|| *Comments on the 2012 Federated Auto Parts 400:* View the most recent comment <#455> | Post a comment <#post> 1. Talon64 posted: 09.07.2012 - 7:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dale Earnhardt Jr. earns his 11th career Sprint Cup Series pole and his first since last year's Daytona 500. He now has a pole in 5 of the last 6 seasons. Surprisingly, it's Dale Jr.'s first ever pole on a short track, despite 4 wins and a 12.8 average finish in 57 starts (his best avg fin on any type of track). Jeff Gordon qualifies on the front row for the 3rd time this season, and first time at Richmond since 2009. Regan Smith qualifies in the top 5 for the 13th time in 157 career starts, and in the top 3 for just the 4th time. Kyle Busch qualifies 15th, 13 spots behind Gordon, but his 4 Richmond wins have come from starting 14th, 1st, 20th and 5th (12.7 avg start vs. 4.7 avg fin in 15 starts). All his wins have come in the April/May race, but he has 7 straight top 6 finishes at Richmond. Mark Green failed to qualify for his 1st career Cup race; he ended up 1.065 seconds off the pace and his time would've only been good enough for 15th in the Nationwide race. 2. 10andJoe posted: 09.07.2012 - 7:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It was Mark Green's 4th attempt at a Cup race; the others came in 2001 and 2003, all with A.J. Foyt's Conseco team, where careers went to die. The team never really had a chance - it used an old MWR chassis and their shop was the family barn - but it was good to see a "little guy" at least trying. 3. Talon64 posted: 09.07.2012 - 7:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) whoops, that's 77 short track starts for Dale Jr. 4. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.07.2012 - 7:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Really June? Tony Sr only made your career. The numbers tell the story: with Tony Sr, 15 wins in his first 5 seasons and two top 5 points finishes, without: 4 wins in 8 years. Maybe he wasn't right for your organization (like June and Kelley Earnhardt *insert whatever her last name is this year* would know what is best, only Brad K has done jack for that organization and as it turns out he is a damn good driver), but you don't release the people that made you look good. You can at least make him senior executive technical director of cocaine trafficking at Whisky River or some bullshit title. I don't know how tonights Busch race is gonna go, but how about Johanna's qualifying run? I hope she gets a shot in good equipment some time. Anybody who thinks Danica is a better driver than Johanna simply doesn't know what they are talking about. Hopefully she will get equal funding one day to show just how much better she is. The only reason they are even compared is they both happen to be female. That would be like trying to compare Joey Logano to Geoff Bodine just cause they are both Northeastern drivers when Bodine is infinitely better (that's right, I'm starting the praise early). In fact I bet Bodine at his current age could do a better job in the #22 car next year than Joey. And I am being dead serious. Speaking of this, watching the pre race for the Busch race. RUSTY!!!!!! He just called out Penske for hiring Logano. THAT is the Rusty I grew up watching. 5. joey2448 posted: 09.07.2012 - 7:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I know that some people don't like others discussing the Nationwide race on the Cup race page, but Johanna Long did AWESOME in qualifying! Hope she gets a top-10 finish tonight. And when the green flag drops in the Cup race, Jeff Gordon will hold the Chase spot advantage, although I'm not sure how long that'll last. Go 24!!! Also, good job Landon Cassill for qualifying 12th! 6. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.07.2012 - 7:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Marty Ried up top here next to Dale Jarrett, for those of you who have been enjoying Rusty's tell it like it is commentary, prepare to be thouroughly dissapointed as we give up up to the second updates on Danica while thoroughly ignoring Johanna, Jeremy Clements, Taylor Malsam, and other drivers who are actually overachieving in their equipment. Hope you enjoy, now on to our first of 13,319 commercial breaks. 7. Bronco posted: 09.07.2012 - 7:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Really June? Tony Sr only made your career. The numbers tell the story: with Tony Sr, 15 wins in his first 5 seasons and two top 5 points finishes, without: 4 wins in 8 years." Definitely a shocking story, and you're right, the numbers do tell the story, but you can't pin this on Dale Jr alone. He doesn't handle the business side of JRM. JRM is struggling because they chose to focus all their attention on the #7 car beginning in 2010, then they released Kelly Bires really early into the season for no good reason, and their program hasn't been the same since. Dale Jr won at Daytona in 2010 with the Wrangler car and McMurray won Atlanta, but their Nationwide only drivers haven't done anything since then (Josh Wise, Aric Almirola, Cole Whitt, and Danica). The only way I think they ever get better is Danica leaves, which she is doing next year as laughable as that sounds and that they get Dale Jr/Kahne/McMurray or some other Cuppers to evaluate their program. Kurt Busch driving some races next year would be a good choice. 8. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.07.2012 - 7:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That is true. June does whatever Kelley Earnhardt Whatever Her Husband This Year's Last Name Is tells him to. Also: JOHANNA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Catching Denny Hamlin in a JGR Busch car at Richmond is no damn joke. 9. loomer posted: 09.07.2012 - 7:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hope I don't jinx her, but Johanna just passed Hamlin for 5th at Richmond. Wow. 10. joey2448 posted: 09.07.2012 - 7:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) GO JOHANNA!!!! Up to fifth! Passing Hamlin! Haha ESPN is finally forced to notice her! 11. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.07.2012 - 7:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I am about to pass out for excitement at Johanna's run. I don't care what happens from here on out, she passed a JGR car with Denny Hamlin in it at Richmond. Top that GoDaddy Girl. 12. Rusty posted: 09.07.2012 - 7:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Johanna Long passes Denny Hamlin for a top 5 spot. Anyone who thinks Danica has more talent is straight up out of their minds. The only thing Danica has more talent than Johnanna is the talent of wearing skimpy clothing for commercials. 13. New14 & 88Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Go Johanna Go!!! 14. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hey Denny, kiss my ass. You got passed fair and square. You also choked away the 2010 Cup title. So get bent you useless human being. 15. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sounds like Denny's getting rattled over a meaningless Nationwide race because he got passed by a girl for the first time. And of course, Johanna's pit crew knocks her out of the top 10. 16. New14 & 88Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If Diva doesn't like how the N'wide regulars race him, he should stay his ego in cup. Moron 17. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hey DSFF, I missed the pre-race show. What did Rusty "I can speak my mind now that my son isn't tearing up equipment anymore" Wallace say about Joey Logano going to Penske? Also, Richard Childress is interested in putting Kurt Busch in a 4th Cup car in 2013 should sponsorship be found. 18. Bronco posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Can't say I'm surprised to see Sadler leave, he probably realized RCR was never going to have a Cup ride opening up for him soon. I'm guessing he takes the OMF sponsorship to the #20 and drives it full time next year. 19. Rusty posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Also, Richard Childress is interested in putting Kurt Busch in a 4th Cup car in 2013 should sponsorship be found." This is something that has been talked about for a while actually, but the problem is companies are afraid of potential bad publicity. 20. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Rusty said he was very disappointed that Roger didn't keep Sam in that car and totally disagrees with his decision. He said nothing against Logano, just that Sam deserved it. And yes, the lack of funding on the 70 team has sunk Johanna in the pits. And a special thanks to Denny for reminding me why I hate him so much. 21. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "This is something that has been talked about for a while actually, but the problem is companies are afraid of potential bad publicity." I thought there was no such thing as bad publicity? Also, I haven't heard RC himself say he was interested in Kurt until today. "And a special thanks to Denny for reminding me why I hate him so much." I know what you mean. Every time I begin to like him, he does something that either annoys or angers me. He himself said earlier this year that he doesn't care to do double-duty, so why does he even bother? It's just a shame that companies want to sponsor someone that doesn't want to be in the car in the first place. 22. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Does anyone know if Jeremy Clements got anything for letting Ty Dillon use his number this weekend? I know RCR gave him a "lightly used" car at Indy, but didn't hear anything for this weekend. 23. GreenMan posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Glad to see Johanna crash, too much love for this no talent hack. 24. Schroeder51 posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Don't tell me you think Danica is better. 25. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And there goes my interest level in this race. 26. cjs3872 posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) While battling Kevin Harvick for the lead, Ricky Stenhouse, Jr. did something I just don't get. With a lead of more than the length of the back straightaway on third place, Stenhouse races Harvick when Harvick gets on his inside, costing them most of that big lead they built in a short time. If I was on the radio to Stenhouse when he and Harvick built that lead on third place, I would have told him to let Harvick go if he wanted to go by. That kind of unnecessary racing will get him in trouble. After all, why race someone hard with a 5-second lead on third place when just letting him go will cost you far less time. 27. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) denny doesn't like doing double duty, he's running this race because otherwise, without kyle busch in the car, z-lines and sportclips were going to leave the team. 28. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, now I'm just gonna have to pull for Mike Bliss or Joe Nemechek to get a top 10. How sad is it when the "stars" add nothing to a race, but an underdog who runs part-time and is running up front is the only thing interesting? That's the Nationwide Series. 29. Rusty posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I wish the sponsors at JGR would support Darrell Wallace, Jr. instead of demanding Denny Hamlin be in the car. They ended up screwing Aric Almirola for that same exact thing. 30. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) sponsors want wins-hamlin and logano provide wins, wallace or r truex, if full-time, might pull off 1-2 wins per season and run 6-9 every race on average. that's not good enough (for gibbs sponsors standards). 31. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "denny doesn't like doing double duty, he's running this race because otherwise, without kyle busch in the car, z-lines and sportclips were going to leave the team." That's the whole point. He doesn't like doing double-duty, but sponsors want him to so he does anyways. I'm not criticizing him for doing double-duty because I understand how much control sponsors have over the drivers. What I'm saying is that I find it sad that they would waste their time sponsoring a guy who has no interest in running this race when they could be sponsoring someone of equal talent who doesn't have a good ride. Whatever. Sadler, Vickers, and possibly Truex are getting those rides next year anyways so we won't have to worry about Denny too much next year. 32. Rusty posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Who wants to take bets on how Harvick manages to lose this race? 33. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Calm yourself DSFF before you turn into Jim Hellwig's alter-ego 34. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Amen, these modern day "Cup superstars" add nothing. I am so damn bored with this race now it is unreal. When Johanna's tire deflated, so did my interest level in the same amount of time. 35. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Alright, how freaking pathetic am I that I know who Jim Hellwig is? 36. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dave, Denny Hamlin and Joey Logano had a combined one win in their respective first Nationwide seasons. Just because Wallace and Truex aren't winning right now, doesn't mean they won't in the near future. Without sponsorship, they're only going to have to wait longer. 37. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Alright, how freaking pathetic am I that I know who Jim Hellwig is?" Technically, he legally changed his name to "Warrior". No joke. 38. Rusty posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) GoDaddy girl in the wall. 39. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Now both women have crashed. 40. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Okay, how many times have Danica and Brad Sweet gotten together this season? I swear I've seen the two of them involved in the same caution about seven times this year. 41. New14 & 88Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Tonight is just not a good night for woman racers. 42. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) i would love to see truex and wallace in gibbs nns cars full-time, but unless they find their own sponsors it won't happen. and gibbs has already said that although they will have 3 nns cars next year, 2 with full-time drivers, the 3rd car will have a mix of matt, denny, and a development driver, so we'll be seeing plenty of denny in nationwide next year. 43. The Final Gear posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That's why Danica shouldn't be in Cup anytime soon. That was terrible. 44. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hey Paul, even more pathetic, I knew that he legally changed his name to Warrior. Oh well, he gave me quite a few awesome childhood memories. 7 car in the wall. Again. I don't even care about that anymore. 45. The Final Gear posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Welcome back to the top 10 in N'Wide points Joe Nemechek. 46. Rusty posted: 09.07.2012 - 8:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Any long shot of winning the chapionship Sam Hornish had just went out the window. 47. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) once again, allgaier proves that he doesn't belong behind the wheel of a tricycle, let alone a racecar. that's why, after 4 years, he hasn't even been rumored to any cup rides. 48. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Looks like Allgaier ran Ty Dillon up into the wall, causing Hornish to check up and when he did, Ryan Blaney cut the left rear tire. Poor Timmy Hill, destroyed the entire right side of his car trying to dodge Hornish's car as it slid down the race track. 49. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dave, I too used to think he deserved a Cup ride. But after he wrecked his teammate Reed Sorenson at Atlanta last year and the way he's driven this year, he doesn't deserve one anymore. 50. Rusty posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Allgaier wasn't at fault there, Hornish gave him the bumper and shoved his car up into Ty Dillon IMO. 51. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) i agree paul. how many times have we seen allgaier pull a move like that, for something like 8th or 9th place less than halfway into a race? back in 2009-2010 driving for penske, he looked like a shoo-in to cup, now, he looks like the next jeff green. he'll get to cup eventually, but for progressively worse teams (green drove cup for rcr, then dei, then petty, and then haas) and eventually he'll be back in nns start and parking every week. 52. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yeah, I am starting to second guess my "Allgaier deserves a shot in Cup" stance. Save that kind of blocking for the Cup regulars. 53. joey2448 posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Comment 26 cjs3872, I understand the reasoning there, but it is, after all, A RACE. If I was racing a guy for the lead, and third place is five seconds back, I think we could afford to race hard. 54. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) if this was a one-time thing, i might agree rusty. but look at allgaier's track record. remember at bristol when allgaier wrecked himself trying to drive up to austin dillon to get him back for spinning him out? kid has some talent, but NO judgement whatsoever. 55. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I don't think Hornish sent Allgaier into Dillon because Dillon had to pass Hornish first to get to Allgaier. Allgaier cut Hornish off going into turn 1 and it slowed both of them down because Allgaier had to slow down earlier due to the bad angle he took into the corner. Just a classic case of one guy wrecking and another guy pays the price for it. 56. Rusty posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The championship battle just got more interesting. 57. Schroeder51 posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Elliott Sadler has crashed. I think Stenhouse is on the verge of winning back to back championships. 58. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) looks like sadler just got loose. 59. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Stenhouse did a hell of a job not losing control of his car as Sadler got into him. 60. The Final Gear posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sadler won't have to worry about that next year when he's with Gibbs. It will be Sadler vs Dillon for the championship. 61. cjs3872 posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) But the thing is joey2448, if you race hard in that situation, you'll lose all the time you gained. If you're that far in front, especially that early in the race (in this case, about 60 laps into a 250-lap race), if someone catches you, it obviously means he's faster, and if you have a sizeable lead over the next car, it's more adviseable to just let him go, because of the time you would lose to the guy behind you. by racing Harvick so hard, he let Austin Dillon close from five or six seconds back to three in just a few laps. 62. Rusty posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brian Scott's weekly crash. 63. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) or it'll be sadler vr. trevor bayne for the championship. 64. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) the 11 just about spun the 99 out under caution for revenge. apparently, scott's teammate kyle busch hasn't taught him anything :) 65. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm telling ya, aggressive beats passive in stock car racing 95% of the time. 66. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) there's been rumors that brian scott will be using his family's unlimited money to buy his way into james finch's #51 for a full-time cup ride next season. if brian scott AND danica patrick are both racing cup full-time....they'll never be a need for a fake "debris caution" every again. 67. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I found Truex wrecking Scott a little ironic. On one hand, you have a guy who won't be back at JGR next year who's underachieved in a full-time JGR ride despite daddy's money, and another guy who will be back at JGR in some capacity but can't find sponsorship for a full-time ride despite his talents. 68. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "there's been rumors that brian scott will be using his family's unlimited money to buy his way into james finch's #51 for a full-time cup ride next season" If that's the case, Phoenix Racing will have as many, if not more, wrecked race cars as Kurt Busch has this year. The only difference will be that Scott will be wrecking when running 30th, not 15th like Kurt. 69. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) paul, the difference is that when kurt wrecks a phoenix racing car, james finch has to pay for it out of pocket. when brian scott wrecks, he and his rich dad will be paying for it themselves. 70. David posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) No one has mentioned this yet, but this may very well be a historic thread. This may soon contain the most forced words ever typed (aka the Bodine Speech). 71. Rusty posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Man, everyone is beating up on poor Darrell Wallace lol. 72. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's just amazing how much James Finch has been humbled over the last 3 years. Three years ago, he fired Mike Bliss because he "wasn't winning enough." Now, he's considering hiring Brian Scott because his daddy will pay for the damages. I know he lost his Miccosukee sponsorship and everything, but sheesh! Talk about eating crow. 73. Rusty posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It looks like Harvick actually didn't blow this one. 74. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Congrats to Joe Nemechek on his first top 10 of the season. Oh, and Harvick won, but who cares... 75. The Final Gear posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) First top 10 of the year for Joe Nemechek. 76. Paul posted: 09.07.2012 - 9:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Darrell Wallace, Jr. gets his 3rd top 10 in his 3rd start. 77. cjs3872 posted: 09.07.2012 - 10:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, it's one thing to be aggressinve, but it's aonther to be smart, and what I was saying about Stenhouse not letting Harvick through when they had about a 5-6 second lead on third place was a case of not intelligent racing. And as Dave #38 Fan said, it could be something like Elliott Sadler against Trevor Bayne (ironically, the final two drivers to win for the Wood Brothers) for the title, though I'll throw two more names into the mix, Austin Dillon and Sam Hornish, Jr. But the crash Hornish had tonight, started by Justin Allgier's move on Ty Dillon, knocked Hornish out of title contention, so it's down to three, and Childres has two of the three bullets. The thing I like about Sadler and Bayne, if they are the main rivals for next year's title, is that they won't likely risk their cars like Stenhouse did 60 laps into a 250 lap race. They'll let a more aggressive driver through and deal with him later, if they can. Austin Dillon's usually the same way, which makes what he did at Bristol so out of character for him. In fact, with dull and conservative drivers likely battling for the title next year (none of those likely to contend next year are aggressive on the track), it could be a title decided by who drops out of the fewest races, not who goes out there and wins races, because next year's Nationwide champion might not win a race, giventhat Austin Dillon, Bayne, Sadler, and Hornish are the most likely ones to be battling for the title next year. Say what you want about Ricky Stenhouse, Jr., but at least he adds some color to the series with his all-out aggression, and on-track aggression among the leaders almost certainly be totally lacking in the series next year, other than by Cup drivers. 78. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.07.2012 - 10:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) gibbs said they will have 3 nns cars next year, 2 with fulll-time drivers. the 4 drivers assummed to be in the running for those spots are sadler, vickers, mcdowell, and ryan truex, but with 3 great runs so far, and with big time gibbs sponsor dollar general stepping up for all 2 of his races so far, could darrell wallace jr. be one of the full-time drivers with dollar general sponsorship? 79. 10andJoe posted: 09.07.2012 - 11:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #23: Talentless hacks don't win the Snowball Derby. #78: Let's hope for Sadler, Truex and Wallace Jr... 80. BON GORDON posted: 09.08.2012 - 1:36 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Im kinda glad Jeff didnt get the pole. It seems to be a bad omen when Gordon gets the pole at Richmond. Four out of the five races he's earned the pole resulted in a finish of 31st or worse. He finished 4th in 2007 though. His avg. finish is much better starting after second here. Hopefully good things are in store for team #24. Although I wont get my hopes up. 81. BON GORDON posted: 09.08.2012 - 1:47 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I know these are pointless stats but when starting on the pole Gordon's avg. finish at Richmond is 29th. Every race he started second resulted in an 8th place finish or better (including a win way back in his Glory days). His average finish then is 4th. Hopefully Saturday night is another glory day for Gordon. Kyle Busch's numbers here are amazing. 4 wins and 12 Top 5s in 15 starts......ugh. 82. Spen posted: 09.08.2012 - 1:51 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Talentless hacks don't win the Snowball Derby." *coughSteveWallacecoughcough* 83. Paul posted: 09.08.2012 - 1:54 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Richard Petty Motorsports could switch to running Chevrolets and form a technical alliance with RCR in 2013. 84. Bronco posted: 09.08.2012 - 5:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "*coughSteveWallacecoughcough*" Nice try, but not. Steve scored top 5s at the so called "driver's tracks" - Richmond, Gateway, IRP, Montreal Darlington (2 there), while driving for an average Nationwide team with no real Cup connections during the days when Cup drivers were out in full force. Using today's point system, he finished in the top 5 in points from 2009-2010 and might have snuck a win in there if there were less Cup drivers to compete against. In his one off Cup start at last year's Daytona 500 he stayed out of trouble and finished on the lead lap, despite all the racing "experts" on this site predicting gloom and doom by him entering the race. And earlier he finished 11th at Richmond in a Johnny Davis car in his one and only Nationwide attempt. His ex-teammates, Annett and Gaughan have also done much better since leaving RWR, proving that their cars made those drivers look worse than they really were. 85. m00nee posted: 09.08.2012 - 6:16 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Just to get back to the cup race, can anyone explain why everyone before Bobby Labonte (P29) avoided the 1st pit stall? 86. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:11 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) m00nee: The first pit stall at Richmond is actually in turn one with no wall protection. So not only do you have to make a hard turn to get in it, but there is safety hazard as well. 87. David posted: 09.08.2012 - 12:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mitt Romney must be a rain-bringing jinx. First the Daytona 500 was postponed for the first time in its history, then the Republican National Convention got a scare out of Hurricane Isaac, then he announces he will be the grand marshal for the race tonight, and all of a sudden the forecast looks very bleak. Just making conversation. Don't take the above too seriously. 88. 18fan posted: 09.08.2012 - 12:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yeah, the forecast looks pretty bleak for tonight. 89. 10andJoe posted: 09.08.2012 - 12:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Meanwhile, cold water gets tossed on the 'Brian Scott to Phoenix Racing' rumour, as James Finch says without a major sponsor he'll be out of the sport after this year due to the need to change to the new cars next year. 90. murb posted: 09.08.2012 - 1:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Richard Petty Motorsports could switch to running Chevrolets and form a technical alliance with RCR in 2013." This seems like a surprising rumor, but really, it isn't. Ford is pulling their support from the team so they can fund Penske's efforts. So I think this could be a good move for RPM. It would be cool to see them back with GM after they ran Pontiacs for all those years. 91. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 1:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "The thing I like about Sadler and Bayne, if they are the main rivals for next year's title, is that they won't likely risk their cars like Stenhouse did 60 laps into a 250 lap race." I really like the contrast this year between the RCR-system Sadler and the go for broke every lap Stenhouse. I love Ricky's championship-be-damned style of racing for wins. Yeah, it might not be smart, but it is fun as hell to watch. Like Earnhardt going 3 wide on the 2nd lap of the '93 Hooter's 500 when he needed only to finish 34th. 92. cjs3872 posted: 09.08.2012 - 2:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, the interesting thing is DSFF, that last year, someone actually compared Stenhouse to Cale Yarborough for exactly that reason, because Stenhouse goes all-out every lap, as Yarborough did for many years. As we both mentioned, that's not always the smartest thing to do, but there wasn't a race Yarborough ran (unless it was something like the 1976 Daytona 500, where he only lasted one lap) that he didn't give the fans their money's worth, no matter how he fared, and Stenhouse is much the same way. And you often decry the 1984 championship battle between Terry Labonte and Harry Gant (ironically, two of the three drivers Dale Earnhardt beat for Rookie of the Year in 1979) because both Labonte and Gant were conservative drivers who each had a championship-winning crew chief calling the shots that year (Labonte had Dale Inman while Gant had Travis Carter, who won championships with Benny Parsons and Yarborough). Well, next year's NNS championship battle may look a lot like that 1984 Cup title race, because every driver I expect to seriously contend for the title, unless something unexpected happens, is a conservative driver. Elliott Sadler, Trevor Bayne, Austin Dillon, and Sam Hornish, Jr., the four drivers who, at this moment, I expect to contend for the title next year, all fit that description. All four of them are conservative drivers, meaning that next year's title fight may not look anything like this year's title fight, as Sadler and Stenhouse have each won four times. The four drivers contending for the tile next year may not have more than 6-8 wins between them. 93. 10andJoe posted: 09.08.2012 - 2:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If (and it's a big if) he gets a full-time JGR ride next year, I'd toss Ryan Truex into that contender hat as a wildcard. 94. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 2:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Here was my reaction when Johanna's tire blew: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQgZ7HLZLv8 95. 10andJoe posted: 09.08.2012 - 5:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) WEBMASTER: Chris Cook's points need adjusting in the 2012 Standings. He switched to Nationwide points after Watkins Glen and in NASCAR's official standings is now listed as having 0 points; they zeroed-out his points when he changed series. The same goes for Ryan Blaney in the Nationwide Series; he is now officially listed as having 0 points, having switched to Trucks. 96. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.08.2012 - 5:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) My weather opinion: Cup race is doomed. I have been right almost every time, so don't tell I don't know my weather. 97. David posted: 09.08.2012 - 6:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, if the mighty weather prognosticator, NicoRosbergFan, says the race is doomed, it is doomed (Not making fun of you, but I really want to see the race tonight. But I also prefer day racing to night racing, too). But maybe not. 98. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.08.2012 - 6:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sorry if I seem haughty David, but since you wouldn't know I am studying meteorology at school right now. But I do think the race is doomed, if not at least severely delayed to the extent of finishing on 9/9/12. 99. David posted: 09.08.2012 - 7:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I wasn't criticizing you. In fact, I was wondering if you should have been a meteorologist, if you weren't already or studying to be one. 100. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.08.2012 - 7:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Thanks for the vote of confidence. On to the wet works! 101. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 7:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NASCAR.com seems pretty confident that the rain will stop and the race will be run tonight. We'll see about that... 102. David posted: 09.08.2012 - 7:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Just to kill some time, here are the top 20 in the standings with my point system, and their Chase status: 1. Jimmie Johnson - 1073 (clinched - top 10) 2. Denny Hamlin - 1017 (clinched - top 10) 3. Greg Biffle - 987 (clinched - top 10) 4. Dale Earnhardt, Jr. - 977 (clinched - top 10) 5. Brad Keselowski - 966 (clinched - top 10 6. Matt Kenseth - 947 (clinched - top 10) 7. Tony Stewart - 852 (clinched - wild card) 8. Clint Bowyer - 845 8. Martin Truex, Jr. - 845 10. Kasey Kahne - 832 11. Kyle Busch - 792 12. Jeff Gordon - 769 13. Kevin Harvick - 746 14. Carl Edwards - 656 (eliminated) 15. Ryan Newman - 638 16. Marcos Ambrose - 626 17. Joey Logano - 567 18. Paul Menard - 542 (eliminated) 19. Jeff Burton - 465 (eliminated) 20. Jamie McMurray - 453 (eliminated) As you can see, if this point system was in place now, there would still be drama around who would get the 4 remaining automatic berths, as Busch, Gordon, and Harvick can still leapfrog the drivers ahead of them. Obviously, vastly different strategies would be in play, as Busch and Gordon would not have to battle each other for the final wild card position. 103. cjs3872 posted: 09.08.2012 - 7:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, bad weather has racked the Atlantic coast today, from early morning tornadoes near Queens to storms up and down the Atlantic this afternoon, including a tornado near Washington, D.C., to t-storms that caused a delay in the USC-Syracuse game at Met Life Stadium. In fact, if that game had not been delayed for about an hour, we would better know the status of what's going on at Richmond, since ABC would be airing the pre-race show from Richmond, which would be extended due to the weather. But back to how the weather will impact the race. I think that NASCAR would much rather run the race tomorrow (as they did in 2008) than risk a situation like what happened at Charlotte in the 2009 Coca-Cola 600, where someone like Joey Logano or Marcos Ambrose could run 20th all race long, have a caution, not pit when everyone else does and inherit the lead, then have rain stop and shorten the race with one of those two in front and have that driver back into the Chase that way, which could happen if the race is delayed and run, because there is supposedly more rain coming around midnight. NASCAR would much rather postpone the race and run it tomorrow, when no inclement weather is forecast, guaranteeing that it will run the full distance. After al, I don't think that after about 7500 miles of racing this year that NASCAR would want something fluky like a combination of caution flag strategy and rain deciding who makes the Chase. NASCAR wants this race to run the full distance more than any other race, because of what's at stake, even if it has to run it tomorrow afternoon. And unless I'm mistaken, doesn't it seem that this race seems to be marred by rain every other year, because it sure seems to have happened often in recent years. This race, I believe, has twice been postponed in the last five or six years, including the 2008 example I mentioned. 104. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 8:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It was postponed in 2008, and the spring race in '02 was postponed as well. The '03 spring race was shortened by just seven laps due to rain. Yeah, Richmond seems to get a lot of rain when NASCAR comes to town. NASCAR.com says the jet dryers out, so they seem to be planning to get the whole race in tonight. Goodness, I would be REALLY mad if this race got cut short just after halfway and Ryan Newman and Joey Logano wound up sneaking their way into the Chase that way... 105. Rusty posted: 09.08.2012 - 8:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) ESPN has the corniest and cheesiest statements. This bubble thing with Marty Smith is stupid. 106. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 8:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You beat me to it Rusty, that bubble segment was a waste of 5 minutes of my life I will never get back. And HA! On a twitter account called Nascarcasm which pokes fun at NASCAR in a fun way, they had a post this afternoon saying something to the effect of "I don't want to say the weather forecast tonight is dire, but Carl Edwards is already heading for the pit studio". 107. cjs3872 posted: 09.08.2012 - 8:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And of course, Schroeder51, Richmond used to be the second race of the season, and you could get some ungodly cold and miserable weather there in February and early March, which was why the first race there was moved to May in the first place. Remember that Dave Marcis got his last win there due to rain in 1982 in a car sponsored by Jim Stacy, when Joe Ruttman, driving for Stacy, spun out, bringing out a caution and all the leaders, except for Marcis who got back on the lead lap when Ruttman spun out, stopped, and then rain enbed the race with Marcis leading. Let's hope something like that doesn't decide who makes the Chase. And there had been races there affected by snow, as well. Tired of fighting the bad weather, NASCAR simply moved that race to May in 1998. 108. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 8:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think we agree it wasn't the best idea to host a race as far north as Richmond THAT early in the year. 109. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 8:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) How many times was the February Richmond race SNOW delayed? Quite a few. Or how about the infamous "Mark Martin race" in 1990 when it was like 15 degrees outside. 110. Mr X posted: 09.08.2012 - 8:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I am on the fence with this race, on one hand I want it to be rain shortened because I have said many times that the hot slick track surface of an afternoon race produces better racing then the cool track surface of a night race, primarily due to the groove being narrower. I have said this before, and I also said before that Richmond is the track hurt by the night racing most of all in my mind. The above mentioned 2008 fall race here was the best race this track has seen in years, very competitive and some excellent racing, and I believe it was because the groove was very wide compared to a typical night race, it was from the yellow line all the way to the last dotted line before the wall, it was 3-4 lanes wide, as opposed to 2-3 at night. On the other hand I want the race to happen tonight so I can watch the race at Monza tomorrow afternoon. 111. cjs3872 posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) But the problem with running the late-summer race during the day is the possibility of drivers having problems due to the heat, so much so that they could become safety hazards. In fact, in 1989, Rusty Wallace nearly crashed numerous times in the last few laps of his victory because he was overcome by the heat. That race may have resulted in lights being installed for the 1991 September race, and that race has been a scheduled night race ever since. That's also a main reason lights were installed at the Darlington Raceway, not knowing that the race would be moved twice in as many years from Labor Day weekend to Mother's Day weekend, with a stop in November in between. Lights were installed there so that competitors and fans alike wouldn't have to spend all day in potentially deadly heat. 112. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NASCAR fans have braved blazing heat for 60+ years. Usually while consuming large amounts of beer which is especially deadly. We can handle it. And if the drivers can't handle it, get out of the kitchen. Neil Bonnett passed out in victory lane after winning the 1979 Firecracker 400. He was at it the next week. 113. David posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) How's the weather outlook now, NRF? 114. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Problem is this is not your 1970's 1980's & 1990's Baddass NASCAR driver who can withstand any type of conditions. This is today's Spoiled whiny prima-donna NASCAR driver. 115. cjs3872 posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) But DSFF, what happens when a fatality occurs in the stands, on the track, or in the pit area due to heat. What happens if a crash occurs on the track because a driver passes ot due to the heat that seriously injures or, God forbid, kills another driver. Remember what happened with Dale, Sr. on the first lap of the 1997 Southern 500? That could easily happen as a result of heat exhaustion (that wasn't the case then). What if that happened due to heat and caused a huge crash and seriously injured or killed another driver. Believe or not, heat exhaustion did kill Carl Scarborough in the 1953 Indianapolis 500, so it's happened before. That's one reason why NASCAR started shortening racesand move races away from hot weather times of the year about 15-18 years ago (the second Talladega race is a prime example). They wanted their competitors to be at their best at all times, and that can't happen if they're impaired by the heat. 116. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Slight chance of rain, but all seems good for racing. 117. Rusty posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) What is the point of the damn green/yellow start? 118. Paul posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Only car separates Jeff Gordon and Kyle Busch's pit boxes, and it's Gordon's satellite teammate and Kyle's brother Kurt Busch. I think it's safe to say that no team orders will be played by Kurt on pit road. 119. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I HATE these green/yellow starts. Hate 'em. Cjs, again, we have 60 years of fans being fine in the blazing heat. In my opinion night races are more dangerous that day races due to traffic trying to get out late. 120. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think Denny Hamlin is going to make it three in a row tonight. 121. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon's car looks pretty bad early in the race. Not looking good... 122. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Honestly, this race would be way more interesting if Danica was in it. 123. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, I have an imposter. That is the sign you have made it. 124. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I am predicting Jeff finishes outside the top 20 while Kyle finishes 2nd to Denny Hamlin. 125. 18fan posted: 09.08.2012 - 9:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nice replay they showed us of Ragan's spin. 126. New14 & 88Fan posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Not looking good for Gordon so far, back in the pack plus he's concerned about his oil temp. Better get your Bodine speech prepped DSFF. 127. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It would definitely be no surprise to me if Gordon capped off his dismal season by blowing an engine here. I'm ready for the Bodine speech... 128. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Again, it is so hard to believe somebody who is so clutch in high profile races has just never been the guy who can step it up when a big points day is needed for championships. 129. Paul posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon's best hope is for a long green flag run that lasts at least until the next set of pit stops. He restarted 17th, lost two positions right away, and has since gained four more positions. He'll be just fine if we get a long green flag run and if rain doesn't get here in time. 130. David posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Has anyone noticed that since the inception of the Chase, 5 of 9 Daytona 500 winners have missed the cut? 131. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon is dropping back again. He's already back to almost 20th. 132. David posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Granted, Trevor Bayne not making last year's Chase was a given, but it is still a head-scratcher. 133. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Why did Penske choose Logano ahead of Hornish? Why did Brad want Logano as a teammate instead? Just focus on racing dude. 134. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) hornish is in the top ten, and has been all race. logano just got lapped. nice move, penske. 135. David posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Talk about DRASTIC changes. MRN just reported that the #24 crew is considering CUTTING one of the sway bars (I believe they said the right rear). 136. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @ #84 bronco the car that steve wallace finished 11th with at richmond earlier this year was an old roush car entered using johnny davis's number and owners points, not an actual johnny davis car. 137. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If this race runs to completion, I wouldn't be surprised to see Jeff finish multiple laps down. 138. New14 & 88Fan posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon just got lapped. 139. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's raining again. We might not even make it to halfway. 140. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff Gordon is the Marty Schottenheimer of NASCAR. 141. David posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #138 While MRN was talking to the AARP president/chairman, whoever she was. 142. cjs3872 posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, before the caution for rain, Denny Hamlin played the role as Kyle Busch's teammate perfectly, as he had lapped EVERY driver that could knock Kyle Busch out of the Chase by winning. This caution lets Ryan Newman get back on the same lap. But, if they have to stop the race and complete it tomorrow, that will dramatically change everything, because they would then finish the race in daylight with drastically different track conditions. 143. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Ha! Ol' Marty. What's his playoff record? How many playoff games has he lost at home? How much does John Elway love him? 144. David posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) They just cut the chain on the rear sway bar on the #24 car. It's do or die now. 145. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Can I still make Brett Bodine jokes? His job is to basically tell the tower if it is raining or not. May I take that easy joke? 146. David posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sure, DSFF. Go for it. 147. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This is going to be a LONG caution, it looks like... 148. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It does NOT look good out there. We may have to come back tomorrow. 149. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Just park 'em and lets try it again tomorrow. This is just wasting time. Good thing they have Brett Bodine in the pace car to tell the tower if it is raining or not. Surely he can manage that right? Right? 150. Jordan posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Has Jeff Gordon ever truly performed well under pressure? I know in most of his championship seasons, he was well-established as the dominant driver way before the end of the season. I could be wrong but I just don't remember him performing well in circumstances where there is a lot of pressure. 151. Paul posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) As punishment for ending Darrell Waltrip's 15 consecutive year winning streak, via the pace car picking up the "wrong" driver, NASCAR handed Brett Bodine a lifetime penalty of having to drive the pace car. 152. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #150 Not that I can think of. Gordon DID do very well in the Chase...but he had no chance to win when pitted against Jimmie Johnson winning 4 straight races. 153. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Forgot to mention that was in 2007. 154. Paul posted: 09.08.2012 - 10:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Has Jeff Gordon ever truly performed well under pressure?" Well, he didn't finish last in the 1995 season finale at Atlanta to hold off Earnhardt for his 1st Cup championship. Surely that should count for something (and I say this knowing fully well Gordon finished 32nd in that race). 155. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 11:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) He also finished where he needed to finish to win the championship in 1997...I guess that counts. 156. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 11:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) As far as points battles, 1998 is the only time Jeff truly stomped on the throats of his competitors. Even in 2001 when he easily clinched a week early, he didn't do so well to end the season its just that his chief competitors during the season, DJ and Rudd, faded even worse. But when it comes to marquee races he does great under pressure. In the 1997 Southern 500 he won the Winston Million with an inferior handling car. He was clearly outclassed by the Fords in the 1998 Brickyard 400 but still won. His Daytona 500 wins in '99 and '05 were with cars that I don't think were the best. That is why I can't figure out his issues when it comes to the end of a points run. 157. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.08.2012 - 11:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I say let em race in the rain what's the worst that could happen 158. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.08.2012 - 11:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well Gordon Choked in 1996, 2004, & 2007. Nearly Choked in 1995 & 1997 The only years where he didn't choke were 1998 & 2001 (when his competitors choked worse then he did) Gordon always seems to crack under the late season pressure. 159. Paul posted: 09.08.2012 - 11:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "That is why I can't figure out his issues when it comes to the end of a points run." Hmmm... is it possible that he was carrying the team on his back in '95-'97, '99, and '01, and by the time the season came to an end he was running on empty with a back in as bad shape as it was from '08-'10? 160. Schroeder51 posted: 09.08.2012 - 11:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I can't believe they're actually going to try to finish this race tonight. How late do they plan on this race running? 161. BON GORDON posted: 09.08.2012 - 11:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You ppl make me sick. Stop picking apart Gordon just cause hes running bad. His team sucks this weekend. If Gordon actually had a car he could race hed be up near the front. Hes one of the greatest NASCAR drivers ever. Go choke on that and talk about something else. He wasnt gonna make it anyway. 162. Rusty posted: 09.08.2012 - 11:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I hope they end this race tonight, I have to work tommorrow. 163. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 11:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Epic mistake by NASCAR. 164. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 11:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bon, this isn't a one time occurance where Jeff's best work has come prior to the end of a points run. 165. BON GORDON posted: 09.08.2012 - 11:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dont care. He had other chances to make it. This team shouldnt wait till Richmond to win. He had good cars all season long. They missed it tonight, thats racing. Im not gonna pick apart his career cause of tonight 166. JG24FanForever posted: 09.08.2012 - 11:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Since Gordon is always the subject of ridicule for his titles no matter what,how about picking apart Big E's title's for a moment in brief. 1980: only won it because Cale had too many mechancal problems. 1986: only won because it he crashed DW at Richmond and destabilized him. 1987: only won it because he was supreme. 1990: only won it because he was supreme. 1991: only won it because nobody else wanted it. 1993: only won it because Rusty's Talldega crash ruined his next 4 races. 1994: only won it because his only competition was Ernie Irvan. Gordon has 4 title's where he also won the most and he had a Crown Jewel win in each of those title's too. Dale has 2 like that. 167. David posted: 09.08.2012 - 11:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @166 Tee hee!!! 168. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:02 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) JG24, you forgot to make an excuse for Earnhardt's 1990 title. It should have read: "1990: only won it because Mark Martin got penalized for a part that wasn't even illegal." 169. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:04 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) David,Honestly I couldn't, because Dale humiliated Martin and Rousch so bad at the finale in Atlanta. And he dominated the hell out of the season. 170. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:06 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) BON, I'm not picking apart his career at all. But you can't deny the fact that he's had some mediocre endings to otherwise superb seasons. I don't think it affects his legacy as a driver, but it is an interesting fact about his career. If there's one thing Earnhardt was able to do that Jeff hasn't, it's be able to finish off a championship season on top of his game. I looked up Earnhardt's championship seasons, and the only one that had a "slow" finish was '91 when he only had 3 top fives in the final 12 races. DSFF, in a way, Earnhardt's '91 season was a lot like Gordon's '01 season. In the final 12 races of those seasons, they each had 1 win, 3 top fives, and 7 top tens. They also each had just 2 DNFs and were easily the class of the field in a weak championship battle. 171. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:06 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I suppose so. 172. Schroeder51 posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:13 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bowyer goes for a loop. 173. JRacingFast posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:15 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) DON DON DON.......Juan Pablo's season of being a roadblock continues.... 174. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:17 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bon, look up the following races: 1980 Old Dominion 500 1980 National 500 1986 National 500 1986 Atlanta Journal 500 1990 Checker 500 1991 Tyson Holly Farms 400 1994 AC Delco 500 I'll go in further detail later. 175. New14 & 88Fan posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:18 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Truex to the lead, maybe his luck will change for once and he'll get that second career victory. 176. Schroeder51 posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:24 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) It looks like Gordon's car has gotten better, but it is probably too little, too late. 177. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:26 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) And for the record, that 46 point penalty the 6 team got early in 1990 was the best thing that could have happened to them. With those points they get a big lead in early Summer, go into conservation mode, lost momentum, and get eaten alive by Earnhardt, losing even worse than they did. We have years of evidence from Roush to prove this. The penalty kept Dale close and forced them to keep their game up. 178. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:31 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mark Martin and Roush's 1990 Atlanta meltdown is the biggest of all-time bar none. 179. Schroeder51 posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:37 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, this race just got REALLY messed up. 180. Schroeder51 posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:40 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Now I'm beginning to think the Ryan Newman miracle may actually happen... 181. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:41 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon's now 4 points behind Kyle. 182. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:41 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow. Do we see team orders? Also, listening to Kyle Busch's radio, there appear to be team orders being discussed now. 183. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:42 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm starting to feel sick.... 184. Schroeder51 posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:42 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, I can't believe it. The miracle is going to happen and Ryan Newman is going to sneak into the Chase. I can't believe it. 185. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:43 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Lets see if Jeffy Schottenheimer can get his act together. 186. New14 & 88Fan posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:43 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) That caution was Tony and Newman's best friend, and just as I typed that Newman just took the lead. 187. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:46 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) i said this earlier but i'll say it again, hornish has ran in the top ten all night long, logano has been lapped 3 times so far. nice move, penske. not. 188. Schroeder51 posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:46 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) That is going to piss me off BIG time if Newman sneaks in like that. 189. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:46 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Can't believe I'm pulling for an MWR car to win a race. C'mon Clint! Pass the #39. 190. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:47 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) With Clint bearing down on the SHR cars, how hard does Tony race him? Are we gonna see a replay of the '01 Daytona 500 (hopefully without the tragedy). 191. Jordan posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:47 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I can't believe NASCAR's blatant favoritism in giving Gordon his lap back. 192. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:48 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Never mind. Also, Kyle is trying to work out team orders with the 56. 193. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:48 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Clint!!!! 194. Rusty posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:49 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon may pull off the comeback and get in, lol. 195. Schroeder51 posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:50 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) What the hell did they even do to Jeff's car to get it running like that? 196. Jordan posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:51 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) They cut the sway bar apparently. I'm not even sure that's legal. 197. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:52 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Rainbow Nation, I tried to tell ya. 198. Rusty posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:57 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle Busch's crew just botched the last pit stop. Yikes. 199. New14 & 88Fan posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:57 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle's coming in when they tried to tell him to ride it out, and now they had trouble on the right front. His chase hopes are just about gone. 200. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:59 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Just watch it. I never said, insinuated, or implied in any shape or form on this board that I thought he would miss the Chase. 201. 18fan posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) For all of you who love to bash Kyle's performance in key situations, this was not his fault. He wanted to pit on the caution and Dave Rogers told him to stay out. He was running fine in a position to make the chase until that happened. 202. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:01 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff Gordon, that is. 203. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:03 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) This whole time my reasoning behind Gordon is this: KyBu is a meltdown artist. Gordon has a slight dip in perfromance historically when it matters for points, by KyBu has made an ARTFORM out of it. Gordon just fades a tick. 204. Sean posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:05 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Because of the time Kyle's gaining each lap on Gordon, I think he's got it if the race finishes under green. Gordon only gets the transfer spot if there's a caution before he pits. 205. Mr X posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:05 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, clearly you are the person to ask, what does the future hold for me, and don`t tell me a chase berth for Jeff Gordon, this race has been interesting. 206. Sean posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:07 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Don't get me wrong. I think Gordon will beat Busch in the race, just not by 13 positions. 207. Sean posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:18 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Okay. I was wrong. 208. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:20 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle passing Truex was team orders. And I am skeptical of this Hamlin stop. 209. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:20 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "DRAMA" The above has been the thought of the race by Brian France. 210. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Johnson, PLEASE HOLD OFF BUSCH! 211. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:23 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Goddamn I love it!! 212. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:23 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) No BODINE PRAISE SPEECH!!!! 213. Schroeder51 posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:23 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Holy crap. Jeff Gordon is in the Chase! I'm actually kind of disappointed we won't get to see the Bodine speech now... 214. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:23 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) EPIC MELT DOWN 215. loomer posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:24 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Vintage Jeff Gordon. Wow. 216. Sean posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:24 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Since Kyle had the tiebreaker, it was Marcos's pass right at the end that decided it... Yeah, how can you blame Kyle for this one? It was Dave Rogers's bad call... 217. Jordan posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:24 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) As Kyle's brother might say, the decrepit old has-been gets the spot. He earned it tonight though, just not sure if whatever they did to the sway bar is legal. THat was a good drive by Gordon to get the spot. 218. JRacingFast posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:24 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Have you ever?" 219. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:24 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) @212 Aww, man!! 220. New14 & 88Fan posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:25 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wile E Coyote actually did it, he raced in!!! Second win for Clint Bowyer this year and at Richmond. It's probably best if Kyle isn't interviewed, he's gonna be very disappointed and frustrated. 221. Rusty posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:25 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, what a finish. 222. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:26 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Vintage Kyle Busch interview. 223. loomer posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:27 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Can't blame Kyle for this one. That was an AWFUL call by Dave Rogers. 224. New14 & 88Fan posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:27 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) 212. Paul posted: 09.09.12 - 1:23 am "No BODINE PRAISE SPEECH!!!!" FFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU!!!!!! Was looking forward to that speech. Kyle handled that interview with Shannon pretty well. 225. Rusty posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:28 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dave Rogers will probably end up fired. If he doesn't keep Kyle out on that last caution, the 18 likely makes the Chase pretty comfortably. 226. BON GORDON posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:29 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Haha!!!!! Yea baby!!!! Now everyone including myself can have a nice big serving of crow!!!! This is awesome!!! 227. 18fan posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:29 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) For the record, Kyle not making the chase tonight was not his fault. He was sitting pretty running 8th until Dave Rogers told him to stay out when Kyle wanted to pit. After that there was nothing he could do. That was a hell of a drive by Bowyer to make it all the way on that tank of gas and still be able to go hard. 228. loomer posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:29 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) LOL at the Clint Bowyer Interview 229. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:29 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff did it the way everyone thought he wouldn't, including Jeff himself. By points. 230. MarkMartinFan posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:29 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle handled himself fairly well. That's tough to miss the chase by 1 point. 231. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:29 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think the best thing to happen to Jeff was the fact that he was a lap down. Had he been on the lead lap for that final caution, AG could very well have messed it up by keeping Jeff out instead of pitting. I will give AG credit though, he did a hell of a job fixing that car over the first 300 laps. 232. MarkMartinFan posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:31 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Let me correct myself, 3 points. 233. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:31 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) #230: Actually, it was 3 points. Jeff led some laps early and Carl Edwards passed Kyle at the line. 234. Jordan posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:31 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle not only was screwed by horrible strategy, but by the missing lugnuts on the pit stop. His team shot itself in the foot. 235. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:32 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Vintage Gordon, Vintage Kyle Busch meltdown, Vintage Kyle interview. Btw, since I am a crowd pleaser, I will still do the Bodine speech. 236. Schroeder51 posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:33 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) You know what I really like? The fact that the last run of the race went all the way to the finish without a caution. It ended up playing out naturally. 237. Lugnut18 posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:33 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wouldn't be surprised if there is a new CC on top of the 18's pit box. The trust factor between those two just went out the window. 238. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:34 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hamlin gave the spot to Busch and it still didn't help. Thank God ! 239. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:35 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) @235 Awesome!! 240. loomer posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:36 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) There was some masterful driving performances tonight, Clint Bowyer and Jeff Gordon just to name a few. Great run for Mark as well. Epic crew chief meltdown by Dave Rogers. If Kyle pits, he finishes inside the top-10 and clinches a spot in the chase with relative ease. Won't be surprised if he gets fired. 241. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:36 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "The above has been the thought of the race by Brian France." Fans love it too. The 18 team has a history of shooting themselves in the foot. So none of us should be suprised. No Bodine Speech? Damn it all. :-P I wounder if CJS will have some wild and crazy conspiracy theory about how Bowyer made it on gas. 242. 18fan posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:38 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, how was that a Kyle Busch meltdown. Sure they didn't quite hit the setup, but they were still a top 10 car and would've made it easily if they pitted under the last caution. Kyle did what he could, but he couldn't do enough to stay in it because he was on older tires. The deciding factor was Kyle's three consecutive engine failures in the summer. At least Denny came out and admitted his last pit stop was team orders. 243. MarkMartinFan posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:38 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) What is the Bodine Speech? Its being mentioned a lot and I feel like I should know what it is but I don't. 244. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:40 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Btw, since I am a crowd pleaser, I will still do the Bodine speech." I always knew you were a good guy, no matter what anyone else thinks. I just realized that this will be the first Chase without a Busch brother in it. 245. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:41 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) But it won't be tonight, I am tired and wanna go to bed. 246. cjs3872 posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:41 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I have compared Jeff Gordon's driving style in recent years to that of Al Unser, Sr., and there was no better indication of that than tonight. Kyle Busch is a hot-headed personality, and you knew that either he or his team would find a way to blow it, while Jeff Gordon might have the coolest head on the track, even when he was nearly two laps down (the caution for Bowyer's spin came out just as Denny Hamlin was about to put him a second lap down), and Gordon's coolenss under fire, which is a big reason why he's the most successful modern stock car driver, especially when the money's on the line, again showed, as unlike Busch, Gordon calmly drove through his problems and finished second, and had the race been one more lap, would have won it. The irony of all ironies was that it was a bad pit call that put Gordon in the Chase. Gordon had a free stop for tires, since he got the free pass with the last caution, while Busch decided not to pit, and it ended up costing him. But even though he made the Chase with consecutive finishes of third, second, and second (again, the last two coming in cars leeser than those finishes), I doubt Gordon will be a factor in the Chase, but the fact that he raced himself in the Chase under the circumstances under which he did it, showed everyone just how great Gordon still is after 20 years. Again, I don't see Gordon doing much during the Chase, as the first race is on a high-speed intermediate, the type of track where he's lacked 2-3 MPH all year, but don't be surprised if he starts winning big races again next year, possibly even the Daytona 500. But tonight's race was another Al Unser-like performance for Gordon, as he finished much higher than he ever should have, and also proved how great he's always been when the pressure's on, which is the mark of a true champion, while Kyle Busch and his team showed again why they'll never win a championship, as they choked again when the pressure was on, and Kyle Busch has never been a good pressure performer, and tonight he was up against arguably the best in that regard, so the end result should realy not have been surprising. 247. Spen posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:42 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF hates Geoff Bodine. If Gordon missed the chase, he'd have to give a speech of nothing but glowing praise for Bodine. 248. loomer posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:42 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle Busch has now missed two chases in the last four years. After he missed it in 2009, Addington got fired. I expect the same fate for Rogers. 249. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:42 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) MarkMartinFan, DSFF promised about a month ago that if Gordon missed the Chase, he would write three paragraphs praising Geoff Bodine with no tongue-in-cheek sarcastic remarks or back-handed comments. Either way, we would all be winners, but now it looks like we'll have our cake and eat it too. 250. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:42 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) @243 It is a 3 paragraph speech written by a Dale Sr. fan about Geoff Bodine without any backhanded compliments, etc. It was intended to be written by DSFF if Jeff Gordon missed the Chase. 251. Schroeder51 posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:44 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I agree that Gordon probably will not threaten for the championship (I'm amazed he actually made it considering how AWFUL his luck was in the the first 12-13 races or so). But I think Gordon should at least have a great shot at finishing in the top 10 in points again. 252. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:45 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) JG24FanForever, so did Truex. Truex pitted twice in that final green flag run because Kyle wasn't going to catch him. Seems rather odd that Truex had to pit twice in the final 100 laps, yet his teammate Bowyer didn't pit once and won the race. 253. Anonymous posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:49 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) 2nd straight top 20 finish for Landon Cassill in the #83 254. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:49 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff Gordon got himself a get out of jail free card while Kyle Busch gets locked up and locked out of the chase. 255. MarkMartinFan posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:54 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well in my opinion its certainly easier to do that for Geoff Bodine than Todd Bodine. Every time I see Todd in an interview these days, I find myself shaking my head at what he had to say. 256. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:54 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Finger Lakes 355 at the Glen, post #195. The following is a direct quote by DaleSrFanForever: "Listen very carefully Rainbow Nation: JEFF GORDON WILL MAKE THE CHA$E! You have my guarantee. If he doesn't, then on the Richmond page here I will post at least a 3 paragraph post doing nothing but praising Geoff Bodine, with no backhanded compliments, and no use of the phrase 'smart mouthed Yankee bastard'. Do you have any idea how hard that will be? That is how confident I am. Also, if he misses it, I will issue a personal apology to all of Rainbow Nation. But I won't stop calling you 'Rainbow Nation'. That is just too damn funny." End of quote. 257. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:54 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sam Hornish, Jr. finishes 11th and on the lead lap after running top 10 the entire race; Joey Logano finishes 30th and four laps down with teammates that ran top 10 much of the race. Way to go Penske Racing. I sure hope they put Sam in a 3rd Cup car and move the #22 team to his team. He and Todd Gordon seem to work very well together and breaking them up after this season just seems like a step backward. Great run by Jeff Burton as well. I think this is the first time at a non-restrictor plate track he's the highest-finishing RCR car this year. 258. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:55 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Paul, I didn't even notice that, but to no avail. haha! This is better than almost all of Gordon's 1st place finishes. 259. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:59 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kenny Wallace: "do you feel like your twenty years old again?" Jeff Gordon:"in a lot of ways. other than the fact that my back really hurts right now" is anybody watching Victory Lane on Speed? 260. murb posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:02 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Alright, I apologize for not being on here during the race, but there was so much going on that I decided to wait until it was over to talk about it all. My thoughts: - This has to be one of the five greatest races that Jeff Gordon has ever run in his life. I completely thought they were out of it during that first rain delay (and apparently, so did he). I felt like I was five years old again watching the rainbow car. That's what it reminded me of. Outstanding. - The 18 team continues to choke in high pressure situations. Sure, Kyle's hot-headedness definitely doesn't help matters. But it's really the whole package that causes these meltdowns. It's like they are fast in the early going, and then the handling just takes off. Basically, I think it's about time that the Kyle Busch - Dave Rogers relationship ends. They had a great chemistry when they first started their tenure together, but over the last little while, especially this year, you can just see both of them deteriorating. So with Matt Kenseth coming over there next year, why not do a crew swap? Put Jason Ratcliff with Kyle on the 18 (a proven combo in their NNS days), and put Dave Rogers with Matt Kenseth (which seems like a great fit, given both of their even keeled demeanors). - When Newman got by Stewart for the lead, and there was a threat of rain, I almost puked. I was like, "Really? Is he really gonna get another lucky break? Is he really gonna take the lead, have it start raining, and then fluke his way into the Chase? Really?" But luckily, it didn't happen, and someone much more deserving (Jeff Gordon with his epic drive on the night) got in instead. - Fantastic race overall. Unbelievably intriguing with all sorts of different storylines. The Wild Cards, the threatening weather, pit strategies, short track tempers, etc. Awesome, awesome race. - Clint might be a darkhorse for the championship, along with Kasey. - Hamlin, Jimmie, Brad, and Dale Jr are the main favorites, followed by the next group of Biffle and Kenseth. - It should be a fun Chase!!! Just as long as the boring 1.5 milers don't ruin it. 261. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:04 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) JG24, I am and I got a good chuckle out of that line. Here's a very telling tale about Kyle Busch from one of his biggest supporters, Darrell Waltrip: "When things don't go well, he gets worse and worse." Couldn't have said it better myself. 262. Norman in Ohio posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:12 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow!!! Congrats to Jeff Gordon and the entire 24 team! Reading the comments tonight was just classic!!! Epic. 263. Anonymous posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:13 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Clint Bowyer is not a darkhouse for the championship because he doesn't know how to win just like cjs3872 said in the past. Matter of cjs3872 hasn't backed off of his Clint Bowyer doesn't know how to win comment despite the fact Clint won 2 times after cjs3872 made that comment. 264. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:16 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) We were making driver-quarterback comparisons earlier this week, but here's another football analogy: What Jeff Gordon did tonight was the equivalent of a quarterback taking the field at their own 20-yard line with two minutes to go and down by four points. When an elite quarterback like Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers have the ball at their own 20, not much time left, and need a score, as a fan you have faith that they're going to drive down the field and get a touchdown that wins the game. I think Jeff is one of the few drivers that we had faith that he was somehow going to pull it off and overcome a 12-point deficit and win the race to get into the Chase, and that is why he is one of the few elite drivers in the sport today and one of the top clutch performers in NASCAR history. As good a driver as Kyle is, he is Jay Cutler to Jeff's Aaron Rodgers. And to add to that analogy, Jeff beat Kyle with Kyle's former crew chief/head coach, Alan Gustafson, who CC'd Kyle from '05-'07. 265. cjs3872 posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, they just played a taste of the radio communications of both the #18 and #24 cars during the race, and the difference betwen Kyle Busch and Jeff Gordon about one driver (Busch) being hot-headed and the other (Gordon) being calm could not have been underscored more. Like I said, Gordon has a lot of Al Unser in him, in that he almost never loses his cool to his team on the radio, and tells them calmly what's wrong, while Busch, much like his older brother Kurt, screamed in just about every replayed communication. now some of that, especially the botched pit call, was deserved, but he screamed in almost every communication. and even the interviews done by ESPN when the drivers were a their lowest showed the contrast. Busch raged away, and there was a team meting in the #18 hauler after the race, possibly about that, while during the rain delay, when everything was semingly crumbling for Gordon, Gordon calmly told the ESPN reporter what was happening. Perhaps there's a reason why a higher power decreed that Gordon be in the Chase ahead of Busch. his win at Pocono was due to rain, and his getting back on the same lap as the leaders was from the rain. As drivers like Unser and David Pearson showed in their day, and Gordon shows now, it's coolness under fire that will always win out when the pressure is highest, and why Kyle has never won any of the three biggest races on the circuit, races that Gordon has won a total of 10 times, and he may win one of them again next year, while Busch may never win any of those three races, because he can't stand the heat, and tonight was just another indicator of that. It certainly wasn't all Kyle's fault tht he missed the Chase tonight, but his attitude wil always bring his team down, while Gordon's attitude always seems to bring his team UP. 266. 18fan posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think the Kansas race on the new pavement will be dull, Charlotte is usually dull, as is Texas. The hope for the 1.5 mile tracks is Chicago (kind of bleak) and Homestead. 267. Schroeder51 posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I wonder how Ty, who said Jeff Gordon is an absolute dick to the fans and a cheater who should have banned for life years ago, is reacting to this... 268. cjs3872 posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:28 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Anonymous (#265), I never said that Clint Bowyer doesn't know how to win. His record shows otherwise. When you win at places like Loudon (twice), Richmond (twice), Sonoma, and make a last straightaway pass to win at Talladega, that proves to me that you know how to win. It's Martin Truex, Jr. that I said doesn't know how to win at the Cup level. You might want to get your MWR drivers straight on that. And let's not forget that in 2007, Bowyer was the only driver to put any pressure on the Gordon-Johnson duo during that entire Chase. Andthink that Bowyer, as he's been in the past, is a darkhorse for the title, though he's not among the favorites. But more races like tonight might put him in the championship diuscussion. 269. Jarrett88fan posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:28 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Perhaps the "Refuse to Lose" Rainbow Warrior pit wagon can make a special appearance... that was a clutch performance throughout the race. The best part is the Martinsville finish fiasco didn't effect the Chase. For MarkMartinFan: When Mark missed the pits, I thought he was doomed. With Mark's next top-10, he will tie Bobby Allison's record for 2nd most top-10s in Nascar history. Honestly, with the late in the race blown engines and the wreck at Michigan, I thought he'd have the record by now. Do you believe Mark will get at least two more top-10s for the record in the last seven races he is running in 2012? 270. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:31 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs3872, you said Gordon has 10 wins in the 3 biggest events? Daytona 500: 3 Southern 500: 6 World 600: 3 Total: 12 you consider the Brickyard bigger than The Southern 500? 271. cjs3872 posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:36 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yes I do, JG24FanForever. In fact, just about everyone does. The three biggest races on the circuit are the Daytona 500 (obviously), the Brickyard 400, and the Coca-Cola 600, and Gordon has won those three races a total of 10 times. The Southern 500 ranks fourth, while the spring Talladega race is the other historical crown jewel of the sport. And the finish of tonight's race certainly looked a lot like last year's Brickyard 400, where Gordon closed up on the leader at more than a second per lap, but came up short of the win. In fact, he made up a full lap on Bowyer in just 25 laps at the end, and would have won had the race been one more lap. 272. DanicaPatrick'sFlatChest posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:43 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dave Rogers should definitely be fired for that call, (as well as that tire changer who missed the most important lugnut of the season, but that's another matter). They all work too hard for this, and Dave Rogers cost them. Other than following a gamble that had no chance of working (not pitting before the last caution ended) with a gamble that rarely works (riding it out, hoping for a lucky dog and subsequently losing way more ground than they should have), the problem with Dave Rogers is that Kyle Busch is no longer going to have any confidence in him as a crew chief. Losing a shot at the championship through a terrible call (that the driver was against) is the kind of thing that sticks with you and irrecoverably effects the relationship between driver and crew chief. Maybe Kyle Busch should be mature enough to move past this, but that's not the issue. It's a lot like Mike Ford's fuel mileage blunder at Phoenix in 2010. There was more on the line and the decision was slightly less dumb than Rogers', but Hamlin and Ford were never the same after that. Maybe Rogers won't be fired, but I can certainly see Gibbs swapping the crew chiefs of the 18 and 20 in the offseason, if not sooner. Jason Ratcliff would be the perfect replacement and Dave Rogers would pair up nicely with Kenseth. 273. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:47 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Here's how I would categorize the 12 Chase drivers: Contenders: Denny Hamlin Jimmie Johnson Brad Keselowski Tony Stewart Greg Biffle Sleepers: Dale Earnhardt, Jr. Matt Kenseth Darkhorses: Clint Bowyer Kasey Kahne Martin Truex, Jr. Toss-Up: Jeff Gordon Kevin Harvick This might be the strongest Chase field since the Chase's inception. All 12 drivers are great drivers, have momentum going into the Chase, and don't have any behind-the-scenes distractions that could damage their team (unless you count Matt Kenseth's lame-duck situation). I didn't know where to put Gordon or Harvick because of their crew chief situations. Harvick has Gil Martin back as his crew chief, but has no wins and is going back to eight Chase tracks with different notes than what Gil has. Gordon has to hope that pit strategy doesn't play a part in most of these Chase races because he has a crew chief with a history of losing races based on pit calls. Plus, being a teammate to the #48 could derail all the momentum he's had the last month. I'm really looking forward to this Chase because there is no clear-cut lead championship contender and we could very well have a first-time Cup champion by the end of these 10 races. 274. cjs3872 posted: 09.09.2012 - 3:02 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) #272, I'm not sure I'd wish being Kyle Busch's crew chief on my worst enemy, but if Dave Rogers were released (which I very much doubt), it would be a fresh start for him. I know Rogers made a terrible strategic blunder, but he wasn't the only crew chief that made that blunder. Kenny Francis made the same blunder, as did Martin Truex, Jr.'s crew chief, but their drivers didn't (and don't) act the same way Kyle Busch does. Once that decision was made and the race played out the way it did, Rogers made the only decision he could, which was to keep Kyle out as long as possible before pitting, hoping the caution would come out. It didn't, but that second decision wasn't a bad one, in my eyes, because it was forced by the first one. The pit stop gaffe was a common one that is seen multiple times in each race, but it was magnified because of the stakes involved (as it turned out, it was meaningless because Gordon raced up to second and Busch wouldn't have done better than 14th anyway). But as long as Kyle Busch drives that car, he'll continue to deface the flagship car of Joe Gibbs Racing, the car that started it all for JGR, the car that Dale Jarrett won the 1993 Daytona 500 in (the 20th anniversary of which comes up next year), the car that Bobby Labonte scored every one of his wins and the 2000 NASCAR championship in. If I was Joe Gibbs, I'd fire Kyle now (I would have done it after last year's 128 MPH speeding ticket). Sure the fill-in won't be competitve, but Gibbs needs to bring the respect and class that Jarrett and Labonte brought to that car, and if putting an uncompetitve driver in that car for the rest of the season is the answer until hiring someone for 2013, then so be it. 275. TheTruthâ?¢ posted: 09.09.2012 - 3:27 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "It's Martin Truex, Jr. that I said doesn't know how to win at the Cup level." He has worse luck more than anything. If it wasn't for a loose wheel, he would have won Homestead in 2010. If it wasn't for that last caution & JGR's 11 team beating him out of pit road FROM 3RD, he would've won last week. If his car wasn't insanely godawful loose after that last pit stop at Kansas, he would've won that race. Granted, some people argue that he made his move too quickly at Kansas, but that race was over regardless of what he did. If he timed that move at the "right time", Denny still would've crossed him over and won easily because of the way clean air and passing was. 276. DanicaPatrick'sFlatChest posted: 09.09.2012 - 3:48 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I know Rogers wasn't the only one that made that call, but the other teams didn't have nearly as much to lose. That was just the wrong time to stop being conservative. I'm also just not a fan of the staying out/waiting for a caution/lucky dog strategy. I've always hated seeing teams do that. I understand the decision, I just don't like it. So, when I saw Johnson pitting after getting in his fuel window, I really thought Busch should have done the same. And I know pit stop mistakes like that happen all the time, but you have to be clutch in those situations. If a tire changer can't be relied upon to do a flawless tire change when it matters most, he doesn't deserve his job, even if it was ultimately meaningless (it's hard to say it was meaningless, though, who knows what would have been different on that final run if Busch would have had that extra time and had only been slightly less demoralized) But none of that matters. Shoulda, woulda, coulda, etc. It was the problems, accidents and mechanical issues the team had in the previous 25 races, not this one that lost it. My only point is, Busch is pissed right now, he'll be pissed about it for a long time, and he and Rogers are not going to be able to work together anymore. A more mature driver could move past this, but this is Kyle Busch we're talking about. If Gibbs wants to keep Busch as a driver, which it seems he does, I don't see any way they can keep Rogers as his crew chief. I can see them going a year being above average but irrelevant - like Hamlin and Ford in 2011 - but why delay the inevitable? Like I said, a swap between the 18 and 20 teams is probably most likely. Gibbs should realize that Rogers is still a good crew chief, just not with Kyle Busch. 277. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 4:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) This extends Gordon's Modern records: }20 Consecutive seasons with at least 7 Top 5's }139th Front Row start }149th Top 2 finish He said that his second last week at Atlanta was the most disappointing runner-up he ever had,and said tonight's runner-up was the best he ever had. Truly one of the greatest races of Gordon's life. 278. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 4:03 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) ^^ sorry it's actually Front-Row start #138 279. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 4:16 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) After all the "He won't finish in the Top 20" bullshit talk, how does everyone feel about Gordon's automatic 19th consecutive Top 12 points finish? Gordon's streak is the second longest in Modern Cup history. Behind only Big E's entire career streak of 22 straight from 1979-2000. wow! 280. Jarrett88fan posted: 09.09.2012 - 5:02 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) JG24FanForever, It may take a few weeks or months to actually appreciate how Gordon put his team on his back and willed his way to the Chase. However, what we witnessed was an incredible moment similar to Stewart at Homestead 2011. It is resolve and steady determination among other qualities that separate drivers like Gordon, Stewart and Johnson from all their current competitors. As a Jarrett fan since 97', I congratulate the entire Gordon fanbase. Bask in the glory Rainbow Nation! 281. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.09.2012 - 5:06 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs and Ty eat a ton, I mean a ton, of crow. At least DSFF will still go on about smartmouth Yankee @#$@#%@s. Perhaps he should be allowed to use that term once in his speech since Jeff made the Chase. 282. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 5:09 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Top 5 greatest Runner-up finishes in Cup history 1. Jeff Gordon-Tonight(No handle on the car for more than half the race) 2. Jimmie Johnson-Homestead 2010 3. Dale Earnhardt-Bristol Night 1995 4. Dale Earnhardt-Daytona 500 1995 5. Dale Earnhardt-Daytona 500 1999 283. joey2448 posted: 09.09.2012 - 5:19 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hey fellow posters on RR, I unfortunately had to work a busy day today, but I still managed to listen to most of the race on MRN and follow the leaderboard on NASCAR.com, and I am still shocked (and excited) to know that Jeff Gordon made the Chase! Just quite an incredible run to finish second after the way that car was driving. Kind of reminds me of the 2004 fall Charlotte race, where he battled an ill-handling car early in the race (and ended up wrecking), but came back to finish second in that race. It just proves to me that JEFF GORDON IS THE F**KIN MAN!!! Also, it has been an absolute joy to read all the comments here, and I have been laughing so hard at how every poster was declaring Gordon's chances dead (including myself), only to realize that he was going to make it in those final laps. It's so amusing, all of the talk this year about Jeff's chances of making the Chase, and again, I too, didn't think he would make it. But this race was one of the classics. Like Mayfield in 2004, Jeff drove his ass off and performed miraculously (and had some help from Kyle) to pull it off! Looking forward to that Bodine Speech, DaleSrFanForever! (even though the 24 did make the Chase) 284. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 6:11 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) it's GP2 time. Monza has to be the most charismatic racing circuit in the world. My man Alonso's car broke in Q3, costing him an easy pole and handing an easy win to the Ham in the Italian Grand Prix. is anybody up for the GP2 and F1 races? 285. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.09.2012 - 6:43 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Does anyone else have a moral issue with the fact that Hamlin is the points leader despite being 2 races back without the Chase? 286. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 6:48 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) NicoRosbergFan, if he won the title that way, maybe. 287. joey2448 posted: 09.09.2012 - 7:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm up for F1 at Monza! Let's go McLaren! 288. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 7:06 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) joey2448,get ready for a potential Lewis Hamilton Grand Slam. A Grand Slam is when you lead every lap from the pole and cut the Fastest lap of the race. Alonso has the pace to beat him but the track position factor ruins Alonso's race. 289. Ed posted: 09.09.2012 - 7:09 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Top 5 greatest Runner-up finishes in Cup history 1. Jeff Gordon-Tonight(No handle on the car for more than half the race) 2. Jimmie Johnson-Homestead 2010 3. Dale Earnhardt-Bristol Night 1995 4. Dale Earnhardt-Daytona 500 1995 5. Dale Earnhardt-Daytona 500 1999" Why is Jeff Gordon - 2004 fall Charlotte race not on this list. 290. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 7:11 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Ed,I actually had a dream the night before that race that he won but he finished 2nd instead. I never actually saw that race. 291. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 7:14 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nice to see a Scuderia win GP2 at Monza. 292. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 7:21 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Let me rephrase the above. Nice to see an Italian driving a Scuderia win at Monza. 293. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.09.2012 - 7:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) ^ I guess we're watching the same thing. Darned good race. I'd like to see their results here, but that's another few years off still. I'm bargaining on Schumi breaking through today. 294. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 7:24 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) ^ Schumi winning at Monza? cool. I know it won't happen but I really want Alonso to pull off another of his famous Magic tricks today. 295. 10andJoe posted: 09.09.2012 - 7:59 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) #24 sponsor: Drive to End Hunger / Chase AARP Visa Note that the #19 actually carried sponsor logos this week instead of just being a 'paper sponsor'. And was it an "OPSEC" (operational security) in-joke that the dark-gold-on-a-black-car sponsor logos on the 33 were utterly unreadable? 296. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 8:14 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I take my original list back. Top 5 greatest 2nd place finishes in Cup history: 1. Jeff Gordon-Last night 2. Jeff Gordon-Charlotte Chase 2004 3. Jimmie Johnson-Homestead 2010 4. Dale Earnhardt-Bristol Night 1995 5. Dale Earnhadt-Daytona 500 1995 297. Matthew Tesfaye posted: 09.09.2012 - 9:25 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) What time did the race finished i was sleepin at midnight 298. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 9:27 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) ^ The race was over at about 1:30 A.M 299. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.09.2012 - 9:43 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Get your Grand-Am picks in fast! 300. MarkMartinFan posted: 09.09.2012 - 10:25 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) @Jarrett88fan I believe Mark will definitely get at least 2 more top 10s before the year is out. Just look at a few facts about the 7 races he will run: Chicago - 12.5 avg finish, 1 win, finished 9th last year Dover - 12.5 avg finish, 4 wins, 14th in June, avg running position of 6th Charlotte - 16.7 avg finish, 4 wins, was running top 10 until engine failure Kansas - 14.6 avg finish, 1 win, ran top 15 until engine failure Texas - 13.3 avg finish, 1 win, finished 3rd in April Phoenix - 9.0 avg finish, 2 wins, finished 9th in March Homestead - 13.3 avg finish, best finish of 2nd Realistically, he could be looking at getting top 10s at all 7 races but I believe he will get either 3 or 4. I don't fully trust those TRD engines. 301. 10andJoe posted: 09.09.2012 - 10:38 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) -Travis Kvapil's 200th Cup start. 302. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 10:41 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Top 5 longest 7+ Top 5 seasons in the Modern era of Cup 1. Jeff Gordon 20 1993-2012 2. Tony Stewart 14 1999-2012 3. Darrell Waltrip 13 1974-1986 3. Dale Earnhardt 13 1979-1991 5. Richard Petty 12 1972-1983 5. Mark Martin 12 1989-2000 303. 10andJoe posted: 09.09.2012 - 10:57 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) -Ken Schrader's 750th Cup start. 304. 10andJoe posted: 09.09.2012 - 10:59 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) And for those from the Kyle Busch/ESPN "HISTORY" School of Counting: -Joe Nemechek's 1000th combined Cup+Nationwide+Truck start. 305. 10andJoe posted: 09.09.2012 - 11:03 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) And it's good to see Cassill finally starting to show some light at the end of the tunnel, after the first part of the season was "speed but no luck" followed by "a bit more luck but less speed". Hopefully that light isn't the sponsorship train though. 306. ch posted: 09.09.2012 - 11:30 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sponsor Change: 91 - Humphrey Smith Racing 307. Billy posted: 09.09.2012 - 11:48 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) The #30 of David Stremme was driving a Toyota, not a Chevrolet. http://www.thehotlap.com/gallery/albums/2012/sprintcupseries/20120908%20Virginia%20529/20120908pc0725.jpg 308. cjs3872 posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NicoRosbergFan (#285), I can't agree with you more that it's a crying shame that Denny Hamlin's going to be the point leader based on just the four races that he won, stead of the first 26 races as a whole. For the last month, I've been posting how the Chase standings would look like using a weighted system of giving the top ten drivers three points per position up from 11th, then adding three points per win, because I think that's the best barometer of what it should look like. Wins should be rewarded when the Chase comes. That I don't have a problem with. What I don't agree with is basing the points just on wins. I think it should be a combination of point standings and wins that the Chase seeding should be based on. Later today, I'll be posting, for the final time now that we know what the Chase field looks like, what the Chase standings would look like under my weighted format. I'll also be posting my predictions on the last ten Chase races, as well sa my predicted order of finish in the Chase. And as for those that think, just as I did most of the year, that Jeff Gordon didn't belong in the Chase, I base that opinion mostly on the fact that he was nowhere near the top 12 for most of the season. Sure he lucked into that win at Pocono due to Mother Nature (who seemed to have an affinity for him the past six weeks), but the fact that he raced his way into 12th in points proves he belongs, as I think it should be the top 12 in points that make the Chase, no questions asked. Last night, Gordon raced his way into the top 12 in points, moving into 12th position. The Chase should be the 12 best on the circuit, and that's what it's going to be. Nobody lucking a win to get in (unless you count Gordon's Pocono win as lucking in a win). And by the way, if Gordon doesn't luck into that win at Pocono, he's not 12th in points after Richmond, and Kyle Busch would be, and he'd be the driver deserving of the final Chase spot. 309. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff Gordon just tweeted that he had made a statement that if he made the Chase, he would bring back the mustache. 310. JG24FanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs3872 "And by the way, if Gordon doesn't luck into that win at Pocono, he's not 12th in points after Richmond, and Kyle Busch would be, and he'd be the driver deserving of the final Chase spot." Pocono was a just reward to make up for Martinsville. And last night was a just reward for the "Horror Show" of a season JG's had. 311. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 12:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I agree JG24FanForever. You could also argue that it was a receipt for having the caution come out at Dover after he pitted on a different cycle, and Sonoma when his crew chief ran him out of gas with 30-40 laps to go. Cjs, you could say that Kyle Busch lucked into his only win this year too. If Carl Edwards isn't incorrectly listed as the leader and then penalized for jumping the start, and if Kyle's pit crew doesn't leap frog him in front of Tony Stewart with a few laps to go at Richmond earlier this year, he enters this Richmond race needing to win to have a chance at the Chase. Of course, if Carl Edwards didn't get penalized and went on to win, who's to say he wouldn't have been more consistent down the road and was in better position to make the Chase. 312. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Its not that Jeff is "cool under pressure". He is one of the rare drivers who actually gets better when adversity strikes. The only other people I have seen in my lifetime who thrive under being down are Dale and JJ. Jeff's horrible start to this race made him race better. He is able to channel his anger into the ultimate productivity. When they gave him the motto "refuse to lose" it was a motivational cliche, but it fits Jeff like a glove. He doesn't know how to quit. And that is why I label this as a "Kyle Busch Meltdown". I listened to his radio throughout the race cause I picked him for this race in my race pool (F*#%). Yeah, Dave made the bad call and they picked the worst possible time to have a pit stop flub. But as soon as that call was made Kyle threw in the towel. He had been giving precise feedback the entire night until that point. But he flipped out when he realized the error had been made and didn't say a word about the car the rest of the night. As they played on TV, when Dave asked what he wanted for the car, he just said "I don't f***ing care". All he said on the radio the rest of the night was "talk to the 56 and you know what I am talking about" and asked where they were in points. Kyle Busch may have insane talent, but he is not a champion. He is a loser. That is right, a loser. His talent has carried him to many wins, but overall he is a loser. He turned 27 this year and will end the year not only still never having won a championship, but never even coming close. The year Jeff turned 27 he won his 3rd Winston Cup. And we have to give Gustfson credit too. His decision to cut the swaybar gave Jeff a car he could carry like he did. I think he gets unnecessary flak here. He knew they needed something desperate, made the call, and it was the right one. 313. murb posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) After the whole "Texas Meltdown" of last year, I was really thinking and hoping Kyle would turn it around this year. I don't really consider myself a fan of his, but it will be a shame in my opinion if he never does win a championship. He has more than enough driving talent to do it. He just can't get it all together in his head. Like I said, I think J.D. and Joe should just blow that whole team up. Him and Rogers have been falling apart for a while now. I think it all started at the "2010 Texas Meltdown" where he got penalized for flipping off the official. You could totally tell that Dave Rogers knew then what he would be in for as Kyle's crew chief. Also, real quick, I have to mention how nice it is to see my guy JB get a top ten. It's been a hellacious two years, so it is great to see. 314. cjs3872 posted: 09.09.2012 - 1:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Paul, wat happened with Carl Edwards in the May race at Richmond had nothing to do with Kyle Busch winning that race. That happened much earlier. Where Kyle might have gotten some luck was when a caution was thrown for a water bottle in turn two with about 15 laps remaining with Tony Stewart leading handily. Stewart then had a botched pit stop, handing the lead to Busch, who drove a smart race and kept a cool head (for once). Busch got the lead on those pit stops and held off Dale Earnhardt, Jr. for the win. But Busch was up there the entire race. And DSFF, what you say about Gordon thriving under pressure to me counts as being cool under pressure, because he almost never violates Darrell Waltrip's golden rule, which is "don't beat yourself". Gordon rarely beats himself when he's in a big situation, which is why he's won 86 races, more than any modern driver, 20 crown jewel races, shattering the previous record of 13, which was held by Bobby Allison (they're the only two drivers to win each of the crown jewels at least three times). And you talk about how Gordon's team has always had difficulties finishing seasons. I lay that on two things. First, he had big point leads, so they were just being conservative and letting the clock run out on his championship rivals. But also, the fault for that goes on Gordon's team, not Gordon himself. Only once, at the 1997 season finale at Atlanta, do remember Gordon making a mistake late in a season where he was in contention for a championship, but his team failed him numerous times with untimely engine problems and poorly set up cars late in seasons. But other than Jimmie Johnson, who's won five championships, of the current drivers, there isn't anyone I would trust more in the kind of situation that arose last night more than Gordon, even at 41, and last night was yet another example of why. And you bring up Alan Gustafson's decison to cut the rear sway bar. I've always said that Gufstason's area of expertise was in the cars themselves, so I'm not surprised that he made the car marketly better, but that decision was a gamble that ended up being just sheer brilliance on his part. My beef with him has always been race strategy, not anything to do with the cars, because among today's crew chiefs, he's one of the top five in terms of knowledge about the cars, maybe the top three. The thing was that the last caution flag pit stop they made was a free stop for tires, since they got the free pass, which meant they would start at the back anyway, so there was no strategy decision at all there. And as for Kyle Busch and his attitude problems, like I mentioned in post #274, as long as Joe Gibbs has him in that #18 car, he will continue to deface the flagship car of JGR, which carried two of the classiest champions in the recent history of the sport, Dale Jarrett and Bobby Labonte, to some of their biggest wins, including Jarrett's 1993 Daytona 500 win and all of Bobby Labonte's wins and his 2000 championship. Busch also defaced Hendrick's flagship #5 car the same way before Hendrick finally had enough. Busch replaced another of the sport's classiest champions, Terry Labonte, in that car. Casey Mears, and most significantly, Mark Martin, brought the element of class back to the #5 HMS car, ething that Kasey Kahne is following through on. Now Gibbs needs to do the same with his flagship car, just as Hendrick did with his, and if that means bringing an classy, but uncompetitve driver into that car to restore some dignity to the #18 car, then so be it. If I was Gibbs, I'd fire Busch, then ask a driver like Bill Elliott or Terry Labonte if they could drive the car the rest of the season, then hire someone else to drive the #18 car for 2013. Sure Elliott or Labonte wouldn't be competitve, but for Gibbs, a man of the highest cass, to have such a classless driver like Busch driving the #18 car, which carried guys like Jarrett and Bobby Labonte to success, just doesn't seem right, and I'd fire Busch today, and would have last year after his 128 MPH speeding ticket. 315. loomer posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) My guess is that Ratcliff(who probably has the best relationship with Kyle by winning the Nationwide title with him) switches to the 18 while Rogers goes to the 20 to crew chief Kenseth next year. 316. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) But Cjs, had Edwards not been black flagged, Kyle would've had to pass AND Stewart. It would've been a more difficult task to have his pit crew get him out in front of both front runners on that final pit stop instead of just Stewart. And I agree that when it comes to making the right adjustments to the car, Alan Gustafson is one of the very best at making the car better throughout the race, with the last two races being great examples of his expertise. But when it comes to race strategy and deciding whether to put tires on or how many tires to put on, he's out of his element. Gordon himself spoke during the pre-race show about how Alan wasn't being himself when making those calls and how he held a team meeting a few weeks back basically stating that he's (Alan) blown some races this year and would start listening to Gordon and others more when it comes to strategy, rather than try making them on his own. If Gibbs did fire Kyle (which I think he should, but probably won't), I think Michael McDowell would be the perfect fit. MM's a classy guy and a Christian, like Gibbs, and has worked with JGR the past two seasons on a part-time basis in the Nationwide Series. Plus, Gibbs picked him to fill-in for Kyle after his "Texas Meltdown: Part Two" saga from last year. 317. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Kyle would've had to pass AND Stewart" My bad. It should read "Kyle would've have to pass Carl AND Stewart". 318. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 2:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I actually agree about Busch cjs. Yes he has all the talent in the world, but so does his brother. I can only see him going the same way. He simply cannot help himself. I just can't stop thinking about his radio traffic last night. He just doesn't have "it" and I can't see him ever getting "it". Racing will present you with adversity quite often. You HAVE to be able to handle it. Any adversity is always a death sentence for Kyle. I'm just surprised he didn't find a way to put it in the fence last night. I guess that is some type of progress. So I think it would be best to just part ways with Busch. The combo of him and Hamlin is just toxic. But now they have Kenseth, and with the strength of their cars, surely they could find another worthy driver to fill the 18 car and finally be true rivals to HMS. Hamlin, despite his personality flaws, can be redeemable (I think). The youth excuse doesn't work for Kyle anymore. He is 27. That is not a kid by any means. Again, compare him to Gordon at age 27 (that was during his monumental 1998 season). Hell, compare him to Earnhardt at age 27. Dale was trying to make a name for himself and get team owners attention in Will Cronkite's severely underfunded Fords (the equivalent of today's Front Row Motorsports teams). He finished a very credible 16th in the World 600, 12th in the Southern 500, and 7th in the Firecracker 400. This gave him his big shot in Osterlund's big dollar (albeit green as hell) team in a one off deal. In his big chance, he finished 4th, and the rest is history. It's time to give up on Kyle Busch. 319. cjs3872 posted: 09.09.2012 - 3:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) But Paul, who's to say that Busch wouldn't have beaten Edwards in the pits the same way he beat Stewart that night. He never passed Stewart for the lead late in that race. Stewart's team had a bad pit stop, which resulted in Kyle getting the lead in the pits. Who's to say that Busch wouldn't have beaten Edwards out of the pits and held him off, anyway? Like I said, Kyle, for once, drove a smart, conservative race, and let his competition beat themselves, instead of Kyle beating himself. That's how he won that race at Richmond in May. He didn't have the best car, but he and his team made no mistakes, while his competition consistenly shot themselves in the foot. And also, Michael McDowell would be just the type of driver I was talking about, when I said that I would bring a driver hat would bring respect to the #18 car. The problem with that move is that he was a disaster in the Cup series the first time around, and that he ran at the back at Texas the #18 car, and he has seemingly hit half his competitors in the NNS races he ran for JGR this year. But a driver like McDowell would be a perfect stop gap until a better, more respectful driver can be found, but he would need to be better than McDowell has proven to be. 320. murb posted: 09.09.2012 - 3:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Trevor Bayne. 18 car. Enough said. Too bad it won't happen though. 321. joey2448 posted: 09.09.2012 - 3:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) THE STACHE IS COMING BACK FOR JEFF!!! Should be interesting to follow. 322. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 3:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Since Penske has decided to put a soon-to-be ex-JGR driver, Joey Logano, in one of its Cup cars, perhaps JGR should try seeking Sam Hornish, Jr. out for their #18 Cup car for 2013. If the Sam's contract with Penske doesn't get in the way, JGR could come up to him and say "Hey Sam, you've been running very well in that #22 this season and have performed far better than your replacement. Since Penske doesn't think you're good enough for their Cup car, we're extending an offer to you to join our Cup team." Of course, Sam does have loyalty to both Penske and Shell-Pennzoil dating back to his IndyCar days, but I think if his contract doesn't prevent him from doing so, and if JGR extends an offer, it'd be the right career move for him to jump to JGR. Sam's a classy guy and a great driver too, and I think he'd be the perfect long-term investment for JGR going forward with their #18 team. Also Cjs, don't forget about J.J. Yeley. Sure he didn't have the results and isn't a great Cup driver, but he did bring class to that #18 car prior to Kyle Busch coming over. 323. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 3:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) murb, that would be a great move by JGR. But like you said, it'll never happen. Bayne is too loyal to Ford and Roush, and has stated that he wouldn't even try switching Ford teams (Penske) unless he got the okay from Roush himself. Once his contract runs out, I hope he gets as far away from Roush as he can. 324. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.09.2012 - 3:23 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Trivia Time! Eleven cars finished on the lead lap for this 400 lap short track race (that had 6 cautions). That is a pretty low number by today's standards. When was the last time somebody lapped the field to win a Cup race? Of course, since we are all history nerds here, we all know the answer is Geoff Bodine in the 1994 Fall North Wilkesboro race. But this was before the lucky dog, the wave arounds, the debris cautions, etc so that was pretty common back then meaning that is no big deal that Geoff accomplished this in 1994 right? Right? Wrong! That race was a 400 lap short track race that took 2 hours and 32 minutes to complete. And Geoff started 18th and not only drove to the front but lapped the field as the first 329 laps were run caution free. But is was still common back then right? Wrong! That was the first time it had happened since the 1991 Fall Dover race, more than 3 years earlier when Harry Gant lapped the field after 500 grueling miles on the Monster. That race took FOUR hours and 32 minutes to finish. The third to last time? The 1987 World 600. After 4 hours and 33 minutes in the brutal Memorial Day heat Kyle Petty won by over a lap. So no, it was not commonplace back then. But Geoff Bodine accomplished it so it gets overlooked and downplayed. As you guys know, I have been fascinated by drivers who are overrated, underrated, properly rated, properly rated but for the wrong reasons (Earnhardt), and especially by drivers who seem to have slipped through the cracks of time. And Geoff is one of those people. As you guys also know, I have taken endless potshots at him due to his grating personality, and I feel that is a big reason he has been not given his proper due. And that is a bad reason. As much hell as I have given him, I have never questioned his ability behind the wheel. Let's have a look at his career: After spending his first two seasons in Cliff Stewart's mid pack cars, and putting up better numbers than HOFer Rusty Wallace did in his first two seasons also in Cliff's cars (Geoff actually did really well considering the equipment) he got tabbed to drive for Rick Hendrick's start up team. The problem is they had no sponsorship and Rick wanted to shut it down prior to Martinsville. But crew chief Harry Hyde, a legend, convinced Rick to run the car at Martinsville cause he thought they could win. Think about that: start up team, a driver that has never won, but the legendary Harry Hyde thinks Geoff can win on one of the toughest tracks out there in Martinsville. What does that tell you? We all know the story, they did show up, Geoff did win (on Earnhardt's birthday lol), Rick stayed in business, and NASCAR has never been the same. In that year he also won the last race at the old Nasville short track, beating Darrell Waltrip on his own turf, then winning a road course race at Riverside. 1985 didn't go so well, but it didn't so well for anyone not named Bill Elliott. Geoff and his Monte Carlo got destroyed, just like everyone else, by that little red TBird. Plus him and Harry started butting heads. Harry is the kind of crew chief who liked to do everything his way. That is why he did do well with Tim Richmond. Tim didn't care what was under the car, and that was the exact driver Harry needed. Geoff liked to be more involved. So in 1986 he got Gary Nelson, they led half the laps and won the Daytona 500, and led over 1600 laps for the year, adding another win, but only finished 8th in points thanks to TEN engine failures. As for 1987, copy and past 1985, only replace "Bill Elliott" with "Dale Earnhardt" and "little red TBird" with "battle scarred blue and yellow Wrangler car". 1988 and 1989 were servicable, but HMS was quite inconsistent back then. They expanded too fast which left Geoff looking for more stable ground. He then joined Junior Johnson in 1990 and finished 3rd in points behind the epic Dale/Mark contest. In other words, had Geoff come around 20 years later, he would be a champion. And that is another thing holding Geoff back historically. The era he peaked in was NASCAR's most stacked. He started winning in 1984. That was the year after Bill Eliott, Ricky Rudd, and Richard Childress Racing got their first wins. Dale joined Richard, Ricky joined Bud Moore as he had one last run of relevancy. Tim Richmond became a star under Harry Hyde, Davey Allison jumped right in as a talented driver in fast equipment. Rusty would soon join Blue Max then Penske and have a Hall of Fame run, Ken Schrader became his teammate and started winning. Darrell was still around winning races and contending for championships, Bobby Allison was still a contender for a little while, Mark Martin and Roush quickly established themselves as week in week out threats, Ernie Irvan got in good equipment and started winning a lot. Neil Bonnett was still winning. Dale Jarrett began making noise, Harry Gant was big time in '84 and '85, then in '89-'92. Morgan Shepherd was no joke, Alan Kulwicki was a winner and champion, and oh yeah, the little kid with the mustache showed up in '93. Throw in there only being 29 races per year at the time and it was REALLY damn hard to win then. But he won 4 races in 2 years with a past his prime Junior Johnson ('92 was an anomoly, '87-'94 was ugly for them otherwise), then won 3 times in a year and a half for a past being past his prime Bud Moore. He then took over the #7 car and quite simply inherited a mess. Seeing as how their driver, owner, de facto crew chief, head engineer, everything to everyone who micromanaged EVERYTHING on that team had died in a plane crash, they had nothing, not even a sponsor. But Geoff made some really smart business decisions and his infamous 1994 seasons happened. It was supposed to be a rebuilding year. He hooked up with Hoosier and tested extensively for them building for the future, got Exide on board, and put together a damn good team. Best of all, he had them build fast, if unreliable cars. When something broke (as it often did) they would just figure it out and fix it. At least that was the plan. Smart business IMO. The result was 3 dominating wins including the Yes It Was A Big Deal He Lapped The Field Holly Farms 400, a victory in The Winston (it's not his fault Ernie went retro and brought back Swervin Irvan for one night) and led over 1700 laps. He also had FIFTEEN DNFs which dropped him to 17th in the standings. He also should have won the inaugural Brickyard 400 but his own brother wiped him out due to family issues in one of the biggest dick moves ever (you will NEVER get a Brett Bodine praise post from me cause there is really nothing to praise him for). Unfortunately he got burned badly in the offseason as Hoosier pulled out. With that, his window closed. He got one last win in the 1996 Bud At The Glen beating 3 time defending winner Mark Martin and that was it. He took a big risk, the kind of risk that gets people places, but just happened to pick the wrong partners. Anyways, let the record show that, during NASCAR's most difficult stretch to win and be successful in, he still won 18 times. All 3 road courses (beating Ernie at Sears Point in a hell of a battle in '93 as Ernie had won 2 of the previous 3 road course races, and would have had 3 in a row at Sonoma were it not for Geoff). 7 combined wins on the tough short tracks of Martinsville and Wilkesboro and 3 at Pocono. Also, modified king Richie Evan's most famous win came by having to beat Geoff at Martinsville in an epic finish as they both slid sideways across the line on the wall. He may have been annoying (I can say that cause Jeff made the cha$e), but he was damn good too. Underrated as hell. 325. murb posted: 09.09.2012 - 3:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Once his contract runs out, I hope he gets as far away from Roush as he can." Totally agree Paul. It's gonna be terrible if Roush throws him in the same direction as Colin Braun, Erik Darnell, and Todd Kluever. Great speech on Bodine there DSFF. Say what you want about his personality, but he definitely was one tough S.O.B. behind the wheel. That's the thing that sticks out to me when I've gone back to look at his stats. 326. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.09.2012 - 3:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Since he won the bet, DSFF should have thrown 1 "smartmouth yankee b@$*@^) in there. 327. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 4:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "you will NEVER get a Brett Bodine praise post from me cause there is really nothing to praise him for" Haha, I got a good chuckle out of that line. Geoff's personality may not have connected with a lot of fans, but was one hell of a wheelman that can at least be respected by his ability behind the wheel. And just think, if Brett doesn't wreck brother Geoff at the inaugural Brickyard 400, Geoff Bodine goes down in history as the first driver to win at Indianapolis in a stock car, becomes the 3rd driver in auto racing history to win both the Daytona 500 and at IMS (joining A.J. Foyt and Mario Andretti, two of the greatest drivers ever), and together he and his good buddy Earnhardt would be the first two Brickyard 400 winners in NASCAR. So basically, Brett Bodine single-handedly affected his brother's place in not just NASCAR history, but in racing history. Dick move by Brett. Having him drive the pace car allows him to know what it was like being Geoff Bodine: Seeing clean air. Great speech DSFF. If for nothing else, Geoff should be remembered for building HMS up in its early years, and that alone makes him a Hall of Fame driver. Oh, and he was a great driver. 328. joey2448 posted: 09.09.2012 - 4:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bravo, DSFF! Quite excellent, indeed! 329. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 09.09.2012 - 5:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Championship Contenders: Hamlin: lesson learned from 2010, plus he has a championship CC on the pit box. Keselowski: Brad and Paul aren't ready yet. Smoke: I don't see him repeating but i see ATLEAST top 5 in points. J.J: Always a threat but very quiet this year. Scary quiet The Biff: Not beating against him at all, others shouldn't either. Boywer: MWR isn't ready for this stage. Kenseth: With his situation, don't see him winning it all but contending. Junior: consistent but not race winning speed. Pulling a "Carl Edwards" will not work. Plus, he doesn't have that edge to do what is needed. Whiney Harvick: No, just no. Really Conservative Racing. Gordon: Top 10 in points. Kaey Kahne: Dark Horse. Truex Jr. See Boywer. DSFF, i'd rather have a poem but close enough on Geoff. :-P 330. cjs3872 posted: 09.09.2012 - 6:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, let's not forget that Bodine also led the 1979 Daytona 500 at the 200-mile mark and battled with the leaders in Jack Beebe's car until he dropped out just before the halfway point. And two years later in 1981, while driving for Bob and Dick Bahre, who later built the New Hampshire Motor Speedway, Bodine had perhaps the most bizarre crash in Daytona 500 history when he spun out in oil from Terry Labonte's blown engine, and ended up on a hillside in turn four with a couple of ambulances (nobody was injured). 331. NadeauFan91 posted: 09.09.2012 - 6:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, that was perhaps one of the best Richmond races in a LONG time! Kinda pissed that my local ABC station decided to go to local news after the first red flag though, ended up having to watch it on a stream after that. I loved all the different strategies during that final run, it was hilarious to see the leaders getting blown past by backmarkers with new tires. Oh and of course, grats to Gordon, he definitely deserved a chase spot after that run. My thoughts on the Chasers Hamlin: Will probably choke the championship away. Top half. BK: Has been too inconsistent all season to really be a contender. Bottom 5. Smoke: A bit more consistent than BK, but not enough. Will prolly be in the top half. JJ: This guy...Who F*%*in knows... Bifle: I'll keep an eye out for him, he led for a while in the first 26, but would need a win or two to seal the deal in the chase. Top 5 contender. Bowyer: Sorry, not expecting much from him. Kenseth: Much like Bifle. Even though he has a worse overall fnish in the first 26, I think he has a better chance than Bifle. Championship Contender. Junior: MUST...AVOID...FAN BIAS...Very Consistent, Needs to win if he wants the championship. Top 5 contender. Gordon: DARK HORSE Kasey Khane: He's been strong, but I don't see much from him in the chase. Bottom 5. Truex Jr: WHAT?! This guy was in the Chase all this time!? I seriously didn't realize it until I saw his name in green around lap 100 something. Bottom 5. Harvick: Well he is called Mr. Where-Did-He-Come-From, so like Jimmie, I'm not sure here. 332. Mr X posted: 09.09.2012 - 6:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) As promised here are the up to date top 15 in points standings as of last nights Richmond race, those of you joining in late can find out how my system works on the 2012 Watkins Glen Cup race comments page, comment #272. Those of you looking for last weeks standings can find them on last weeks Atlanta Cup race comments page, comment #223. Top 15 as of RIR-Race #26 without Chase Driver-Points Total-Bonus Points-(Difference) 1. Greg Biffle-28610-362-(Leader) 2. Jimmie Johnson-28340-596-(-270) 3. Dale Earnhardt Jr.-28246-258-(-364) 4. Matt Kenseth-27955-287-(-655) 5. Brad Keselowski-27389-261-(-1221) 6. Denny Hamlin-27053-497-(-1557) 7. Clint Bowyer-26857-165-(-1753) 8. Martin Truex Jr.-26552-252-(-2058) 9. Kevin Harvick-25701-117-(-2909) 10. Tony Stewart-25649-257-(-2961) 11. Kasey Kahne-24764-120-(-3846) WC1 12. Kyle Busch-24329-433-(-4281) WC2 13. Jeff Gordon-24173-189-(-4437) 14. Carl Edwards-22918-106-(-5692) 15. Paul Menard-22705-17-(-5905) As you can see under my system Jeff Gordon would miss the chase by just 156 points, a very small margin similar to the margin that Kyle actually missed it by last night. I'm not biased or anything but I'm thinking of scrapping the system lol. Top 15 as of RIR-Race #26 with Chase Driver-Points Total-Bonus Points-(Difference) 1. Denny Hamlin-40320-0-(Leader) 2. Jimmie Johnson-40240-0-(-80) 3. Tony Stewart-40240-0-(-80) 4. Brad Keselowski-40240-0-(-80) 5. Greg Biffle-40160-0-(-160) 6. Clint Bowyer-40160-0-(-160) 7. Dale Earnhardt Jr.-40080-0-(-240) 8. Matt Kenseth-40080-0-(-240) 9. Kevin Harvick-40000-0-(-320) 10. Martin Truex Jr.-40000-0-(-320) 11. Kasey Kahne-40000-0-(-320) WC1 12. Kyle Busch-40000-0-(-320) WC2 333. cjs3872 posted: 09.09.2012 - 6:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) We all know what the official NASCAR point standings are, but I'll post them in this post, as well as what it would look like using my weighted system, which combines a point edge to the top en, three points per position, with a three-point bonus for each win. As you'll see, there's an enormous difference, but I think mine better exemplifies the season to date: -Note that all ties in both lists broken by traditional point standings after Richmond (the race page has most of the tied drivers listed incorrectly). Official NASCAR Standings: 1. Denny Hamlin (eighth in points, four wins) 2. Jimmie Johnson (fourth in points, three wins) 3. Brad Keselowski (fifth in points, three wins) 4. Tony Stewart (tenth in points, three wins) 5. Greg Biffle (points leader, two wins) 6. Clint Bowyer (seventh in points, two wins) 7. Dale Earnhardt, Jr. (second in points, one win) 8. Matt Knseth (third in points, one win) 9. Martin Truex, Jr. 2000 (no wins, sixth in points) 10. Kevin Harvick 2000 (no wins, tenth in points) 11. Kasey Kahne 2000 (2 wins banked) 12. Jeff Gordon 2000 (one win banked, highest in points among the 1-win drivers below 10th in the standings) Here are my standings, using my weighted system: -All ties broken by points standings. 1. Greg Biffle 2036 (points leader, 2 wins) 2. Dale Earnhardt, Jr. 2030 (2027+3) (second in points, 1 win) 3. Jimmie Johnson 2030 (2021+9) (fourth in points, 3 wins) 4. Matt Kenseth 2027 (2024+3) (third in points, 1 win) 5. Brad Keselowski 2027 (2018+9) (fifth in points, 3 wins) 6. Denny Hamlin 2021 (2009+12) (eighth in points, 4 wins) 7. Clint Bowyer 2018 (2012+6) (seventh in points, 2 wins) 8. Martin Truex, Jr. 2015 (sixth in points, no wins) 9. Tony Stewart 2012 (2003+9) (tenth in points, 3 wins) 10. Kevin Harvick 2006 (ninth in points, no wins) 11. Kasey Kahne 2000 (two wins banked) 12. Jeff Gordon 2000 (one win banked, highest in points among 1-win drivers below 10th in points) Note that in my weighted system that the top five in traditional points are still the top five, and the same is true regarding drivers 6-10, though there are minor changes in the order within the groups of five. 334. cjs3872 posted: 09.09.2012 - 6:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) By the way, judging by what I heard about the meeting that Alan Gustafson had with his team a few weeks ago (as mentioned in post #316), which has resulted in three consecutive finishes of third or better, it seems like, while most others are trying to find better tricks to use, it seems that the #24 team has gone back to basics, and it seems to have worked. The question is, will that philosophy, if that's what they've done, work on the high-speed tracks. If it does, the #24 team may be a very dangerous one in the Chase. The irony about that might be that Atlanta was the very race in which the #14 team turned it around last year, as Tony Stewart finished third (completely lost in the Gordon-Johnson battle), and we all know what happened from there. Gordon is a driver, as he showed duing the middle of the season last year, that's still capable of dominant stratches over a 2-3 month period, if everything's right, and if they get it right, a sleeping giant might have been awoken in Gordon in the last three races. 335. David posted: 09.09.2012 - 7:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Actually cjs, the tiebreakers are correct on NASCAR.com. The tiebreakers are the same as they have always been (number of wins, number of seconds, thirds, etc.) They don't change the procedure just for Richmond. They only use pre-Richmond points to determine the wild-card recipient in case of a tie in wins. 336. Eric posted: 09.09.2012 - 7:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) My thoughts on the chasers. I have Jimmie or Brad to win the title. Hamlin: I don't trust TRD engines and a couple of factors of why I don't see Hamlin as a champion for 2012. It looks like the 11 team is peaking too soon like Brad did last year and the other issue is Denny Hamlin mentally. I wouldn't be shocked if he finishes in the 5 in points, but he could finish outside of the 5 also. Jimmie: He is a threat to win the title, but there is somethings to look at. Rule change is question how Hendrick as a whole will do. Jimmie isn't great at fuel millage and isn't known for his plate skills. Brad: He is a threat for the championship. Dodge is going away, but this team has been hot since Kentucky. The only question is if the 2 can carry their hot streak chase. Bristol is the only race after Sonoma that Brad didn't get a top 10 in. Tony: The best he can do is finish 5th in points and that means it is likely that Stewart will finish 6th to 10th in points. The 14 team has been off on Mile and half tracks since Tony's win at Vegas. That is a problem for the chase. Biffle: Top 5 in points isn't out the question, but winning the title will tough for Biffle. Greg isn't that great at Martinsville. He is off and on for 1 mile tracks. Greg doesn't have a good record at plate tracks either. 16 team has a great 26 weeks, but the drivers weak points will show itself. Bowyer:Top 3 in points isn't out of the question, but it isn't likely for him to win the title. Top 3 in points isn't out the question due to Clint being a s steady driver in the Terry Labonte mold. Clint doesn't have a top 5 at a mile and half track or a 2 mile track this season. Clint never has been known for his mile and a half powers. TRD engines is a question mark like it is for Hamlin. Clint winning a couple races in the chase isn't out of the question though. Clint is good at plate tracks and is at his best at driver tracks. Kenseth: I don't see him as a champion this year. I see Roush giving the best equipment to Biffle because Matt is a lame duck driver.Matt is anywhere from a top 5 in points to a top 10 in points. I would have Matt as a favorite if he wasn't a lame duck driver. Junior: Not going to win the championship. The 88 team doesn't have great speed on mile and a half tracks this year. The 88 team already peaked and haven't been quite as good since his Michigan win. I think Jimmie Johnson is a bigger threat for the title. Jeff Gordon: He is only going finish 6th to 10th in points. Team had bad luck or has been off. Kahne: He isn't going to finish in the top 5 in points. The 5 team has been too streaky for my taste. Truex: Top 10 in points isn't out of the question. Clint is the better threat to win the title. Truex was better earlier in the season. TRD engines is a question mark. Harvick: He is not a threat to win the title. Kevin got his old crew chief back a few race ago, but this team is at its weakest since 2009. Team hasn't been that great all season long. 337. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.09.2012 - 8:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs, do you also see irony in the fact the Jeff got in due to superior pit strategy from Gustafson? 338. cjs3872 posted: 09.09.2012 - 8:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) There wasn't any strategy involved where the #24 team was involved, NicoRosbergFan. When that last caution for rain came, Gordon was the first car one lap down, so what he got was a lap back and a free stop for tires. He was going to start in the back regardless. It was just a terrible call on the part all the teams that stayed out when it became obvious that the race was going to restart. But unlike the others, Kyle Busch, as he always does, becomes Mt. Busch if something goes wrong. But the #24 team was locked into what they did on that caution period, so there wasn't any strategy involved there, whatsoever. And David, if you're correct, then how on Earth can Wild Card drivers be posted ahead of top ten drivers, since in that four-way tie for ninth, you have the two Wild Card drivers and two winless drivers that have been in the top ten the entire season. I'm still standing by how I list them.the only way we'll know for sure is if all pre-qualifying practice is rained ou at Chicagoland Speedway and the field has to be set by points. But if it's officially shown as listed, the way they have it is dead wrong, in my opinion. Now the tie-breaking scenarios should go back to top finishes when the race at Chicagoland starts, but not before then. 339. Paul posted: 09.09.2012 - 9:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I said this just after the race ended, but I'll say it again to reiterate cjs's point. The fact that Gordon was a lap down may have been a blessing for that #24 team because it meant Alan Gustafson wouldn't be in a position to make a pit strategy decision. By being a lap down and getting the lucky dog, they were coming in to pit regardless because there's nothing to gain by staying out and nothing to lose by coming in to pit under that last caution. So in a way, being a lap down was a blessing for Gordon because it took out the possibility of Gustafson pulling a Dave Rogers and keeping him on the track. Of course, there was a team meeting held earlier that month, so maybe Gustafson wouldn't have made it anyways. Regardless, they had the best car before the caution and did once again after the caution on new tires. I've never heard of a crew chief cutting the sway bar before, but desperate times call for desperate measures and it turned out to be the move that turned Gordon's race around. Kudos to Alan Gustafson for making that move and giving Gordon a chance to make it into the Chase. Also, I like Cjs' points system. I think drivers should be compensated based on their performance in the regular season, rather than just reset the points to 2,000. It just seems wrong for Denny Hamlin to go from 8th to 1st and for Stewart to go from 10th to being tied for 2nd just because they have more wins than some of the guys in front of them in points. 340. cjs3872 posted: 09.09.2012 - 9:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Or Paul, for Greg Biffle go from the point leader to a tie for FIFTH and for Dale Earnhardt, Jr. and Matt Kenseth from second and third respectively, to a tie for SEVENTH, just because they don't have the wins that more wildly inconsistent drivers don't have. Now the Chase has never really been fair, but this is grossly unfair, because it penalizes drivers who are up front more consistently, but don't win that often, while moving guys who aren't consistently up front, but win more often, up to threatening the points leader. Somehow, that's just wrong, but it's also the usual backwards logic of those running NASCAR now. 341. 10andJoe posted: 09.09.2012 - 10:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Fans: "We want wins to count for more." NASCAR: "Here, here's a way wins count for more." Fans: "How dare you..." 342. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 09.09.2012 - 10:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Once upon a time, fans thought they should and could run the business of auto racing... " 343. Matt G posted: 09.10.2012 - 1:02 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) @ JG24FanForever (Post #296) That's a pretty good list there but I believe there's one glaring omission - Alan Kulwicki's 2nd place finish in the 1992 Hooters 500 where he led 103 laps to Bill Elliot's 102 to clinch the championship. I would argue that still is (and likely always will be) the greatest second place finish this sport has even seen. It even left race winner Bill Elliot saying "Well, we won but we lost" after the race. I think there's a pretty good argument to be made though that this run by Gordon was the second greatest second place finish of all time. 344. Matt G posted: 09.10.2012 - 1:06 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Also, if Jeff Gordon is still in contention to win the championship when we get to November (which also happens be the 20 year anniversary of his Cup debut), the #24 team should really consider bringing out the old "Rainbow" paint scheme (where he enjoyed the most success of his career) for the final three races of the season or so. C'mon, I'm not even a Gordon fan and that would give me goosebumps!!! 345. cjs3872 posted: 09.10.2012 - 1:51 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Matt G, this wasn't even his greatest second place finish. That occurred in the fall race at Charlotte in 2004, when he was so bad (much like the Coca-Cola 600, when he was lapped seven times) that he got lapped and spun out, collecting Rusty Wallace, and knocking the rear bumper off the car. Amazingly enough, the car came to life right after that, and if it weren't for the timing of a late caution, he would have passed Jimmie Johnson for the lead (he had pulled to Johnson's inside when the caution came out), and probably won the race. And speaking of Gordon and Rusty, Kenny Wallace mentioned on Victory Lane on SPEED that in his mind, that Gordon seems to have been fired up by some comments Rusty made at Michigan about Gordon apparently not wanting it badly enough any more. In the three races since, Gordon has finished third, second, and second. This kind of reminds me of what happened with two of golf's greatest champions, Gary Player and Jack Nicklaus, just before their final Masters victories. In each case, there was a newspaper article claiming that each of them was no longer capable of winning at the sport's highest level. In 1978, an article prior to the Masters claimed that Player was a "fading star". All Player did was to storm from seven shots behind in the final round to win his third Masters and ninth major championship. A simliar thing happened regarding Nicklaus prior to the 1986 Masters, and all that happened in the final round in that year's Masters was that Nicklaus shot the greatest round of his entire career to win his sixth Masters and 18th professional major championship. I might be crazy for saying this, but Jeff Gordon's competitors may not have an affinity for Rusty Wallace, the commentator, if history repeats itself, and Wallace's comments have lit a fire under Gordon. If it has, and Gordon drivers like the old Gordon, the one that Wallace remembers racing against (and not fondly), the rest of the field may be in BIG trouble, and we may have seen the beginnings of that at Richmond (the move Gordon put on Mark Martin late is something I haven't seen out of him in years, as was the elation we saw from him after the race). A fired-up Jeff Gordon could be the same problem for his competition in this year's Chase as Tony Stewart was for his competitors in last year's Chase. And we saw what Stewart did, winning half the races in the Chase last year. Anyone who's watched the sport over the last two decades knows that, with Gordon seemingly struggling for most of the season, he's like a bomb that's just about ready to explode, and if he starts winning races, which we know he's capable of, that Wallace's comments may have been what ignited that bomb. If Gordon has turned the clock back, and the cars are willing, the rest of the field may be in big trouble in the Chase. 346. Matt G posted: 09.10.2012 - 4:05 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) If you throw out the surrounding circumstances and just focus on the in race accomplishments by themselves, I agree that Jeff's 04 Charlotte performance was better. However, when you consider what was on the line and how close the points were all the way down to the last lap, I give Saturday night the edge. I guess it also may depend some on what happens from here on out too. If Gordon goes out in the Chase and just runs 8th or 10th in the points and is a nonfactor once we reach November, then Richmond will probably seem less important than it does now - But imagine if this propels Gordon into a down to the wire battle for his 5th Cup? If that scenario plays out, then the legend of Richmond only grows. 347. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.10.2012 - 5:09 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm glad I'm not the only one seeing twinges of the Jeff we all know and love from the 90s, and I think the whole mustache thing tells you he means BIG business. He's already starting the head games. 348. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.10.2012 - 8:27 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Let's not forget the driver who truly set Jeff's historic 1998 season on fire by blatently wrecking him in the Spring Richmond race. 349. Robert Nelson posted: 09.10.2012 - 8:42 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Under the F1 points system, Jeff Gordon finishes 10th, Kyle Busch and Ryan Newman get the two wildcards. Martin Truex Jr. and Kevin Harvick do not get into the Chase. 350. cjs3872 posted: 09.10.2012 - 11:39 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, three things combined to set Gordon off in 1998. The first was Rusty wrecking him at Richmond. The same Rusty that may have set him off with some less than flattering comments at Michigan close to a month ago. The second was Gordon running out of fuel on the final lap o the All-Star Race, something that should never happen, because his team should never have made such a gamble. And the third was him oversleeping a few days later, causing him to be late and to force Terry Labonte to have to practice the car (Labonte wound up crashing it, if I remember the story right). Those three things combined to set Gordon and his team off in 1998. It wasn't just one thing. And also, I wonder what Ray Evernham was thinking when Rusty made that harsh critique of Gordon, since he was sitting only a couple of feet from him when he made those comments. I wouldn't be surprised if it was through Evernham in some way that Gordon learned of those comments. 351. I Love Japan posted: 09.10.2012 - 12:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Like Chelsea in the Champions League last season, it is in the stars. Jeff Gordon will win the championship. Btw, I hate Chelsea. It was my Bayern that they beat in the final in OUR stadium :(. Sorry for bringing up soccer but I had to. I'm probaly the only person in the world that likes both NASCAR and soccer. GO OREGON STATE! Sorry had to get a colege football reference in there :P. My thoughts on the chasers: Hamlin: Yup, as said before peaking too early. I think he'll start the chase well but taper off as the races wear on. Brad K: He has ben ruuning well all year but I don't see a title happening. Not this season. He'll win one in the future but not 2012. Stewart: Nope. Had his run last year, a lot of turmoil. I think he'll be the Chase's biggest flop. Johnson: I HOPE TO GOD he doesn't win. By far my least favorite driver. But he will factor in one way or another. I expect a great duel between him and a certain teammate of his for the title. Biffle: Consistent but not tile-contending. I think he'll finish high but not be a real threat to win the Chase. Bowyer: A lot of people think he is a darkhorse. others think he will flop. I think he will be decent, maybe even win a race or two, but winning a title will likely never happen for him or MWR Kenseth: Biggest wildcard of the Chase. he'll either contend for the title and go out for Roush with a big bang or he'll flop. Earnhardt: Not winning the title. He hasn't done much lately. I think he'll finsh pretty low. Possibly the lowest in the Hendrick brigade. Harvick: No. just no. If he couldn't win it in 2006 or 2010 what make syou think he could this year? he is a fading driver and RCR is an old relic. Gordon: As mentioned earlier. my pick to win it. It is destiny. Miracle comeback, everything just screams miracle title. He just has this aura about him right now. Kahne: He might win a race or two, but he'll wreck and have bad luck far to often. Just like his whole career. Truex: Consistent but not great. I think he'll perform decent but he is not a threat for a title at all. Now or in the future. 352. Paul posted: 09.10.2012 - 1:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) FUN FACT: Clint Bowyer now has as many wins at Richmond in 14 starts as his boss has top tens in 45 starts (2). I think Biffle's best chance at winning the title was if the points system was adjusted so as to benefit drivers based on their finishing position in the regular season. Now that the points have been reset, instead of leading Junior by six points, he's in a tie for 5th place and six points behind leader Denny Hamlin. The same thing happened back in 2010. Kevin Harvick entered the Chase with a 228-point lead over Kyle Busch and a 230-point lead over a winless Jeff Gordon (so he had a 1.5 race lead). When the points reset, not only did Harvick lose that giant lead, but he fell from 1st to 3rd in points and was 30 points (6-10 positions) behind Denny Hamlin, who was 9th in points prior to the Chase, much like he was this year. I agree that wins should be rewarded, but consistency should be as well. Just because a driver isn't winning (Martin Truex, Jr.), they shouldn't be penalized for it because their consistency was very good in spite of their lack of victories. The old adage was "consistency wins championships"; yet another phrase that means nothing in NASCAR under the current rules set in place. 353. cjs3872 posted: 09.10.2012 - 2:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Like I said in post #340 Paul, that's the typical backwards logic of the eople that run NASCAR these days for you. When they first came up with the Chase, they seeded the drivers in the Chase based entirely on points standings, which is much netter that what they do now, but win were unaccounted for, so in 2007, they changed it to reward only wins in terms of seeding, which as you mentioned, cost Kevin Harvick a 1.5 race lead in 2010, and Jeff Gordon a 2.5 race lead in 2007, and because neither driver led the series in wins after the 26th race, neither even led the standings when the adjustments were made. What NASCAR should do is to do a hybrid of their two reseeding formats, and make it so that both points standings AND wins count when the seeding for the Chase takes place. That's what my system for reseeding based on the current way points are awarded is based on. 3 points per points standings position above 11th and 3 points for wins after that is done for those in the top 10 in points. It shuffles the deck somewhat, but does not turn it completely upside down and put undeserving drivers, such as Denny Hamlin and Tony Stewart, on top of more deserving drivers, such as Greg Biffle, Matt Kenseth, and Dale Earnhardt, Jr. When I thought of my "3&3" system, I was curious to see what it would look like, and it did have some interesting results, but as it turned out, the top five in the seeding process were the same top five in points after the 26th race, and the same is obviously true regarding the drivers in the sixth through tenth positions, and that's how it should be. As I said, the deck was shuffled within those groups of five, but the drivers that earned the top positions through the first 26 races ended up being the same top five under my weighted system. Of course, the major difference is that the drivers in 10th, 11th, and 12th would still be a full race behind under my system, while they could be leading under the system NASCAR curretnly uses. Again, my system is an example of the drivers leading the points gettng the advantage they earned through 26 races, not just three or four, which is the way NASCAR errantly does it. Again, this is the backwards logic of those currently running NASCAR at work here. 354. David posted: 09.10.2012 - 4:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Richard Petty Motorsports has swapped crews for their two teams, including the crew chiefs. Guess what I just found out today? Tony Stewart went winless in the 2005 Chase but still won the title. I had previously thought that no Chase champion had gone winless during the last 10 races. 355. Paul posted: 09.10.2012 - 4:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) In fact David, 2005 also featured the 2nd most number of non-Chase drivers who won Chase races (3). The only year that had more was 2006 when Smoke himself decided he wanted to win after missing the Chase, en route to 4 Chase wins. I think what won Stewart the 2005 Cup title was that he was the only driver who didn't shoot himself in the foot all Chase long. Jimmie Johnson was only 50 points behind entering Homestead, but crashed and finished 40th. Had he finshed 2nd at Homestead (or finished 3rd after leading a lap), he would have won the 2005 Cup title. Biffle was pretty much hit-or-miss with 5 top four finishes and three 20th or worse finishes. Edwards came to life in the final 4 races, but it was too little too late. Mark Martin never recovered from his yearly Talladega crash, despite having 6 top fives in the Chase. And Rusty started off great, but wound up ending his career by finishing outside the top 20 in five of his final eight races. It was truly Stewart's title to lose, and he delivered. 356. cjs3872 posted: 09.10.2012 - 4:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Right David. The key was that Stewart and his team din't make any mistakes in the last ten races that year, while his key competition made a few. Even Stewart's worst race, a 25th-place finish in the fall race at Charlotte, was caused by the tire debacle that nearly caused NASCAR to shorten that race, intead of any mistake he made. (The Wood Brothers even scored a top ten in that race with Ricky Rudd because of all the trouble.) And although Stewart did not win in the 2005 Chase, he finished second three times, each of which could have been a victory had things broken his way, and fourth two other times, while his key competition mat have been faster, they were also prone to mistakes (such as Greg Biffle's loose wheel at Texas). Those mistakes allowed Stewart to cruise to a 15th-pace finish in the finale at Homestead and still win the title easily. In fact, despite not winning in the Chase in 2005, Stewart and Jimmie Johnson (only in his second championship year, in 2007) are the only two drivers in the history of the Chase to enter as the leader and end up the champion, but Stewart's the only one to truly lead going into the Chase and win the title, as Johnson only got the lead in 2007 as a result of the reset. 357. Paul posted: 09.10.2012 - 4:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "The only year that had more was 2006 when Smoke himself decided he wanted to win after missing the Chase, en route to 4 Chase wins" My bad. That should say "3 Chase wins", plus Biffle and Vickers won, making 5 non-Chase winners in 2006. 358. Daniel posted: 09.10.2012 - 5:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Chicago entry list: -Danica Patrick in the #10 -Trevor Bayne in the #21 -T.J. Bell in the #32 -Jason Leffler in the #49 -Scott Speed in the #95 359. Talon64 posted: 09.10.2012 - 5:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Clint Bowyer picks up his 7th career Sprint Cup Series victory, and 2nd of 2010 which ties his career high (2010). After having just 2 wins in his first 4 seasons in Cup, he now has 5 in the last 3 (ranks him 7th over that span). He now has 15+ top 10's for a 6th consecutive season as well (99 top 10's over that span rank him tied for 8th with former RCR teammate Kevin Harvick). It's Bowyer's 2nd win at Richmond, which represent his only top 5's in 14 stars there (8 top 10's, 9.6 avg fin). Bowyer led 88 laps in the race, after leading just 75 laps in his first 13 Richmond starts. In his first season with MWR, Bowyer is on pace for career high's in top 5's (8), top 10's (20) and average finish (11.5). His 2 wins in 2012 equal MWR's total wins from 2007-2011. Coming into 2012, Michael Waltrip Racing had 17 top 5's in 414 starts. This season, MWR has 18 top 5's in 78 starts. Jeff Gordon has back-to-back runner-up finishes for the first time since October of 2009 at Kansas and Fontana (63rd career runner-up finish). He also has 3 consecutive top 3 finishes to close out the regular season for a 2nd straight season. Gordon's best finish in the first 20 races of 2012 was 4th, but has 4 top 3 finishes in the last 6 races. It's also Gordon's 4th top 3 finish in the last 7 races at Richmond, and 13th in 40 career Richmond starts (14.4 avg fin). He's only led 13 laps over the last 5 races, but the 2 he led in this race are probably the most important laps he's ever led at Richmond. Gordon ties Darrell Waltrip for 5th all time in podium finishes with 203. Dale Earnhardt's just ahead of him in 4th with 205. Mark Martin has his first top 5 finish in 6 starts (2nd at Pocono back in June), and has back-to-back top 10's for the first time since the first 2 races of 2012. It's his 3rd top 5 in 17 starts this season, versus 2 in all 36 races in 2011. Based on average points per race, Mark would be at 752 points and sitting 14th in points if he'd run the full season. Even if he'd won Pocono instead of Joey Logano, it wouldn't have been enough for him to make the Chase. Richmond becomes the 4th different track that Mark Martin has 30+ top 10's at. His 30 top 10's lead all active drivers, and tie him with Rusty Wallace for 4th all time at the track. BTW, Jeff Gordon's 9th all time with 25. It's Mark's 3rd straight top 10 at Richmond but his 1st top 5 in 3 years there. Tony Stewart has 10+ top 5's in a season for the 12th time in 14 years competing in Cup, but his first since 2009 (9 in each of 2010 and 2011). It's also his first top 5 finish in 5 races; in the 4 races prior to Richmond his best finish was 19th (25.0 avg fin). It's Stewart's 4th straight top 10 at Richmond, and he has back-to-back top 5's there for the first since back-to-back runner-up finishes in the Sept. '08 and May '09 races. It's his 11th top 5 at Richmond, tied with Michigan and Pocono for his 2nd most at any track (10.4 avg fin in 28 starts). Matt Kenseth now has 10+ top 5's in 7 of his 13 full seasons in Cup, but in back-to-back seasons for the first time since 2005-07. It's his first top 5 in 8 races, and just his 2nd top 5 in the 10 races since the announcement that he was leaving Roush (13th in points scored, 5 top 10's, 14.5 avg fin). It's just Kenseth's 17th top 5 in 77 career short track starts, and just his 4th top 5 in 26 Richmond starts (16.5 avg fin). It's his first since a runner-up finish back in 2005, which capped off a 6-race stretch that took Kenseth from 17th to 8th in the standings to make the Chase. Jeff Burton picks up just his 5th top 10 of the season, and his first in the 8 races since his runner-up finish at Daytona, but it equals his total from all of 2011. His 16 top 10's at Richmond tie Martinsville and Darlington for his 2nd most at any track (17 at Pocono), but it's his first top 10 there in 6 races. Brad Keselowski sets a new career high with his 15th top 10 of the season (14 all of last season), 9 of which have come in the last 10 races. After having a 23.0 avg fin in his first 5 Richmond starts, Keselowski now has back-to-back top 10's. Ryan Newman picks up his 6th top 10 in the last 9 races (but also had finishes of 36th and 35th at Bristol and Atlanta to doom his Chase hopes). His 13 top 10's at Richmond (22 starts, 11.6 avg fin) are 2nd only to Loudon (14) for his most at any track, and it's his 5th top 10 in the last 8 races there (10.5 avg fin). Greg Biffle "wins" the regular season championship, the 2nd Roush driver to do so (Matt Kenseth in 2005; ended up 2nd in the Chase). It's his first top 10 in the 3 races since his Michigan win (14.3 avg fin). It's also his first top 10 at Richmond in 12 races (6th back in Sept. 2006) and 6th top 10 in 21 career starts there (16.3 avg fin). Kevin Harvick has back-to-back top 10's for the first time since Charlotte and Dover back in May/June. His 15 top 10's at Richmond are by far his most at any track, 3 more than the next best (12 at Loudon and Bristol). Sam Hornish Jr.'s 2nd straight 11th place finish improves his average finish in the #22 car to 18.1 in 9 starts. All 4 Hendrick cars will make the Chase for the first time. HMS now has a chance of having all 4 cars finish in the top 10 in points for the first time since they expanded to 4 full time teams back in 2002, but are guaranteed all in the top 12 for the first time (previous best was all in the top 15 back in 2007 [1-2-5-15] and 2006 [1-6-10-15]). 360. joey2448 posted: 09.10.2012 - 6:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #351 I Love Japan, I'm probably only the second person in the world that loves NASCAR and football (soccer), behind you, haha! That was an exciting Champions League this year, never thought BM and Chelsea would be the ones in the final! Like what everyone is saying here, I hope that Jeff Gordon has found that old flame and can make a "Tony Stewart Chase run". Wouldn't that just be the ultimate story? After all the struggles and bad luck this season, and the predictions (including myself) that he wouldn't make the Chase, if he can go out and win his ever-elusive fifth title, that would just make my year! 361. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 09.10.2012 - 6:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "#351 I Love Japan, I'm probably only the second person in the world that loves NASCAR and football (soccer), behind you, haha! That was an exciting Champions League this year, never thought BM and Chelsea would be the ones in the final!" I like football (soccer) more then football (American version). And the best things about soccer: IT IS ALWAYS DONE ON TIME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They let ties happen? So what, when it comes down to the REAL stuff, ties are out of the question. There is also ALWAYS something going on in an soccer match, unlike the NFL (zzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZ). Take the wussies who fall down like they have been shot with a rocket launcher and soccer is fine. 362. joey2448 posted: 09.10.2012 - 6:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) After Kyle Busch got out of his car at the end of the race, did anyone see Kyle's "helper" (for lack of a better word) tell ESPN's Jamie Little that now wasn't a good time to talk to Kyle? Jamie was following them, trying to get an interview, and that guy was shaking his head, and probably saying something like, "not now, he'll talk later." Pretty funny. 363. Talon64 posted: 09.10.2012 - 6:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Some Chase facts: Jimmie Johnson's the only driver to make the Chase all 9 years. Thanks to his 5 consecutive championships, he's one of just 3 drivers to win a championship during the Chase era (Kurt Busch, the 2004 champ, is one of the others, but didn't qualify this season). 80 starts, 20 wins, 43 top 5's, 58 top 10's, 3,883 laps led (15.45% of the laps he's completed), 9.0 average finish. Insanity. However, last season was the first time that Johnson failed to win a single race in the Chase. Tony Stewart, Jeff Gordon and Matt Kenseth have all made the Chase 8 times, tied for the 2nd most. Tony Stewart's the other driver to win a Chase championship (2005 & 2011), and will try to become the 11th different driver to win back-to-back championships. Stewart's only Chase win prior to 2011 was at Talladega in 2008, before winning a Chase-record 5 races last season. He also won 3 times in 2006, but that was when he missed the Chase. Jeff Gordon has finished top 3 in points 3 times in his 8 Chase appearances (missed it in 2005, but won a race), finishing no worse than 9th in points (2010). Gordon's only two career Chase wins came in 2007 when he ended up 2nd in points (Talladega and Charlotte back-to-back). Matt Kenseth's only time missing the Chase was in 2009. His worst Chase performance was in 2008 when he ended up 11th in points, but he's been top 5 in points 4 times with a best of 2nd in 2006. He has 2 career Chase wins (Charlotte in 2011 and Homestead in 2007). Denny Hamlin's made the Chase in all 7 seasons he's competed full time in Cup, joining Johnson as the only drivers with a perfect record of making the Chase. He's still the only rookie driver to make the Chase (2006, modern-era record 3rd in points), was 2nd in points in 2010 and has been top 5 in points 3 times (dead-last in 2007). Hamlin has 4 career Chase wins, 2 in 2010 and 2 in 2009. After missing the Chase in it's first two seasons, Kevin Harvick has now made the Chase in 6 of the last 7 seasons (2006-08, 2010-12). Harvick's finished top 4 in points four times, including 3rd each of the previous two seasons. His two career Chase wins both came in 2006, Loudon and Phoenix. Greg Biffle's in the Chase for the 5th time in his career; after making the Chase just once in it's first 4 seasons, Biffle's now made it in 4 of the last 5 years. Biffle's finished top 7 in points in each of his previous 4 appearances, including 2nd in 2005 and 3rd in 2008. He owns 4 career Chase wins, and in 2008 he became the first of two drivers who've won the first 2 Chase races (Stewart in 2011). Dale Earnhardt Jr. is in the Chase in back-to-back seasons for the 1st time, making his 5th appearance in 9 seasons. Dale Jr. finished 5th in points in each of his first two appearances in 2004 and 2006, but has finished 12th (2008) and 7th (2011) in his two appearances with Hendrick Motorsports. His only two Chase wins both came in 2004 (Talladega and Phoenix). Clint Bowyer is in the Chase for the 4th time in 7 seasons in Cup. In his first two Chase appearances in 2007 and 2008, Bowyer finished 3rd and 5th in points. And in both 2007 and 2010, Bowyer's first wins of the season were in the 1st Chase race at Loudon. He has 3 career Chase wins, those Loudon wins and Talladega in 2010. Brad Keselowski makes the Chase for a 2nd consecutive season, and is looking to be the 1st Penske driver to finish top 5 in points in back-to-back seasons since Rusty Wallace was top 5 in 3 straight seasons back in 1993-95. Keselowski had 4 top 5's last season, but they were his only top 10's and he was no better than 19th in the last 4 races (19.75 avg fin). Martin Truex Jr. is in the Chase for just the 2nd time in his career, last time was in 2007 where he ended up 11th in points (1 top 10 in the first 7 races, 3 straight to close out). He'll be looking to finish top 10 in points for the first time in his 7-year Cup career. Kasey Kahne makes the Chase for just the 3rd time in his 9-year career. His best career points finish was 8th in 2006, and in his last Chase appearance back in 2009 he ended up 10th. His lone Chase win was at Charlotte in 2006, which ended up being his series-leading 6th win that year. 364. David posted: 09.10.2012 - 6:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) When it comes to American football, I could care less. 365. Paul posted: 09.10.2012 - 6:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Joey2448, actually it was Shannon Spake. Jamie's on maternity leave. But yeah, it seemed like that guy knew what he was doing escorting Kyle back to the hauler. 366. Mr X posted: 09.10.2012 - 7:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Talon64 Jimmie won Kansas in the chase last year. 367. cjs3872 posted: 09.10.2012 - 8:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) As promised, it's time for me to reveal my races picks and Chase standings predictions. Since I don't know how to start a blog (or have any interest in doing so), I'll make my predictions on the comments page, as I always do. What the predictions are going to be are the winners of the nine Non-RP Chase races, and the top 5 at Talladega in order of car number. And of course, there's the predicted order of finish in the Chase. So without further delay, here are those predictions: Chase Race #1-Chicago: 48-Jimmie Johnson Chase Race #2-Loudon: 11-Denny Hamlin Chase Race #3-Dover: 48-Jimmie Johnson (would set the all-time win record there) Chase Race #4-Talladega (top five): 2-Brad Keselowski, 11-Denny Hamlin, 20-Joey Logano (don't laugh), 29-Kevin Harvick, 88-Dale Earnhardt, Jr. (got to have an HMS car in there, somehere) Chase Race #5-Charlotte: 5-Kasey Kahne Chase Race #6-Kansas: 99-Carl Edwards Chase Race #7-Martinsville: 11-Denny Hamlin Chase Race #8-Texas: 17-Matt Kenseth Chase Race #9-Phoenix: 18-Kyle Busch Chase Race #10-Homestead: 2-Brad Keselowski Championship Standings Predictions: 1. 48-Jimmie Johnson 2. 11-Denny Hamlin 3. 16-Greg Biffle 4. 15-Clint Bowyer 5. 2-Brad Keselowski 6. 88-Dale Earnhardt, Jr. 7. 14-Tony Stewart 8. 5-Kasey Kahne 9. 24-Jeff Gordon 10. 29-Kevin Harvick 11. 17-Matt Kenseth 12. 56-Martin Truex, Jr. I may give rational for these predictions later, but note that I have two (and possibly three) Chase races going to non-Chasers, and don't be surprised if either Kyle Busch and/or Carl Edwards are in the top five in terms of points scored during the Chase, even though they're not in it, now that the pressure of making the Chase is off. After all, neither Edwards or Busch have ever been very good at handling pressure. 368. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 09.10.2012 - 8:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Stewart's only Chase win prior to 2011 was at Talladega in 2008, before winning a Chase-record 5 races last season." You do realize that Tony didn't win a race in 2008? He went winless and so did Regan Smith. :-P 369. cjs3872 posted: 09.10.2012 - 10:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) According to the record books, Tony Stewart won that race at Talladega in the fall of 2008, even though he didn't cross the finish line first, but was given the win after Regan Smith was penalized one lap for passing on the apron. I didn't agree with that call either, and still don't, but Stewart is the officially recognized winner of that race. Any pass under green coming to the checkered flag, no matter where on the track it is, should count, unless the guy flat out wrecks the guy he's passing, something Smith avoided doing by passing on the apron. It is ironic, given what happened there, that Smith's only win is in one of the very few races to have eluded Stewart, the Southern 500 at Darlington. I still say that Smith would not have been penalized one lap if it was a low-profile driver he passed, given the circumstances involved. 370. 18fan posted: 09.10.2012 - 10:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Tony actually did have a Chase win as a chaser before 2011 in which he crossed the finish line first. He won at Kansas in 2009. 371. Smiff_99 posted: 09.11.2012 - 9:02 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kid Rock Amps Up ESPN's NASCAR Sprint Cup Coverage: Renowned singer-songwriter and musician Kid Rock will lend both his presence and his music to ESPN's telecasts of the 10 races in the Chase for the NASCAR Sprint Cup, which begins with this Sunday's event at Chicagoland Speedway. ESPN's coverage from Chicagoland begins at 1:00pm/et with NASCAR Countdown. Kid Rock, who has been a fan of NASCAR for more than a decade, will narrate and appear in the opening teases of the telecasts of the 10 races, with each tease tailored to the racetrack hosting that week's event. Kid Rock's music will be featured throughout the campaign, including sneak peeks at his yet-to-be-titled new album and hits from his catalogue. "Kid Rock brings rock stardom to a sport that has its own rock stars," said Rich Feinberg, ESPN vice president, motorsports, production. "His music appeals to a cross-section of America and is a perfect fit for our NASCAR coverage." Also known for his philanthropy, Kid Rock is especially connected to the U.S. military and is a regular supporter of Operation Homefront, the USO and Operation Finally Home, all organizations to assist members of the armed forces and their families.(ESPN)(9-11-2012) *GAG* 372. Rob posted: 09.11.2012 - 9:40 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) who even saw this one?? i think it went til like 1:30am on the east coast. 373. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 09.11.2012 - 12:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) So ESPN couldn't find someone OTHER then a country singer to feature during the 10 race Chase? NASCAR has been disperatly trying for the past 10-12 years to try and shed its "southern hillbilly, beer drinking" sterotype. THIS DOES NOT HELP!!!!!!!!!!! Oh and ESPN, WHAT NASCAR COVERAGE!?!?!?!?!?!?!??! Showing only ONE little snipit from possbily the BEST event of the weekend? Really? Note: I didn't mean to sterotype but Kid Rock fits what most people precieve as a "NASCAR fan." They are better choices out there then Kid Rock. 374. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.11.2012 - 2:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Is it possible that we could see the return of the old Jeff, the Jeff Gordon who can win races at will? I actually am seeing twinges of that personality return. He is acting much more like the 23 year old that was so fast that he had races won before the green flag then he is acting like the Jeff we have seen from the last 6 or 7 years. 375. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.11.2012 - 2:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I predicted a Gordon vintage resurgance this season. Then he had his Wile E Coyote luck. This race was vintage Gordon. Btw, speaking of Jeff oversleeping that Charlotte practice, cjs, any conspiracy theories on that one? Something seemed odd with that from the word go. 376. cjs3872 posted: 09.11.2012 - 3:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, from what I understand, he just overslept and didn't get to the track in time, plain and simple, and they had Labonte drive the car to get some laps in, and he crashed it. I never heard any conspiracy theories about that. And NicoRosbergFan, you've started blogs about topics and predictions that get comments (including numerous comments from me). Do you think it's a good idea to post predictions about the Chase, such as is in post #367 in the comments page, because I have no idea how to start a blog, or just to start a blog to post predictions, and I have no clue as to how to start one. Any idea how? 377. 10andJoe posted: 09.11.2012 - 3:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) -Cole Whitt will be in the #33 at Chicagoland. Odd since Leicht just took over the ROTY lead; looks like Leicht and other drivers will be alternating the rest of the year per the comments. 378. Talon64 posted: 09.11.2012 - 4:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Tony actually did have a Chase win as a chaser before 2011 in which he crossed the finish line first. He won at Kansas in 2009." Oh yeah, that's right. Then it's 7 career Chase wins. 379. murb posted: 09.11.2012 - 6:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kid Rock? Ugh. 380. Paul posted: 09.11.2012 - 6:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I saw a commercial yesterday advertising Las Vegas Motor Speedway that involved Stewart and Johnson texting each other about how well they're going to do at Vegas. Well...at least it was a change from the usual "great racing...excitement...side-by-side...car crashes" mumbo-jumbo we usually get, though I don't think this is the right approach to advertise a NASCAR race. Maybe for a Kid Rock concert, but certainly not a race. 381. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.11.2012 - 6:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs, just e-mail the webmaster, and he will tell you the rest and give you an account. Go to blogs section and click on "Become a blogger." 382. Paul posted: 09.11.2012 - 6:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bob Dillner on SPEED just said consistency will win this championship, then used Denny Hamlin's four wins as an example. It boggles me how a guy who entered the Chase 9th in points, is ranked 8th in top tens, ranked 9th in average finish, has four DNFs, and has six finishes of 18th or worse in the last 12 races is considered the most consistent driver in NASCAR, but who cares about statistics, right? Here's another statistic: Matt Kenseth had an average finish of 7.7 and only two finishes worse than 13th in the first 16 races (before the announcement), but an average finish of 14.5 and four finishes worse than 13th in the last 10 races (after the announcement). Now that the points have been reset, I think Matt will finish in the bottom half of the Chase because he no longer has his early season success to back up his Chase performance. And if the Chase doesn't get reset, I think Greg Biffle holds on and wins the championship. But since they did, I think he falls short, but should still finish in the top 5 because of their consistency. This points system largely benefits those who can win a lot AND be consistent. Biffle's career shows that he's one or the other, and I think losing that points lead from the reset may cost him the title. 383. David posted: 09.11.2012 - 7:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Question: What are the top 25 Chase runs (by Chasers)? 384. David posted: 09.11.2012 - 7:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Concerning posts #333, #335, and #338, I misunderstood you, cjs. I have no idea how on earth I thought you meant NASCAR.com. Looking at the race page, their seedings are definitely incorrect. NASCAR.com's are correct. I was wrong. 385. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.11.2012 - 8:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Its funny. For all these years ESPN has been shoving this "we are witnessing history" garbage usually for Busch races, but actually UNDERPLAYED what Jeff did in this race. Yes, what he did, his rally, was amazing, the stuff of legends. But do you have any idea how rare it is a living legend actually ADDS to his legacy with a performance? Jeff did just that in this race. That should be mentioned more than it has. The only other times I remember a situation like this is JJ's rally to win his record extending 5th consecutive championship and Dale's incredible late race rally in his last win in the 2000 Winston 500. Legends like them rarely actually add to their legacy. But Jeff did. And ESPN and the racing media in general have missed the boat on this one. 386. David posted: 09.11.2012 - 10:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) No wonder our beloved NASCAR is in a sad state right now. Brian France is a football fanatic. 387. cjs3872 posted: 09.11.2012 - 10:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well DSFF, Gordon's run at the end of the race at Richmond Saturday night was an exact replay of his run at a fifth Brickyard 400 win last year, when he gained more than a second per lap on the leaders in the last 20 laps of the race, only to come up short. In that race Saturday night, Gordon almost did the impossible. Had that race been one or two laps longer, he would have passed Clint Bowyer TWICE under green, making up a full lap under green for the win in the last 30 laps. Certainly, Bowyer slowing down on old tires and trying to save fuel aided Gordon's charge greatly, but when's the last time in any race that a driver effectively lapped the field in just 25-30 laps, because that's basically what Gordon did. That brings to mind an interview ABC pit reporter (and current GM of he New Hampshire Motor Speedway) Jerry Gappens had with Vince Granatelli late in the 1987 Indianapolis 500, when his driver, Roberto Guerrero trailed Mario Andretti by more than a lap just before Andretti's car broke. Granatelli said in that interview that they'd have to come up with some kind of trick to "make up a full lap in 25". Well, Gordon did that on Saturday night, faliing just more than a second short of a win that would have been described as "a miracle of all miracles". And thanks, NicoRosbergFan for showing me how to become a blogger on this site. My first blog, which is basically a repeat of post #367 (predictions for the 2012 Chase), is now up. Becoming a blogger is something I never, ever thought I'd do. I plan to make more blogs about stats, predictions, lists, and the sport's history in the future. So thanks a million. 388. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 09.12.2012 - 2:26 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff Gordon pulls one of those "I'm going to will my car to do what needs to be done" performances, and with the #18 team's help with that bad pit call on their part, it happened for him. He is in the Chase. I agree with everyone else, Jeff is one of the few guys out there (I'd put Tony Stewart and Jimmie Johnson in this group as well) who can take a so-so car and finish in the top 5 with it. I'll have to post my take on the Chasers' chances for this year's title later in the week, as my pre-thoughts going into the Chase. 389. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.12.2012 - 5:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff Gordon pulls one of those "I'm going to will my car to do what needs to be done" performances, and with the #18 team's help with that bad pit call on their part, it happened for him. He is in the Chase. I agree with everyone else, Jeff is one of the few guys out there (I'd put Tony Stewart and Jimmie Johnson in this group as well) who can take a so-so car and finish in the top 5 with it. That's exactly my point about Jeff. He isn't one of a few. When Tony's car sucks, he sucks and that's the end of it. He's been around for 14 years, and I've never seen do well with crap. Same for Jimmie, Mark, and just about everybody else. 390. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.12.2012 - 8:04 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) One thing I think we can all agree on: Jeff drove like a man possessed after that rain delay. And once the 18 team made their miscue, and knowing full well Kyle would tank psychologically after that (Dave Rogers has been catching hell, and yes he made a mistake, but Kyle deserves just as much, if not more of the blame for this race), Jeff smelled blood and attacked. It may as well have been 1998 again. All that was missing was a rainbow paint scheme. 391. I Love Japan posted: 09.12.2012 - 8:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Totally agree DSFF. Like I said I think he wins the title this year. Everyone knows he can do it one more time. This is his year. 392. Scott B posted: 09.12.2012 - 11:11 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Cole Whitt in the #33 Cup car this weekend at Chicagoland. 393. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 09.12.2012 - 12:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) What Jeff did SHOULD be concidered to be one of the greatest comebacks in all sports. They were JUNK the first 25% of the race, but once the rain came and the 18 team imploded like they usually do, Jeff went into "Aryton Senna qualifiying lap mode for the rest of the race" mode and went by people like they were tied to a stump. Other drivers have done what Jeff did: (few examples) Big E at Dega in 2000 Robby (the other) Gordon at Richmond in 2003: no lucky dog, free pass, 2 laps back BY HIMSELF. Smoke at Homestead 2011: Do i really NEED to say anymore? Jeremy Mayfield at Richmond in 2004: He did what he needed to do: lead 1 lap, lead the most laps, win the damn the race. he did all that. 394. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 09.12.2012 - 1:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Smoke at Homestead 2011: Do i really NEED to say anymore?" Exactly, and that's why I included him. To come back from the issues he had that day not only to win the race, but the championship shows that he can will his car when he truly needs to. 395. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.12.2012 - 2:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I guess I didn't include 2011 Homestead in that category cause, imo, that was the race that cemented Tony as a living legend. I'm sure we could argue that one forever. My biggest point, other than the living legend and legacy thing, is this: Does anyone else get the feeling Jeff smelled blood after the 18 didn't pit? One of the things that really defined Jeff from '97-'01 is that he was a shark. When he sensed another competitor's weakness, he went into full blown attack mode. Anyone else get reminded of that aspect of Vintage Jeff in this race. 396. Talon64 posted: 09.12.2012 - 5:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NASCAR's announced the top 10 finalists for the 2012 Most Popular Driver award: Kyle Busch, Dale Earnhardt Jr., Carl Edwards, Jeff Gordon, Kevin Harvick, Jimmie Johnson, Matt Kenseth, Bobby Labonte and Tony Stewart. The only reason I'm posting this is because it's the exact same set of finalists as in 2011. Joey Logano fans need to step up! lol 397. David posted: 09.12.2012 - 5:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle Busch, Dale Earnhardt, Jr., Carl Edwards, Jeff Gordon, Kevin Harvick, Jimmie Johnson, Kasey Kahne, Matt Kenseth, Bobby Labonte and Tony Stewart. Those are the ten finalists for the Most Popular Driver Award. Now take a guess at who is going to win it. 398. David posted: 09.12.2012 - 5:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Talon, you beat me to the punch!! 399. cjs3872 posted: 09.12.2012 - 5:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 1995 Subaru WRX STi, I thought that Robby Gordon was nearly four laps down in that race at Richmond in 2003 and got back on the lead lap before the use of the free pass. And I'll give you some more examples, not all of them ending up in wins: -Dale Earnhardt, Sr.'s charge late in the 1995 Daytona 500 to second place. -Bobby Allison's charge from nowhere to the win at the 1987 Firecracker 400 at Daytona. (He went from about 13th to the lead in about three or four laps.) -Jeff Gordon making up three laps to win the 2005 spring race at Martinsville. -Dale Jarrett making up four laps in the 1998 Brickyard 400 at Indianapolis. (He still finished about 15th) -Bill Elliott making up about four miles under green at the 1985 Winston 500 at Talladega. -Jeff Gordon making up a second per lap for 20 consecutive laps at the 2011 Brickyard 400 in an attempt to win the race for the fifth time, only to fall short by less than a second. -And of course, the most famous instance of all, Cale Yarborough making up three laps to battle Donnie Allison (who made up one lap himself) for the win in the 1979 Daytona 500, which as we all know, neither won because they took each other out on the last lap. And note that many of these efforts have ocurred on some of the sport's biggest stages. 400. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.12.2012 - 6:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Coming up next a fight 23 years in the making. DSFF Vs Ricky Rudd 401. Paul posted: 09.12.2012 - 7:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Cjs, you're correct. Robby was four laps down in that race. Not only that, but he even led 29 laps late in the race until he was passed by eventual winner and dominant driver Joe Nemechek with about 64 laps to go. The first 2/3rds of 2003 was truly Robby's best season in NASCAR as he was in position to finishing in the top 10 in points that year up until that point. 402. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.12.2012 - 7:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I don't wanna fight The Rooster. That is one tough scrappy little dude. I'm still disappointed they didn't let Harvick get to him after that Richmond race in '03. That would have been an ass kicking for the ages. Like Nolan Ryan vs Robin Ventura or The Ultimare Warrior vs The Honky Tonk Man. 403. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.12.2012 - 7:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It was almost 4 laps for Robby in his greatest performance ever. But unless there is a desert around or an anger management class reunion, Robby hardly qualifies as a living legend. 404. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.12.2012 - 7:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) *greatest NASCAR performance ever for Robby. *and just in case it needs explanation, Harvick would have been the one getting a Grade A ass whipping that night. Hell, it might have knocked some sense in to him. 405. Paul posted: 09.12.2012 - 7:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Haha love the Warrior/HTM mention. Honky Tonk Man held the belt for 64 weeks and lost it to Warrior in 30 seconds. Harvick didn't know what he was getting into trying to act tough to The Rooster. He parked his car right beside Ricky on pit road, got out, and just froze when he saw Ricky was ready for him. So to make himself look like a complete jackass, he waited for his crew to arrive (notice how Harvick's crew is always there whenever he confronts another driver) and walked over Rudd's car. The best part about that was after the cameras began following Harvick back to his hauler, Rudd, while being restrained by crew chief Pat Tryson, chucked his HANS device at one of Harvick's crew members. Harvick was all tough the night before when he was confronting Matt Kenseth after the Busch Series race for roughing up Johnny Sauter, but the fact that he completely froze and backed off when the guy he confronted wasn't backing down says a lot about Harvick's character. Rudd may only be 5'8", but he would've whipped Harvick's ass after that race. 406. cjs3872 posted: 09.12.2012 - 8:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, Richard Childress should have told Harvick what he was getting into that night. After all, if anyone would know how tough a competitor Ricky Rudd was, it would be Childress, especially with all the encounters that Dale Earnhardt, Sr. had with Ricky, and let's not forget that Rudd himself was actually the driver that first got Childress into victory lane in 1983 at Martinsville. In other words, Childress should have told Harvick not to go after Rudd, because he knew Rudd never backed down from ANYONE. And while Robby Gordon can hardly be called a legend, that performance in the spring race at Richmond in 2003 was certainly a legendary performance, even if it did not result in victory. And why is it that many of the most legendary performances in NASCAR history did NOT result in victory? Some did, but more often than you would ever think, a lgendary performance resulted in something other than victory. 407. Paul posted: 09.12.2012 - 8:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Looks like JR Motorsports has found a replacement for Tony Eury, Sr. as competition director in Ryan Pemberton, who up until now was Dave Blaney's crew chief. I have a problem with this for two reasons: 1. I think it's obvious now that they got rid of Tony Sr. because they (meaning Kelley Earnhardt-Miller) didn't like that he wasn't telling them what they wanted to hear about the organization, and if I'm not mistaken, Ryan Pemberton fits that bill as the passive "Yes Man" that they're (she's) looking for. 2. This is the second time that TBR has been raided by a bigger team this season. First it was their "technical alliance" with SHR that involved the swapping of owner's points that Dave Blaney worked so hard for and locked Danica into the Daytona 500. Someone please tell me one positive thing that came out of that alliance that worked out in TBR's favor. And now, JRM has taken their crew chief, and he immediately took the bigger payday. TBR showed a lot of promise late last season, but even with a 2nd full-time Cup car, it seems like they've taken a step back this year. And this latest crew chief loss doesn't help matters. 408. OldSchoolNascarDude1 posted: 09.13.2012 - 12:34 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Speaking of great comebacks, what about Jimmie Johnson's finish during the Fall race at Atlanta in 2008? He rallied from outside of the top 10 up to a runner up finish in the final few laps. He didn't win, but it really took the wind out of race winner, and eventual title runner up, Carl Edwards. 409. Bronco posted: 09.13.2012 - 1:39 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Since we're talking about great comebacks, or memorable second place finishes, I'd like to add Dale Jr's Talladega win in 2003 and his 2nd place charge in the 2010 Daytona 500. In 2003, he got a bit of nose damage from the the lap 4 big one, pitted over a dozen times, and ended up winning an unprecedent 4 in a row at the track (A record that will probably never be broken). In 2010, he started on the front row but was never a factor all day long, but used the two green white checkers to get through traffic and almost catch McMurray at the end. 410. Sean posted: 09.13.2012 - 3:09 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Speaking of great comebacks, what about Jimmie Johnson's finish during the Fall race at Atlanta in 2008? He rallied from outside of the top 10 up to a runner up finish in the final few laps. He didn't win, but it really took the wind out of race winner, and eventual title runner up, Carl Edwards." ABSOLUTELY. I think that was his best race ever (even if he didn't win) because it totally psyched Edwards out. He thought he was going to make a sizable dent in Johnson's points lead, he didn't, he was demoralized, and the title was over, and it isn't talked about much even though it's the race that pretty much ensured he'd tie Cale Yarborough's three titles in a row. "And while Robby Gordon can hardly be called a legend" At NASCAR alone, certainly not, but definitely at desert truck racing and I'd call him a racing legend in GENERAL for the diversity of the series he has won in. I think there's a case for somebody who has been legendary in one series, passable in others, and godawful in some others to count as legendary in racing overall. I'd list JPM, Max Papis, and Scott Pruett as legends, but for their success in other series or combinations of series (Montoya for being one of three drivers to win in F1/IndyCar/Cup, and Papis and Pruett for their sports car results). I definitely wouldn't call any of them CUP legends. Montoya has been a disappointment (and I really expected a lot more at the end of '09...he totally blew out his teammate who is one of this year's chasers) and Papis and Pruett were terrible. "That's exactly my point about Jeff. He isn't one of a few. When Tony's car sucks, he sucks and that's the end of it. He's been around for 14 years, and I've never seen do well with crap. Same for Jimmie, Mark, and just about everybody else." I think that pretty much applies to everyone now. Car is more important and driver is less important than ever probably. I don't think that's a good argument for saying that everyone post-1996 lacks talent. You just can't win in a second or third-tier car without strategy or lucking out at a plate race unlike the period through 1995 when you could. I can't believe people are actually suggesting Gibbs dump Kyle Busch for Michael McDowell. I really don't think Kyle's worse than the other prima donnas populating the sport (his brother, Harvick, Hamlin, Edwards, etc..., etc...), and I think he gets a bum rap compared to all those guys. I'd take him over any of them in fact, since it seems Kyle is at least more HONEST. It shouldn't be about personality (especially because today's NASCAR personalities are so contrived...especially Harvick's). It should be about driving talent (although granted, Kyle hasn't shown all that much THIS year), and drivers being fired by sponsor directive for not being "nice" enough one of the problems I have with this era. I don't believe any of them are nice. Some of them are just better at pretending. Kurt being fired because he was a bad boy reminds me too much of Ernie Irvan getting fired from the #28 after getting into a barroom brawl...which is oddly one of the things that divides the "classic era" and the "corporate era" of NASCAR to me, and Kyle being fired would too... Now, if Kyle keeps underperforming, THAT'S a valid argument and I could easily see Kenseth and Hamlin beating him in points for several years to come...but this year and Richmond I'd say was MORE on his crew than him. Yet he hasn't demanded any members of his crew be fired yet like his teammate once did. I think Greg Biffle is the only driver in the chase I actually 100% like without reservations, and I know he doesn't have a prayer. 411. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.13.2012 - 5:31 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) You'd have to be stupid the think McDowell is better than Shrub. McDowell has shown himself to be a 6th-10th place level driver except for road courses. 412. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.13.2012 - 8:08 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) The truth is you could fill a page up with great JJ comebacks. The '06 Dover race where he spun in practice (and somehow didn't hit anything), had to share a pit box, fell two laps down, and came back to 6th (perhaps the greatest 6th place finish ever). His furious rally in the '05 World 600. The same race where Jeff rallied from 3 laps down at Martinsville due to a loose wheel, JJ got lapped just from being slow and still got a Top 5. The Phoenix 2010 kick to the 11 team's nuts. Talladega 2009 (the second greatest 6th place finish ever). His furious rally to win the 2009 Dover race when he lost all his track position in the end. 2006 Indy being lapped with a flat tire. Jeez, I could go on forever. But here is the thing: despite his insane success and 5 straight titles I feel like he is still shaping his legend. As much as I hate to say it (nothing personal against JJ, but damn I'm sick of watching him win) I think he still has a lot more hardware in front of him. 413. Jim Davis posted: 09.13.2012 - 9:25 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) #410: "It should be about driving talent (although granted, Kyle hasn't shown all that much THIS year), and drivers being fired by sponsor directive for not being "nice" enough one of the problems I have with this era." Please outline your plan to compel sponsors to sponsor drivers based on talent. I think we're all agreed that David Reutimann has more driving talent than Danica Patrick, particularly at their present career stages. Yet GoDaddy prefers, for reasons which we all would have to agree are quite sound, to sponsor Patrick. No one is satisfied with the way that money dominates Nascar these days. But as long as the sport we watch requires lots of money to run we'll have to dance with that devil. 414. Paul posted: 09.13.2012 - 12:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nobody ever said that Michael McDowell was a better driver than Kyle Busch. All I said was that if Joe Gibbs woke up one day and decided that he didn't want to deal with Shrub anymore, then McDowell would be the perfect replacement driver until a better prospect comes along. Cjs mentioned how the JGR #18 had always been driven by classy drivers (Jarrett, Labonte, Yeley), just like Gibbs himself. Since McDowell comes off as a classy guy and is already in Cup and in JGR's stable of drivers, I thought he would be the perfect replacement should Gibbs decide he's had enough of Kyle. I never said McDowell would be the full-time replacement as I think he blew his shot at Cup at Texas last year, but he would be the perfect temporary driver until a better one comes along. I do think that McDowell should at least have a full-time Nationwide ride for Gibbs, but that seems unlikely at this point. Bronco, I'll admit Junior did an amazing job coming back to win Talladega in 2003 after all that front end damage early in the race, but I also think that had he not been in a DEI car, he would've been done on lap 4. Those cars were in another time zone compared to the rest of the field at restrictor plate tracks. But Junior did his job of not giving up and fighting back to win that race. Of course, I don't think he could have done it without Tony Sr. as his crew chief to keep him focused, but as it turns out, Ryan Pemberton's better than him (bravo Kelly Earnhardt-Miller). And don't forget, had that been Regan Smith who made that winning pass, he would have been black flagged as Junior passed Matt Kenseth below the yellow line. But of course, NASCAR changes their rules to fit their sponsorship needs. 415. Jordan posted: 09.13.2012 - 12:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @411: 6rh-10th place? McDowell is a 26th to 30th place driver and that may be overestimating him somewhat. 416. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.13.2012 - 1:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) ^ I meant the NNS. 417. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 09.13.2012 - 1:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "And don't forget, had that been Regan Smith who made that winning pass, he would have been black flagged as Junior passed Matt Kenseth below the yellow line. But of course, NASCAR changes their rules to fit their sponsorship needs." If Junior stays straight, he wrecks what was left of the field after the lap 4 big one. Had he gotten black flagged, there would be 4 beer bombing incidents to make NASCAR look worse and worse and there would have been a riot. Besides, Regan SHOULD have held his line. i'm still waiting for someone to give the name of the person who said "passing on the last lap below the yellow line is legal." I know it wasn't Brian France and it wasn't Mike Helton, proably some spokemen who has no say what so ever. Paul Menard won the race anyway, end of story. 418. Paul posted: 09.13.2012 - 1:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The thing I have with the Regan Smith incident isn't whether it's legal to pass below the yellow on the final lap, but that he was forced below the yellow and therefore should have been exempt from a black flag. Junior passed Kenseth below the yellow line in 2003, but kept his position because he was "forced" below the yellow (Kenseth was coming down into his lane and Junior moved down to avoid him). Yet the same thing happened five years later, except Stewart came down to block Smith below the yellow, which is illegal according to the NASCAR rule book. Quite honestly, I think NASCAR wanted their official home improvement warehouse car in victory lane because he couldn't do it on his own that year being the 3rd JGR car, so they enforced one rule but not another. If Regan Smith was penalized for passing below the yellow, Stewart should've been penalized for forcing him down there. And if it's true that the yellow line is ineffective on the last lap, then Smith should've won anyway because he beat Stewart to the line. Stewart's consecutive years-with-a-win ended at 9 in my book. That race was the beginning of the end of my 1st run as a NASCAR fan as I only watched sparingly for the next two years. I didn't watch regularly again until the 2011 Daytona 500 when my love of NASCAR came back, thanks to one kid from Tennessee. 419. murb posted: 09.13.2012 - 1:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm gonna have to disagree with the whole "Michael McDowell is classy" thing. He seems like it when he's on camera being interviewed, but on the track he doesn't show anybody any respect at all. He flat took out Hornish at the Montreal race a few weeks ago. He's also made plenty of other boneheaded moves in the past to show that the Hornish incident wasn't isolated. Remember the huge accident at Watkins Glen in 2008? McDowell caused it. Remember the numerous crashes in the past two or so years of NNS road racing? Along with Villeneuve, McDowell has caused a lot of them. I don't really have any respect for his driving ability. He seems like an okay guy personality wise, but his knack for tearing other people's stuff up has turned me off from him. 420. Paul posted: 09.13.2012 - 1:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) McDowell is better than a 6th-10th place driver in the Nationwide Series. He may have only led 4 laps in 5 starts, but he had 2 top fives and a worse finish of 7th driving on three different types of tracks. Also, he finished 23rd at Bristol in a Phil Parsons Cup car, so I think he's better than just a 26th-30th place Cup driver. When given the chance to run the distance, he's capable of finishing top 30 in a PPR car, so I'm sure he'd at least finish top 25 in a JGR car. 421. Paul posted: 09.13.2012 - 2:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Murb, I agree that McDowell is reckless on the track, but speaking for his personality off the track, I consider him a classy guy. But you bring up a great point. I think McDowell does get a pass for his recklessness because he is a Christian and he smiles a lot and is politically correct. What I'm frustrated by is the drivers who are reckless but don't get a pass because they don't present themselves well in front of the camera, such as Jacques Villeneuve. Really, he and McDowell are a lot alike with two major differences: McDowell comes off better on camera than Villeneuve, but at least Villeneuve is going for the win when he wrecks somebody. McDowell wrecked Villeneuve at Road America this year while running around 10th, and wrecked Bobby Labonte at Sonoma last year while running 30th, yet nobody said anything. Villeneuve gets into Ambrose and Tagliani at Montreal in different years while battling for the lead, and suddenly he's the most hated guy in the sport. Personally, I'd rather root for a wolf in wolves' clothing like Villeneuve or Kurt Busch than a wolf in sheep's clothing like McDowell or even Allgaier, because at least then what you see is what you get. I think a lot of people are seeing Allgaier for who he really is after his bad driving the past few weeks, but this all started back at Atlanta last year when he wrecked his teammate Reed Sorenson, which caused dissension between the two and ultimately led to Reed's release. But at the same time, it was just fine for Allgaier to plow into Villeneuve and win Montreal because he presents himself better, something that he tried at Road America to Kurt Busch and completely missed. So basically what I'm saying is that I'd rather root for a guy who comes off like a jerk and does whatever it takes to win than a guy who's not as nice as he portrays himself as and wrecks himself and others more times than he's competing for wins, and I think there's a double standard set based on the difference in personalities between two drivers. 422. Talon64 posted: 09.13.2012 - 4:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Quite honestly, I think NASCAR wanted their official home improvement warehouse car in victory lane because he couldn't do it on his own that year being the 3rd JGR car, so they enforced one rule but not another. If Regan Smith was penalized for passing below the yellow, Stewart should've been penalized for forcing him down there. And if it's true that the yellow line is ineffective on the last lap, then Smith should've won anyway because he beat Stewart to the line. Stewart's consecutive years-with-a-win ended at 9 in my book." If NASCAR had penalized both Stewart and Smith, then THAT would've been Paul Menard's 1st career Cup. And DEI would've gotten the victory that they deserved no matter what. But Tony's win streak is still going strong in my book, because Talladega made up for the flat tire with 2 laps to go that cost him a win in the Coke 600. 423. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.13.2012 - 6:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) i know michael mcdowell is far from the most talented driver out there, but please don't ever, EVER, compare him to villeneuve. the incident at sonoma with bobby labonte was just a racing incident, labotne even said is was partially his fault, besides, even the best driver would be a little rusty in their first full cup race in 2 1/2 years. i didn't see the wreck with villeneuve at road america this year, but remember that villeneuve isn't know for giving guys a lot of room. at montreal this year, hornish pretty much pulled down in front of him. and they both still got top ten's, so no harm no foul. he did pull a pretty stupid move on kurt busch at iowa in may, but let's been honest, kurt, a cup regular, shouldn't have been in that race anyway. so is mcdowell a great driver? no, he's average at best. is he reckless? a little bit. but he's 100X times the driver and person that villeneuve will ever be. at least mcdowell's fans don't throw shoes on the track when he's not leading. 424. Smiff_99 posted: 09.13.2012 - 6:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Has anybody actually ever BEEN black flagged for forcing someone below the yellow line? Initially, when created the rule, they claimed they'd do that, yet I can't recall ever seeing it. They ALWAYS give the blacg flag to the guy who went below the line, regardless or circumstance. Lest we forget, Stewart was also served a classic NASCAR screw-job at the end of the '01 Pepsi 400 (maybe 'Dega in '08 was a make-up for that?) Oh, and their shit-ass call on Edwards in the '06 Budweiser Shootout? Ridiculous. The guy avoids cars slowing to get onto pit road (thus averting a serious wreck) and gets penalized for it....lol 425. 18fan posted: 09.13.2012 - 6:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That call on Carl in the Bud Shootout might have been the worst call I've ever seen. 426. 1995 Subaru WRX STi posted: 09.13.2012 - 7:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "If NASCAR had penalized both Stewart and Smith, then THAT would've been Paul Menard's 1st career Cup. And DEI would've gotten the victory that they deserved no matter what." That is my view of it. Penalize both of them, 2 wrongs don't make a right. "Has anybody actually ever BEEN black flagged for forcing someone below the yellow line?" This is the rule as i see it. People in the booth have mention the guy forcing the other guy below once in a while but i've never seen it. Most of the time the guy getting forced gives it back anyway so it works out. IMHO we have the yellow line rule because of Jimmy Spencer. He couldn't keep his mouth shut about how Mike Mcgliclian (sp?) was blocking him. Cuz at the very next plate race at Daytona, we had the rule in effect. I understand the concept of rule but it really isn't needed. They wreck with it and they wreck without it. Meant to keep the drivers in line and the rule works to a point. 427. cjs3872 posted: 09.13.2012 - 9:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Paul (#420), McDowell finished 23rd in Phil Parsons' car in the Cup race for the same reason Danica was running 19th before she wrecked, and that was that he avoided all the carnage. He didn't really race anybody all night, but as cars dropped by the wayside, McDowell moved up because he avoided the carnage in that race. But in that race, had Carl Edwards not run out of fuel, McDowell would have finished three laps behind the next guy in front of him in the race, and finished six laps ahead of the next car in the race (Landon Cassill). In 1994, Dave Marcis scored his final top ten finish, which was at the same facility, for the same reason, even though he was 14 laps behind the winner when the race ended. And 1995 Subaru WRX STi, NASCAR did not make the yellow line rule because of the Nationwide Series race at Talladega in 2001 with Jimmy Spencer blasting Mike McLaughlin. That weekend actually marked the first time that rule was in use, and as a result, two or three drivers suffered one lap penalties in the Cup race, including Mike Skinner after the race ended. That rule was put in place for a couple of reasons. The first was the Dale Earnhardt crash at the end of that year's Daytona 500. But also, one driver (I don't know who) used the apron at the end of one of the qualifying races to race his way into, and knock Todd Bodine out of the Daytona 500. NASCAR didn't like the fact that one driver short-cutted the course to race his way into the Daytona 500, while knocking another driver out, and that combined with the Earnhardt tragedy was what caused the rule change for the 2001 spring Talladega weekend. And by the way, NASCAR has never flatly said they would penalize a driver for forcing a driver on the apron on the plate tracks. They have said that if a driver forces another on to the apron, they COULD be subject to the black flag ond a one lap penalty. Actually, NASCAR has, in those cases, especially at the end of the race, more often than not, let it go, with the exception of the 2008 fall race at Talladega, which setup the frightening end to the 2009 spring race there. But in most cases, if a driver forced another onto the apron at the end of the race, they would not penalize either driver. That was actually NASCAR's rational for not penalizing Rusty Wallace or the driver he passed on the apron at the end of a race at Talladega years ago. 428. Paul posted: 09.13.2012 - 10:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Oh, and their shit-ass call on Edwards in the '06 Budweiser Shootout? Ridiculous. The guy avoids cars slowing to get onto pit road (thus averting a serious wreck) and gets penalized for it....lol" Yeah that was a bad call and if I remember correctly, the only cars he passed were the ones slowing down so he really didn't gain anything by going below the yellow line, other than keeping his car in one piece. It makes me wonder if NASCAR was even watching, or if they just put tracking devices on the cars and have a monitor that shows whether they go below the yellow or something. "i know michael mcdowell is far from the most talented driver out there, but please don't ever, EVER, compare him to villeneuve." I will compare him to Villeneuve. They may not be the same personality-wise, but their driving is very similar, as they each have on occasion been "bulls in a china shop". At Watkins Glen 2008, McDowell got into the back of David Gilliland in turn 11 and couldn't stay off of him and sent him into the wall, causing the track to get blocked and resulted in a 9-car pileup. I've never seen Villeneuve take out more than two cars at once on a road course, and I've only seen him end one driver's race (Max Papis at Road America 2011). I think they're a lot more alike than people give them credit for, the difference is that one guy smiles a lot and the other doesn't. "the incident at sonoma with bobby labonte was just a racing incident" McDowell was on the outside of Bobby coming onto the frontstretch and turned dead right and sent Bobby into the wall. It's possible he got loose or he felt squeezed and turned to stay off the wall, but I think most guys would have backed off the throttle if they felt squeezed at such a high-speed, narrow part of the race track. Or who knows, maybe he got possessed by the devil for a brief moment. I just know that it didn't look like a racing incident. "even the best driver would be a little rusty in their first full cup race in 2 1/2 years." Technically, it was his first full Cup race in two months. He ran the distance at Martinsville earlier that year. And while it may not be quite the same thing, Jeff Green ran his first full Nationwide race in 1 1/2 years and finished in the top 20 in each race he finished in place of the injured Eric McClure, and Tim Andrews finished his first Nationwide race in almost 3 years at Montreal and finished 17th on the lead lap. I know it's not the same as Cup, but neither of those guys showed rust in their first races back. Part of being a start & park driver is being ready for when the time comes to run a full race, and the same goes for McDowell. "i didn't see the wreck with villeneuve at road america this year, but remember that villeneuve isn't know for giving guys a lot of room." He certainly showed Danica a lot of room at Montreal. When her car wasn't handling right after the shoe incident, he had several opportunities to stick his nose underneath her car going into the corner, but he didn't and waited for her to make a mistake before completing the pass. "at montreal this year, hornish pretty much pulled down in front of him." No, Hornish stayed in his lane and gave McDowell room to pass him on the inside, but McDowell's brakes locked up and he just plowed right into him. It looked a lot like Allgaier's crash at Road America, except that McDowell took someone else out with him. "he did pull a pretty stupid move on kurt busch at iowa in may, but let's been honest, kurt, a cup regular, shouldn't have been in that race anyway." Kurt being a Cup driver is beside the point (especially considering how uncompetitive he is in Cup this season). McDowell drove it too hard in turn 1 and came up into Kurt and took him out, much like the Kyle Busch/Dale Jr. incident at Richmond in 2008, except Kurt actually gave McDowell room (understandable though, because they weren't racing for the win or for points). "but he's 100X times the driver and person that villeneuve will ever be" Villeneuve has won the Indianapolis 500, the CART title, the Formula One World Championship, and may be the best at driving a Nationwide car deep into a corner without over-driving the car and/or smoking the tires while slowing down. McDowell is a great road course driver, but for someone who's been in stock cars longer and has more experience in them than Villeneuve, he doesn't have a whole lot more to show for it, other than his vicious Texas crash. And while he may be a better person than Villenuve, I can at least respect Villeneuve for being who he is and not trying to convince others that he's a better person based on which book he thumps. "at least mcdowell's fans don't throw shoes on the track when he's not leading." You have no proof that it was a Villeneuve fan who threw the shoe. For all we know, it could have been a Carpentier fan or a Tagliani fan. Maybe it was a someone who had played too much Mario Kart the night before. Really, why has nobody blamed NASCAR for not throwing the caution? That shoe had been lying there a good 20 seconds before Danica hit it. I guess shoes and oil go hand-in-hand when it comes to debris that doesn't result in a debris caution. "IMHO we have the yellow line rule because of Jimmy Spencer. He couldn't keep his mouth shut about how Mike McLaughlin was blocking him. Cuz at the very next plate race at Daytona, we had the rule in effect." He gets paid not to keep his big mouth shut. He's very good at it. If that's the case, then doesn't this make Jimmy a hypocrite for always saying that it's the drivers' faults for Talladega wrecks and not the track, yet he pretty much changed the rules that makes it harder for drivers to stay off one another? I think NASCAR should ditch the yellow line rule and let the drivers use their best judgement in deciding whether to pass below the line or not. I think they should at least have the option of going down there and to enter the corners at their own risk should they be below the line in the corners. Or at the very least, come out and announce publicly what the rules are, because it seems like either nobody knows for sure, or they change them based on who's involved in the situation. 429. Paul posted: 09.13.2012 - 10:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "If that's the case, then doesn't this make Jimmy a hypocrite for always saying that it's the drivers' faults for Talladega wrecks and not the track, yet he pretty much changed the rules that makes it harder for drivers to stay off one another?" Disregard that statement. I didn't see cjs' post until just now. Also cjs, I know that McDowell got to 23rd simply because he finished the race, but I just wanted to give him credit for finishing in PPR equipment period. 430. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.13.2012 - 10:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Personally, I'd rather root for a wolf in wolves' clothing like Villeneuve or Kurt Busch than a wolf in sheep's clothing like McDowell or even Allgaier, because at least then what you see is what you get." I agree with this. WYSIWYG folks have my respect more than the phonies (Carl alert). Of course for those that take it too far, like the Busch Boys, I won't root for them no matter what they present publically. But at least I can respest the fact that they basically just come out and say "Hey, we are a couple of first class assholes". "Jimmy Spencer. He couldn't keep his mouth shut" That right there sums up his entire career. I always though him and Kurt deserved each other. Like Kyle and Harvick. Btw, speaking of Harvick, since he didn't win this race, that is the 7th time already in his career that a calendar year has passed without him winning a Cup race. This includes the three that passed between his Daytona 500 win and his next win. A career not even 12 years old. Even Michael Waltrip won quicker after both of his 500 wins. 431. cjs3872 posted: 09.13.2012 - 11:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I can't agree more about letting the drivers run down on the apron on the plate tracks ifwant to, or need to, and force them to make the decision on when to go up onto the track for the turns. After all, on the 1.5 and 2 mile tracks where there's an apron, they're allowed to race down there, so why not on the plate tracks? I've always thought that was a dumb rule and knew that the OB line would only lead to more crashes, and it triggered more crashes almost instantly. For instance, both huge crashes at Daytona in 2002 was caused by the OB line, including the 18-car pile-up at the three-quarter mark of the 2002 Daytona 500 that decimated the field, as well as the incident that cost both Jeff Gordon and Sterling Marlin a chance to win the Daytona 500 that year. The OB line rule was a knee-jerk reaction to the events of the 2001 Daytona 500, and that qualifying race I mentioned three days before the '01 Daytona 500, wen one driver gained four spots by short-cutting the tri-oval. 432. 18fan posted: 09.13.2012 - 11:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I may be wrong on this, but I think it was Jimmy Spencer who went on the apron in 2001 in the qualifying race at Daytona. 433. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.14.2012 - 12:09 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Stupid NFL Network. Thanks to them I missed the chance to watch Jay Cutler get sacked 50 times live. Yeah the replays of him going down then pouting at his linemen (who in all fairness REALLY suck) are nice, but it would have been so much cooler live. 434. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.14.2012 - 12:18 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I can't remember who it was that went on the apron but it wouldn't surprise me one bit if it were Spencer who then turned around 2 months later and whined like crazy about Magic Shoes racing down there. Don't know if it was him, but that would be classic Spencer. Its amazing how almost everything that happened in 2001 Speedweeks has all but been wiped from history. Replays from any part of it are never shown and nobody ever talks about it. Excpet the Waltrip Brothers of course. 435. 18fan posted: 09.14.2012 - 12:18 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Even better about the NFL Network, they will be airing a "Top 10 Things We Love About Tim Tebow". 436. Paul posted: 09.14.2012 - 12:53 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well guys, I just went back and watched both 2001 Twin 125 races, and I can tell you that Jimmy Spencer did in fact make it 4-wide coming to the start-finish line, but he was not the one that eliminated teammate Todd Bodine from the Daytona 500. They were in different races, so they couldn't have come across each other anyways. It was Dave Blaney who made it an astonishing 5-wide going into turn 1 on the final lap of the 2nd race. He had a huge run on Todd and went to the apron to avoid running into him, but as he entered the corner his car slid up and into Todd's. Amazingly, nobody crashed, but it knocked Todd back from about 7th to 17th and the transfer position was 14th. Also, had the yellow line rule been in effect, we would have seen two different outcomes of those races. In the 1st race, Dale Earnhardt on the final lap restart got a huge jump on the field, but Sterling Marlin caught him coming down the backstretch and passed him on the apron as Dale forced him all the way down the track. Then in the 2nd race, Mike Skinner had the same thing happen to him with Dale Earnhardt, Jr. passing him below the line, but luckily for Mike he had drafting help from Ward Burton and wound up beating Junior by 0.004 seconds. Its interesting to think that had that rule been in effect then, Dale Earnhardt would have won the last race he finished (but then again, he may not have crashed at all had the rule been in effect 3 days later) and RCR would become the only team to sweep the Gatorade Duels. Not having the yellow line rule and an improved aero package on the restrictor plate tracks made them probably the greatest Twin 125 races of all time. 437. 18fan posted: 09.14.2012 - 12:58 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Thanks Paul for clarifying for everybody. I was referring to Spencer going 4-wide at the start-finish line, but I also do remember Blaney's 5-wide move, but I forgot who he affected with that move. 438. cjs3872 posted: 09.14.2012 - 1:17 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Paul, how do we know that Spencer's move did not eliminate Bodine from the Daytona 500, because that driver that Jimmy Spencer dropped out of a transfer spot may have been the driver who's time was fast enough to knock Bodine out of the 500 that year. But the whole point was that NASCAR did not like the idea of drivers short-cutting the course, especially in the tri-oval, hence the rule change for the races at Talladega that spring. That move that Spencer made was similar to one that Darrell Waltrip made to win a qualifying race in 1981, which was probably the greatest race, regardless of distance, in the history of Daytona (25 lead changes in 50 laps among Waltrip, Benny Parsons, A.J. Foyt, Richard Petty, and Bill Elliott). And again, what's the difference between short-cutting the course at Daytona and Talladega and short-cutting it this coming weekend at Chicago, except for the legality of it at Chicago and the othe mid-sized tracks. 439. Paul posted: 09.14.2012 - 2:28 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs, Spencer finished 5th in that race so unless he passed 10 cars on the apron (which I don't think he did, it looked like 5-7 at the most) then his passing below the line didn't have any effect on Todd's transfer spot in the 2nd Duel race. Rick Mast finished 15th in the 1st Duel and missed the race and there were only 17 cars in that lead draft, so I don't think it had any effect on Todd at all. And even if it did, Todd lost about 10 positions in the last lap of the 2nd Duel race because of a bold move made by Dave Blaney that caused Todd to get out of the throttle and wound up missing the race because of it. So I think that had more to do with him missing the Daytona 500 than what Spencer did. At the end of the 1st Duel race, there was a humorous moment between Earnhardt and Gordon as they discussed the last lap. Gordon was behind Earnhardt on the outside and Earnhardt asked Gordon after the race why he didn't go with him when he went down to block Sterling Marlin. I got a kick out of because in that one little soundbite, it was clear that their driving styles couldn't have been any more different. Gordon wasn't going to take any risks and was willing to just come home with a top 5 (wound up finishing 6th thanks to Spencer), while Earnhardt was willing to win at all costs (even if it meant driving halfway across the race track to block someone). Also, there's a trivia question right there: Who was the last driver seen on-screen with Dale Earnhardt in a post-race interview? None other than the man who took the torch away from The Intimidator himself, Jeff Gordon. In my mind, the two greatest NASCAR drivers of all time, together one last time. 440. Paul posted: 09.14.2012 - 2:48 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) And cjs, you have a point about tracks like Chicagoland where drivers go below the white line without the risk of a penalty. I started seeing that last year during qualifying and noticed that pretty much every driver went below the white line coming to the start/finish line. If you remember, Kyle Busch qualified for a Truck race at Talladega in 2010 while driving on the apron the entire lap and qualified 12th, with a lap that was faster than his practice speeds. And Jeff Gordon won the pole at Talladega this past spring while running entirely on the yellow line. So there is quite a bit of speed down on the very bottom of the track, but I think it should be legal everywhere because it would eliminate the need for drivers/teams to question whether they'd be allowed to go below the yellow line (such as to avoid a wreck, a slower car, or by being forced down there), and also so they can have more control over what goes on on the track at Daytona and Talladega. They should have the ability to decide whether they want to pull a Dave Blaney or a Jimmy Spencer and try passing below the line, and/or pull a Sterling Marlin and be forced below the line without the risk of a penalty. Also, since you brought up Chicagoland I have a question for everyone. Last year's race had a somewhat controversial ending when cars began running out of fuel and lapped car J.J. Yeley pushed an out-of-fuel Matt Kenseth across the start/finish line on the final lap. Matt was penalized to the last car on the lead lap because of this. I can't remember if the rule is that you can't push a car that's out of fuel, or that you just can't on the last lap (yet another rule that's confusing for the fans), but do you guys think that NASCAR should change that rule and allow drivers to push each other when one driver runs out of fuel? It's kind of confusing to me since they let drivers bump draft each other on the restrictor plate tracks and even on some of the high-speed tracks like Michigan and Atlanta. I think they should get rid of the rule and let drivers at least push each other back to the pits. Jimmie Johnson was going to push Jeff Gordon back to the pits at Martinsville, but was called off in fear of being penalized. So what I'm asking is a.) what is the current rule on pushing drivers who are out of fuel, and b.) would you change the current rule to allow them to push each other, under green or yellow? 441. cjs3872 posted: 09.14.2012 - 4:19 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Actually Paul, the rule against cars pushing others under caution came about this year because there were instances where drivers were cutting their engine off and having teammates or others push them around under caution. The famous instance of this came in the Coca-Cola 600 last year when Kevin Harvick was shutting his engine off and having his RCR teammates push him around the track. There were other instances of this last year, so NASCAR outlawed that practice for this year. As for not being able to be pushed on the last lap, that's always been the rule. In fact, that rule was invoked in perhaps the most famous finish in NASCAR history, the 1976 Daytona 500. Everyone remembers that last turn crash between Richard Petty and David Pearson. What people don't remember is that Petty never actually completed the last lap, because after Pearson crossed the finish line, members of Petty's crew pushed the car across the line. As a result, Petty's final lap was not scored. Neil Bonnett also officially did not finish the 1980 Daytona 500 because his car was pushed by Don Whittington after his engine blew under caution. The rule has always been that a car must finish the final lap unassisted. The only exceptions to this rule are the case of bump, or push drafting, where this rule can't possibly be enforced when a fully able car is pushed across the finish line, but if a car is disabled, it must finish the final lap unassisted, or it's final lap is not scored. Of course, crashes are also disregarded where this rule is concerned, as wrecked cars can be pushed, or knocked across the finish line (such as the Ricky Stenhouse-Carl Edwards situation at Iowa last year when Stenhouse's engine blew coming off the last corner and Edwards knocked him over the finish line). 442. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.14.2012 - 7:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) You Know what I would do for the race at Chicagoland put the roof strip from the 2000 winston 500 on the top of the cars and increase the downforce on the cars to make for some better racing there. 443. cjs3872 posted: 09.14.2012 - 11:37 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I've been saying that for more than a year, Benjamin. By dirtying up the air, you can make it so that the draft can be effective at tracks such as Chicago, Charlotte, Texas, as well as the tracks 2 miles and longer, such as Michigan, Auto Club Speedway, Pocono, and Indy, and putting that roof strip on the cars would do just that. Just look at some of the races from the 70s and 80s at Charlotte, Michigan, Pocono, and the old Ontario Motor Speedway, which was a wider, faster copy of the Indianapolis Motor Speedway. Many of those races were great races because drafting was a key element with those particular cars. But when the '83 T-Bird got some horsepower in 1985, you saw just what an areodynamic edge that car had. So much in fact, that NASCAR had to allow window extenders on existing GM models for 1986, which negated a lot of the drafting effects, even at Daytona and Talladega, just so that the older GM cars could be competitve with the Fords, as well as the Oldsmobiles and Buicks, which came out with new models with the slant-back windows in 1986. 444. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.14.2012 - 1:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Can you imagine if a manufacturer tried to submit a model as radical commpared to the rest of the competition as the '83 TBird? Helton and Darby woould laugh them out of the joint. 445. cjs3872 posted: 09.14.2012 - 5:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Has anyone noticed that, since NASCAR has taken away some of what teams could do regarding the rear end of their cars beginning this week, that Jeff Gordon has suddenly found himself near the top of the board at Chicago? To me, this is more evidence that, unlike the rest of the Hendrick cars, they weren't tinkering with the trick rear end setup nearly as much as his teammates were, if they were tinkering with it at all. And also note that Kasey Kahne has not practiced nearly as well today, and was terrible at Atanta, and the sane goes for Dale Earnhardt, Jr. He has not practiced well today, either and didn't run that well at Atlanta, either. And even Jimmie Johnson struggled early today before moving up to third. I wonder if some of this regarding the #5, #24, and #88 cars have sonething to do with the trick setups they were running, or in the case of the #24 team, were likely not running. That tells me that Alan Gustafson knew something like this might be happening, and decided not to run those setups, since they weren't going to be legal for very long. And Tony Stewart is suddenly doing well today, which tells me he may not have been running those setups, either. If my hunch is right, Gordon and Stewart may be bigger factors in the Chase than I thought they'd be, because their teams may not have to adjust to the new rules as much as some of the others. And if you give Gordon and Stewart anywhere close to a level playing field, they can make up the rest. 446. murb posted: 09.14.2012 - 6:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I do remember the Jimmy Spencer/Mike McLaughlin thing. It was in the 2001 Busch Series race at Talladega. McLaughlin ended up winning it, and Jimmy then gave his idiotic "Jimmy Spencer Never Forgets" rant when he was interviewed about it. I think he also was pissed off at Todd Bodine in that race too. Typical Mr. Excitement being a jerkoff. 447. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.14.2012 - 6:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) CJS I have to give you a lot of credit for what I typed on Post 442 because all of your ideas you have talked about for the past year is trying to improve the racing on the intermediate tracks. 448. cjs3872 posted: 09.14.2012 - 7:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wel Benjamin, considering that most of the races now are on 1.5-2.5 mile tracks, if NASCAR wanted to improve the quality of racing, they need to find ways to incorporate drafting back to where it's a factor. Some of the greatest races in NASCAR history were not at Daytona, Talladega, or the short tracks, but rather on the intermediates in the 1970s and early 80s, when drafting at those places was important. After all, back then, it was not uncommon to see 40 or more lead changes at Michigan, Charlotte, and Pocono. Even the Ontario Motor Speedway, which was a faster, wider duplicate of Indy, had great races, as all but one of the nine races there had at least 20 lead changes, seven races had 25 or more lead changes, and five of the nine had 30 or more lead changes, and four had 35 or more lead changes, with a high of 39 occurring in 1974, a year where numerous races set records for lead changes, including both Daytona races, 37 in 1977, 36 in 1972, and 35 in 1979. 1979 was another year that saw races set lead change records that still stand, including the 54 lead changes in the World 600 at Charlotte (won by Darrell Waltrip) and 56 at Pocono (a race won by Cale Yarborough). Can you imagine a Brickyard 400 with drafting happening all day and 30 or more lead changes? That would bring the fans back to that race faster than anything. And Richard Petty won the two most competitve races at Michigan. One was a race in 1974 with 50 lead changes (in 180 laps, and what was it about 1974 and races with record numbers of lead changes?) and the other was in 1981, when Petty won a race at Michigan with an incredible 65 lead changes (on average, one every third lap). In other words, if racing with anywhere near that kind of competition ever resurfaces, no fan of the sport is ever going to have to worry about empty seats, because there won't be any if that kind of racing returns. 449. MStall41 posted: 09.14.2012 - 9:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You and I are totally on the same paqe with the drafting argument cjs, and i honestly believe that is something NASCAR may take a look at at some point (hopefully). 450. cjs3872 posted: 09.14.2012 - 10:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) A lot of other fans hope so, too MStall41. However, one problem with being able to draft is that the cars today make too much horsepower. Even if you dirty up the air, the cars today make so much horsepower that they have the power to break the draft. Back in the 1970s and early 80s, when drafting was at it's absolute peak, the cars made about 600-630 horsepower, but now they make as much horsepower as the IndyCar engines of the early 1970s made (before pop-off valves were installed after the tragic 1973 Indianapolis 500), about 900 horsepower, and that power can easily break the draft, along with the aerodynamics of the cars not allowing the cars to race closer together, and there may just not be anything NASCAR can do about it, other than use restrictors of some kind to reduce horsepower at the mid-size tracks, or to reduce the size of the engines. The problem with that is that the cars will be able to run wide open on all those tracks, except for Indianapolis, Pocono, and maybe Auto Club Speedway, which reduces the role of the drivers even more, and NASCAR has always wanted the drivers to have a big role in what happens during a race. But that's another reason they need to bring drafting back to what it once was, because that puts another element of decision back into the driver's hands. 451. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.15.2012 - 7:12 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) How about we reduce the horsepower back to the 600-630 range and try to take aerodynamics out of the equation by putting a mid 1970's to early 1980's body style on the cars. 452. cjs3872 posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:50 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) The only way to reduce horsepower by that much would be to go to a smaller engine or run a restrictor plate. But again, doing that would take the element of the driver out of the equation, because the drivers would then be able to flat-foot it all the way around many of the mid-size tracks because straightaway speeds would be slower than turn speeds are now. 453. David posted: 09.15.2012 - 12:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Lost in all the news about Jeff Gordon's revival of "The 'Stache" is that Alan Gustafson shaved his head as part of the same bet. 454. ch posted: 07.16.2013 - 8:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sponsor for the #30 should be Swan Racing, as the team transferred over from Inception. 455. ch posted: 07.18.2013 - 3:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #26 Sponsor: MDS Transport (consistent with all 2012/2013 starts) ------------------------------------------------------------------------ *Post a comment:* Your comment may not appear immediately - all comments must be approved by the moderator. Name: Comment: