|| *Comments on the 2012 GEICO 400:* View the most recent comment <#349> | Post a comment <#post> 1. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 3:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Just give him the trophy. 2. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 09.15.2012 - 3:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) What a terrible place to start the chase. 3. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 3:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Also, VERY pleasantly surprised and pleased by ESPN's prerace show. No Cup guy interiews, and they interviewed Johanna and not "hometown girl" (who loves Illinois so much she moved to Arizona as quick as possible). Btw, love how Johanna got all the deserved praise for her run at Richmond last week, so this week the driver of the heavily sponsored mid pack green car gave interviews to every media outlet in sight about her "hometown race". I knew the Hype Machine wouldn't be happy about another female doing well in contemporary racing. I just hope they never Google the names "Ashley Force" or "Erica Enders". They will flip out. 4. Jim Davis posted: 09.15.2012 - 3:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Why doesn't Long ever mention her sponsor? That's NASCAR interviewing 101. 5. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 4:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dale Earnhardt totally would have made that 3 wide on corner entry and made it work for himself, not wait until he had the safety of the wide frontstretch to go 3 wide then totally screw it up anyways. I just thought I'd mention that to Mr Dillon. You wanna drive that black #3 and "carry on the legacy"? Then prepare for many comments like that one. You are opening yourself up to some damning comparisons. Especially with your conservative racing. 6. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 4:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Man I can't stand Marty Ried. And I REALLY can't stand Joey Logano. Why did Brad recommend him so highly? And why didn't The Captain tell him "I appreciate your input, but we are gonna hire a real driver for the #22 car"? Is Brad impressed that Joey has spent 4 consecutive years recreating Brad's 2010 season (dominant on Saturdays, invisible on Sundays)? Ugh. 7. Jordan posted: 09.15.2012 - 4:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It appears the ESPN Nationwide coverage has done a complete 180 and now covers Johanna Long, even when she is performing poorly. I imagine people will be complaining about this, as they complain about their similar coverage of Danica Patrick. 8. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 4:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I know this has nothing to do anything, but I must say: that John Clayton commercial was freaking hilarious. 9. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 4:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Allgaier strikes again. 10. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.15.2012 - 4:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mark Martin has got to be NASCAR's version of the Buffalo Bills. 11. MarkMartinFan posted: 09.15.2012 - 4:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I love the fact ESPN is finally covering Johanna Long. She's done really well this year and deserves to get some exposure. On another note, 13 start and parks for the Nationwide race? That's insane. 12. Mr X posted: 09.15.2012 - 4:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, one of my wishes for 2013 is for Joey Logano to fall flat on his face, I've never liked him but after I read that he was apparently insulted by not being offered a full time ride at JGR for 2013 I now just have more reason not to like him. I sincerely hope that he gets trailered by Brad and get fired and replaced by a massively improved Sam Hornish Jr. 13. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.15.2012 - 5:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) i mentioned this on last week's race page, but at richmond (in the cup race) hornish finished 11th and logano was 4 laps down in about 28th, which is about what his average finish will be next year too. 14. Paul posted: 09.15.2012 - 5:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Looks like Allgaier got a taste of his own medicine via Michael Annett. 15. Paul posted: 09.15.2012 - 5:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Whoever that was that came over Austin Dillon's radio transmission should do that more often. After Austin backed off Logano for 2nd, he moved over and let teammate Elliott Sadler pass him for 3rd. I think it was his crew chief Danny Stockman that said "don't you let that #2 car pass you," and suddenly Austin passed Sadler back. The problem I see with Austin is that he avoids contact with other drivers (not literally, but he doesn't like being side-by-side). He needs to have that attitude of passing cars more often if he wants to win this championship. 16. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 6:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dang, they finally give Johanna the coverage she deserves and she has perhaps her worst non Bristol race of the year. Oh well, she finished better than it was looking at one point. Twas a valiant effort by Kyle, but The House won (I won't rest until that becomes a popular saying). Ricky is the most exciting driver to watch in all of NASCAR (with the exception of a motivated Smoke). He just drives the shit outta that car, out driving Kyle at the end. It works to his detriment at times, but it is always fun. Is he gonna make is work? Is he gonna fall flat on his face trying something like at Montreal? You have to stay tuned. He is the new Ernie Irvan, who was also entertaining as hell. Watching him drive the piss outta that famous Roush #6 made famous by the conservative Mark Martin and watching Austin drive so conservatively in the famous RCR black #3 is mind bendingly backwards. 17. Jordan posted: 09.15.2012 - 6:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) So how well will Stenhouse do in Cup next year? I say he's about 15th in points after 26th races with a win and sneaks into the chase, where he proceeds to finish around 8th or 9th in points while picking up another win. 18. Daniel posted: 09.15.2012 - 6:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) In using fastest 43: #23 Scott Riggs, #37 J.J. Yeley, #49 Jason Leffler, #91 Reed Sorenson Out using fastest 43: #10 Danica Patrick, #32 T.J. Bell, #36 Dave Blaney, #38 David Gilliland 19. 10andJoe posted: 09.15.2012 - 6:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) >Why doesn't Long ever mention her sponsor? That's NASCAR interviewing 101. I /think/ Foretravel Motorcoach is owned by the same folks who own her team. It's not really a sponsor. I could be wrong though. Also, good to see Almirola back on the front row. 20. Matt G posted: 09.15.2012 - 6:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If I was building a Cup track and wanted to make the racing as boring as possible, I would probably come up with something pretty close to this one. It's not as bad a the anti-Christ of racetracks known as Kentucky, but it still ranks quite high on the "Suck Meter". 21. murb posted: 09.15.2012 - 7:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think Ricky Stenhouse will do a decent job next year. ROTY without a doubt (if he's even eligible - I think he is). But I still think he has a lot to learn if he wants to be a top five Cup driver over the next decade. DSFF made a good comparison between him and Ernie. Hopefully he'll realize that he may need to calm down a little bit, a lot like Ernie did there in the early 90s. The Cup race should be interesting. Jimmie is on the pole, but you've got some non-Chase guys in the top ten like Almirola, Edwards, Smith, and Logano. And then there are some Chase guys starting way back like Biffle, Stewart, and Harvick. So it should be a race full of comers and goers, which makes it exciting. Unfortunately, it will probably end up being a fuel mileage derby just like practically all Chicagoland races are. The NNS race was okay. I was impressed by Stenhouse's late charge back up to the front. And for once, KB didn't really complain about giving a race away like that. Bread Keselowski (that's not a typo by the way. Marty Reid actually believes that's his name) did a good job too with a seemingly terrible car. Normally, I would be excited about a race at Iowa, but I'm gonna have to skip out on the Truck race tonight to watch the IndyCar finale at Fontana. Will Power and Ryan Hunter Reay are in a tight points battle, and it can really go either way. Should be a fun rest of the racing weekend!!!! 22. JG24FanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 7:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm hoping Gordon turns another outside the Top 15 start into a win. And in the process spins Jimmie J for it, thus creating a furious rivalry between the two. Truck Quali really sucks BTW. Here's a list of the Mount Rushmore of Cup's total wins from outside the Top 15. (I know Rushmore is Four. So what.) Jeff Gordon 13 Dale Earnhardt 13 Jimmie Johnson 9 Darrell Waltrip 4 Richard Petty 3 Bobby Allison 3 Cale Yarborough 3 David Pearson 1 you gotta like Gordon having as many as Dale, but with 49 more Poles to boot. 23. Paul posted: 09.15.2012 - 7:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's pretty sad when the four drivers who failed to qualify were all among the fastest 43 cars. Another reason to get rid of the top 35 rule. murb, Ricky is eligible for Cup ROTY for next season. He's only made two prior Cup starts, and under the "2011-present" rules, he can run as many Cup races as he wants and still be eligible just as long as he isn't running for Cup points. That's why Trevor Bayne is still eligible for Cup ROTY should he ever run for Cup points. As far as I'm concerned, he's already won the award as his only competition will be Danica and possibly Brian Scott. DSFF, in Austin's defense, his driving style is perfect for the present day RCR team (Really Conservative Racing). I'm really impressed by how much Ricky has improved as a driver since 2010. Before, he was very aggressive and wrecked a lot of cars. Now, he's still very aggressive, but has his aggressiveness more under control and doesn't tear up race cars anymore. Having Jimmy Fennig as his Cup crew chief next year will be great for him because he'll have veteran leadership to go along with his massive talent. 24. Paul posted: 09.15.2012 - 8:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Haha, Drew Herring just said that the Truck Series puts on the best racing out of all three series. So true. It sounds like Roger Penske is interested in re-hiring A.J. Allmendinger, but didn't specify which series (NASCAR or IndyCar) that he would bring him back in. Ryan Briscoe's been told that he can start looking for a new ride while they look for sponsorship in that #2 IndyCar. It's possible that they may look for sponsors for Allmendinger should the two sides reunite. 25. cjs3872 posted: 09.15.2012 - 8:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Paul, if Dillon doesn't back off and move over at that instant, Childress has two wrecked cars and team anarchy on his hands. Sadler had such a run while Dillon was trapped on the inside of whoever it was he was racing for second, and couldn't get back up the track in time to clearly be in front of Sadler. Dillon made the only decision he could at that instant. The reaction from his team kind of tells you where the attention there is going the rest of the season, regardless of point standings. And I think we saw a graphis demonstration of why there's a chance Roush's Nationwide team, if it runs the full season as planned, may not win a race next year if Trevor Bayne drives the car the entire year, which is the plan at this time. The way Ricky Stenhouse got to get into position to get the win is something that Trevor Bayne, as good as he may be, just doesn't have in him, because he won't take the chances that Stenhouse will. Where Stenhouse is willing to stck his nose in there when the hole is about to close up, Bayne's tendency is to back off and let tyhe guy in front have the spot, and try to pass him later, when the risk is lower. I'm not sure I made this analagy before, but what Roush's Nationwide team may go through next year may very well be the same thing that Junior Johnson's team went through in 1987 when Darrell Waltrip (and Neil Bonnett) was replaced by Terry Labonte. Waltrip was a driver that would take chances to win races (as his 84 wins and three championships proves), while Labonte never would take a chance. He would take second or third over taking a chance at a win that might not pay off. Roush may be in for the same thing next year. Bayne will almost surely go into next year as one of the title favorites (if Roush runs the NNS, which I'm still not entirely sure he'll do), but he may have a hard time finding victory lane if he won't take the chances during the race to get him into position to get him there. And speaking of Stenhouse, if what I heard is true about leaving Jimmy Fennig as his crew chief for next year, that would be a great move, because without a mentor, Stenhouse is likely to crash and burn next year in the Cup series. And while both Greg Biffle and Carl Edwards have said they would try to mentor Stenhouse, it just isn't in them. I believe that's why Roush is leaving Fennig as the crew chief of the #17 car, because putting a guy like Mike Kelley as his crew chief and moving him up with Stenhouse has a great likelyhood of leading to disaster. 26. joey2448 posted: 09.15.2012 - 8:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Anyone watching the Indy Car race at Fontana? 27. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Note to the Indycar drivers have a competitive but safe race 28. JG24FanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) For those that like Drag Racing: Charlotte is this weekend. it will be the first time I won't be there since the inaugural event in 2008. I even went back on Monday for the finals after it got rained out on Sunday in 2010's Four-Wide Nationals. For those that scoff at Drag cars, think about his: The Fuel cars put out 8,000+ HP,and I recently read that Tony Stewart want's to race either the Rail or Funny Car sometime in the future. He said it would complete his bucket list if he did. 29. JG24FanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) joey2448,definately watching the Indy race, seeing the Great Will Power finally get that overwhelmingly deserved first title. John Force: Best Racing Name Will Power: Next Best 30. A-Frame43 posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This is cjs3872's "I don't like Trevor Bayne" comment of the week. Most people that post here and read regularly know you don't like him. Why continue to beat that drum? 31. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Stenthouse's Cup season next year will look a lot like Gordon's rookie year. Run up front a lot, wreck a lot. But it will damn sure be entertaining. 32. joey2448 posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) WILL POWER JUST CRASHED!!!! OOHHH NOOOO!!! That poor guy! 33. murb posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Will Power just crashed away the IndyCar championship. Wow. 34. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Will Power has got to be one of the biggest chokers in all of motorsports. 35. joey2448 posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think Hunter-Reay is still sitting second in points, though. They said he needs to finish sixth in order to take the title away. I hate to comment about the IndyCar race on the NASCAR Cup page, but this is crazy! 36. Sean posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) RHR still needs a top five. That's by no means guaranteed... If Newgarden or de Silvestro come out and beat Power, then RHR could finish 6th. I don't think he's going to pass Hildebrand's laps led total. I still say Power lost last year's title due to bad luck. He got wrecked in the pits while leading handing Dario the points lead, and Dario got a bunch more calls... 2010 was a choke. Having said that, Power's 2010 and 2011 were WAY better than this season, and honestly Hunter-Reay's 2012 has been more impressive. While I think Power deserved it last season and Dario got lucky, it's hard for me to argue Power deserves it this year. RHR's DNFs were mechanicals. Power's had several stupid crashes. 37. Sean posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, now it's 6th RHR needs because Newgarden passed him. 38. cjs3872 posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) A-Frame43, Bayne is more a tactician and technician than he is a fighter, when he's racing. Chris Economaki once made that comment about Terry Labonte at Talladega when he won there in 1989. It fit in regards to Labonte, and from what I've seen, it also fits Bayne. Again, there's nothing wrong with driving conservatively. Benny Parsons made a career of it, and won two of the sport's biggest races and a championship with that style. Labonte won two championships with that style. What I was saying is that Roush's team is not likely to find victory lane very often with Bayne next year, if at all, but Bayne's also likely not to make as many mistakes that Stenhouse has made, but rather accept whatever the situation allows. I think both can be champions, but they would do it in different ways. The proof is in this. When both were competing for the title last year before Bayne had his illness, they put their diametrically different styles to work, and were just a couple of points apart entering Richmond, which was the first race Bayne missed. But Bayne is capable of brilliant moves, as his stealing the NNS race from Carl Edwards on a restart at Texas last fall proves. He just isn't as likely to put his car at risk during the race as much as Stenhouse does. 39. JG24FanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Will Power doesn't have very good Will Power. 40. JG24FanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 9:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wrecking under caution? is this Nascar? 41. JG24FanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 10:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Trying to get Will Powers car back on the track is preposterous. IndyCar seems to blatantly pattern the series after Nascar. Open Wheel cars wreck and that's it. They don't ever return. 42. Sean posted: 09.15.2012 - 10:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) There's usually no incentive to bring IndyCars back on the track because the bottom positions score the same points or close to the same points. This time, there's big incentive since Power CAN gain points... I'm fine with it. 43. JG24FanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 10:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sean,I meant no disrespect. I do actually like it the way it is now. I really Hope Power gets it. You can't really blame him for his mistake, the car was getting away from him from the start. 44. Jordan posted: 09.15.2012 - 10:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Power's car seems dangerously slow, they really shouldn't allow this... 45. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.15.2012 - 10:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) truck race finish is gonna be good. top 3 are ryan blaney, cale gale, and ty dillon. 46. JG24FanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 10:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jordan, yeah, Power shouldn't be on the track. 47. murb posted: 09.15.2012 - 10:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) So I just switched over to the Truck race... JEFF CHOQUETTE IS RUNNING 5TH??????? I can't remember where he ran his first race, but wherever it was, he was extremely impressive. He ran top ten in it. It will be a shame if a big team doesn't give him at least a development deal. 48. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.15.2012 - 10:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) poor ryan blaney, that idiot todd bodine will probably wreck him on the restart. 49. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.15.2012 - 10:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) why is the truck series points lead always like a game of "hot patoto" late in the season? 4 of the top five in points entering tonight have had issues tonight, and it isn't over yet. 50. murb posted: 09.15.2012 - 10:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Ryan Blaney!!!! Awesome job!!!! 51. Paul posted: 09.15.2012 - 10:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Ryan Blaney becomes the youngest winner in Truck Series history and gives BKR its 1st Truck Series win. 52. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.15.2012 - 10:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) and ty dillon takes the points lead by 8 points over second place. 53. Baker posted: 09.15.2012 - 10:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Blaney!!!!!!!!!!!!! Love it! 54. JG24FanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 11:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's looking like an American may win the Indy Crown! Totally contradicting my enthusiasm for Power. 55. Jordan posted: 09.15.2012 - 11:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I wanted RHR to win all along, but this situation has been totally handed to him. Power crashed out, then Tagliani crashed out late to give him the 5th position. He's been slow all race and would have never got to the top 5 had Tagliani not crashed. 56. JG24FanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 11:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) RHR looked wicked good before Kanaan's crash. Michael Andretti is very emotional right now because apparently they "changed the rules in the middle of the game" according to him. 57. Schroeder51 posted: 09.15.2012 - 11:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hunter-Reay is the champion as Sato wrecks on the last lap of a 500 mile race AGAIN. And Ed Carpenter wins his 2nd career race! 58. JG24FanForever posted: 09.15.2012 - 11:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Will Power joins Lewis Hamilton(in 2007) as the biggest championship chokes of all-time. To be fair, Hamilton(F1)was a rookie. I love Michael Andretti, so this is very sweet to see him take the title. 59. Jordan posted: 09.15.2012 - 11:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) RHR was dropping back, I thought Castroneves was going to play the role of spoiler but Takuma Tsunami makes that a moot point. Congrats to RHR and Andretti! 60. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 12:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) RHR is the first Sun Drop Sponsored Champion since Big E in 1994. 61. joey2448 posted: 09.16.2012 - 12:01 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) WOW what a championship battle tonight in Fontana!!! A yank wins the title (yay!) but at Will Power's expense (Damn!). Just incredible! And now the NASCAR championship battle begins tomorrow! 62. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.16.2012 - 12:03 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Will Power is indycar's version of Mark Martin 63. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 12:07 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) and like Mark Martin he's man enough to accept defeat and congratulate the Champ. 64. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 09.16.2012 - 12:07 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hell of a job by Ryan Blaney to win the Truck race tonight in Brad's truck. 65. Schroeder51 posted: 09.16.2012 - 12:10 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) With Blaney winning the Truck race, it's the first time in NASCAR's top 3 series I've seen someone younger than me win a race. I feel older all the time... 66. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.16.2012 - 12:13 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) great day for underdogs in motorsports, stenhouse keeps kyle busch out of victory lane in a non-cup race, 18 year old ryan blaney wins the truck race in his 3rd series start, and rookie ty dillon inherits the point lead tom hessert gets an arca victory driving for ken schrader's team, and owner / driver ed carpenter gets the usa into victory lane (and keeps franchitti out) and hunter-reay becomes the first american open wheel champ since sam hornish a few years ago. 67. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 12:19 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Schroeder51,the first time someone younger than me won in Nascar's National series was Kyle Busch way back in 2004. So I feel old myself now that you mention it. 68. cjs3872 posted: 09.16.2012 - 12:47 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) And joey2448, if Jimmie Johnson dominates and wins at Chicago, it might also end tomorrow, because that will effectively defeat everyone else after just the first race, at least mentally. However, there's a potential problem for HMS, as Dale, Jr.'s has changed engines, meaning he'll start at the back. Could this be the start of another bad weekend for Hendrick engines? Remember that the last time this happened, when Jimmie Johnson had an engine change before Michigan, three other Hendrick engines failed, including Johnson's while leading with six laps remaining. And speaking of the IndyCar championship, there's a reason why Roger Penske tried to sign Ryan Hunter-Reay away from Andretti, and that is that Hunter-Reay actually thrives under pressure, unlike Will Power, who chokes every time he's under pressure. There's a reason why Penske's only real chance at the Indianapolis 500 is Helio Castroneves. Castroneves would never have made the mistake that Power made, and Ryan Briscoe's just as bad under pressure. Castroneves is the only driver Penske has that can win at Indy, meaning that untkil Penske gets another driver that doesn't constantly choke under pressure, he'll never win the title again, if it comes down to the final race, since Castroneves is a driver that will never win the title. And by the way, there's a connection between the drivers that won all three major races today, and that's a background in dirt racing. Ricky Stenhouse, Jr. and Ed Carpenter started in USAC, and Ryan Blaney, who's father Dave won both a USAC Silver Crown (1984) and World of Outlaws (1995) championship, also raced on dirt, where Ryan, I believe started his career before switching to ashpalt. I wonder what that could mean for the Cup race at Chicago? Might we see another driver with a dirt racing background, such as Carl Edwards, Tony Stewart, Jeff Gordon, or Jimmie Johnson win the Cup race? 69. Sean posted: 09.16.2012 - 12:54 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) At this point I will say Power is a choker, but I'll also add that he's terrible on ovals and IndyCar traditionally insists on an oval finale. If it was like CART back in the '90s when the finale was at Laguna Seca, Power would win the title every year as he would not give up points in the season finale. 2011 he solely lost to bad luck and Dario getting better calls than Will did. He got wrecked in the pits by Ana Beatriz in Kentucky despite making a crazy comeback in the second half of 2011 after Dario wrecked him at Toronto which seemed like it was going to decide the title. If he was a real and total choker, he would have completely given up at that point. Getting wrecked in the pits is NOT CHOKING. Power did not choke the 2011 title. He did choke the other two, but RHR did have a lot of luck today. I agree he'll never win an Indy 500, but it's because he can't drive an oval to save his life, not because he cracks under pressure (if he cracked under pressure he wouldn't win at Long Beach either...) 70. Paul posted: 09.16.2012 - 12:54 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Schroeder51, it's the first time a driver younger than me won in NASCAR's top 3 series as well. The previous closest was the last Truck race when Ty Dillon (who's nine months older than me) won the race. 71. Sean posted: 09.16.2012 - 12:57 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I just can't buy this argument that certain drivers are DESTINED to win things and certain drivers aren't for the most part. To be honest, Dario looked much like a choker to me in his CART days (losing the 1999 title to JPM for instance) and then suddenly later in his career he developed a steady consistency. Who's to say the same won't happen with Power? If he even improves to MEDIOCRE on the ovals, he should be the favorite to win every title. 72. Mr X posted: 09.16.2012 - 1:14 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm absolutely stunned and terrified as I just learned that I'm 9 months older then Ryan Blaney. Why couldn't my dad be a race car driver!?! 73. Spen posted: 09.16.2012 - 1:32 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) On the Cup side at least, I believe the first time a race winner was younger than me was Bobby Hillin in '86. 74. Jordan posted: 09.16.2012 - 1:35 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) @69. The California race would have still happened though, you can't automatically say Power would have won the title. It could have even had a worse outcome for him, as he could fail at the oval race anyway and choke under pressure at a road course finale. RHR deserves the title because he is better all-around and when Power takes the oval tracks seriously, maybe he will win one himself. 75. Sean posted: 09.16.2012 - 1:39 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I agree Ryan Hunter-Reay was more deserving THIS season. He won more races, Power drove much worse than the last two seasons making stupid on-track errors, and RHR's problems were generally NOT self-inflicted (mechanical failures, getting punted by Tagliani at Sonoma) while Power's were. However, I think Power was more deserving than Franchitti LAST season and I felt he was even robbed last year based on some of the crap Dario got away with. That's why I was rooting for Power, but I agree that he didn't deserve it as this was a worse year for him than the last two, which is very bizarre since there were fewer ovals but he seemed to drive worse on them. 76. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Did Will really lose it again? Jeez. Congrats to RHR. 77. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:23 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) And yes it is awesome knowing the Sun Drop car is champ. Although I can't stand the stuff, when I think of it, I think of Dale. 78. Robert Nelson posted: 09.16.2012 - 9:37 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Even though I hate the top 35 rule, at least it takes 4 Start-N-Parkers out of the race and puts 4 full-racers (36 may SnP though) into the race. I wonder if Danica will be able to keep her car in the top 35 next year, because if she slips out of the top 35 in points, she could easily be missing races, only twice in 6 starts has she qualified inside the top 37. 79. Dave#38Fan posted: 09.16.2012 - 9:49 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) but robert nelson, you can't deny that the 4 start and parks who missed the field deserved to be in the race than the 4 that got bumped out for. if you're not fast enough to get in on speed, then you shouldn't race, period. and don't worry about danica missing races, they'll pull a paul menard at daytona 2010 (in the nns race in February, qualifying was rained out and paul menard had only ran like 8 races the year before and was about 54th in owners points and would have missed the race, until the 8 cars ahead of him "withdrew" from the race and menard got in). there was never in doubt that john menard bought them out so that his son could race. 80. RaceFanX posted: 09.16.2012 - 11:15 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Start and parks shouldn't be in the race period, a race with 37 real entries is better than one with 43 and a few fake ones. You don't see start-and-parks in IndyCar or Grand-Am. 81. Jordan posted: 09.16.2012 - 12:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I've never understood how the series can make claims like "43 of the world's best racers" when only 30-35 actually race on a given weekend. I have ZERO sympathy towards teams who enter races just so they can collect paychecks. 82. murb posted: 09.16.2012 - 1:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sort of random here, but the Sprint Cup Championship trophy is so pathetic looking. It seriously looks like the same size as a regular race win trophy. The old Winston Cup one actually looked like a CHAMPIONSHIP. 83. cjs3872 posted: 09.16.2012 - 1:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) RaceFanX, this goes back to the TV contract NASCAR signed in 1999 which took effect in 2001 that requires a full field of 43 cars for the Cup series, or NASCAR doesn't get half the TV money for that weekend. Back when that contract was signed, full fields weren't a problem. In fact, so many good cars were going home on shorter tracks that NASCAR expnded the field to 43 for all Cup races midway through the 1997 season. And let's not forget that there were effectively two S&P's in this year's Indianapolis 500. 84. Mr X posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm thrilled that TSN2 has decided to air some delayed womens golf as opposed to the chase opener. 85. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nice to see the drivers sawing at the wheel and hopping up and down in the car. I thought Chicago was supposed to suck, it seems to have pretty good character. 86. Paul posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Almirola's held his own thus far. He led the first 3 laps and just regained 2nd place. The driver swap between the 9 and 43 teams seems to be working for him. 87. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) is it me or are we watching commercials 10 minutes for every 5 of racing? 88. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Terrible coverage, but at leat unlike the Canadians we get to actually watch it. TSN is a joke just like it's US sister so not a suprise. 89. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Danica stayed on the lead lap for 34 laps! Way to go! 90. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) racefanx, if not for TEAM money you would see start and parks in Indycar. All but 2 DP teams in Grand Am are subsidised to race there by NASCAR. 91. John Royal posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Oh lord I wish they ditch this track. 92. joey2448 posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Just realized my landlord has payed extra for DirecTV to show NASCAR Hotpass. I can watch Junior, Danica, Hamlin or Stewart's in-car camera. Score! 93. murb posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Congratulations Chicagoland. You've proved yourself. You now get to stay in my top five of least favorite tracks. 94. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brad moving up fast, nervous and excited. #BradIn2012 95. Paul posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This track looks like it's really fun to race on because of the multiple grooves and wide corners, but it's just a snooze to watch. If they can find a way to make drafting more important on these cars without reducing horsepower too much, I think this track is salvageable. 96. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff is 6th already. If he finishes this week like he finished last week, the winner will lap the field for the first time since 1994! #nopressureJefflol 97. Jordan posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) A debris caution... there NASCAR goes helping Hendrick out again! 98. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) tv caution out. 99. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The first of many boredom cautions we will see today. Really wish they'd can some of these boring Mid Western tracks and replace them with the exciting Mid Western tracks. #Iowa 100. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) almirola given his lap back because nascar reviewed his penalty and realized that he did NOT have a pit road violation after all. 101. Paul posted: 09.16.2012 - 2:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Haha, NASCAR just threw a caution so Almirola could get his lap back after further review that his team did not commit a pit road penalty. Didn't they do that for Earnhardt at Charlotte one year? 102. Paul posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, I like how they split the weekend between Iowa and Chicago. The racing last night was fantastic. Hopefully they take the hint and swap one Midwestern track for another. 103. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) They gave Big E his lap back at The Rock. 104. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Rockingham '95. Seeing as how he only lost the title by 34 points after being down 304 with 4 races left, can you imagine if he had won it? Rainbow Nation would still be going nuts (like me about '89 actually). 105. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Attention NASCAR. When you have to throw 2 boredom cautions in the first 100 laps, you might wanna consider other tracks. #IowaDamnit 106. murb posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This ranks up there with Kentucky as a commercial-fest. The Danica and Dale Jr Nationwide commercial is getting on my last nerve. 107. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon's '96 season in wins: Darlington sweep Dover sweep(Both were 500 miles) North Wilksboro(Final race) Fall Martinsville Spring Bristol Dead of Winter Richmond June Pocono Talladega(Big E's crash ruined 2 full seasons and the rest of '96) I'm sorry but it doesn't matter that Terry scored 37 more points. I'd rather have 8 more wins especially when you win at all 4 of the Short Tracks and sweep Both Dover and Darlington. 108. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon has the greatest Modern: Championship season in 1998 Runner-up in 1996 3rd place in 2004 4th place in 2002(Bristol Night and Southern 500 back-back,and He beat JJ!) Does anybody have a better fit for 4th? 109. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Does anybody have a better fit for 4th?" Harry Gant in 1991 110. Paul posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think Gordon's 4th place finish in '03 was more impressive than in '02. He had a horrible August, having four straight finishes of 28th or worse, and ended the season with 7 top fives in the final 9 races, including 2 wins at Martinsville Atlanta (becoming the 1st driver since Fred Lorenzen in '64 to sweep both Martinsville poles and races). 111. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon's '02 for me gets the nod because of the Bristol and Southern 500 wins. 112. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) They are still blaming Rogers for the Richmond collapse (aka Kyle Busch Cup Series Meltdown VIII: The '12 edition). I still blame Kyle for shutting down. He simply does not have the heart of a champion. Jeff does and THAT was the difference. 113. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I agree Kyle gave up. He had the Chase made. all he had to do was drive up just a few positions and he didn't have the heart. Not the Crew Chiefs fault. 114. Jordan posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle can't be blamed for a terribly poor strategy decision and for missing lugnuts. He couldn't have really done anymore himself to get himself into the chase after that point. Am I the only one who hates the wave-around policy? It is way too easy for a driver to get a lap back now. 115. Paul posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think part of the reason why Rogers is getting the blame is because Rogers took the blame and Kyle didn't stand up for him. Had Kyle stood up for his crew chief, it'd be a non-issue. But he hasn't and now Rogers is the scapegoat. Of course, I don't know why because Kyle wasn't going to win the title anyways. 116. Paul posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) He could've asked a couple more Toyotas to come down pit road so he could pass them, like he did with Hamlin and Truex. Truex pitted twice in the final 100 laps and his teammate Bowyer didn't pit once, how this hasn't been brought up in the media I'll never know. 117. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle has a history of letting things go. Example: Phoenix 2010 Jimmie Johnson and Kyle restarted next to each other in 8th and 9th on the last restart after Kyle had an insurmountable lead before the caution came out, Kyle finished where he restarted and Johnson 3rd. 118. Paul posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Caution for Casey Mears hitting the wall. 1st legit caution of the race. 119. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's not legit when it's a "pay to crash" driver. 120. Paul posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Haha, yeah maybe GEICO just wanted their car to get some tv time in the GEICO 400. 121. Jordan posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Commercial during caution, and for the second time of the race, they decide to use the picture-in-picture display. Isn't that kind of a poor usage of it since I am sure they get very limited opportunities to use that given the wishes of the advertisers? 122. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nah, Nascar pays them off to bring out commercial cautions. That's why it's always the 25th-35th place drivers that crash(36th-43rd are already parked due to electrical issues). 123. Jordan posted: 09.16.2012 - 3:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nine drivers are legitimately on the lead lap, but it seems 24 will be on the lead lap at the restart. They REALLY need to change the wave-around, this really cheapens the race a lot. 124. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I wish Newman would just crash already. 125. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kenseth's season is officially over. 126. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Come on damnit! Blow the engine!! 127. murb posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 24 wrecked. 128. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Just a firendly reminder folks, prior to the season I predicted Gordon to win the championship outright. This definitely wasn't the path I expected, but I did predict Vintage Gordon (we saw that last week) and a championship. 129. John Royal posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And there goes Gordon. 130. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon can finally put that final nail in the Coffin now. 131. Jordan posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff Gordon has a flat tire, and predictably, Kenseth gets his caution. I wonder who will stay out to get an unearned position on the lead lap this time, Danica Ptrick maybe? 132. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Epic Jinx! While I was sending that post I looked up and saw the 24 wrecked. #damn 133. Schroeder51 posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I wouldn't be surprised if Jeff finished last in the Chase by a bunch. 134. Paul posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well I'm done with this race now. The only thing keeping me interested just hit the wall. 135. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Damn it. I'm not a fan of Gordon's, but he could make this championship battle interesting if he contends. 136. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That's Gordon's 51st career Crash out 137. John Royal posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Rick Hendrick has breasts. 138. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) When was the last time Gordon crashed due to a hung Throttle? 139. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Now Rick shows up in the garage to pretend he cares. But that was a Vintage Stached Gordon race ('93). Ran up front all day, crashed late. 140. Schroeder51 posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Also wouldn't be surprised if Kyle Busch has an extremely epic final 10 races and shows us that Gordon making the Chase over him was an incredible fluke. 141. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Alan Bestwick:" That's Dave Blaney who's got no power under the hood of that #36" 142. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think the mustache is Gordon's bad Luck charm 143. Jordan posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sam Hornish continues to prove that if Penske does not add a third car for him next year that Hornish should just leave the team altogether. He's been one of the best drivers in the whole series ever since he replaced Allmendinger, who did next to nothing in the car. 144. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Epic Milestone: This is the 50th career race where Jimmie J has Led The Most laps. 145. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hornish has impressed the hell outta me. JJ has hit the "go" button here at the end just like he did at Indy and Michigan. 146. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bad Brad!! 147. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Looks like Bad Chad is pissed about something. 148. Jordan posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) No, Keselowski hit the "go" button. 149. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) JJ will eventually pass Brad cause their car is better, but that was a great statement sent by the 2 team taking the lead now to the 48. 150. Jordan posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I see why Chad is upset. Keselowski merged way too early, seems like he did it just to block Johnson. For someone who whines so much, he's pretty much the dirtiest out there. 151. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If they take it away from Brad.... 152. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It'll be between JJ and Brad for this win it looks like. 153. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I guess Chad thinks he is the only one allowed to push the rules (and in many cases just break them outright). Undoubtably a shot across the 48's bow. It definitely got Cheating Chad angry, so it worked in one respect. I still think JJ has that "go" button. 154. 1995 Subaru WRX Sti posted: 09.16.2012 - 4:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brad, you pull one of there. Well done sir, well played. 155. Jordan posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NASCAR shouldn't punish Brad for that, but it was about as dirty as it gets. He probably shouldn't expect an inch of room from Johnson for the rest of the season, nor does he deserve it. He just violated racing etiquette and the drivers don't like when that happens. 156. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Go" button: being pushed Lapped traffic: heavy The yellow flag: always a possibility DSFF: Nervous 157. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Congrats on your first Chase win, Brad! 158. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bad Brad is Badass!! Jimmie J looks like a chump at Chicago yet again! 159. Mr X posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yay, it's that time of year, the furthest possible point in the year from more cup racing at Chicago, but happy about Brad Keselowski winning. 160. Schroeder51 posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brad Keselowski...2012 champion? We'll see... I know we can cross Jeff off the list already. 161. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brad 2 The Bone! First cha$e win for Brad and Paul. So happy my favorite driver has the best crew chief in the garage. 162. Jordan posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Oh well, at least Hamlin broke. Since the #2 wasn't going to break, that's the next best one to see lose positions. 163. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bad Brad leads the points for the first time. 164. 1995 Subaru WRX Sti posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Overall, not a bad Chicago race. Enjoyied from start to finish. 165. John Royal posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dodge wins championship and pulls out. 166. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Random question: does Matt Kenseth wear his street clothes under his firesuit on race days? I thought Big E got dressed quick after races, but I think Matt is faster. 167. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) you should ask Matt K. that question on his Twitter. 168. Ty (fourturns.blogspot.com) posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) First off, Jimmie had the dominant car yet again at Chicagoland and didn't come home with the checkered flag. One of the few tracks he hasn't won at, although he won the inaugural Nationwide race there in 2001 (his only N'wide career victory). Secondly, Chad Knaus has nothing to complain about. That man has cheated so many times throughout his career and for Keselowski to "merge too early", he just needs to shut the &%#% up. Such a little baby. He's just mad that Keselowski won the race -- and by the way, I'm not a big fan of Keselowski so anyone replying saying "I'm a Brad fan" can stop that right now. Third, good job Jeff Gordon. Funny as hell he slammed the outside wall. NASCAR absolutely gave him the final wild-card spot last weekend at Richmond and God practically told him that he doesn't deserve to be in the Chase. Now, he's 47 points back and has a very, very, very, very distant chance of winning the title. Haha Lastly, congratulations to Keselowski. Fourth win of the season, tying him for Denny Hamlin for most wins this year. 169. murb posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Good job by the 2 team. Just another plain Chicago race. Hopefully Loudon will be a little better. 170. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I know a lot of people give cjs shit for ragging on Trevor Bayne and his easy going style of driving, but Brad is proving him right. You need an aggressive driver and teach him how to tone it down at times and calculate from time to time like he did today. It is much easier to back one up a little bit than teach one to be aggressive. Yo need to be both aggressive and calculating at the right times to be ultimately successful. Think Roush feels like he is sitting on a gold mine with Stenhouse right now? 2015 and 2016 are looking awful bright for them right now. 171. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jimmie Johnson is the King of Chicago Choke. MRN was even talking about his loss to Kyle Busch before they interviewed him this morning. 172. 18fan posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Great run by Kyle and the 18 team today. Kyle can be Denny's best friend or his biggest nightmare. If Kyle runs well he can take points away from Denny's biggest challengers. What could be problematic for Denny is races like today where Kyle outruns him. 173. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think Brad is putting in extra effort on his side to get that Blue Deuce in the winner's circle. The fact that Kurt Busch's highest win total in that car for a single season was 2, and they've just had back to back 3+ win seasons with Brad sort of proves that too. Not taking anything away from Kurt because he is really talented, but when adversity strikes he doesn't stay in the game the way Brad does. I see Brad as one of the smartest racers out there right now. 174. 10andJoe posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) >I have ZERO sympathy towards teams who enter races just so they can collect paychecks. "And that is why you fail." - Yoda 175. Anonymous posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I don't think ESPN mentioned Danica one time in the entire race. I'm impressed and shocked. 176. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brad Keselowski ties the great Kyle Petty in career wins with his 8th. 177. 18fan posted: 09.16.2012 - 5:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) They mentioned Danica once when Jimmie lapped her the first time and they gave a quick update on what she was saying about her car, but other than that I don't remember if they mentioned Danica more, but it wasn't very much. 178. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 6:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm gonna start calling Jeff's stache a "Crash Stache" 179. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 6:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Crash Stache. It is perfect. But at least he runs well with it like he did in '93. Just WAY too many days ending on a rollback. 180. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 6:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I mentioned earlier that Gordon has 51 Crash outs. I have noticed that Gordon is to Crashing out what Big E was to blowing Engines. Jeff G. 51 crash outs and 24 Blown Motor's Big E 22 crash outs and 49 Blown Motor's 181. Draco (Candraco) posted: 09.16.2012 - 6:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) When was the last time Ford was completely shut out of the top 10 in a cup race??? 182. Baker posted: 09.16.2012 - 6:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yes! Brad Keselowski out drove JJ and like a typical Hendrick diva Johnson and Knaus start crying about it. I hope Brad runs JJ over for the next 10 years. 183. Anonymous posted: 09.16.2012 - 6:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @181 Talladega last fall, Carl was the top Ford in 11th 184. Baker posted: 09.16.2012 - 6:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) My point standings for the year :: 1. Brad Keselowski 2091 2. Jimmie Johnson 2077 3. Kasey Kahne 2060 4. Tony Stewart 2059 5. Denny Hamlin 2044 6. Clint Bowyer 2037 7. Kyle Busch 2036 8. Ryan Newman 2032 9. Dale Junior 2032 10. Greg Biffle 2029 11. Matt Kenseth 2014 12. Jeff Gordon 2011 I go 1. 60 2. 45 3. 40 4. 36 5. 32 6. 28 7. 25 8. 22 9. 19 10. 16 11. 13 12. 11 13. 9 14. 7 15. 5 16-20. 3 21-30. 2 31-43. 1 1 Point for lap led and 1 more for most laps led. Drivers were reseaded with 10 bonus points for each win except for wild card drivers Kyle Busch and Ryan Newman(Gordon made it in on points a well as Kahne over Truex and Harvick). Also, since this is suppose to be a "playoff" I will also eliminate a driver each week. Jeff Gordon had the great day last week, but today it is heartbreak city and he's out of it. 185. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 6:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Does anyone know if Will Power is the first Driver in Pro Racing history with 3 straight Championship runner-ups? Jim Kelly comes to mind from Football. 186. David posted: 09.16.2012 - 7:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) How does the elimination system work, Baker? 187. cjs3872 posted: 09.16.2012 - 7:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) JG24FanForever, Power is not even the first IndyCar driver to finish runner-up three years in a row. Johnny Rutherford finished second in the championship race three consecutive years from 1974-'76, though some of the sting was taken out of that because he also won the Indianapolis 500 twice in that three year period. Of those runner-up finishes, 1976 was the hardest to take, because he was leading the championship going into the final race at Phoenix, but had a mechanical failure and lost the title to Gordon Johncock. Rutherford finally won the IndyCar title in 1980, when he also joined the exclusive list of three-time Indianapolis 500 winners, becoming just the sixth man to win a third Indianapolis 500. And by the way, is Roush sabotaging Matt Kenseth's title bid, because his misfortune marked the second time in three races that something just fell off the #17 car. At Bristol, it was a brake line, and today it was a shock. But Jeff Gordon's hung throttle is a MAJOR concern for all the teams, especially with the series heading to Loudon, where in 2000, stuck throttles killed two drivers. They said that there's something in the EFI system that's supposed to stop that from happening, as well as the "kill" switch on the steering wheel. Now certainly the cars and tracks have become much safer in the 12 years that have passed since those tragedies in 2000, but one can't possibly ignore the irony of a top driver having a hung throttle the week before a trip to Loudon, NH. One thing that prevented the situation from being significantly worse is that Gordon was two-thirds of the way up the track when he skidded to the wall, which meant that he probably knew he had a problem before the hung throttle put him in the wall. That was why Richard Petty always ran high, because if something did happen, such as a blown tire, failed brakes, or a stuck throttle, he wouldn't have as far to go to hit the wall, resulting in a hit not as hard as it could have been. But as Andy Petree said in the broadcast, what else can happen to Gordon this year? 188. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 8:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Thanks for the info cjs3872. Gordon has 1. a Barrel Roll to start the racing season--2. Blown Engine at Daytona--3. Cut tire at Bristol--4. Gas can rain out at California--5. The idiocy fest of Martinsville--6. Dropped cylinder at Kansas--7. Cut Tire at Richmond--8. Turned head on into the wall at Talladega--9. Cut Two Tires on thin air at Darlington--10. loose wheel+ Mandatory Bullshit caution at Dover--11. Gustafson Gaff at Pocono--12. Gustafson Gaff at Sonoma--13. Three separate crashes at Daytona--14. slipped on oil at The Glen 15. Blown Engine #2 at Michigan 16. Hung Throttle at Chicago. This is the "Bizzaro 1998" Gordon season. 189. cjs3872 posted: 09.16.2012 - 8:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And by the way JG24FanForever, one other note on the Rutherford deal. He won the Indianapolis 500 three times (and finished second once), but only finished the full 500 miles twice, in his victories in 1974 and '80. When he was runner-up in 1975 (a race he could have won had the timing of certain events been different), the race was ended by a monsoon at 435 miles, and he won the shortest Indy race ever, at 255 miles, in 1976. But Gordon's stuck throttle worries me, because with the safety provisions put in to prevent that from happening, a stuck throttle should never happen. And heading to Loudon, where two drivers lost their lives from stuck throttles a dozen years ago, that's got to be worisome to the garage area. And I'm worried about what Roush may be doing to Matt Kenseth. I knew he wouldn't focus on the #17 for the title be of Kenseth leaving, but to have parts literally fall off the car twice in three races is more than a bit suspicious to me. 190. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 8:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The sabotage of Kenseth seems to be inevitable. Remember before Kenseth made his deal public when Roush said "He's going to the dark side"? I think Roush has a personal dislike of Toyota racing and it's associates. 191. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.16.2012 - 8:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon also has a win that was overshadowed by tragedy 192. 18fan posted: 09.16.2012 - 8:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The Kenseth-Roush situation could make Talladega really interesting because the Kenseth-Biffle pair has been by far the most formidable on the plate tracks this year, with Kenseth having the strongest car in all three plate races so far. 193. Robert Nelson posted: 09.16.2012 - 9:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) F1 points. 1. Brad Keselowski 34 2. Jimmie Johnson 27 3. Tony Stewart 15.5* =4. Denny Hamlin 12 =4. Kyle Busch 12 =6. Clint Bowyer 7 =6. Dale Earnhardt Jr. 7 =8. Greg Biffle 6 =8. Kasey Kahne 6 10. Matt Kenseth 3 11 Jeff Gordon 1.5* 12 Ryan Newman 0 * = F1 rule: If race does not reach 75%, half points are given. Wildcards were Kyle Busch and Ryan Newman (Newman had to get 4 points over Logano at Richmond, Newman finished 8th, Logano finished well outside the points.) 194. cjs3872 posted: 09.16.2012 - 9:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yes 18fan, we could see Kenseth team up with one of the JGR cars, perhaps even the very car he'll drive next year, the #20, or even the #21 car since we know that Trevor Bayne will have a very strong car, but no drafting partner since the Woods are a single-car team. Remember that Bayne's drafting partner for the fall Talladega race last year was Robby Gordon's #7 Dodge until Robby fell out. If Roush doesn't want Kenseth drafting with Biffle or Carl Edwards, he could have Bayne's #21 to draft with, which would pair up the two drivers that have combined to win the last three Daytona 500s. And by the way, speaking of JGR, lost in all the attention that the controversial move that Keselowski made, as well as the problems that befell Gordon and Kenseth today, was the incredibly dumb decision by Darian Grubb not to put enough fuel in Denny Hamlin's car on the last pit stop. They say they were trying to make an adjustment to his car, but what difference would that make if you don't put enough fuel in the car to make it to the finish. This is at least the second boneheaded decision Grubb's made this year, the other one being pitting Hamlin from second place at Auto Club Speedway when it was obvious that they weren't going to go racing again when the rain hit. I've talked nearly endlessly about Alan Gustafson's pit strategy decisions, but even his decisions weren't any more boneheaded than Grubb's two pit flubs. Maybe Tony Stewart knew something about Grubb's apparent problems calling a race when he released him last year. 195. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 9:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hard to believe, as hard as Dale drove, he only crashed out of 22 races. 196. Thomas posted: 09.16.2012 - 9:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #184. Baker I have a similar points system. Only mine goes: 1. 50 2. 45 3. 40 4. 36 5. 32 6. 28 7. 26 8. 24 9. 22 10. 20 11. 18 12. 16 13. 14 14. 12 15. 10 16. 8 17. 6 18. 4 19. 2 20. 1 21-43. 0 2 points for leading the most laps (no points for leading just a lap) 1 point for the pole (unless qualifying is rained out, then there's no point--like at Bristol) The points in my standings after today are: 1. Johnson 1078 2. Keselowski 1065 3. Kahne 1050 4. Stewart 1043 5. Ky. Busch 1036 6. Bowyer 1030 7. Earhardt Jr. 1029 8. Hamlin 1028 9. Biffle 1024 10. Truex 1022 11. Kenseth 1009 12. Gordon 1000 The Chasers were set to 1000 points, with a 5 point bonus per win for the top 10 in points. The points leader (Johnson) was given a 10 point lead over the driver with the most wins. And if anybody was wondering, 42 of 73 drivers to have started a race this season have scored points under my system. 197. murb posted: 09.16.2012 - 9:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It is inevitable that Kenseth will be sabotaged. It's Jack Roush we're talking about here guys. 18fan brings up a great point about Talladega. The 17 has virtually dominated at all three of the plate tracks thus far. And with Roush's bogus team orders last year in that race (where he essentially threatened Trevor's job if he pushed anyone who wasn't a Ford), who knows what he will have up his sleeve this time. Matt should just go all out for the rest of this year. Win or bust style. A championship just isn't going to happen with the lame duck situation. And then, before he knows it, he'll be with JGR next year with some bad fast race cars, and an owner who will treat him right. (By the way, just for the record, I expect JGR to have a "Hendrick in '07" type of year. Win double digit races, three cars in the Chase, title contenders, etc.) He'll never have to worry about the Idiot in the Hat politicking anymore. "Does anyone know if Will Power is the first Driver in Pro Racing history with 3 straight Championship runner-ups?" Jeff Green came close in the late 90s/early 00s in the Busch Series. He had a 2nd, 1st, 2nd run. He messed it up by winning the title in 2000 by like 600 points or whatever it was. 198. murb posted: 09.16.2012 - 9:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) *I meant to say at all three of the plate RACES, not tracks. Obviously, there's only two plate tracks. As Allen Bestwick would say, "My bad". 199. David posted: 09.16.2012 - 9:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bobby Allison also came close in 1983, except that he won the title. 200. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 9:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Richard Petty was first in 1975 and 2nd in '76 and '77 201. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 9:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) ^^ Gotta like the 200th Comment being Petty related. Petty also finished 2nd in '62 and 63' epically failing to finish 2nd in the title three straight year's by winning the title in '64. What an epic choke;) 202. cjs3872 posted: 09.16.2012 - 10:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Murb, I mentioned in post #187 that Johnny Rutherford finished second in the IndyCar championship three years in a row from 1974-'76, so it has happened before for a driver to finish second three years in a row, and it's probably happened elsewhere. And as I also mentioned, Trevor pushed Robby Gordon practically the entire race in the fall race at Talladega last year, and might have pushed Robby right into victory lane had Robby not had a mechanical failure late. The difference for Trevor for this year's fall race is that, with Roush only running three cars, he could get the "out man" from Roush's team to be his drafting partner, and that driver might very well be Kenseth. And that would be ironic, considering that would pair up the two drivers that have won three of the past four Daytona 500s, including the last two. That might be a lethal combination for the rest of the field, considering how much Kenseth has led at those two places this year, combined with the fact that Trevor doesn't like to lead at those places, but prefers instead to follow. A 17/21 drafting combo could be unbeatable for every other driver in that race, if Roush decides not to let Greg Biffle be Kenseth's partner at Talladega. Also remember how Carl Edwards wanted to draft with Trevor in that race last year, but was overruled by Roush. this year, a Roush driver may have to draft with the #21 car if he wants to draft with a Ford, unless Roush enters the #6 there, which I very much doubt will happen. 203. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 10:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Austin Dillon sucks. his "the number 3 was my grandaddy's number. not Dale's" attitude doesn't bode very well with me,not to mention the idiot slide and doofy looking hat. His little brother is just as annoying too. Does anybody think that considering the circumstances that the #3 in Nascar should be retired? Much like Richie Evans #61 is retired in Modifieds. He perished in the final race in 1985 at Martinsville during practice after locking up his 8th consecutive title. To me Dale should get the same respect as Evans,but the Dillon bastards don't seem to have any respect for what Big E made of that #. I don't mean to offend any Dillon-Brother fans, but I can't imagine that I really did anyway. 204. cjs3872 posted: 09.16.2012 - 10:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) No JG24FF, I don't think any numbers should ever be retired in racing, because there's only a certain amount of numbers (110 of them) that can be used. That's one reason why the #43 was not retired after 1992. Petty chose not to run the number in 1993, but had to in 1994, or he would have lost it. I personally think that NASCAR should do the same thing with Richard Childress regarding the #3 in the Cup series. If he doesn't want to run it with the same font as was the case when Earnhardt ran it every year but his first there, that's fine, but NASCAR has to make Childress run it or lose it, just as was the case with the #43 when Petty retired, or with the #22 in the 1960s when Fireball Roberts was killed. Holman-Moody, for whom Roberts was driving for in 1964, chose not to run that number, so they lost the rights to it, and the same was true regarding Bud Moore and the #8 when Joe Weatherly was killed. Moore never ran it again, so he lost it. They can't allow Childress to hold the number hostage, which is what he's been doing for a decade. They should tell him that if he doesn't use that number, he loses it, plain and simple. 205. JG24FanForever posted: 09.16.2012 - 10:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yeah, but the #61 is still retired in Modifieds out of deep respect. But I do agree that they at least shouldn't use Big E's licensed and trademarked by the man himself version of The #3, because it was his and not either of the "Chosen" Dillon-Brothers. 206. ch posted: 09.16.2012 - 11:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sposnor changes: 33 - Special Ops OPSEC 95 - Jordan Truck Sales 207. ch posted: 09.16.2012 - 11:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Also, does anybody know what the 33 team's agenda was this week. By the score sheet it would look like they parked, but they were in and out throughout the race. With Whitt drving, do you think they could have been using this race as a test session to see if Leicht was giving good feedback? It felt like they would make a change, and go out for 10-20 laps to see how it felt, and then go back in and do it again. If they did use it as a test session, I must say that that is pretty smart use of time considering small teams don't preform their greatest on 1.5 mile tracks! I mean, what they did was probably better than running around all day making minor adjustments. 208. cjs3872 posted: 09.16.2012 - 11:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's simple ch. They wanted to be the highest finishing of the S&P teams. The #33 is currently 36th in points, and although they don't figure to bust in the top 35 by season's end, if they can stay 36th and one of the current top 35 teams drop out, which could very well happen, the #33 car would be guaranteed a spot in next year's first five races, including the Daytona 500, if the current exemption format locking in the top 35 in points remains in tact for next year, which I hope doesn't happen. What they did was went behind the wall early to make adjustments, and then saw how many laps they had to run to become the highest finishing car among those that start-and-park, and once they did that (which they did by running 70 laps), they parked it for the day. 209. Talk4Tar posted: 09.16.2012 - 11:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I see why Chad is upset. Keselowski merged way too early, seems like he did it just to block Johnson. For someone who whines so much, he's pretty much the dirtiest out there." Drivers are told to blend coming off of two. "Coming off of two" is very subjective. I'm sure NASCAR will be a little more strict about it, just like the pit road lines at Bristol. I respect the 2 team for doing something the 48 team never could, make NASCAR change the rules around their innovation, rather than just break the rules NASCAR already has in place. BK and his team know how to take advantage of a situation and show NASCAR where they were lackadaisical on their rule making. This is a smart team, making smart moves. Chad Knaus is just mad he didn't think of doing it himself. 210. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.16.2012 - 11:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) i honestly don't see the big deal about the dillon brothers running the #3. it's just a number. i mean, they let robby gordon disrespect the legacy of the #7 by start and parking with it, and they ran the #28 after davey allison died and the #45 after adam petty died, the #3 shouldn't be any different. dale's legacy was in the man, not the number on the door. 211. ch posted: 09.17.2012 - 12:32 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I can see that cjs, the 26 did the same thing when they came back out for a little. It just seemed a little different the way the team was off and on soooo much. Also the press release about Cole Whitt driving this week made it seem like their goal was something beyond just starting and parking. 212. cjs3872 posted: 09.17.2012 - 1:06 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yes, ch. Often times, the start-and-park teams are in a competition of their own to see who can complete the most laps, and thus gain the highest finishing position. for some odd reason, this only seems to happen in the Cup series, but not in the other series. For instance, in the Nationwide Series race, about one-third of the starting field did S&P's, but they didn't seem to care when they dropped out of the race, and the same seems to be true in the Truck Series, though the percentage of S&P's there is often much lower than in the Nationwide Series. And as for Cole Whitt driving the car, I wonder if that could be part of a new alliance between the #33 team, RCR, and Junior Motorsports, because you're right, that does seem odd. I do want to correct something I mentioned in an earlier post. By doing a start-and-park, the #33 team dropped to 37th in owner points, 13 points behind the Wood Brothers, who moved back into 36th, and could solidify that position since they're running half the races in the Chase. That could be important for the Woods because if they finish 36th, if one team in front of them falls by the wayside, that would put them in a guaranteed spot for the Daytona 500, if NASCAR continues it's top-35 exemption rule for next year, which as I said doesn't happen, because that's actually suppressing any potential teams and sponsors that actually have interest in competing, or existing teams that wish to expand and resulting in the increase in the number of start-and-parks to where all the teams not in the top 35 are doing S&P's (and a couple of exempt teams are doing S&P's), except when the Wood Brothers compete. Frankly, I think the exemption rule is a big reason why JGR is not expanding to a fourth team, because no sponsor wants to take a chance on missing a race because that extra team would not be exempt. 213. A-Frame43 posted: 09.17.2012 - 2:29 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sabotage is an awfully strong word. Unless you have proof, I suggest you cram it. Your conspiracy theories that you can't prove are tired. 214. cjs3872 posted: 09.17.2012 - 3:07 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) A-Frame43, what else would you call it when a usually precise team with a championship crew chief of 25 years of experience has things like a brake line and a shock literally fall off the car twice in three weeks. And in the Cup race, the shock fell off the car under caution. And the fact that this has happened since the announcement was made that Kenseth will be driving for JGR next year can't be a coincidence for me. Add that to Roush's shabby treatment of his drivers in the past, and it all adds up to the fact that something fishy's going on here. Sabotage my be too strong a term, but if this kind of thing happens a third time, then it becomes pretty obvious what's going on. 215. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.17.2012 - 5:05 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I have never seen a shock just fall off like that with no damage to the mounts. And Matt's interview after the race (the one 3 minutes after the checkered flag dropped when he was already in street clothes) he had a look of resignation instead of his usual calculated expression of frustration after a bad race. That said more to me than anything. The shame is that if any driver on the tour could flourish in a lame duck situation, it would be Matt. But Jack is Jack. 216. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.17.2012 - 5:28 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Just to clarify the 3 situation... Childress has had the #3 hostage (kudos to cjs for using my previous wording) since 2001. In the past, I have read of NASCAR threatening to bring financial harm (as in fining) or take away numbers from teams that had applied for numbers at the beginning of the year and hadn't used them by June. The worst part about the Dillons is that they seem to think they're the greatest drivers ever. 217. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.17.2012 - 8:16 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I certainly don't wanna see the Dillons driving the #3. Watching Austin on Saturday tip toeing around in that car while Stenhouse in the #6 (long associated with conservatism) drove the ever loving shit out of it to victory was disorienting in how backwards it is. And I hate the deal where Austin says "that is YOUR number grandpa". Yeah, he had it first and owned it, but Dale made it. That is becoming more and more obvious as the years go by. They probably think Dale was just lucky to have their grandfather as his owner. Much like the Saturday race, that is completely backwards. 218. cjs3872 posted: 09.17.2012 - 8:55 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) NicoRosbergFan, why NASCAR's letting Childress get away with something that not even Richard Petty could get away with, as far as keeping numbers hostage, is beyond me, because they told Petty that if he didn't use the 43 in 1994 that he woud lose it. Why they're letting Childress keep the #3 when he has no intention of using it is something I'll never understand. I know that Childress believes that the #3 should never be used again in the Cup series, a belief that's just as ridiculous, if not moreso, and I use the Fireball Roberts case as proof. 22 was Roberts' car number, and within a year or two of his death, the number 22 was being used again, and Bobby Allison was winning with it by the end of the 60s. And DSFF, while Dale Earnhardt, Sr. made the #3 famous for this generation of fans, you're dead wrong about saying that 3 is "Dale's number". Obviously you forget that long before Richard Childress got the #3 in 1976, that Ray Fox had that number for years and drivers such as Junior Johnson, Jim Paschal, and Buck and Buddy Baker all had great success using the #3 when Fox had the number. And by the way, the sane is true regarding Jack Roush and the #6. Most fans identify the #6 as Jack Roush's number, when in fact, Cotton Owens had far more success with the #6 than Roush has ever had with it, scoring many wins with drivers like David Pearson, Pete Hamliton, Buddy Baker, and even Owens himself driving it. Even Ralph Earnhardt, Dale's father, drove Owens' #6 cars in the early 60s. And again, thank you NicoRosbergFan, for helping me become a blogger. Your help is very much appreciated, and I'll be making more blogs, especially about statistics and lists regarding the sport in the future, particularly about "best ever" lists and the history about the sport's biggest events, such as the Indianapolis 500, and NASCAR's crown jewel races. 219. Baker posted: 09.17.2012 - 10:20 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) The elimination is simple. Low man remaining in points gets the boot. Its not like the current point system where you seemingly cannot make up ground unless the drivers ahead of you crash out or blow up either. You can gain and lose significant points each week. This week the driver heading into Loudon lowest in points is Matt Kenseth 15 points behind Greg Biffle. In the current points he would have to win and Biffle finish out of the Top 10 or worse where as the most points are awarded to the Top 3-5 drivers and to award racing for the win. If Kenseth were to score a Top 3 finish or win he would almost certainly pass on of the 6 cars ahead of him in points. IMO my point system awards more for running up front whereas the current system award more for no having really bad days bascially you can run 7-10 all year and be a contender. 220. 10andJoe posted: 09.17.2012 - 11:41 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) >Chad Knaus is just mad he didn't think of doing it himself. Also Brad's getting into Jimmie's and Chad's heads. He isn't going to be mind-gamed out of a title like Hamlin and Harvick were in 2010; the 48 team is going up against a team that can mind-game THEM into mistakes for once. This is going to be interesting. 221. 10andJoe posted: 09.17.2012 - 12:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) -Denny Hamlin's 250th Cup start. 222. 1995 Subaru WRX Sti posted: 09.17.2012 - 12:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Tony did it the #48 in 2005. He mind gamed them outta their boots. I think Jimmie is mentally strong but don't think Chad is (just by his expression after what Brad pulled). Chad is brillant (and a cheater), but if something goes wrong, he loses it. #48 has weaknesses: 1. Plate races (especially now with Manufactered Plate Racing). 2. Fuel mileage (yeah they suck at it). 3. Jimmie is mistake prone (see CMS last year). 4. Chad can easily lose his temper. 223. 10andJoe posted: 09.17.2012 - 12:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) -Landon Cassill's 75th Cup start. 224. 10andJoe posted: 09.17.2012 - 12:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) -Scott Speed's 100th Cup start. 225. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.17.2012 - 1:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dale still "made" that number by being so good with it for so long. Just like David Pearson "made" the #21 despite its impressive list of accolades with some of the best drivers out there before him (Tiny Lund, Panch, Cale, that Indy Car driver from Texas whose name I forget that won a few Indy 500s :) ). Sometimes a driver just gets in a car and simply makes it, and its number, legendary. That is what The Silver Fox did to the #21, just like Dale did to the #3. Watching the Dillon Boys drive those cars and Trucks with their black schemes and THAT #3 just makes me miss Dale more. I don't want to see that number on a car, I want to see it on a car driven by HIM again, out there causing controlled chaos again. I was watching a YouTube clip from 1989 narrated by Ken Squire. This was in the Fall of that year, and Neil Bonnett was the Woods' car but was injured. In what Ken called "one of the most heart warming stories in a long time" a retired Pearson tested that #21 car to see if he felt his back could hold up for a one race reunion (he ultimately decided no). But even then just the thought of David driving that #21 Woods' car one last time tugged the heart strings. That is my point about Dale and the #3. Needs to be retired from Cup like the #61 was rightfully retired from modifieds. 226. cjs3872 posted: 09.17.2012 - 2:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Interesting note. As far as I know, Roger Penske's team has never led the points at this late a juncture of the season in NASCAR before. With his win, Brad Keselowski brought the #2 car to the top of the point standings, the first time the #2 car has led the points at any time since after the spring race at Talladega back in 1998, which was the eighth consecutive week Rusty led the points that year. In his five years driving the #2 car, Kurt Busch never once led the points, so Keselowski's taking the point lead marks the first time in 14 and a half years that the #2 car has led the point standings, and the first time it has ever led the standings in the second half of the season. And 1995 Subaru WRX STi, Chad does get upset if things don't go his way. Another case of this was the fall race at Talladega in 2007, when Jeff Gordon passed Jimmie Johnson on the last lap for the win. Chad Knaus was livid over that, and it was at about that time that the information sharing between the 48 and 24 temas stopped. And Jimmie Johnson has shown that he will make errors, although he has rarely shown that under pressure. But for once, as far as the #48 team is concerned, the shoe is on the other foot, because they're the ones that are getting the mind games played on them, and they have showed a tendency to get off their game if something's off kilter. 227. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.17.2012 - 2:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Other numbers "made" despite being driven at other times by other legends (which is why you'll notice the absence of 9, 20, 24, and 48): 2: Rusty Wallace (remember, Earnhardt's first championship came in a #2 car, but that number will always scream "Rusty") 3: Dale Earnhardt (good luck Austin) 7: Alan Kulwicki (rough years for it since '99, Michael Waltrip, Mike Wallace, Casey Atwood, Jimmy Spencer, Robby Gordon, soon to be Danica, but Alan forever made that number mean something powerful no matter how many scrubs get in that car) 11: Cale Yarborough (saying something considering the sheer number of legends that have driven that number) 12: Bobby Allison (between his runs in the 70's in the Coke car with that number and his cut short run in the gold High Life car that saw him win the Daytona 500 with his son in 2nd that will forever be Bobby's) 13: Fireball Roberts (black and gold + 13 = badass, sorry Casey Mears fans :) ) 14: AJ Foyt (I know he didn't do much with it in NASCAR, but I counter by saying AJ Freaking Foyt drove it and it was his number) 21: David Pearson (see above) 22: Fireball Roberts (he makes another appearance! impressive considering cult hero Ward Burton drove this number forever, I miss Ward) 28: Davey Allison (this one also had not shortage of legends drive this number, but never looked as good as it did with that bright orange Texaco Star on the hood with Davey outrunning legends on all types of tracks) 33: Harry Gant (high, wide, and handsome) 43: Richard Petty (any explanation needed?) 228. Daniel posted: 09.17.2012 - 2:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #185, Dennis Setzer was runner-up in truck points in '03, '04, and '05. 229. cjs3872 posted: 09.17.2012 - 2:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, Danica does it again. She did it to the teams of Bobby Rahal and Michael Andretti in IndyCar racing (though Andretti's has clearly recoverd ans Rahal's showed signs of doing he sane thing), and now she's done it to JR Motorsports n the Nationwide Series. She has now torpedoed her third team, as Tony Eury, Jr. has followed his father in leaving, as it was announced that Tony Eury, Jr. is out as Danica's crew chief. Last week Tony, Sr. left the team, and now Tony, Jr. has followed. But is anyone truly surprised at this, because I've been saying for months that Danica would tear this team apart, just like she did the two IndyCar orgaizations she drove for. And for the fans of Tony Stewart, and there are a lot of them, I fear his team is next on Danica's hit list. If ever there was driver in motorsports that deserves the moniker that Skip Bayless put on Terrell Owens years ago, it's Danica Patrick, as Danica lives up to the nickname I gave her a while back, as racing's "Team Obliterator" strikes once again, and for the third time, and I fear that within two or three years, Tony Stewart's team will become Danica's fourth victim, as his team will come crashing down due to having racing's greatest cancer as part of it. 230. Daniel posted: 09.17.2012 - 3:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Loudon entry list out: -David Reutimann in the #10 -Jeff Green in the #19 -Mike Olsen in the #32 -Kelly Bires in the #79 231. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.17.2012 - 3:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) With Tony Jr out, who is gonna make excuses for Danica's performances now? Oh wait, everybody involved in the freaking sport. 232. 1995 Subaru WRX Sti posted: 09.17.2012 - 3:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "7: Alan Kulwicki (rough years for it since '99, Michael Waltrip, Mike Wallace, Casey Atwood, Jimmy Spencer, Robby Gordon, soon to be Danica, but Alan forever made that number mean something powerful no matter how many scrubs get in that car)" Robby will give Danica the #7 over his dead body. He already said he will not part with it no matter how money is ponyied up or how much bad pubilcity he gets. HE ISN"T GIVING HER THE #7!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! BTW Robby isn't a scrub, he is furthest thing from a scrub as you can get. I wouldn't name Mike Wallace one either. Both have been successful. Champions? No but successful. 233. 10andJoe posted: 09.17.2012 - 4:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NHIS entry list is out. 47 cars: -Reutimann back in the 10 -Jeff Green in the 19 -Mike Olsen in the 32 -Leicht back in the 33 -Biers in the 79 -Scott Speed in the 95 234. cjs3872 posted: 09.17.2012 - 4:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) But 1995 Subaru WRX STi, if Robby's not in the sport, then he wouldn't have the rights to the #7 for the reasons mentioned in previous posts. He doesn't have the right to hold the #7 hostage any more than his ex-boss Richard Childress has the right to hold the #3 hostage. And if Robby does not run next year, he'll lose the right to the #7. And I believe Robby was at Auto Club Speedway to watch Ryan Hunter-Reay win the IndyCar title for his (Robby's) one-time archrival Michael Andretti. And remember, I don't think Robby and Tony Stewart (Danica's Cup car owner) exactly see eye to eye, either. 235. Talon64 posted: 09.17.2012 - 5:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brad Keselowski picks up his 8th career Sprint Cup Series win, and ties Denny Hamlin for the series lead with his career-high 4th win of 2012. He also picked up his 11th top 5 of the season, a new career-high. It's the first time the #2 Penske team has had 4 wins in a season since Rusty Wallace in 2000 and the first time they've had 7+ wins in a 2-season stretch since 1995 (2) and 1996 (5). Keselowski's 7 wins since 2011 rank 2nd only to Tony Stewart (8). Keselowski's the 16th different Chase driver to score a Chase win. It's Keselowski's 2nd straight top 5 finish at Chicagoland (14.0 avg fin in 4 career starts). Jimmie Johnson earned his 27th career Sprint Cup Series pole, tying him with Terry Labonte for 24th all time, and 2nd of 2012 (none in 2011). Of Johnson's 20 career Chase wins, none of them have come in the 1st Chase race (11.8 avg fin in 9 races, best of 2nd in 2008 and 2012). Johnson picks up his 39th career runner-up finish and series-leading 4th of 2012 (tied with Denny Hamlin for most top 2's with 7). Johnson has 4 top 10's in his last 8 races, but they're all top 3 finishes. Johnson also led 100+ laps for the 48th time in his career (12.3% of his 390 starts). Johnson now has 3 runner-up finishes but no wins in 11 career Chicagoland starts (9 top 10's, 9.3 avg fin). This despite overtaking Tony Stewart for the most laps led all time at Chicagoland with 537 (172 in this race alone). Kasey Kahne's 8th top 5 of 2012 equals his total from all of 2011; he's on pace for 11 top 5's this season, his most since 2006 and just his 3rd season with 10+. After having just 1 top 3 finish in the first 16 races of 2012, Kahne now has 5 in the last 11. Kasey Kahne finishes in the top 15 for a 5th straight race at Chicagoland (two 3rd place finishes, 3 top 10's, 7.8 avg fin). Kyle Busch is the highest finishing non-Chase driver in 4th, his first top 5 in 7 races (4 top 10's, 12.1 avg fin). Kyle's 13th top 10 of the season equals his career-low, and he's still on pace to just equal his career low of top 5's in a season (9). Kyle picks up just his 3rd top 10 in 8 career Chicagoland starts (all top 5 finishes, 13.4 avg fin). Ryan Newman picks up just his 4th top 5 of the season and first in 9 races (6 top 10's in that stretch). However, Newman now has 10+ top 10's for a 4th consecutive season and for the 9th time in 11 full seasons in Cup. It's Newman's 5th top 10 in his last 6 Chicagoland races (9.8 avg fin) and 7th in 11 career starts there (14.9 avg fin). After going 4 straight races without a top 10 (25.0 avg fin), Tony Stewart now has back-to-back top 6 finishes (started 28th and 29th in those races). It's his 6th straight top 10 at Chicagoland, his 10th career top 10 there (leads all drivers) and he improves his record average finish at Chicagoland to 8.5. Joey Logano finishes in the top 10 for just the 2nd time in the last 9 races (20.7 avg fin, 19th in points scored over that stretch). But it's his 9th top 10 of 2012, versus just 6 in 2011. It's Logano's 1st top 10 in 4 starts at Chicagoland but he's never finished worse than 19th there (15.0 avg fin). That leaves just 4 tracks that Logano doesn't have a top 10 at: Homestead, Kentucky, Kansas and Atlanta. Dale Earnhardt Jr.'s 18th top 10 of the season still has him tied with Jimmie Johnson for the series lead. Interestingly, it's his 180th career top 10. However, it's just his 3rd top 10 in the last 7 races. Dale Jr. picks up his 5th top 10 in 12 career Chicagoland starts (14.2 avg fin) and his 2nd straight. Martin Truex Jr. establishes a new career-high with his 15th top 10 of the season (previous best was 14 in 2007). It's just his 2nd top 10 in 7 Chicagoland starts (16.9 avg fin) and 9th ties his best ever finish there (2008). Clint Bowyer has now put up at least 16 top 10's for a 6th consecutive season; his 100 top 10's over that stretch rank him 8th among all drivers. It's his 7th top 10 in the last 9 races, during which he's 3rd in points scored (MWR teammate Truex Jr. is 4th). Bowyer picks up his 6th top 10 in 7 starts at Chicagoland (10.1 avg fin). Sam Hornish Jr finishes 11th for a 3rd consecutive race, improving his average finish in 10 starts in the #22 to 17.4. If Hornish were collecting points in Cup he'd be 18th in points scored over that span, scoring 15 more than Joey Logano in 19th. Danica Patrick's 25th place finish is her best in 6 starts this season (30.3 avg fin). 236. 1995 Subaru WRX Sti posted: 09.17.2012 - 6:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Robby will be running next year. 2-3 races but concidered "active". If Robby does give up the # then i'll use ALL respect for him. Besides the #7 is known for "doing it your way and making it work reguardless of how successful you are." Not for Danica who has sold her soul and carrer to her sponsers. I'm sure Robby and Tony get along just fine, they are both business men but Robby isn't going to cave in. 237. cjs3872 posted: 09.17.2012 - 6:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 1995 Subaru WRX STi, Robby and Tony, as far as I know, have never gotten along, because both drivers have the same personality. And as for the #7, it may be a symbol of "doing it your way", but driving the #7 car has historically been bad luck for whoever drives it. The lone modern exception being Alan Kulwicki's 1992 championship (which may have indirectly led t his demise the following spring). But only once has the #7 car ever won one of NASCAR's crown jewel races, and that was way back in the 1959 Southern 500, with Jim Reed driving. And the #7 car hasn't fared any better in IndyCar racing over the years. In fact, the #7 car has only won the Indianapolis 500 once, and that was way back in 1934 with Bill Cummings. The closest brush since then was in 1986, when Kevin Cogan seemed like a sure thing to win that year's Indianapolis 500 with one of the gutsuest drives in modern race history, but Arie Luyendyk's crash with five laps left bunched up the field, and Bobby Rahal beat him on a restart with two laps to go. By the way, Rahal was driving the #3 car, the winningest car number in race history. And by the way, much like his father did with Kurt Busch in 2000, Dale Earnhardt, Jr. sent a subtle message to Trevor Bayne early in Sunday's Cup race by sideswiping him as he passed, which may have been a slight payback for an incident Bayne had with one of Dale, Jr.'s NNS drivers, Cole Whitt, late in the NNS race at Bristol about a month ago. 238. murb posted: 09.17.2012 - 8:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I don't get why you guys are talking about Robby giving Danica/Tony the #7. She's gonna run the 10 car in Cup, so it doesn't matter. 239. 10andJoe posted: 09.17.2012 - 8:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) ^ Only because Robby refused to give up the 7 to her already - she tried. 240. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.17.2012 - 9:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF the people who are going to be making excuses for Danica's Failures is Danica herself, her fanbase and the media who has bought in to the unrealistic hype and expectactions that Danica herself has created knowing deep down that she is nothing more than smoke and mirrors. 241. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.17.2012 - 9:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I just can't get past how much Robby has left on the table in racing (outside of the deserts). I respect his maverick ways but ultimately I see him as somebody who wasted a lot of talent, money, and time on NASCAR. Just a personal thing with me. 242. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.17.2012 - 9:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You are right Ben, unfortunately the people you mentioned make up 3/4 of the industry. 243. murb posted: 09.17.2012 - 10:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I just can't get past how much Robby has left on the table in racing (outside of the deserts). I respect his maverick ways but ultimately I see him as somebody who wasted a lot of talent, money, and time on NASCAR. Just a personal thing with me." Totally agree with you DSFF. He has just as much driving ability as Tony Stewart or Kyle Busch I think. But he's really been his own worst enemy as far as being a stable force in the sport goes. He had a nice little career going with RCR, but he screwed himself by starting his own team. He easily could have stayed with RCR or gotten another decent ride (I might be wrong, but I think that he was a candidate for the JGR 11 car in 2005 before they stupidly went with Leffler). But I guess in Robby's mind it's the hard way or the highway. 244. JG24FanForever posted: 09.17.2012 - 10:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) My biggest argument for the #3 being more sacred than the #22 the #28 and the #7 is the fact that Dale passed away in front of millions of people, including myself, while driving the Black #3 and as DaleSrFanForever mentioned I don't want to see anyone driving that # and especially Dale's Trademarked font. Dale left us in that car. I think there needs to be just a bit more respect for that fact. And another point I made earlier that no one continues to notice, is the fact that Richie Evans left this world in the "Big Orange" #61 at Martinsville and the sport had enough class to officially retire the # in the Modifieds. The same should be true for Dale in at least the Cup series. 245. Paul posted: 09.17.2012 - 10:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, like I said last week, Robby Gordon is the Ryan Leaf of NASCAR. He had so much talent, but couldn't get along with people or deal with failure well enough to be successful. It saddens me that someone who had the potential to be a Cup championship contender and a winner of 20-30+ races wasted it all away simply because he wanted to do things his way in a sport that's thrived on team success for the past 20 years. As far as the Dillon boys go, Ty doesn't annoy me all that much, but I can't stand Austin. Along with the driver of the #7 Nationwide car, he's one of two drivers that I'll change the channel for when they give interviews. I can't stand his voice, I can't stand his phoniness, I can't stand his attitude, but most of all, I can't stand that damn cowboy hat. Thankfully he's stopped wearing it the last couple weeks, but that along with his "privileged grandson" attitude just makes him come off as second-rate and a poser. cjs, you said earlier on this page that had Austin not let Sadler pass him, they would have wrecked. I'm not discounting that, but I just found it funny how Austin suddenly had the speed to pass and drive by Sadler once his crew chief told him too. If Austin wants to win this championship, he needs to grow a set and pass cars because he's faster, not wait for them to make a mistake. Too many times this season he's run 4th or 5th the entire race, which is why he has 0 wins this season that didn't involve failing post-race inspection. Ricky Stenhouse, Jr. seems to be well past his early summer slump and with Sadler having problems the past few weeks, Ricky could be in position to win his 2nd straight Nationwide title. Personally, I'm rooting for Sadler because he hasn't won a NASCAR championship yet, but Stenhouse has shown that he's more deserving of the title this year. This should be a great championship battle over the next 7 races if Sadler can overcome his recent mishaps. I wonder how much longer the whole "making excuses for Danica" fad will last. Hopefully it's not too much longer because she can only learn these tracks and these cars for so much longer. Nelson Piquet, Jr. won a Nationwide race in just his 3rd start after growing up racing open wheel cars, Danica had a similar upbringing and has only 1 top five to show for it. She's just wasting her team's time with that JRM equipment in my eyes. Put Bliss, Nemechek, Clements, Bowles-- well, pretty much any full-time Nationwide driver that doesn't get tv time--in the car and they'll be contending for wins. Oh, and before one of you marks that constantly has to remind us that teams hire drivers who have sponsors, let me stop you right there. I know how the system works, but in a perfect world, we would hire drivers with talent. That's all I'm saying. Going back to the Dillon boys and the #3, it doesn't matter much to me what they do with the number. My football team the Minnesota Vikings gave Randy Moss' #84 to Michael Jenkins, but I don't consider Jenkins as a guy ruining the legacy of the #84. But I remember Kerry Earnhardt once saying that if the #3 is going to be brought back to Cup, that they should add another 3 in front of it (as Kerry drove the #33 in Cup for a few races in '04 and '05). RCR owns the Earnhardt-styled font, but I agree with cjs that he should lose the rights to use that number if he doesn't use it. I'd hate to think that one of the Dillon boys will drive the #3 in Cup with hopes of "continuing a legacy that simply cannot be continued by anybody not named Dale Earnhardt". I think Childress is doing his grandsons a huge disservice by giving his grandkids a number that they simply cannot live up to, but they're not doing themselves any favors by acting the way they do. 246. cjs3872 posted: 09.17.2012 - 10:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) About Robby Gordon, you guys forget that he also drove for Chip Ganassi some in 1992, A.J. Foyt in 1993, and then left for Derrick Walker's car in 1994, then left for NASCAR in 1996 and jumped between NASCAR and IndyCar for three years before settling into NASCAR in 2000. He then jumped from a team he co-owned with John Menard to the Morgan-McClure car, then got in the #31 car for Childress, where he immediately clashed with Kevin Harvick. Then after being replaced by Jeff Burton at Childress in 2004, he bought the #7 team, where he was immediately hit with bad luck, as the first real victim of the top 35 exemption rule, as he failed to qualify for a Daytona 500 he would have started 15th in any previous year, and his team never truly recovered from that. And no murb (#253), he was never a candidate for the #11 car. And after his experiences with other teams (Ganassi, Foyt, Walker, Robert Yates, SabCo, Menard, and Childress), he wanted to control his own destiny, so much like Dave Marcis from another generation, he wanted no part of driving for another team. And a guy like Joe Gibbs would never have hired him anyway. That would have made him and Tony Stewart teammates, and like I said, those two have never gotten along. And as for Austin Dillon being faster than Elliott Sadler, I'm not sure about that. If anything, the oppposite is true. I think Sadler is actually faster than Dillon this year, but of course, Sadler also has 15 years of experience that Dillon doesn't have, and has used that to great advantage. Another thing about Dillon is that, like Trevor Bayne, he may be one of those drivers suited more to the longer races in Cup than the shorter Nationwide races. Sure he's run third through sixth a lot this year, but it may be a case of biding hs time to charge at the finish. After all, he's an intelligent driver for his age, as is his brother. And what good does it do to run hard the whole race and crash making a mistake? And as for him speaking in interviews, doesn't he sound an awful lot like Davey Allison? And by the way, I don't get that vibe about either of the Dillon brothers. Quite the opposite actually. And yes, Stenhouse seems over his summer slump, but he's a driver capable of taking himself out of races at any time, like he did at Dover earlier this year, so Sadler still has a chance because of his greater experience. Having driven (and won for) sages like the Wood Brothers, Robert Yates, and now Childress, he has that experience to fall back on. He also has a much better chance at beating Stenhouse for the title this year than he had last, because his cars are faster, and he also knows that Stenhouse does have the knack for beating himself from time to time. Another advantage Sadler might have, especially if Dillon falls out of contention, is teammates to help him, if Childress wants to help him. Remember that Stenhouse is effectively on an island, with no teammates, and only one other competitve Ford, the RPM car driven by Micahel Annett, is running the circuit, so Stenhouse is not going to get much help at all. In fact, I still favor Sadler to win the title for those reasons. 247. murb posted: 09.17.2012 - 11:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs, here's an article from Jayski's news archive on the 11 team: "Robby to Gibbs? the Winston Salem Journal is reporting.....Robby Gordon's season with car owner Richard Childress hasn't been that great. It started fine, and he could have won Darlington. But since then things have gone downhill, generally because of bad luck and too many crashes. So there are questions being raised about Gordon's future with Childress. Yesterday Gordon finished seventh, his best run since Talladega in April. Ironically just as those questions are being heard about Gordon and Childress, officials at Joe Gibbs Racing are expressing interest in Gordon as a candidate for next year's third team [#11 Fed-Ex], as a teammate with Tony Stewart and Bobby Labonte. Stewart is calling Gordon one of the most talented drivers in the Cup garage. Stewart's crew says that Stewart would like to have Gordon as a teammate and could work with him. Stewart and Gordon are NASCAR's top two Indy-car racers.(Winston Salem Journal)(8-2-2004)" I'm not saying that it was close to happening, but it was considered, according to this. I think Robby would have done a lot better in that car then Leffler did. But like we've been saying, Robby decided to do it the hard way and form his own team, with catastrophic results. DSFF said it best. He should just stick to desert racing. 248. Paul posted: 09.17.2012 - 11:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Cjs, I didn't say that Austin is faster that Elliott in general, I was only speaking for that one spot at Chicago when Austin allowed Logano to stay in front of him even though he had a faster car, then let Elliott pass him before his crew chief told him to pass Elliott back. To be honest, I never got that Davey Allison-like vive from Austin. To me, Davey seemed like a genuinely nice guy, while Austin I feel is only nice in front of the camera. Remember at Bristol when Trevor Bayne got in his face (which is very productive for Trevor in my eyes)? He says to Trevor "don't touch me" while having a big smile on his face, almost like it was an insecure defense mechanism that went off when he was confronted by another driver. Also, I never knew Davey as a driver when he was alive, so I'm afraid we're not going to see eye-to-eye on this issue. It could be because of the greater coverage that he's gotten from ESPN this season, because Austin didn't annoy me last year when SPEED was covering his races, and Ty doesn't annoy me either. And cjs, now that you mention the all those teams that Robby drove for in such a short period of time in both IndyCar and NASCAR, I'm going to change my Robby Gordon comparison. He's not the Ryan Leaf of NASCAR, he's the Jeff George of NASCAR. Jeff was the 1st overall pick in 1990, but despite his great talents, could never get along with his teammates or coaches long enough to stay in one place for too long. As a result, Jeff played for 8 teams in 15 seasons, and never more than 4 with one team. And you're right about Robby and Smoke not getting along. I can't recall them having an incident since their near-fight in 2000, but I can't recall hearing about them making up either. Kurt Busch may be a hothead, but even he and Smoke made up, twice if I'm not mistaken. 249. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.17.2012 - 11:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I just wanna say I know Robby's "my way or nothing" attitude has attracted him a lot of fans, and I respect those who gravitate towards it. For me personally though I just can't look past the wasted potential. 250. Jocke Persson posted: 09.17.2012 - 11:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 176. JG24FanForever posted: Brad Keselowski ties the great Kyle Petty in career wins with his 8th. __________________________________ Yeah, but in 713 less races. 251. Jocke Persson posted: 09.17.2012 - 11:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 220. 10andJoe posted: Also Brad's getting into Jimmie's and Chad's heads. ________________________________ Like Kurt did? 252. Jocke Persson posted: 09.18.2012 - 12:01 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) 185. JG24FanForever posted: Does anyone know if Will Power is the first Driver in Pro Racing history with 3 straight Championship runner-ups? _________________________________________ Stirling Moss was runner-up for four years straight in the Formula One World Championship between 1955-58. 253. JG24FanForever posted: 09.18.2012 - 12:05 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) ^^^ Stirling Moss is the Master of not winning the World Championship. But he's often cited as one of the 8 great F1 drivers of all-time. Thanks for the info. 254. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.18.2012 - 12:30 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) JG24Fan, I didn't want to mention it, but you touched on probably the biggest reason I want NASCAR to retire the #3. The fact that he died in that car makes it a much more delicate situation. Had Dale been able to just retire on his own terms and walk out for the last time, somebody would be there to drive that #3 the very next year as it should be, like it was for Richard (except that dumb decision to run the #44 in '93). The same circumstances that led to the modifieds retiring Richie's #61. And I know the next question is what about other driver's that have passed away in cars. I know this sounds harsh and hypocritical, but you have to consider the legend and status of a driver at the time of their on track passing imo. I agree with the mods retiring the #61, and I am for the retiring of the #3. And yes, I know it is coming back within the next year or two to Cup with Austin. That is just a fact. He is in for something he's not gonna want driving that number (in any style) on the big stage. 255. cjs3872 posted: 09.18.2012 - 1:26 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) No it's not, DSFF. Richard Childress has said many times that he has no intention of ever running the #3 in the Cup series again. My guess is that when Austin runs in the Cup Series, that he will either be driving car #31, replacing Jeff Burton (which is needed badly), or car #33 (ex-RCR crew chief Andy Petree's old number), which he drove at Michigan earlier ths year. And Ty would either get whichever one of those numbers his brother doesn't get, though there are a couple of other possibilities. One is to give Ty the #41, the number with which he won the ARCA championship last year, and another is to give him the #51, the car number he's driven in his two NNS starts, and the car number that Neil Bonnett, a close friend of both Childress and Dale Earnhardt, was driving when he was killed nine days before the 1994 Daytona 500 in almost the exact place that Earnhardt would be killed seven years and seven days later. 256. Paul posted: 09.18.2012 - 2:30 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) But cjs, don't you think RCR will keep Jeff Burton at least through the 2014 season so that he can mentor Austin Dillon when he inevitably reaches Cup? I know that Burton isn't competitive anymore, but his leadership is still very valuable to that organization and he could help Austin transition into and mature into a strong competitor in Cup. For that reason, I don't think he will drive the #31 once he reaches Cup and think that 33 will be his number, unless of course Childress gives him the #3. 257. Paul posted: 09.18.2012 - 2:40 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) It looks like Ricky Stenhouse, Jr. will drive the #6 Cup car at Dover next week. This was one of the tracks I said a couple weeks ago that I think they should send him to in his pre-rookie year. Dover is notoriously tough on younger drivers and having him drive there now when it doesn't matter should be good for him. Ryan Pemberton could take Tony Eury, Jr.'s place as Danica's Nationwide crew chief. If that's the case, then she'll have an even softer guy to make excuses m=for her over the radio. At least Tony Jr. would occasionally tell her what she was doing wrong, but Ryan doesn't seem like that kind of guy. And Ricky Craven will wave the green flag for the Truck race at Kentucky this weekend, which doesn't make much sense considering that the Cup Series will be at his native New Hampshire Motor Speedway and he could just as well wave the green flag for that race instead. But, I digress. 258. Benjamin Lowe posted: 09.18.2012 - 7:11 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Danica Patrick is the Brian Bosworth of Auto Racing. 259. JG24FanForever posted: 09.18.2012 - 7:12 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) If your a big fan the ninety's Cup series, then watch this video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GzpSABmR4cg 260. Jocke Persson posted: 09.18.2012 - 11:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) #253 I think he was the designated number two. Fangio was the one who got the latest parts and the wins. Much like Irvine, Barrichello & Massa in recent years. 261. Paul posted: 09.18.2012 - 2:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) JG24, that's a great video. I never got to experience NASCAR in the '90s first-hand, but just from watching videos like that, it's obvious how much has been lost in NASCAR over the past 15 years. 262. cjs3872 posted: 09.18.2012 - 3:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I know it's off topic, but R.I.P., Steve Sabol. Sabol died today from brain cancer at the age of 69. Without the futuristic ideas of he and his father Ed, the video documentation of sports events, and sports in general, would not be nearly what it is today, and most of the recording techniques used in highlight packages tday, either for highlight shows like SportsCenter and it's offspring, or film documentaries of sports and major sporting events, were pioneered by NFL Films, and Steve Sabol was a major part of that. The video documentation of sports will never be the same without the man who's ideas made the video documentation of sports what it is today. 263. Paul posted: 09.18.2012 - 4:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well said cjs. Steve Sabol may not be the biggest name in sports, but he had arguably the biggest impact by allowing fans to feel like they're a part of the action as they watch from their home. Without Steve Sabol, football is just a game; but because of him and his work with NFL Films, it became almost a part of us who watched it. From all accounts I've heard, he was a genius behind the camera and a great human being. May he rest in peace. In NASCAR-related news, A.J. Allmendinger has been reinstated by NASCAR one day after completing NASCAR's "Road to Recovery" program. Penske has stated that he would be willing to rehire A.J., but didn't specify which sport he would hire him for. With Ryan Briscoe possibly leaving Penske's IndyCar team, A.J. could take his place in Penske's #2 IndyCar. 264. cjs3872 posted: 09.18.2012 - 4:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And Paul, Sabol's influence extends beyond football. NFL Films did a number of sporting events outside of football, including the 1974 PGA Championship, and their lab services were extensively used by the Augusta National Golf Club for the Masters films from 1982-'84, and even the Indianapolis Motor Speedway used their services for the 1987 Indianapolis 500 film, and every sports highlight program today uses and does things pioneered by NFL Films nearly a half century ago. And the narration done by NFL Films also changed the way sporting events are documented by making it ore dramatic, and that's used in just about every sport today. In fact, NASCAR even uses that style today, as well. In fact, NASCAR's film division has used a couple of people that narrated for NFL Films, including Earl Mann and Jim Birdsall. Those two men narrated every Super Bowl film for a decade (Mann narrated the films for Super Bowls 30-33 and Birdsall narrated for the next six after that). And the legendary John Facenda even narrated a piece involving NASCAR in 1983. And NFL Films music was frequently used in the Car and Track series with Bud Lindemann back in the late 60s through the mid 70s. 265. Talon64 posted: 09.18.2012 - 4:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Grand-Am's racing at Lime Rock in a couple of weeks, so you might see AJ in the #60 Shank DP car. Michael Shank's already tweeted that he's looking forward to teaming up with AJ for the Daytona 24 Hours for an 8th straight year. No duh since they'll be going for back-to-back 24HaD victories. 266. Schroeder51 posted: 09.18.2012 - 5:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) ^There is a comment that will surely not last long... 267. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.18.2012 - 5:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #Oldschoolstache is gone :( 268. David posted: 09.18.2012 - 5:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, it's happened. We should have known that we weren't immune to it. Now it's staring us in the face. The idiots from other websites who like to make stupid comments have finally invaded. 269. David posted: 09.18.2012 - 5:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @270 Maybe he thought it was a jinx from 1993. 270. Schroeder51 posted: 09.18.2012 - 6:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #271 Unfortunately, that's the way the Internet is in general. It is the breeding ground for idiots. 271. murb posted: 09.18.2012 - 6:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I believe that it is in AJ's best interest to go back to IndyCar. He needs to rejuvenate and reinvent himself, so what better way to do that then to go back to his roots? There are plenty of quality options in that series as well. Plenty more than Nascar, at least. As Paul was saying, it's been reported that Penske is willing to rehire AJ (AJ was a guest of the team at this past weekend's IndyCar finale at Fontana). I think he could do a good job in that 2 car. Briscoe has been lagging for the past couple of years there. But also, I've heard that many of the single-car Honda teams are considering adding second cars to their stable. And AJ Foyt's team is also interested in him, apparently. If he were to stick around in Nascar, he would have an awfully hard time finding a Cup ride. He would probably have to go the Scott Speed route and start out by start/parking for someone. So I think it's his best bet to go back to IndyCar. 272. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.18.2012 - 6:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think we do a good job here of simply ignoring people like that. Should be deleted soon and it will be like it never happened. We are a good group here (even you Bronco lol). 273. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.18.2012 - 6:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I also just wnat to announce that, for the first time since 2000, I am officially "all in" in rooting for a driver to win a championship. Sure I "wanted" Brad to win it last year. But I knew deep down they weren't ready, so my defenses were still mostly up. Just like with Dale from '97-'99. I "wanted" him to win the championship those years, but I knew between his injuries and how bad the top teams (HMS, Roush, Yates, JGR) were ahead of RCR it wasn't gonna happen. So my defenses against disappointment were up until my 16th birthday. In the Darlington Spring race of 2000 (it is on YouTube now, a great race and a Ward Burton win!) a soon to be 49 year old Dale finished 3rd with a 7th place car. Between him FINALLY getting surgery, his son becoming the biggest thing to hit NASCAR since the merchandise boom of the late 80s and early 90s (spearheaded by "Intimidator" and "Man In Black" T-Shirts), and RCR gaining some of their lost ground back, you could see the rejuvenation in him. So I let my guard down, felt bad the next race when he crashed at Bristol, but felt GREAT after the first Loudon race when he was just 45 points behind Bobby. I just knew Dale was gonna make another kick ass late season run and I was gonna get to watch Dale win the Cup again. For a record eigth time no less! You know the rest: he blew a tire at the second Pocono, got whooped by Bobby at Indy, and wrecked unassisted at The Glen. But anyways, for the first time since 2000 my defenses are down. I am all in. Am I setting myself for heartbreak? The odds say yes, especially considering HMS' week in week out strength and the fact Brad hasn't made a mistake in Cup in a while (at Dover Brad is looking at losing at least 13 points to the 48 cause JJ WILL win and lead the most laps while Brad WILL struggle to finish 10th). But I don't care. I am ready for the emotional rollercoaster. 274. Paul posted: 09.18.2012 - 7:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Exactly DSFF. As a great man once said: "Don't feed the trolls." I think we all do a great job of respecting each other's opinions on this board, while at the same time having great discussions and debates about racing. murb, A.J. going back to IndyCar would be great for his career in that he will most likely be competitive right away, but I think if he leaves NASCAR for IndyCar, it'll be permanent. These cars are already difficult to learn the first time around, but to leave for a year, or even several years, and then come back and have to re-learn these cars, I just don't see A.J. doing that. I know A.J. Foyt could come in front open wheel cars and be competitive in stock cars, but as it's already been stated, he's A.J. "Freaking" Foyt! I just don't think A.J. is good enough at stock cars to leave and have any chance at coming back and being successful. Probably the best thing he can do is get aligned with a top team (such as Penske) and stay with them, even if it means driving only part-time. Sam Hornish, Jr. stayed with Penske after losing his Cup ride last year, and in a part-time Nationwide schedule, won a race and is back in a full-time ride with a shot at driving a 3rd Penske Cup car in 2013. I think if A.J. stays in NASCAR and is willing to drive a part-time Nationwide/Cup schedule next year for Penske (if he returns to Penske, of course), then 2013 will be considered a rebuilding year and hopefully he can resurrect his career that way. Again, I just think that going to IndyCar, while being good for his career on a smaller scale, will end his NASCAR career. Just look at Dario Franchitti; he went back to IndyCar after one Cup season (that he clearly wasn't ready for) and hasn't returned since, and I feel like that will happen to A.J. as well should he go to IndyCar. 275. Paul posted: 09.18.2012 - 7:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF #276, just be warned: That damn 48 team ruined what looked to be a perfect 2007 season for my driver. I hope that doesn't happen this year because I like Brad and am rooting for anybody not named Johnson, Harvick, or Hamlin to win this title, but just a little heads-up because that 48 team has broken hearts in the past. 276. David posted: 09.18.2012 - 7:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I like Brad and am rooting for anybody not named Johnson, Harvick, or Hamlin to win this title" 2010 wasn't a very good year for you, huh? Most of the time I will avoid posting comments about trolls' comments, but this time I slipped. 277. Paul posted: 09.18.2012 - 7:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) We all have our moments David. As for 2010, I consider that my off year as a NASCAR fan. Not just because Brad sucked, Gordon went winless, and Johnson, Hamlin, and Harvick were the title contenders, but because I wasn't watching that season. I literally watched the first two races and then didn't watch another race until the 2011 Daytona 500, so my only memory of that season was seeing Jamie McMurray win the Daytona 500. Now that I think about it, after re-reading my third sentence, I'm glad I wasn't watching because I would have just been miserable haha. 278. David posted: 09.18.2012 - 7:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) So, how's the weather over there? It is beautiful evening here in Kansas. 279. startandparkfan posted: 09.18.2012 - 7:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) AJ IS BACK IN NASCAR!!! YAY! Also, J J Yeley continues to not make races, while Cole Whitt brought his skills to cup to start and park the Pick-a-Name motorsports car. (really, wasn't it LTD Powersports last year?) 280. David posted: 09.18.2012 - 7:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "beautiful evening" Should be "a beautiful evening"... 281. startandparkfan posted: 09.18.2012 - 8:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 283, here in NY it is POURING and incredibly windy! 282. startandparkfan posted: 09.18.2012 - 8:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) One more thing... Jeff Gordon failed to make it work after just making the chase! None of my faves ever do well! Except Gordon last year, and Ryan Blaney! 283. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.18.2012 - 8:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The weather sucked in NC here today. Supposed to be better tomorrow, but it was a friggin monsson at 1pm when I was driving to my training meeting. And people cannot friggin drive on the highway in the rain. Swerving in and out of lanes, tailgating, and just being jackasses. 284. Mr X posted: 09.18.2012 - 8:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, Brad will win the title in the future, and while we're talking about the weather, Winnipeg has seen some slightly cooler temps then usual this September, with lows around freezing, and high's in the mid teens, lots of wind, but no rain. 285. David posted: 09.18.2012 - 9:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Monsoon? We could use one of those here. 286. Paul posted: 09.18.2012 - 9:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's finally getting cold here in Minnesota. Hadn't been cooler than 70 degrees all month, now suddenly we're in the 50s. This should be one fun fall/winter. 287. murb posted: 09.18.2012 - 9:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm in Idaho, so one day it is 80 degrees and sunny, and the next day it is in the 50s and fully cloudy. I think we're on par with Pocono as far as drastic weather changes go, lol 288. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.18.2012 - 9:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And just like that he never existed. Good work to my fellow posters and a huge shout out to the webmaster. This is an excellent debate site because of you guys. 289. Schroeder51 posted: 09.18.2012 - 10:10 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Being from South Carolina, I can't help but laugh a bit seeing that 70 degrees would be a damn great summer day considering most summer days here push 100 or surpass it. It really sucks spending pretty much 3 months on end with every day being 85+ degrees, at least. Right now it's finally in the lower 80s, which for me is much appreciated! I'm sure some of you will laugh when I say that I find the 40-50 degree winters around here cold... 290. Paul posted: 09.18.2012 - 10:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Haha, I do laugh at that Schroeder51. 40-50 degree winters up here would be a blessing. And kudos to the Webmaster and my fellow posters for "keeping the streets clean" on this site. I really appreciate the integrity of this site. 291. 18fan posted: 09.19.2012 - 12:26 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I wish it was in the 70s where I am. It's been in the 90s and 100s for months here in Southern California. At least when the race comes around in March the weather is pleasant. 292. cjs3872 posted: 09.19.2012 - 1:15 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) It wasn't pleasant there for the Cup race this year, 18fan. If you remember, the race was rain shortened. And the 2008 spring race there (the last Cup race there while I was in Southern California) was also marred by rain and weepers. If you ask me, the best times of the year to have a Cup race there would be when the first two Cup races were there, either in May or June before it gets really hot, or the season finale to crown a champion in such a big media capital like Southern California, as was the case for many years, either at Riverside or the Ontario Motor Speedway. 293. Mr X posted: 09.19.2012 - 1:52 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) As promised here are the up to date top 15 in points standings as of Sunday's Chicagoland race, those of you joining in late can find out how my system works on the 2012 Watkins Glen Cup race comments page, comment #272. Those of you looking for last weeks standings can find them on last weeks Richmond Cup race comments page, comment #332. Top 15 as of CS-Race #27 without Chase Driver-Points Total-Bonus Points-(Difference) 1. Jimmie Johnson-29849-705-(Leader) 2. Greg Biffle-29538-362-(-311) 3. Dale Earnhardt Jr.-29366-258-(-483) 4. Brad Keselowski-29018-310-(-831) 5. Matt Kenseth-28724-288-(-1125) 6. Clint Bowyer-27901-169-(-1948) 7. Denny Hamlin-27885-497-(-1964) 8. Martin Truex Jr.-27632-252-(-2217) 9. Tony Stewart-26850-258-(-2999) 10. Kevin Harvick-26661-117-(-3188) 11. Kasey Kahne-26104-120-(-3745) 12. Kyle Busch-25609-433-(-4240) 13. Jeff Gordon-24493-189-(-5356) 14. Ryan Newman-23913-9-(-5936) 15. Carl Edwards-23654-106-(-6195) Top 13 as of CS-Race #27 with Chase Driver-Points Total-Bonus Points-(Difference) 1. Brad Keselowski-41868-48-(Leader) 2. Jimmie Johnson-41750-110-(-118) 3. Tony Stewart-41442-2-(-426) 4. Kasey Kahne-41340-0-(-528) 5. Kyle Busch-41280-0-(-588) 6. Clint Bowyer-41204-4-(-664) 7. Dale Earnhardt Jr.-41200-0-(-668) 8. Denny Hamlin-41153-1-(-715) 9. Greg Biffle-41088-0-(-780) 10. Martin Truex Jr.-41080-0-(-788) 11. Kevin Harvick-40960-0-(-908) 12. Matt Kenseth-40849-1-(-1019) 13. Jeff Gordon-24493-189-(-17375) Keep in mind that under this system Jeff missed the chase and Kyle made it in. All of the bonus points you see under the chase standings are after the first chase race, with the exception of Jeff Gordon. 294. Paul posted: 09.19.2012 - 2:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Robby Gordon's Stadium SUPER Trucks league has reached an agreement with the NBC Sports Group to have the inaugural 2013 SST season broadcast on NBC and NBC Sports starting April 2013. 295. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.19.2012 - 5:21 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Robby Gordon is now a jerk of all trades. Here in Florida, it's hotter than hell, March-November. You need a chainsaw to cut the air. 296. Paul posted: 09.19.2012 - 11:31 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Because Sam Hornish, Jr. will be in Kentucky most of the weekend for the Nationwide race, Dave Blaney will practice and qualify the #22 Cup car at Loudon and Tony Raines will be in the #36. The fact that Penske wants Hornish to drive his Cup car even though he's going to miss the entire weekend up until the race, tells me that Penske wants Hornish in a 3rd Cup car next season. If he was just in the car to finish out the year before Logano takes it next year, I don't think they'd ask him to drive it this weekend, similar to when he drove it at Michigan despite missing practice and qualifying. It could also be because Shell-Pennzoil wants him in the car, which is even more reason to put him in a 3rd Cup car. Penske made a big mistake taking Logano over Hornish, but he can still right his wrong by putting Hornish in a 3rd Cup car next season. 297. Scott B posted: 09.19.2012 - 12:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Paul, I think you are correct that Penske is trying to make a case to sponsors to run a third Cup car with Hornish next year. I do think that will happen, but only on a part-time schedule. It seems like a weird situation for Logano to put himself in. After all those years at Gibbs of not living up to expectations, he's essentially joining a new organization where from day one he'll be looking over his shoulder at a potential replacement. There's going to be a lot of second guessing on that contract. 298. cjs3872 posted: 09.19.2012 - 12:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Paul, I think the thing is that I think Penske hired Joey Logano over Sam Hornish, Jr. is that I'm not sure Penske thinks Hornish can run with the leaders in the Cup series, but he thinks Logano can run with the front runners, as evidenced by his two career wins. It's a situation where Penske wants someone in the #22 car that can run with the leaders in the Cup series, and Penske doesn't think that Hornish can run up there, while it's been proven that Logano can run with the leaders, even though he doesn't do it very often. Penske probably realizes that Hornish has reached his ceiling in the Cup series by running 8th-12th, where he thinks that Logano can run up front and contend for wins, and hiring Hornish to drive a third car would, in my mind, be a disaster waiting for a place to happen, and I think Penske knows that. What I think he would really like to do is to wait for two or three years, and then put someone like Ryan Blaney in that third car. It's a case where Logano's ceiling is higher than Hornish's, as Hornish has probably already reached his ceiling in NASCAR, and I think Penske realizes that. What I think Penske wants to do is to put Ryan Blaney in the #12 NNS car in 2014, and possibly in the Cup series by 2015 or '16, either in one of the existing cars, or in a third car. But another reason, and I hate to keep harping on it, that Penske is hesitant to start a third Cup team, even if he has sponsorship, is that top 35 exemption rule. Since that third team would have no points, it would have to qualify on time. He was okay that last time he tried this because he had a past champion in Kurt Busch, and he could switch the points around within his own team to give Hornish the #2's points because Busch had a champion's provisional to use. Unless Brad Keselowski wins the championship, Penske will not have this option. Penske might start a third team if Keselowski won the championship because he could play the shell game to get the third team in the first five races, including the Daytona 500, and have Keselowski use the start-up team's points (or lack of) because he'd have the champion's provisional to use. Penske might be waiting to see how the Chase goes before he makes that decision of whether or not to run a third car in the Daytona 500 and the other races in the frst five of the season. But if Keselowski does win the title this year, look for the #12 car to run the first five races of 2013, at least, with the #12 car getting the #2's points, and Keselowski to use the champion's provisional, if needed. But if Keselowski doesn't win the title this year, don't look for the #12 car to run early next season, because it will not have a safety net. 299. Paul posted: 09.19.2012 - 1:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Cjs, I agree that Logano's ceiling is higher than Hornish's because he does have two wins and has shown on occasion to run top 5, while Hornish seems to only break top 10. But while Logano's ceiling may be higher, I think Hornish's floor is much higher as well, as he has been more consistent over the past 2 months ever since he stepped into the #22 Cup car than Logano has been in his 4th year in the JGR #20 the past 2 months. In the 10 races where Hornish has been in the #22, he has five top 12 finishes and one finish worse than 22nd, while Logano has only three top 12 finishes and four finishes of 22nd or worse. On the other hand, all three of Logano's top 12 finishes have been top 10s, while only one of Hornish's five top 12 finishes have been top 10s. Hornish is currently on a three-race streak of finishing 11th, while Logano has finishes of 18th, 30th, and 7th the past three weeks. So while Logano's ceiling may be higher, Hornish is more consistent and thus has a higher floor than Logano. With Logano, you're not sure if he's going to battle for a top 5 or be slow all race and finish 24th. With Hornish, it's a matter of will be finish in the top 10 or have some bad luck with cautions or a speeding penalty and finish 18th with a top 10 car. So cjs, what do you think Penske would prefer? You seem to know about him and what he likes out of his drivers. You once mentioned how Penske fired Tom Sneva from his USAC Champ Car team after 1978 because he wasn't aggressive enough, despite winning the title in '77 and '78. Do you think Penske would rather have a driver like Logano that will finish anywhere from 1st to 30th, or a driver like Hornish that will finish anywhere from 7th to 18th? Thinking back on Penske's history as a Cup owner, I can't think of anyone who fits the same description as Hornish, but I can think of a few that fit the same description as Logano (Busch, Newman, Mayfield). And also, do you think Penske's keeping Hornish on his team because he plans on moving him to Cup full-time, or is it more because he's a dependable driver that Penske's known since his IndyCar days and he won't move him to Cup because he isn't aggressive enough to win at that level? 300. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.19.2012 - 1:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Still don't understand what Brad and The Captain are seeing in Logano. 301. Paul posted: 09.19.2012 - 1:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Honestly DSFF, I think they just looked at who was available for 2013 and who had the highest win total, which Logano as if you count the Nationwide Series as well. I don't see how Brad and Joey can get along though because they come across as being the complete opposite of one another. Brad had to drive junk for several years before he got his first opportunity, Joey got his opportunity at a young age largely because of his dad's money. Brad isn't afraid to speak his own mind, Joey's mind is made up of what other people have said to him. Brad races for wins, Joey races for a good finish. Brad dumps people who do him wrong (Denny Hamlin), Joey dumps people who "are in the way" (Tim Bainey, Jr.). But most importantly, Brad has overachieved in his career, while "The Greatest Thing Since Sliced Bread" has underachieved. Why someone who's been a career underachiever is getting Cup opportunities is mind-boggling to me. Personally, I'd rather have a driver like Brad that will win races and a driver like Hornish who will finish races, than a driver like Brad and a driver like Joey who will finish anywhere on the track on a weekly basis. Brad will get into the Chase based on wins and consistency, Sam will contend for the Chase based on consistency (Dale Jr. style), but Joey will only contend if he has a win, which I don't think he's capable of on a yearly basis. 302. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 09.19.2012 - 2:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If Logano can't run up front more often than he has with JGR, I too don't see much hope for him in the #22. I don't see Joey as a Johnny Benson or Jamie McMurray type of driver where they struggle at one organization then find success at another. 303. cjs3872 posted: 09.19.2012 - 2:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Paul, one thing about Penske's firing of Tom Sneva after 1978 when he won the championship without winning a race was that Bobby Unser became available in 1979. Had Unser not become available for 1979, Penske would never have fired Sneva because Sneva brought Penske's team to where drivers like Mario Andretti and Bobby Unser wanted to drive for them. As for what kind of drivers Penske likes, Penske himself has a saying that his drivers have to "put the numbers on the board". Personally, I think that Hornish and/or Logano are stop gaps until Ryan Blaney steps into one of Penske's cars in about three years, because he seems to be the real thing. In fact, his performances on the track, combined with his demeanor off it, would seem to make him the perfect Penske driver. And remember that it Brad Keselowski that apparently urged Penske to hire Joey Logano. Now a couple of things could be at work here. First, I think Joey's relatively poor showings in the #20 car has to do with a combination of factors. First, he was rushed, something all parties involved have admitted to, but somethig that Tony Stewart effectively forced on Gibbs when he left. Then there's the problem of Gibbs simply not focusing on the #20 car. When he hired Kyle Busch, the intent was to get the #18 car, the flagship car at JGR, back among the contenders, and that was accomplished, but in doing that, there was virtually no attention paid to the #20 car, which is why I worry about the #11 car next year with Matt Kenseth in the #20 next year. And I think Keselowski knows that he's the kind of person that can make Joey Logano a more aggressive driver, which is something he has almost always lacked in his Cup career. And of course, a change of scenery could help Logano out, as well. And let's not forget that Logano's only 22 years old, so Penske and Keselowsi figure they have time to make Logano a winning driver. If Logano becomes a contender more often next year, especially if either the 11 or 18 struggle, it will say a lot about the Gibbs organization and their inability to focus on all three cars. 304. Dave #38 Fan posted: 09.19.2012 - 5:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) but cjs, if you look at the last few races in the cup series, hornish had been a LOT closer to the leaders than logano has. at richmond, hornish finised 11th and logano was around 28th multiple laps down, if hornish were eligible for points, since the july daytona race hornish would be 18th in points, logano would be 19th. and don't forget that logano has more stock car experience than sam (counting nns and east series), so there's no excuse for that (on logano's end). hornish's average finish in the #22 is also slightly better than allmendinger, i can't remember exactly but a.j. was 22nd or 23rd in points at the time of his suspension, that's where logano will be all next year. 305. Talon64 posted: 09.19.2012 - 5:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Still don't understand what Brad and The Captain are seeing in Logano." They see a guy who's only 22 years old and already has 2 Cup wins. Well, one that didn't involve Biblical-miracle amounts of luck with pit strategy and rain. And also a guy who lights it up in the Nationwide Series on a level with the likes of Kyle Busch, Carl Edwards, Kevin Harvick and Brad Keselowski (it makes me happy to put him here when I was making this same point for him back in 2010). And they see no reason to divert from their original plan of putting Hornish in a 3rd Cup car, which they were going to do before Allmendinger's suspension. And I don't think it'll be as big a disaster as the last time Penske had 3 teams. Worst case scenario? Logano is the next David Ragan. Struggles with the championship organization that originally brought him up, then eventually falls into obscurity. Don't forget though that if Allmendinger hadn't become available, it would be David Ragan driving the #22 Penske car right now and might have done a good enough job to still have it for 2013. I wonder how pissed off Ragan was when Allmendinger pissed that ride away? Best case scenario? He's the next Brian Vickers. Struggles with the championship team that originally brought him up but then proves that he's got the ability with another organization. Did it with Red Bull Racing, and when that wasn't good enough for people he goes and runs top 5 just about every race in a partial schedule for MWR. Now people are clamoring for him to have a full time ride. I get that people don't like how Logano didn't have to work for what he had, hold it against him and will always continue to hold it against him. But Pocono proved he can step up and be a legitimate winner in the Cup Series under the right circumstances and I trust both Roger Penske's evaluation of talent and that he can give Logano the right circumstances to succeed. Or he won't. But I'd rather be optimistic about it and think Logano's going to fail. 306. Talon64 posted: 09.19.2012 - 5:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hornish is 33 years old. That gives him the edge as far as maturity in both life and racing, so I do have to agree that at this point his floor's higher than Logano's right now. I also agree that the ceiling's not higher, but he's still worthy enough of that 3rd Penske Cup car and I'm sure he'll get it. But Keselowski thinks Logano's a better choice for the #22 than Hornish. Maybe it's because he sees that Hornish can't be as competitive in the same Nationwide equipment as he can, despite them being pretty even as far as experience in Nationwide and Cup. And maybe he sees that Logano can get the job done and then some in Nationwide but can't find what works in Cup, just like what he went through in 2010. That's what I see, at least. And it's why I agree with Penske putting Logano in the #22. 307. cjs3872 posted: 09.19.2012 - 7:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dave #38 Fan, I agree that Logano's performances aren't up to his teammates, but remember that little to no attention's been paid to the #20 team by JGR for five years, so it's only natural that Logano would struggle. Another part of the problem is that Logano is a conservative driver for a good part of the race, and that conservatism is a part of why he gets so far behind. Brad Keselowski is just the kind of driver that will get Logano out of that, because he will get Logano to become more aggressive. Also, if Logano does get in some kind of scrape, Keselowski is the kind of guy that will back him up. When Logano got into those scrapes with Greg Biffle and Kevin Harvick a couple of years ago, hardly anybody at JGR backed him up, and the drivers certainly didn't, because neither Denny Hamlin or Kyle Busch have it in them to act as mentors, or to protect their teammates. He won't have that problem at Penske, especially with Keseloswki there. Keselowski is one of those kind that if someone messes with Logano when he gets there, that someone will have to deal with Keselowski down the line, because Brad's the kind that won't take anything from anyone, and if someone does try to get into a teammate's head, Brad won't stand for it from what I've seen. 308. Jordan posted: 09.19.2012 - 8:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think Hornish actually has a higher ceiling than Logano, I know most people probably wouldn't agree with this though. At this point, each of them have basically the same amount of Cup experience. Hornish has never been given all the tools to succeed at Penske as Logano has been given at Gibbs, which overall has been the better team during their careers. The big difference is, Logano has been driving stock cars his whole like as his dad is just as bad as one of those beauty pageant moms. Hornish never really drove a stock car until he decided to switch in 2006. It took him a while, but I think he's really become a great driver in a stock car because Penske was patient with him and gave him time to develop. To me, the biggest difference between Hornish and Logano is the drive to win. Hornish knows what it's like to be a winner, he's shown in IndyCar that he'll go for wins. Once he's in a stable situation where he has the resources available to him, he'll get plenty of wins because that's in his mindset. Logano only has one high-level win and he's never really shown any potential of winning on a regular basis even with one of the top 2 teams in the whole series. Anyway, what are Penske's chances of keeping Logano after his contract expires (if he performs well enough to make it that long)? We all know his dad will still be around pushing him towards the highest bidder. 309. murb posted: 09.19.2012 - 8:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I don't see how Brad and Joey can get along though because they come across as being the complete opposite of one another." Their backgrounds are indeed completely opposites. But remember, these two have worked really well together in the NNS plate races. Joey even pushed Brad to the win in the 2010 Talladega race (even though the race ended under caution - Joey was still pushing him. I remember Brad being thankful for that). So I think that is what Brad sees in Joey: a teammate who has potential and will undoubtably be a team player. I'm still not gonna judge Penske's hiring of Logano. That was the big mistake I made with Allmendinger. I predicted that he would go out and win multiple races this year and contend for the Chase. And look how it turned out. So who knows what type of results Joey can post in that 22 car? I do agree with the whole "Hornish deserves a third Cup ride" deal. His runs in the 22 have been fantastic, and I don't believe there is any denying that Penske wants him in Cup. I still think it is being considered. The owners points thing that CJS was talking about was a good point, but I'm sure they would be able to work something out, even if Brad doesn't win the championship and get the past champ's provisional. 310. Paul posted: 09.19.2012 - 9:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "The owners points thing that CJS was talking about was a good point, but I'm sure they would be able to work something out, even if Brad doesn't win the championship and get the past champ's provisional." That is a great point. Take RCR's Nationwide team for example: Austin Dillon's #3 team originally had no owner's points entering this season. Despite having a driver with a past champion's provisional in Kevin Harvick, they decided to purchase their owner's points from Morgan Shepherd, which is one of the reasons why Morgan has struggled making races this season. So even if Brad doesn't win the title, they could still purchase owner's points from another team like Front Row Motorsports, or perhaps hire the services of Terry Labonte or Bill Elliott for the Daytona 500 if they're worried they may miss the Daytona 500. That's really the only race where these big teams have a chance at missing the field with a new car, with only a few exceptions of horrible qualifying in other races. I think Penske will be just fine without having owner's points, especially since if the top 35 rule is still in play in 2013, Hornish could make the Daytona 500 on speed, so he wouldn't have to worry about the qualifying race. I think sponsorship is more of an issue for Penske than owner's points for a 3rd full-time Cup team. 311. David posted: 09.20.2012 - 12:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dum dah dah dum dah DUUUUUUM!!! After many attempts (I have a terrible habit of not finishing started projects), I have finally finished a season with my points system. I started this particular season one week ago, on Wednesday night, and just finished it up a few hours ago. Now which season was it? Drum roll please... 1964... 1949... 1957... 1998... 2007... 1978... 2002!! Yes, let's rewind to the year of the Salt Lake City Winter Olympics and awesome Coldplay hits. The year that Sterling Marlin couldn't get anything to go his way, losing the Daytona 500 by a fender (literally) and bone-jarring wrecks at Richmond and Kansas (also literally). At least he won two races. Oh, and he did lead the points standings for 25 straight weeks, but that's not much :). Without further adieu, the standings and comparisons to the actual standings. 1. Tony Stewart - 1377 2. Kurt Busch - 1329 (+1) 3. Jeff Gordon - 1270 (+1) 4. Matt Kenseth - 1265 (+4) 5. Ryan Newman - 1265 (+1) 6. Mark Martin - 1250 (-4) 7. Jimmie Johnson - 1223 (-2) 8. Dale Jarrett - 1160 (+1) 9. Dale Earnhardt, Jr. - 1074 (+2) 10. Rusty Wallace - 1067 (-3) 11. Ricky Rudd - 999 (-1) 12. Sterling Marlin - 975 (+6) 13. Bill Elliott - 972 14. Jeff Burton - 961 (-2) 15. Michael Waltrip - 830 (-1) 16. Bobby Labonte - 779 17. Ricky Craven - 753 (-2) 18. Kevin Harvick - 708 (+3) 19. Ward Burton - 696 (+6) 20. Jeff Green - 681 (-3) 21. Robby Gordon - 627 (-1) 22. Johnny Benson, Jr. - 623 (+7) 23. Elliott Sadler - 599 24. Dave Blaney - 588 (-5) 25. Terry Labonte - 551 (-1) If you want to know where a particular driver placed, just ask. Further analysis to come. Maybe. 312. Paul posted: 09.20.2012 - 12:07 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) It sounds like JR Motorsports wants to put a veteran driver in the #7 Nationwide car next year to team up with Cole Whitt. JRM hasn't won a race since 2010 at Atlanta with Jamie McMurray and hope that putting a veteran behind the wheel behind one of their cars will improve their program because of the information they will be able to share with the crew. I've also heard that Danica may return for a part-time Nationwide schedule. If that's the case, then it'll probably be shared by her and a number of Cup drivers like Dale Jr., McMurray, and maybe Kasey Kahne (if he leaves Turner). That's probably what it will be, but by the tone of the article, I wouldn't be surprised if they put a veteran in to drive the full season. Kelley Earnhardt-Miller stated that she has no idea who will drive the #7 car next year, and she also said that Dale likes putting younger drivers in his cars because he enjoys teaching them and helping their careers, but it sounds like she'd rather put in a veteran who can get results and give good feedback right away. At the current state of JR Motorsports and the way they seemed to have taken a step back this year, I'd say Kelley has the right idea. Plus, putting a veteran in the #7 car would be great for Cole Whitt because then he'd (hopefully) get feedback from that team and would get more attention from Dale Jr. as far as teaching goes. 313. Paul posted: 09.20.2012 - 12:18 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "4. Matt Kenseth - 1265 (+4)" Today's points system would have really benefited Kenseth back in '02. I still find it hard to believe that one of the most conservative drivers in the sport led the series in wins (5) in what was one of his least consistent seasons (13 non-lead lap finishes). What really hurt him in the points that year was that winning a race in '02 wasn't a whole lot more rewarding in points as 2nd place was, as you could gain anywhere from 0 to 15 points on 2nd place depending on bonus points. Since NASCAR decided to reward more points for winning by redoing the points system in '04, '07, and '11, Kenseth has only twice had seasons with more than 2 wins. Also, if anyone has the time, energy, and patience, I'd like to see where Matt would have finished in '09 under the 1974 points system. He missed the Chase in real life, but I bet winning the Daytona 500 that year would have benefited him tremendously since race winnings were a part of the points system. "6. Mark Martin - 1250 (-4)" I bet Mark Martin's glad we didn't use the current points system back in '02. His lack of winning that season would have made him go from title contender to outside the top 5 and the 3rd highest finishing Roush driver. Oh well, at least he could still say he beat Jimmie Johnson. 314. Paul posted: 09.20.2012 - 1:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sad news in the racing world. Former NASCAR driver Cecil Gordon died yesterday at the age of 71 after a short battle with cancer. Regarded as one of the best independent drivers in NASCAR history, Cecil made 449 Sprint Cup starts between 1968 and 1985, driving for the likes of Henley Gray, Bill Seifert, himself, and made a couple starts for D.K. Ulrich as well. Though he never won a race, he did earn 21 top fives and 111 top ten finishes and finished 3rd in the standings in '71 and '73. He had a career best finish of 2nd in the 1975 500-mile Dover race, finishing 7 laps behind race winner David Pearson, and 3 laps ahead of 3rd place Richard Petty. After his driving career, he worked as a crew member for both RCR with driver Dale Earnhardt and for Travis Carter's Cup team. He is survived by his wife Elaine, his five children, his brother, and his sister. May he rest in peace. 315. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.20.2012 - 1:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hate that. One of the independents that did EVERYTHING on their cars. The original Gordon #24. Those guys were tough as nails back then to be able to keep it going. And of course he was one of The Flying Aces, The Junkyard Dogs. The perfect crew for The Man. God Speed Cecil. 316. NicoRosbergFan posted: 09.20.2012 - 3:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) In honor of Cecil, I think cjs should make his next post be a list of the greatest winless drivers or independent drivers. 317. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.20.2012 - 4:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Turtles in a half shell, TURTLE POWER!!! Jeff is gonna drive a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles paint scheme at Charlotte. For people my age who were little kids when they first exploded, first off try getting that song out of your head, and secondly it should bring back some fun childhood memories. This is one of those "why couldn't this have happened in 1991?" moments. NASCAR and The Turtles, two of my obsessions at the time. I might still be floating if they had run a Turtles paint scheme back then. Of course, as happy as the 7 year old inside me is, the 28 year old in me can't help but wonder. They can run a Farmville paint scheme, a Turtles paint scheme, and at Homestead, for their 20 years together, they will run a special silver DuPont paint scheme. WHERE IS THE DAMN RAINBOW THROWBACK?!?!?!?!? Are we really gonna go this whole "20th year celebration" season without seeing it? Really? Are they that far out of touch in Wilmington, Delaware? It is getting late in the season and I am getting really impatient. He even regrew his infamous '93 "crash stache" and went retro at Pocono by winning with some of his famous "Gordon luck", this after a season's worth of "Schrader luck". Speaking of Schrader, is there any driver that didn't die in competition with worse racing luck than Schrader? A lot is made of the "#25 curse", but I think it was just Schrader. Even after he left that car his luck continued to be garbage. They replaced him with Ricky Craven who admittantly pressed too hard trying to immediately run with champions Gordon and Labonte, got hurt and that ride was filled with driver like Jack Sprague and Todd Bodine, then permanently filled for one season with Wally Dallenbach who is Wally Dallenbach. Bad luck or bad drivers? He was replaced with Jerry Nadeau who won once, but somebody who also had bad luck no matter where he went (Sonoma '02 anyone? I'm still scarred by that one. Even The Rooster spent most of his victory lane interview lamenting Jerry's bad luck). Nemecheck stepped in in, won once, and appeared to be gaining traction when HMS replaced him with the bum Brian Vikers. Bad luck or bad management? The #25 spent its last few years with Vickers and Casey Mears, each of which got a miracle win. Again, bad luck or bad drivers? 318. cjs3872 posted: 09.20.2012 - 4:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sorry NicoRosbergFan, but I probably won't do a blog on that, simply because I wouldn't know enough about winless drivers. But thanks for wondering about that and for showing me how to become a blogger in the first place. As I've said numerous times, I really appreciate your help. 319. Schroeder51 posted: 09.20.2012 - 6:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, in my opinion, here are the ten best independent drivers of all time: 1. James Hylton 2. Dave Marcis 3. G. C. Spencer 4. Elmo Langley 5. Cecil Gordon 6. Wendell Scott 7. J. D. McDuffie 8. Buddy Arrington 9. John Sears 10. Neil Castles I think that's a pretty good list, actually. 320. David posted: 09.20.2012 - 6:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Concerning posts #311 and #313: Paul, I hate to rain on your analysis, but did you bother reading the fine print? The standings I posted were calculated with my system, not the current actual one. Mine can be found on the 2012 Watkins Glen race page's comment board, post #256. Now, as for season-long flucuations and tidbits with my system: - Ward Burton led the standings for the first two weeks, then Sterling Marlin gained the lead after Las Vegas, lost it after Martinsville, regained it at Talladega, and held it for 13 straight weeks before Tony Stewart took it over for good at Watkins Glen. - The media hounds wouldn't have a chance to drool over Jimmie Johnson, as he never led the standings at any point in the season. - As previously mentioned, Tony Stewart took the lead at Watkins Glen, never to relinquish it. However, he was back in title contention just a few races removed from his Daytona 500 engine failure. He locked up the title with one race remaining. - After his season-ending injury, Sterling Marlin remained in the top 10 for three more weeks, before eventually slipping to eleventh, and then twelfth in the final rankings. He had been the only driver to stay in the top 10 in the standings up to that point, remaining there for a whopping 32 consecutive weeks to start out the season. He was seventh after the race at Kansas. - For all the media attention rookie Jimmie Johnson received for his three wins, fellow rookie Ryan Newman wasn't too shabby either. In fact, for five weeks in a row late in the season, from Talladega to Rockingham, Newman stood second to leader Tony Stewart. He ended the season in a tie with Matt Kenseth for fourth (but losing on the tiebreaker), 112 points behind Stewart. He still finished 42 points ahead of Johnson in the final tally. - Not relevant, but interesting nonetheless, is that the top 10 and only the top 10 accumulated 1000 points through the course of the season. Ricky Rudd was one point from being the eleventh driver to do so. - The highest ranking winless driver was Rusty Wallace in tenth. 321. Bronco posted: 09.20.2012 - 7:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Speaking of Schrader, is there any driver that didn't die in competition with worse racing luck than Schrader?" List of drivers that didn't die in competition with worse racing luck than Schrader (Cup careers only): 1) Steve Park 2) Jerry Nadeau 3) Mike Skinner 4) Dave Blaney 5) Jeff Green 6) Scott Riggs 7) Johnny Benson 8) Kenny Wallace 9) Elliott Sadler 10) Martin Truex Jr Schrader was unlucky in that he should have won more races than he did, but at the same time he was very lucky to just to have had full time Cup rides for as long as he did. 322. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.20.2012 - 7:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Here is my Top 1 list of best independant drivers: 1) Alan Kulwicki 323. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.20.2012 - 7:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I guess I should have specified "didn't die and din't have a major debilitating injury either end their caareer or seriously affect it". My bad. Even with Nadeau's awful injury, he is still up there. 324. Bronco posted: 09.20.2012 - 7:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If you take away the injury affected drivers from the past, the list looks like this. 1) Blaney 2) Allmendinger (forgot about him initially) 3) Green 4) Riggs 5) Wallace 6) Sadler 7) Truex Jr My list of unlucky, but successful drivers (current) 1) Mark Martin (2nd in the championship 5 times) 2) Carl Edwards (Finished 2nd in all the major races, and a tiebreaker loss in the championship) 3) Jeff Burton (First a 5 year winless streak, now a 4 year winless streak) 4) Kyle Busch (Should have at least 30 wins by now with all the laps he's led and races that he' contended in) 5) Jamie McMurray (Should have made the first chase and finished well in it, as well as other races that should have been won) 325. Paul posted: 09.20.2012 - 9:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) David, I was just speaking generally that Kenseth would have benefited from the current points system back in '02 because it's more rewarding to win and it not as bad to finish poorly as the '02 points system was. On the other side of the coin, Mark Martin's lucky that it wasn't under the current points system because his lack of winning would have cost him a shot at the title. Here's my list of the top 10 winless Cup drivers of all-time: 1. Hut Stricklin (Davey Allison once said Hut was the better driver. Nuff said) 2. Neil Castles (Finished top 10 36% of the time driving his own equipment) 3. Ted Musgrave (Led the points in '95, but could never lead the end of a race) 4. Cecil Gordon (Finished 72% of his starts in his own equipment) 5. Buddy Arrington (In 560 starts, had only 14 crash DNFs in his own equipment) 6. Dick Trickle (Came to Cup 10-20 years too late to be competitive) 7. Mike Skinner (Very talented, but his driving style wasn't right for Cup) 8. Rick Mast (Had his engine held up at The Rock in '95, he's off this list) 9. Kenny Wallace (Had the dominant car at Rockingham in '01) 10. Todd Bodine (See Mike Skinner; more talented than Brett) Honorable Mentions: J.D. McDuffie, Mike Wallace, Jeff Green, Scott Riggs 326. Paul posted: 09.20.2012 - 9:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) ^ Another Honorable Mention: Dave Blaney 327. David posted: 09.20.2012 - 9:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @325 Oh, OK. I should have known that you were quoting my post just so you could talk about a completely different system :). 328. Paul posted: 09.20.2012 - 11:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) No worries David. I like your points system because it seems to reward more for wins and high finishes than the '02 system did. Mark Martin may have had the most consistent season among the Roush camp, but Kurt Busch and Matt Kenseth were more dominant and would have finished higher than Mark under your system and I'm sure the current points system because of their dominance. By the way, 2002 marks the only season in which two Roush cars led the series in wins, with Kenseth having 5 wins and Busch with 4. I find it funny how two guys, who aren't known for winning a whole lot in a season, could lead the series in wins while driving for a team that's more known for its consistency than for its win total. And as we all know, those two guys went on to win the Cup championship over the next two seasons. Since I'm on the subject of Roush-Fenway Racing, how well do you guys think Ricky Stenhouse, Jr. will do in his rookie season next year? Will he be like Kurt Busch and struggle his rookie season and then catch fire afterwards, or will he be like Carl Edwards and quickly become one of the top Cup drivers? Will he be like Matt Kenseth and Greg Biffle and slowly progress from top 20 to championship contender, or will he be like David Ragan and start off pretty well and get progressively worse each year? I think with his driving style, his early career will be similar to that of either Greg Biffle or Kurt Busch. I think it'll take some time for him to adjust to these Cup cars and the difference in horsepower from the Nationwide cars, but once he figures these cars out, he'll be a force for the championship and fast. I won't be surprised if he doesn't win a Cup race next year and I'll be really surprised if he's a Chase contender. But come 2014 and beyond, if he can adjust to these cars and start getting results towards the end of his rookie season, I think he will start to win races and contend for the Chase and eventually the title. I don't think he'll struggle his rookie season as badly as Busch did, but he has the potential to have a tremendous sophomore campaign and beyond like Busch. 329. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 09.21.2012 - 12:42 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Like I said a week or two ago, I actually compare Nadeau to Truex Jr (although Martin is probably slightly better than Jerry was) because of how many more races they should have won in their careers and they have only one day where they did shine (Atlanta '00 for Jerry and Dover '07 for Truex Jr). When that caution came out for Jamie Mac having trouble at Atlanta, it reminded me of the luck Jerry always had when he was close to a win. 330. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 09.21.2012 - 12:50 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hate to hear of Cecil Gordon's passing. I respect guys like him, J.D. McDuffie and Dave Marcis because they truly know the meaning of perserverance. Those guys ran all or most of their careers on their own team. I hope Cecil rests in peace. 331. David posted: 09.21.2012 - 10:24 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think Ricky Stenhouse, Jr.'s rookie season will look a lot like Jeff Gordon's: Good runs and plenty of wrecked race cars, yet a decent points finish. 332. Bronco posted: 09.21.2012 - 11:53 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) It boggles my mind to see how far off Carl and the #99 team. Last year he had a stunning 19 top fives. This year he only has two, and the last one was 22 races ago, and it was only a 5th place finish. If his current career history holds, it means he will rebound next year with a win or two, a chase spot but won't contend for the championship, and will have another strong season in 2014, which may or may not lead to a championship. 333. Smiff_99 posted: 09.21.2012 - 12:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) HELP!!! I need ideas! I'm meeting Bobby Allison today at 4pm and I need to ask him a good question.....anybody? 334. David posted: 09.21.2012 - 12:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @333 Dude, you ROCK! Ask him what his favorite color is...no, that wouldn't work, he's color blind. Ask him which one of his car owners he liked best. 335. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.21.2012 - 1:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) How awesome was it being inducted into the NASCAR HOF before Darrell? Did Cale's nose hurt your fist when he went to beating on it in '79? How much ass did your incredible late race comeback in the '87 Firecracker 400 kick? How cool was your late race comeback in the '75 Rebel 500? If you could have had the career stability and equipment of Richard Petty, where would you be keeping your 250 Cup race win trophies and 10 championship trophies? 336. Jim Davis posted: 09.21.2012 - 3:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Smiff_99, ask him if the following incident is true: From http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070604024137AAJYJ6I "Franklin's memory is littered with on-track incidents he believes were race related. There are some that stand out more than others. At Martinsville, Va., one spring, Franklin said, Bobby Allison spun Wendell several times, but his dad never retaliated - during the race. "I even put up the on the pit board for him to spin Bobby, but he didn't do anything. When he came into the pits after the race, he got out of the car, walked over to Bobby's pits and told him if he ever did that to him again, he'd whip his butt."" or if that's too long ask him if he ever had any run-ins with Wendall Scott. 337. Paul posted: 09.21.2012 - 3:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I just read a headline from the other day that reads: "Gordon's 'stache gone, reason for Gordon's stuck throttle at Chicago". Now after reading the article it's clear that those are two different stories, but the way it was worded makes it hilarious. Thus, adding more meaning to the term "Crash 'Stache". 338. David posted: 09.21.2012 - 4:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow DSFF, you ripped through those. I always go brain dead in those situations. 339. David posted: 09.21.2012 - 4:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Why was Bill Gardner such a deadbeat? What do you think was your best season, besides your championship? What was the best car you ever drove (legal or illegal)? How good do you think your brother was? 340. David posted: 09.21.2012 - 4:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) How many win would you have had if John Holman didn't fire you and Ralph Moody? How cool is it to have three times as many Daytona 500 wins as Darrell Waltrip? Who was your favorite driver to race door to door with? How did you ever work up the nerve to tell Junior Johnson to kiss your...? 341. Smiff_99 posted: 09.21.2012 - 6:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Alright, so I met him and he was INCREDIBLE! I got to talk to him for a whole 2 minutes! He told me he thought Donnie was actually the better of the two of them (and that other than The King, he had the most fun racing against Donnie). And in between picking his brain a bit and having him sign my DVD copy of the 1988 Daytona 500, I managed to tell him (on the behalf of myself and allll of my fellow die-hard fans) that he'll ALWAYS have 85 wins in our minds. He chuckled and said "Great! Now go see if you can change NASCAR's mind!" It was crazy! *I* made a living legend laugh in agreement with me! I even waited through the line twice JUST so I could shake his hand a second time and tell him how amazing of a person he is. This was easily one of the greatest days of my life.....lol *Interesting Footnote*---The place where I met him today was just 3 miles down the road from Oxford Plains Speedway, the sight of his first win. How cool is that?! 342. Smiff_99 posted: 09.21.2012 - 6:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) *site 343. David posted: 09.21.2012 - 6:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I am so envious of you now. 344. DaleSrFanForever posted: 09.21.2012 - 8:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Smiff, that is awesome. 345. 10andJoe posted: 09.21.2012 - 10:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bobby Allison is a great guy. When I was a kid I got to sit next to him and Ray Fox in a reviewing stand at the Daytona Beach Shores Christmas Parade in...er, 90-something. '96 I think it was. Still got the David Pearson #3 diecast Ray Fox signed the box of... 346. Jocke Persson posted: 09.22.2012 - 7:36 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) #317 watch http://www.nascar.com/video/none/inside-nascar/120912/cup-chi-showtime-gordon/index.html?MostPopular Jeff talks about the Rainbow scheme. 347. RaceFanX posted: 10.15.2012 - 12:15 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sponsor: #18 Kyle Busch- Wrigley Doublemint (One wonders why they haven't run any other Wrigley gum brands on his car, they did Big Red and Juicy Fruit cars back when they sponsored Ganassi's teams) 348. ch posted: 07.16.2013 - 8:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sponsor for the #30 should be Swan Racing, as the team transferred over from Inception. Also, 18 - Doublemint 349. NascarLeadLapPoints posted: 05.08.2020 - 1:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Best run for Johnson at Chicagoland, finished 2nd after leading 172 laps Due to Covid-19 cancelled 2020 Chicagoland weekend, Johnson will remain winless at Chicagoland ------------------------------------------------------------------------ *Post a comment:* Your comment may not appear immediately - all comments must be approved by the moderator. Name: Comment: