or at least got airborne, no matter what. What I'm saying is that 2x2 racing is safer than the pack racing, and there's a great likelyhood that there will be more competitve cars running at the end. But you are right on the dot when you say that the politics have to stop. You'll get no argument from me on that. And the fact that there were 16 cautions in the Daytona 500, nearly 50% more than the previous record, all but two for crashes, and yet not one car got airborne, despite running the fastest lap speeds in race history should tell you how much safer the 2x2 style of racing is. DSFF, that man you call JD Stacy, was actually Jim Stacy, the man who purchased Nord Krauskopf's K&K Insurance team in the middle of the 1977 season and changed the number from 71 to 5. Jim Stacy and JD Stacy were one and the ame person. If you watch the 1982 Daytona 500, you'll even hear Ken Squier refer to him as Jim Stacy. And Mr X, when I said the start-and-parks were partly responsible for the drop in cautions across all three major NASCAR series this year, I meant that the overall number of cautions is down across the board in NASCAR's three top series, and start-and-parks are, in my view, a major reason why, as there are fewer cars competing in the race, especially later in the race. Sure, you're going to have crash-fests along the way. There's no way that's not going to happen sometime. And the Coca-Cola 600 was a perfect example of both happeneing in the same race. The first half of that race went smoothly, with few cautions and multiple green flag pit stops. The second half of the race was a virtual crash fest. So these two things can even happen in the same race. 243. cjs3872 posted: 10.26.2011 - 9:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yes, #240, two cars hoooked together are a second per lap faster than even the traditional draft. The Truck Series race at Talladega this past weekend was proof of trhat, as the KHI trucks got as much as 11-12 seconds, nor not much less than a quarter lap, ahead of the main draft. not to mention that they were 15 MPH faster than they qualified. You saw how fast Denny Hamlin got lapped in the Cup race, because he was the odd car in the field at the time. At the time that Hamlin got lapped, there were an uneven number of cars in the race, and Hamlin just happened to be the unlucky "one". 244. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 10.27.2011 - 12:18 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Cooper, when has Roger Penske ever run a small racing organization? Sure he's only running two cars in the Cup series, but can you seriously say that his IndyCar team isn't helping his Cup team in any way? I believe the technology he and his organization have been running in IndyCar racing has been bled into his NASCAR cars, which is why they're running better." I think the deal that made Penske start running better was that they started actually setting up the cars like stock cars rather than relying so much on engineering. That may work good in IRL, but not in NASCAR. The only reason Ryan Newman won so many races and poles in 2003 was because that team was the first to excercise that aspect. Now everyone has long since caught and passed that curve. But Roger Penske is one of the best when it comes to building and maintaining winning teams. If anyone was going to figure out a way to run better in Cup eventually, it was going to be him. The fact that his IRL AND Sprint Cup teams are both running up front and contending for wins supports that. As for RC, I don't like how he has basically told Menard to act as a puppet just to benefit one of his other cars multiple times recently. Combined with the embarrassing incident at Kansas where he punched KyBusch (Ky had it coming after all he had done over the years, but still...), this is going to be remembered as a dark season for him by this particular fan. 245. Spen posted: 10.27.2011 - 4:13 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) An off-the-wall question for the webmaster: Who was the 10000th driver added? 246. webmaster posted: 10.27.2011 - 7:29 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm not sure -- I added a couple at the same time. :-) 247. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.27.2011 - 10:30 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I just heard the audio of Chad instructing JJ to wreck the back end had he won. That is just another very ugly episode in a career of ugly episodes for Knaus. That will be another aspect that will hold JJ back historically, along with having mentally feeble competition (not the cha$e, he deserves credit for doing what it took to win those championships). The saddest thing is the lack of overall outrage over this. It is almost like we have simply come to expect that from him. That, more than anything taints the legacy of the 48. And yeah, Menard is nothing but Richard's patsy. The legacy of the Brickyard 400 just keeps fading week after week since Rich Boy won it. 248. cjs3872 posted: 10.27.2011 - 11:13 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, what I'm surprised about, as far as the Paul Menard sutuation goes, is that his father John, a former car owner himself, hasn't told Richard Childress to stop using his son like he has been, or he'll take his sponsorship money somewhere else. That would stop Childress' shenanigans regarding Paul Menard faster than anything else ever could. Especially after this incident with Tony Stewart, who got his first big-league racing opportunity in 1996 from John Menard (and Stewart rewarded him with his first of two IRL titles in 1998), and although their relationship was rocky at times, as all of Stewart's relationships have been over the years, it seems that the relationship between Stewart and the Menard family has become more cordial over the last few years. Frankly, I believe that John Menard is starting to get sick and tired of the way that Childress is treating his son. 249. Scott B posted: 10.27.2011 - 1:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Childress also got his Menard's kid his first victory after numerous other high profile teams failed to. That gives him some leverage, though the guy paying the bills ulimately does hold the trump card. If Menard makes the chase in the future (I don't expect that, though it's not as far-fetched as it would've seemed a few years ago), I'm sure his team be a higher priority. I don't think the call to not help Smoke was personal, just business. RCR had two drivers in a position to win the race, and a third still with championship hopes. It appears Stewart and Jeff Gordon talked about pairing up at the end of the race, but didn't. That might have changed the results, but there would still be somebody else with hurt feelings... just the nature of the beast. 250. cjs3872 posted: 10.27.2011 - 1:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Scott B, it would have made some sense for Gordon and Stewart to hook up, since not only did they both lose their drafting partners, but both drive Hendrick cars (Gordon for HMS and Stewart for his own team), but it might be a situation similar to Gordon and Earnhardt, Jr., in that Stewart and Gordon are such rivals that, even though they may have wanted to help each other, an instict born from a long rivalry told them not to help each other. 251. Scott B posted: 10.27.2011 - 1:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) On another topic, UPS announced it's move to the #99 as an associate except for Kentucky where they will be the primary sponsor for Carl Edwards. So, 3 full-time Cup teams for Roush in 2012 seems more and more likely with each week that passes. No firm news on a buyer for the Red Bull operation, either. It looks like teams not in the top-35 will have opportunities to buy their way in to the Daytona 500 next year. 252. Terminator posted: 10.27.2011 - 1:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) I loathe this gay two car crap.Go back to the big snarling pack racing that made the 4 plate races so enthralling.These races now are boring as hell until the last lap.They've managed to ruin Bristol and now Dega.No wonder Na$car's popularity has gone down the toilet. 253. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 10.27.2011 - 2:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I loathe this gay two car crap.Go back to the big snarling pack racing that made the 4 plate races so enthralling.These races now are boring as hell until the last lap.They've managed to ruin Bristol and now Dega.No wonder Na$car's popularity has gone down the toilet." ANother person NASCAR shouldn't listen too. And no one is forcing your butt to watch it. Either pull up your big boy undies and watch it or shut the heck up. Nothing Chad Knaus does suprises me anymore. Is is any wounder why NASCAR should have launched Chad from NASCAR after he cheated the last time? I do, he shouldn't even be in NASCAR anymore. If there was anybody John Menard who should worry about its his son and Robby. LEts not forget, Robby almost won the 1999 Indy 500 with "Menards" on the car. And John has sponsered Robby in the past. If John wanted to take his money else where, he'd have atleast 1 guy who would be happy to have that money and name on his car. ANd John wouldn't have to worry about having "politics" getting in the way with Robby. 254. cjs3872 posted: 10.27.2011 - 6:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Correct, Scott B. And one of those non-top-35 teams that will probably buy their way into the Daytona 500 next year just happen to be that race's reigning champions, the Wood Brothers (probably with Ricky Stenhouse, Jr. next year, since Trevor Bayne is likely out at Roush at year's end due to either lack of sponsorship, or the post-race comments after Talladega), though Roush would probably give them the points from the #6 car, so there may not be any points buying there. It gets a little stickier where the points from, say the Red Bull cars, are concerned. You can bet the farm that another non-top-35 team that will purchase points for the Daytona 500 next year from one of those cars will be the third Stewart-Haas Racing entry, though whether or not Danica Patrick will be in that car for the Daytona 500 is still up in the air. Also Terminator, that's what you might think about plate racing now, but what happens when just 12-15 cars (and rolling wrecks) finish due to all the big crashes that would likely take place due to the fact that, with the old style of pack racing, the cars just couldn't get away from each other. After all, that's exactly what happened in the 2001 and 2002 Daytona 500s, and there were only 28 cars left in the Daytona 500 in 2004 after just 200 miles, because everyone else either had engine problems, or wrecked (17 cars were involved in wrecks in that race's first 200 miles), which is why that race never saw another caution after the 200th mile. I prefer what you have now, because the drivers can get away from each other, and the chances of those huge, field-decimating crashes have been greatly reduced. It seems that nobody here remembers how bad and unsafe racing in huge packs used to be. 255. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.27.2011 - 6:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I don't know much about John Menard other than the basics. He is freaking loaded, he has sponsored Indy cars for a long time (including Tony Stewart), has given his son an open checkbook for his motorsports career, and he is FREAKING LOADED. But I get the feeling that he wouldn't care much that his son is Richard's personal goon. He just seems to want him to be out there so he can a race car driver. Since he got that win at Indy (and destroyed any remaining mystique about the Brickyard 400) especially, everything else seems to be gravy. I could be wrong, but that is the sense I get. It is just a really expensive hobby for his son. 256. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 10.27.2011 - 9:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "It seems that nobody here remembers how bad and unsafe racing in huge packs used to be." short term memory lose or as i like to call it (selective memory). "fans" have that. 257. cjs3872 posted: 10.27.2011 - 10:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well 95 Subaru, I watch every every Daytona 500 in preparation for the upcoming race, as I do with the Super Bowl films prior to the Super Bowl (the preparation for which begins in 3-4 weeks with the "NFL Leagcy Series"). In early December, I do the 1959 Daytona 500, and go all the way to Bayne's shocker, which comes up on January 23, covering all 53 runnings of the Daytona classic, so I know how dangerous the pack racing really was. In fact, I am doing the 1980 Daytona 500 right now, putting the complete race on tape for the very first time, instead of the editied version shown on SPEED's NASCAR Classics. Last month, I put the entire 1979 Daytona 500 on tape for the first time, which was well over 4 hours including commercials, and the 1980-'82 races should also take that long. The 1980 and 1981 races will also include the pre-race, as well as the opening song, "Children of Sanchez", which was used to open the Daytona 500 broadcast during the early years that CBS broacasted it live (I believe from 1979-'81, though someone said they actually used that song to open the CBS race broadcast through 1984). 258. cjs3872 posted: 10.27.2011 - 10:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That should have siad February 23 for my airing of "The Return of a Legacy"/"Bayne's Shocker", the race broadcast of the only Daytona 500 ever won by a rookie. 259. Red posted: 10.27.2011 - 11:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs, your repeated statement that only 12-15 cars will finish if we go back to pack racing is simply not accurate. The vast majority of plate races in the 2000's had 20-30 cars running at the finish, and a couple of them even ran caution free. The only plate races in the last decade with only 12-15 healthy cars were the 2001 and 2002 Daytona 500's, the 2005 Dega spring race, the 2008 Dega fall race, and the 2010 Firecracker. I'm not counting the 2001 Dega fall race or the 2007 Daytona 500, because those races featured last lap pileups, which are just as likely in 2x2 racing. So really, from 2001-2010, only 5/40 plate races had super high attrition. Even if there were bigger accidents in pack racing, I don't think they were any less safe. If you take all the "big ones" from the last decade, that's probably 200 destroyed cars, yet not one driver was injured in those wrecks. The wrecks that have the highest potential for injury are the single car, head-on impacts with the wall; a bunch of cars bouncing off each other in a big wreck is relatively safe, because everyone is traveling roughly the same speed. If you prefer 2x2 racing that's fine, but I don't think you can realistically say it's safer than pack racing, especially in the COT era. 260. cjs3872 posted: 10.28.2011 - 12:25 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Red, that's because more drivers started getting smart and not racing until the last 100 miles. If they raced the races from 2005-2010 like they did earlier in the 2000s, there would have been far more races with higher attrition. And by the way, the 2005 Daytona 500 had two-thirds of the field get in wrecks, most of which occurred late, and the 2007 and 2010 Daytona 500s both had enormous late-race crash attrition. And the 2004 Daytona 500 would have had such attrition had the druvers not gotten smart after seeing 17 cars get caught up in crashes in the race's first 200 miles. And let's not forget that, until this year, the record for cautions in the Daytona 500 was 11, done three times, including the 2005 and '06 Daytona 500s. And also, let's not forget that in 2007, Jeff Gordon won the slowest race in Talladega history. The reason I say that the 2x2 racing is safer has to do with the fact that the field spreads out and, most importantly, blocking has been virtually eliminated, because drivers realize that under this rules package that you can go from anywhere to anywhere, so there's no need for the excessive blocking that you saw in previous years, when it was near impossible to pass, especially the leader. Sure there are hard hits with today's drafting rules, but that's no different than any other track where the speeds are high. 261. cjs3872 posted: 10.28.2011 - 1:13 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) By the way, it looks like there will be a maximum of 36 cars trying to run the full race this weekend at Martinsville. You've got the top 35 in points, all of whom, I believe are expected to attempt to run the full race, with the possible exception of the #13 car of Casey Mears. And I believe the only car among those that have to qualify on speed that may try to run the distance in the #71 of Hermie Sadler. Scott Speed's #46 car has tried to run the entire distance in several races, and I don't know if that's the case this weekend. However, if the #71 car doesn't qualify and the #13 is a start-and-park this weekend, that means you'll have as many as nine S&P's, meaning that only 34 cars may try to run the distance, one fewer than are locked in before the weekend starts. 262. Matthew Tesfaye posted: 10.28.2011 - 12:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff Gordon will win 2 more races this year and 28 wins in 2012 263. 00andJoe posted: 10.28.2011 - 1:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The S&Ps - I don't have too much of a problem with that. The short tracks used to run 34-36 cars (depending on how many provisionals were taken, back in the days when only the top 40 got them, they could be used up, and they didn't fill out the field on time if they weren't all taken). Meanwhile, as for the 48's shenanigans at Talladega, somebody at NASCAR gets a gold star from me for their sense of humour: "The 48 organization knows that from this occurrence that their car is likely to be a regular customer at the R&D Center for post race inspection the balance of this season." 264. 00andJoe posted: 10.28.2011 - 1:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Martinsville entry list update: Robby Gordon's second car (#177) has been withdrawn. If qualifying gets rained out (which looks uncomfortably likely) Cope and Setzer will miss the race. 265. cjs3872 posted: 10.28.2011 - 2:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 00andJoe, I wasn't complaining about the fact that there will probably be a maximum of 36 cars attempting to go the distance. I was just stating a probable fact. But with both Red Bull cars going away and no buyer, along with the fact that both Jack Roush (#6) and Richard Childress (#33) are losing one car, we caould be down to 31 or 32 sponsored cars next year, meaning there may be races next year in which as many as ten cars, or nearly one quarter of the field in NASCAR's top series, start-and-park, which has to be a major concern to NASCAR. 266. DaleSrFanForever posted: 10.28.2011 - 2:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I agree 00andJoe, the S&Ps are a good thing for short tracks. And it seems like it ALWAYS rains at Martinsville on Fridays. Luckily they have only had one Sunday rainout since 2002 (when I began going there regularly). Weather looks good for Sunday. That is good cause I have to work Monday. 267. Anonymous posted: 10.28.2011 - 2:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 28 cup wins next year for Jeff Gordon is unrealistic or for any cup driver for that matter. I know the 6 team is going away,possibly the 2 Red Bull Cars going away, and the 33 car is going away. The catch is those teams being gone or possibly gone isn't going give a driver 28 cup wins and there would be 2 new cup teams next year. The new cup teams are the 3rd MWR team, Stewart Hass racing fielding a car for Danica Patrick/another driver. Stewart Haas Racing hasn't announced a sponsor yet or another driver. The only things that would change based off teams being gone in this case is the possibility of a driver getting more top 10's, changing some teams drafting partners, and a couple new teams. 268. Spen posted: 10.28.2011 - 2:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The good news about fewer competitive cars is that we may see a much-needed reduction in the number of locked-in cars. When regular start-and-parkers are locked into the show, it's embarrassing. 269. 00andJoe posted: 10.28.2011 - 2:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "there would be 2 new cup teams next year. The new cup teams are the 3rd MWR team, Stewart Hass racing fielding a car for Danica Patrick/another driver. " Also the #93, Sineca Motorsports with Grant Enfinger, don't forget. Betcha Larry Gunselman buys some owner points for the 37, too... 270. cjs3872 posted: 10.28.2011 - 3:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) But 00andJoe, that still leaves a reduction in the number of sponsored teams for next season. Four teams going away being replaced by two still leaves a reduction of two. And that's just for the Cup series. The situation is just as bad for the Nationwide Series, where at least one of Roush's cars figures to go away, if not the entire program, as well as one of Turner's cars, so the reduction exists there, as well, though Childress will add one car with Austin Dillon joining the newly merged operation with Kevin Harvick, who'll be running two cars. Then there's the dillemma of Rusty Wallace's team, so there figures to be fewer cars in that series as well. As for the number of cars locked in. I've always felt that 35 (the Cup Series number) is far too many, and 30 cars (the Nationwide number) is still too many, though not eggregiously so. I think 25 is the right number for the Cup and Nationwide Series, whie 290 is the right number for the Truck Series, as only 36 start in that series. The top teams should be locked into the race, but I think 25 is the right number, which would still leave 18 spots open for the non-exempt cars. Having 18 spots open would also make it possible for new teams to enter the sport more reasonably. After all, there are only a maximum of eight (out of 43) spots open for the Cup race, and no new car owner in his right mind would enter the sport under those terms. After all, that represents less than 20% of the field open for new teams, while having 18 spots open, which would be the case if just the top 25 were locked in, would represent close to half the field. That is a BIG difference. The top-35 rule is the reason no new team hardly enter the sport, because it created a closed sport for potential new teams, for all practical purposes. 271. cjs3872 posted: 10.28.2011 - 3:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I meant to say in the last post that 20 locked-in positions is just right for the Truck Series, with a 36-truck field, instead of the 43-car fields for the Cup and Nationwide Series race. 272. 00andJoe posted: 10.28.2011 - 6:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The Top-35 rule was (admittedly or not) intended to lock out new teams - by locking in the existing teams. It's better than the "franchising" idea that was kicked around for awhile, but not by much. I, personally, would limit those "locked in" to: -The top 12. -The most recent champion not inside the top 12. And that's all folks. 273. cjs3872 posted: 10.28.2011 - 6:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 00andJoe, 12 or 13 exempt cars is not nearly enough. The top 25 definately need to be locked in. Maybe 30, but definately no more than that. After all, what would happen in your way if the guy 13th in points had a mechanical problem that prevents him from even making a qualifying run. That's why that idea makes no sense. Remember that Jimmie Johnson won the 2003 Coca-Cola 600 at charlotte,. but had to take a provisional, starting the race 37th because he blew his engine on the warm-up lap and never even got to make a quaifying lap. It's one thing for a driver not to be fast enough to make the field, if he's a non-exempt car, but it's something totally different if circumstances prevent him from even having a chance to qualify. I think locking in the top 25 would guarantee the top teams a place in the field, while giving newer car owners-to-be a legitimate chance to at least try to compete with 18 other spots open. Even going to a 30-13 formula, especially in today's economic climate would give potential new owners and teams a legitimate chance, but no one in their right mind would enter the sport with today's 35-8 formula. After all, something similar kept many top IndyCar teams from the Indianapolis 500 for years, even well after that rule was gone. 274. Talon64 posted: 10.28.2011 - 6:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Rankings/Milestones after this race: Clint Bowyer's 5th career win moved into a tie with 7 others (including Ward Burton and Jeremy Mayfield) for 67th all time, 39th in the modern era and tied for 12th with Mark Martin and Jamie McMurray since 2006. His 92nd career top 10 ties him with Davey Allison and LeeRoy Yarbrough for 69th all time, 43rd in the modern era and 9th since 2006. Jeff Burton's 239th career top 10 ties him with Ned Jarrett for 20th all time, tied him with Benny Parsons for 13th all time in the modern era, and ranks him 4th since 1994. Brian Vickers' 21st career top 5 moved him into a tie with Bobby Johns and Emanuel Zervakis for 96th all time, ranks him 51st in the modern era and 18th since 2004. Mark Martin's 51st career pole ties him with Cale Yarborough for 5th in the modern era, and ranks him 3rd since 1981. 275. 00andJoe posted: 10.28.2011 - 6:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That was more (legitimate) sour grapes that kept the teams away from Indy after it was gone, but I do see your point. 25 would be OK, and would make a lot more sense. Of course, my personal choice would be to go back to the old provisional system, but pigs will be dodging snowballs while airborne in Hades before that happens! 276. Michael S. posted: 10.28.2011 - 9:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The reason no new teams enter the sport has to do with money. It takes a lot of money to run a successful racing operation, especially in the highest echelon of NASCAR. We're talking upwards of 20-40 million dollars just to be competitive and potentially win races or championships. The reason we don't see as many new teams entering the sport now as we have in the past is because at that price they cannot compete or even exist past a season or two. For a fraction of that price 1-10 million dollars you can attempt as many races as you want, park the car and collect a check in the amount of 50-200 thousand dollars. Until you find a way to ease that 20-40 million cost down you won't find many owners willing to risk forming new operations and fielding new cars as the rewards don't outweigh the risk. 277. Eric posted: 10.28.2011 - 11:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Besides not finding many owner willing to risk forming new operations and cars, there also is a question of if the owner realizes that you are not going to get great results in the beginning. Red Bull Racing is a prime example of an organization that had way too high expections. Red Bull Racing thought that they could get a championship right away, but that is not how it works in the cup series Joe Gibbs Racing and Hendrick Motorsports were competitive, but they didn't win a cup championship 5 years in their existence. The 2nd problem Red Bull Racing had was how they selected cup drivers and dealt with them. They didn't show a lot of patience with drivers that shouldn't have been in the cup series yet in A.J. Allmendinger and Scott Speed. Those two drivers needed more time in the lower levels of Nascar before going cup racing. Those were making the tough transition from Cart and Formula 1 to stock car racing. When A.J. Allmendinger was starting to come around, Red Bull got a rid of him. 278. cjs3872 posted: 10.28.2011 - 11:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 00andJoe, one big reason that it took the teams from the previous regime so long before returning to the Indianapolis 500 was that they would have to build or order completely different cars for that event, not to mention the politics of the situation. And Michael S., temasn could enter the sport now, but it wouldn't make any sense, not just due to finiancial reasons you mention, but the fact that only eight spots on the grid of 43 are open. That's 18.6% of the field, and if a non-exempt champion tries to make the race, that number is cut to seven, which is 16.28% of the field. now imagine trying to enter NASCAR, and only having 16-18% of the field available because every other spot on the starting grid is guaranteed just doesn't make any sense. But if you cut the number of exempt cars to 30, that would increase the number of open spots in the field to 13, or 30.2%. And you decrease that number to 25, you'd increase the number of open spots in the field to 18, or 41.86%. If you were a car owner, would you rather be in asituation where less than 20% of the field is available, or hope that NASCAR opens up more spots, possibly up to more than 40% of the starting grid. Open up more spots on the grid, and I'll guarantee that you'll see more new teams, or even existing teams like Ganassi, Penske, and Gibbs add cars. 279. cjs3872 posted: 10.28.2011 - 11:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Another example of this is that this year's Daytona 500 saw the third-fewest number of entries in the race's history. Only 48 cars were entered for this year's Daytona 500. In 1995, 62 cars were entered, and in 1980, 68 cars were entered. Even in the dark days of the early 1970s, you had incredible entry lists. In 1972, 70 cars were entered and 74 were entered in 1973. (I only count those that start the qualifying races, so there might have been even more in those years.) Granted not very many of those cars were race-contending calibur, but there was no chance of a short field for the Daytona 500. In fact, almost as many cars failed to qualify for those Daytona 500s (30 in 1972 and 34 in '73) as there were cars that actually qualified, and quality drivers were on the DNQ lists those years. 280. DJ posted: 10.30.2011 - 4:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) The plate "racing" has reached a pathetic level.Na$car has got to do something to break this wretched two car draft that's sucked the life out of what used to be the 4 most exciting races of the year. 281. Smokey posted: 10.30.2011 - 4:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I've been to every Dega cup race since 1999 but unless they change the rules away from this absurd two car junk i will not waste my money on another snooze a thon. 282. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 10.30.2011 - 4:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "28 cup wins next year for Jeff Gordon is unrealistic or for any cup driver for that matter." Agreed, just because a select number of fringe rides (or fringe drivers in good rides) are closing down because performance hasn't been there doesn't ensure Gordon, or any other driver any more wins, especially if next year is anything like this year, with teams and drivers you wouldn't expect winning (Wood Brothers, Furniture Row, #27 RCR ride, #9 RPM ride). Hell, TEN wins is almost impossible nowadays let alone 28. 283. the_man posted: 11.24.2011 - 9:38 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) David Ragan on a 28th place finish: "Our engine ran well all day; our car was fast and I think we had an opportunity to win. We just did not have the power at the end. I don't know if when that wreck happened we ran over something and it knocked a plug wire off or what happened. It was a good day, just a bad finish. Luck just wasn't on our side." 284. Daniel posted: 05.21.2012 - 3:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) In using fastest 43: #35 Geoffrey Bodine Out using fastest 43: #13 Casey Mears 285. Robert Nelson posted: 07.13.2012 - 1:10 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) F1 points Kyle Busch 272 Carl Edwards 263 Jimmie Johnson 237 F1 points Chase Brad Keselowski 64 Matt Kenseth 61 Carl Edwards 58 F1 points real life Chase Matt Kenseth 61 Tony Stewart 60 Carl Edwards 58 286. Jordan posted: 09.26.2012 - 10:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Looks like all the people saying Bowyer leaving RCR sure have been validated this season. 287. Zackary Shawn posted: 09.16.2013 - 4:12 am Rate this comment: (2) (0) LOL to all the people who said that this race would probably be Bowyer's last win for a while. Also, shout out to I Love Japan saying this would be Vickers' last top 5 and to whoever only gave Tony a 12.5% chance of winning the championship. 288. RaceFanX posted: 04.06.2014 - 5:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This looks like it will be the final Cup race for 2010 Rookie of the Year Kevin Conway. He has not run NASCAR on any level since and moved over to running in a Lamborghini road racing series. 289. RaceFanX posted: 04.29.2018 - 1:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Regan Smith described his crash in this one, where he went head on in the turn 4 wall in the late pileup, as one of the hardest of his career. He said the wreck left him with bruises everywhere his seatbelts were including his, uh, lower region. 290. Chase9Fan posted: 11.10.2019 - 4:58 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wasn't this the race the infamous cam basically caught Chad telling Jimmie to hit his back end during a burn out if they won? 291. Anoynomous posted: 11.10.2019 - 7:32 am Rate this comment: (0) (1) @290. Yes. If you had read all 289 comments, you'd know that. 292. Mile501 posted: 11.10.2019 - 10:09 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) Brian Vickers finished 5th and Kasey Kahne finished 6th, giving Red Bull Racing an average finish of 5.5 in this race. This was their best overall finish as an organization in their short 5-year existence, and it happened just 5 races before the team shut down. Red Bull Racing went out on a high note, scoring a combined 9 top 10 finishes in their last 9 races of 2011. Most of those were by Kasey Kahne, though, who only had a one-year deal with Red Bull while waiting for the #5 team at Hendrick to open up the next year. 293. JSPorts posted: 11.10.2019 - 10:28 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I wonder what could've become of the team if they'd continued with such momentum. Obviously Kahne would've been gone, but it appeared that Cole Whitt may have been their selection to replace him, given the starts they gave him at the end of 2011. 294. Corey posted: 11.10.2019 - 1:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @292 Don't forget Kahne's win at Phoenix two races from the end. 295. RaceFanX posted: 12.09.2020 - 1:02 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) This indeed was then still reigning Rookie of the Year Kevin Conway's final Cup start...and he ended up parking the #97 ExtenZe Toyota on lap 3. Kind of a flaccid way to depart the series. 296. Jimmie4life posted: 12.09.2020 - 1:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'd expect nothing more from Kevin Conway in NASCAR than going out in the first 5 laps. 297. Corey posted: 12.09.2020 - 2:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @296 Why? It obvious from his stats that his last three races were S&P efforts for Joe Nemechek. Before this the earliest he had DNF'd was Lap 38 at Michigan with an engine. 298. Mile501 posted: 12.09.2020 - 2:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @296 - When he was running for Front Row, he generally finished about 5-10 laps down. That means he was there for the whole race; he just wasn't fast at all. 299. Rich posted: 04.26.2021 - 8:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Allen Bestwick along with Andy Petree and Dale Jarrett were the commentators. Dr. Jerry Punch along with Dave Burns, Jamie Little and Vince Welch were the pit road reporters. Tim Brewer was in the Craftsman tech garage. Nicole Briscoe along with Brad Daugherty and Rusty Wallace was in the ESPN pit studio. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ *Post a comment:* Your comment may not appear immediately - all comments must be approved by the moderator. Name: Comment: