|| *Comments on the 2013 FedEx 400 Benefiting Autism Speaks:* First Page | Previous Page | Next Page | Last Page | View All On One Page View the most recent comment | Post a comment <#post> 1. Jim Davis posted: 05.31.2013 - 4:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) What happened to Johnson? 2. cjs3872 posted: 05.31.2013 - 5:09 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Yeah, Jim Davis. Even Landon Cassill outqualified him. And when's the last time no HMS car qualified in the top ten at Dover, because Kasey Kahne was their best in 11th, just as he's been their most consistent performer all year long. 3. Anonymous posted: 05.31.2013 - 5:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs3872, You didn't answer Jim Davis's question. Jimmie was the fasted car in practice. Kasey Kahne also was the 2nd fastest car in practice. Jeff was the 10th fastest in practice also. 4. Kenny posted: 05.31.2013 - 5:17 pm Rate this comment: (1) (2) I'm gonna miss fox(I'm gonna miss the races now seance I don't have cable):( 5. The Long Shot posted: 05.31.2013 - 5:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs: The last time that happened was at the 2001 fall race. 23. 24-Jeff Gordon 33. 5-Terry Labonte 41. 25-Jerry Nadeau And where did they finish? 2nd (Nadeau), 4th (Gordon), and 17th (Labonte). 6. Eric posted: 05.31.2013 - 5:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jim Davis, What happened to Jimmie the temperature of the track, and where he was in qualifying order based on the difference in track speeds from practice and Qualifying. The fact is the Jimmie Johnson was the fastest car in practice with a 159.603, but Denny was 157.978 for qualifying. Denny was the 19th car out for qualifying and Jimmie was 28th out. 7. DaleSrFanForever posted: 05.31.2013 - 5:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, on the pace laps, Brad will actually get to line up behind the first pace car. Progress lol. 8. Benjamin Lowe posted: 05.31.2013 - 5:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Okay Brad you better start performing this Sunday or I am going to start wondering if that Championship was nothing more than a fluke. 9. Anthony posted: 05.31.2013 - 5:38 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) YES!!!! Jimmie Johnson P24 WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!! 10. Kenny posted: 05.31.2013 - 5:45 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) I know Anthony isn't is grate :D 11. David posted: 05.31.2013 - 5:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Denny Hamlin qualifies first, RoboPrick 24th...at Dover?!?! 12. murb posted: 05.31.2013 - 6:27 pm Rate this comment: (2) (2) Since this is Fox's last race of the season, we should participate in a "Na Na Na Na Hey Hey Goodbye" chant, just like how the wrestling fans did to Lesnar and Goldberg at Wrestlemania 2004. 13. joey2448 posted: 05.31.2013 - 6:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The biggest reason Jimmie qualified poorly was because he got way loose coming off turn four on his first lap, and it completely ruined his whole run. It almost turned into a replay of when he spun off four in qualifying in 2006 but didn't hit anything. Since it's been hot in Dover for the past few days and is forecasted to be hot on Sunday, hopefully guys like Jeff Gordon and Tony Stewart will flourish (when the track is slick). 14. Sector posted: 05.31.2013 - 6:37 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Why would the championship be a fluke of Brad's? People forget to realize that he wasn't in a Ford last year. 15. NicoRosbergFan posted: 05.31.2013 - 6:40 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Vegas is catching on... Danica 300-1 to win. 16. Baker posted: 05.31.2013 - 6:43 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Alright Jimmie Johnson is starting mid pack and if there were any fairness in the world of racing then the racing God would have him get caught up in someone else's wreck in the beginning of the race. If happens to every other driver in Nascar several times a year while this scum bag can go years in between getting caught up in others messes. 17. jabber1990 posted: 05.31.2013 - 6:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) how does Jimmie thrive under pressure? I mean he was under pressure in Homestead 2012...and it cost him a championship 18. David posted: 05.31.2013 - 7:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I mean he was under pressure in Homestead 2012...and it cost him a championship" To be fair, that was an outlier. 19. Paul posted: 05.31.2013 - 7:27 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) murb (#12), a better example would be on an episode of RAW back in August 2005 (I believe it was the night after SummerSlam), when Chris Jericho lost a "Loser Leaves RAW" match to John Cena. After the match, Jericho was begging for his job and had to be forcibly carried to the back by security as the crowd chanted "Na Na Hey Hey Goodbye." Jericho was such a great chickenshit heel back in the day. He still is, but back then he was so easy to hate. Splendid qualifying runs for Casey Mears and Landon Cassill. Cassill already has the best finish for Circle Sport since their return to NASCAR in 2011 (22nd place at Talladega), and now he has their best start since returning to NASCAR by starting 21st. Their previous best qualifying spot was 31st at Richmond earlier this year, with (yep, you guessed it) Landon Cassill behind the wheel. I'm hoping he gets an opportunity in better equipment next season, as he's shown improvement each season in NASCAR. 20. Sky Warrior posted: 05.31.2013 - 7:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Why are the Vegas odds for Austin Dillon 300-1, yet for Timmy Hill it's 50-1? Even Jeff Burton is 200-1, and he HAS a Dover win in '06 21. TS1420 posted: 05.31.2013 - 8:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Baker, There will probably be a big opening lap crash that swallows up the back half of the field and that slimy weasel in the 48 will probably sneak on by like he usually does. 22. murb posted: 05.31.2013 - 8:39 pm Rate this comment: (4) (0) "Why are the Vegas odds for Austin Dillon 300-1, yet for Timmy Hill it's 50-1? Even Jeff Burton is 200-1, and he HAS a Dover win in '06" lol, Fox must be doing the math on that one. 23. webmaster posted: 05.31.2013 - 8:44 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) @20: Hill is part of the 'field', hence the (f) after his odds. That means that the 16 or so field drivers *combined* are a 50-1 shot for the race. If you place a bet on the field and any of those drivers wins, you win. The odds against any individual member of the 'field' winning are several thousand to 1. That's probably why Vegas combines them in the first place. 24. joey2448 posted: 05.31.2013 - 8:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) http://racing.ap.org/article/gordon-calls-safer-barriers-all-track I swear to god, how is it that Jeff Gordon is always the guy that hits the wrong area of a track??? Las Vegas 2008, Watkins Glen 2009, Charlotte last week, etc....he's like the bizarro Jimmie Johnson. 25. cjs3872 posted: 05.31.2013 - 9:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That's right, webmaster. I tried to make that very same point but just as I was about to publish that comment, my computer became non-responsive. If you make a bet on any of those 16 drivers that are part of the "mutual field", you get all of them. I find it ironic that this comes up on a weekend on which they're running at a track that has a horse racing track next to it. But that's what the "F" means. On a much more serious note, it's almost impossible to believe that the very same area that got hit with an EF5 tornado just 10 days ago is getting hit by huge tornadoes again tonight. Yesterday, Jimmie Johnson and Marty Smith of ESPN were in Moore, OK as Johnson is doing something with his charity to help those in Moore that were affected by the EF5 that struck last week, and now 10 days later, that same area, including Moore, OK, is getting hit again by huge tornadoes. And tonight's storms are hitting downtown OKC and are even approaching St. Louis. Let's hope this doesn't end up as bad as it's looking. And if it hits St. Louis, as it appeared it has, this could be VERY bad. 26. Anonymous posted: 05.31.2013 - 9:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Just wondering, does anyone think Dale Jr will win a race this year or will he never win again? 27. BJ posted: 05.31.2013 - 10:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Scott Riggs qualified last...but at least he made the race since there were only 43 cars entered...hopefully he does well on sunday 28. The Long Shot posted: 05.31.2013 - 10:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Agree 100%, cjs. I'm a bit of a "weather freak" myself, and I love seeing tornadoes, but what you have to realize is, beneath that beauty, that majesty, there are people's lives being altered completely, some even ending, and unfortunately, that has been the case today as at least 2 have been reported dead, a woman and a baby. If there has been any good news from all this, it appears as though the worst hit areas from last week escaped the tornado by a few miles, and St. Louis was spared as the storm system moved north of the city. Nevertheless, all of our thoughts and prayers should be with all the folks who have been affected by these storms. It has been an unspeakably tragic couple of weeks for these people. 29. TS1420 posted: 05.31.2013 - 10:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I love how the talking heads keep bragging up Dover as "A Short Track On Steroids!!!" when in reality Dover is "LasKanTuckyLand In A Smaller Package..zzz" 30. David posted: 05.31.2013 - 11:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You mean "Las Charlkantuckylandana". 31. DaleSrFanForever posted: 05.31.2013 - 11:55 pm Rate this comment: (12) (0) So with KyBu winning today's Truck race, a certain win in tomorrow's NWide race, and a Cup race where he is the favorite IMO (those JGR cars are STRONG right now, KyBu has won this race twice, and definitely look for yet another end of season collapse for JGR) he keeps moving up that ridiculous "most NASCAR wins" list. This needs to stop before I go on a 5 state Gorilla Press Slamming spree. Not only does he not belong on ANY greatest ever list (unless it is greatest choke artists ever), he isn't even close to the greatest driver he has ever raced against. Every race he has been in, there has been a #24 car in it with Jeff Gordon behind the wheel. While KyBu may have the head to head edge due to Jeff having been in his injury years ('08-'10) and "paying the piper" years ('11-present), let's not forget this is Kyle's 9th season at age 28. Jeff had his 8th season in 2000 at age 29. So let's compare them at this arbitrary point (Rainbow Nation, y'all are gonna love this). Experience: Kyle got an earlier start to not only gain experience but to pad his stats. He had also been groomed from a very young age to be a stock car driver, racing Trucks at age 16, and having a NWide car waiting on him the week he turned 18. Jeff was groomed from a very young age to be an open wheel racer, but funds caused him to make an abrupt turn towards stock cars at age 19. So Kyle had way more stock car experience by this age. Some will tell you "racing is racing". Those people are called idiots. Advantage: Kyle (not a good thing for the sake of this discussion) Championship Prowess: Ha! Ha ha! Ha ha ha! By this time Jeff had 3 Winston Cups, a runner up, a 6th, an 8th, and a 14th in his rookie year when he hit everything, causing some of us to wonder if Earnhardt was losing his mind when he won the World 600 and declared the runner up, Jeff, a great racer who will have to be reckoned with in the future. Kyle, on the other hand, has one Top Top 5 points finish (a distant 5th), an 8th, two 10ths, and FOUR finishes out of the Top 10. Super Duper Humongous Advantage: Jeff Grace Under Pressure, Big Races: An even bigger laugher. By this point, Jeff had 2 Daytona 500s, 4 (consecutive!!!) Southern 500s, 3 World 600s, 2 Brickyard 400s, 2 All Star Wins, and 3 Grandfather Clocks (screw it, I'm counting it as a major, we all make this stuff up anyways). He also won the Winston Million in 1997 (age 26) holding off a much stronger Burton in the end on Labor Day weekend. Kyle has one Southern 500, oh wait, that's it. And he tried like hell to give that one away, they are still pulling pieces of that car's right side out of the walls down there. He also had a chance on Labor Day weekend at age 26 to win a Series sponsor promotional million dollars. He got lapped and finished out of the Top 20. Meanwhile Jeff won the race, holding off a much stronger Jimmie Johnson. Super Duper Extra Humongously Giantic Enormous Advantage: Jeff Grace Under Pressure, Championship Races: Even Rainbow Nation has to admit the one glaring weakness on Jeff's resume is his noticeable drop in performance after the leaves turn orange. Of course there was the huge exception in '98. But at least he never "folded", "collapsed", "blatently threw in the towel", or "got suspened for doing something stupid in a minor league race". They were more like "fades", or "dips". Kyle just curls up in a ball the second the pressure gets tight. Hands down the worst championship racer ever. Jeff was much more graceful even in his biggest weakness. Surprisingly Large Advantage: Jeff Wins: Kyle has 26 wins. In many more starts. Or as Jeff called it in June 2000 "half my total". Jeff had just won his 50th race at Dega. So it is pretty much half, and his winning % was more than double. Double The Advantage: Not The Doublemint Driver, but Jeff Short Track Wins: Kyle's strongest Cup statistic. 9 total, 5 at Bristol, and a 4peat in the Spring Richmond race. Of course a huge goose egg in the one with the prestigious trophy, Martinsville. Jeff also had 9 at this point, highlighted by a 4peat at the Bristol Spring race, 3 Grandfather clocks, a Richmond win, and the last Wilkesboro win. Now Jeff had an era specific advantage because they ran 2 more short tracks per year in his first 4 seasons with the two trips to North Wilkesboro. But he also had to go against short track masters Rusty and Dale in their primes. Kyle has had nowhere near the competition. Plus Jeff had the rare short track Grand Slam of his day. In just 4 years! The only others to do this in a 4 year stretch in the 90's were Rusty, Mark and Dale. Drivers to get two of the three short track "triple crown" in Kyle's career: Harvick, Kurt Busch, Kahne, Johnson, Hamlin Slight Advantage: Jeff Road Course Wins: Kyle swept the road courses in '08. Jeff had already swept the road in '98 and '99 to go along with his '97 win at The Glen, and was a few weeks from making it a road course 6peat. Advantage: Jeff Nickname: I know he hated it, but Wonder Boy was perfect for Jeff. He was outrageously young, and looked and sounded even younger. Plus that was given to him by the Legend, the 7 time champ, Dale Earnhardt. Also, as I have mentioned before, the only DW TV gimmick that doesn't make me wanna pour Sulfuric Acid down my eardrums is him humming the Jaws theme when Jeff can sniff the lead. Very appropriate. Kyle, meanwhile, has "Rowdy". First off, that is a self appointed nickname. Secondly, he is nothing like the stoic, I'm So Bad I Don't Have To Tell You How Bad I Am character Rowdy Burns (although I am of the opinion Marty Smith is a terrible reporter, a firesuit sniffer, and even worse on TV, he did an excellent piece about the movie Days Of Thunder and how Michael Rooker and his portrayal of Rowdy Burns stole the show, and he is right). Kyle is a whiney sulking pouter. Rowdy was a badass who tried to get cleared to race despite a brain hemorrhage. Kyle is MUCH closer to Russ Wheeler, right down to the #18 and the epic choke job in the Daytona 500. And don't get me started on "Wild Thing". I love the movie Major League, and Ricky Vaughn likewise kicked ass and was clutch. Advantage: Jeff mostly by default Ability To Win Races They Have Dominated: When Jeff would dominate early in the late 90's my thoughts were "shit, its bad enough I have to watch him win this shit, but I also have to sit through 4 hours of this shit while he leads all the shit, in conclusion, shit!". When Kyle dominates early nowadays, I think "how's he gonna blow it this time?". Advantage: Jeff Do I need to go any further? BTW, don't count out another Richmond "Kyle vs Jeff for the cha$e" this year. I know who my money is on! 32. joey2448 posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) EVERYONE!!! Go to Sportscenter on BSPN right now! Important story on Stenica! Has she forgiven Ricky for the accident at Charlotte??? Danica herself even said this was an entertainment sport! 33. TS1420 posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:14 am Rate this comment: (0) (1) Oh thank goodness Princess Backmarker and her boy-toy Wrecky have made up! I feel all warm and fuzzy knowing everything is just hunky dory with the cancer of Stewart-Haas Racing, strike that, all race teams period. 34. David posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:26 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Russ Wheeler was a jerk. DSFF, that post was beautiful. 35. The Long Shot posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:38 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) One hell of a rant, DSFF. If only BSPN and the "historical" Marty Reid could read that. 36. Watto posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:44 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) "Okay Brad you better start performing this Sunday or I am going to start wondering if that Championship was nothing more than a fluke." I don't think he has anything to prove. He was phenomenal from May forward in 2011, and he started the year phenomenal this year. The problem is that 3 of his last four races have resulted in horrendous finishes. Charlotte he was at his slowest and had a good shot of getting that lucky dog and competing for a top 15 without attrition, Darlington he was running roughly 3rd fastest times as he worked his way through the field, then had a loose wheel which cost him 2 laps, and as he worked his way into the lucky dog spot, they wrecked around him. Richmond he came from the back to the front like 3 different times, easily should've had a top 10 even AFTER a flat tire, but the car lost power. A lot of people can point to the Paul Wolfe suspension and claim Paul is the entire reason Brad is competitive in Cup, but they were literally one of the fastest cars on the track at Darlington but had truly awful luck. "how does Jimmie thrive under pressure? I mean he was under pressure in Homestead 2012...and it cost him a championship" He was also under pressure in 2010 at Homestead and won the championship. 2012 was crew error & mechanical failure. 37. Sky Warrior posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:53 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) DSFF, that is one of the top 5 posts I've ever read on here, especially as a huge Gordon fan and a huge Kyle hater, though that's mostly due to his attitude and his fetish for beating up lesser drivers to boost himself up. I think he needs a wake up call like his brother got, but unfortunately I think that chance may have passed with the Ron Hornaday incident. Joe Gibbs isn't gonna fire a driver who's winning for him, no matter how bad the public image or what series he's winning in, which is why Kyle stayed after 2011 and Joey had already become a lame duck. Also, thanks to Webmaster and cjs for clarifying the Vegas odds thing. I think it's clear I'm no gamblin' man so I don't understand most of it 38. Jim Davis posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:56 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "So let's compare them at this arbitrary point (Rainbow Nation, y'all are gonna love this)." I think Gordon benefited enormously with Ray Evernham as his crew chief throughout the '90s. I think Busch's career might have compared more favorably to Gordon's if Busch had been paired up with a crew chief of Evernham's ability at the start of his career. 39. 18fan posted: 06.01.2013 - 2:27 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) I was rooting for Ryan Blaney to win that Truck race when it looked like it would be between him, Kyle, and Crafton because I'm tired of Kyle winning all of these races and I cannot stand Crafton. DSFF, I am torn between wanting to respond to your comments and defend Kyle and not wanting to because I agree with you on some points (like the greatest of all-time part, which only FOX and ESPN seem to believe, but they try to hammer it into our heads). Does anyone else kind of get the feeling that Jeff is kind of the lovable loser now? While he can still win at any time, strange things seem to happen to him and it seems like, at least on this board, there is a lot of sympathy for Jeff (I know some of that comes from me) that there never used to be. My one Kyle defense: His first two crew chiefs were Alan Gustafson and Steve Addington. Gustafson was a rookie crew chief when Kyle was a rookie and made some questionable pit calls (Jeff Gordon fans I feel your pain. I can never watch the restart of the 2007 Fall Atlanta race where Denny Hamlin's car sputters and think that Kyle would've won that race if Alan had put on two tires on the last stop instead of four. And of course Jimmie Johnson wins that race while leading a whopping quarter of a lap under green). They were both young and inexperienced, never really had consistency and, in the Jeff parallel, Kyle and Alan didn't develop as quickly individually and as a tandem as Jeff and Ray did. Then he gets Steve Addington, who had done nothing with Bobby Labonte and J.J. Yeley (although Yeley has been pretty bad his entire NASCAR career) and we were first exposed to Steve Addington's traditional late season fades, that occurred first with Kyle in '08 and '09, then with Kurt in '10 and '11, and with Tony last year and they still haven't recovered. One place where you have to say that Kyle has improved in the last few years is that after he missed the Chase in 2009 Kyle had Steve Addington fired. I think it was for the best in terms of Kyle getting Dave Rogers but Kyle went about it the wrong way. After the Richmond debacle last September, I thought for sure Dave was going to be gone. But, although it took them a week or two to sit down and discuss things, they did and it has made them better, just hopefully the TRD engines hold together this summer. 40. murb posted: 06.01.2013 - 3:09 am Rate this comment: (2) (0) "Jericho was such a great chickenshit heel back in the day. He still is, but back then he was so easy to hate." Yeah, especially in his WCW and early WWF days. Someone on YouTube a while ago put up like a half hour long compilation of him just being a smartass, and all the clips were from that time period. It was pretty awesome, but unfortunately I don't think it's on there anymore. "Does anyone else kind of get the feeling that Jeff is kind of the lovable loser now? While he can still win at any time, strange things seem to happen to him and it seems like, at least on this board, there is a lot of sympathy for Jeff (I know some of that comes from me) that there never used to be." Well, a large portion of the regulars on here are pretty diehard Gordon fans, so I guess that's where a lot of the sympathy comes from. But even I (and I don't consider myself a Gordon fan) hate seeing him have the bad luck and head scratching runs that he's been having the past two years. I guess it's because when I first got into Nascar (1998), he was in the middle of his dynasty run. So for me, I think I have sympathy with him because when I think of him I think of all the memories he gave me as a kid. I feel the same thing for other drivers from back then that are still racing like Burton, Mark, and Bobby. 41. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.01.2013 - 5:08 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) ESPN is calling it Kyle Busch's 10th win of the year. *vomits on computer screen* DSFF, that was the best post in the history of racing reference. Absolutely, positutely, kick-@$$ post. DW said Jeff fell into a pot of gold, but Kyle had the pot of gold handed to him at 16-years old. Many drivers have come into Cup racing as "the next big thing": Reed Sorenson, David Ragan, both Busch's, Carl Edwards, Dale Earnhardt, Jr., Juan Pablo Montoya, etc... only one has a won a title, Kurt Busch, and that being a lucky, grind your teeth, stick-your-tongue-out-like-Lightning-McQueen finish. 42. David posted: 06.01.2013 - 9:45 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "DSFF that was the best post in the history of racing reference" And to think that just Sunday you wanted to leave the site because of him. :) 43. David posted: 06.01.2013 - 9:49 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Honestly, I have never seen this much praise for a driver from a fan who doesn't like him. That would NEVER happen on other racing forums. That is what separates this site from the rest. 44. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.01.2013 - 9:58 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yes, David, amazing what happens when the fighters retreat to their corners, isn't it? Unfortunately, my IndyCar picks took a HUGE hit as a result. 45. Baker posted: 06.01.2013 - 11:05 am Rate this comment: (0) (2) I have grown very tired of Kyle Busch's inability to close out races and a season on strong notes. I am not exactly a huge fan of his and I especially don't like him running so many Truck races and Nationwide races. I do, however, see and respect his driving talents. With that being said the head to head with him and Jeff Gordon is easily advantage Jeff Gordon, however, the gap is no where near as wide as DSFF and many others make it out to be. When Jeff Gordon was dominating those years in the mid-late 90s his car owner and team had far and away the best equipment in the entire garage and those years were some of the weaker years for competition as far as numbers go. Nascar had some stacked fields all the way up through almost the time Gordon came to cup and then it started getting crowed again after his last championship with JGR expanding and guys like Kahne, Johnson, Busch, Busch, Hamlin, Harvick, Kenseth, and Junior making there way into the sport. From top to bottom those years Gordon was king were some of the weakest years combined with Gordon's team having a huge equipment advantage on the rest of the field and you have a 40-50 win driver turned into an 87 win driver. 46. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.01.2013 - 11:23 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) I have to disagree. The 90s were crazy. You had Rusty, Mark, the Dales, the Labontes, Hamilton, Marlin, the Burtons, Rudd, and others all still in their prime and all NEVER going to flinch in the face of adversity during all or at least 3 years of Jeff dominance. If anything, Kyle Busch has a BETTER car than Jeff had then. Plus, now, car is so much important than driver that it's ridiculous. It's not much different from IndyCar really in the sense of car importance. Also, power steering was still a relatively bitchy technology up until 3 or 4 years ago, plus the cars had WAY less traction and broke down at the drop of a hat. One wrong move and you were singing in the Heavenly Choir. Plus, Jeff has that knack of once in a while taking a junk car and shitting on the field with it (see Phoenix 2011, Rockingham 98). Jeff Gordon produces the "Jeff Gordon Never Say Die Moment presented by NRF and DSFF," something not one other driver in tomorrow's field is capable of doing. That being said, I still think Kyle Busch is a very talented driver, but he mentally does not have the ability to win. About the field stacking, could anyone on this site honestly see David Reutimann charging from 27th to lead 296 out of 400 laps on Sunday? Didn't think so... until 10 years ago, that happened usually 1 to 2 times a year. 47. Baker posted: 06.01.2013 - 11:35 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dale Earnhardt had the worst years of his career while Jeff Gordon was at his peak and it had nothing to do with Jeff Gordon beating him because Dale wasn't even running fast enough to make him sweat. Ward Burton and Bobby Hamilton were never a threat like Edwards, Hamlin, Kenseth, Busch, Busch, Johnson, Stewart, Khane, Harvick and the guys today. Terry Labonte was no threat to win week in and week out like many of the guys today. Sterling Marlin was a restrictor plate king and aside from that didn't win much of anything. I think 60% or more of his wins were at Daytona or Dega. Rusty Wallace was past his big winning days when Jeff Gordon was piling up over half his current win total. He was a 1 win a year guy there in the late part of the 90s. It was basically Jarrett, Martin and Jeff Gordon that was it. Today no matter who you driver is there are guys like Hamlin, Busch, Kenseth, Johnson, Kahne, Stewart, Edwards, and Harvick that are more than capable of winning multiple times a year. I'm not defending Kyle Busch in anyway and Jeff Gordon is a great driver he is just not as great as everyone makes him out to be. He dominanted an era of NASCAR that saw a huge chunk of its stars taken early(Allison, Kulwick and Richmond) or going through personal rough times(Elliott) or in the worst spell of there career(Earnhardt), or career altering injured(Irvan). It was a severely depleted time in NASCAR no matter how you try to get around it. 48. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I guess that's why Terry was nicknamed... "Mr. Consistency" and "The Iceman." Dale Earnhardt wasn't winning... but he was still consistently in the top-5. You couldn't come up with anything for Jeff Burton. Stewart's a threat? Ward Burton was very similar to Harvick, when you consider Harvick lucked into about half of his wins in FAR superior equipment to Bill Davis... just not as lucky. Sterling Marlin got half of his wins on non-plate tracks, including a dominant show at Darlington in the spring of 95. Rusty was the most dangerous driver on a short track until he retired. Just because drivers didn't win 3 times a year doesn't mean they weren't that talented. The average finish of most of those drivers was much better than today's drivers who finished in the same points position. If you read (as in reed, not red) Darrell Waltrip's "Sunday's Will Never Be the Same," you will see that Hendrick has purchased almost all of his success, including buying the Chevy factory backing from the Junior Johnson team in the 80s. 49. Eric posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NicoRosbergFan, You are overrating part of the Jeff Gordon era. While Ricky Rudd was in his prime in 1997 to 1999, Rudd made the mistake of being a driver/owner. It affected Rudd from after the first race after the 1997 Brickyard 400 to the final race of 1999. While Rudd had a win at Martinsville, his final 2 seasons as a driver/owner was bad otherwise. Based on how well Rudd did with Yates in 2000 and 2001, that says Rudd underperformed in his later years as an owner/driver because of focus and equipment. Single Car teams was going the way of the Dinosaur. Jeff Gordon didn't get the best out of Bill Elliott either. While Bill had 2 top 10 points finishes as a driver/owner, he struggled in his final years as a driver/owner and Bill Bill never won a points race as a driver/owner either. Dale Earnhardt Sr. from the summer race at Talladega to the end of the 1999 season, Dale was racing hurt. Dale had to have surgery after the 1999 season after injuries from his 1996 Talladega wreck was still bothering him. RCR being being didn't help either. Terry Labonte was declining after his 1996 cup Championship. By the end of 1999, Terry was fading very bad. Rusty Wallace only had season with 2 or means wins from the start of 1997 to the end of his career. Robin Pemberton had something to do with it. 50. Eric posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NicoRosbergFan, You are Overrating Terry Labonte from 1997 to the end of 1999. Terry from 1996 to 1997 went down from 24 top 10's to 20's top 10's. That isn't a big deal, but the decline didn't stop in 1998 and 1999 either. What happened was Terry Labonte had 15 top 10's in 1998, but he only had 7 top 10's in 1999. Terry also went from 21 top 5's in 1996 to 1 top 5 in 1999. Now granted Terry would have had 2 if Dale didn't rattle his cage at Bristol. That shows Terry was really on the decline. 51. Eric posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NicoRosbergFan, Baker didn't mention Stewart for a reason. Tony Stewart wasn't in cup when Jeff Gordon won 3 out of his 4 cup titles and that meant Stewart wasn't a threat. 52. Sean posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF's post on Kyle Busch/Jeff Gordon was beautifully written, but I certainly have several areas of disagreement (what did you expect)? I don't think anyone - even the media - is claiming Kyle Busch's entire career > Jeff Gordon's entire career (or even their respective careers to date). My first point Baker already made. Jeff Gordon was battling with aging veterans, while Kyle Busch is battling with a LOT of strong contemporaries. Many fans like the drivers of the '90s better than the drivers today. I do myself. But I think as a result of this "likability" people are massively overrating drivers like Terry Labonte, Bobby Labonte, Jeff Burton, Dale Jarrett, even Mark Martin, and selling many of today's drivers short whom I think are no worse because they are not likable. Secondly, making a comparison between Kyle Busch and Jeff Gordon may be justified in terms of the media hype they got at the start of their careers, but saying his career has not been as good as Jeff Gordon's is not exactly an insult. Is it better (or on pace to being better) than Terry Labonte's? Bobby Labonte's? Jeff Burton's? Dale Jarrett's? I could see a reasonable argument for any of those, which is still damn good (even though I find all four of those drivers - and almost everyone who peaked in the late '90s except Gordon - overrated because of what Baker said - lack of depth...few of the multi-car teams could be competitive with more than 1 or 2 cars and had all kinds of mediocre drivers in them like Dallenbach, Little, Lepage, Irwin, etc...) I realize almost everyone would say Kyle Busch has more natural talent than those four drivers and people are frustrated that he is wasting his potential. On that point, I mostly agree. He has not proven good at closing races or championship battles, but he is STILL one of the most dominant drivers of his day in Cup regardless and I tend to rate dominance highly, oftentimes more highly than actually winning since ESPECIALLY in this era, I believe that dominating the actual race is more important than the actual result thanks to NASCAR's charity rules that attempt to give everyone a shot at the end, which turns at least one third of the races into crapshoots where anything can happen. Since Kyle dominates more races than most drivers, he loses more races he dominates once NASCAR decides through the art of debris cautions, GWCs, double-file restarts, and so on to turn races into Russian Roulette matches. NASCAR would not LET anyone dominate the way Jeff Gordon did in the late '90s at this point, I think... (And no, I wouldn't say Jimmie Johnson has. Gordon felt much further ahead of the field during his peak, even in 1996 when he didn't win the title, than Jimmie did to me in any of his championship seasons.) I think this artificial crapshoot mentality of NASCAR helps some drivers (this is Kevin Harvick's so-called "closing" ability) and hurts others (including Kyle AND Jeff). 53. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:40 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) I get what you guys are saying. Nice points brought by all of us. Just one last thing to throw into the ring, which I sort of dusted on... those guys in the 90s were mentally WAY tougher than what we have today, but Shrubby still chokes... doesn't say much for Shrubby other than it's REALLY easy to get into his head. 54. Sean posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:42 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) When some users here try to fit everything into a predefined narrative, it totally underestimates the effect of luck. Sure, I know in any endeavor, some things that can be considered bad luck are really errors that allow your competition to exploit your weaknesses. But still, luck exists and there is no question Jeff Gordon had more of it in the late '90s and Jimmie Johnson had more of it in the late '00s than Kyle has had in his Cup career. Take a look at the 2009 season. Once people got it into their heads that Kyle was a choker (and he is, but I think it's overblown, and not as bad as say...Will Power), everybody has tried to explain every past year of his career to fit that narrative. Really, to me, the big things that cost Kyle Busch his 2009 chase bid were his two crashes at Daytona. In the 500 (DSFF, please don't be implying THIS is the Daytona 500 that Kyle choked in...I don't believe he HAS choked in one) he dominated and would have easily won if Dale, Jr. hadn't decided to have a hissy fit in front of the field and wreck Brian Vickers AT ALL COSTS. That is not choking. In the summer Daytona race, most people would probably say Kyle chose to cut Tony Stewart off on the last lap. However, there were a few people who blamed Stewart. I myself blame NASCAR for screwing over Regan Smith which FORCED subsequent leaders to block. Had that not happened, Tony and Kyle would have battled to the line in 1st and 2nd with Tony probably winning, and Kyle makes the chase. There are so many little things that go into making/missing a chase or doing well in it, and I do think Kyle Busch has tended to have bad luck in most chases. In 2012, if Kyle just doesn't get spun out at Watkins Glen or if they decide to end under caution due to Bobby Labonte leaking oil, again, he makes the chase. Jeff Gordon certainly exploited the opportunity to pass Kyle brilliantly, but if the races had been officiated just a bit differently, he might not have been in the position to so. If Kyle had managed to make the 2009 and 2012 chases, which he came perilously close to doing, with only SLIGHTLY better luck, would people suddenly put his career in a different perspective? Point taken that he's been horrible IN the chases. That I won't dispute. To me, short track and road course performance is more important than performance on other tracks (especially the marquee races, and ESPECIALLY the marquee races in the crapshoot era) and although Kyle Busch is no Jeff Gordon, this is one reason I would rate him higher than (say) Dale Jarrett as an overall driver. People are acting like Kyle Busch is the modern-day equivalent of Sterling Marlin or something when he's obviously more talented than that, and that annoys me. He is a marquee-level talent who cracks under the pressure. While thriving under the pressure is valuable, I'll still take somebody with fantastic talent over a more mediocre driver who doesn't crack under the pressure (Jeff Burton or Clint Bowyer or whoever...) While I wouldn't rate Kyle over Jeff career-wise (duh), I DO think he is better today, and that's no insult. Just as it's no insult to say that Jeff Gordon was better than Dale Earnhardt from 1995-1999 (or at least mid-'96 to '99). Nobody stays on top their entire career, and I would never assume that the driver who currently has the most wins is the best driver NOW. Look at IndyCar, where Sebastien Bourdais and Dario Franchitti are currently tied with 31 wins. Are either of them better than Ryan Hunter-Reay lately? No. 18fan also has a bit of a point with regard to crew chiefs. Steve Addington is the new Larry McReynolds or Robin Pemberton who makes good drivers look mediocre, as McReynolds did with Earnhardt and Jarrett, and Pemberton did with Martin (who had better results with Hmiel/Fennig) and Wallace (who had better results with Barry Dodson/Buddy Parrott). This is as opposed to truly great crew chiefs like Andy Petree, Buddy Parrott, or Todd Parrott who made mediocre drivers look competitive (I'm referring to Phil Parsons, Derrike Cope, and Elliott Sadler respectively here...I'm not claiming that DJ was mediocre in the Todd Parrott years, okay?) I absolutely have despised Ray Evernham in every one of his roles (crew chief, owner, and announcer) and in fact STOPPED hating Gordon once Evernham was no longer his crew chief. All his mock-motivational crap he stole from Vince Lombardi and Pat Riley made me want to throw up. "From Nobody to Upstart to Contender to Winner to Champion to Dynasty to Emperor of a Third World Country" my ass. Yet the NASCAR media repeated this chart over and over and over again in 1997-1998 as if it was Evernham's idea... As for NRF's points on Gordon's equipment, it seems people are all over the map on this. I do think Ford had better stuff in '97-'98 and Gordon overpowered Ford pretty much by himself, which is to his credit. On the flip side, a lot of people say that in those years GM put almost all its money into the #24 neglecting all the other Chevy and Pontiac (and even Hendrick) teams to the point where the #24 was the de facto factory Chevy ride, even though the #3 was actually SPONSORED by GM. I don't know if I buy that theory or not (I tend to think I don't, since the Fords looked faster to me in 1997-98, even faster than Gordon's own equipment), but a LOT of people still have it. As for Kyle having stronger equipment, I don't know if I'd say that. It probably is AS strong, but I certainly think Kyle faces more fresh competition than Gordon did. If all Kyle had to do was beat a 40-year-old Jeff Gordon, a 40-year-old Tony Stewart, a bunch of shitty drivers in premier cars, and a bunch of hard-working journeymen like Bobby Hamilton who weren't given anything good to drive, Kyle would find it much easier to rack up the 10-win seasons, I would think... I mentioned above and want to repeat: what Daytona 500 did Kyle choke? In 2007, he was 2nd behind Mark Martin and he might have had a shot to win that if he had made a move to the inside before Harvick made a move to the outside but probably nobody would have drafted with him. I don't think he really had that much of a shot. In 2008, he led the most laps but Tony Stewart passed him late and it was Stewart, if anyone, who choked that one by choosing the wrong lane (you'd have a much better argument for Stewart choking marquee races, in and out of NASCAR, than Kyle, by the way, although Stewart closes the deal on every championship battle he is in except the 1998 IRL title battle against Kenny Brack, which is one of the main things to his credit, and much more important than closing individual race wins). And in 2009, Junior wrecked the field in front of him and Kyle had no way to avoid it (please don't be saying he choked THIS one). However, I DO agree with NRF that car is much more important today than it was in the '90s. I totally miss the days when Rick Mast or Hut Stricklin or Michael Waltrip (even if his team was cheating in that Darlington race) or Mike Skinner could randomly just spank the field, hell, even '01 had a lot of this (and although I found a LOT of the races boring that season due to aero push, it was still compelling because there seemed to be different competitors every week. There was a lot LESS of that in the late '90s, but still some, and there's almost none of that today...) I actually think IndyCar has a lot of that now, however, contrary to NRF. Takuma Sato was leading the points entering Indy in A.J. Foyt's car(?!) Marco leading the points now? Penske and Ganassi have failed to win in the first five races this season (which they haven't done since 1986!) Although NRF is low on Tony Kanaan's win, it's still the first win for KV Racing Technology since Will Power's 2008 win at Long Beach on the split weekend where Danica won the other race. This year's Long Beach race where Penske, Ganassi, and Andretti were shut out of the podium for the first time since 2003? Will Power actually looking slow sometimes on the road courses? Carlos Munoz finishing 2nd on his debut? E.J. Viso, Mike Conway, and James Jakes, widely held to be three of the worst drivers in the field starting in the top three today? Etc... etc... etc... One of the MANY reasons I am finding IndyCar more compelling than NASCAR the past few seasons, and MUCH more than say 2009 when every race pretty much WAS decided between Penske and Ganassi. I think car is LESS important in IndyCar than it has been most of the last 20 years, but I think it is MORE important in NASCAR these days... And yes, when it appears like Hendrick or Gibbs is going to dominate every single race (and even their satellites are shit now...when a Stewart-Haas dominant run would be a "change of pace", it's just sad), I can't remain interested. Period. 55. Sean posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "The average finish of most of those drivers was much better than today's drivers who finished in the same points position." There were fewer cars per race, there was no chase to shuffle up the running order, there are more competitive cars now, and NASCAR's charity rules jumble up the running order to mostly prevent drivers from having as high a top ten percentage as they once did. "Ward Burton was very similar to Harvick, when you consider Harvick lucked into about half of his wins in FAR superior equipment to Bill Davis... just not as lucky. Sterling Marlin got half of his wins on non-plate tracks, including a dominant show at Darlington in the spring of 95. Rusty was the most dangerous driver on a short track until he retired." Not sure how great I'd say Harvick's equipment has been. I think he's a little better than Ward. I think Kevin is a driver who is underrated by some due to being dislikable while Ward is overrated due to being likable, but I can understand that, since the media MASSIVELY overrates him. Marlin was not really a championship threat - he was the Cup Arie Luyendyk. Not JUST a marquee race specialist, but not really a threat over the overall schedule (and don't give me 2002 - nobody deserved that title and he wouldn't have even uninjured). Jeff Gordon surpassed Rusty as the best short track driver at least by 2001, and I'd say Kurt Busch was probably the best on them at the time of Rusty's retirement. "You will see that Hendrick has purchased almost all of his success, including buying the Chevy factory backing from the Junior Johnson team in the 80s." Then what the hell was up with their 1990-92 if THEY, not the #3 car, were the GM factory team? 56. Eric posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NicoRosbergFan, Dale wasn't getting top 5's week in and week out from 1997 to 1999. Dale only had 19 top 5's from 1997 to 1999. Dale had 7 top 5's in 1997, 5 top 5's in 1998, and 7 in 1999. Dale in 1997 and 1998 was his some of his worst seasons as a cup driver ever. I argue Dale's 1998 season was even worst than his 1992 season was even. That meant his 1998 season was his worst since he was with Bud "I got engines from the Acme factory" Moore. I remembered Dale from the 1997 to 1999 era. He wasn't the same driver after the Talladega crash in 1996 that he suffered multiple injuries from. RCR at the time was behind, Dale had the wrong crew chief in Larry McReynolds, and not all of his injuries from Talladega was healed even in 1999. Dale had neck surgery done after the 1999 season. Based on how Dale Did in 2000, that shows his injuries affected him. 57. Eric posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If anyone doesn't believe me Bud Moore got engines from Acme when Dale Sr. was a driver there, Benny Parsons had problems with engines while racing for Bud Moore also. The engines at Bud Moore had durability problems for lasting 500 miles. 58. David posted: 06.01.2013 - 12:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dang Sean, you never fail to remind me why you're one of my favorite posters. I could never write something that long. Lots of good points in there, too. 59. Paul posted: 06.01.2013 - 1:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "In 2012, if Kyle just doesn't get spun out at Watkins Glen or if they decide to end under caution due to Bobby Labonte leaking oil, again, he makes the chase. Jeff Gordon certainly exploited the opportunity to pass Kyle brilliantly, but if the races had been officiated just a bit differently, he might not have been in the position to so." Jeff Gordon spun out on the last lap at Watkins Glen as well, and actually lost more positions and points than Kyle did, as Jeff lost 12 positions/points, while Kyle lost only six positions and 10 points. Had that race been officiating differently, the end result at Richmond would have been the same, with Jeff making the Chase and Kyle missing it. "I tend to think I don't, since the Fords looked faster to me in 1997-98, even faster than Gordon's own equipment" Seeing as how Gordon didn't lead the most laps in either of those two seasons, including leading over 400 laps less than Dale Jarrett in '97, I don't think it mattered how much money GM was putting into the #24 team. That team was good enough to overcome the powerhouse Fords those two seasons, and again in 2001 when Gordon beat the Yates teammates Jarrett and Rudd, and a lot of that was because they had the best driver in the sport behind the wheel. If the car is good enough and nothing bad comes along his way, Jeff Gordon will get the job done. Always has been, and always will be the status quo. "In 2008, he led the most laps but Tony Stewart passed him late and it was Stewart, if anyone, who choked that one by choosing the wrong lane" That might have been the biggest self-inflicted choke I've ever seen in NASCAR. All Stewart had to do was hold his line and he would have won the Daytona 500. Kyle had a head of steam on the inside lane, but Stewart had Ryan Newman shoving him for two laps in order to break away from that inside lane, plus he's good enough on restrictor plate tracks to break the draft and take the air off of Kyle's car if necessary. Instead, he switched lanes down the backstretch on the last lap, essentially said "Hey Newman, I'm not ready to win this race. Here, you go win it instead," and went on to have one of his worst seasons in NASCAR. It would have been winless had the debacle at Talladega in the fall not happened (Although I can forgive that somewhat now, now that Regan Smith does have a Talladega win to his credit.). 60. Sean posted: 06.01.2013 - 1:25 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "Jeff Gordon spun out on the last lap at Watkins Glen as well, and actually lost more positions and points than Kyle did, as Jeff lost 12 positions/points, while Kyle lost only six positions and 10 points. Had that race been officiating differently, the end result at Richmond would have been the same, with Jeff making the Chase and Kyle missing it." Wrong, because Kyle would have made the chase because he had 2 wins to Jeff's 1. THAT was my point. 61. cjs3872 posted: 06.01.2013 - 1:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Actually Paul, had the final lap at the race at Watkins Glen been officiated differently, Kyle Busch would have made the Chase instead of Jeff Gordon. Sure, Gordon's spin cost him more positions than Busch's problems cost him, but Kyle would have won that race, which would have give him two wins to Gordon's one, thus putting Kyle into the Chase instead of Gordon. Also, Tony Stewart was probably going to be passed on the final lap of the 2008 Daytona 500 by the Penske cars anyway. The Penske cars had such a run at him that, if he doesn't go down low to try to pick up Kyle Busch, the two Penske cars would have blown by him on the inside, and I think he knew it. Actually, I think Stewart may have gotten a better finish than he was going to get by dropping to the inside because there were other Dodges behind the two Penske cars that might also have gone by him, and if he doesn't duck low, he might have finished fifth or sixth, instead of third. 62. Eric posted: 06.01.2013 - 1:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle is very overrated as a driver, but I do think he will be looked upon better in time as a cup driver than he is now. Kyle Busch to me appears to be a 40 to 60 cup wins in his career driver. That means I expect the win totals anywhere from Mark Martin to past Rusty Wallace. Kyle to me as a driver that wins 3 to 4 wins a season in his prime. I think he's going to be the worst driver to be in the 50 win club unless something changes where he wins at and gets a cup championship. I am saying that because Junior Johnson has currently the most cup wins ever without having a cup championship. That is a record that don't want to break. Kyle is one of the best short track driver of his generation in cup. I think Kyle varies on the intermediate tracks. I don't think all of Kyle Busch's problems is mentally. I am saying that because Kyle does have some tracks that he's weak at in the cup side. He stinks at Kansas. When a driver's best finish at track is 7th place in 12 starts, that is a bad track. Kyle only has 2 top 10's there also. Kyle also had problems at Atlanta for most of his cup career also. Before last year, Kyle had problems at Homestead also before 2012. Kyle is a driver that is streaky at Chicagoland and Texas despite having wins there. 63. Paul posted: 06.01.2013 - 1:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sorry about that. I was in that pre-2011 mindset that the top 12 drivers qualify for the Chase when I made that last post. "if he doesn't go down low to try to pick up Kyle Busch, the two Penske cars would have blown by him on the inside" Kyle was already there and had a pretty good run down the backstretch thanks to Kasey Kahne. Newman might have cleared Kyle if he made the move at the right time, but Kurt would not have been able to change lanes. Stewart's lane change slowed Kyle down and killed the inside lane's momentum, thereby giving the win to Ryan Newman. The Penske cars would not have blown by Stewart. Newman might have been able to clear Kyle and race side-by-side with Stewart, but he wouldn't have blown by him and cost Stewart four or five positions, rather than the two that he lost by changing lanes. 64. Baker posted: 06.01.2013 - 1:46 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) I was more upset about the 2008 Dayton 500 than anyone and I was even upset Tony Stewart didn't try to move up that track to block Newman, however, he didn't choke that race away. He has had his fair share of chokes or self inflicted bad finishes, however, the 2008 500 was not one of those races. Newman and Busch were coming like a bat out of hell and Stewart was just a sitting duck. Whichever lane he chose to block the other lane would have gone by him. Heck those guys had such a run if he did move up they could have easily dipped to the bottom and drove past him anyway. Its not like there was a wad of traffic there that would have made it hard for them to change lanes if Stewart did first. 65. Baker posted: 06.01.2013 - 1:53 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Another thing that is killing Kyle Busch since joining Gibbs and I am sure has a lot to do with his mental toughness too is the mechanical failures. You cannot say with a straight face that out of all the top dogs in the game today Kyle Busch doesn't have the worst luck when it comes to mechanical. Just the 2008 season alone with 8 wins in 26 races and then the first 3 events of the chase he had mechanical failures before the first third of the race was over. He blows engines like its going out of style. Sure you could possible blame that on the driver sometimes, however, Denny Hamlin, Joey Logano, and Matt Kenseth have also had those problems in Cup and Nationwide as well. That to me clearly makes it a team problem and not a driver problem. Take away the mental toughness argument, the drivers skill and just make it about luck and Kyle Busch is the anti Jimmie Johnson. He has the anti Golden Horse Shoe up his butt. 66. 83andJoe posted: 06.01.2013 - 2:27 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) New news: Corey LaJoie has signed a driver development deal with Richard Petty Motorsports. 67. The Long Shot posted: 06.01.2013 - 2:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Another thing that is killing Kyle Busch since joining Gibbs and I am sure has a lot to do with his mental toughness too is the mechanical failures. You cannot say with a straight face that out of all the top dogs in the game today Kyle Busch doesn't have the worst luck when it comes to mechanical. Just the 2008 season alone with 8 wins in 26 races and then the first 3 events of the chase he had mechanical failures before the first third of the race was over. He blows engines like its going out of style. Sure you could possible blame that on the driver sometimes, however, Denny Hamlin, Joey Logano, and Matt Kenseth have also had those problems in Cup and Nationwide as well. That to me clearly makes it a team problem and not a driver problem." Agreed. I've often wondered why NASCAR hasn't done something about TRD. They build really good race cars, but their engines are crap. 68. The Final Gear posted: 06.01.2013 - 2:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @66 N'Wide series next year? I know that Trucks are likely non-existent because BKR is the only big Ford team. 69. murb posted: 06.01.2013 - 2:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "N'Wide series next year? I know that Trucks are likely non-existent because BKR is the only big Ford team." Part time NNS later this year and full time NNS next year. That's the plan. 70. TS1420 posted: 06.01.2013 - 2:54 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) I agree 100% with Baker's last two posts. I've hated for years that everybody claims "LOL Stewart choked and gave away the 2008 Daytona 500 to Ryan Newman" when he was a sitting duck to the Penske teammates and his best chance was to hook up with teammate Kyle Busch had a hell of a run coming out of turn 2. If Tony would have stayed high and the Penske teammates blasted by him everybody would be saying "LOL Stewart is such a horrible teammate, he could have won if he hooked up Kyle instead of trying to block the Penske cars" And while Kyle Busch has had his fair share of epic chokes (Richmond 2012 most notably), a lot of his JGR/TuRD & just plain horrible luck aided losses are unfairly attributed to him being a choker. His 2008 chase failure was all due to JGR building their cars out of glass and Kyle was put in position to miss the 2012 chase mostly due to TuRD giving him 100 mile engines for most of the summer & NASCAR's inability to correctly officiate races. 71. Baker posted: 06.01.2013 - 3:53 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) TS140, The real choke last season at Richmond was Rogers. It was a BS call to bring Kyle Busch in. Jeff Gordon was having a crap day and all they had to do at that point was match Jeff Gordon move for move and Rogers made a stupid call. Easily one of the worst pick calls I've seen in NASCAR. 72. Schroeder51 posted: 06.01.2013 - 4:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sebastian Saavedra crashes in the IndyCar race...Good grief, how many times has he wrecked this year? 73. Anonymous posted: 06.01.2013 - 5:01 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Should I just accept the fact Jr will never win again? 74. murb posted: 06.01.2013 - 5:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Saavedra's double bird was pretty epic. Not as epic as Will Power's double bird to the officials in the tower, but still pretty epic. 75. Schroeder51 posted: 06.01.2013 - 5:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) BSPN fail: During Mike Conway's pit stop they listed him as Justin Wilson. 76. We need more Onion posted: 06.01.2013 - 5:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) How often do you see Dale Coyne running 1-2? Nice runs so far for both Wilson and Conway. Also I lost all interest in Ana Beatriz, thought her bad runs were more her equipment than talent, now I see that car is being one of the strongest with the right driver. 77. Schroeder51 posted: 06.01.2013 - 5:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Ryan Briscoe crashes. 78. Schroeder51 posted: 06.01.2013 - 5:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mike Conway! 79. We need more Onion posted: 06.01.2013 - 5:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dale Coyne with two guys on the podium, gotta' be happy for him. And for his drivers. 80. murb posted: 06.01.2013 - 5:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Congrats to Conway. He's on the pole for tomorrow's race too, so he's got a great shot at sweeping these two double headers. I also think it's cool how he doesn't want to do the ovals. He realizes that the road and street courses are his bread and butter, so he's sticking to that. 81. David posted: 06.01.2013 - 6:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) No, murb, he just doesn't want to have a repeat of Indy 2010. :) 82. murb posted: 06.01.2013 - 6:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "No, murb, he just doesn't want to have a repeat of Indy 2010. :)" Well yeah, that to. But I wish more guys would just stick to what they're good at. 83. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.01.2013 - 6:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Not as epic as Will Power's double bird to the officials in the tower" I still get a kick out of that. "The real choke last season at Richmond was Rogers. It was a BS call to bring Kyle Busch in." Although that was a bad call, Kyle blatantly threw in the towel after that, saying nothing of the car's handling and falling like a rock. He could have made back high enough to make the cha$e regardless what Jeff did (sadly, they don't give out points for epicness). But even despite two Toyotas (Hamlin and Truex) falling back intentionally to give Kyle spots, he collapsed so bad it didn't matter. "That meant his 1998 season was his worst since he was with Bud "I got engines from the Acme factory" Moore." To me, 1998 was definitely Dale's worst season. I know he finished lower in points in '82 and '92, but at least he led laps in those years and was competitive fairly often only to be undone by mechanical issues. In 1998, Dale just plain was out in left field. He has never finished so far behind the champion in points. Granted that was Gordon's 13 win season, but Dale was lost after Daytona. He never got lapped that regularly and even his other Top 5s (the Brickyard 400, the Southern 500) were distant Top 5s. He has never looked worse than he did in '98. " but saying his career has not been as good as Jeff Gordon's is not exactly an insult" I'm not saying his career hasn't been as good as Jeff's, I'm saying, in Cup, he has been WAY WAY WAY off the pace of a young Gordon. "Honestly, I have never seen this much praise for a driver from a fan who doesn't like him. That would NEVER happen on other racing forums. That is what separates this site from the rest." I know some will disagree, but I feel I am pretty objective. Yes I know Jeff had a massive advantage beginning in '95 when technology and engineering became the most important aspect of racing in NASCAR, but holy shit look at his numbers! I will post more about this later. Need to grab a bite to eat, then its off to The Madhouse! 84. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.01.2013 - 7:26 pm Rate this comment: (4) (0) Holy shit, the K&N Series is racing here at Bowman Gray tonight, and Brian France's grandson is in the race. Was hoping Brian would be here tonight so I could yell insults at him. Seriously, I would love to do that, let him know what I think of "his" NASCAR. 85. murb posted: 06.01.2013 - 7:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Too bad that he probably would be too wasted to hear you, lol. 86. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.01.2013 - 7:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Actually it is Lesa's grandson, his last name is Kennedy. Also, I've been to the Cup races at Martinsville and Darlington this year, and here at tiny little Bowman Gray I've seen my first flyover of the year. Lol murb 87. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.01.2013 - 8:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Ernie Irvan is somewhere here tonight. Gotta find him. 88. TS1420 posted: 06.01.2013 - 9:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I highly doubt Brian France would show up at Bowman-Gray Stadium. He doesn't even up show for Cup races most of the season. 89. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.01.2013 - 9:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) F***! That damn Kennedy/France kid won (he is actually Lesa's son, Brian's nephew). I just can't catch a damn break in racing. The two girls finished 4th and 6th. They both looked very smooth out there. 90. Anonymous posted: 06.01.2013 - 10:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Are the drivers going to be shifting at Pocono next week? 91. jabber1990 posted: 06.01.2013 - 10:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I was listening to NPR's "Wait, wait, dont tell me" and they made fun of "The Stenica" Peter Sagal was talkign to either Roy Blunt JR. or Amy Dickinson Sagal: A textbook example of why you shouldnt date in your workplace occured when Danica Patricks boyfreind is now in the Doghouse following "blank" "um? he ran her off the road?" "Right, During the Coca-Cola 600 he crashed into her causing her to crash into another driver. but not even her fire resistant suit can put out the fire that is their love" despite all the headline news that NASCAR has had thats the only thing that gets news? Danica taking the pole (which writes its own jokes) the Nationwide crash (which they did talk about on NPR) Cablegate (which was also headline news) maybe im overreacting to a show that doesnt take itself serious on NPR 92. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 12:18 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Never got to see Ernie :( 93. Paul posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:26 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) The news hasn't officially been released yet, but word has broken out that Ryan Truex has signed a driver development deal with Richard Petty Motorsports. He joins fellow 2nd generation K&N Pro Series East winner Corey LaJoie as two drivers who have signed on with RPM in as many days. They certainly are stacking on talent on that team, now all they need is a concrete plan to put both drivers in full-time rides. If I'm Marcos Ambrose, I'm looking for a new ride. If I'm Aric Almirola or Michael Annett, I'm working my ass off to get results in order to keep my ride, just in case RPM might have other near future plans. 94. murb posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, lots of shaking up going on RPM. Like I said earlier, good to see them giving more young guys shots. 95. The Long Shot posted: 06.02.2013 - 11:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think Almirola should be quite safe. He's shown a lot of potential throughout his 2 years with the team, even though he has yet to win a race (which I think he will at some point this year; perhaps the fall Charlotte race). Ambrose is almost certainly gone after this season, but the question remains: who would replace him? While I highly disagree with this move, it wouldn't shock me if RPM decided to bump Michael Annett into Cup next year. He clearly needs some more time to develop, but RPM needs that 43 ride open, since I can't see them turning into a 3 car team next year, so they might just push him up. Jeff Burton or David Ragan could also be options for that #9 car (I checked: Burton's contract does expire after this year, according to Jayski.com). 96. murb posted: 06.02.2013 - 12:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'll have to miss most of this race unfortunately. With my luck lately, it will probably be an amazing race, lol 97. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 12:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) As it happens, I'm not even getting FOX today. Probably because of my tirade against them last week, haha. 98. The Long Shot posted: 06.02.2013 - 12:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nice rear end, Carl. 99. The Final Gear posted: 06.02.2013 - 12:49 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) This is my favorite FOX broadcast of the year, their last one... 100. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 12:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DW predicts BoB will win a race before Stenhouse. WOW. 101. Mr X posted: 06.02.2013 - 12:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) They should burn that effigy of Michael Waltrip. 102. Jim Davis posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "DW predicts BoB will win a race before Stenhouse" There are four plate races every year. It's not unthinkable. 103. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:00 pm Rate this comment: (1) (2) Ugh. Please FOX, keep Mikey far, far away from these telecasts next year. Why does that network hate us so much? Two Waltrips when one is WAY too many to begin with? Ugh. 104. WinstonCup4Ever posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) FOX concludes their racing season today at a track where they first started broadcasting auto racing ironically enough. (1999 MBNA Mid Atlantic 200 IRL Race). 105. FOX posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:10 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Thanks to you, our loyal viewers! We hope you will join us when next year's broadcasts start with the Sprint Unlimited live from Daytona International Speedway. Enjoy today's race! 106. Anonymous posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I dont think Michael Annett is in much trouble as he has Sponsors who are very loyal 107. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Guys, this show on SPEED, named "King of the Curve", is this a one-off or teams and drivers change weekly? 108. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Aero Push as ridiculous as usual today 109. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeez Darrell, if you have to preface your statement with "I know the fans aren't gonna like me saying this" THEN DON'T F***ING SAY IT! Him and his mouth. Earnhardt: 14 Top 5 point finishes in 22 seasons Kyle Busch: 1 Top 5 point finish in 8 seasons 110. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Time for my weekly caution predictions... I predict there will be five cautions today, and all but one of them will be for BS debris/boredom cautions. 111. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:37 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Honestly, if I were Tony Gibson, I'd just park that 10 for the day. Let the media make all the excuses for her. The Baroness simply looks lost out there. And she is. This is not where she belongs. 112. The Final Gear posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Danica went down into 3 in a really bad angle, car washed up and she probably blamed Stremme for it. Oh well, her race is already bad, I couldn't be happier. 113. 18fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I am surprised that FOX didn't try to blame Stremme for Danica's contact with him that was clearly her foot. Darrell has the two straightaways mixed up on the onboard ride along with Junior. 114. Benjamin Lowe posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:40 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) 2013 has been a really, really bad year to be a fan of NASCAR. 115. New14 & 88Fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) JJ isn't that far off from being lapped, they'll probably work/luck themselves back into contention like they always do though. 116. Logano22 posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) About that time for a debris caution 117. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Great seats still available" 118. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:44 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) MWR has led more laps than RFR this year great job Jack 119. murb posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jimmie is about to go a lap down? Maybe there is hope!!!! 120. John posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:46 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Ill probably watch this race until the first garbage caution. After that its IRL time baby 121. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) ABC local affiliate here has cancelled Indy coverage for some spelling bee, apparently spelling bees get better ratings than Indycar so I guess it's fair but sucks for me. 122. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) JJ getting lapped early is not a good thing at all. 123. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) No boredom cautions yet? 124. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:53 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Boredom caution. NASCAR, shit like this is why you are such a damn joke. 125. 18fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:53 pm Rate this comment: (4) (0) The Jimmie Johnson benefit caution. 126. The Final Gear posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Debris caution. 127. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I wonder what the interval between first and second place has to be for NASCAR to throw a boredom caution? 128. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Speak of the devil. Our first boredom caution. Actually, scratch that. I predict ALL the cautions today will be boredom cautions. 129. OldSchoolNascarDude1 posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:54 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Debris caution gives Jimmie Johnson his lap back. 130. John posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) What a joke. Off goes the race 131. Conspiracy Theorist #1 posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) There are drivers who usually get the BS caution to get their lap back (Danica, JG, Dale Jr.), but there is one driver who 100% of time gets the BS caution: Jimmie Johnson 132. Woodbridge posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:57 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) I think this counts as a boredom caution. At least, I didn't see any shots of debris. Danica does not deserve a 3rd year in the #10. Give that ride to Harvick, or if you have to go with 4 SHR cars, let's get Ragan or Regan in that #10.. 133. WinstonCup4Ever posted: 06.02.2013 - 1:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @121: I here ya. A while back sometime in the late 2000's, my ABC affiliate, KSTP from the Twin Cities, simulcasted an NHL Wild game off sister station KSTC 45 instead of an NBA Sunday game. Lucky for me, I had both Cable and Satellite at the time (now I only have Satellite), but I was able to catch the game off an ABC affiliate from La Crosse WI. I also recorded the game as well. 134. Woodbridge posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:00 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Almirola too fast entering pit road. Depressing, I really want to see him keep up the good work he's done lately. Speaking of good work, Casey Mears lead lap in 19th spot after 89 laps. Props. 135. Jim Davis posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) "Danica does not deserve a 3rd year in the #10. Give that ride to Harvick, or if you have to go with 4 SHR cars, let's get Ragan or Regan in that #10.." With what sponsor? 136. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Watch Johnson come back and end up either winning this race or finish in the top 3. 137. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Thank you Larry Mac. Although I don't like JJ personally, with all the hullabaloo around the 48 team and Chad and all the money and resources they have, their biggest asset is indeed Jimmie himself. Had KyBu started the race like JJ did he would have hit the wall by now. 138. AveryNH posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I wish it was 3:30. The indycar race cannot come fast enough. 139. WinstonCup4Ever posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) What a run David Gilliland is having. He's close to cracking the top 20. 140. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The caution flag HATES Jeff Gordon, despite what Conspiracy Theorist #1 says. 141. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) BoB is only running ahead of two cars out there on the track, Joe Nemechek and Timmy Hill. And this is the Face of NASCAR, folks. 142. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:12 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) As I am Conspiracy Theorist #1, I think of 2005 Martinsville! 143. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:13 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) To those who told me I'm nuts for saying "Beware Jamie McMurray," look who's in 4th! 144. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NASCAR will probably throw another boredom caution soon enough to help Jimmie Johnson get even closer to the front. I can sense it... 145. AveryNH posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mr. Consistency, Paul Menard is having a dismal run sitting in 27th one lap down. 146. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And that folks is the definition of arrogance. Must be nice to be on a team that has the most money, most resources, most connections in the sport, and Jimmie Johnson behind the wheel. Chad Knaus is gonna be in the Hall Of Fame one day and that is a damn shame. HMS and Jimmie have made him. 147. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:16 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Jesus Christ! Do I have psychic powers or what?! 148. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:16 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Let's be truthful, DSFF. Read Darrell's autobiography... Hendrick has bought ALL of his success. After reading most of that book, I sadly doubt the authenticity of Jeff's success. 149. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Good to see NASCAR throwing the caution to give the 48 a break. Yesterday, I was debating whether or not to pick Jeff Gordon in my top-5 or not. I figured he would either drive to the front and contend today, or he would go nowhere. Today seems to be one of those "do nothing" days for Jeff. *sigh* Oh good, another caution to clean up some really dangerous debris... 150. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Decided to tune myself in for Indycar and found a video when Hinchcliffe tries out a dog washing machine... much more entertaining than NASCAR. 151. Woodbridge posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:19 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) 2nd straight debris caution without showing the actual debris. 152. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That's it, I officially need to start playing the lottery. 153. Benjamin Lowe posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think we might need the League of Shadows to take care of NASCAR's incompetence 154. Rich56 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) These debris cautions are literally out of control. Of course it won't change until NASCAR actually capitulates 155. Chives posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Is it just me, or does it seem like every single time they have a "debris" caution, it's during a commercial break? 156. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NicoRosbergFan, what's the name of Darrell's book? Cuz I've read his book, "DW: A lifetime going around in circles". Is that the one you're talking about? 157. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:20 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) Hendrick has definitely bought all his success, and he bought it with dirty money (see Honda and Mail Fraud and Presidential Pardon). Worst of all, he has bought connections in the sport. It is a shame for drivers like Jeff and Jimmie (character flaws aside) that have done so well with superior mental toughness, but we have to legitimately question all their success and discount them historically. I think they both would be champions and have a lot of wins elsewhere, and probably be thought more of as drivers and rightfully so. But Rick Hendrick ruined that. 158. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) BSPN is to Kyle Busch what FOX is to Jimmie Johnson. 159. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Sunday's Will Never Be the Same" is the DW bio I'm chugging through right now... even he leaves an air of doubt about Hendrick. 160. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NRF, the only free pass Jeff got that day in 2005 was when Sterling Marlin spun. That kind of disproves your claim. 161. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:22 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Good grief. FOX is cheering for Johnson just as much as BSPN was cheering for Kyle yesterday. Please, let this race end quickly so we can get on to TNT's all-too-brief coverage! 162. OldSchoolNascarDude1 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I didn't know that David Hoots spends time on Racing Reference during actual races. It's nice to have a celebrity on here, Schroeder51, or as I should call you, David Hoots. 163. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Darrell has two autobios, the "Going Around In Circles" which is actually a good read, then the "Sundays Will Never Be The Same" which was basically released to capitolizr on the 10th anniversary of Dale's death, it mostly revolves around his relationship with Dale. But he does let a few nuggets slip, like Junior was already planning a leave from Chevrolet as early as '86 cause Hendrick was buying their support. 164. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I read "Sundays Will Never be the Same" in less than two days, if even that long. I'm kind of a fast reader. 165. Benjamin Lowe posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Schroder51 I think you might need to become a Jedi Master. 166. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm reading it slow just because it's good. I read the book, and I don't see how he's such a lousy announcer unless they're told to act that way on TV. 167. murb posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm sure any of Darrell's books are better than that self loathing sobfest book that Mikey put out a couple years ago. 168. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I read Michael Waltrip's "In the Blink of a Eye", too. It's actually pretty good. Plus, it's an autographed copy, though now I'm not too sure now whether that's a good thing or not. 169. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Holy cow. BoB is now behind Joe Nemechek! She's only running ahead of Timmy Hill currently. I think this might be a new low for her so far this season. 170. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Worst timing ever on my previous comment. 171. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kenseth just blew up. 172. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And Logano has a flat tire. 173. 18fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kenseth just blew up and Logano has a flat left front. 174. Benjamin Lowe posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:31 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) Have you read DW latest book it's called how me & the Fox Crew drove off a million fans from NASCAR in less then 5 minutes. 175. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) She had ONE decent race this season, Martinsville. Somehow she really ran well there and had a great car. But this is the low, also something needs to change at FAS Lane, they are the slowest week in-week out. TuRD blows another engine... 176. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Caution is out. 177. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Tough break for Matt. He's really become an unofficial favorite of mine this year. 178. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Our first legitimate caution flag of the day. It might be the only one, too. 179. murb posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Worst timing ever on my previous comment." lol, I'm not denying that it was probably interesting, David. I just hate how he put it out and used it to basically exploit everything that happened on 2/18/01. Classic TURD engine expiration. 180. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:33 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) TRD is a running joke. Every week they have one of the cars to beat only to break. Embarrassing. 181. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Serously, TRD is like Geoff Bodine was with his own team. Fastest for 150 miles, then blowing up. 182. Rich56 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NASCAR.com says its for debris on the frontstretch 183. New14 & 88Fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sounds like I missed another TRD engine failure. JGR really needs to consider going back to building their own engines, for Toyato to give their teams so many engines only for them to go sour in the race is just ridicules. 184. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) IndyCar, where are you?! 185. Baker posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) So Kenseth blows up again? My dad swears Kenseth is the man to beat this year and I keep telling him its not happening. I have seen too many mechanical failures at Joe Gibbs over the years to see that ever working out. He will blow 2 engines in the chase at minimum while Hendrick runs away with another championship. 186. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:37 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Nice timing for the 'Toyota is so reliable' commercial LOL. 187. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Holy cow, Matt is ALREADY in his street clothes!!! 188. murb posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I actually agree with you Baker. Kenseth without a doubt is the driver and has the team to win the championship this year, but Toyota's shaky reliability will probably cost him (and us of seeing someone other than Jimmie hoist the Cup). 189. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:39 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Travis Kvapil blew up? Good grief, can BK Racing ever make it through a single race without something happening to at least one of their cars? 190. Dave#38 Fan-Go Gilliland! posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:40 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) ABC's IndyCar coverage at 3:30 can't get here fast enough. 191. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:40 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Also they say BK Racing lost another engine, they are absolutely luckless this year. 192. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kahne moves to second. I get the feeling that an android will be leading this race shortly... 193. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:43 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Piss off, Johnson! 194. 18fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:46 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Johnson is going to be leading this race before too long. God damn that team. 195. Mr X posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:49 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) It's worth noting that despite only coming to Cup in 2007 the Toyota engine is actually the oldest in NASCAR because if you remember Toyota came to the Truck Series in 2004 with a detuned version of the same motor. The Ford FR9 is the newest, running its first races in late 2009, the Dodge R6P8 made its debut roughly a year earlier in 2008, and the Chevrolet R07 won for the first time with Kevin Harvick in the All Star Race in 2007 I believe. Given that Toyota had never developed an OHV pushrod V8 engine in its history it's not a huge surprise that their first foray into it has been marginally successful at best, with marginal power, marginal fuel economy, and poor reliability, mind you much of this can also be because of some internally designed parts by the teams themselves. 196. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Totally would not be surprised if Kyle blew up before too much longer and Johnson dominated the rest of the race. 197. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:51 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) 18fan, good old Hendrick/NASCAR race-fixing. 198. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Seriously, NASCAR's gotta be slipping the 48 team something special during the yellow-flag pit stops, because they went from almost being a lap down to being the fastest car on track! WTF! 199. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The FOX mid race report is coming up! Yay! *pukes in Donny Lia bucket* Kyle, don't look in your mirror. 200. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The 48 was 3/10ths faster than anyone on that last lap! W....T....F! 201. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Johnson to the lead... Urgh! 202. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mears is racing flawlessly, currently holding on to a stellar 13th place, but who cares what happens behind the 5th unless it is with a big team. 203. Benjamin Lowe posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:55 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) Chad Belichick & Jimmie Brady. 204. 18fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Johnson is the only car up front with 4 fresh tires, that explains how he is that much faster than everybody else. 205. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:56 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) If Johnson wins this race, I will throw my Kindle from the couch all the way through the den and through the computer screen. And scream. Just kidding, I'm not that violent. 206. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:56 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) FOX what a joke misses Johnson's pass for the lead when doing the stupid Mid-Race Report then goes to commercial like the lead change never happened. 207. loomer posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Game over. 208. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I just got a message from Don Merideth to pass on here: Turn the lights out, the party's over. 209. murb posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:57 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) So glad this is Fox's last race. 210. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Truex to second. 211. cjs3872 posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) As fast as Kyle Busch is fading, I wonder if he's beginning to have problems with his car, because not only did Jimmie Johnson catch him fast, so has Martin Truex, Jr., so I wonder if something's happening with his car. 212. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 2:59 pm Rate this comment: (2) (1) Kyle is throwing in the towel as we speak. Suddenly Truex is past him. Everytime Kyle loses the lead after dominating for a while, he gets passed by more cars. That is why I still doubt he had a deflating tire at the end of the Southern 500. That looked to me to be yet another Kyle throwing in the towel performance. 213. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle Busch's dropping back another TuRD Engine failure? 214. Benjamin Lowe posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Martin Truex Jr could be the Tony Romo of NASCAR. 215. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:00 pm Rate this comment: (2) (1) David Caraviello just tweeted: "Here comes Jimmie. Cue the "Jaws" theme ...." How dare him! Doesn't he know that the Jaws theme is only reserved for Jeff Gordon?? 216. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:01 pm Rate this comment: (2) (1) WOW Casey Mears actually got mentioned. 217. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @216 I'm seeing the same and can't believe my eyes O.O 218. cjs3872 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:02 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) As hard as it is to believe, when Casey Mears just passed Brad Keselowski, it made the #13 car the LEADING Ford in the race. Now we KNOW the Ford teams are in trouble. 219. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mears top Ford in the FIELD. 220. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) What happened with Newman? or he just pitted? 221. Benjamin Lowe posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:04 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Kyle Busch is NASCAR's Dan Marino. 222. WinstonCup4Ever posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, I never knew Aric Almirola was the leader. 223. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The way cjs wrote post #218 was actually kind of funny. 224. League of Shadows posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Over the ages, our weapons have grown more sophisticated. With NASCAR, we tried a new one: Danica. 225. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Let's hope that Jimmie Johnson's run today ends like Kyle Busch's yesterday. 226. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) David, I actually tweeted Caraviello the same response! Lol! 227. NicoRosbergFAn posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Great, Mister-Me-and-my-owner-and-crew-chief-bought-and-cheated-to-get-our-success-Hack to the front... *pukes in Donny Lia bucket* 228. cjs3872 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) David, when the Germain Racing Ford is the top Ford in the race more than hallway through, it means the Ford teams are in REALLY big trouble, because that means that Roush, Penske, and Petty are all having terrible days not to be in front of the #13 car. 229. Benjamin Lowe posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:09 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Michael Waltrip is Jar Jar Binks. 230. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, disappointing performance from the Germain pit crew. 231. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You just earned yourself a follower, joey2448. 232. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Comparing Michael Waltrip to Jar Jar Binks is a huge insult to the Gungan. Jar Jar actually is somewhat intelligent. His only fault is that he is a klutz. 233. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And Jar Jar would probably had better results with DEI's #15. 234. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nice job posting as League of Shadows, NRF. Try the Justice League this time. 235. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DW is praising BoB for her performance today... 236. NicoRosbergFAn posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:17 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) I didn't do that post, David. 237. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) There, fixed that capital 'A' 238. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:19 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Is Darrell really defending The Baroness' performance? Waltrip, YOU ARE OUTTA HERE! 239. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:19 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Where are the "debris" cautions now, NASCAR??? Now that the 48 car is out front and dominating, it appears the track is clean as a whistle! But when he's back in the pack, there's shards of shit everywhere! In the spirit of some of those Saturday Night Live skits...REALLY??? *Getting ready to change the channel to ABC* 240. James T. Kirk posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:19 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Let me at Danica! I know how to fix this! Next March Danica is giving birth to little James Tiberius Patrick-Stenhouse... 241. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) No really, Schroeder, what did he do? 242. cjs3872 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @230, that's one of the drawbacks of being a small team. The same is true regarding Furniture Row Racing, which is why they didn't win the All-Star Race. The biggest pitfalls of being a small team is that they can't have the people, and that's where the big teams have the advantage. 243. Benjamin Lowe posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The FedEx 400 Benefiting insomnia has lived up to its name. 244. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:22 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) DW said something to the effect of "considering how she got 3 laps down off the bat, she's not doing too bad so far" or something like that. So if you're Danica Patrick, 32nd place is impressive. 245. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You didn't, NRF? Darn. I thought I had you with that capital "A". 246. Pavel Chekov posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Prepare to fire photon torpedoes on enemy (Jimmie Johnson) wessel without causing loss of life! 247. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Landon Cassill has a broken track bar. 248. Borg posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yes, David, NicoRosbergFan merely made a typo when he typed "NicoRosbergFAn" instead of "NicoRosbergFan." You and your forum will be assimilated into our race. Resistance is futile. 249. Chives posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Great car control by Cassill! 250. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And of course, now that Johnson has a massive lead and has this race all but won, watch it run green all to the way to the checkered flag. 251. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Whenever I'm mad or frustrated, I usually play the piano for a while. That piano may get a beating today. 252. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @cjs I know, but 6 seconds slower than Tony is not good at all. BTW, didn't Furniture have a deal with a big team helping them with pit crew training? (RCR maybe) 253. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Truex blows up! 254. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Caution is out. 255. 18fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:26 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Truex just blew up. Another TRD engine. 256. Borg posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You will now give up hope on someone other than Johnson winning. Resistance is futile. He has already been assimilated, as will you. *now we know where Johnson got that boring-ass personality* 257. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) TuRD! 258. New14 & 88Fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Though break for Truex, TRD you are outta here. 259. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) TRD, another classic race for them. 260. Anonymous posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Holy shit they talk about how Martin Truex could win blows up immediately no damn luck at all 261. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:28 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) David, I don't know what kind of music you play, but my piano may face the wrath of Chopin's Ballade No. 4 if this IndyCar race is turd. 262. Mr X posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nice to see Truex stay on the track and potentially turding all over it. 263. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Damn, no Trekkies... 264. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:30 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) TRD should change its name to "Toyota Lemon Development". 265. New14 & 88Fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:32 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) TRD is the Acme Corporation of engine builders. 266. cjs3872 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:32 pm Rate this comment: (4) (0) We know why these Toyota engines are having these problems, and that's lightweight parts. Toyota has always been known for running lightweight parts. I find it interesting that in today's pre-race show, Darrell Waltrip predicted that Matt Kenseth will win the championship, but you can't win a championship if you can't finish races, and the Toyota engines are built to go fast, but not necessarily last, and they've always been built that way. The actually remind me somewhat of Dan Gurney's engines in the early 70s when Bobby Unser was so much faster than everyone else was, but they could never make the engine last. By 1974, Gurney figured out he had to be more conservative and Bobby won the USAAC championship that year and the Indianapolis 500 the next year with a conservative strategy. Toyota's got to start doing that or they'll never win a championship. 267. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) TRD probably hired Bud Moore... 268. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NRF, I haven't branched out into classical piano music yet, considering I started just last year. I don't take lessons, I watch YouTube videos. I'm probably nothing compared to you. 269. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Oh God, Johnson and Kahne 1-2. 270. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And Kyle is fading fast. 271. JimmyJohn'sCar posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 93. Paul posted: The news hasn't officially been released yet, but word has broken out that Ryan Truex has signed a driver development deal with Richard Petty Motorsports. Now it is..they just announced it. Good info, Paul. 272. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:38 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "TRD probably hired Bud Moore..." With Buddy Baker as a tester. 273. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Ryan Newman dumps David Gilliland. 274. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) D'oh 275. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, that was a vicious crash between Newman and Gilliland... 276. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This is going to get ugly... 277. Anonymous posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Newman just wrecked he shit outa gilliland 278. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:40 pm Rate this comment: (4) (0) Sounds like Newman pulled a dick move. 279. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:41 pm Rate this comment: (4) (0) Gilliland was having a good run, Newman got angry at him for racing better, nice work fatass. 280. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:41 pm Rate this comment: (7) (0) Disgraceful race for Newman. That is why he will be looking for a ride. 281. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:42 pm Rate this comment: (4) (1) Newman is an asshole. 282. Anthony posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (4) This Crap race was sponsor by Lowes proud sponsor of cheater Jimmie Johnson And brought do you by Can You Spare A Win on a Busch show your support to help Kurt of Kyle Win. Ryan Newman & Daivd Gilliland have discussion! Another Crap Crap Crap Crap race for 4x & Always for Jeff Gordon. 283. Chives posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Ryan Newman and David Gilliland have discussion!" I don't know why I laughed at that... 284. The Long Shot posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:51 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) What I'm surprised no one has mentioned is how poorly Austin Dillon is running. He's currently 31st, 6 laps down, and running laps a full second off the pace of the leaders. This is the guy RCR is entrusting their future to? Good call there, Grandpa Richard. 285. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The android crashes! 286. New14 & 88Fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:52 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Kahne in the wall. 287. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yes 288. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kahne just lost it Darrell. 289. AveryNH posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Welp A.J. Just crashed out again on lap one in Detroit again. Harsh weekend for him 290. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:54 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) @288 NO, it was Grosjean's fault, he forced Kahne to the dirty part of the track. 291. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Probably because they completely forgot he was in the race. I know I did. 292. Anonymous posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Did Allmendinger really crash out again? 293. cjs3872 posted: 06.02.2013 - 3:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I wonder if the track bar broke DSFF, because as Kahne was starting back up, the car was not tracking straight, yet he hit the wall with the back of the car, so I wonder if Kahne's crash was a result of a mechanical failure. 294. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) McMurray has a flat tire. Tough break for him. 295. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Oh man, if someone told me in 2007 that I will be cheering for Kurt Busch, I would have laughed hard... And dammit Jamie, was having a nice race. Top 10 all day long. 296. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And how about the Jaws theme now? 297. The Long Shot posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:05 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) *Ryan* Truex? Oh brother. 298. cjs3872 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's now being reported as a broken radiator in the #1 car, Schroeder51. 299. Anonymous posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jamie has no luck at all cant catch a break. Hopefully someone can catch Johnson hopefully 300. Destroyahirismix666 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I had more fun playing 6 hours worth of 'Nascar 2005: Chase for the Cup' on my Gamecube then watching Dover spring since 2007, with the exception of the mid-race wreck/tire fest that the 2009 event mutated into and the last laps leading Truex's vicotry in 2007. 2013 has been a hard year as a NASCAR fan. While the racing is good, I don't see it being THAT much better as a whole compared to last year, and I still think 2011 had some of the best racing. But what really grinds my ears in Michael 'I'm-still-not-outta-here' Waltrip on PCP going down pit lane, DW salivating over Danica, the nerve-racking lack of consistent results from anyone that isn't Jimmie Johnson! And yes, I am upset that no one is doing as good as JJ. While he is STILL my favorite driver, I want him to have someone to race against for the championship. 2006, 2007, and 2010 were nice to watch for the championship. But h***, in the 2008 Ford 400, he locked the championship up with 8 laps to go when Dale Jr's engine went to hell and finished...37th, I think. And don't get me started on 2009. That was a heartbreak year for me, because while I was happy to see Johnson win, I truly wanted Mark to get the championship. 301. Destroyahirismix666 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Oh yeah. I also left out the comment Slamica Pornographic ahd made 'I wish the Talladega race didn't go back to green because I got a worse finish and my car got all tore up. Boo-hoo'. That was my memorable comment of 2013 spring Dega, and it hurt deep. When we have 'professional' drivers saying that, the sport is heading to it's end. 302. Destroyahirismix666 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 'Oh man, if someone told me in 2007 that I will be cheering for Kurt Busch, I would have laughed hard...' Same. In fact, in 2009 someone told me I would be cheering for KU. Busch, I would have punched them in the face so hard that they would need Dental Work done. Now he has become this year to me what Jeff Gordon was last year, my compassionate 'favorite' who I call on every race to do something good and something still happens to him. 303. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) WHY do all the "good" sentimental favorites lose??? Jamie Mac, Truex, Gilliland and Kenseth in the Cup race, and Allmendinger and now Simona de Silvestro in the IndyCar race! I swear, every time one of the "good guys" has a good run going, it all blows up, unlike the superpowers of the Emotionless Juggernaut, etc...that 48 car could run 1,000 laps at Dover and it wouldn't break down. 304. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Good, fast work from the EGR guys. 305. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:16 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "What Jeff Gordon would love as a caution." He'll probably get one...after he makes his pit stop. 306. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:20 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Hamlin hits the wall! And for once, Gordon gets some good luck. 307. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Seems like Kyle and his team learned a lot from yesterday. 308. AveryNH posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) RHR just smashed the wall and his day is most likely done. And by god I hope Juan Pablo holds Johnson off. Just flipped back and saw him beat Jimmie off pit lane 309. Bronco posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:24 pm Rate this comment: (2) (1) #303 When did Kenseth ever become a sentimental favorite? He's had enough things go his way this year. 310. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Go 24 and 18 (I picked Kyle to win)!!! 311. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Come on JPM, you are often regarded as one of the finest of this generation, PROVE IT! 312. New14 & 88Fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) JPM blew it. 313. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:26 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) *El Facepalmo* 314. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Johnson got black flagged...? 315. AveryNH posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:27 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Black flag #48. Jumped the restart. YESS!! There is a god!! 316. NadeauFan91 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) BLACK FLAG JIMMIE! GO MONTOYA! 317. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, that is really nice, but I don't think it is just. 318. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon to 3rd! 319. Destroyahirismix666 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) D@NM IT MONTOYA! WIN A OVAL RACE ALREADY SO I CaN CONFIDENTLY SAY YOU ARE ONE OF THE WORLD'S FINEST DRIVERS! 320. New14 & 88Fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:29 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) NASCAR penalizing a Hendrick car for a violation, lol it must be 50 below in hell right now. Even better, Smoke is up to second. 321. Destroyahirismix666 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) HOLY F*! Johnson got flagged! There is some other force at work here... 322. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Rainbow Nation, you might have it. 323. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) HOLY SHIT THIS RACE JUST BECAME INCREDIBLE!!! Simply because the top-3 are all drivers I would like to see win today! 324. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I cannot breathe 325. New14 & 88Fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Smoke and Gordon have caught JPM, this is gonna be good! 326. AveryNH posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Cue the jaws music!!! 327. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jaws theme 328. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Not a fan of him or his attitude but Juan would have really deserved it. BTW Darrell: "Magic Mile" lol 329. New14 & 88Fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) YAY SMOKE!!! 330. Kubica Fan Ireland posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:33 pm Rate this comment: (4) (0) Stewart you fat bastard 331. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:34 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) The only disappointing thing for me about a Tony Stewart win is that it makes DW look smart for his theory that "Tony will get better once the Indy 500 comes and goes". 332. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:34 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) How the HELL did Brad get a Top 5? Paul Wolfe rules all. 333. We need more Onion posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:34 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) Casey with a nice 16th place on the lead lap. Cool. 334. 18fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:34 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Wow. A boring race for 300 laps became a great race at the end. 335. Ryan W posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:36 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Wow. What is the world coming to? Lebron James gets called for an offensive foul late in a playoff game and Jimmie Johnson gets called for a black flag late in the race! Montoya messed up not guarding the top when Stewart was coming around. Don't like Stewart but he smelled blood at the end and did what he had to do. I guess he will be called a "vulture" too. 336. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:37 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) And what a great comeback for BoB! To come back all the way from 41st, 3 laps down in the opening 40 laps to a 24th place finish, only 4 laps down...Comeback of the year! Sadly, I can see FOX saying this...on the plus side of things...NO MORE FOX THIS YEAR! 337. Anonymous posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sort of a flukey finish as only 3 cars that were in the top10 all day finished there 338. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Major pileup in the IndyCar race. 339. Ryan W posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:46 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) The Blue Deuce was due for a good finish. His crew chief gives him great comfort it appears. Hopefully he isn't as dependent on Wolfe like Gordon was with Evernham. 340. AveryNH posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yeah the indycar race has turned into a demolition derby all of a sudden. 341. Ryan W posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:47 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Please Michael Waltrip go golf or write bogus books on Sunday. Just get off my TV. 342. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Damn it, IndyCar, why must you run all your races when NASCAR is running??? Belle Isle has some serious action going on! 343. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Seeing that the Penske and Ganassi drivers are struggling for the most part, it really looks like the IndyCar championship is going to be pretty wide open this year. 344. Destroyahirismix666 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, blast. Montoya lost to Stewart. While good job to Stewart, he is still my third least favorite driver, only ahead of Brad K and Danica. I can only continue hoping against hope for Montoya. Johnson, that is b*ll on you 'half-in' the throttle. That was at least 3/4 in, if not more! 345. Chives posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I like Danica's hair in a bun. 346. TS1420 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:54 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) YES! YES! YES! Johnson gets black flagged and Smoke comes through and wins the race! Perfect ending to a race. And the at least 1 win every season streak is still alive for Tony. 347. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 4:57 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) This is the 15th year in a row that Smoke has won a race....Let's go for Ricky Rudd's record! 348. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Damn! Conway has a REAL rocket ship. Cutting through traffic with almost no problems at all. It looks like he's going to sweep the duel races. 349. Eric posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Stewart is now 2 wins wins away from tying Ned Jarrett and Junior Johnson in wins. 350. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:19 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Also kinda ironic that Stewart gets his 48th career win, on a day that the 48 car dominates but is penalized at the end, lol. 351. Eric posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Why does Blazing saddles has to be on a different channel at the same time Indy Car is on? I love watching both. 352. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:32 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) I am impressed by the way JPM raced at the end. He got all the car had without wrecking himself or Stewart. I thought Jeff was gonna pass them both, but his car just wasn't that good after 15 laps. A better long run car and Rainbow Nation is celebrating. After taking an objective look at the final restart, doing my best to clear my head of all JJ/Chad/48 biases (no easy task!) I feel NASCAR got it right. He took off before the second restart line. They got it right. And Jimmie's car was SO incredibly dominant, why didn't he immediately give the spot back to Montoya on the back stretch just to be safe? For all the times he has shown grace under pressure, he sure has given away a lot of wins with self inflicted mistakes (by contrast, in a long career, Gordon has only given away 2 races with self inflicted driving errors). And this is why it is so hard to assess Jeff and Jimmie historically due to their association with The Felon. I truly believe had Bill Davis been able to keep Jeff for his '93 Cup debut, in that #22 Maxwell House car, then a move to a team like Joe Gibbs Racing in '95 (basically follow fellow '93 rookie BLab's early career), he would have used his talent and superior mental toughness (for me personally, mental toughness and coolness under fire are the two attributes in drivers I admire the most although you could probably argue they are one in the same) to overachieve, get 2 or 3 titles for JGR and have a win total in the mid 50s right now, and be valued even higher historically despite less overall numbers. Plus, can you imagine Jeff in those present day JGR motors and how bad he would whip the field until they blew into a smoking pile of metal shit? How about the New And Improved Jeff Gordon being taken to school by The Old Jeff Gordon in identical cars? I'd love to have a bizarro world where we can see that. With HMS, he has made it look too easy (even though, to the careful observer, he has made a huge difference) then JJ came along and went on a similar run of domination in the same stuff while Jeff got placed on the back burner. Although I think even Rainbow Nation needs to send some scorn Gordon's way for his part in the creation of the 48 monster. He just had to try his hand in an ownership type role. Much like Big E ignoring Junior's mental weaknesses, placing him in his top flight equipment, making him the most high profile driver, and launching the dreaded Junior Nation. Like mentor, like student I guess. 353. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Lol, gotta love that movie. Also, Stewart's 3 laps led for a race winner breaks the previous record of 6, set by Jeff Burton in 2006. Can't wait for TNT! 354. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:36 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) I had to step out for the last 59 laps. When I got back to the radio, the first thing I heard was MRN playing radio transmissions from Tony Stewart's crew. Needless to say, I was shocked at the result. Reaction after hearing Stewart won: Tony Stewart?!?!?!?! Reaction after hearing he battled Montoya for the win: Are we in the twilight zone?!?! Reaction after hearing about Gordon: Jeff finished third?!?! Reaction after hearing about Johnson's penalty: What?!?!?!?! 355. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, the top 3 in the IndyCar race is Simon Pagenaud, James Jakes, and Mike Conway. This is why the IndyCar series has been better than NASCAR this year. It looks like the Year of the Underdog over there. 356. Anthony posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff Gordon has witness history once again. 301 Top5s ties him with David Pearson! 357. 18fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:44 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) It seems like the only people who think Jimmie should not have been penalized are the 48 team and David Smith. 358. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, three first time winners already in IndyCar this year. Hinchcliffe, Sato, and Pagenaud. 359. AveryNH posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Fox showed a replay and paused it at the time the green dropped and I am nearly certain Johnson was ahead of Montoya in the restart box. Meanwhile in Detroit, Simon Pagenaud is going to become a first time winner!! Awesome job! 360. 18fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NASCAR made the right call, no doubt about it. Also, Brad Keselowski failed post race inspection. What could that mean for the guys who are on probation from the Texas technical failure. 361. Eric posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I saw the ending of the Indycar race. It is turning into a great year for Indycar. 362. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 5:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) According to Kenny Bruce, the rear of the #2 car was too low in post-race inspection. Uh-oh. 363. Anonymous posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jayski said the front was to low not the back. 364. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jimmie Johnson and Hendrick got penalized by NA$CAR? Gained a bunch of respect and hope for the sanctioning body today, even Helen Keller could see Jimmie jumped it. 365. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:03 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) All of Jimmie Johnson's fans aka Old Women with 8 cats, little kids, and Southern California are fuming. Sweet, Sweet, Sweet. 366. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Destroyahirismix666 might take offense at that, TeamPlayersBlue. 367. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, a low rear end is actually a disadvantage, but it is still against the rules so they will probably be hammered. Ugh. This has been a tough season so far for them, yet they are still Top 10 (for a few days anyways) showing they have made huge strides. But this is a tough deal. The move to Ford was not a good one. Even if Dodge was pulling out completely, to go to a community program with Roush and his satellite teams was not a good idea. Surely their kick ass engine program could make a switch to building Ford motors. And even more extreme but not totally unplausible, keep running Dodges. They at least had a Gen 6 prototype. Surely Penske could have fine tuned that. Keep hearing rumbling of Dodge coming back next year. If they do, I hope Penske returns. Not be so worried about the lack of numbers. DidnMt hurt him too much last year, did it? He won the full season and chase points title, and tied for the most wins. 368. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) David I'm just saying what I see, at races and on social media that's at least 95% of the Jimmie Johnson fans I see. 369. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I totally misquoted Bruce. He just said the car was too low. He said nothing about the rear end. 370. 18fan posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Tony and Juan both took only two tires. Jeff and Kyle took four on the last stop. It took Kyle's car a bit too long to come in to be a factor on the last run and Jeff's car started to go away just a little bit that prevented him from passing Montoya. I think there is a good chance Montoya will win an oval race this year. I might even say he'll win before Truex does. 371. Ryan W posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "for me personally, mental toughness and coolness under fire are the two attributes in drivers I admire the most although you could probably argue they are one in the same" DSFF, you make a good point there. When I think of the anti-mental toughness or anti-cooless I think of Kyle Busch. Always a front runner. Has he ever sneaked up on everyone throughout a race and won? Say like Johnson, Gordon, Stewart, or Harvick. Bad pit stop or car goes bad during a run, he doesn't know how to make changes during a race. His car has to be perfect and sometimes it is, but a car or conditions are hardly ever perfect for one car throughout the day (especially the last decade) and you have to be able to make changes and tell the crew what is going on with it and to be able to overcome your own or team miscues. Also, you're thinking outside the box on Gordon is interesting say for instance if he got with JGR early in his career. I agree with you saying that he might be looked at even in higher standing had he been with JGR. It's hard to say what all would have happened in racing if certain things here or there happened or didn't happen like a few untimely deaths. Richmond and DAllison passing away were big events that altered Nascar history more than likely in a lot of ways. Alan Kulwicki might have won another title in '94 wih Hoosier tires if he raced them that year. Sponsors may have gave more owner/drivers chances if AK wouldn't have crashed and died. Dale Jarrett probably wouldn't be in the Hall of Fame, hard to say. And one must wonder how come Davey isn't in there yet with his wins that he had in a short career? Jimmie Johnson's Busch Series crash at Watkins Glen early in his career that could have been fatal would have altered Nascar history as well. 372. Baker posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:21 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) My dad calls with 14 laps to go and says Tony Stewart is in 2nd if you want to watch. I said cool I'm not at home right now but I have been recording the races just incase Tony wins. He then says Jimmie Johnson jumped the restart and NASCAR black flagged him. I about chit my pants and suddenly was in a hurry to get home and see this amazing turn of events. I did watch it when I got home and he clearly jumped the restart. I have seen some that weren't even as bad called in dirt and I have seen Jimmie, Kyle, Tony, Harvick and others jump restarts before as well, but none have ever been as bad an obvious as today. Jimmie said he was half throttle? What a joke. He knew he jumped and blew the race. If he was half throttle then his engine would obviously be illegal because he was pulling away from everyone. It also had nothing to do with JPM not going because it wasn't just him, none of the field went even close to when Johnson took off. I just may have to end my boycott of NASCAR in celebration of them actually penalizing a Hendrick for doing something wrong. Also #349 why would you mention Tony Stewart is 2 wins away from tying Jarrett and Johnson while not even mentioning he DID tie Herb Thomas today. IMO Herb Thomas is the greatest racing talent ever in NASCAR and anytime someone reaches Herb Thomas' milestones has truly done something great. 373. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Surprised that no one mentioned this, but FOX's scoring was a lap behind on that final green flag run. I was watching Jeff Gordon trying to pass Montoya for 2nd with 3 laps to go at the top of the screen, but when Stewart came off turn 4 moments later, the white flag was waving! Hahaha! FOX quickly corrected that problem. 374. ch posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Sponsor Changes: 9 - DeWalt / Stanley / Ace / CMN 14 - Code 3 Associates Helping Oklahoma / Mobil 1 19 - Humphrey Smith Racing 34 - Taco Bell 36 - Drive Sober, Arrive Alive DE 375. RaceFanX posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sponsor: #48 Jimmie Johnson- Lowe's Build and Grow / Monsters University 376. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm happy for you, Baker. 377. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Actually, after rewatching the final laps, FOX's ticker was correct up until 3 laps to go. When Stewart took the lead and crossed the line next time by, the ticker didn't change to 2 laps to go, it stayed with 3 left. THAT'S why I was confused for a second... 378. cjs3872 posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Actually joey2448, what happened was that Fox's lap counter froze, because it had counted the laps remaining accurately, but when they got to 3 to go, it froze, which is sort of fitting with what happened regarding their coverage the last two races. The wire problem that negatively affected the 600 last week, covering their mid-race report instead of a live lead change (which they never once mentioned), and having the lap counter freeze. That put a symbolic end to their NASCAR coverage for 2013, as if someone was trying to tell them something. And this matched Montoya's second-best finish on an oval. One such finish was the 2007 Brickyard 400. And this race had the exact same top four, in order, as that race did, with Stewart, Montoya, Gordon, and Kyle Busch finishing 1-2-3-4 in that order. That was the top four at the 2007 Brickyard 400, as it was today. And that, to say the very last, is a bit odd, especially in today's era when so many more drivers are competitive, to have the exact same top four in a race twice. 379. 1995z71 posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Tony Stewart: 15 years in a row with a win. 380. David posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:49 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) FOX, I didn't watch your coverage at all today, but since you're done for the year, I can say this proudly: FOX, YOU'RE OUTTA HERE!!!! 381. joey2448 posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, that indeed is weird that the top-4 all finished in the exact order twice now....Wonder how many times that's happened? and I beat you to it, cjs! 382. Eric posted: 06.02.2013 - 6:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Baker, I didn't mention Herb Thomas because I thought someone already typed in Stewart tying Herb Thomas in career wins. 383. Nick posted: 06.02.2013 - 7:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) First Stewart, JPM, Gordon & Kyle Busch 1-2-3-4 finish since the 2007 Brickyard 400. 384. Baker posted: 06.02.2013 - 7:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Eric, I can forgive you for that then. I just don't want Herb Thomas being left out as he seems to be the forgotten great of NASCAR's past. 385. Destroyahirismix666 posted: 06.02.2013 - 7:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 365. TeamPlayersBlue posted: All of Jimmie Johnson's fans aka Old Women with 8 cats, little kids, and Southern California are fuming. Sweet, Sweet, Sweet. - 366. David posted: Destroyahirismix666 might take offense at that, TeamPlayersBlue. - - - - Not hardly. Johnson earned his penalty. Just because the 48 is my favorite, I'm not blinded by bias. - - - - - - - I really, really badly want JPM to win at least one oval race. Preferably at Kansas, Brickyard, Atlanta, Charlotte 600 miler, or Daytona. Kansas because it's my home track Brickyard because of is 2001 Indy 500 win and his pathetic loss in 2009 Daytona so he can join the small list of those who have won the Indy 500 and Daytona 500 *Mario Andretti and AJ Foyt, two of the best* Coke 600 so he can say he has won at Monaco/Indy 500/Coke 600 in his career. And Atlanta after that screwjob in the 2010 spring event between Edwards and Brad K. Everyone forgets how badly that f*ed up Montoya and cheated us out of a good finish. 386. AveryNH posted: 06.02.2013 - 7:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @ 385 JPM won Indy in 2000. If anyone caught speed center earlier Kyle Busch gave a pretty disgusting interview for someone who came home in fourth after leading a large chunk of the race. He has a Ricky Bobby attitude. Winning is all that matters to him. And while its nice to see that intensity, it's never ever gonna win him a championship. 387. FOX posted: 06.02.2013 - 8:00 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Thanks for your loyal viewership. We hope you enjoyed today's broadcast, and we will see y'all next year at Daytona. Until then, boogity, boogity, boogity, let's keep racing boys! 388. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.02.2013 - 8:01 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) I feel powerful... I told Johnson to piss off, and he did. 389. Ryan W posted: 06.02.2013 - 8:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I didn't forget that race in 2010 for sure. Montoya was gaining on Ku. Busch and I think he would have got him if not for Edwards' dumb ace. Atlanta always has the ability to produce great finishes. JPM was robbed at Indy when he had like a 5 second lead on last pit stops. The 48 got the call that day, but not today. :) 390. cjs3872 posted: 06.02.2013 - 8:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nor is staying with JGR and their fragile engines, AveryNH. That's why I found it amusing when Darrell Waltrip predict that Matt Kenseth was going to win the championship, because you can't win a title if you're in the garage area in the Chase with a blown engine or two, or three, and that's their problem. Last week, it was Kyle Busch that had an engine failure, and today both Kenseth and Martin Truex, Jr. had engine failures, as did Travis Kvapil in another Toyota, though TRD does not build the engines for that team. Still, that four more Toyota engine failures in the last two races, three of which were TRD failures. And the next two races are at Pocono and Michigan, which have always been known for engine problems due to the long straightaways and extreme RPMs that are turned. But at least JGR and MWR are competitive, something I can't say for the Ford teams, because with each passing race, they seem to be getting worse. None of the Ford teams were very good, and it got so bad that for a time, Germain Racing's #13 was the top Ford. That was about as embarrassing as it gets, because the Roush cars were again non-competitive, as each was one lap down at one time and Greg Biffle was two laps down, RPM was never competitive, and Penske wasn't very good, though Joey Logano did have some rotten luck. Forget the results, as free passes and wave-arounds made the Fords look better than they were. 2013 is already a year to forget for Ford, and it may get worse before it gets better. 391. TNT posted: 06.02.2013 - 8:57 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) Don't miss next week, when TNT makes its return to the racetrack with the incredibly talented and energetic Adam Alexander, Wally Dallenbach, and, wait, Kyle Petty? That's incredible. See you there! (And Fox, you can kiss our butts.) 392. Cornys posted: 06.02.2013 - 9:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "he would have used his talent and superior mental toughness (for me personally, mental toughness and coolness under fire are the two attributes in drivers I admire the most although you could probably argue they are one in the same) to overachieve, get 2 or 3 titles for JGR and have a win total in the mid 50s right now, and be valued even higher historically despite less overall numbers." This is what I love about auto-racing period :). I tell you one thing, and that is that Darrell Wallace Jr. is the real deal. He's not where he is just because of the fact that he's an african american. I watch him win the K&N East race at Columbus in 2011 (the first time I'd heard of him) and I've been watching him ever since. He's always calm, cool, colected, and he's got a head on his shoulders. Yes, he made a rookie mistake at Charlotte a few weeks ago in the truck race while racing for 3rd late in the race, but all young, rookie drivers have these kinds of mistakes. He's finished in the top 10 in 3 of 6 races (got dumped under caution at the Rock from the top 10 if I recall his running position correctly). But, anyways, great race today after a "debris caution" filled start. These is a rule that the leader must get to the line first correctly? I called it to my JJ fan of a girl friend (who I got into racing at the Columbus K&N race by the way ;) ) as soon as it happened. No brainer call on NASCAR's part. Having been at the track for this race last year I KNOW that he fans in Dover were happy about that one and Jeff's 3rd place finish. The stands looked a little better this summer, but with 140,000 seats in Dover, there's bound to be a good number empty sadly. NASCAR's just not that big right now and the economy isn't 100% either. 393. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.02.2013 - 9:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Corny's, I couldn't agree more about Bubba Wallace and his mental toughness. And yes I know I am opening Pandora's Box by playing the "what if" game with Jeff going to Cup with Bill Davis then moving up to JGR, but it might not be as bad as you think. Remember, Rickcreated that 24 team from thin air just for Jeff. The story Rick likes to tell is he saw Jeff in the Busch Atlanta race driving it sideways, not crashing, winning, and knew Jeff was gonna turn NASCAR on its ear one day. I think the truth is he saw Jeff's Hollywood looks (even with the mullet and mustache lol) and his incredible well spoken interviews in an era where the sport's King proudly spoke gramatically incorrect American Southern (and still does) and whose Dominator was a Southern 9th grade dropout, and saw a sponsor magnet. Somebody to bring in some extra sponsorship money to help his "real racers" Schrader and Rudd get over that big black championship hump. Obviously this is ironic in retrospect as it would be Jeff himself who got over that black and silver hump, winning Rick's first Cup in a beatdown. I just don't think Rick really saw a huge amount of racing potential in Jeff. In his two Busch years, he was still in that "Swervin Gordon" mode that carried into '93, run fast, usually hit something. Of course he had only stepped in a stock car for the first time in 1990 basically for a ESPN Speedworld fluff piece. I just think Rick saw a great spokeman and lucked out of his ass as Jeff figured out how to run 500 mile races and became Jeff Gordon. 394. Schroeder51 posted: 06.02.2013 - 9:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Looking back at this race, I'm not sure what surprised me more: The fact that Jimmie Johnson actually got penalized by NASCAR or the fact that an Alan Gustafson pit call actually ended up paying off and ended up getting Gordon a higher finish than he would have otherwise. 395. murb posted: 06.02.2013 - 10:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) STEWART WINS BY LEADING ONLY THREE LAPS?!?!?! Wow, I missed some important stuff in the second half of this race. 396. GDR29 posted: 06.02.2013 - 11:14 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Smoke playing the role of the vulture 397. AveryNH posted: 06.02.2013 - 11:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) the 11 o'clock sportscenter once again displays their NASCAR knowledge, while showing replays of JJ jumping the restart they stated that the blue line at the bottom of the wall, which we know distinguishes the wall from the track, was in fact the restart zone! They highlighted it and everything! The only thing I can do is shake my head. Tisk Tisk. 398. Eric posted: 06.02.2013 - 11:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I am bit surprised that no one here has mentioned the attendance at Dover by watching seeing on television. I am saying that because Dover has 135,000 seats, but it appears like only half of them are full. I hate to say it, but I think Dover is in danger of losing a track date in in future if this keeps up. I know NASCAR doesn't want to get a rid of the Brickyard 400 despite the attendance because they feel it it important to keep a cup date at IMS. That means Dover is going to the track down the road that would lose a date that Burton Smith could get his 2nd LMS date from instead of Charlotte. It also could the track that Iowa could get a 2nd track date from. 399. ESPN posted: 06.02.2013 - 11:32 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) And when our colleagues at TNT are done with their portion of the season, tune in to ESPN beginning July 28 at the historic Indianapolis Motor Speedway. Because we are ESPN. ESPN: The Worldwide Leader in Sports (So FOX and TNT can SUCK IT.) 400. NBC posted: 06.02.2013 - 11:57 pm Rate this comment: (1) (2) And in the meantime, we gentlemen here at NBC are just biding our time, waiting for one of you Southern buffoon-owned television stations to finally depart so we can insert our delightful commentary into your, um, car races... And when that occurs, you will all have to, ahem, suck it. 401. murb posted: 06.02.2013 - 11:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Just saw a replay of the last five laps on YouTube, and all I can say is that while we give Stewart grief for his personality a lot, he is one of the few guys in the sport who actually could have made that move for the win. Passing on the outside at Dover (and Martinsville - remember he made a similar move there in 2011 to beat Johnson) is no easy feat. Awesome shootout between those guys. 402. Bronco posted: 06.03.2013 - 12:00 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) Heartbreak for Montoya, he deserved this one just like he deserved Richmond a month ago. Regardless, I would have never have believed that after the horrible seasons he had in 2011 and 2012 that he would have even been remotely in contention to win two races already this year. Despite this win, I'm hoping Stewart doesn't make the chase, he has just been awful this whole year. Newman is an idiot for causing that unnecessary wreck with Gilliland. Had it not been for a speeding penalty towards the end of the 2010 race and jumping the restart today, we'd be talking about JJ's 9th Dover win. Brad Keselowski's car failed another inspection, this time it was after the race. And this is the same clown who preached about the level of integrity that his team competed with. 403. CBS posted: 06.03.2013 - 12:03 am Rate this comment: (1) (2) Leave us out of this. It appears we were quite wise in breaking off with NASCAR. The buffoons that they have in this sport nowadays are SO appalling. 404. Paul posted: 06.03.2013 - 12:06 am Rate this comment: (4) (0) I only the first part of this race (the last thing I saw was Denny Hamlin completely botch his green flag pit entry), so here are some of my thoughts after seeing the final results: The three most versatile NASCAR drivers finished 1-2-3 in this race, which just goes to show how much talent it takes to finish up front at Dover with these cars. I'm gonna be honest; when I saw the top three finishers, I had to stare at my phone for awhile before it finally set in. I was completely expecting Smoke to go winless this season, and here he is winning a race at Dover, a track that he hadn't won at since sweeping both races in 2000. Great job for him, as well as his team for not screwing it all up. IMO, he is the most talented driver in NASCAR, and while I shouldn't be surprised that he was able to put his lousy car into victory lane this season, I was surprised that it came on a non-restrictor plate/road course track. So once again, great job by him. That being said, the fact that he went from outside the top 20 in points to Chase contender in two races frustrates me. Especially since this win was his first top five of the season. If he does manage to make the Chase, hopefully it's because he built a string of consistency over the next 13 races, and not just because he managed to win a race and stay inside the top 20 in points. I want him to earn his Chase position, not just record one victory and luck into a Chase spot because of NASCAR's lousy points system. Juan Pablo Montoya went 72 races without a top five finish, and now he's earned 2 top fives in five races. Perhaps he is finally starting to click with his team and is motivated more than ever to perform well in NASCAR. Then again, perhaps he's just racing his ass off now that he's in a contract year, with a talented free agent-to-be named Ryan Newman on one hand, and a young hot shot named Kyle Larson next in line for a Ganassi Cup ride on the other hand. Either way, the fact that Ganassi's team is finally getting results after two miserable seasons is a good sign. (Maybe this explains why Ganassi has no IndyCar wins yet this season.) Speaking of Ryan Newman, what the hell was that between he and David Gilliland? He had been working Gilly for about three laps trying to pass him (for position, mind you), before he just dumped him, then getting wrecked himself. I want to commend Gilliland for not doing anything regrettable to Newman afterwards. If ever there was a reason to punch a guy in the face, that was it. But to Gilliland's credit, he stayed calm and used his words to express his frustrations with Newman, rather than his fists. I'm proud of how Gilliland handled himself, and he definitely acted like a true professional and a Christian with how he handled that situation. He's definitely a better man than Jimmy Spencer, Greg Biffle, and Michael Waltrip, that's for sure. Speaking of Jimmy's, Jimmie Johnson goes from qualifying poorly and running outside the top 20 for the first part of the race, to charging through the field and leading 143 laps, to blowing a restart and finishing in 17th place, one lap down. I wonder how he's going to respond to his haters this week, seeing as how he blew a chance at both a trophy and a big paycheck. He doesn't get the credit he deserves for being a choker, especially since his biggest competition often beat themselves before he has a chance to, but I would say that Jimmie Johnson is a pretty underrated choker in NASCAR. And speaking of Jimmie Johnson, take a look at whose team failed post-race inspection. None other than the team that caused the #48 team to beat themselves in the final two races last season, the #2 Penske Racing team, whose car was too low in the front end. Don't worry Brad fans, the #2 team will probably only be docked six points (an equivalent to an 11th place finish) because their penalty is the same as the #56 team's from earlier this season. I find it ironic how a lot of you guys were commenting earlier on how Gordon and Johnson's legacies have been tarnished by their teams' history of cheating, yet a driver who beat the cheating #48 team last season has now been busted again this season. Paul Wolfe comes back from his suspension only to set the car up too low in his first race back. Worse yet, his car finished behind the #14 and #24 cars, both of which have probably the two worst crew chiefs among competitive teams. I'm starting to question the validity of Brad's 2012 title, as well as his 8 Cup victories with Paul Wolfe as his crew chief. And if he couldn't beat two superior drivers with lousy crew chiefs in a cheated-up race car, how good can he really be? The biggest thing preventing Toyota from a championship is TRD. They need to figure out a way to build engines that are both fast AND reliable, and they need to figure it out before the Chase, otherwise they're gonna get killed by the #48 team. Austin Dillon sucks. There I said it. Through 13 races, the #51 team has only six finishes outside the top 20. Three of those finishes were by Regan Smith, who also has both of Phoenix Racing's top ten finishes this season, and the other three finishes had Austin Dillon behind the wheel, who has only made three starts this season in the #51 car. He may have pretty good results in Pop-Pop's Nationwide car, which is the best Chevrolet team in the Nationwide Series, but he's slacked off this season and is completely outmatched in Cup. A.J. Allmendinger has four top 16 finishes in four races in the #51 car compared to Austin's three non-top 20 finishes in three races in the #51 car, and the latter driver has an automatic RCR Cup ride lined up for him, while Dinger is still unsure of which series he'll be competing in next season? And did I mention that Jeff Burton finished a solid 11th place in this race? You know, the driver who Austin supposedly couldn't do any worse than in the #31 car? Give me a break. And last, but certainly not least, I thought the racing and telecast of the race were both very good today. I thought these cars ran very well on the Monster Mile's concrete surface, much like how they did at Bristol earlier this season, and I thought the fact that they were able to race side-by-side on the mutli-grooved one miler was exciting to watch. I also thought FOX did a really good job of covering this race, as the cameras showed action across the field and there were plenty of zoomed-out camera angles that showed a lot of the action on the track. The zoomed-out cameras really made the side-by-side, multi-grooved racing more noticeable, and kept me interested in the race for the entire time that I got to watch it. So good job by FOX on keeping me entertained while I was watching. That being said, one good race coverage does not a good broadcast team make. As good a job as I thought they did, it doesn't make up for the annoyance that I got from their coverage over the previous 16 FOX races this season (12 points, 4 non-points). Hopefully they improve their coverage next February when they get their next opportunity to cover the Cup races, but I'm looking forward to seeing how the TNT crew covers these races for the next six weeks. Getting a chance to listen to the best announcer/pit reporter team in NASCAR, as they cover races at Pocono, Sonoma, and Daytona? Now that's incredible! 405. MStall41 posted: 06.03.2013 - 12:14 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) What a fantastic race this was! Without a doubt the best Dover race since '08. Tires were actually a factor and passing was happening all over the place from start to finish. Not sure what made the Gen 6 so racy here but Dover may just be the most improved track under the Gen 6 thus far. 406. Mike posted: 06.03.2013 - 12:18 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Eric: The problem is that Bruton Smith doesn't own Dover, so it can't lose a date for Las Vegas. (He can only take a date from one of his own tracks.) 407. Cornys posted: 06.03.2013 - 12:29 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) FOX I feel has the best camera angles, shots, and mixing (until all the missed lead changes this year :x). I'd put them 2nd as far as commentators only because of BSPN's, well, BS. TNT has terrible coverage I feel as far as cameras and such, but they also have as stated above the best commentary. They seemed a little disjointed at times though last year( Wally and KP), but still much better than DW's lines (usually a good announcer though when he avoids being stupid). BSPN has the middle camera work and the worst commentary sadly, and that's who covers the championship. #404, you have earned yourself a thumbs up from me even though you brought up religion for a moment :) 408. MStall41 posted: 06.03.2013 - 12:33 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) ESPN's coverage is the best in the business right now, and it's not even remotely close. ESPN has the best commentary, best camera angles, and they treat the sport with the most respect. Now, ESPN's non-NASCAR people treat the sport TERRIBLY, but their actual NASCAR people/coverage are without a doubt the best network for the sport right now. 409. Paul posted: 06.03.2013 - 12:44 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) One more thing: Jeff Gordon tied the legendary David Pearson on the all-time top fives list with his 301st career top five finish. Pearson was a 5-time Dover winner, and Gordon himself is a 4-time Dover winner, so there was definitely some greatness achieved today on a track where both drivers achieved a lot of success. 410. 18fan posted: 06.03.2013 - 1:15 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I read that Kyle said that he broke a right front bump stop sometime around the halfway point. Another thing that made this race very interesting was the cloud cover coming and going throughout the race and watching certain cars react differently to the different conditions. 411. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.03.2013 - 1:28 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) You know, part of me almost wishes that all of the #2 team's issues in inspection this year were due to a lack of integrity. That they knew these cars so well, they knew clearly how to make a legal car and how to press past the envelope. But the sad truth is I feel they simply have that bad of a grasp of this Gen 6 car. Think about it, why would they cheat after getting hammered for infractions barely one month ago, on the very week they got their guys off suspension? To me, these infractions scream "we don't totally have a grasp on what we are doing out here". 412. jabber1990 posted: 06.03.2013 - 5:26 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I am not saying that cheating is right, but usually if you fail post-race it was usually an accident (Boywers Bumper after NH, when was that 2010? Mikey's spolier in the truck race at Daytona in 2011 Truex and his spring earlier this year those are the first three examples I can think of..im sure the list is very very long) isnt Danica in a contract year? and does she even have a sponsor lined up next year? can you imagine if Tony and Denny made the chase? that would be awsome! oh and I have 2 questions 1) what if there are only 9 or 11 race winners come Richmond, how will the wildcard work? 1b) what if the other person with a win is 21st or lower in points how does that work? 413. jabber1990 posted: 06.03.2013 - 5:36 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) what I mean is its hard to cheat and get away with it. unless of course you cheat to run second its also hard to mid-race cheat (although Knaus might figure out a way) there are officals assigned to every pit stall who monitor the crews every move, doing 4-6 pitstops a race 38-40 weeks a year you figure out what your looking for. NASCAR also restricts what you can and cannot do on pit road, you cannot take apart the engine or rebuild the suspension on pit road (well you can do the second, we've seen it more than once) and if you cheat and win your car is confiscated and NASCAR takes it apart and well we know what they do, if you cheat to run second you wont have that problem unless you're the random. my point stands, NOBODY TRIES to run second, its not worth it. you dont get the points, the money, the fame, nobody knows who ran second, when you turn on the news before you go to work or school in the morning and they talk about the race they'll show Tony getting the flag and they'll say "Tony Stewart won the race at Dover" they MIGHT do a top 5 rundown, but nobody will care about what Montoya did 414. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.03.2013 - 6:46 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) You must be in the top-20 in points to be eligible for the wild card. Likewise, if all of the winners are top-10 in points and outside of the top-20 in points, then the wild cards just go to the drivers who round out the top-12 in points. 415. JimmyJohn'sCar posted: 06.03.2013 - 10:52 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Murb, Smoke only led those last 3, so unless you turned it back on with 10 to go, you didnt miss a lot. Edit--saw you watched it on youtube..yep, nice finish in Dover. Good friend of mine is a Stewart fan, so he was definitely waaaaay past due. 416. Baker posted: 06.03.2013 - 11:15 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Tony Stewart has now won at least 3 races on 9 different tracks and 5-10 more years of racing left in him. 417. Baker posted: 06.03.2013 - 11:28 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Something else I was thinking about last night with all the Kyle Busch hate is that he just turned 28 this year. I get that he has been around awhile, but that doesn't mean that he is ready to be a winner in cup. He still has plenty of years to learn how to become a winner and learn to overcome challenges as opposed to just folding. Tony Stewart was offered a Cup ride by Rick Hendrick as early as 1996. He knew he was not year ready to win. He was still on the immature hot head side even more than he has been since 1999. He made the right decision in waiting until he was ready to compete at the highest level in the sport before making the move. He was 28 years old when he was a rookie and has since won 48 races and 3 championships the only driver to win a cup under 3 different systems. Jimmie Johnson Mr. 5 time himself choked away championships and wins before his 28th birthday and has since that day won 5 championships and 52 races. Jeff Gordon obviously had the bulk of his success before he was 28, however, since he turned 28 he has still won a championship and 36 races. I could give plenty more examples from NASCAR's past, however, those would be bad example because until recently more drivers never got there break until around 28 years old or even older. The three I did mention are good examples of Kyle still having time to grow up as a competitor, racers and person. 418. Biscuits In A Red Bull posted: 06.03.2013 - 11:30 am Rate this comment: (2) (0) Probably the most talented podium that NASCAR can offer right now. Tony, who can do anything in American motorsport, Juan, who can do anything (both good AND bad) and Jeff, who is arguably stock car's best ever driver. Not bad, eh. 419. The Sound posted: 06.03.2013 - 11:41 am Rate this comment: (6) (0) Saw this comment on Yahoo! after the race: "Scott Riggs started the race, ran 16 laps and pulled in. For this huge effort, he was paid $61,430. Just think how long it takes to make that kind of dough at your regular job. This start and park stuff is horseshit. Cut the field to 35 cars." My response: "Do you understand the idea of start-and-parking? The vast majority of those teams hate to park the car early. They do it because they need to build momentum and attract a sponsor. If they can tell potential suitors that they consistently make the field, they will be more attractive. The simple reality of the NASCAR economic structure of today is that the race purse alone is not enough to fund a race team and be remotely competitive. Whatever profit these organizations glean from the race purse is minimal, at best. The goal is to attract a sponsor to go racing full time, not to attract a profit. NASCAR just reduced the winnings of the last few positions in the field at the beginning of the year to discourage S&P, yet the practice continues. Why? Because every week survived is another week to attract a sponsor. Take this example. Front Row Motorsports began as a start and park team... Yet, here we are several years later, and they are running full races. Oh, yeah, and they also just finished 1-2 at Talladega, and Gilliland was dumped by Newman yesterday while nearly in the Top 20. This was the plan all along, and they succeeded. Not every team WILL succeed, but why not try?" 420. Neal posted: 06.03.2013 - 11:46 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hey Smoke - thanks for shattering the "Myth of Inferior Equipment." Who's going to get the blame next for Danica's terrible performances? Left-front tire changer? Catch can man? Brian France? Obama? Jesus? 421. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.03.2013 - 11:54 am Rate this comment: (0) (1) Neal, they will blame individual pit crew members, than the crew chief. Eventually, they will blame Stewart and Newman for "hogging the good stuff" when she is the de facto Hendrick #2 car after Johnson. 422. Baker posted: 06.03.2013 - 12:09 pm Rate this comment: (4) (0) Danica Patrick could have Hendrick's top equipment with a tag team duo crew chief of Chad Knaus and Paul Wolfe and allowed 50 more cubic inch than the rest of the field and she would still average a 32nd place finish. 423. David posted: 06.03.2013 - 12:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Excellent post, Paul. I agree with a lot of it. 424. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.03.2013 - 12:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The finger will start being pointed heavily towards Tony Gibson soon. Yeah, the same guy who coaxed a few wins and a chase appearance or two out of Ryan Newman's useless ass. Remember the masses demanding Tony Eury Jr's head? It will happen soon. 425. 83andJoe posted: 06.03.2013 - 12:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The Sound: Exactly. Maybe Landon Cassill and Tommy Baldwin Racing should be mentioned, too. 426. Ryan W posted: 06.03.2013 - 12:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, It could be the switch to Ford as well for Penske. I feel that they have the best all-around driver though. If I had to pick someone to drive for me right now starting a Cup team it would be Brad K. I would have to have Wolfe with him. He's Good with sponsors, if something goes wrong he has a "that's racin" attitude, will run it up front, can make changes during race and the right moves to win a race or get in position to win one. Also, out of Stewart's 48 wins 43 have came after June 1 in his career. 427. New14 & 88Fan posted: 06.03.2013 - 1:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Paul Wolfe comes back from his suspension only to set the car up too low in his first race back." If that was the case, NASCAR's inspectors would of caught it in pre-race like they did the illegal rear-end modifications. There are lots of things that could of happened during the race to result in the car being low, plus I'm pretty sure having a too-low car would be a disadvantage. 428. murb posted: 06.03.2013 - 2:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) "Smoke only led those last 3, so unless you turned it back on with 10 to go, you didnt miss a lot." I actually missed the entire second half of the race. The last noteworthy thing I really saw was Kenseth blowing up. 429. Baker posted: 06.03.2013 - 2:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I should put this in the truck race, however, I always seem to have the last post on those other pages this long after the race because no one else checks back. Anyway, according to this website and everything I could find Chase Elliott is not yet 18. So, I ask why is he allowed to race in the truck series? I thought NASCAR changed the rules to an 18 year old minimum? 430. murb posted: 06.03.2013 - 2:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I ask why is he allowed to race in the truck series? I thought NASCAR changed the rules to an 18 year old minimum?" They changed it to where you can be 15 to run in lower level series (on 1 mile or shorter tracks). That's why kids like Chase and Erik Jones are running in the Truck Series. 431. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.03.2013 - 3:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Baker and murb, it is 16 years or older on tracks 1.017 miles or shorter, hence why they ran Rockingham. 432. David posted: 06.03.2013 - 3:25 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "it is 16 years or older on tracks 1.017 miles or shorter" Well, actually it is 1.1 miles or shorter AND road courses. Sieg heil! 433. Baker posted: 06.03.2013 - 3:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (3) So when Kyle Busch was with Ford and Roush NASCAR changes the rules so he cannot run. He later leaves for Hendrick and Chevy. Fast forward a decade and Rick Hendrick has a hot shot young guy and now NASCAR changes the rules back so that he can run lower level races. Exactly the type of things that have made me a firm believer in the ridiculous favoritism NASCAR shows toward Hendrick. You know it crushed them to have to black flag Johnson yesterday, but they knew they would be unprepared for the backlash if they let him get away with the most obvious jump of a restart seen in a long time. 434. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.03.2013 - 3:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Add fuel to the fire, Baker. The other guy that switch helped was Kyle Busch's development driver, Erik Jones. 435. Scott B posted: 06.03.2013 - 4:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The minimum age rule change may have had something to do with the last three ROTY Awards in the Cup series going to Kevin Conway, Andrew Lally and Stephen Leicht. It would be good for the sport to have this go to someone who doesn't become the answer to a "whatever happened to...?" trivia question as soon as the engraving on the trophy is finished. 436. TS1420 posted: 06.03.2013 - 4:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I only got to see bits and pieces of the race yesterday, but what I saw was usually pretty good (except for the Johnson dominating parts). The Gen 6 seemed to put on a good show at Dover, lots passing going on. Unlike most of the races under the Gen 5, which made me start calling Dover "The Monotonous Mild". Glad too see Smoke finally break through and pick up a win this horrid season. I was only beginning to think the only way he would pick up a win this season would be at a plate race, road race or a lucky fuel mileage race. Hopefully he can squeeze out a few more wins for a wild card spot and make some more 2011 end of season magic happen. I about cried tears of joy when Johnson got black flagged for jumping the restart. He was gunning the gas before they even completely exited turn 4. Its about time NASCAR penalized that clown rather than looking the other way for him. I am surprised they didn't throw a debris caution at the same time to lessen the blow a bit for him. And BS on "I tried giving the position back but Montoya wouldn't take it". Montoya had cars behind him that would have passed him if he was slowing up to not pass Nap-Time. If a Smoke win is a tell tale sign that summer is starting, the Toyota engines are also a tell tale sign. Once again the weather is heating up and the Toyota's are popping like balloons. You'd think after 7 seasons they would have their reliability issues figured out. I think they keep getting worse every season. At this rate, Kenseth will probably win 3-4 races in the chase, but finish 10th-12th in points due to TuRD's engines & JGR's glass cars failing in the rest of the races. I give what I seen of the race a 7/10. 437. Baker posted: 06.03.2013 - 5:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Scott B, Speaking of the ROTY winners. How awesome would it be if by 2015 or 2016 we had a rookie class or Ryan Blaney, Kyle Larson, Darrell Wallace Jr., Jeb Burton and Chase Elliott? Could be the first great rookie battle since Jimmie Johnson and Ryan Newman before Newman's career went south. 438. The Long Shot posted: 06.03.2013 - 5:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That would be amazing, Baker. I'd take Larson out, though, because I think they'll try and push him up to Cup next season. 439. OldSchoolNascarDude1 posted: 06.03.2013 - 5:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This may be a bit off-topic, but what ever happened to the kid that used to wave the flag at Dover every year? He would usually stay right at the start/finish line and pretend to be the flagman? He's a grown man by now, I'd assume. 440. Eric posted: 06.03.2013 - 5:19 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Scott B, The age change has nothing to do with the ROTY awards. What happened was the government stopped allowing tobacco companies to sponsor cars, races and race series. Tobacco companies were allowed to sponsor stuff in auto racing before a few years ago, race car drivers really wasn't allowed to race in races sponsored by Tobacco companies under the age of 18 because of the smoking laws in the United States. That is why Kyle Busch wasn't allowed to race at California Motor Speedway in 2001. While the Truck race wasn't sponsored by a tobacco company, The Cart series was at the same track on the same same race weekend. The CART Race was sponsored by Marlboro and the track promoters didn't want any driver under the age of 18 to race that weekend under the age of 18 as a result. 441. Eric posted: 06.03.2013 - 5:28 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Baker, I usually would agree with you on ridiculous favoritism NASCAR shows toward Hendrick, but what happened to Kyle Busch wasn't favoritism compared to Chase Elliot. What happened with Kyle in 2001 was different than Chase Elliott now though because the circumstances and it can't be called favoritism as a result. The age change for 2002 was caused from a legal standpoint. Cigarette companies were sponsoring races at the time and the legal age to smoke is 18 years old. Back in 2001, the truck series and CART was racing at California Motor Speedway the same weekend. The problem was a cigarette company was sponsoring a CART RACE at the same Track Kyle was supposed to be racing at in the truck series. The track promotors forbid to run the truck race as a result despite the fact Marlboro was only sponsoring the CART racing called the Marlboro 500. In 2013, Tobacco companies aren't allowed to sponsor race teams, race series, or races. That has been that way since 2010 and that meant Chase Elliott is allowed to race in a major series at young age as a result. 442. Daniel posted: 06.03.2013 - 5:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Pocono Entry list: 43 entered -Jason Leffler in the #19 -A.J. Allmendinger in the #51 443. Red Byron posted: 06.03.2013 - 7:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Just my opinion,but Juan snookered jimmy on the restart..knaus told jimmy during the caution "get a good start, u know he will be difficult to pass"....Juan knew he didn't have a car to beat him, so he tried to make it a formula one type start, he has the right to go anywhere inside the restart lines...nascars rule is fairly simple, the leader has to go first, jimmy didn't follow that rule, and he was caught.....as for jpm, I've said for a long time that he is better than his results have shown...ganassi cars have been awful since 2009-2010...tony glover and Steve hmiel were running chips NASCAR teams using technology from the 1990's, and when red bull racing folded, chips first move was hiring their engineers and firing glover and hmiel, this finally set in motion the organization becoming up to date in terms of technology...hiring Chris herby, who was well respected at Hendricks, was also a huge move, as was leasing Hendricks engines....criticize jpm for his mistakes in the past, he has finished second at Dover and 4 th at Richmond, two off nascars tougher tracks, he was 8th at darlington, another drivers track......just saying,when the car is fast, he's as good as any of the roush guys, better than many out there.....he's not in Gordon's or Johnson's class, nor Matt Kenseths, but he can take a top 10 car and win with it 444. 83andJoe posted: 06.03.2013 - 8:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) News: Ryan Blaney will run three ARCA races for Cunningham Motorsports, at Michigan, Road America, and Chicagoland. 445. 18fan posted: 06.03.2013 - 9:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I had to make sure I didn't mis-read Leffler on the entry list. 446. jabber1990 posted: 06.03.2013 - 10:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) one thing I always found funny about the smoking law...if I buy cigarettes for a minor then I go to jail or prison (which I should) or a minor cant buy them for any reason..peroid if a minor has a cigarette and is smoking one in front of a cop the cop wont ask any questions and wont go after them for being in posession im kind of an anti-smoking person, but I belive in smokers rights..if you want to smoke, go over there. if im the one in the smoking section I am entering at my own risk, so yea sorry that seemed relevant to the discussion 447. Sky Warrior posted: 06.03.2013 - 10:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle Busch isn't running the #54 at Iowa. Has someone put Marty Reid on suicide watch yet? 448. David posted: 06.03.2013 - 11:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Tony Kanaan will be on the "Late Show" tonight. 449. 18fan posted: 06.04.2013 - 12:26 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Marty Reid will treat Logano as if he is the greatest driver ever. 450. 83andJoe posted: 06.04.2013 - 2:11 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) The ironic thing is that it's the stand-alone tracks where "having the Cup stars is good for the fans" would actually be true... 451. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.04.2013 - 7:34 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) One thing I've always found ironic about the smoking rules is that alcohol is a MUCH more dangerous substance, yet there are no rules saying 21 year-olds can't be at tracks where the race or cars are sponsored by booze and you can advertise booze wherever you please. 452. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.04.2013 - 7:49 am Rate this comment: (2) (0) Nico, I couldn't agree more about tobacco vs alcohol. I don't smoke and find it off puttingg while I enjoy some cold beers on some nights I am off, but alcohol should definitely be regulated more than tobacco. While tobacco is highly addictive and has some really bad long term effects, so does alcohol if you don't keep from becoming an alcoholic and it screws you up for the time being. Drunk driving deaths are a ridiculous statistic that nobody does much about. 453. jabber1990 posted: 06.04.2013 - 10:16 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) in those racing stories I have they dont allow alcohol and tobacco sponsorships. 1) because I created the series when I was 12 and hated everything Tobacco and alcohol related and 2) there is an entire series for drivers and crew members ages 19 and under. they cant show stock-footage of an alcohol related car on the Telecasts, they cant have their haulers in the infield if they are alchohol related, basicly its overreacting to censoring however at the sporting events they do serve Alchol and I dont know about tobacco thats up the discretion of the tracks then again this is the same series that has a Gun-themed race every year in Kentucky, its pretty much a pain for the TV networks 454. AveryNH posted: 06.04.2013 - 10:39 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) At least Nascar tries to promote anti-underage drinking. Forever now Coors has the 21 means 21 sticker on anybody under 21 competing in a Nascar sanctioned race. Bud used to just have the pole award sticker for those under 21, i.e. Reed Sorenson and Kyle Busch back in the day. Also last year at Texas I think that roadblock Ali was replaced and his sponsor was a local Budweiser brewery, but when Timmy Hill took over they had to block out the bud logos. 455. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.04.2013 - 11:05 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) Still, if they want the Coors car to have the "21 means 21" sticker, then they should let cars have cigarettes with "18 means 18" on it. 456. David posted: 06.04.2013 - 1:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff Gordon just tweeted an image of the Axalta paint scheme. Bleh. 457. murb posted: 06.04.2013 - 3:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) TRD's President Lee White is gonna be retiring at the end of the season. I can't help but acknowledge the irony in this, lol 458. Eric posted: 06.04.2013 - 4:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) TRD announced that they will introduce upgraded engine parts and make adjustments in power at Pocono. 459. Sky Warrior posted: 06.04.2013 - 4:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brad got his slap on the wrist today. 6 points, $25k fine for Paulie Wolfie 460. 13 posted: 06.04.2013 - 5:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 459, they obviously didnt make a part fail to make the car to low, Martin Truex got the same fine earlier this year, 461. joey2448 posted: 06.04.2013 - 5:35 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Soooo...anyone going to the Brickyard 400 on July 28th? Because I just bought tickets!!! So stoked! It would make my life to see Jeff Gordon win his 5th at that track! 462. Baker posted: 06.04.2013 - 5:45 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Slap on the wrist? 6 points is the equivalent to what 25 used to be and this is only the 2nd time they have been caught outside the rules. Jimmie Johnson and his team have been outside the legal window more than double digit times and they get there points back after appealing. Now tell me again who gets the slap on the wrist in this sport? 463. cjs3872 posted: 06.04.2013 - 5:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I don't understand why Penske's team was fined what they were, given the fact that's they're already on probation, for all practical purposes. If it were me, I would have doubled the penalty because they were on probation. That means $50,000 and 12 points for this infraction because they're on probation. If they weren't on probation, then yes, the standard penalties are appropriate, but since the #2 team is on probation, the penalty should be increased, and I would have doubled it. When you're on probation, you should never take any chances on getting caught with a car out of spec, even if it's accidental, as this infraction obviously is. 464. jabber1990 posted: 06.04.2013 - 7:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I have a question does Indy or F1 have a "nationwide" series? 465. 83andJoe posted: 06.04.2013 - 7:25 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) IndyCar has the Mazda Road to Indy, where Indy Lights is the step below the main IndyCar Series, and below that is the Star Mazda Series. Back in the 1990s the ladder was Barber Dodge Pro > Toyota Atlantic > Indy Lights > CART. GP2 acts as the "feeder" series to Formula One. There used to be a Formula Two series, but that only lasted a few seasons before going kaput; hopefully we'll get that up on the site soon. :) 466. Baker posted: 06.04.2013 - 8:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 83andJoe, Wasn't there also a Formula 2000 or 3000 or something like that at some point? I remember something of the sort for some reason. 467. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.04.2013 - 10:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I just read the TRD story. Something tells me they are going to tune the motors WAY back for these next two horsepower races to make a point. They have been the object of scorn and ridicule for their constant failures, with even Matt Kenseth being as demonstrotive as you will ever see him in public after his Dover engine failure. And Lord only know what is being said behind closed doors. While TRD undoubtably deserves this criticism (the TuRD nickname is perfect) they are also highly sensitive to it. Remember last year after the Fall Dover race when Kyle trashed TRD on the radio and had to give a shotgun apology the next week? He didn't look that scared, as in "I think I just screwed up royally and this is gonna be bad if I don't backtrack quickly" after his Texas '11 epic meltdown. Look for the TuRD folks to make a point and give out some real engine duds for a few weeks. Even '90s era RCR would be ashamed of the power or lack thereof of these motors. 468. cjs3872 posted: 06.04.2013 - 11:04 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) Except DSFF, the problem isn't the tuning of the Toyota engines. The problem is the material the engine parts are being made of. Kyle Busch believes that there are particles in the parts that are comprimising the life of the engine (I think he said there were dust particles, or something like that). No amount of de-tuning of the engines can eliminate those problems because it's not a tuning issue, but rather a parts issue. I also think that they've been using lightweight parts, which are also not going to last either, and are not helping matters one bit. In fact, if Toyota de-tunes the engines the way you think they're going to, DSFF, if could actually cause more problems, because it they de-tune the engines very much, the Toyota teams are going to have problems with burned pistons, so just de-tuning the engines is not going to eliminate their problems. In fact, it may add to them. But the fact that Kyle Busch said that the Toyots engines were, in effect, ticking time bombs, and the drivers had no idea when they would go, can't make any Toyota driver very comfortable. And remember this. The JGR teams, and by extension, Kyle Busch Motorsports, are not having engine problems in the Nationwide and Truck Series this year, and I believe a big reason is that JGR is still building those engines, which do not seem to have the same intergrity issue with the parts themselves, so the problem appears to be a manufacturer defect, which TRD doesn't even seem to be trying to fix, which may be why Kyle Busch said that there's nothing that can be done with these engine issues Toyota is having in the Cup series because of the defective parts the teams are being given. At least in Kyle Busch, the Toyota drivers have a driver that's not afraid to give his opinion on the Toyota engine situation. And Toyota's been having these problems for years, so it's not anything new. In fact, this is exactly opposite to what happened with Dodge, because when Dodge re-entered the sport in 2001, they had virtually no engine failures for quite some time, but Toyota's been having these problems practically since they entered the Cup Series in 2007. 469. Baker posted: 06.05.2013 - 12:24 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm pretty sure JGR has multiple and maybe as man as at least a half dozen engine failures in Nationwide. I remember several just the first couple weeks. 470. Anonymous posted: 06.05.2013 - 12:32 am Rate this comment: (2) (0) Trevor Bayne got married yesterday to Ashton Clapp, my congrats to them! 471. Baker posted: 06.05.2013 - 12:33 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I went back through the results and only found 3, but I feel as though there were more. There could have been some practice issues I missed, or I could just be a little wrong. The entire Truck series combines has only 7 engine failures all year because they simply don't run enough miles to really take a beating. 472. Mr X posted: 06.05.2013 - 2:04 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) CJS there are many ways to detune an engine without burning pistons or valves, and personally I the don't believe that's the issue. Again as I said in post 195 the Toyota engine is currently the oldest in NASCAR and I believe that Toyota's design is being pushed to and beyond its limits. As the vast majority of these failures have been in the top end of the engines meaning valve train components for the most part. If I had to make a guess I believe the problem lies with a cam that is too large for the valve train geometry. The internal combustion engine is just a big complex air pump, the power lies in the fuel however it must be correctly mixed with air to make maximum power. This means the more air the engine flows the more fuel can be burned. The limiting factor in air flow is virtually always the cylinder head. The shape, size, and location of the intake and exhaust ports will make or break an engine, get it right and the heads will flow very well, get it wrong and they'll strangle the engine. NASCAR has restrictions for all of the parameters as far as I know. The design of the cylinder head can ultimately determine the possibilities of the shape, size, and location of these ports especially on the intake side in the case of a pushrod engine. Personally I believe that this is where Toyota has boxed themselves in. As a result they are likely to be running some aggressive cam profiles with too much valve lift and duration with lift being the particular danger in this case. This will slightly help airflow but given from pictures I've seen of the different engines the Toyota appears to have the skinniest valve covers meaning there likely isn't much clearance for larger valve train parts which will aid the geometry problems I believe they are having. A larger cam will also demand bigger stiffer valve springs, but I highly doubt any of the teams are running anything really different from each other in that area, that being said the way the valve springs are abused between lift and duration, the way they're cooled and other factors can effect their life span. Again these are all problems relatively specific to pushrod engines which is a design that Toyota has never utilized in the street or track with the exception of the engine they developed for NASCAR per NASCAR rules. They aren't the company to hire for the job, as pushrod V8's are typically American engines. Certain car companies have gained notoriety for certain design aspects of their vehicles, engines included. Harley Davidson has become famous for their air cooled V-Twin, Ferrari for their V12's, and the most mass produced car engine of all time is the Small Block Chevrolet. Over 100 million of these engines have been produced through 4 generations(5th Gen's coming in 2014) since the 1955 model year. These are pushrod V8's, they always have been and GM certainly knows the ropes with these engines better then any other car company, the first gen motors lasted from 1955 to 1985, and the second gen motors were largely based off the first and lasted until 1996. 1997 saw the introduction of the third gen LS1 and many more LS based engines followed until 2005 when GM again made some minute changes for the fourth gen. The SB1 and SB2 were based off of the first and second generation SBC's. Ford abandoned this valve train design in the 1990's in favour of the modular overhead cam engines which include the 5.0 coyote in the current Mustang's as well as several other engines. The Gen III(2003 and up) Hemi from Chrysler is the only other gas pushrod V8 in production today with any power potential. But the GM engines are the perennial favourites amongst performance enthusiasts such as myself. Needless to say the American car companies and specifically GM have decades of R&D to look back on, Toyota could only piggy back off those lessons learned, but there were certainly still some unknowns. Toyota played their inexperienced hand first, and while JGR's best engine builders have kept it competitive for a while GM, Ford, and Chrysler looked back into their wealth of knowledge, looked at what Toyota may have incorporated into their clean sheet design, and played their hands and are now winning the pot. Their design is maxed out plain and simple. Whilst the big three have incorporated more room for development. Long story short Toyota needs a new cylinder head IMO. But even given reliability issues they are still competitive, Ford is the struggling manufacturer right now. I am unsure if that will happen. One wonders how long it will be before all the manufacturers are unveiling new engines again. 473. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.05.2013 - 10:04 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Am I the only one here who is so poor he can't go to a race? There are times I feel like NASCAR's Drive for Diversity should be sued for discriminating against poor people. 474. Baker posted: 06.05.2013 - 10:18 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nico, I'm right there with you. I can only afford so many things a year and what little money I do have goes to local dirt track events and a few Outlaws events that are left in Ohio. I would basically have to give up my entire racing season, football season(high school - NFL), and drinking nights with the guys just to be able to go to a single race. I used to get free tickets to the ARCA race and Truck race at Mansfield until they folded. 475. murb posted: 06.05.2013 - 2:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Am I the only one here who is so poor he can't go to a race?" It's not that I'm poor, it's just that I live in Idaho. My only real opportunity is to go to Las Vegas, but there's no way in hell I'm wasting my money at that place. If I lived down where DSFF lived and had Bowman Gray, Martinsville, and Darlington all in close vicinity, I'd be all over it. 476. Anonymous posted: 06.05.2013 - 2:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Me and my family go to Bristol every year twice a year we only live an hour away 477. Jim Davis posted: 06.05.2013 - 3:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "It's not that I'm poor, it's just that I live in Idaho. My only real opportunity is to go to Las Vegas, but there's no way in hell I'm wasting my money at that place." Sonoma? That's as close to Idaho as Las Vegas. 478. The Long Shot posted: 06.05.2013 - 4:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The closest tracks I live to are Iowa and Road America, but there's no way I'd be able to convince the family to drive 6 hours just to watch one race. Here's hoping that Minnesota can get a track soon! 479. 83andJoe posted: 06.05.2013 - 4:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) >Wasn't there also a Formula 2000 or 3000 or something like that at some point? I remember something of the sort for some reason. Pretty sure F2000 and F3000 are further down the food chain relative to F1 than Nationwide is to Cup. 480. murb posted: 06.05.2013 - 5:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Sonoma? That's as close to Idaho as Las Vegas." I could go there, but it's a tad bit more out of the way to me than Vegas is. 481. jabber1990 posted: 06.05.2013 - 5:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) your from Idaho murb? I got family there! I even desgined a track to go out in Southern Idaho, having family in the Treasure valley I naturally chose that area as the geography of it. I even desgined a dirt track in Lewiston. and im from Southeast Missouri...I am literally equal distance from Chicagoland and Kansas... 482. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.05.2013 - 5:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 'Old GP2:' Formula 3000. 483. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 06.05.2013 - 5:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm relatively well off so can afford to go to many races around the world with different series despite mostly living in Bermuda. I also get free tickets from Shell-Pennzoil. Going to Bristol this summer. 484. murb posted: 06.05.2013 - 6:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I am in Idaho, Jabber. 485. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.05.2013 - 6:21 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Nico, the thing with me is I'm not married and have no kids. I also don't have any expensive hobbies outside of going to races. So I don't have any large "income drains" presently. I make $16.83 per hour, 42 hours per week. That is why I can go to 3 races a year, plus the fact, as mentioned, they are close enough that I don't have the additional expense of finding a place to stay. Heck, I could go to a Charlotte race if I wanted to in addition to the others, but I don't want to. 486. jabber1990 posted: 06.05.2013 - 6:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) what do you do that pays $16.83 an hour? 487. AveryNH posted: 06.05.2013 - 7:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I live maybe an hour or so from Loudon and once every year i try to get out there. whether it's $90 bucks for a Cup race or $20 bucks for a vintage car race or bike week. To me it's always worth the visit. Plus the Lakes region in N.H. is absolutely beautiful. I'm a sucker for the foliage. 488. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.05.2013 - 7:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) jabber, DSFF is a parademic whose regular rounds in Winston-Salem takes him "the giant penis building" in his own words. 489. David posted: 06.05.2013 - 9:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Nico, the thing with me is I'm not married and have no kids. I also don't have any expensive hobbies outside of going to races. So I don't have any large "income drains" presently." Man, that sounds like the life, right there. 490. JG24FanForever posted: 06.05.2013 - 9:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff Gordon becomes the first driver since 1983 to reach 301 Top 5's. David Pearson got his final Top 5 that year and Bobby Allison also cracked 301 toward the end of the season. Jeff Gordon became only the second driver in Cup history to record 500 lead lap finishes too. 491. joey2448 posted: 06.05.2013 - 10:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Damn I'd be more interested to hear what TeamPlayersBlue does...petroleum engineer? 492. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.05.2013 - 10:50 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "DSFF is a parademic whose regular rounds in Winston-Salem takes him "the giant penis building" in his own words." Lol, he's not kidding. Go to Google images, type in "Wells Fargo Building Winston Salem" and you'll see what greets me on my way to work every day. "Man, that sounds like the life, right there." I like it! 493. JG24FanForever posted: 06.05.2013 - 11:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) How big is this win for Tony? This is only his second Top 8 finish at Dover over the last eight seasons. 494. joey2448 posted: 06.06.2013 - 3:42 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) So I saw that Carl Long is entered in Rick Ware's #15 in the Nationwide race at Iowa this weekend. I guess that $200K fine that won't allow him in the NASCAR garage is only applicable in the Cup series? I thought it was for any NASCAR event. Drew Herring will be driving the 54 Gibbs car at one of his best tracks! Hope he wins! 495. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 4:48 am Rate this comment: (0) (1) Oh my word... he's right. It's a giant penis building! 496. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 6:33 am Rate this comment: (0) (1) Just to make the point, I can't afford to do the 30 minute drive to attend a race at Orlando Speedworld. 497. AveryNH posted: 06.06.2013 - 8:59 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Joey- I think Carl's fine only applies to him attempting to run in the cup series, though I'm not entirely positive as to why it's limited to just that series. Also to whomever designed the Winston-Salem Wells Fargo Building congrats on the best practical joke in the history of practical jokes! 498. Paul posted: 06.06.2013 - 9:06 am Rate this comment: (2) (0) Carl Long is only banned from the Cup Series garage, which includes serving as a driver and crew member. He's been working in the Nationwide and Truck Series' garages since his 2009 penalty, doing whatever he can to make enough money to pay off that fine, and last I heard he had only paid off about $35,000 of that $200,000 fine. Also, in case you didn't notice, Long competed in more than 2/3 of the Nationwide races back in 2011 (primarily as a start-and-park driver for Rick Ware) and competed in a race earlier this year, so it's not a new occurrence to see him back in a Nationwide car this weekend. 499. Baker posted: 06.06.2013 - 10:44 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) JG24FanForever, Up until the last 3 season he has had some excellent cars and Top 5 runs in progress at Dover only to have them go south for various different reasons. The last 3 years or so he has not really even been fast at Dover. Even the win on Sunday he was a 7th-10th place car if everything were equal and everyone had the same pit strategy and took the same tires. He may have been able to squeeze at 5th or 6th out of it max. 500. Baker posted: 06.06.2013 - 10:52 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) What ever happened to Willy on Wheels? 501. The Long Shot posted: 06.06.2013 - 10:59 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) Who knows? Personally, if he's gone, I'm glad. He was probably the biggest troll that I've seen on this website. 502. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 11:01 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I like to say Willy on Wheels finally "went to hell." 503. David posted: 06.06.2013 - 11:28 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) "He was probably the biggest troll that I've seen on this website." I don't know about you, but "myself" really ticked me off sometimes. 504. The Sound posted: 06.06.2013 - 11:50 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff Gordon just signed an extension with Axalta through 2016. I would imagine that would become his final year; actually, I am grateful that he will race that long. I was beginning to have some doubts. Now, I just hope he can get to 100 and that Jimmie does not pass him on the wins list while he is still active. 505. 83andJoe posted: 06.06.2013 - 12:07 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Given that a "Willy on Wheels" is one of Wikipedia's more infamous banned trolls, I'd reckon that nothing of value was lost. 506. Baker posted: 06.06.2013 - 12:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I just don't see Gordon getting 13 wins in 4 seasons. I actually see no reason why he cannot race until he is 50 giving him 8 more season and I still cannot see him getting 13 more wins. 507. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 12:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow, Willy on Wheels was so bad that Wiki banned him permanently, deleted his page, AND deleted all records of his existence. 508. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 12:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You google "Wiki Willy" and Wiki willy on wheels comes up... tons of stuff about his vandalism. 509. The Long Shot posted: 06.06.2013 - 12:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) My guess is that the webmaster could have installed some sort of a ban on him (if that's even possible). By the way, apparently he's been banned by Wikipedia since 2009, although there have been some sightings of imposters of him. 510. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 12:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You're a sicko when the Guardian does an article on you. 511. AveryNH posted: 06.06.2013 - 12:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) His trolling is so prolific he has an entry on urban dictionary! I was never on here to interact with him but I'd notice when reading old race comments he'd appear often, agitating users and eventually and fortunately it became more and more sporadic. 512. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 12:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think I may have been one the anonymous people who told him to go to hell, but that was 5 or 6 years ago, and I've forgotten. :P And there's that corrupt Uncyclopedia, which basically hails him as lord and god. 513. Eric posted: 06.06.2013 - 1:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The user "Myself" was a bigger pain than Willy on Wheels on this site and I think "myself" needed mental help. I am saying that because the webmaster deleted inappropriate comments from "Myself" like typing Earnhardt crashing on the final lap the 2001 Daytona 500 was funny. 514. Eric posted: 06.06.2013 - 1:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I admit the Willy on Wheels was a big pain on this site, but it was like picking your poison on what troll is worse. Willy on Wheels didn't appear to make any comments that were sick on this site and that is what gave the poster "Myself" the edge on Willy on Wheels for who is the bigger troll. 515. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 2:15 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Myself's comments were pretty similar to the posts we see from Anthony. Plain disturbing. I'm glad both he and Willy on Wheels are gone. We don't rats like that here. A different kind of troll was biffle16 *rolls eyes* 516. Schroeder51 posted: 06.06.2013 - 2:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I remember Myself also laughing at Tim Richmond for dying of AIDs, and making some comment on the race where Richmond won his first pole to the effect of "many women would argue with that". I think he still shows up on old races from time to time... 517. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 2:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yeah, that troll's all over the joint. I just found some of his rotten beer foam. 518. murb posted: 06.06.2013 - 2:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) lol, I feel lucky that I didn't join the site until 2011. I've noticed that most of those troll incidents happened in like 2009 or around there. We still get the occasional troll from time to time, but I think we handle it well. 519. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 2:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) murb, you have no idea how lucky you are. Blast you, Andrea! 520. David posted: 06.06.2013 - 2:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "myself" was always making derogatory comments about lesser drivers like Rick Wilson, Riick Mast, Phil Parsons, etc., just because they weren't successful. He basically knocked every driver except Cale Yarborough and Davey Allison, his favorites. He practically worshipped Cale. I know this from reading old comment pages. 521. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 2:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) myself loves to troll things. If you really want to vomit (seriously vomit), read the comments on the Gary Batson fatal crash on YouTube. It was actually so disgusting that you could get youtube pulled from the web for the gore going on there. 522. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 2:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Going to 1982 Busch 500 page and asking the webmaster to remove the vulgarities didn't do any good... there's even a myself comment that is a :D face because he caught away with the vulgarity. 523. Schroeder51 posted: 06.06.2013 - 3:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's not just Gary Batson's fatal crash. Look up ANY fatal racing crash on Youtube and you will come across sick trolls laughing their asses off at the driver deaths and making sarcastic and sick comments about how the driver deserved it or how they would like to have intercourse with the "beautiful" corpse (just a few examples). Youtube is THE kingdom of the trolls... 524. David posted: 06.06.2013 - 3:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Post #4 on that page didn't offend anyone, NRF. "Youtube is THE kingdom of the trolls..." That's mainly why I left that horrid place. My channel has been idle for quite a while, except for the occasional log-on. 525. David posted: 06.06.2013 - 3:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "You're a sicko when the Guardian does an article on you." Where is it? 526. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 4:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Schroeder, I was thinking specifically of the troll that said that "fat ass deserved to die" and "the doctors at the hospital made sandwiches out of his burned flesh" 527. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 4:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) David, here it is. http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2007/mar/25/wikipedia.web20 528. Schroeder51 posted: 06.06.2013 - 4:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Those were exactly the comments I was thinking of, NRF. Between that, people giving Giles Villeneuve a grade for being thrown from his car in his fatal crash, people calling Russell Phillips a child molester who deserved to be cut to pieces in his crash, and someone claiming to be Gordon Smiley's corpse...I'm also reminded of this idiot who claimed to be a professional motorsports researcher and tried to spread rumors that there was a cover-up concerning a big crash early in the '88 Pepsi Firecracker 400 and that the crash actually killed three drivers, H. B. Bailey, Rodney Combs, and Connie Saylor (never mind the fact that Bailey and Saylor weren't even IN that race and Combs is STILL alive). See why commenting on Youtube is a waste of time? 529. joey2448 posted: 06.06.2013 - 4:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Lol, I just went to the 1982 Busch 500 page to read the comments. When I first got there, there were 6 comments. I clicked on it, and there were only 3. When I refreshed the page, only 2 comments remained. I guess the Webmaster works fast, haha. Good for him! The think about posters like Willy on Wheels, is that most statements they made proved to be false. I remember Willy posting things like "x driver" will never amount to anything. He is just a danger to everyone and is a terrible driver, etc...so they just made an ass of themselves on this site... 530. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 4:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yeah, it's too bad there are such people here. The Gordon Smiley crash is hard enough to even watch, never mind how could you possibly take that lightly; that was literally the most violent death in the history of all professional sports, and no I'm not joking. Youtube's just a troll house. People even made X-rated comments on one of Chopin's Ballades... 531. Baker posted: 06.06.2013 - 5:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I don't remember myself for some reason. Was he before Willy on Wheels? 532. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 5:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You wouldn't "remember" myself because he still trolls RR, but he only trolls old races to make disgusting comments where people are less likely to see it. 533. cjs3872 posted: 06.06.2013 - 5:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You don't even know the half of it, NicoRosbergFan. Someone on YouTube even has the Gordon Smiley crash in slow-motion. And that crash is hard to watch in full-speed. In fact, it was such a horrifying crash that, when they did the 1982 episode of "Legends of the Brickyard", ESPN edited the sequence where the crash and aftermath was in the film, right out of the program, though passing mention of Smiley's death was mentioned in the closing host segment of that program by Larry Nuber. And speaking of horrifying crashes, in the last week, another user has uploaded the 1973 race, including the minute or so right after the Armando Teran incident that was edited out of the ESPN Classic version of the race, on his channel. Interestingly, in that minute, Jim McKay and Chris Economaki mention three other crashes that occurred right where Savage's crash took place, including the Dave MacDonald crash, which killed both him and Eddie Sachs, Mike Mosley's hitting Mark Donohue's car there (Mosley and Bobby Unser actually piled into three cars there), and Chris Economaki even mentioned the crash that killed Keith Andrews. That also took place there. That wall at Indy exiting turn four might have been the most unsafe wall in American racing history, though a similar wall exiting turn four at Daytona that wasn't changed until 1984 was equally unsafe. 534. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 5:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Unfortunately, cjs, I've seen that video... including the streaks left on the track... I have 1973 DVR'd to watch still... 535. David posted: 06.06.2013 - 5:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I'm also reminded of this idiot who claimed to be a professional motorsports researcher and tried to spread rumors that there was a cover-up concerning a big crash early in the '88 Pepsi Firecracker 400 and that the crash actually killed three drivers, H. B. Bailey, Rodney Combs, and Connie Saylor (never mind the fact that Bailey and Saylor weren't even IN that race and Combs is STILL alive)" Really? I wonder why he picked on those three drivers. 536. Schroeder51 posted: 06.06.2013 - 5:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I've actually seen a clip from a documentary that actually SHOWED Armando Teran getting hit by the fire truck and actually showed his BODY tumbling down the pits. It was...very, VERY surreal to watch. SERIOUSLY makes me question the sanity of anyone who can find terrible accidents like that funny... 537. cjs3872 posted: 06.06.2013 - 5:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well NicoRosbergFan, you can go to the channel I referred to, doctorindy, to watch his version of the race that includes the minute edited out of the ESPN Classic version, or go to my YouTube channel to watch the 1973 race in 14 parts, including qualifying and pre-race coverage from the 1973 episode of "Indy 500: The Classics". Actually, part 3 of that collection even made its way SPEEDTV.com just after Salt Walther died this past December. Part three deals with the analysis of the Walther crash (which totally misses what I believe caused that incident to happen, the failure on Steve Krisiloff's car from which you can visibly see smoke just as the field is accelerating for the green flag), as well as Dave Diles of ABC Sports reporting on a stormy driver's meeting that took place on May 29, including their criticism of how USAC handled the start of the Indianapolis 500 annually (I guess things never change over time). 538. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 6:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And on top of that guy saying those three drivers died, we know for a fact that Connie Saylor died from cancer in 1993. 539. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 6:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs, what's your channel? 540. JG24FanForever posted: 06.06.2013 - 8:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "read the comments on the Gary Batson fatal crash on YouTube. It was actually so disgusting that you could get youtube pulled from the web for the gore going on there." He was a friend of my Father's and he even let my dad turn laps at Greenville-Pickens in his outlaw car. He owned a BBQ restaurant in Travelers Rest,just down the road from where I live in Greenville. His death was the first real experience I had with the dangers of racing and it still bother's me to this day. Anybody that wants to mock his death doesn't deserve the air they breath. 541. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.06.2013 - 8:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm sorry for that JG24FanForever... that must have really hurt. Not only was it a fatality, but someone whom you'd come to know personally. Changing the topic... Have you ever gone to a race shop, seen a driver, and have him run out like a chicken when he sees you? 542. cjs3872 posted: 06.06.2013 - 9:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NicoRosbergFan, my current channel is cjs83172. 543. JG24FanForever posted: 06.06.2013 - 9:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Have you ever gone to a race shop, seen a driver, and have him run out like a chicken when he sees you?" I've only been to a handful of race shops over the years and everyone of them were super-late model and very small local teams and the drivers were always real friendly. However,I did have garage passes at the 2010 Southern 500 and ran into: Scott Speed,Carl Edwards,Greg Biffle,David Ragan,Clint Bowyer,Chad Knaus,who snubbed my friend Corey for a picture,but he was rather busy. And the best was Richard Petty,who did let Corey take a picture of,and as soon as I saw the Hat from where me and my friends were standing I started running towards him without saying anything to my friends and slowed down when I got close to him and then quietly said "Richard" and handed him my Pass to sign,and that was the perfect way for me to react to the first,and still,only time i've ever met The King. 544. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.06.2013 - 9:18 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) I'd like to show some of these posters a horribly deformed corpse up close and see if they still think it is funny. It is one thing to see it on TV. Seeing it in person is something you never forget. 545. The Long Shot posted: 06.06.2013 - 9:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "cjs, what's your channel?" I know the question wasn't directed at me, but this is it: http://www.youtube.com/user/cjs83172?feature=watch 546. The Long Shot posted: 06.06.2013 - 9:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Someone on YouTube even has the Gordon Smiley crash in slow-motion." I just watched that footage for the first time. While Russell Phillips' death was definitely the most gruesome death in the history of motorsports, Smiley's crash was by far the most horrific I have ever seen, fatal or not. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: stock cars are much safer than open-wheel race-cars. My reasoning is simple: closed cockpits. NASCAR drivers, because their cars have enclosed cockpits, are in little to no danger from any outside materials that may hit their cars. Look back to 2008, and Brian Vickers' crash where he lost the tire. The tire bounced off of the car of David Gilliland before bounding into a camper area. Had that been an open-wheel race-car, David Gilliland would not be alive today. I can give you many different examples where, had their cars had enclosed cockpits, these drivers would have survived their accidents: Mark Donohue, Tom Pryce, Gilles Villeneuve, Ayrton Senna, Jeff Krosnoff, Greg Moore, Tony Renna, Henry Surtees, and Dan Wheldon. So, there's my opinion. Disagree if you want, but I think I've made a good argument. 547. Baker posted: 06.06.2013 - 9:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) They are also safer because they are much slower. Michael McDowell's accident at Texas was not all that different from the Gordon Smiley crash, but the difference in speed when turning right head on into the wall made all the different in the world. 548. David posted: 06.06.2013 - 9:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "He was a friend of my Father's and he even let my dad turn laps at Greenville-Pickens in his outlaw car. He owned a BBQ restaurant in Travelers Rest,just down the road from where I live in Greenville. His death was the first real experience I had with the dangers of racing and it still bother's me to this day." Wow, JG24, that's sad. I'm really sorry about that. "I'd like to show some of these posters a horribly deformed corpse up close and see if they still think it is funny. It is one thing to see it on TV. Seeing it in person is something you never forget." You'd be the guy for that, DSFF. It makes one wonder why one would choose to work as a paramedic. 549. cjs3872 posted: 06.06.2013 - 9:42 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) JG24FF, there's a reason why Richard Petty is called "The King", and it's not necessarily just because of his on-track accomplishments. The reason he has that nickname is, just like his golf counterpart, Arnold Palmer, Petty has always been accommodating to his fans because he knows that it's because of them that he's been able to do what he's done, and has said too many times to count that when he signs an autograph, he considers it to b a "thank you" for all those that paid to watch him race, and it's his way of paying the customer back for their loyalty to him and the sport he represents. That, possibly even more than his on-track accomplishments, is why he's called "King Richard", and why his fan base is like no other in the sport's history. Jeff Gordon has often said that, upon entering the sport, he looked at the way Richard Petty always accommodated the fans and conducted himself as a whole, and considered Petty the model for him to shoot at, not just because of his on-track accomplishments, but his off-track accomplishments, as well. Let's just hope the current generation of younger drivers as well as the next generation use Gordon as the model for how to conduct themselves, just like Gordon used Petty as the model as to how to conduct himself. If the younger drivers do that, I don't think the sport's in that much trouble going ahead. But if they don't, and act like guys such as Kyle Busch, Juan Montoya, and Kevin Harvick often do, then there are rough times ahead for the sport. For many people, Gordon and Tony Stewart are the last of the old-school racers in NASCAR, though Stewart does not have near the off-track record that Gordon does (his on-track record doesn't match Gordon's either, but only a handful of others do, so I'll give him a break on that). 550. DaleSrFanForever posted: 06.06.2013 - 9:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Luckily I don't see it that often. But it can leave an imprint when you do see it for sure. 551. cjs3872 posted: 06.06.2013 - 9:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The Long Shot, just watch the 1976 Daytona 500 broadcast, especially the early part of it, and you'll hear Jackie Stewart make that exact point, so that's been the case for a very long time. One incident that Stewart referred to in a piece he did on NASCAR safety that aired during both the 1976 and 1978 Daytona 500s was an incident that Red Farmer had with Terry Link in the 1975 Permatex 300, a race won by newly-elected Hall of Famer Jack Ingram. Both cars sailed over the guardrail they had there and into the infield spectator area, with Farmer's car flipping numerous times (there were no spectator injuries), but Red was back at the track the next day, though he had to be replaced by Bob Burcham, who failed to qualify for that Daytona 500 (1975) in Henley Gray's car. (Burcham finished 13th). 552. The Long Shot posted: 06.06.2013 - 10:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) So why haven't they installed some sort of cover for these cars, if so many drivers have been injured or killed because of a lack of one? 553. David posted: 06.06.2013 - 10:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Oh yeah, by the way, D-Day was 69 years ago today. Bud Moore was there. 554. cjs3872 posted: 06.06.2013 - 11:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The Long Shot, I think there are two very significant reasons for that. First, if they put some kind of bubble or cover on the IndyCars, they'd actually go faster because the air would flow over the top of the cars significantly better. I remember Emerson Fittipaldi saying something like that many years ago. The second has to do with the fact that the drivers would not get any kind of ventilation during the race because of the enclosed cockpit, which could actually make things more dangerous for the drivers in case they have heat-related problems during the race. 555. 83andJoe posted: 06.07.2013 - 12:41 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) There's also the fact that having an enclosed cockpit would be regarded as heresy. The anti-rideover "bumper" on the rear of the current DW12 car was thoroughly rubbished by the traditionalists because it semi-encloses the rear wheels... 556. cjs3872 posted: 06.07.2013 - 3:26 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) That's true 83andJoe, even though building a car that enclosed the rear wheels was hardly a new concept in IndyCar racing. In 1955, the car that Jim Rathmann was slated to drive originally had enclosed wheels, as well what may have been the first radio in a racecar (the extra bodywork and the radio were eventually removed), as did the cars that Mickey Thompson brought to Indy in 1964 with drivers Eddie Johnson and Dave MacDonald, and we all know how that ended up. MacDonald crashed on the second lap and his car exploded, killing both himself and Eddie Sachs when Sachs T-boned MacDonald's car. Thompson's team withdrew their other car, pulling it out of the race one lap after the restart in deference to MacDonald. So enclosed wheels had been tried in IndyCar racing before. Ironically, the extra bodywork is doubtlessly what has caused the incredible racing at Indy the last two years, with a combined 102 official lead changes in this year's and last year's Indianapolis 500s. Prior to that, the record for lead changes had been 29, set way back in 1960, and the record prior to that was 28, set back in 1923. 557. NicoRosbergFan posted: 06.07.2013 - 4:25 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs, I'm adding a little bit to what you mentioned. Something a lot of people don't realize is that Jeff was the first athlete to have heavy involvement in charity (at least establish his own charity); all the others, Johnson and Stewart namely, are all copycats. 558. JG24FanForever posted: 06.07.2013 - 7:08 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "there's a reason why Richard Petty is called "The King"" You'd love this, cjs3872. http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/nascar/cup/columns/story?columnist=hinton_ed&id=3673003 559. Ferret posted: 06.17.2013 - 1:21 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) @546 "I can give you many different examples where, had their cars had enclosed cockpits, these drivers would have survived their accidents: Mark Donohue, Tom Pryce, Gilles Villeneuve, Ayrton Senna, Jeff Krosnoff, Greg Moore, Tony Renna, Henry Surtees, and Dan Wheldon. So, there's my opinion. Disagree if you want, but I think I've made a good argument." I'll disagree based on what I know from physics here. Look at the forces involved when a car goes airborne or gets hit by something. Tom Pryce? He was decapitated by a fire marshal's extinguisher, a canopy would with the 1970s technology, have smashed or shattered with the sheer force of impact. Even if it had saved his life, he'd still have been hurt by flying glass. Gilles? He locked wheels with Jochen Mass and went airborne, the car flipping end over end, he was thrown out and still would have been with a canopy, but thrown against it. Senna? Given that Patrick Head states he believes the steering column caused the crash, it's possible, however the forces involved would still injure or worse, especially to the neck and skull. Krosnoff? Again possible, from what I recall the car split in two after striking a light pole. So I doubt that a canopy could have saved him, though I'm not sure. Greg Moore? The car dug in and flipped and he died from (IIRC) a skull fracture, a canopy would have simply given more things to hit the head against Renna? Got airborne and again hit a light pole, yes? IMO a canopy may have saved him Surtees? Possibly, however that was a wheel and as with the Tom Pryce incident (I've been to his memorial in Ruthin, Wales, it's simple and well done), the force would have to be calculated in Wheldon? Again, locked wheels as we all know and went head first into the fence. 560. DRF posted: 08.05.2015 - 3:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Tony Stewart's last career win. 561. Anthony posted: 12.04.2015 - 6:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I hope this doesn't end up as Smoke's last win - he deserves a good farewell season. Maybe a win or two to round off his career. 562. 88&4Fan posted: 12.04.2015 - 6:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Unfortunately I just don't see it happening. The only race next year that I can see him winning is the July 4th Daytona race because he's always been really good in that race and won it a bunch. But besides that, I don't think he'll win. 563. Rusty posted: 12.17.2015 - 11:16 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's crazy to think that this could be Tony Stewart's final win. 564. Sam posted: 06.26.2016 - 6:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @560 and 563 nope he won today at Sonoma 565. boom posted: 10.02.2016 - 3:07 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well it looks like you were all wrong again. 566. RaceFanX posted: 11.20.2016 - 7:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This would be Stewart's last Cup victory on an oval. If you would have said that at the time they would have called you crazy. 567. Rich posted: 12.19.2020 - 10:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mike Joy, Larry McReynolds and Darrell Waltrip were the commentators. Steve Byrnes, Matt Yocum and Krista Voda were the pit road reporters. Jeff Hammond was the roving reporter. Chris Myers and Michael Waltrip were in the Hollywood hotel. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ *Post a comment:* Your comment may not appear immediately - all comments must be approved by the moderator. Name: Comment: