|| *Comments on the 2013 Pure Michigan 400:* First Page | Previous Page | Next Page | Last Page | View All On One Page View the most recent comment | Post a comment <#post> 1. 83andJoe posted: 08.16.2013 - 6:38 pm Rate this comment: (15) (1) It's a newwwwwwwww traaaaaaaaaaccccckkk recccccccccoooorrrrddddd! 2. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.16.2013 - 6:50 pm Rate this comment: (4) (4) Kasey's car was painted like Jeff's, but he didn't drive it like Jeff. 3. Josh C posted: 08.16.2013 - 6:59 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Damn that is fast, 203 mph. 4. Eric posted: 08.16.2013 - 7:10 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) One of these years MIS will turn into a plate track. If MIS doesn't became a plate in 10 year, it will be in 15 to 20 years when it gets repaved. 5. David posted: 08.16.2013 - 7:16 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "It's a newwwwwwwww traaaaaaaaaaccccckkk recccccccccoooorrrrddddd!" Someone foolishly trying to pronounce that would probably choke on all the "c"s. Jeff qualifies in the top fifteen, what a surprise. 6. JG24shouldbe5time posted: 08.16.2013 - 7:21 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Glad to see Jeff put together a decent qualifying run; well, at least compared to his run here in June. His first practice speeds weren't too bad. Nap-time is in the top three. I was hoping they'd sort of treat this as a "throw away" race since they've got their chase spot locked...and his odds are listed as 5-1 so, I don't know, this could be another robo-race. If so, at least I can tune into the NHRA Mello Yellow Series' visit to my home state. Side note: The late night/early morning replay (4 Am EDT) of today's qualifying session is the last thing that SPEED will show before it reboots as Fox Sports 1. This has been discussed here quite a bit, but I'll give my last thoughts on SPEED(unless provoked/asked for more). There's little to no argument that SPEED went downhill after Fox bought Speedvision, rebranded it and made it the outlet for its NASCAR programming; I'm guessing we're all NASCAR fans here so that wasn't the end of the world. It seems to me too that SPEED at least showed international series (DTM, WRC) as late as 2008 before becoming a network with few live events sprinkled with reality/lifestyle programming. Even with the crud shows, it was THE place to go to get my fix on my favorite series until this year. I'm very disappointed not knowing where I can catch DTM, Aussie V8 and heck, even Monster Jam on TV after tonight. 7. The Long Shot posted: 08.16.2013 - 7:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) So far, so good for my fantasy pick to win. 8. JG24shouldbe5time posted: 08.16.2013 - 7:34 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) Oops, forgot to congratulate Logano on his pole. I like Logano, regardless of some of the controversy he's been involved in. NASCAR claims it needs a new "youth movement" and Joey could be part of it, maybe even help lead it. He has 5 years of Cup experience; he needs to be able to stay consistent and WIN a few times. 9. cjs3872 posted: 08.16.2013 - 7:37 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Actually DSFF, Kasey Kahne qualified EXACTLY like Jeff Gordon has be qualifying on these type of tracks, as it's his turn to have to fight from the back of the field, so in a way, he qualified that car just the Gordon has a number of times. Meanwhile, Gordon finally joined the 200 MPH club with a lap of 202.117 MPH to qualify 13th, which was always Dale, Sr.'s "lucky" spot on the grid. For some reason, Dale, Sr. always liked it when he qualified 13th. By the way, Kahne reverses the numbers for his starting position, which is 31st. But seriously, 25 cars over 200 MPH and four more within a tenth of a second of a 200 MPH lap? As I've been saying, the 200 MPH lap may wow the fans, but it doesn't produce good racing because the cars can't run close together. And I agree Eric, I believe Michigan will be a restrictor plate track, and I think that may be sooner than you think. All that's needed is one major injury, or in the worst case scenario, a fatality, and they'll be bringing restrictor plates for Michigan. They need to knock down the speeds at least 15 MPH, because they can race at Michigan at 180-185, that's been proven, but not at 200+, and I don't think the race pace will be slowing down much unless the temperature goes up. The unseasonably cool temperatures are one reason why the speeds were so fast this time around. But I'm also worried about tire problems this time around because they can't handle the speed. Remember that Kasey Kahne and Jimmie Johnson were among those that had right front tire problems in June, and they may be going faster now than they were then. One thing I don't think the teams will have to worry too much about is a long green flag run like those that Michigan's famous for, because I don't think the tires can last that long as fast as they're going. This is one thing I deeply hope I'm wrong about and that it's a safe race, but I just don't know if the tires are going to be able to last a full fuel run at 200 MPH. 10. Daniel posted: 08.16.2013 - 7:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) In using fastest 43: #19 Scott Riggs Out using fastest 43: #33 Landon Cassill 11. murb posted: 08.16.2013 - 7:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Picking Kurt Busch this weekend. I think I picked him for the June race too. Hopefully this one will turn out better for him. 12. The Long Shot posted: 08.16.2013 - 8:01 pm Rate this comment: (4) (0) R-E-S-P-E-C-T. My encouragement of the week to all us posters. Can we all agree to follow it? 13. Sky Warrior posted: 08.16.2013 - 8:01 pm Rate this comment: (8) (0) Starting 27th, the driver of the #14 Mobil 1 Chevrolet, you all know him as the driver who threw away a Nationwide Championship to run a few early Cup races, Aaaaaauuuuuuuusssssttttiiiinnnnnn Diiiiilllllloooonnnnnn 14. Jarrett88fan posted: 08.16.2013 - 8:14 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) If anyone who qualified well needs a great run its Mark Martin. After Vickers got the full time deal in the #55 car next year and this race last year was the site of the horrendous crash after having the best car. Nationwide at Mid-Ohio should be intriguing with Ambrose coming from the back, Allmendinger returning to a road-course, the Nationwide points situation recreating the 1991 Winston Cup Championship race, oh and a new track to navigate. 15. BON GORDON posted: 08.16.2013 - 8:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Very disappointed with Gordon's 13th place start. He needs to pick it up or pack up and go home. Hopefully he can get a podium finish on Sunday. I'm still pissed at him after that needless wreck at Watkins Glen. 2012 all over again without the win for insurance. 16. Jarrett88fan posted: 08.16.2013 - 8:30 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) This race is scheduled for August 18 and the last three Cup races run on August 18 (1991, 1996, and 2002) were won by one driver who is currently retired... who is it? 17. David posted: 08.16.2013 - 8:38 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Too easy. Dale Jarrett. 18. Jarrett88fan posted: 08.16.2013 - 8:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dead giveaway David. Seriously, guys has any other Nascar driver won three consecutive races on the same date other than DJ? 19. David posted: 08.16.2013 - 8:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) My second guess would be Ricky Rudd, but I'm fairly certain that it's Jarrett. 20. cjs3872 posted: 08.16.2013 - 8:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) BON GORDON, how can you be disappointed in Gordon qualifying 13th (ironically, also his current position in points), when he usually qualifies closer to where the driver that carries one of Gordon's paint jobs qualified (Kasey Kahne was 31st in the Pepsi MAX paint scheme, which is carried by Gordon on a semi-regular basis). 13th is a significant improvement over where he usually qualifies, and if his car shows the speed in the race it's shown so far (much to my surprise), he's going to give Jimmie Johnson and the other front runners something to think about. Gordon has had a knack throughout his career by following up races where he makes a REALLY bad mistake with a big effort, and there are too many examples to list, and he made a king-sized mistake at Watkins Glen. The question is, can Gordon keep his car up there to threaten the leaders. Everyone talks about Jimmie Johnson never having won at Michigan, but Jeff Gordon's not won there himself since 2001 (that epic duel with Ricky Rudd), and Hendrick Motorsports has a relatively pedestrian history at Michigan, as only Rudd, Gordon, Dale, Jr., and Mark Martin have won there for HMS at the historically Ford track. (Darrell Waltrip, Geoff Bodine, Kasey Kahne, Brian Vickers, and Kyle Busch all drove for, or have driven for HMS at Michigan, but won there for other teams, while Martin is the only driver to win there for HMS and another team.) 21. Scott. B posted: 08.16.2013 - 9:30 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) Brendan Gaughan and Johnny Sauter will be making their first Cup starts of the season. For Sauter, it's actually the first since early in the 2011 season. 22. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.16.2013 - 9:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kasey Kahne may be driving a Pepsi MAX car but it looks absolutely nothing like the paint scheme Gordon drives from time to time. Gordon drives a plain black car with blue and white flame outlines, while Kahne's car is equal parts black and blue with red outlines. Both are nice schemes, I'd say Kahne's is better overall but Gordon's is better for Gordon (flames are pretty much the trademark of 2000s Gordon). Speaking of Gordon paint schemes, the Standox one he is racing this weekend is really nice. I thought Bass Pro Shops may have played a big part in the SHR-Dillon decision, but I see their primary sponsor this weekend is Mobil 1, so that's interesting. "Nap-time is in the top three. I was hoping they'd sort of treat this as a "throw away" race since they've got their chase spot locked" This is the opposite mentality from what any championship team would follow. They are already locked in, so winning is ALL they care about through Richmond. If they win, they get 3 bonus points. If they blow a tire, blow an engine, crash, etc, they lose nothing. "If anyone who qualified well needs a great run its Mark Martin. After Vickers got the full time deal in the #55 car next year and this race last year was the site of the horrendous crash after having the best car. " I'm of the opinion that Martin's a has-been, but I would love to see him have a good run or even win. It would be nice to see him back next season on a part-time basis with a team like the Wood Brothers. 23. Scott. B posted: 08.16.2013 - 9:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Three of the top six qualifiers are drivers who don't have rides for next season locked in. Along with Mark Martin, there's Kurt Busch and Juan Pablo Montoya. 24. SpeedWorld97 posted: 08.16.2013 - 9:46 pm Rate this comment: (8) (0) As previously mentioned, SPEED is less than 12 hours away from going off the air, and I must say that I'm very disgusted by this. It's hard to believe that around this time one year ago, SPEED had F1 coverage, one-hour long Wind Tunnel episodes, and endless coverage of all motorsports on SPEED Center. But starting tomorrow, all of that is just a thing of the past. Looking at the listings for Fox Sports 1, it's nothing really special. Like ESPN, they will manage to have NFL talk shows at least twice a day (I have no interest in the NFL, but for those NFL fans on this site, don't you think enough is enough?). Also, they will have some sort of series called "Spectacular Finishes." When I first saw that, I thought it might be about NASCAR, but NASCAR is only part of the series. Also like ESPN, their Fox Sports Live (equivalent to SportsCenter) will rerun all night every night. I don't see how "America's newest sports network" will ever surpass ESPN just by copying them. And perhaps worst of all, NASCAR Race Hub will be cut down to a half an hour at 4:30 pm weekdays. And, in my opinion, all of the news anchors for the network just seem boring and will probably always act politically correct. At least I can now call the NBC Sports Network my new favorite channel... But let's remember SPEED/SpeedVision for what it was, a network that catered to racing fans of all kinds. One that has been unequalled in racing coverage for quite some time and ranks with the likes of ESPN SpeedWorld (1979-2006) and TNN's auto racing coverage as the best of all time. R.I.P. SpeedVision/SPEED 1996-2013 It was fun while it lasted... 25. Chives5150 posted: 08.16.2013 - 9:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I remember the SPEED guys saying that Kahne's car sounded pretty terrible as it came across the frontstretch during his qualifying lap. Did they ever officially report that there was something wrong with Kahne's car that only allowed him to qualify only 31st? 26. cjs3872 posted: 08.16.2013 - 10:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well Chives5150, if it did sound bad, then it could be bad news for teams running Hendrick engines this weekend, because that would be two engine problems, if indeed it is an engine problem. Remember that the #1 car, which has a Hendrick motor in it, had a catastrophic engine failure in practice. And when Hendrick has two engine failures in a race weekend, it could be an across the board problem. Remember that they had several engine failures in this race last year, including two or three in the race itself. And they've had weekends over the years where they've run across a company-wide problem. The two races that stand out to me where that's concerned are the 2002 fall race at Talladega and the 2005 spring race at Fontana, where all the cars the had Hendrick engines had engine difficulties. In the 2005 spring race at Fontana, every car in the field that had a Hendrick engine had an engine failure, except for Jimmie Johnson, and they said his engine was two or three laps from going when the race ended. With Jeff Gordon needing a good finish to stay in Chase contention and Kasey Kahne needing one to stay within reach of the top ten in points, the last thing HMS needs to run into is a bad batch of engine parts, but with two engines having problems, it looks like they're REALLY going to have to watch it the rest of the weekend. And engine failure in the race Sunday would even put Dale Earnhardt, Jr. in the danger zone, as far as making the Chase is concerned, and one would effectively end Gordon's shot at making the Chase this year, due to where it would put him in the points, compared to other drivers that could be out of the top ten with one win. 27. ch posted: 08.16.2013 - 10:11 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) >And perhaps worst of all, NASCAR Race Hub will be cut down to a half an hour at 4:30 pm weekdays. Actually, from what I've seen on my guide, it will be half an hour at 4:30 like you said, but only on Mondays / Thursdays. The Directv guide is showing that on Tuesdays / Wednesdays, Race Hub will be an hour long at Noon. >At least I can now call the NBC Sports Network my new favorite channel... With the NHL / Indy car / F1 / Premier League Soccer, NBCSN is already the best out there in my opinion. Adding Nascar will just make the best even better. Other than the World Cup, I will have absolutely no reason to watch ESPN once 2015 comes around. 28. The Long Shot posted: 08.16.2013 - 10:12 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) "I have no interest in the NFL, but for those NFL fans on this site, don't you think enough is enough?" The NFL has a whole network to themselves. I would think that should be plenty, but I guess the people at ESPN, NBC, and Fox don't agree. I wouldn't mind so much if it weren't for the fact that 9/10 of the NFL analysts are complete idiots (*cough* *cough* Deion Sanders). The only ones who have any sense nowadays are Mike Ditka, Troy Aikman, Phil Simms, Cris Collinsworth (although I can't stand him), and Howie Long (though he gets swept into the NFL on Fox shenanigans too often). 29. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.16.2013 - 10:16 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Hey Long Shot, kiss my ass! Just kidding, I agree with you, we've seen enough hostility here lately. One of the hallmarks of this noard is the way we can disagree on stuff yet still ne respectful about it. 30. cjs3872 posted: 08.16.2013 - 10:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Actually ch, Race Hub is going to be half an hour, regardless of the date and time it airs. However, much like NASCAR Now, it's not going to be on at the same time each day. On Monday and Thursday, it's going to be on from 4:30-5 pm, on Tuesday, it'll be on from noon-12:30pm, and on Wednesday, it's scheduled to air from 1:30-2 pm. And unlike what it's been, the episodes are only going to air once. Now since there is live coverage of the trucks at Bristol on Wednesday, I'm not sure that's going to be the slot for race Hub the rest of this season, or it's just going to be a one-time deal due to the live action. My Comcast program guide doesn't go to August 28, since that's too far out at this point. If it did, I'd know what time it airs on Wednesdays. But I'll probably find out in a day or two, and I'll post my findings. 31. AveryNH posted: 08.16.2013 - 10:27 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) I get friggin sick of the Nfl too, most especially when espn dedicates two hour long shows to it all year long, yet the air a half hour nascar show at 1 a.m. it's frustrating and nauseating. As for the anchors on Fox sports live, their version of sports center. They brought in two hilariously wacky Canadians Jay Onrait and Dan O'Toole from TSN sportscentre fame. That should be a fun alternative to the boring shtick that is currently on every waking hour. Although it does provide some nice back round noise for me to fall asleep, so there are some positives there! 32. SpeedWorld97 posted: 08.16.2013 - 10:29 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "Other than the World Cup, I will have absolutely no reason to watch ESPN once 2015 comes around." Agreed. by the time 2015 comes around, I will only watch ESPN/ABC for IndyCar races. 33. Eric posted: 08.16.2013 - 10:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs3872, HMS engines shouldn't be only concern with engines this weekend. I am saying that based on the TRD has as a new aggressive engine package. 34. cjs3872 posted: 08.16.2013 - 11:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Oh, I totally agree with you there, Eric. The thing is that Hendrick engines have suffered one, and quite probably two problems already, and as bulletproof as those engines usually are, when they suffer two failures on the same weekend with a race still to come, everyone running Hendrick engines should be concerned, because their history is that when they suffer engine failures, like they did today, they usually suffer them in bunches, like about four, five, or six in one fell swoop. TRD usually doesn't suffer them in bunches like that, but rather one or two per weekend when they do suffer engine failures, which has to make Martin Truex, Jr. and Matt Kenseth worry. The way I see I, what TRD should have done is to use the more aggressive engine package in cars that have a lot to gain and don't have much to lose. In other words, what thy should have done is to put the more aggressive package in the 11, 15, 55 cars, and possibly the 18 car, as well, but run the more conservative engine package in the 20 and 56 cars since a engine failure would be disastrous to those teams. But as worried as I would be this week if I was JGR or MWR in terms of engine problems, the race in Atlanta could be an even bigger problem, since it's a 500-mile race, and it will be the first race over 400 miles since May. An engine failure in the race may knock Martin Truex, Jr. out of the Chase (he's currently tenth, but could drop as low as 16th with such a failure), and an engine failure cold knock Matt Kenseth into the danger zone, as far as falling out of the top ten is concerned, since he's currently only 36 points ahead of tenth. And if Matt Kenseth falls out of the top ten in points, that changes everything where the Chase is concerned, especially if Kasey Kahne's team doesn't get their act together, because that would affect the Wild Card situation if Kenseth dropped out of the top ten, since he's tied for the lead in victories with four, but would lose the 12 bonus points he would have if he fell out of the top ten and had to use those four wins for the Wild Card. 35. murb posted: 08.16.2013 - 11:07 pm Rate this comment: (2) (1) Excellent post about the end of Speed, Speedworld. It's been pretty difficult to watch all of these Speed exclusive shows air their final episodes. Of course the amazing last episode of Wind Tunnel has been documented, but it's been sad for all the shows. I even got sad watching the final episode of that goofy Trackside show today. And like you mentioned, I'm failing to see how Fox Sports 1 is going to "change the face of sports broadcasting" like how they've been plugging. It's just gonna be more NFL roundtable crap, a bunch of soccer that no one cares about, SportsCenter ripoffs, UFC which is cool for about five minutes until you realize that every fight is the same, and the Truck/Sports Car races that Speed already had. Nothing about any of this sounds revolutionary like what they're trying to get us to believe. It'll just be another bland sports network. Oh well. On the bright side for us motorsports fans, at least pretty much all of the cable/satellite providers have picked it up. I've got Dish, and I was getting nervous because from what it sounds like they didn't strike a deal until a couple days ago. So at least all the diehard motorsports fans won't be jipped out of the actual racing that Fox Sports will carry. It would be a travesty for the Nascar fans to be missing the Truck races (best series in Nascar right now hands down) and for all the diehard sports car fans to be missing those races. 36. David posted: 08.16.2013 - 11:20 pm Rate this comment: (4) (1) Folks, here's your nickname for FS1: "BS1" A takeoff on "BSPN", but as murb mentioned, this network is a ripoff of ESPN anyway. 37. SpeedWorld97 posted: 08.16.2013 - 11:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Folks, here's your nickname for FS1: "BS1" Good one. Here's another I thought of earlier but forgot to mention: ESPN Lite 38. Sky Warrior posted: 08.16.2013 - 11:35 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Hey everyone, what's your favorite racing shirt you own? I've got a few I can't decide among: -picked up an Inaugural Phoenix 1988 Checker 500 shirt at a garage sale a few years ago which is really cool -have an ARCA Truck series shirt I got last year at Toledo. As far as I saw you couldn't even buy them, the only way to get one was to catch one that the top 6 qualifiers were throwing into the stands. 2nd place starter Shawn Szep threw one that I got, and race winner Danny Jackson signed it for me in Victory Lane. My only autographed shirt -Jeff Gordon 2011 Pocono win shirt because my favorite driver won the day before my birthday. Needless to say I was through the roof -Inaugural Eldora Mudsummer Classic shirt that I went through hell to get What's some cool shirts everyone else has? 39. SpeedWorld97 posted: 08.16.2013 - 11:41 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) "Hey everyone, what's your favorite racing shirt you own?" Though it may not have been by favorite at the time, my SPEED Channel racing shirt is probabaly my favorite now. In fact, I am going to wear it tomorrow in honor of the network. 40. murb posted: 08.16.2013 - 11:47 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "What's some cool shirts everyone else has?" My favorite one would probably be my 2002 Ward Burton shirt. On the front it's got his black Cat Dealers paint scheme (the one he ran at the Bristol night race where Dale Jr wrecked him), and it says "Bringing The Heat" on it. Ward's one of my all time favorite drivers, so that's probably why it's my favorite shirt. As far as others, I have a 2002 Tony Stewart Winston Cup Championship shirt (I've never been a huge Smoke fan, so I have no idea how I got it - I think someone gave it to me as a kid or something). And I also have a bunch of shirts from race tracks. My dad used to work for this company that would travel to a few of the races, so he was able to get me shirts from Indy, Charlotte, and Richmond. That's really about it for my racing shirts that I still currently have. I think I did have some others as a kid (maybe a Bobby Labonte 18 car one?), but I just can't remember them right now. 41. AveryNH posted: 08.16.2013 - 11:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) My favorite shirt I had was a Pepsi racing shirt with Jeff Gordon's face plastered on the back of it. I think I gave it away when I out grew it. Most of my nascar shirts are ones included with the programs I buy at NHMS. Strangely though I didn't get one this year. The shirt I've worn there the last two years was a Mark Martin #5 quaker state shirt from 2011. Although this year I saw a guy for real dressed head to toe in Chad Little gear. #97 hard hat. A john deere PONTIAC shirt from 1997 and some faded green n yellow 97 shorts that I didn't even know where ever made. This guy was a true die hard fan. And I kinda actually felt bad for him. But he was quite the sight. 42. The Long Shot posted: 08.17.2013 - 12:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Hey Long Shot, kiss my ass!" Hey, I have nothing against Deion Sanders as a player. He was arguably one of the best cornerbacks of all time during his days with the Falcons, Niners, and Cowboys. It's Deion Sanders the show-boat and Deion Sanders the announcer that I can't stand. "Hey everyone, what's your favorite racing shirt you own?" As of now, I unfortunately do not own one, but hopefully that will be changing soon. 43. DB1995 posted: 08.17.2013 - 12:04 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) To everyone whos close to Kingsport Speedway in TN you need to go anytime you can, tonight was championship night and they had Legends, Rookie Pure 4, Late Model, Street stocks, and regular pure 4. The legends race guy spun his brother out on the final lap on the backstretch, and in street stock the top 2 in points tied, and the street stock had an awesome 77ish Chevelle in it, it was slow but still awesome 44. Jarrett88fan posted: 08.17.2013 - 12:05 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I loved my 1999 Jarrett and Bobby Labonte 2000 Winston Cup Championship shirts with the old Winston Cup Championship trophy. Trackside was a cool concept in the early 2000s with drivers showing up and revealing a little more personality in informal interviews with a few funny segments mixed in. Recently, the show became stale. However, Kyle Petty was quite entertaining from time to time. RIP Speed. 45. Rexrobe posted: 08.17.2013 - 12:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Hey everyone, what's your favorite racing shirt you own?" I have a Davey Allison shirt. It's just a white tee with his picture and the 28 on it, but you would be surprised how many people stop and comment when I wear it to a race track - I only get to see live races once or twice a year, too. 46. OldSchoolNascarDude1 posted: 08.17.2013 - 12:58 am Rate this comment: (4) (0) It's bittersweet to see Speed leave the air. On one side, the nostalgia part of me doesn't want it to change. However, this channel has been dying for a few years now. This isn't the show that we all grew up watching. Inside Winston Cup no longer exists, no USAR Procup events, not much motorcycle coverage, etc. The shows have either been cancelled, or have gotten so dumb that they no longer generate interest from the hardcore fan. For instance, Trackside has turned into an attempted comedy show, the segments on Race Hub with Jimmy Spencer are horrific and there are hardly any non Nascar related material left that focuses on strictly a racing aspect. I understand the need to cater to a young age; I get that. However, this isn't a good thing for auto racing. I think NASCAR will be fine with this deal. To be honest, NASCAR program has been over saturated in my opinion. However, the ARCA series is struggling as is, and moving that over to Fox Sports 2 isn't going to help matters. The same can be said for all of the other similar programming that isn't NASCAR based. There is hardly no audience for that channel at all. I'm a huge stick and ball sport fan, but I've had it with NFL coverage. You can't turn on the television without seeing some type of NFL news. Honestly, how many hours of television should be devoted to Tim Tebow's throwing motion? Mark Sanchez's awfulness? Aaron Hernandez's murder trial? Goodness, not even news/court related shows have went as in-depth as ESPN. Let's go back to when Fox first bought what was Speedvision at the time. They showed tons of ARCA racing, along with professional NASCAR programming. However, as time went along, so did the seriousness. I'm a comical guy, but these past few years have featured nothing but comedy based NASCAR programs. Everyone will be whining during college sports season when an even runs long and NASCAR is kicked to Fox Sports 2, a channel that I think has less than 50 million viewers. Is that good for the series? I do think that another motorsports channel will form, however. There will be a huge demand for it. If done properly, I think it can be successful, too. There are a lot of great racing events going on around the country that television hasn't focused on. I think the potential is there for someone to form a network and build something similar to the early Speedvision/Speed/TNN years. An auto racing channel without NASCAR content can still be successful, I believe. 47. David posted: 08.17.2013 - 2:28 am Rate this comment: (4) (0) This will be my last post before SPEED goes off the air. Since I was never able to watch it on a regular basis, I will keep it brief, and say only this: Farewell, SPEED, and we salute you. 48. AveryNH posted: 08.17.2013 - 3:05 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) Does staying up until three a.m. just to watch the history of trans am classify me as a racing nerd? Or does it just mean I'm crazy? Nonetheless it's incredible. I feel like I'm watching a PBS documentary. And I'm savoring every waning second of speedvision 49. Jarrett88fan posted: 08.17.2013 - 3:25 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) So am I Avery, every second of this old school trip down nostalgia lane. It was nice to see parts of one final episode of Pinks which had over 2 million viewers at its peak. Car and driver magazine had an excellent piece, Reflections on SPEED or something to that effect that almost brought tears to my eyes with Bestwick, Mario Andretti, Despain, etc. sharing their reflections on SPEED. Despite all the warts and flaws through the years, SPEED was our channel in one incarnation or another. 50. AveryNH posted: 08.17.2013 - 4:21 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) Jarrett88fan, for me it was just so incredible and chilling to hear Sam Posey so artfully describe the storied history of what was trans am. I got into trans am around the mid nineties, hell I was born with it and grew up watching it. My knowledge of the series really only extended to the early 80s. And to physically see such greats like Jones, Donahue, Rindt, Foyt and so many others just makes my appreciation for it grow even more. The archive footage shown was remarkable. And the old speedvision logo... gahhh okay I'll stop gushing and finally go off to bed. 51. Jarrett88fan posted: 08.17.2013 - 4:43 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) No doubt about it, Posey's narration was poetic. Come to think about it, that program was the best form of automotive poetry I have seen in a long time with strong narrative techniques, archived footage reels, etc. I guess that show brought in a much older demographic than Fox wanted for Fox Sports 1. I'm 26. Fox Sports, in the gesture of the late Dale Earnhardt, "You're number ONE!" 52. Anonymous posted: 08.17.2013 - 5:10 am Rate this comment: (1) (1) It's approximately 5 AM. SPEED is no longer with us. SPEED was declared DOA at 4AM EST. RIP SPEED (1996-2013) *plays "Taps"* 53. Jarrett88fan posted: 08.17.2013 - 6:03 am Rate this comment: (1) (1) *Followed by "Amazing Grace" on bagpipes* Farewell SPEED, goodnight and good luck. 54. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.17.2013 - 6:08 am Rate this comment: (1) (2) SPEED is no longer with us :( I miss "Legends of Motorsport" 55. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.17.2013 - 6:30 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Long Shot, I was making a joke about your lets all respect each other this week post before agreeing with it. I also agree about Deion. Funny, as a kid, with him playing for my Falcons (this was before the Panthers) I thought all that show boating was so cool. Then he went to the Niners and Cowboys and I'm like "act like you've done this before". Must be because I was a kid because now, as a Panthers fan, Cam's Superman poses irritate the ever loving shit out of me. Although if he were a winner I might like it. But he isn't. He is looking as ineffective at making the plays that count as ever this pre season. Should be another losing season for him. 56. JG24shouldbe5time posted: 08.17.2013 - 7:17 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) www.speedtv.com now redirects to http://msn.foxsports.com/speed aka "SPEED The motors on FOX blog". My favorite t-shirt ever was my Darrell Waltrip Tide shirt. IIRC, Tide had a proof of purchase mail-in promo after DW won the Daytona 500. I'm sure my Mom sold it years ago or we donated it to charity, it would have been 20+ years ago we did that. My current favorite is a tie between my DuPont Chevy shirt and even though I despise the Chase...my "Inaugural Chase for the NEXTEL Cup 2004" shirt. 57. OldSchoolNascarDude1 posted: 08.17.2013 - 7:17 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) This is a great article on the transformation of the channel. http://www.caranddriver.com/features/voices-of-speed-reflections-on-the-demise-of-the-speed-channel-feature 58. SpeedWorld97 posted: 08.17.2013 - 7:54 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well I missed the "History of SCCA Racing" special live, but thank goodness for DVRs. I will try and watch it later after the Mid-Ohio Nationwide race. 59. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.17.2013 - 8:12 am Rate this comment: (3) (4) I giggle at the fact that it was shows like NASCAR Raceday that caused the ratings bomb. They tried to screw off shows like "Legends of Motorsport" and they eventually paid for it. 60. Canadianfan posted: 08.17.2013 - 8:47 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) Just wanted to let you guys know SPEED is alive and well in Canada and will be through the end of 2015 due to some deal in Canada to contiune to show it. I believe this is known as SPEED International. Even the Station Bug once again just says SPEED with no fox logo. There are even rumors I heard on another forum that some of the old shows like victory by design and legends of motorsport will make a return apparently one of the original creators of SPEEDVISION was Canadian and he made some kind of deal to keep it on the air in Canada. 61. Zackary Shawn posted: 08.17.2013 - 9:04 am Rate this comment: (2) (0) Well, Fox Sports 1 has already rubbed me the wrong way. Why? Their first program was about Alabama's 2012 National Championship. 62. David posted: 08.17.2013 - 9:21 am Rate this comment: (2) (0) "Does staying up until three a.m. just to watch the history of trans am classify me as a racing nerd?" Just being on this site classifies you as a racing nerd. 63. David posted: 08.17.2013 - 9:23 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) At least the first live competitive event on BS1 FS1 is the Camping World Truck Series race. That's what I call justice. 64. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.17.2013 - 9:33 am Rate this comment: (0) (2) Does anyone else think the new Kansas Speedway road course layout sucks? 65. David posted: 08.17.2013 - 10:25 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, it is a bit unimaginative at that. 66. pimmy posted: 08.17.2013 - 10:43 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Most rovals aren't very good. There's only so much you can do with a flat & fairly cramped section of infield. 67. Anthony posted: 08.17.2013 - 11:31 am Rate this comment: (1) (2) Jeff Gordon has A winning car here @ Michigan! 3x Michigan Winner (1998, 2001 & 2013) 68. Anthony posted: 08.17.2013 - 11:32 am Rate this comment: (1) (2) What I mean by 2013 winner (Jeff Gordon) talking about his August 2013 win tomorrow! 69. David posted: 08.17.2013 - 11:44 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) ^You've got to appreciate the enthusiasm, at least. 70. joey2448 posted: 08.17.2013 - 11:45 am Rate this comment: (2) (1) Once again, a five-time champion spins out all by his lonesome... 71. BON GORDON posted: 08.17.2013 - 11:46 am Rate this comment: (0) (1) Cjs, when Gordon and his fans start settling for a 13th place qualifying run there's a problem. A winner of 72 poles and many many more top ten starts who is at Hendrick Motorsports needs to so at least that. He had a late draw and a car that was apparently really good. I dont care how much the 24 team has struggled, Jeff and his fans should never settle for 13th when his teammate JJ qualified 3rd right before him. I'm pissed and I've had enough of his struggles. Put up the numbers or retire. I know it was just qualifying but I just wanted more. That's my feelings about it and no comment after this will change my mind. However, I'm fairly sure he will be good tomorrow but something will probably go wrong like always and he will be out of the chase conversation for good. I may be pessimistic or maybe just a realist. 72. joey2448 posted: 08.17.2013 - 12:05 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) I can't believe know one has mentioned this yet, but it's good to see Jeff Burton having a good qualifying run in fifth! And he's been decent in practice. Hopefully he can nab a good finish tomorrow, maybe even get a win. Jeff Gordon has been (kind of surprisingly) fast this weekend too! Cjs has constantly been saying how Gordon is 2-3 mph off his teammates (which has been true), so maybe it's not the driver after all...refuse to lose. 73. Schroeder51 posted: 08.17.2013 - 12:44 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) FOX Football Daily is already America's #1 football program, and it hasn't even begun airing yet? Sad to see what became of SPEED... 74. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 08.17.2013 - 1:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) We still have SPEED here in the Caribbean region (Bermuda), and apparently they also have it in Canada. 75. cjs3872 posted: 08.17.2013 - 1:15 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) Joey2448, I brought it up near the end of the last thread, but the reason Jimmie Johnson spins out as often as he does has to do with the way his car is set up. It's set up looser than just about every other car out there. As a result, the car is faster than just about any other car. But while a loose setup is the fastest setup, it also makes him susceptible spinning out more often because it's on the edge, and frequently, when you're on the edge, you go over the edge, and when that happens, you spin out. But Johnson's of the mindset that he'll take that chance on a faster setup, even if it means a riskier setup. A major reason Jeff Gordon's car is almost always slower than Johnson's (and Kasey Kahne's) is that Gordon prefers a setup he's comfortable with, which in his case is a tighter car, which in turn means his car's going to be a bit slower, but easier to control. After all, how often do you see Jeff Gordon lose it by himself. His problem last week was an aero-push that nobody could have expected. The same is true regarding Dale Earnhardt, Jr. He also prefers his cars to be set up tighter, which is why he rarely has the speed to win, but always manages to be there at the finish. And BON GORDON, when you're qualifying in the second half (and sometimes the back third) of the field as often as Jeff Gordon has the last couple of years on one of these ultra-fast tracks, qualifying close enough to the front to where you can actually see the race start is something he has to feel better about. Would he like to be up there in the first two or three rows? Of course he would, but 13th is a vast improvement over where he's been qualifying on this type of track. 76. murb posted: 08.17.2013 - 1:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Needless to say, I was not surprised to hear Jimmie crashed all by himself in practice. 77. ch posted: 08.17.2013 - 1:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yep, FS1 / FS 2 are only in America (and the territories). The reason Speed is still on the air in other countries is that FOX is still required to show the live Nascar that their agreement with the sport stipulates. They figured that they'd just keep the Speed name since they aren't allowed to broadcast any of FS1's other sporting events in other countries. 78. OldSchoolNascarDude1 posted: 08.17.2013 - 2:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) What all types of content will be available on the international version of Speed? 79. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 08.17.2013 - 2:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wonder if Logano can repeat his Fontana performance? I get the feeling this race will be fought out by other drivers, as Logano has not been that hot lately. In fact, he's around his usual spot in points and it doesn't look like he'll even contend for the Chase, despite showing strength earlier in the year. 80. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.17.2013 - 3:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Joey2448, I brought it up near the end of the last thread, but the reason Jimmie Johnson spins out as often as he does has to do with the way his car is set up. It's set up looser than just about every other car out there. As a result, the car is faster than just about any other car. But while a loose setup is the fastest setup, it also makes him susceptible spinning out more often because it's on the edge, and frequently, when you're on the edge, you go over the edge, and when that happens, you spin out. But Johnson's of the mindset that he'll take that chance on a faster setup, even if it means a riskier setup. A major reason Jeff Gordon's car is almost always slower than Johnson's (and Kasey Kahne's) is that Gordon prefers a setup he's comfortable with, which in his case is a tighter car, which in turn means his car's going to be a bit slower, but easier to control. After all, how often do you see Jeff Gordon lose it by himself. His problem last week was an aero-push that nobody could have expected. The same is true regarding Dale Earnhardt, Jr. He also prefers his cars to be set up tighter, which is why he rarely has the speed to win, but always manages to be there at the finish." I mentioned this several races back, but it's good to see someone else say it also. When you drive insanely loose cars, you're going to go faster than someone in an equal car set up to be tight, that's just common sense if you understand cars. However, it also makes you much more susceptible to losing control, which explains a lot of the driver errors Johnson (and Kahne to some extent) has made. I don't know why so many people still insist Hendrick is going to his engine shop and telling the guys to give his two most popular drivers lemon motors so his least two popular drivers can win races, it's a completely illogical opinion. Likewise, who knows if Chad Knaus could prepare a car for Jeff or Dale's driving style if he was paired with him as well as he can for Johnson? It's just the nature of the sport today with the box of a car that they use that a driver that can drive a loose race car will be more successful than one who prefers a tight car as the loose car can carry far more speed through the corners. A guy like Jeff has to lift more which gives him a lower exit speed which ultimately gives him less speed at the end of the straightaway. 81. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.17.2013 - 5:55 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Once again Sprint Cup has to follow a KICK ASS event in another Series. 82. I Love Japan posted: 08.17.2013 - 8:42 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Am I the only one who finds the Nationwide series more entertaining then Cup? Ha ha. Penske btw in my opinion will be the top organization in NASCAR by the end of the decade. 83. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.17.2013 - 9:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) NWide stand alone races with no notable Claim Jumpers (sorry Marcos) are a lot of fun. 84. JG24shouldbe5time posted: 08.17.2013 - 10:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Well, Fox Sports 1 has already rubbed me the wrong way. Why? Their first program was about Alabama's 2012 National Championship." Wow. Just wow. Here I thought I was joking when I said they'd over do it on college sports right after over doing it on the NFL. Here's how I see FS1's hierarchy 1) NFL t2) NCAA t2) MLB 3) UFC 4) NASCAR 5)everything else I agree with previous posters, Jeff Gordon does have a somewhat unique driving style and due to that, his setups are a bit different. I don't think I have anything else to add, so I'll leave it at that. I chuckled a little when I read that JJ spun himself...then I realized I agreed with a poster on another forum I visit; The 48 starting last just gives them more to prove. JJ is going to try and drive the wheels of the car and he's either going to pass most of the field, get up front and challenge if not win OR he could make another mistake and take part of the field with him if it's early on. I'm guessing it will be the former rather than the latter. 85. The Long Shot posted: 08.17.2013 - 11:29 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) "Here's how I see FS1's hierarchy 1) NFL t2) NCAA t2) MLB 3) UFC 4) NASCAR 5)everything else" Well, that's an improvement on ESPN, which apparently lists NASCAR somewhere around 432nd on their priorities list. 86. SpeedWorld97 posted: 08.17.2013 - 11:38 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "Well, that's an improvement on ESPN, which apparently lists NASCAR somewhere around 432nd on their priorities list." And fortnately they are above IndyCar, which lies 433rd! 87. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 12:12 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "And fortnately they are above IndyCar, which lies 433rd!" Followed by F1 in 434th, out of 434. All other forms of racing are off their radar. 88. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 12:43 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) "Followed by F1 in 434th, out of 434. All other forms of racing are off their radar." Do they ever show F1 highlights? I don't think they do. And as for other racing series, I think NHRA sits around 376th (yes, ahead of NASCAR). 89. Paul posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:22 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) This is off-topic, but for those of you who have Twitter pages, check out what Jeremy Clements and.Parker Kligerman tweeted out after the Nationwide race at Mid-Ohio. Clements was not surprisingly elated after his 10th place finish without a scratch on his unsponsored, family-owned car, and did something that I've never seen any driver do before: Reply back to everyone, including yours truly, for the kind words congratulating him on the top ten finish. I've seen drivers make a general tweet thanking the fans, and have seen some of them make a couple tweets out thanking a handful of fans directly. But I've never seen a driver thank so many people (62 to be exact) on Twitter before. I think it's obvious that that race meant a lot to Clements. As for Kligerman, he was none too happy with not just Marcos Ambrose, but all the road course ringers in general. He said that the racing at Watkins Glen was a lot cleaner because it consisted entirely of "professional stock car drivers" who, even if they weren't racing for points, had respect for each of their competitors because they see each other every week in the garage area. The ringers on the other hand show up two or three times a year for a cup of coffee and then they're gone, not caring if they had to ruffle a few feathers or cost a few drivers some points along the way (Not his words, but that's the gist of his complaints). There was even a moment where Brian Scott chimed in and jokingly asked Kligerman and Kyle Larson how much they enjoyed racing againt ringers. But here's the most interesting part to me: Kligerman was asked by a fan whether or not he was upset about AJ Allmendinger winning, considering he's only made two Nationwide starts this year; both on road courses. And Kligerman's response to that was he wasn't upset because AJ "is a professional stock car driver." Meanwhile Marcos Ambrose, the driver who ran Kligerman off the race track who also happens to be a full-time Cup driver, was put into the generad course ringer category So were Kligerman's comments just an example of a young driver venting his frustrations on having a good points day negated by someone else, or are these similar opinions that other drivers may feel towards the ringers? And if that's the case, do other drivers feel the same way about Ambrose, and think that he's not a professional stock car driver, but rather just a road course ringer? 90. Paul posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:25 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) As for ESPN, the only racing that they show as far as I'm aware are NASCAR Cup and Nationwide (I'm not sure if they talk about Trucks), IndyCar (mostly just the ABC broadcasted races), NHRA, and ALMS. 91. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:37 am Rate this comment: (3) (2) I'm with Parker, Paul. I understand that the only reason the ringers are there is to win, but the fact of the matter is that most of them drive like complete jerkoffs in every road race. We've seen it before with Boris Said at Watkins Glen, we've seen it EVERYWHERE with Jacques Villeneuve, and today Ambrose definitely did his fair share of idiotic driving (and as far as I'm concerned, Ambrose is just a road ringer that just happens to run the ovals too). The only ringer I see that really races cleanly for the most part is Ron Fellows. There are a few others too like Andrew Ranger who do a nice job of racing smart when they get rides, but like I said, the majority of the ringers ALWAYS start stuff at these road races. So I think it's cool to see guys like Parker Kligerman and Kyle Larson standing up for themselves. It's totally cool to come in and race the Nascar regulars hard for the win, but there's a difference between doing that and just flat running everyone over. 92. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:40 am Rate this comment: (2) (0) "Clements was not surprisingly elated after his 10th place finish without a scratch on his unsponsored, family-owned car" He also had the best pass differential of the race. That's impressive. 93. 18fan posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:02 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I don't watch Sportscenter anymore, but when I did I do not remember seeing any Truck highlights. As has been mentioned here before, if ESPN doesn't show something, they treat it as if it doesn't exist or barely exists (NHL falls into the latter). 94. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:20 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I didn't know ESPN showed Le Mans racing, Paul. Do they show all Le Mans events, or just a select few? Some news items: Michael Waltrip Racing and Stewart-Haas Racing are currently working on a deal to allow Mark Martin to get in the seat of the #14 for some races this season. This will not only give SHR another driver to run that #14 car while Tony Stewart is recovering from his leg injury, but it will also give Brian Vickers some more seat time in the #55 to prepare for his full-time run next year. Also, Ray Dunlap has reported that Jeb Burton will return to full-time Truck competition in 2014 while competing in select Nationwide events. With Justin Allgaier and/or Kyle Larson expected to move to Cup next season, look for James Buescher to move up to Nationwide full-time next year in one of those cars. 95. Eric posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:58 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs3872, I think your post on comment 75 is off on Jeff Gordon doesn't win much because he wanted his race car to be set up tight due to the fact Jeff Gordon won 6 races in 2007. Jeff in 2007 liked his race cars like they are now in terms of wanting his cars to be set up tight. The fact is winning 6 races in a season is a lot. I know for sure Jeff in 2002 to 2007 liked his cars tight and he was winning more than now. If you remembered the reports about Jeff Gordon from 2002 to 2007 era, Jeff admitted to wanting his cars set up tight on race day with him winning 23 times in that era. Jeff Gordon in that era made a comment to the extent that tight race cars are faster than loose race cars. What is really going on with Jeff is he's past prime as driver and isn't quite the same driver after his 2008 Las Vegas crash despite wanting cars tight like he did in 2007. Remember Jeff in 2007 wanting his race set ups tight was a 35 to 36 year old Jeff Gordon before his back got very back. 96. Eric posted: 08.18.2013 - 11:19 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs3872, I agree that loose race cars gives you more wins, but what you on why Jeff Doesn't get a lot win wins in a season is off like I tried to state on post 95. When a driver is able to get 6 wins in a season with a race car being set up tight 6 years ago like he or she wants it, I think that says something what happened to the driver outside of race set up. Remember you are dealing with a 42 year old Jeff Gordon in 2013 with past severe back problems compare to a 35/36 year Jeff Gordon in 2007. 97. Eric posted: 08.18.2013 - 11:33 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Based on Longhshot's information he mention that Ray Dunlap said, I think we got a new truck series favorite for the championship in 2014. As far as James Buescher goes, he should have been in the Nationwide series full time this season. That fact is James had 1win, 2 top 5's, and 8 top 10's in 20 Nationwide starts in 2012 while driving in the same car as Nelson Piquet, Jr. is this season. That meant Buescher in the 30 car in 2012 was better than Nelson in the 30 car in 2013. I do think if Justin Allgaier goes to cup next year, he's going to have a bad rookie season. I also don't like Kyle Larson in cup next year if it happens. Kyle Larson only has 2 years of Stock car experience. Tony Stewart raced in the Busch series from 1996 to 1998 before going to cup with him being in 36 Busch series races in 3 seasons. 98. cjs3872 posted: 08.18.2013 - 11:39 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Eric, it's a known fact that loose cars are faster than tight cars are, but not as easy to control. But what happened in 2007 was that the COT, or "Gen 5" car debuted, and that year when they ran the races with that car, it was almost impossible to make that car too loose because of the wing. Remember that in 2007, they did not run those crazy suspension setups that caused the car to track awkwardly. As a result, everyone's car was tighter, and that played right into Gordon's hands in the races they ran that particular car. Plus there were unusual circumstances involved in some of the races he won that year. At Phoenix, he was on pit road when the caution came out, which resulted in him leading on the restart. At Darlington, his crew chief leaves him out when some of the other leaders, including then-leader Jimmie Johnson pit, and he wins that race. At Pocono, which was run with the "Gen 4" car, the caution comes out for rain just as Ryan Newman is about to pass him, and in the Chase race at Charlotte, Newman has that race in the bag when he cuts a left rear tire with 2 to go, so Gordon had a number of races that we won that year that, by all rights, he should not have won, and only once, the infamous Watkins Glen race that year when he spun out, did he lose a race he should have won. But in 2008, two things which occurred at almost the same time, led to his decline. The first was his crash at Las Vegas, and the second was the way the cars were being set up, because they were being set up looser, especially with the off-set that was causing the cars to not even drive straight on the straightaways. Those two things combined were what led to Gordon's decline as a driver, though he has shown flashes of his old brilliance, but the truth is, those were only flashes. 99. cjs3872 posted: 08.18.2013 - 12:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) By the way, following up on what I said in post #30, as I said I would, the 1:30-2 pm airing of Race Hub is a one-time deal because of live coverage from Bristol. Like Tuesday, the Wednesday airings of Race Hub will be form noon-12:30pm. And by the way, if the reports are true about Mark Martin driving the #14 car after today's race until Tony Stewart is healthy, it just tells me how much respect that both Stewart and Martin have from the other parties involved, because the fact that someone from a Toyota team would be allowed to drive the #14 car, a top-tier Chevrolet, tells me just how much both Stewart and Martin are respected. I must say that I didn't see that coming. What I wonder is whether or not Martin, at his age, can be competitive, because the #55 car has, for the most part, really fallen off in the races Mark has driven it this year, while it's remained competitive and even won with Brian Vickers, and has been a top 5 car in Michael Waltrip's starts in it on the restrictor plate tracks. This might be a bigger mistake than many realize to put Mark in the #14 car, given his relative lack of competitiveness this year. 100. Eric posted: 08.18.2013 - 12:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs3872, Lets remember that while the Gen 5 car debut in 2007, Gen 4 was still in use for some the races that year. I did mention in post 95 about Jeff not being the same driver after his Las Vegas crash. Remember in 2004 Jeff Gordon won 5 races with a tight race set up in a Gen 4 car. The fact is the Gen 4 was a perfect fit for Jeff Gordon. While is well known that loose is fast, Jeff with a gen 4 car was the opposite. It also is possible that Jeff had tight set ups in cup from the beginning. 101. Eric posted: 08.18.2013 - 12:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs3872, I think Mark can be competitive in NASCAR, but in the trucks or the Nationwide. Lets remember Joe Ruttman won races in the Truck series including 2 when he was 56 years old for most of the 2001 season. Joe Ruttman also finished 3rd points. Yes, I know Hornday didn't race in that series that year. My point is the Truck Series is a series that Mark still can be competitive at his age. Remember next year that James Buescher is going to Nationwide full time and possibly Ty Dillon and that means the series might be a little weaker in drivers next year and there is going to some good driver seats opening up for the 2014 season. 102. cjs3872 posted: 08.18.2013 - 12:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You may have a point there, Eric, because Jeff has always liked to drive deeper into the corner than just about anyone else, and to do that, the car has to be set up tighter, because if you drive deep with a loose setup, the car is going to snap around on you. And in 1998, when Jeff and Mark Martin did a car swap at a test in Atlanta, Mark could not believe how tight Gordon's car was set up. And when I referred to the races Gordon won in 2007, I did mention that the race he won at Pocono was with the "Gen 4" car, though I did not mention that with his win in the Chase race at Charlotte. Of course, the "Gen 4" car was the end result of the evolution that really began with the '83 T-Bird, as far as aerodynamics are concerned. My point about the fact that the way his cars are set up preventing him from winning race has to do with that extra 1-2 MPH his car usually lacks on the high-speed tracks. However when they get to the shorter tracks, the tighter setup he prefers plays to his advantage, and as a result, it's no real surprise that his best races now come on the slower tracks, either the short tracks or at Sonoma. But when they get to the faster tracks, his tighter setups usually ends up resulting in him running about about 6th-9th with an occasional top 5 finish because of that missing 1-2 MPH in car setup. 103. Paul posted: 08.18.2013 - 12:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mark Martin was originally supposed to drive the #6 Roush truck in the Truck Series in 2007 (which is why he ran so many Truck races in 2006), but he took up an offer to drive part-time for Ginn Racing instead. If he chose a part-time average Cup ride over a championship-caliber Truck ride before, I think he would do the same again next season. A lot of Cup drivers have huge egos, and the more time they spend in Cup, the larger their egos become. I'm not saying that in a negative way, but when you've been swimming in the big pond for 15, 20, or even 25 years like Mark has, it's very hard to get out and move to a smaller pond on your own volition. And that's exactly why I don't see Jeff Burton or Bobby Labonte dropping down to a lower series either. 104. Eric posted: 08.18.2013 - 12:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs3872, As far as Mark in the 14 goes there is I have a 3 theories that you didn't mention. My first theory theory is the fact the Nationwide series has a tight points battle right now and the owners want the drivers to focus on the Nationwide series despite most of the races being companion races to cup races. My 2nd theory is Bobby Labonte isn't available for a lot of races and Stewart isn't interest in putting Schrader, or Terry Labonte in the car. My 3rd theory is Stewart Haas Racing can't get certain drivers like Justin Allgaier despite really not really being in the points race anymore. Remember It is expected that Justin is going to cup next season and I'm guessing that its the 51 car. I think we can make a connection with the 51 car if James Finch did finalize a deal. My 4th theory is Stewart my not be interested in putting full Truck Series drivers in the car even if Stewart can't be in the car for Martinsville. 105. Eric posted: 08.18.2013 - 12:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Paul, That is true enough with cup driver having big egos and not wanting to go down to the Truck series. There also is the truck series drivers are getting paid less than cup driver drivers are. The purses are smaller in the races in the trucks also. 106. Paul posted: 08.18.2013 - 12:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) By the way, for those of you saying that Kyle Larson isn't ready for Cup after just two years worth of stock car experience, just take into account that he has a Nationwide PEER of 2.977 after the Mid-Ohio race (It would probably be over 3.000 had Papis not run him off the track.). That ranks him 1st among Nationwide points eligible drivers, 6th in the Nationwide Series, and makes him the only Nationwide regular in the top 7 in PEER (He's also ranked higher than fellow sprint car ace Kasey Kahne.). I'm not normally in favor of drivers going to Cup with such little experience in stock cars, but I would make an exception for Larson. If his team was better and he didn't wreck so much early on in the season, he would be right there with the likes of Dillon, Smith, and Hornish, battling for the championship. 107. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 12:55 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) What was Joey Logano's 2008 PEER, 4.000? If that was the case, then do you also think he was ready to move up to Cup? Because that certainly worked out well. As much as I hate to break it to you guys, PEER isn't the sole way to determine how ready a driver is for Cup. 108. AveryNH posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm ecstatic to hear about Martin moving to the 14 next week at Bristol. However I feel this is his final swan song. I would love to see him run trucks next year. I remember years ago when he announced he wasn't running trucks and he'd run the 01 chevy I cried. Yes I'm not ashamed to admit that. However I still pulled for him and never cheered as hard or was as happy for him after the 2007 daytona 500. Then everyone wrote him off the year after and he left for Hendrick's 5 car as a stop gap. He shocked everyone when he finished second for his fifth runner up turned in an unimpressive 2010. He was my first hero, my first favorite driver, Mark Martin shirts, hats, die casts, books, I've got plenty of em. So I'm incredibly happy to see him get this chance. Not that the 55 isn't competitive. Obviously Vickers showed it is. In my opinion last year's Michigan race was Mark's best shot at a win in that car. I flipped away for a second, flip the channel back and he's impaled on the pit wall. Nonetheless I think he's got a few more heroics left in him. Go Mark! 109. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "What was Joey Logano's 2008 PEER, 4.000?" If you refer to those few Cup starts he made in 2008, it was -0.500. I don't know about Nationwide that season, though. "As much as I hate to break it to you guys, PEER isn't the sole way to determine how ready a driver is for Cup." No, really? 110. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Clint Bowyer spins out on the first lap. 111. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That didn't take long 112. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nice save by Clint. 113. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I did mean Nationwide PEER, David, but it doesn't matter. I apologize if I came off as rude on that last comment of mine. 114. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:32 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) This race may take a while 115. Dave #38 Fan-Go Gilliland! posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Trouble early for David Reutimann two weeks in a row. That team's had a lot of bad luck this year. I still can't believe that fired Landon Cassill to make way for Reutimann. 116. OldSchoolNascarDude1 posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This may be a long race. 117. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) BK Racing is completely luckless. 118. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Reutimann slaps the wall in Turn 2 to bring out the caution. 119. Jim Davis posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:35 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) " I still can't believe that fired Landon Cassill to make way for Reutimann." They didn't. Cassill quit when they didn't pay him. Litigation is pending. 120. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow. 121. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:39 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) At this rate, we might get to the double digits in caution flags. 122. SpeedWorld97 posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:39 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) NASCAR "fans" are probably loving this race so far. 123. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dillon and Yeley wreck. 124. Ryan posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:39 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Having 2005 Coca-Cola 600 flashbacks with this race 125. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Another example of cars going too high too early. There's absolutely no grip on the high side at the moment, and both Reutimann and Yeley wrecked as a result. Austin Dillon was an innocent victim of that last wreck, though he didn't seem to suffer much damage. 126. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:45 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Cowboy Hat has damage 127. Zackary Shawn posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:45 pm Rate this comment: (3) (3) Da Felin must be paying N$CRAP to bring out all these yellers so Canause and Jimmy, the biggest cheeters in sports and sport ruerners, can have time to cheet up theiyre car. BOOOOO Hendickxs. $$$$$$$$$$$$$ Obviously, I don't believe that but I had to take a jab at the conspiracy theorists and I saw the opportunity. 128. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Not so bold prediction : Kurt Busch will spin out at some point. 129. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) The difference clean air makes: Scott Speed is 40th, running 6th seconds behind Nemechek in 39th. He's running laptimes similar to the 20th-25th place cars. 130. Jim Davis posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:51 pm Rate this comment: (5) (0) "Austin Dillon was an innocent victim of that last wreck..." Really? To me it looked like Dillon got loose under Yeley and took both cars out. 131. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I did mean Nationwide PEER, David, but it doesn't matter. I apologize if I came off as rude on that last comment of mine." That's fine. The thing is, no rookie, no matter how experienced in NNS/NCWTS, is ever really ready for Cup. All rookies tend to struggle (except if you're Tony Stewart or Dick Hutcherson). 132. JRacingFast posted: 08.18.2013 - 1:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This is a random question that ive wondered for sometime but how does the networks who cover NASCAR assign who does the Victory lane interview? Is it a rotation are whoever is covering that drivers section of pit road? 133. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bad pit stop for the 78 I think. Shocker. 134. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:05 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Furniture Row Pit crew is junk. 135. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:05 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) Kurt Busch and Kevin Harvick: Two guys you REALLY don't want to mess up pit stops for. 136. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:06 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Good to see a Healthy crowd in Michigan today considering how bad the economy has been in that area. 137. TeamPlayersBlue posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Dale Joonyer is going to be leading after Mears pits. 138. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:08 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "That's fine. The thing is, no rookie, no matter how experienced in NNS/NCWTS, is ever really ready for Cup. All rookies tend to struggle (except if you're Tony Stewart or Dick Hutcherson)." That is usually the case, but there are many exceptions in addition to the two you mentioned, especially in recent years. Dale Earnhardt Jr. won 2 races + The Winston, Matt Kenseth won the World 600, Kevin Harvick finished in the top 10 in points and won 2 races, Jimmie Johnson finished 5th in points with 3 wins and actually led the points with just a few races left, Ryan Newman finished 6th in points with 1 win and had 14 top 5s, Kasey Kahne had 5 2nd place finishes and 13 total top 5s, and Denny Hamlin finished 3rd in points with 2 wins. It's only in the past 5 or so years that there just haven't been many rookie drivers coming up with competitive teams. I think had Danica Patrick and Ricky Stenhouse been rookies 20 years ago (both are actually on par with Brad Keselowski's rookie season), their seasons would be considered typical. It's just that the early 2000s and the litany of competitive rookies to come up changed the expectations many have of rookies. 139. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:09 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Johnson is in the pits with the hood up. 140. SpeedWorld97 posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:09 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Johnson is having engine issues. 141. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:09 pm Rate this comment: (5) (3) Happy days are here again 142. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Problems for Android #1. 143. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This could be bad news for Junior and Gordon, not the first time a Hendrick engine has had problems this weekend, and when Hendrick motors have problems, they usually do so in bunches. 144. Chad's Hair Plugs posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:10 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) Too bad this is happening on August 18th and not October 18th. 145. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I will say though, that was a pretty insane charge up to the top ten. 146. Rexrobe posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I really wanted Johnson do to well... I am worried he is getting through all his bad luck before the Chase starts. 147. joey2448 posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jimmie Johnson and Michigan... 148. SpeedWorld97 posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This isn't a good sign for Gordon, Jr., and Kahne who all need to make sure they have a good day for their chase hopes. 149. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:14 pm Rate this comment: (1) (2) "That is usually the case, but there are many exceptions in addition to the two you mentioned, especially in recent years." Sure, but you can't predict that kind of thing. Johnson has engine problems? WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!! 150. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:15 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "Really? To me it looked like Dillon got loose under Yeley and took both cars out." You may be right. I didn't get that good of a look at it, so I'm not that sure. "The thing is, no rookie, no matter how experienced in NNS/NCWTS, is ever really ready for Cup." Exactly the point I was trying to make. Kyle Larson is maturing, but there's absolutely no way he's ready for Cup yet. And when Paul used PEER stats to back himself up, I had to laugh, not because his stats are B.S. (because they're not; Paul's pretty doggone smart when it comes to auto racing), but just because the majority of people on here seem to think that David Smith and his PEER rankings are divine. I'll agree that his writing is better than the majority of NASCAR analysts, but I'm not going to say he's great or anything. "All rookies tend to struggle (except if you're Tony Stewart or Dick Hutcherson)." Yeah, but Stewart and Hutcherson had a lot of prior racing experience, didn't they? Stewart did, obviously, but I'm not sure about Hutcherson. 151. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Caution is out for Ricky Stenhouse hitting the wall. 152. WinstonCup4Ever posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This is the 2008 Brickyard 400 all over again. 153. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "but I'm not sure about Hutcherson" Oh, yes. In fact, he was a former IMCA champion, which is why he was ruled ineligible for the Rookie of the Year award. 154. Zackary Shawn posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "This is the 2008 Brickyard 400 all over again." Not quite... 155. The Long Shot Trolling as NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:23 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Piss off, Johns...damn, too late. 156. WinstonCup4Ever posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Let Tony Stewart and his ranting about Goodyear begin. @154: I'll agree to an extent. 157. Anthony posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (10) Jimmie blows up. Jeff Gordon very calm Dale Jr trying to win yes WHU BOUT A restart 158. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:28 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "WHU BOUT A restart" Huh? 159. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:35 pm Rate this comment: (5) (0) I can't believe I forgot to mention this, but good luck to Onion on today's broadcast. And for the record, Onion's Hungarian, and he speaks better English than some of the Americans on here (*cough* *cough* Anthony *cough* *cough*). 160. BON GORDON posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:36 pm Rate this comment: (3) (6) And BIG surprise Gordon is struggling. Park the car and put Kyle Larson in. He would get the team a Top ten. 161. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I can't believe I forgot to mention this, but good luck to Onion on today's broadcast." I forgot, too. Must have been the exciting races yesterday. 162. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Caution for "debris". 163. Chad's Hair Plugs posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mark Martin got screwed. 164. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Time now for the semi-annual "screw over Mark Martin" fake debris caution. 165. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:46 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) Onion is probably killing it on that broadcast. Came back in time to see a debris caution. On the bright side though, my Kurt Busch pick is looking pretty good. 166. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Didn't Mark get the free pass though? 167. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I had low expectations for Kurt's pit stop. And it was even worse. 168. AveryNH posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Indeed he did get the free pass. Probably the last time most of the leaders take left side tires. I expect two tires here on out 169. Ched Little posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "And BIG surprise Gordon is struggling. Park the car and put Kyle Larson in. He would get the team a Top ten. " Seriously? This is Jeff freaking Gordon. Larson's still a USAC boy, which means he still wants that thing set up the opposite of Jeff. 170. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:52 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) And BIG surprise Gordon is struggling. Park the car and put Kyle Larson in. He would get the team a Top ten. And that folks is high quality satire. 171. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (3) Gordon's not even going to finish in the top 20 today. This will almost certainly be the race that eliminates him from Chase contention. 172. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:57 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) What I've learned in 15 years of watching is that you can't count the 24 out until it's over. 173. Ched Little posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:57 pm Rate this comment: (7) (1) Quit being so negative. With a fan base as faithless as this, no wonder he struggles. 174. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 2:59 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) It took Jeff a whole half lap to pass The Baroness. Maybe he is done. 175. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Quit being so negative. With a fan base as faithless as this, no wonder he struggles." My apologies. I didn't realize the fans were the ones driving Gordon's car. 176. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:01 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) "With a fan base as faithless as this, no wonder he struggles." I, for one, have plenty of faith in his ability to wheel a racecar. 177. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:02 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm not being negative, I'm being REALISTIC. The performance he's put forth today has been absolutely awful. 178. BON GORDON posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (2) Get a dose of reality Ched. Its more like his team sucks, his cars suck, and Gordon is no spring chicken anymore. You can take your faith and watch Jeff finish 20th today, Wreck at Bristol, and run terrible at Atlanta and Richmond. I can be negative if I want. I even thought Gordon would be better than this. I figured around 4th or so. Not gonna happen today. If there's a caution late in the race and towards the end of a run Gordon should just stay out. He'll get a better finish. They need to do something cause it isn't looking good. 179. AveryNH posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Special shout out to Burton's teammate Paul Menard running fifth currently 180. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:08 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Junior crashes. 181. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Dale Jr crashes. That sucks. 182. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:09 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Junior crashed. Now he might be in danger of dipping outside the top 10 in points... 183. Jim Davis posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Patrick should be the lucky dog. 184. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:11 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) It's always awesome for me to see Burton running this well. All we need is the Exide paint scheme and it would be all set. 185. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) ...And just as I say that he comes off pit road WAY behind. 186. Chad's Hair Plugs posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Burton took 4 tires, he's now 15th-16th. 187. AveryNH posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Burton takes four and plummets out of the top ten. Stupid pit call there. 4 tires hardly give you any advantage. 188. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:12 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Bro Jackson is looking like a prophet now. 189. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:12 pm Rate this comment: (7) (4) Joonyerr's tire failures are more awesomer than Gordon's tire failures. GORDON SUCKS!! JOONYERR RULES!! GORDON IS GAY!! JOONYERR IS THE BEST!! *throws Budweiser can on track* 190. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Burton took 4 tires while everybody else took 2. That might ruin his chances of battling for a win today. 191. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:14 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Is Bro Jackson one of the so-called "Racing Gods"? If Junior actually misses the Chase, we're going to ALL look foolish when we doubted him. 192. AveryNH posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:15 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Burton did the same thing earlier today, got bit bad, fell back deep and methodically worked his way up back into the top five. Now once again they take four tires?! Ughh 193. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) What the hell? Gordon is up to 12th? 194. Ched Little posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:20 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) "run terrible at Atlanta and Richmond" You, sir, need to actually follow the races via ESPN or Live Leaderboard and not just sit here and act like you're Mr. Genius as Gordon runs 12th, catching Kurt Busch. 195. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kenseth is just lurking in 3rd. That is not a good sign for everyone else. 196. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:21 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) "If Junior actually misses the Chase, we're going to ALL look foolish when we doubted him." They laughed at Jor-El on Krypton... 197. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bobby Labonte spins out and brings out another caution. 198. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bobby Labonte spins. 199. Mr X posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Being as Gordon has taken 4 tires every stop today I'm pretty sure that he took two on the last one and now he has some track position, hopefully he can do something with it. 200. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "You, sir, need to actually follow the races via ESPN or Live Leaderboard and not just sit here and act like you're Mr. Genius as Gordon runs 12th, catching Kurt Busch." Okay, now...we can calm down now. Nothing to get riled about here. 201. Ched Little posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hypnotist: "Relax. Relaaaax. Reeeeeelaaaaaaax!" Me: *falls asleep* 202. DB1995 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) has Brad Keselowski took 4 tires even once today? 203. BON GORDON posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:27 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You know what's funny I am watching the race on ESPN and Gordon had a solid two tire stop, passed two guys who had a sub par restart, and now can't pass anyone else. I think their car is a little better but still way way off. He can't pass when the cars get strung out. I know a lot about Gordon and 12th sucks. Especially when Busch, Logano, and Kahne are ahead of him and guys like Newman are right on his heels. If he gets a Top ten out of this I will say I spoke to soon. 204. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:27 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) I know people like DSFF and murb won't like this, but Joey Logano fully deserves to win this race. He's run in the top 5 for all but about 10 laps, and he's led a fairly size-able portion of it as well. Kurt Busch, Dale Jr., Jimmie Johnson, Jeff Burton, and Greg Biffle have all had chances to win, but none of them have managed to capitalize. If anyone deserves the victory today, it's Logano. 205. Benjamin Lowe posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:29 pm Rate this comment: (0) (2) I hate to say this but maybe Hendrick should do to Gordon what Jerry Jones did to Tom Landry. 206. Ched Little posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:29 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) @204: as of the present moment, I concur. 207. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I know people like DSFF and murb won't like this, but Joey Logano fully deserves to win this race." I don't mind him at all really when he's winning CUP races (you know, the races that actually matter). He has been strong today. It could happen, and I wouldn't really mind it at all. Kenseth just lost about ten spots on that restart. 208. cjs3872 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And could Gordon's struggles have anything to do with being ultra-conservative, knowing there were going to be problems with the right front tire due to the speeds? Maybe he just didn't want to run very hard because he wanted to be there at the end. With the number of teams that have had right front tire issues, that's certainly a possibility. It was just reported that Kyle Busch had a blistering right front tire, though it could be a defect in the sidewall of the tire, as was just shown. 209. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:31 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Gordon lost about 13 spots on the restart. Even BoB got around him! 210. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle Busch in the wall!! 211. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle Busch spins, and almost gets t-boned about six times. 212. BON GORDON posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:32 pm Rate this comment: (2) (2) And Gordon just had a terrible restart. What a joke. Can't even keep track position. And your 20th place driver today is.....Jeff Gordon. 12-23 in one lap!!! 213. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And Kyle Busch backs it in the wall. I think Gordon HAS to pit under this caution. 214. Ryan posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wow that could have been really bad 215. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle wrecks and almost gets t-boned by David Stremme. 216. Chad's Hair Plugs posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) BK's playing the gas game...again. 217. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:34 pm Rate this comment: (2) (1) My not so bold prediction came true *hopes nobody goes back and reads I said Kurt, not Kyle* 218. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I still like Kurt Busch though if he can get back to clean air. I don't think that will happen though, especially when you consider his pit crew keeps losing him spots on every stop. Some guys stayed out, some guys took no tires. This is gonna get interesting. 219. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Maybe he just didn't want to run very hard because he wanted to be there at the end." Which is exactly his style. This kind if run is nothing new for Jeff. "I know people like DSFF and murb won't like this, but Joey Logano fully deserves to win this race." Sure. He had probably the best race of his career at Fontana earlier his year. I wouldn't have minded if he had won that. 220. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:36 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Keselowski, Martin, Almirola, Ragan stay out. 221. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon is now the next to last car on the lead lap as he made a lengthy pit stop. 222. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:37 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Hey, maybe Aric can get a good finish from this. For the great start they had to the year they've fallen off quite considerably. I'd love to see him get something good today. 223. OldSchoolNascarDude1 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm willing to bet that not everyone will/can make it on fuel, unless the caution trend continues. 224. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) *of* I can't even blame my Kindle for that error this time. Mark Martin is second?? Wow. 225. Ched Little posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) David, your grammar was perfect in 219. 226. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gilliland blows up. 227. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gilliland blows up. 228. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:43 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yikes, we just posted the same exact comment. 229. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Yikes, we just posted the same exact comment." lol, Usually it's me and David that do that. Still green after Gilliland's problem though. 230. Benjamin Lowe posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (2) Someone needs to give Gordon an ultimatum either run more harder and flat out on the faster tracks & don't act like a pansy on the restarts. Or face the cold hard alternative which is being fired. 231. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "David, your grammar was perfect in 219." Was that sarcastic? I don't mind if it was. Anyway, I'll be the first to admit that I don't have perfect grammar 100% of the time. I do try to be perfect on spelling in most of my posts, and in the case of #219, I typed "if run" when I meant "of run". 232. OldSchoolNascarDude1 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Caution. 233. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Caution out for Kyle Busch crashing a second time. 234. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Another spin for Kyle Busch. Didn't hit anything this time though. 235. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle spins. 236. Ched Little posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gotcha, Davis 237. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brad pits? 238. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Keselowski pits. 239. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kyle was running so low, you wonder whether or not he hit oil from the 38 car. Anyways, this will help Keselowski and Co. make it to the end on fuel, but it will also give drivers like Harvick and Logano a chance to catch back up. 240. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Does this count as my not so bold prediction? Does two Kyle Busch spins equal one Kurt Busch spin? 241. Chad's Hair Plugs posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:50 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) C'mon Mark. If the 55 gets a 2nd win, they'll probably have a chance to run for the owners chase title. 242. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Brad pits? Okaaayy. 243. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Usually it's me and David that do that" We were in rare form last fall on the Kansas race page. 244. joey2448 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:54 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) C'mon Logano, win this one for me! 245. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:54 pm Rate this comment: (3) (3) Jeff definitely needs to get a spine behind the scenes. He needs to tell The Felon to give him a real crew chief or else he'll drive the 42 next year. 246. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:54 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kurt Busch back to 2nd. Still sticking with him. 247. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) As much as Martin winning would be cool, that would mean Handsome Harry Gant's record would be broken. 248. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Martin would be the oldest race winner in Cup history, hope he can pull it off somehow. Go Mark! 249. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Now Kurt's falling off. It would be cool to see Mark win though. 250. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Here's to hoping Mark can win, and that Brad drives as hard as humanly possible now that he has enough fuel. 251. joey2448 posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:58 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Pocono 2012, anyone? 252. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:58 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Nice comeback for Cowboy Hat, who crashed earlier. 253. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Pocono 2012, anyone?" Looks like it's shaping up to be a similar finish. 254. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (10) I must make a comment on this page soon. 255. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.18.2013 - 3:59 pm Rate this comment: (4) (13) Piss off, Logano! 256. Ched Little posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Go Batman! 257. Ryan W posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:02 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) This has a chance to have a great ending... 10 to go! 258. AveryNH posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:03 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) The things I would do to see Martin win again. Man c'mon! 259. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) How many cars will run out of gas? 260. Bro Jackson posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:03 pm Rate this comment: (2) (5) What'd I tell ya? 261. Ched Little posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (6) Didn't take long for NRF's trolls to come back. Stay away, bud. Come on Mark, you can do it. 262. joey2448 posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:05 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) NicoRosbergFan, sorry but I just had to thumbs down your comment, just for the tradition. Makes me feel so gushy inside... 263. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NOOOOOO!!!!!! 264. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mark's out. 265. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DAMN IT!!!!! 266. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:06 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Joey Logano to the lead. Could he win and possibly get himself in the Chase? 267. Anonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Mark's out of fuel 268. AveryNH posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Damnit. Well it was worth a shot. 269. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) As expected as that was, it still sucks. It would have been awesome to see Mark win. 270. Ched Little posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Vulture time 271. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:07 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "What'd I tell ya?" You're a little late, but yes, your prediction is starting to look more accurate. 272. Ched Little posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:09 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) Sucky way to end, but Logano entirely deserved this one. 273. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:09 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) YESSSS!!! Absolutely elated right now! 274. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Logano wins. I feel pretty confident Logano will get in the Chase. 275. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:09 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) Logano wins. Nice to see him get a well deserved CUP win after all of his meaningless NNS wins. A wholehearted congratulations to him from me. 276. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:09 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Logano wins. He deserved it. 277. Bro Jackson posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:10 pm Rate this comment: (3) (10) Congrats to Logano. My apologies for being late, but it appears my prediction will easily come true. 278. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Gordon is now 26 points out of 10th. Not good for his chances... 279. Word Up! posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) WHEELMAN JOEY! 280. AveryNH posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:10 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Can't say I'm too disappointed. Logano deserved this win. Although this really shakes up the wild card race. 281. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:11 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Logano certainly earned this win, good for him. Could this be a floodgate win for him like Brad's win at Pocono in 2011? All he likely needs would be to do this again once more at Atlanta (can't see him winning at a short track) to be in the Chase. 282. joey2448 posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:11 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) FINALLY!!! I picked a winner this year! Good job Joey! Now his teammate Brad needs to win. 283. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:12 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Despite my elation for Logano getting his first victory with Penske, I do feel really bad for Mark Martin. Like Ched Little said, it was a sucky way to end for him. 284. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "YESSSS!!! Absolutely elated right now!" Alex absolutely called the winner on Tuesday when he posted the predictions for this weekend. That's why he's so happy. 285. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) All frustration aside about the #55 running out of gas, Logano ran a good race and proved me wrong regarding comment #79. I definitely would have rather seen someone else win, but for him and the team it is a deserving win. 286. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That could very well be Mark Martin's final opportunity to win a race. Makes it all the more disappointing to see him run out of gas, even if Logano deservedly won. 287. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Yeah, the more I think about it, the more I'm depressed about Mark losing. Mega heartbreaker. 288. BON GORDON posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Wanted Martin to win. Today was pretty bad for Gordon. Ran terrible and finished 17th, Truex, Newman, Kahne, Kurt Busch finished ahead of him, and Logano won. Gordon has about a 15-20% chance of making the chase this season. As a Gordon fan I'm just tired of this every week. I really shouldn't have watched this. I'm kinda bummed out. 289. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:15 pm Rate this comment: (5) (1) Lol, Joey is the one to save The Captain from a winless season. But hey, Brad has 4 Nationwide wins. In a row! So he is still having a great season *EPIC FART NOISE* 290. RCRandPenskeGuy posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Now his teammate Brad needs to win." Hopefully that will come next week at Bristol, where he has shown lots of strength. I never would have thought Joey would win before Brad, and honestly the thought of that happening depressed me. I still have hope Brad will win before the year's out. 291. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And Joey definitely did a great job. He deserved this one. He didn't need a miracle rain storm or to lay the wood to a legend. Congrats to him. I'm gonna go find some rat poison to swallow now. 292. Benjamin Lowe posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You know I'm thinking of confronting Brad after this season ends and give him the ass-kicking of a lifetime for his miserable failure to defend his championship 293. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Alex absolutely called the winner on Tuesday when he posted the predictions for this weekend. That's why he's so happy." I'm not going to deny that that is part of the reason, but Logano is my favorite "non-underdog" driver, so that's mainly why I'm so happy. But yes, I think that pick alone deserves MIPA of the year. Only 2 other people had even predicted Logano to finish inside the Top 10 until qualifying ended. 294. cjs3872 posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Not only does Joey Logano's win shake up the Chase situation, but so do two other things, Dale Earnhardt, Jr.'s crash and Kurt Busch's third place finish that puts him in the top ten in points. Now I don't think Logano gets in Chase position yet with this win, but it's close. And Schroeder51, I predicted that Gordon would fall back at Michigan, but this is about the worst possible scenario for him, Kurt getting into the top ten, Joey Logano winning a race, and Gordon falling 25+ points behind 10th, since it's unlikely he'll win, and now winning a race may not be enough for him. the only saving grace for someone in his position is that dale Earnhardt, Jr. may have opened up another position in the bottom of the top ten in the points standings for those below tenth to go for, and Matt Kenseth didn't exactly do himself any favors where that's concerned, either with a mid-teens finish. If he gets in a wreck at Bristol or has problems at Atlanta, his top ten position is also in jeopardy. Remember that before this race, Dale, Jr. was just 47 points to the good and Kenseth 36 points to the good. Both lost ground today, though Kenseth lost less than Dale, Jr. did. Believe it or not, positions all the way up through sixth could now be in play, which will make it significantly easier for those trying to get into the top ten. 295. Jim Davis posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:20 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) Roush has to be frustrated. "Ford wins at Michigan" is usually a feather in his cap. 296. Chad's Hair Plugs posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jr's only 20 points in front of 11th now. 297. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:22 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Mark Martin: Class Act 298. New14 & 88Fan posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) A Mark Martin would of been soooo awesome, still congrats to Logano and the #22 team. With Allemdinger winning at Mid-Ohio this was a great weekend for Penske Racing. 299. Jarrett88fan posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well, if this was the last race for Mark Martin in the #55 car and quite possibly the last best chance to win another Cup race, they went out on top leading the race. With fuel to the finish, Mark likely wins due to clean air. Soul crushing finish to say the least. 300. JG24shouldbe5time posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Congrats to Logano, happy he got a win. Hate to see that it was at the expense of Mark Martin though. Gordon needed a much better finish than that. I'm not saying he's done yet, but its looking more and more like it. I'd like to see him put something together late in the season so they have some "momentum" for 2014 whether they make the Chase or not. JPM finished 11th...you know the guy that's getting unceremoniously drummed out of his seat at the end of 2013? Nap time's motor detonation was great. I wish I was watching as it happened. 301. Benjamin Lowe posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:25 pm Rate this comment: (2) (3) Jeff Gordon is in the words of General Patton: A yellow bellied gutless coward. 302. Ched Little posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Yeah, since according to ESPN NNS wins are equal or better than Cup wins, Special K's in great shape 303. Anthony posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (3) What a slap in the face for Jeff Gordon We're done. Jeff Gordon might not make it. 304. AveryNH posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:25 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Damn Paul Menard finished fourth. Helluva run for him. 305. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "But yes, I think that pick alone deserves MIPA of the year." In my defense, my pick of Buescher to win the Truck race yesterday was pretty darn impressive (even after qualifying), considering that there were two truck-whackers in the race and everybody else except riven3d (who picked Jeb Burton) picked one of those two to win. 306. Anthony posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (4) Joey cost Jeff Gordon a chase right there. 307. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Cjs, I won't count Gordon out until we find out how well he does at Atlanta. If he wins, he's certainly still in the running. If he doesn't win, but finishes in the Top 5, well, you never know. There's always Richmond. But if he finishes outside the Top 5, then his season's D-O-A, to put it in medical terms that DSFF would understand. 308. Schroeder51 posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Personally, I think Kurt Busch and Joey Logano will race their way into the Chase, while Kahne and Biffle will end up making it with the Wild Cards. I also think Newman, Truex, and Gordon are all going to end up falling short. That's my personal opinion. If I'm wrong...you can all come back and laugh at this post! 309. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This was actually a pretty good race though. The racing itself wasn't great (it was good, but not great), but all the differing strategies made this one pretty interesting. 310. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "In my defense, my pick of Buescher to win the Truck race yesterday was pretty darn impressive (even after qualifying), considering that there were two truck-whackers in the race and everybody else except riven3d (who picked Jeb Burton) picked one of those two to win." It's ironic that with two "Buschwhackers" in the field, a guy named "Buesch-er" wins the race. But yes, that was a pretty doggone impressive pick by you, David. Well, come end of the season, we'll all find out who really had the most impressive picks of the year. 311. Anonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:31 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) >Congrats to Logano. My apologies for being late, but it appears my prediction will easily come true. I think you're too early to make that prediction. There's still Bristol, Atlanta, and Richmond. You never know, but he can score three top 5s in a row. He had one of the best cars before the tire issue, yet you're going to sit there and say things like, "Jr. keeps missing setups left and right." There's a possibility you may end up correct, but it's still to early to jump to conclusion. Who knows, Jr. can end up winning next week and then everything changes. 312. Anonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I can see Joey winning a short track remember he finished 3rd at Richmond ran great at Bristol and led the most laps at Bristol last fall, but if a Penske car is gonna win at Bristol it needs to be Keselowski cause ill be there 313. Bro Jackson posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (5) @311, we'll see. I say he gets 1 top-10 before the Chase at most but misses the Chase by 1-10 points, maybe more. That team has some sort of curse or something over it. When they run well something breaks, falls off, is run over, or they're crashed. When nothing fails, they run poorly. That's the mark of a team undeserving of being in the Chase, and when we look at the standings after Richmond, Dale Jr. won't be wearing a Chase hat. I know it's an unpopular opinion and it keeps being attacked, but it's what's gonna happen. 314. pimmy posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That sucked for Martin, but it was still better to see Logano win than Harvick. It was quite surprising to see Ambrose finish 6th. 315. 83andJoe posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #9 sponsor: DeWalt/Stanley Tools #33 sponsor: Circle Sport 316. We need more Onion posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:50 pm Rate this comment: (5) (0) Hell yeah! Really nice race, although I had to sound excited for the winner, but at least I got to praise Mears running constantly in the top 25, every week, with such little money. Today was a good day. 317. cjs3872 posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And after a miserable week, Marcos Ambrose was sixth, AveryNH, as there were a number of surprises coming from this race. It should not be a surprise that Ambrose fared as well as he did, considering hustling the car seemed to be a prerequisite this weekend, and Ambrose can hustle a car almost as good as anyone on the NASCAR circuit today. I also wonder if NASCAR's going to make a spring and shock change for future races at Michigan and Pocono to stabilize the cars, because when drivers like Jimmie Johnson (on Saturday), Clint Bowyer, and Kyle Busch all lose it on their own, something's wrong. I know if I was a NASCAR official, I would seriously look into such a change to get the rear spoiler into the air, because as David Hobbs once put it, they were running like motorboats out there today. I think if they raise the rear end of the cars, it could make for better racing because it would slow the cars down somewhat, and make them more stable. When some of the top drivers have problems spinning out on their own, you know you've got problems. At least it was a safe race, and with all the spin outs and tire problems, at least the race was safe. And The Long Shot (#307), I never said it was over for Jeff Gordon, but the combination of things that happened could not have been any worse for him than what happened today. Logano won, Kurt Busch got into the top ten, knocking Martin Truex, Jr. out, and he had a predictable day of running outside the top 15, because he does not like the way the cars are set up. He's one of those drivers that would prefer a rule change to stiffen up the rear end of the car so more air hits the rear spoiler. But all I said was that just winning a race may not be enough now because of the fact that three drivers that have won and are outside the top ten in the standings are now in front of him in points. And this could not have been a good day for Jack Roush, but it was predictable. Not only does Penske win with Joey Logano, but even RPM finished ahead of Roush with Marcos Ambrose at Roush's backyard, simply because of Roush's conservative tuning of his engines. I've mentioned numerous times how Rush's struggles in the Nationwide Series can partly be attributed to his conservative engine tuning, but it really sowed up today. And unfortunately, this probably cost Mark Martin a championship on more than one occasion, because the cars were not as fast as they could have been. I believe this is also what cost Carl Edwards the title in 2011, and was really exposed earlier this season with the way Matt Kenseth ran. Kyle Petty may have said it best when he said, in an indirect way, that Roush does no give his drivers everything they need to win, and he probably never has. Finishing third among the Ford teams today has to be like a punch in the gut to him. 318. joey2448 posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jeff Gordon was competitive at the Bristol race in March, and I can almost guarantee you he will be competitive at Atlanta (maybe not a win, but a top-10, probably a top-five). I just don't know how he'll do at Richmond, since he wasn't all that competitive last April. But since it's Jeff Gordon we're talking about, I think we can expect him to rebound. 319. Anonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 4:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) For a serviceable driver and a guy who had a great run in the truck race here yesterday, Brendan Gaughan did absolutely nothing in the #51 today. 320. Anonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 5:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Good job to Logano for winning, in other sports the pirates 2nd half collapse has begun. 321. b4il3y posted: 08.18.2013 - 5:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) So..Dillon wrecks, comes back and still finishes ahead of Danica. Just throwing it out there. 322. nascarfreak99 posted: 08.18.2013 - 5:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) #321, even Stenhouse had a tire go down and smack the wall, and still finished ahead of Danica. 323. Jarrett88fan posted: 08.18.2013 - 5:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) We might be in store for a Denny Hamlin sighting at Bristol. Seriously, the effects of California still resonate with that driver and team? Michigan and California are sister tracks and that didn't effect Logano today, the same Joey Logano who has flourished since the Bristol/California incidents. The #22 Cup team has found a little consistency since Indy, while Hamlin had two good runs at Darlington and Charlotte before the crash at Dover which might have taken a greater toll on him as an athlete. 324. Jarrett88fan posted: 08.18.2013 - 5:17 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) In addition, the entire #31 team and Jeff Burton had an all-around excellent weekend. 325. Loose Lugnuts posted: 08.18.2013 - 5:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I hope you guys don't mind helping out someone who is new to commenting on this forum. I've had the hardest time accessing this comments page each week before the end of the race. Can you help out here? Much thanks ahead of time. 326. The Long Shot posted: 08.18.2013 - 5:42 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Loose Lugnuts, if you go to the site's home page about an hour or two after qualifying has ended, you should see a link under "New on the site:". It should look something like this: [Cup] "[insert race here] qualifying results" Click on that link, and you should be taken to a page with the qualifying results. The comments button will be on the top left. Hope this helps, and welcome to the forum! 327. Loose Lugnuts posted: 08.18.2013 - 5:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Ambrose had a hell of a run today with that 6th place finish, but how many times did the ESPN booth bozos mention his name during the broadcast? Once? Twice? Couldn't have been more than that. You figured that once Bent Sh!tcan's engine blew up early in the race they'd turn their attention to everybody else, but they tended to concentrate on The Felon's other drivers unless they absolutely had to mention a driver from another organization. 328. Loose Lugnuts posted: 08.18.2013 - 5:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Thanks Long Shot. I really appreciate that! I get on this comment page after every race, but I keep forgetting to ask how to access it earlier in the week. 329. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 5:53 pm Rate this comment: (1) (7) Jeff has to grow a spine and stand up to The Felon. Threaten to publicly sign with the 42 team. What would publicity conscious Rick do then even though Jeff would be violating his contract? Take Jeff to court? He has so much leveragd with The Felon, but won't use it. Either stand up for yourself or get out of the way. 330. Anonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 5:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Has a driver ever missed the chase with a lead like Junior had a couple weeks ago? 331. BON GORDON posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:03 pm Rate this comment: (1) (6) Agree with DSFF 100%. Gordon has no chance at ever being seriously competitive or challenging for another championship under Rick Hendrick. Gordon is clearly the worst car at Hendrick Motorsports and Ricks last priority. Forget the lifetime contract, move on and go to an owner who appreciates him. This problem is bigger than a crew chief. Gordon is still a good driver but I could take a 1997 Saturn Sl1 and beat Gordon at a lot of these tracks. I hope Jeff sees the light and leaves that a**hole. 332. BON GORDON posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (2) And while Rick loves Jeff and considers him his son, not all four cars can be competitive and Gordon is clearly getting the short end of that stick. Its a business and its all about $$$$$$. 333. Loose Lugnuts posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:09 pm Rate this comment: (1) (4) In years past, it's been the 5 car that's been The Felon's R&D car during the year, trying new engines, new set-ups, etc. for the benefit of the 48 (everything that gets done at HMS is done for the 48 team's benefit). This year, it looks like the 48 is the "guinea pig" car. It's not Alan Gustafson's fault; he's doing the best he can with what he's given. The problem is that he's not given much to work with. 334. Loose Lugnuts posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:10 pm Rate this comment: (0) (2) Oops... I meant the 24 is the guinea pig car; obviously it's not the 48. 335. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:13 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) They should make an anti-HMS t-shirt that says "24 Is The New 25" on it. lol Seriously though, I'm not counting Jeff out until the checkered flag flies at Richmond. I've seen him come back from ridiculous odds too many times before, including just one year ago. 336. BON GORDON posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Agreed. You all can hate my comments all you want but the proof is on the race track. Change is needed, change can get Gordon a second life and a chance at another title. I want to see him win one more time or at least have a chance. He deserves that much. The #24 is definitely the R&D car this season. 337. Loose Lugnuts posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:17 pm Rate this comment: (1) (4) Since I'm new to posting on this board, I'll list my favorite and least-favorite drivers so you guys can see where I'm coming from with some of my comments (consider this a partial introduction): Favorites: Martin, Bowyer, Keselowski, Kenseth, Ambrose, Edwards, Biffle Least favorites: Johnson, Patrick, both Busch brothers, Harvick, Montoya Couldn't give two sh!ts about either way: Kahne, Junior, Menard, Logano, Hamlin I have nicknames for a lot of these guys (and the one gal) that I use in the columns I write, but I won't use them here (well, I did use my nickname for Johnson in comment #327). 338. Jarrett88fan posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Jimmie wouldn't be in the #48 car if it wasn't for Jeff paving the way for him. Hopefully, despite all the odds of being the guinea pig car, having average equipment, and a steep mountain to climb the next three weeks, the #24 can make the Chase. Realistically speaking, how many times do you have to go to the well before the well drys up this time? A first ballot HOF legend of the sport shouldn't have to shoulder his team this many times to make the goddamn Chase. A threat of retirement should be in order, will it happen? Not likely. 339. Bro Jackson posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (2) Gordon could make the Chase. I can see it happening, but it's not likely. His teammate in 7th will be 11th-14th after Richmond and will be the odd man out, and Gordon himself is just about out of it now. Personally, I'm looking forward to seeing the real Chase, Chase Elliott, in a Hendrick Cup car. 340. Loose Lugnuts posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (2) If he doesn't make the Chase this year, Jeffy's wife will probably try to talk him into retiring. Realistically, he's not going to win another championship, he's got more money than he needs, and he's got two small children at home that he needs to spend more time with. 341. cjs3872 posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well BON GORDON, Richard Petty actually did that in the 80s. After the 1983 season, he left Petty Enterprises an drove two years for Mike Curb (1984-'85), and it was there that Petty scored the final two wins of his career. In 1984, he scored his final two wins with engines built by Robert Yates, who was also building engines for DiGard Racing, but by the end of the '84 season, Curb had aligned himself with Dan Gurney, so they had Gurney build the engines for Petty in '85, and that was a disaster because they couldn't keep one together, and Petty returned to his old team, as did crew chief Dale Inman, and while there were flashes of the Petty of old with some second and third place finishes, they never won again. The thing with Hendrick Motorsports is that they clearly have an "A" squad and a "B" squad, and it's told in who's in what shop. Jimmie Johnson and Dale, Jr. are the "A" squad and Kasey Kahne and Jeff Gordon are the "B" squad. But what screwed Gordon up more than anything else, and it was something Hendrick could not have foreseen when he did the team swaps after the 2010 season that clearly benefitted Gordon in 2011, was how Kasey Kahne bringing Kenny Francis along with him would affect things at the 5/24 shop, and it really torpedoed Gordon more than anyone could have expected. I believe that, along with the fact that Alan Gustafson can't do well with any driver for more than one year, are what's behind Gordon's decline in how he's run, and it's obvious to everyone that the Gordon/Gustafson pairing has run it's course. Obvious to everyone that is, except those in charge of HMS. But if Gordon doesn't make the Chase, I expect to see some changes over there. This is the worst year of his career, and the proof lies in this one statistic. He's led 151 laps this season, and 96 of them came in two races, the Daytona 500 and the spring race at Bristol. Last year wasn't much better, as he led just 568 laps, with well over 300 of them coming in one race at Martinsville. On another note, I wonder how Denny Hamlin is going to inject himself into the race to the Chase, especially now since Joey Logano's win puts him right in the mix. You know that Hamlin would like nothing better than to be the one that costs Logano a shot at the Chase this year. I look for potential fireworks when and if the 11 and 22 find each other in the next three races. 342. Rexrobe posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:41 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I never thought about Jeff going to the #42, and I don't think it will happen, but can you say an epic hand-off to Kyle Larson in a few years?? 343. Jim Davis posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:41 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "Jeff has to grow a spine and stand up to The Felon." Gordon is getting everything he wants from Hendrick. Gustavson is Gordon's crew chief because Gordon wants him to be. The problem with the 24 team is Gordon. Gordon knows this. That's why he looks so downcast in recent post race interviews. Unlike some of his fans, Gordon has class and won't throw people under the bus because he isn't getting the job done. "Threaten to publicly sign with the 42 team." I think you are kidding yourself if you think Earnhardt-Ganassi will pay Gordon as much as Hendrick does. 344. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Preliminary Chase clinch scenarios for Bristol: If Clint Bowyer finishes twelfth, thirteenth and leads a lap, or fourteenth and leads the most laps, he will clinch a top-ten spot in the Chase. If Carl Edwards finishes second, third and leads a lap, or third and leads the most laps, he will clinch a top-ten spot in the Chase. Kevin Harvick can also clinch a top-ten spot Saturday night at Bristol, but he would need help. 345. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 6:47 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "Unlike some of his fans, Gordon has class and won't throw people under the bus because he isn't getting the job done." Ouch. That's pointed. "You know that Hamlin would like nothing better than to be the one that costs Logano a shot at the Chase this year. I look for potential fireworks when and if the 11 and 22 find each other in the next three races." I doubt it. 346. Anonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 7:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This was the third time that Jeff Burton finished 8th after starting 5th at Michigan. Weird. 347. Loose Lugnuts posted: 08.18.2013 - 7:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (4) Let's see, now why would someone give a thumbs down to my list of favorite and least favorite drivers? It could be someone who: 1. Doesn't like Keselowski 2. Does like Johnson or Kyle Busch or Junior Or it could be all of the above. I'm just curious. 348. Sky Warrior posted: 08.18.2013 - 7:12 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Pretty sad race for me. 7 of my top 10 drivers were racing today, and of those, 6 of them should be top 20 contenders at the very least. 1 top 10 and 2 top 20s out of those 7, and 3 finished 36th or worse. Not to keen on the 1st, 2nd or 5th place drivers either. Just let Wednesday get here fast please 349. Rexrobe posted: 08.18.2013 - 7:33 pm Rate this comment: (0) (4) #347, don't even bother looking at the thumbs up or down. It's just not a good idea... 350. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 8:06 pm Rate this comment: (4) (3) I'm not saying Jeff SHOULD take over the 42 car, but he should use it or something else for leverage toget the same shit his teammates are getting. Imagine if it were the late 90s and Mike Skinner were showing up with cars half a second per lap faster than the 3 car week after week. Dale would raise so much hell that something would get fixed. Hell, look at Rusty and Newman. After Ryan won 11 races to Rusty's 1 from '02-'04, he was noticeably slower in '05 while Rusty was Top 10 week in and week out again for the firat time since 2001, leaving with his dignity intact. Coincidence? Jeff needs to make a power play. Remind Rick who turned him from a shady businessman who was a winning car owner to a shady businessman who was a champion car owner. 351. ESPN SUCKS posted: 08.18.2013 - 8:08 pm Rate this comment: (1) (7) awful broadcast today. How about they fire Bestwick and talk Bob Jenkins out of retirement? and dump Dale and bring in the real Jarrett, Ned. Heck, while we're at it, why doesn't ESPN dig up BP's corpse and put him in the broadcast booth? Even a dead Benny Parsons would do better than that guber Andy Petree. and to top it off, play the old ESPN speedworld intro at the beginning of broadcast! ESPN has 1 year left of NASCAR coverage, bring back the glory years of NASCAR on ESPN! 352. JimmyFennigFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 8:21 pm Rate this comment: (5) (0) As a Jimmy Fennig fan who suffered through the late 90's of watching Jeff beat Jimmy and Mark in better equipment every week, I love that now Jeff is stuck in mediocre equipment. 353. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 8:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (2) ^to the post above, have fun being deleted. 354. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 8:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Not the Fennig fan one. 355. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 8:24 pm Rate this comment: (2) (1) Although they should bring back the old SpeedWorld intro and music. Everytime I hear it on YouTube I get so damn nostalgic. 356. MStall41 posted: 08.18.2013 - 8:24 pm Rate this comment: (3) (1) As a Logano fan, I am over the moon with happiness after his superb performance this weekend. He got the pole, led the most laps, made some decisive passes late in the race, and won the damn thing! Just an awesome weekend. As for the race itself, pretty damn solid for the most part. Clean air is obviously still a factor but there was WAY more racing through the field this weekend than there was in the June race. Also, I think Logano was holding back a bit at the end. Martin was pretty fast but Logano was definitely better, but knowing Martin was going to run out probably allowed Joey to be a bit more conservative with his fuel and equipment in, no matter what he said in victory lane. Just a great weekend, and Go #22! 357. JimmyFennigFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 8:24 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) what? 358. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 8:38 pm Rate this comment: (1) (2) I was responding to the "ESPN SUCKS" troll post which was the last post on the page when I said for it to have fun being deleted referring to the post above mine. Once I posted it, the Jimmy Fennig Fan had been posted and it was the one above mine saying to have fun being deleted. I don't want that one deleted. 359. DB1995 posted: 08.18.2013 - 8:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) can anyone tell me why the X1-R series has 2 ranks of points position on the stats? 360. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 8:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "can anyone tell me why the X1-R series has 2 ranks of points position on the stats?" They have two divisions, north and south. 361. MStall41 posted: 08.18.2013 - 8:45 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Also, I agree wholeheartedly with DSFF's analysis of the Jeff Gordon situation. I think he still has some fire left in him, but until he can convince his team to put the focus back on the #24 team, he will simply not see any improvement. 362. Jim Davis posted: 08.18.2013 - 8:57 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) "I'm not saying Jeff SHOULD take over the 42 car, but he should use it or something else for leverage toget the same shit his teammates are getting." What do you imagine his teammates are getting that he's not getting? Do you honestly think that only the 48, 88, and 5 are getting new engines and he's just getting the rebuilds? Or that only the 48, 88, and 5 are getting new chassis and the 24 has to rebuild the same chassis for every race? Do you honestly think Hendrick is telling Gordon that Gustavson is going to be the crew chief of the 24 and Gordon better get used to it? I frankly can't understand how you can simultaneously hold two mutually exclusive views of Gordon - the "refuse to lose" wheelman who's fearless on the track and the cowardly wimp who licks the boots of Knaus and Hendrick. The problem is Gordon. The specifics aren't that clear, though. It may be medical; the back may be acting up again. It may be personal; he might be more focused at home than the track. It may be financial; maybe his investments aren't doing that well. It may just be declining skills that he hasn't learned to compensate for yet. Gordon will either get a second wind or he won't. I'm betting on the former. 363. Rexrobe posted: 08.18.2013 - 9:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Actually David and DB1995, on this site the left rank is for the regular season and the right rank is for the Championship series. USAR did away with the divisions a few years ago. There's not an "official" way of showing that, so that info is displayed differently depending on what site you're on. 364. Bro Jackson posted: 08.18.2013 - 9:34 pm Rate this comment: (4) (10) After today's race all I can say about the Chase is (with no Dale Jr in it), you guys still not believing me had better get ready to eat crow after Richmond! Either that, or I'm gonna be having some myself. 365. Anthony posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (6) Oh and the stats on Jeff. He has never missed an awards ceremoney EVER in his entire career. And besides 1993 he was there when he won Rookie of the year and 2005 when he finish 11th remember that? Well in 2005 Jeff Gordon's Average Finish in the chase was 16.5 yeah not good. But hey don't we all make mistakes. Jeff could finish 13th in points. 366. SpeedWorld97 posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:14 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Just curious, Bro Jackson, are you psychic or something, because I've never seen someone so confident about expecting things we'll have to wait three weeks to see. "Although they should bring back the old SpeedWorld intro and music. Everytime I hear it on YouTube I get so damn nostalgic." Heck I love that music so much, I used it as my username! Ok, here's what I've wanted to say since the end of the race. I have a lot of respect for just about everyone who posts on this site (even Bro Jackson whose posts I think are total garbage). But I will take break from posting on this site (except F1 predictions) until the Bristol races next weekend. The reason? This race left such a sour taste in my mouth, it's not even funny. My two favorites, Jr. and Jeff Gordon, both had bad days. And to top it off, my hopes of Mark Martin winning this race came to a crushing end. The end result is Gordon most likely out of the chase (yes, I've given up already) and Jr. barely holding a chase spot. But I will NOT give up on Jr. until the checkered flag at Richmond. I still think he can do it, as long as he avoids bad luck. After all, he was in a similar position two years ago, and he got the job done then. Anyway, I feel it is best to avoid this for a few days, because it makes me very nervous to see my two favorites struggle like this. So in the meantime, I will play some golf this week, and try to get this off of my mind. I hope everyone continues to post about racing and have a good week. On that note: 'till we meet again... 367. David posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Catch you later, SpeedWorld. 368. FloridaFan88 posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) There's a hot rumor that Kurt Busch has been offered a contract for Stewart-Haas Racing in a 4th car next season with Haas Automation sponsorship. Silly season is heating up. 369. Allen posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:35 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kevin Harvicks 200th top 10. 3 more top 5s to get to 100. 370. cjs3872 posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:38 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Jim Davis, the problem with, and the truth about Gordon is that he's at the stage of his career where Darrell Waltrip was in about 1994 or '95 before his crash at Charlotte in the All-Star Race that year, or where Bobby Allison and Richard Petty were in about 1985 or '86, or where Dale Earnhardt was in 1998. In other words, he's at the point in his career where he's truly competitive on certain tracks, and not others. Waltrip and Petty never got back to where they could contend for wins again, where Allison and Earnhardt not only were able to contend for victories, but also get victories, and not just any victories, but big victories. It may not seem that way about Gordon because of his age, but again, since he started 5-7 years younger, he's actually close to 50 in racing years, instead of 42, which is his chronological age. And in Gordon's case, his problem is the high-speed tracks, because he simply seems to be somewhat fearful of he speeds, but at the tracks where the speed of the car is less important, he can still be a big factor, as he's showed in a number of those races this year. I'll say this. If they knock 15 MPH off the speed of the cars at Michigan, I think he'd be a factor there again. It's just that the 190-200 MPH lapping at places like Michigan make him uncomfortable, mainly because of all the big crashes he's had. But if they lapped there at 180-185 again, he wouldn't mind sticking his nose in places that he won't stick his nose in at the speeds they're currently running. Some drivers are spooked of the speeds at a track like Michigan, and I think Gordon is spooked by the constant speeds that are run there. When he snuck up into the top dozen about two-thirds of the way through the race, ESPN was showing the top lap speeds turned in, and among the top 12-15, Gordon's top lap speed was by far the slowest. Most guys' top speed was 194 and 195, but Gordon's top speed was 192, and I think it's a case of him being spooked by the speeds because of all the big crashes he's had over the years. Gordon can still be competitive and run up front, but only on certain types of tracks. Other tracks, such as Michigan, Kansas with the repave there, and other freshly repaved tracks where speed is the most important thing, are tracks he may never be competitive at again, simply because of the way he seems to be spooked by the speeds. 371. Anonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:40 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Have fun on your break Speedworld! 372. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:42 pm Rate this comment: (2) (3) What I'm saying is that Jeff's team is subpar. Guatafson seems to be getting worse by the minute and his cars don't seem to be engineered as well. He is Jeff Freaking Gordon. He needs to man up and demand changes. No, unlike others, I don't think Jeff is being hamstrung by HMS. But Chad makes sweeping changes to the 48 team everytime it bobbles or they have a 15 second pit stop. Joonyerr, The Felon's adopted son, is always getting upgrades, and Kenny Francis is no slouch in shitcanning and replacing those who mess up. The fact is in NASCAR, and in the world in general, assholes finish first. Obviously Dale is exhibit A in this. For all his softheartedness off the track, he wrecked TLab to win a race at age 48 and had to fight like hell in victory lane to keep from smiling at what he'd just done. Or how about his cold as ice interview immediately after Richmond '86? Jeff referred to himself as an asshole when recalling the late 90s. That is also when he won the most. He can be nice away from the track and shop, but he needs to start being a jerk inside HMS again. 373. cjs3872 posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) But again DSFF, I think Jeff's at that stage of his career where he can only be competitive at certain types of tracks, because I think he's spooked by the high speeds at some of these tracks, and with all the big crashes he's had over the years, who can blame him. The fact that all of his teammates had tires issues at Michigan this year, either in June or in the recently completed race, can't be helping what already is a shattered confidence on those types of tracks. And I also wonder how much that wild rollover crash at Daytona in the Shootout last year took out of him. That might have been the last straw for Gordon on the big tracks and nobody knew it, myself included, because he's, for the most part, been a pushover on the big tracks since then. 374. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "There's a hot rumor that Kurt Busch has been offered a contract for Stewart-Haas Racing in a 4th car next season with Haas Automation sponsorship. Silly season is heating up." I just read about that as well. If you ask me, it would be an absolutely NUMBSKULL decision for SHR. Not because of Kurt (he's a hell of a driver and I don't blame them for wanting him), but because of all the other stuff. -1. The "sponsored by Haas Automation" thing basically means they'll be paying for that car out of their own pocket, and given their history of shaky sponsorship, that doesn't seem like a good idea. -2. You have to hire a WHOLE new team. -3. Overall, it will be ANOTHER huge distraction for the entire organization, just like their expansion to three cars was. I totally understand them wanting to go after Kurt (easily one of the top ten most talented drivers out there), but I think it would totally set them back even further than they were this year. We've seen how shitty they've been with their expansion to a third car (they've had bright moments, but still mediocre for the most part), so I have no idea why they think an expansion to four cars this soon would be a good idea. 375. ch posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Sponsor changes: 9 - DeWalt / Stanley Tools 10 - GoDaddy.com 17 - Fifth Third Bank 33 - Circle Sport 48 - Lowe's / Kobalt Tools 376. cjs3872 posted: 08.18.2013 - 10:55 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And by the way, in adding to my last comment, let's not forget what happened to him at Chicago at the start of the Chase last year. He was running in the top five all day and poised to finish up there when the throttle hung wide open at the fastest part of the track (entering turn one), and he had still another hard crash. A driver can only take so many hard hits, and he's not the most sturdy guy anyway, so with all the hard crashes he's had since 2006, I'm not at all surprised that he's struggling on the big tracks. Every time he runs well n one, he has to wonder what's going to happen to him next, because it's almost like we're wondering when's the other shoe going to drop on him? And when it does, it's usually bigger than it is for most of the other competitors for whatever reason. 377. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 11:19 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) One thing I have noticed is that Gordon's crew chiefs have taken a lot of the blame for his performance drops over the years, perhaps unfairly. Robbie Loomis was ousted in 2005 after Gordon missed the Chase even though the performance was there and they only missed the Chase because Gordon was caught up in a ton of crashes. Prior to 2005, the pairing had a championship, a 3rd, two 4ths, and a 9th. Steve Letarte was reassigned after a winless 9th place points finish in 2010, but Hendrick as a whole had a down year with both Martin and Earnhardt disappointing, Johnson and Knaus were the only ones who could get it done and 2010 is the year of the streak where they were most seriously threatened. Letarte was then moved to the #88 and their performance drastically improved. Now Gordon is with Alan Gustafson, who had a couple of good seasons with Kyle Busch and was the crew chief for Mark Martin's epic 2009 season where he nearly won the title as a half-centenarian. As I remember, he had a fairly good reputation when he was with Busch and Martin, but now that Gordon's performance has dropped, a lot of people are calling for his head. Granted, he has made some bad calls, but that's the nature of the game, no crew chief always gets the strategy right. A lot of people think Knaus is the best in the business and even he had a 3-4 race streak this season where he blew it every race. There are so many reasons why the #24 is struggling, and while the crew chief may be playing a part in that, I think people are largely missing the other ones, instead simply blaming Gustafson, as well as the far-too-prevalent conspiracy theory that Hendrick doesn't want Gordon to win for God-knows-what reason and Gordon should get out of his contract and go drive Chip Ganassi's slightly-above-mediocre team (I honestly can't tell if this is serious or sarcasm or what). For starters, Gordon is now in his 21st Cup season, not many drivers perform at the level he is performing at right now after that long. Darrell Waltrip, for one, had become a complete non-factor by his 21st Cup season. I think the time spent in racing means more than age because of the factors involved; fatigue, loss of ambition, fear of crashing based on past crashes (similar to what cjs referred to), driving "safer" and taking less risks than young guns who haven't suffered such hits, driving a car with a tight setup, etc. That's why Gordon is steady and doesn't make many driver errors, but he also lacks the speed a lot of competitive drivers have. Now, knowing the competitor Gordon is, I don't think he's nearly done yet, I think his struggles this season will motivate him, if they're not already. I could easily see him winning Bristol and/or Richmond and making a deep run in the Chase and proving armchair crew chiefs like me totally wrong. But I also think it's safe to say he's not the driver he was in 1998 and he is in the twilight of his career. I didn't like Gordon during his prime, but I respect him and I hope he sticks around as long as he wants to. He's a great ambassador for the sport and his presence is something NASCAR will miss greatly whenever he retires. 378. Eric posted: 08.18.2013 - 11:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) cjs3872, I don't think its fair comparing Dale Earnhardt Sr. in 1998 to Darrell Waltrip was in about 1994 or '95 before his crash at Charlotte in the All-Star Race that year, or where Bobby Allison and Richard Petty were in about 1985 or 1986. Dale Earnhardt Sr. was not fully healthy in 1998 compare to Darrell Waltrip.,Bobby Allison, and Richard Petty in the years you mentioned. The last time I check, DW was healthy in 1994, Richard Petty was healthy in 1985/1986, Bobby Allison also was healthy in 1985/1986. Dale Earnhardt Sr. in 1998 still had some effects from Talladega of 1996. Lets remember that Dale Earnhardt Sr. had neck surgery after the 1999 season to correct lingering injury from his 1996 Talladega crash. That meant Dale was racing hurt in 1998 besides RCR being behind and Dale going having 2 crew chiefs that year. Dale in 1999 wasn't healthy, but he had a crew chief he can communicate deal with and RCR was starting to play catch up. Dale Earnhardt Sr. in 2000 was fully healthy for the first time before the July Talladega race of 1996.I think that is the Dale Sr. if Dale was healthy in 1997 or 1998. 379. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.18.2013 - 11:26 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Kurt Busch in a 4th SHR car would be a huge mistake, especially if they self-sponsor it. They've already stretched their resources thin with 3 cars and despite Stewart and Newman's wins, this has been a pretty mediocre year by their standards. I don't see how a race team could successfully double in size within 2 years. They would have to find a ton of employees to even make it work, and with only 3 cars actually sponsored, the financial resources would also be spread thin. I hope they eventually decide against this, it seems like it would have approximately a 0% chance of working out. 380. murb posted: 08.18.2013 - 11:34 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Apparently it's Gene Haas that is pushing hard for this Kurt Busch thing to happen. I can't tell if it is going to be the Stewart or the Haas that runs Stewart Haas Racing into the ground. Speaking of them, it sounds like this Mark Martin deal is gonna happen. In the scenario, Mark would be released from his MWR contract to come sub for Tony in the 14, and Vickers would get a head start on next year and run the rest of the races in the 55. So if this does happen (which again, barring a falling out, it probably will), today might have been Mark's last race with MWR. Too bad he wasn't able to finish it off and go to victory lane for them. 381. cjs3872 posted: 08.18.2013 - 11:37 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Eric, my point was that Gordon's at that stage in his career that those guys were in those years. It doesn't matter why those drivers were struggling like they were, because there were different circumstances involved, it's jut that Gordon's at that stage in his career where he's only competitive with the front runners at certain kinds of tracks, and the same was true about those other drivers I mentioned at that particular point in their careers. Waltrip was struggling, mostly because he was an owner-driver, Earnhardt was struggling for the health-related reasons you mentioned (and the fact that RCR fell behind because of their decision not to have a crew chief in 1996), and Allison's and Petty's struggles were, for the most part, age-related. Earnhardt and Allison were eventually able to pull out of their struggles, while Petty and Waltrip were not able to. I'm not sure where Gordon's travails of the last two years are eventually going to lead the rest of his career. I don't know if an Earnhardt-like revival is in the cards for him, or if his career is going to end like Petty's and Waltrip's did, with years of utter futility. If I had to guess, it would be the latter, just based on the fact that the organization he's driving for is not exactly behind his team, and hasn't been for a few years. Actually, what happened to Terry Labonte's career may be an even better parallel, because Labonte mysteriously fell off the map in 1999, and except for one, last shining moment in 2003, just didn't have it any more. 382. Eric posted: 08.18.2013 - 11:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I don't know what SHR is thinking offering Kurt Busch a ride. SHR has problems with having 3 cars competitive although I blame Danica Patrick on the 10 cars struggles. The 14 car also has a potential problem next season with Tony Stewart. Stewart is going to be 43 next year in May with him coming back from a broken leg. Darrell Waltrip broke his leg in 1990 at the age of 43 and he was not the same driver in 1991 and 1992 despite winning a total of 5 races combined. That means it isn't likely that Stewart is going to be the same driver once he comes back from a broken leg. If Danica wasn't with SHR, I would like that move for being a 3 car team. Kevin is a very good talent in his prime and I call Kurt one of the top 5 drivers in the cup garage on ability right now with Kurt still in his prime. The other problem is the personalities involve for 2014 that Stewart-Haas Racing would have. 383. Eric posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:03 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Murb, If it is indeed true that Gene Haas is pushing for Kurt, than Gene has more power than I thought. It is a big mistake by Gene and it wouldn't shock me. Gene mismanaged his organization before Stewart became a co-owner. I call this the 3rd bad move Stewart-Haas has made if Kurt agrees to a 4th car. The first bad move was Stewart firing his crew chief. Danica being in the 10 car is a mistake despite being a money maker in sponsorship because she's under performing in the 10 car badly was the 2nd mistake. I call getting Kurt a bad move because Stewart-Haas has 3 cars and not all of them are competitive. 384. The Long Shot posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:04 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Anyway, I feel it is best to avoid this for a few days, because it makes me very nervous to see my two favorites struggle like this. So in the meantime, I will play some golf this week, and try to get this off of my mind. I hope everyone continues to post about racing and have a good week." Take all the time you need, SpeedWorld. We seem to have had a lot of people take breaks from posting over the last few weeks due to stress, in part because of this forum and in part just because of this terrible season. I myself won't be posting too much over the coming week due to a hellish schedule. As for Stewart-Haas Racing, I thought they had just said a few weeks ago that they weren't going to run a 4th car next year. Shows you how quickly people's minds can change. I personally think the only car that will be even marginally competitive for SHR in 2014 will be the 4 of Harvick. Stewart's old, Patrick's no good, and Busch won't be getting very good equipment (I think he might be out of a ride by September or October of next year due to sponsorship issues). 385. Anonymous posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:11 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Didn't Tony Stewart say the team wasn't ready to be a four car team and that why Newman is getting replace by Harvick 386. Schroeder51 posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:21 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Stewart-Haas expanding to four cars next year would be an AWFUL idea. They are already struggling after expanding to three cars this year, as mentioned-adding another car is going to only add even MORE problems, not solve the problems they already have. But you know, because it's such a bad idea, that mean there's a good chance it will end up happening. 387. Rexrobe posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:24 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) *tin foil hat time* It could also be that Stewart will not be returning for next year, and Kurt will replace him... 388. Bro Jackson posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:25 am Rate this comment: (2) (1) SpeedWorld97, first of all, I love ESPN SpeedWorld's coverage from the 80s to the mid-90s. Simply stellar. And no, I'm not a psychic, but I know a struggling team when I see one and I know when fate is not going to let a team make the Chase, and this year that team is the #88. He's not gonna be in, and the 62-point lead he had over 10th after Pocono will go down as the biggest pre-Chase collapse in the Chase's mostly disgusting 10-year history. Or I'll gladly eat crow if Dale Jr. makes the Chase. I'll stand by my prediction, however, that he misses it. And if wrong, maybe I'll go by Sis Jackson for a week haha. 389. Anonymous posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:28 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Also Tony Stewart and Kurt Busch haven't always gotten along. Some examples The Spring Dover Race in 2007 The Budweiser Shootout Practice in 2008 This Year at Richmond 390. Eric posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:29 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) 385, That is correct about Stewart saying the team isn't ready to be a 4 car team and why Newman is getting replaced by Harvick. It is possible that Gene Haas is overruling Tony Stewart since Gene Haas is a co-owner. What is going on is Gene Haas knows Kurt Busch is a past champion and wants to get a 4th team for Kurt rather or not Stewart-Haas is ready for it. 391. David posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:32 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "It could also be that Stewart will not be returning for next year, and Kurt will replace him..." That is EXACTLY what I was thinking and was going to post until I saw your post. Did they actually say they were expanding to four cars (honestly asking this, I don't know)? 392. Eric posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:34 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) If Stewart-Haas becomes a 4th car team in 2014, it might be for 1 year. I am saying that because the Godaddy.com contract is up after 2014 and I don't think there has been a contract extension yet on it for Danica. If Godaddy.com decides not to resign with Danica, I would drop her. 393. murb posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:37 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Did they actually say they were expanding to four cars (honestly asking this, I don't know)?" In all the articles I've read it says that it would be in a fourth SHR car. 394. Eric posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:39 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) David, ESPN claim with multiple NASCAR sources that the Kurt Busch contract offer is for a fourth team. Rather or not that is accurate is questionable. The fact is ESPN isn't always the most accurate for fact checking. They Claimed Vickers only had 2 cup wins instead of 3 when MWR announced Brian Vickers for a full time ride and that is their latest example of not getting info correct. 395. David posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:45 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "In all the articles I've read it says that it would be in a fourth SHR car." Okay, then. Fair enough. 396. Paul posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:47 am Rate this comment: (3) (0) I missed this race because of work, but congrats to Joey Logano on his 3rd career Cup victory. Looks like Brad knew what he was doing when he requested for Penske to sign Logano after last season. Too bad the defending champ can't figure out how to win himself. RCR had a great showing in this race as all four cars (including the #78) finished in the top ten, three of whom finished in the top five. Kurt Busch's 3rd place finish moves him into the top ten in points, which I think is the only way he makes the Chase this season as I don't think he can win a race with the team he's got. And the supposed "No-talent, son of a millionaire 'buy-a-ride'" driver Paul Menard finishes right behind Kurt in 4th place. But despite the great finish, I can promise you that the haters will in fact still hate the son of John Menard the next time he finishes "below par" in his RCR equipment. As for Gordon, I'm still confident in his abilities as the series heads to Bristol, Atlanta, and Richmond before the Chase starts. But good grief there's a ton of netivity around here in regards to Gordon's performance this season. From the high ratio of Gordon-related posts compared to other drivers, to the Gordon "fans" putting all the blame on Hendrick not giving him good equipment, to the Gordon critics and so-called admirers calling him a yellow-bellied gutless coward, this is getting out of control. And to put the icing on the cake, some of you are even suggesting that he leadollaHendrick Motorsports to take over an even worse ride that won't pay nearly as well. Oh yeah, that's really the type of ride that a driver who can't hardly win anymore is dying to take up. I'll be a Gordon fan for the rest of my life and have stuck by my driver throughout all the good times and the bad times. I proudly wore my Drive to End Hunger t-shirt that I purchased from the Jeff Gordon online store all day today. But I'm almost embarrassed to be a Gordon fan after reading your guys' comments today. When he let's his boss run his business and has bad runs in the equipment he's been given, he should go up to Rickendrick, tell him to take his job and shove it, and leave for Ganassi, otherwise he's not standing up for himself and his talent. But when he actually stands up for himself to a fellow driver on the race track, like when he wrecked Clint Bowyer at Phoenix, then he's a washed-up has-been wingman who should retire since he's proven to have nothing left (Btw, he won the next race.). Gotta love the continuity provided by your loyal race fans of Racing-Reference. Jim Davis, I think you hit the nail on the head when you said that Gordon is the problem with the #24 car, but that there's still time for him to bounce back with a solid performance. I'm glad at least one person could properly critique Gordon's performance without insulting him or suggesting he go to a worse team for less money. 397. David posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:01 am Rate this comment: (1) (1) "I'll be a Gordon fan for the rest of my life and have stuck by my driver throughout all the good times and the bad times." Amen! "As for Gordon, I'm still confident in his abilities as the series heads to Bristol, Atlanta, and Richmond before the Chase starts." Until that checkered flag falls at Richmond, I am NOT counting him out. I've said it before, but it bears repeating. Oh yeah, and even though he didn't actually make the Chase via the top ten in points, Jeff made up 50 points on tenth place in the final three races before the Chase last year. 398. OldSchoolNascarDude1 posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:02 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Everyone is jumping to conclusions about the Kurt Busch news. Regardless on Tony's fans/critics, I think everyone can conclude that he's not a backstabber. He wouldn't directly lie to Ryan Newman, his friend's, face. That said, IF this rumor is actually true, then I would assume Haas is the one pushing for this. I'm not sure it would bode well for next season, but a trio of Stewart, Busch and Harvick would build up a good notebook, something that none of those three have the luxury of getting from their own teammates for the past few seasons. I think this could be potentially be a great move, but there will be a process to hurdle over first. Compared to the nature of today's drivers, the combination of Stewart, Busch and Harvick on the same team will be equivalent to the NBA's Detroit Pistons Bad Boy era. The one negative for opposing manufacturer owners will be that Rick Hendrick will benefit from this as well. The duo of Hendrick and SHR will be good enough to overcome any of today's current teams. Of course, some of these crew chiefs/drivers are more closed with information, but the basic outline among those teams will be beneficial for both organizations. 399. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:07 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) Again, I am not saying Jeff SHOULD go to the 42, but he should threaten to. He needs to make a power play. He could tell The Felon "that 42 may not be considered 'championship caliber' but HMS wasn't considered that either when I showed up in '93 and look what happened". Also, it doesn't necessarily have to be the 42 to use. I think Jeff can win another championship. I don't buy the "he is a 50 year old in a 42 year old body" deal. I don't think he is afraid of high speeds. I just think he has sat around too long while his team has become the new 25 team. I know he wants his kids and Ingrid to experience the championship celebration (when he last was Cup champ he was still married to The Gold Digger). He needs to make some ultimatums. On another more hilarious note, they now are selling "Paul Menard: The Empire" stickers with the pjrase "The Menarch Since 2010". Look up "menarch" (or "menarche") sometime. 400. David posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:14 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "On another more hilarious note, they now are selling "Paul Menard: The Empire" stickers with the pjrase "The Menarch Since 2010". Look up "menarch" (or "menarche") sometime." Being in the medical field, of course DSFF would know this. 401. murb posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:18 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) "Look up "menarch"" lol. I like Paul Menard, but man, his Empire should have thought that one out a little bit. 402. Zackary Shawn posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:28 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) If the rumor about Kurt Busch is true, which I suspect it is, I feel like this is more the workings of Gene Haas than Tony Stewart. 403. Zackary Shawn posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:33 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Rather or not that is accurate is questionable. The fact is ESPN isn't always the most accurate for fact checking. They Claimed Vickers only had 2 cup wins instead of 3 when MWR announced Brian Vickers for a full time ride and that is their latest example of not getting info correct." Making a mistake about win totals is a little different than not knowing whether or not an anonymous source told you something, isn't it? One is a simple mistake, one would be a made up delusion. 404. Mark N. posted: 08.19.2013 - 2:46 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) After a great showing today, i THINK Menard could be a sleeper at Bristol, a track he has had some strong showings at recently. Wouldn't that throw some more spice in the chase battle? 405. We need more Onion posted: 08.19.2013 - 7:22 am Rate this comment: (2) (0) Came down to mention my usual 'Menard will do good at the upcoming short track', but then I saw this: "On another more hilarious note, they now are selling "Paul Menard: The Empire" stickers with the phrase "The Menarch Since 2010". Look up "menarch" (or "menarche") sometime." Literally has me in tears. Might have to order one just for the lols. 406. Jared DiCarlo posted: 08.19.2013 - 7:34 am Rate this comment: (0) (3) How is Johnson still leading the points? He was never a factor in this race. Just because he led 3 laps should not keep him in the points lead. 407. Destroyahirismix666 posted: 08.19.2013 - 8:20 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Congratulations to Joey Logano for earning maximum points. This makes it, if i recall corectly, a four way battle for the wild-card spots? if things at Atlanta and Bristol stay good, we could have a very interesting 'Wild-card' chase. Also, I'm praying to god that KU. Busch does make the chase. What would that do for team morale?! I mean, just think. I'm glad to see that he's cracked teh top 10. Also, thumb up to Dillon, scorning top-15. 408. Eric posted: 08.19.2013 - 9:41 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Zackary Shawn, I said latest example for a reason on post 394. ESPN writers even made mistakes of what race or series they won a race in before because of bad proof reading. Some NASCAR writers on ESPN even typed some inaccurate stuff and don't admit they screw up like the fact David Newton claimed a Ford didn't win at Watkin's Glen last year despite the fact Marcos Ambrose won there. 409. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.19.2013 - 10:19 am Rate this comment: (2) (0) "How is Johnson still leading the points? He was never a factor in this race. Just because he led 3 laps should not keep him in the points lead." Do you have any idea how points standings work? 410. Baker posted: 08.19.2013 - 10:24 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nice. All the bust talk the last two years and all the sudden Logano is a 3 time cup winner 2 of which are legit. Stewart can still miss Bristol and be chase eligible. Obviously he'd need a miracle win at Atlanta of Richmond. 411. cjs3872 posted: 08.19.2013 - 11:07 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, it goes back to what I said about Gordon being at the point in his career where he can be competitive at some tracks and not others. And h my very well be spooked about running the extreme speeds that are run at Michigan and other high-speed tracks because of all the crashes he's had, much like Darrell Waltrip was in the early and mid 90s. In fact, the last three years of his career are eerily similar to DW's seasons from 1991-'93. Waltrip won two races in '91 and three more in '92, including his final win, a rain-shortened affair at Darlington. But after that, he began running his own stuff and never won again, though he was competitive, but like Gordon now, only on certain kinds of tracks. In 1994, Waltrip had one final top ten points finish and appeared to be on his way back to his old form in 1995 when his crash in the All-Star Race effectively ended his competitive career. But Waltrip had a series of crashes in the 80s and early 90s that affected him as a driver, much the same way Gordon's had a number of crashes in recent years that have seemed to affect him on the faster tracks, the most recent of which were his crashes at Daytona and Chicago last year, and his hard crash in the 600 this year. And the human body can only take so much. I think in Gordon's case on the big tracks, the heart's willing to do what it takes to run up front, but the mind isn't, and that's why we don't see Gordon where he should be on these types of tracks. He should be a contender at Bristol, and his ability to manage his equipment should serve him well at Atlanta, but I don't know about Richmond. What people forget about Gordon's comeback in the fall race there last year was this. That race was stopped during the middle stages due to rain, and that gave Alan Gustafson the time he needed to plan out what needed to be done to the car. If not for that rain delay, they never get back in contention. The fire's still there in Gordon. Of that, I have no doubt, but the willingness to take chances is no longer there, especially on high-speed tracks, because the mind is telling him not to because of all the big crashes he's had since 2006. 412. Anonymous posted: 08.19.2013 - 11:33 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) This would never happen because of marketing, money (and really common sense too) but I'd like to see what would happen with Chase Elliott in the 94 replacing Gordon's 24, and Regan Smith in the 25 replacing Junior's 88 in 2015. I don't think you'd see those teams missing the Chase if Elliott and Smith were piloting the cars instead of Junior and Gordon, and I say that simply because one is pushing 40 and the other is already past it. 413. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.19.2013 - 12:48 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I'd like to see what would happen with Chase Elliott in the 94 replacing Gordon's 24, and Regan Smith in the 25 replacing Junior's 88 in 2015." While nowadays it is much easier to adjust to cup racing, people should understand that most rookies are very accident prone and just will not make the Chase because of it. Regan Smith, yes. Chase Elliott, Kyle Larson, etc... it's not going to work because of the high DNF count. At most tracks, a KNPE is very equivalent to an NNS car, but an NNS car is not equivalent to a Cup car at those same tracks. 414. JG24shouldbe5time posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:15 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) @ 396. Paul: I'm probably more like you than some of our fellow JG fans here. What I'm seeing in our fellow #24 is the same thing you see in NY Yankees fans when they don't finish first: It's become such an expectation that Jeff should be a winner/competitive so when he isn't, it seems like it must be a farce. When it keeps happening someone or something is wrong and it's time to figure that out. That's NOT meant at a criticism, it's just an observation I'm stating. I am disappointed in his performances the last few years and I agree with some that we're seeing the twilight of his career for one reason or another. I'm hoping something turns around and his last few years are like Dale Sr's rather than The King's or D Waltrip. That probably won't happen...I'd like to have seen Jeff solidify his place in NASACR history. I would've like to see him win 5 or 6 Cups, which he would have if they hadn't introduced the Chase. I hoped he'd get to 100 wins (if not 106 so he could pass the Silver Fox for 2nd all time). Watching his career melt while Johnson's solidified is what really annoys me. I won't blame Jeff or Hendrick or even Jimmie though. I do like to point fingers at Brian France's "brain" trust since they introduced us to the Chase though. lol. 415. 12345Dude posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:32 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) JG 24 you can't blame the chase. In the beginning of the season everyone knows that the first 26 races are meaningless and the last 10 are the only ones that matter. Everyone knows that going into the season. Drivers don't say to themselfs "well I want to have the best average finish at the end of the year. or the most top 10s, or top 5s". No they prepare their whole season around the final 10. Everyone knows this. I'm also surprised that no-one has talked about (here or espn) about the Gibbs engines. This was the race that was going to show if their engines were up to par with the rest of the teams. And looking at the results - there obviously not. I said through out the season that Kenseth was going to give Jimmie and run for his money. But this race obviously showed that their engines are way, way behind. Because of that I don't think anyone can touch Jimmie. Every part of your team needs to be at it's best to win the chase. And that can't be said for the Gibbs teams. Also it's almost official that Kurt Busch is going to be joining Stewart-Haas in a 4th car. We all though Clint Bowyer and Martin Truex were crazy when they joined Michael Waltrip Racing. Even with the Stewart-Haas struggles, we see Harvick and Busch joining them for next year. Sometimes the drivers and teams just know way more about these topics than the fans do. I always go back to the Clint and Truex argument (Truex was a big free agent then). For all we know Rick Hendrick might have a plan to make them just as good as Hendrick Motorsports. Harvick and Busch joining after Stewart-Haas's struggles this year tells me something. Those driver's aren't stupid, they want to race in the best equipment, with the best team. Also... Jeff Gordon, Jimmie Johnson, Kasey Kahne, Dale Earnhardt Jr,Tony Stewart, Kevin Harvick, & Kurt Busch sharing equipment. Wow! And what about the all the Turner Scott, and JR motorsports teams. They probably share equipment too. That's a lot of notes, and a lot of information! 416. murb posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:45 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Michael Andretti is trying to find a sponsor to bring JPM back to IndyCar. So maybe Juan isn't staying in Nascar. 417. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "I don't think you'd see those teams missing the Chase if Elliott and Smith were piloting the cars instead of Junior and Gordon, and I say that simply because one is pushing 40 and the other is already past it." If it's just about age, Johnson's less than a year younger than Earnhardt. Just saying. Of course, I personally think Johnson's prime will be coming to an end either in 2014 or 2015. I don't think there's any way Chase Elliott would be making the chase in his rookie season (probably not even in his sophomore season) given his extreme lack of experience. 418. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:53 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) If the Kurt Busch to SHR rumor actually happens, then where will Hendrick go from here? His personal team and his satellite team will both be capped at 4 and who knows if he will even be satisfied there? Will we see JR Motorsports move to Cup in 3-4 years and eventually expand to 4 cars as well? 419. Jared DiCarlo posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) @NoLongerAnonymous: How does it work exactly? 420. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I hate to triple post but it has been announced that Ty Dillon will drive the #3 in Nationwide next season sponsored by Yuengling, so if it wasn't known before, it's pretty much definite now that Cowboy Hat will be in Cup next season. The only question is will it be a (probably renumbered) #29 or will it be a 4th team? 421. Eric posted: 08.19.2013 - 1:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) 12345Dude, JGR has the same engines as MWR does. JGR doesn't make their own engines cup anymore. The fact is the engines for Toyota are fine based on how Mark was doing before he was running out of fuel. Kyle had a top 10 car before his problems also. You shouldn't judge JGR by Hamlin's result at Michigan because Denny hasn't been the same driver since he came back from his back injury and that is very true after his Dover crash. The problem is Michigan to me wasn't a great test in terms of horsepower because of how bad passing was at track. What the new TRD aggressive engines did was pass the test of durability. Michigan had a bad cup race. There was problems with passing due to the tires, new surface, and the gen 6 car. 422. 12345Dude posted: 08.19.2013 - 2:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Very good post Eric. Good point about Mark Martin. I only saw half the race, but it seems to me no matter how good your car is if you get in clean air your going to fly away. So I don't know if that was the TRD engine or the clean air. I seems to me though that they were so focused on this race. That is race was going to prove how good their engines were. Yet they really didn't do all that well, with only 1 driver in top 10. Yeah Mark did look great, but how much of that was clean air? 423. David posted: 08.19.2013 - 2:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) This is one of the rare instances where someone crashed in practice and the backup car carried a different paint scheme than the primary car. Jimmie Johnson's primary car was the normal blue scheme we see on the car, whereas the backup carried the black Kobalt Tools colors. 424. Dave #38 Fan-Go Gilliland! posted: 08.19.2013 - 3:00 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Will we see JR Motorsports move to Cup in 3-4 years and eventually expand to 4 cars as well?" No. Nascar has stated in the past that JR motorsports cannot run any cup cars as long as Dale Jr. is listed as the owner and is driving for Hendrick Motorsports. They have stated that would break the 4-car cap, although apparently SHR running Hendrick cars / engines or HendrickCars.com being the primary sponsor for the Phoenix Racing #51 car does not break the 4-car cap for some reason. 425. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.19.2013 - 3:28 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "No. Nascar has stated in the past that JR motorsports cannot run any cup cars as long as Dale Jr. is listed as the owner and is driving for Hendrick Motorsports. They have stated that would break the 4-car cap, although apparently SHR running Hendrick cars / engines or HendrickCars.com being the primary sponsor for the Phoenix Racing #51 car does not break the 4-car cap for some reason. " Same reason Jimmie is officially a Hendrick car. Yes, Jeff owns 75%, but it is entirely Hendrick's CAR. It's his parts, his chasses, etc. 426. Zackary Shawn posted: 08.19.2013 - 3:34 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) My thoughts on recent events/news... 1) The Michigan race. I know a lot of you don't like Joey Logano (for reasons I really don't understand), but I thought it was refreshing to see someone win who doesn't normally win. A lot of people don't like Michigan as a track, but I like it and I thought this race was better than the one in June. I give it 4 stars. 2) Kurt Busch to Stewart-Haas. I have pretty much no doubts that this rumor is true and I feel like it is something that Gene Haas wants more than Tony Stewart. 3) The Martin/Dillon/Vickers/Stewart craziness. So let me get this straight. Stewart-Haas, a Hendrick powered team, gets Austin Dillon, who drives for the rival Chevy team, to fill in for Tony Stewart at Michigan and Talladega. Then, they get Mark Martin, who drove for a rival manufacturer, to fill in for the rest of the races despite the fact that the car Mark Martin used to drive (the 55) is in close competition with the 14 (the car Mark Martin now drives) to make it into the owner's chase. Not to mention another MWR car, the 56, is also in the battle for the owner's chase. Do I have all the right? I guess, in a way, this is justification for all those who were crying foul over ESPN's coverage of the Nationwide owner's championship. If it's not important in Sprint Cup, probably isn't in Nationwide. 427. Zackary Shawn posted: 08.19.2013 - 3:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I forgot one... 4) Ty Dillon to Nationwide in 2014. This means it's a pretty much forgone conclusion that Austin Dillon will be in Cup in 2014 and we are kidding ourselves if we think he won't drive the 3 car. My question is this...if they star a fourth team and put the 3 number on it, will that be more acceptable to the fans who oppose this move than it would be if they changed the 29 back to the 3 since the 29, in terms of continuity, is Earnhardt's old team? 428. cjs3872 posted: 08.19.2013 - 3:38 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Actually, I think that if the Toyota teams ran the more aggressive engine package, then they passed the most critical test of all, which was finishing the race without a single engine failure. They might not have run up front very much, but at least every one of them finished the race without any engine problems, which was more important, especially for Martin Truex, Jr. and Matt Kenseth because of their precarious position in the standings, which got a little more dicey Sunday, since Truex fell out of the top ten to the second Wild Card (the only one currently available for a 1-win driver) and Matt Kenseth slid a little closer to the top ten bubble himself, which is vital to him because of the bonus points, which he would not get if he slid out of the top ten in points after Richmond. And by the way, Mark Martin has been named the replacement for Tony Stewart for the rest of the season, except for Talladega, where he refuses to race. Tony's sub for that race hasn't yet been determined, though we might see Austin Dillon back in the #14 car for that race since the Nationwide Series is off that weekend. That also moves Brian Vickers into the #55 car for the rest of the season, although what happens with hat car at Talladega, where Michael Waltrip was originally slated to drive that car, is yet unknown. If I had to guess, Waltrip would take himself out of that car and put Vickers in it. 429. murb posted: 08.19.2013 - 3:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "If I had to guess, Waltrip would take himself out of that car and put Vickers in it." MWR said in their press release that Michael would drive Talladega, with Vickers driving the rest. 430. murb posted: 08.19.2013 - 3:44 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) So yeah. This race was officially Mark Martin's final start for MWR. I'm interested to see how he does in the 14. 431. cjs3872 posted: 08.19.2013 - 3:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Thank for info, murb. When I wrote that post, I had not seen any of the releases, except for what I saw on the FS1 sports ticker (I have now). So when I wrote that, I combined what I knew with speculation about the Talladega race, though I was right on about who would drive the #14 car there. It wouldn't matter whether or not it was Vickers or Waltrip driving the #55 car at Talladega, since both have proven they can get it done there (both Vickers and Waltrip are past winners of that race). But what could get real interesting there is who the #14 would team up with there in the draft, because the #14 is a Hendrick-supported car, but Austin Dillon is more likely to help one of RCR's cars there, since he's an RCR driver, than he is an HMS or HMS-supported driver. While Dillon isn't a bad choice, I think Regan Smith might have been a better option, if for no other reason than that conflict of interest, which could actually help to decide that race. Again, the Nationwide Series is off that weekend, so if they chose a Nationwide driver, Smith would have been a better choice, due to the affiliation with Hendrick Motorsports that both Smith and SHR have. That situation could bear watching as that race unfolds, because a Hendrick-supported car (the #14) might push an RCR car to victory in that one because of driver affiliations. 432. Rexrobe posted: 08.19.2013 - 4:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I have to say I am seriously hoping that Austin and Pop Pop decide *against* putting him in the #3 for next year. Not for Dale's sake - his legacy stands on it's own and doesn't need protecting - but for Austin's. I am a big fan of his and Ty both, and I think that they both have the potential to win many races and even a few championships. But putting Austin in the 3 will immediately compare him to Dale and anything less than 76 wins and 7 championships will make an otherwise great career seem lackluster in comparison. Austin is a capable driver but doesn't need to be saddled with being the "next Dale" in the eyes of the media and casual fan. 433. David posted: 08.19.2013 - 4:56 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Actually, cjs, Regan Smith may be driving the #51 car at Talladega. 434. ch posted: 08.19.2013 - 5:50 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Actually, Talledega is after the new owners take over (Atlanta). So I doubt that Regan will drive anymore races after that. 435. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.19.2013 - 5:58 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I know I have said this before, but this silly season is off the charts. Unfortunately way more exciting than the actual season. 436. Daniel posted: 08.19.2013 - 6:00 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) 44 entered at Bristol: -Mark Martin in the #14 -Mike Bliss in the #19 -Ken Schrader in the #32 -Tony Raines in the #40 -Ryan Truex in the #51 -Brian Vickers in the #55 -Michael McDowell in the #98 437. David posted: 08.19.2013 - 6:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Actually, Talledega is after the new owners take over (Atlanta). So I doubt that Regan will drive anymore races after that." Well, we'll see. 438. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.19.2013 - 6:08 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) I have to say I am seriously hoping that Austin and Pop Pop decide *against* putting him in the #3 for next year. Not for Dale's sake - his legacy stands on it's own and doesn't need protecting - but for Austin's. I am a big fan of his and Ty both, and I think that they both have the potential to win many races and even a few championships. But putting Austin in the 3 will immediately compare him to Dale and anything less than 76 wins and 7 championships will make an otherwise great career seem lackluster in comparison. Austin is a capable driver but doesn't need to be saddled with being the "next Dale" in the eyes of the media and casual fan. I agree 100%. I do feel Richard is pushing Austin too much to be the next Dale, or at least the next outlaw. The cowboy hat, the peach fuzz, the "I'm here to win every race" bravado before driving like Mark Martin, all too willing to take a Top 10. Let Austin be Austin. 439. Anonymous posted: 08.19.2013 - 6:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) It's been announced Tony is out for the rest of the year 440. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.19.2013 - 6:24 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Sadly, Floyd Ganassi, Chip's father, has passed away at the age of 87. 441. The Long Shot posted: 08.19.2013 - 6:25 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "It's been announced Tony is out for the rest of the year" Unsurprising. I never expected him to come back. Also being reported is that Austin Dillon will return to the #14 at Talladega, while Mark Martin drives the remaining 12 races. 442. The Long Shot posted: 08.19.2013 - 6:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That's sad to hear about Floyd Ganassi. My condolences to the Ganassi family. 443. David posted: 08.19.2013 - 6:30 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Sadly, Floyd Ganassi, Chip's father, has passed away at the age of 87." My condolences to Chip and his family. 444. David posted: 08.19.2013 - 7:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "the "I'm here to win every race" bravado before driving like Mark Martin" /That's/ why they put those two together in the #14 for the rest of the season... "Let Austin be Austin." I'm sure he'd be a lot more likeable, too. 445. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.19.2013 - 8:05 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) I think Austin has the talent to have a nice Cup career and, if he could be himself, have enough likeability to have a good fan base. But if he continues being pushed as the New Age Dale Earnhardt ("we're outlaws turned heroes") it will never work. As Geoff Bodine once said in 1987 (trying to be condescending towards Dale but too wrapped up in trying to sound smart he wound up accidentally complimenting him, the only smart thing about Bodine is his mouth, the yankee bastard) "there is only one Earnhardt". Let him be Austin Dillon. 446. TS1420 posted: 08.19.2013 - 8:33 pm Rate this comment: (3) (0) I'm back from MIS and I had a blast this weekend! Like usual, the truck race was the best race of the year at MIS (just like the truck races are usually the best races of the year at any other track). Good battles for the lead almost the whole race. Glad to see Buescher finally pick up his 1st win of the season. The Cup race a pretty good, better than June, yet at the same time it was pretty lacking. Whatever car got out front stayed there until pit strategies or restart shenanigans. I bet one of the BK Racing cars could have gotten out front and been untouchable. The lack of tire wear was another thing that made the race pretty lacking. Cars with 2 fuel run left sides were running just as fast, if not faster at times, as cars with 4 fresh tires. There was a lot of different strategies, but most of them were just mind boggling (like the 55 trying to go on a 50 lap miracle run). Congrats to Moldy Bread on winning the race. Even though he was one of the drivers I least wanted to see win (made even worse by the fact the driver I most wanted to see win finished 2nd to him...), he had the most consistent cars all race long and earned the victory. The highlight of the weekend was definitely Nap-Time's troubles. First wrecking his super-mobile primary in practice and then his engine having a "nap time" during the race. At least he looked to be on par with the rest of the front runners before his engine expired, unlike in June was he was catching & passing cars like they stood on the brakes and let him by. Bummer to hear Smoke is official done for 2013, but I expected it and it is for the best. No need to pull a Hamlin, rushing back to gain nothing & only to encounter wrecks making things worse. Not too thrilled about The 7th Annual Part-Time Semi-Retirement I'm Just Having Fun Tour Driver running the 14 almost the rest of the season. And what's this tom-foolery about Kurt Busch in a 4th SHR car next year? Either Gene Haas is up to his usual hair-brained schemes or somebody needs to take Smoke's pain pills away from him because they are making him goofy. While Kurt would be a tremendous hire, they do not need to expand yet again. Hell. They are still trying to build back up from the 3 car expansion. Plus this makes them look shady. Canning Newman because of "no sponsorship and no resources to expand" and then expanding & running the 4th car out of pocket 0_o I give the race 7/10 (probably a 6/10 if I watched it on TV). 447. 12345Dude posted: 08.19.2013 - 9:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) RIP Floyd Ganassi it's horrible to lose a loved one. TS what's with the criticism on Mark Martin? It's not talked about on this board or in the NASCAR media but NASCAR is a team sport. The whole teams need to jell and work together in order to find successful. You all need to have amazing chemistry together. As Ryan Newman said in order to succeed in NASCAR the "moons" have to line up perfectly. You need the whole team to jell. I hear with all the time with the Davis Smith podcasts. And on the Verizon Pit Reports and Hotpass. If this is true that Mark will drive the #14 that would be 6 different teams he has raced for in the last 7 years. That is the major reason he isn't finding the same success. More than his age. How can a team jell and how can he find perfect chemistry with racing for that many teams in that short of a time period? Also TS the reason they want Kurt is because Kurt Busch, Dale Earhardt Jr, Jeff Gordon, Jimmie Johnson, Kasey Kahne, Kevin Harvick, Tony Stewart, Jamie McMurray, (and probably) Kyle Larson will be sharing setups. Roush admitted than he needs to move with the times, and that's why he is sharing stuff with Rodger Penske now. He would never dream of that 7 years ago. Remember when the 4 team cap was announced (2005) Roush was having fits. He had at least 2 meetings with NASCAR to change it. That was because he knew other rival teams were creating satalight teams, to share equipment. And he would refuse to do such thing. Up until this year. Even Jack knows how important it is to be sharing setups now. He had no choice. 448. cjs3872 posted: 08.19.2013 - 9:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Last week, I referred to that crazy scenario which would result in a five-way tie for second if the Chase started now and used my weighted system of seeding drivers by position, then adding the bonus points. Well, that exact scenario actually exists this week. I'll post those standings, most likely tomorrow. It's an odd situation, because you have three groups of drivers, if you want to call Jimmie Johnson a group by himself. You have the leader, the five that would be tied for second place, and then the rest of the Chasers. Obviously, there was quite a bit of movement, but now there are only nine Wild Card hopefuls, though there are realistically only 15 drivers battling for 12 spots, as I believe Jamie McMurray is now out of realistic contention, and if he doesn't have a good finish at Bristol Saturday night, Jeff Gordon would join him among those out of realistic contention. You'll see why when the standings are posted. 449. 12345Dude posted: 08.19.2013 - 9:59 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) CJS do you use your own points system for the regular season? Or do you use the 46-42-41-40-39-38 (etc.) NASCAR uses? 450. Anonymous posted: 08.19.2013 - 10:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Does anyone know if Floyd worked in the racing business? 451. cjs3872 posted: 08.19.2013 - 11:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) What I do for my Chase reset standings that I post, 12345Dude, is to use NASCAR's points reset to 2000, what NASCAR gives those that qualify for the Chase, and then seed the teams by points position, giving them three per position in the top ten. That is to say that with the two Wild Cards starting with 2000 points, each position in the top ten is given three extra points above that. For instance, tenth place would get 2003, ninth 2006, all the way to the points leader, who would get 2030. Once that is done, I then use the NASCAR system of awarding three points for each win. What that does is to award both winning races and season-long consistency the same, though it weighs season-long performance slightly more because of the order the bonus points are given. As a result, a driver at the bottom of the Chase that has the most wins can't suddenly vault straight to the top based on wins alone, and someone who's near the top isn't unfairly penalized for not winning as often, if at all. However, it can get those drivers that win a few positions higher, and it can also give a dominant points leader the big advantage he's earned, but a driver isn't unfairly rewarded for a sizeable number of wins with wild inconsistency, nor is he unfairly penalized for consistency without winning. It's a balance between the two. 452. Ched Little posted: 08.20.2013 - 6:37 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Does anyone know if Floyd worked in the racing business? " Da scoop: Floyd told young Chipper he'd buy a CART team if Chip would quit racing. Rest's history 453. JG24FanForever posted: 08.20.2013 - 6:59 am Rate this comment: (1) (1) Obscure stats of the week: The last time Jeff Gordon finished 17th it was at Michigan in 2011, and he followed up that race with 11 consecutive Top 13 finishes with 8 finishes of 6th or better, 5 podium finishes, two seconds and a win at Pocono. With Bristol,Atlanta and Richmond the next three races, i'm betting Gordon cruises into the Chase with ease. If i'm wrong, it doesn't matter. 454. startandparkfan posted: 08.20.2013 - 7:43 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) 49(!) on the entry list for nationwide, including #10 Cole Whitt #14 TBA for now. #16 Ryan Reed #17 Tanner Berryhill #18 Drew Herring #21 Brendan Gaughan #24 Ken Butler #29 Kenny Wallace #33 Ty Dillon #37 Matt DiBenedetto #44 Chad Hackenbracht #74 TBA #79 Kyle Fowler #86 Kevin Lepage a #90 car is entered, no driver yet. #91 Jeff Green, a number change for the first car to Start and Park. wow... 40 on the Truck Entry List, Including #02 Tyler Young #5 TBA #6 Justin Lofton #07 Jake Crum #19 Brad Keselowski #33 Brandon Jones #45 Nate Monteith #51 Kyle Busch #52 Ken Schrader #75 Caleb Holman #78 BJ McLeod #92 Matt McCall #94 Chase Elliott #96 Ben Kennedy 455. startandparkfan posted: 08.20.2013 - 7:44 am Rate this comment: (7) (0) Also, in the Truck race, Mike Harmon will be sponsored by a Bail Bonds company... I find this funny. 456. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.20.2013 - 9:16 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Also, in the Truck race, Mike Harmon will be sponsored by a Bail Bonds company... I find this funny." You've got to be kidding... 457. Daniel posted: 08.20.2013 - 10:20 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Nope, Beaver Bail Bonds which was also on his truck this past week at Michigan. 458. 83andJoe posted: 08.20.2013 - 12:15 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Eric McClure's illness has been identified as acute renal failure...ouch. Jeff Green back in the #14 NNS this week; the #91 is still on the entry list as TBA. 459. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.20.2013 - 1:09 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Eric McClure's illness has been identified as acute renal failure...ouch. That is awful. My prayers to him. 460. cjs3872 posted: 08.20.2013 - 2:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm not sure any of my fellow posters caught it when it aired, but Jeff Gordon said something candid when it came to his subpar qualifying efforts that have gotten him into the two wrecks that are probably going to wind up costing him a spot in the Chase. He said that he had always prided himself on how he qualified, but he also said that he lost confidence in his cars when he qualified, especially after his crash at Kansas in qualifying. He said that he's not confident in what his car's going to do, whether it's going to stick, or whether it's not going to stick. This tells me that he's unsure on the fast tracks, because you don't usually worry about how your car's going to handle on the slower tracks since you're nowhere near as likely to crash on one of the slower tracks. The fact that this dates back to his qualifying crash at Kansas some months back also tells me that his crew chief isn't exactly doing the job when it comes to making him more confident, because that's part of a crew chief's job. They also said on Race Hub today that the #48 team may be trying to help the #24 team in their efforts to get into the Chase, as they recently tested at Richmond. As funny as it might sound, the #48 team would actually want the #24 team to get into the Chase and would benefit by doing so. The reason being that if the #24 makes the Chase, then that's one less team they would have to beat once the Chase starts. For instance, the #22 team of driver Joey Logano would be a much bigger threat to the #48 team than the #24 team would be. In fact, all things being equal this year, if Logano makes the Chase, I believe he would be Ford's best shot at the title this year, over even his teammate Brad Keselowski, or even Carl Edwards, despite the fact that he's been in the top three in points most of the season, because Logano's is the fastest Ford. And if the #48 team can help knock out a bigger threat and put a non-factor in the #24 team in the Chase, that would better their chances at the title. And I also wonder if the higher-ups with HMS had something to do with that, because the #24 team is traditionally the one HMS team the #48 won't help in any way. 461. Cornys posted: 08.20.2013 - 2:39 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) http://espnmediazone.com/us/press-releases/2013/08/saturdays-nascar-sprint-cup-race-to-air-on-alternate-channels-in-seven-markets/ Saturday's IRWIN Tools Night Race will air on ESPN in 6 cities (and the surrounding areas) in favor of NFL scrimmages on ABC :x In Columbus, Ohio (my affiliate) it will be an a station that I don't get and NOT ESPN :X Pass this link on to the IRWIN Tools night race page so that all of us will know where the race is on TV. I'm leaving for Bristol on Friday morning and won't be online again until Sunday night. Is anybody else going? 462. EarnhardtFan posted: 08.20.2013 - 3:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Oh how I dread the next three races. There are still things that could happen to my guy, even though most things short of running out of gas, running over a seagull or hitting an asteroid have already happened. 463. cjs3872 posted: 08.20.2013 - 3:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Okay, here's this week's edition of how the Chase reset would look using my weighted system of seeding drivers by points position then adding the bonus points for each win. The way things fell this week, there would be a five-way tie for second place if my formula was used. Also, both Dale Earnhardt, Jr. and Matt Kenseth slid closer to the 10th place bubble, and with Bristol up next, anything could happen. While Kenseth's in the Chase with his four wins, Dale, Jr. would currently not make it if he slid out since he's winless this season, which now is a distinct possibility, as he's only 24 points up on 11th place. And as always, any ties would be broken by points standings. Here's how the reset would look no using my system: 1. Jimmie Johnson (points leader, 4 wins) 2042 (2030+12) 2. Clint Bowyer (second, no wins) 2027 3. Carl Edwards (third, 1 win) 2027 (2024+3) 4. Kevin Harvick (fourth, 2 win) 2027 (2021+6) 5. Kyle Busch (fifth, 3 wins) 2027 (2018+9) 6. Matt Kenseth (sixth, 4 wins) 2027 (2015+12) 7. Dale Earnhardt, Jr. (seventh, no wins) 2012 8. Brad Keselowski (eighth, no wins) 2009 9. Kurt Busch (ninth, no wins) 2006 10. Greg Biffle (tenth, 1 win) 2006 (2003+3) 11. Kasey Kahne (11th, 2 wins banked) 2000 12. Martin Truex, Jr. (12th, 1 win banked) 2000 NOTES: There was a significant move in the points between sixth and 15th. First, Kurt Busch moved back into the top ten, knocking Martin Truex, Jr. out, though Truex would still be in the Chase as the second Wild Card. But both Kenseth (currently sixth) and Dale, Jr. (currently seventh) moved closer to the Chase bubble. Last week, Kenseth was 36 points ahead f tenth, and now he's just 29, though he's safe with four wins. However, Dale, Jr. took a much harder hit, dropping from 45 points ahead of tenth to just 20 ahead of tenth, and unlike Kenseth, he has no safety net since he's winless. With Tony Stewart officially out for the season, he's also eliminated, though he's still in the top 20 in points. Joey Logano moved into the third position in the Wild Card chase with his win, dropping Ryan Newman down to fourth, as he's now 15th in points, but third among those 1-win drivers out of the top ten, behind both Truex and now Logano. And while Keselowski moved to eighth and Kurt Busch to ninth, they, like Dale, Jr., have no safety net, as they are also winless this season, and with Busch just 2 points ahead of tenth and Keselowski just four points ahead of tenth, and with 11th place Kasey Kahne just four points behind tenth, any misstep by Keselowski and Busch could prove fatal to their Chase chances this year. This week's activities also effectively eliminated Jamie McMurray, as he's now 41 points behind 10th, and also move Jeff Gordon closer to effective elimination, as well, as he's now 26 points behind 10th and without a win this season, and even a win may not help either Gordon or McMurray based on points position. Not currently in the Chase, but still in Wild Card contention: Joey Logano (13th in points, 1 win), Ryan Newman (15th in points, 1 win), Jeff Gordon (14th in points), Jamie McMurray (16th in points), Paul Menard (17th in points), Aric Almirola (19th in points), and Jeff Burton (20th in points). Tony Stewart is now out of it, even though he's 18th in points with a win, since he's out for the season. A driver must be in the top 20 in points to be eligible for a Wild Card spot. And now the feature I introduced last week, the "bubble board", noting who's "X" number of points ahead or behind tenth in points. Since both sixth and seventh slid closer to the bubble, I'll start with sixth this week, and go down as low as 23rd, the last position that could mathematically move up into possible Chase eligibility by the end of the race at Richmond. For drivers out of the top 20, points behind 20th will be noted, instead of behind 10th. 6. Matt Kenseth (4 wins) +29 points 7. Dale Earnhardt, Jr. +20 points 8. Brad Keselowski +4 points 9. Kurt Busch +2 points 10. Greg Biffle (1 win) +/- 0 points 11. Kasey Kahne (2 wins) -4 points 12. Martin Truex, Jr. (1 win) -10 points 13. Joey Logano (1 win) -17 points 14. Jeff Gordon -26 points 15. Ryan Newman (1 win) -27 points 16. Jamie McMurray -41 points 17. Paul Menard -64 points 18. x-Tony Stewart -69 points 19. Aric Almirola -78 points 20. Jeff Burton -105 points --------------------------------------------------- 21. Ricky Stenhouse, Jr. -5 points from 20th 22. Marcos Ambrose -7 points from 20th 23. Juan Montoya -12 points from 20th x-out for the season and eliminated from the Chase if more than one driver that has won is outside the top ten or is out of the top 20 by the end of the Richmond race. NOTE: With the maximum number of points that can be gained in a single race being 47, if a driver is 95+ points behind tenth in points after Saturday night's race at Bristol or 48+ points behind tenth in points after the race at Atlanta the following weekend, he can not enter the top ten by the Chase cutoff, and if he is said distance plus number of wins behind the lowest current Wild Card driver, he will be officially eliminated from Chase contention. 464. kup posted: 08.20.2013 - 3:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Now after 23 races and just 3 before the Chase. Best average finish is 10,0 for #48. So what? 10th in a race equal to 33 points. For 3 races it is 100 pts. So what? #48 has 813 pts #15 has -41 #99 has -51 #29 has -64 So 4 drivers are much likely locked by pts. And 2 drivers have 3+ wins and likely locked by wins: #18 has 3 wins #20 has 4 wins All in all 4+2 = 6 drivers are very likely locked. Others: 20-6 = 14 drivers are not known yet. We have 3 races = 3 wins before the Chase. #5 has 2 wins and most chances to be 7th locked. #16, #56, #22, #39, #14 - all 5 have 1 win each. #88, #2, #78, #24 - all 4 have 0 wins each. So 5+4 = 9 drivers for 5 last Chase spots. And next race @ Bristol will be cool night fight! 465. Dave #38 Fan-Go Gilliland! posted: 08.20.2013 - 5:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Definately keep Eric McClure in your thoughts and prayers. According to wikipedia,"Patients with AKI (acute kidney injury, also know as acute renal failure, which is what he has) are more likely to die prematurely after they were discharged from hospital even if their kidney function has recovered". As a guy with 5 young children, including a newborn, I can't even imagine how he's feeling right now :( 466. David posted: 08.20.2013 - 5:19 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I did look up "acute renal failure" and that's BAD news. I will most certainly pray for him. 467. cjs3872 posted: 08.20.2013 - 5:23 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Kup, take the #14 out in terms of the driver's championship, since Tony Stewart's out for the year. So that would, in your calculations, leave 4 drivers currently with 1 win and 4 with no wins. The owner's Chase is different, because the #14 is certainly up there with a chance to make the owner's Chase with that win and challenging the top ten in owner's points. And with Mark Martin now in the #14 car, it's almost certain that the #14 team will make the owner's Chase if Martin races the way he has over the years. And with two short track races coming up, there's a good chance that the #14 will be in the to ten in owner's points after Richmond. But I think things may became clearer after the upcoming race at Bristol, because I think some potential Chasers may get knocked from contention there. Right now, the best thing that could happen where those 1-win drivers are concerned is if one of those locked into the Chase wins, because that take wins away from others battling for Wild Card spots. Wins by someone like Jimmie Johnson, Matt Kenseth, Kyle Busch, or even someone like Denny Hamlin, who we know is out of Chase contention, is actually good news for those 1-win drivers battling for Wild Card spots since those drivers don't threaten them in any way, as far as their wins affecting their Chase chances, since they're either solidly in or already eliminated from Chase contention. In other words, we could see some unusual alliances in these next three races. For instance, Joey Logano would actually want to see Denny Hamlin win a race rather, say Jeff Gordon, Martin Truex, Jr., Ryan Newman, or even Dale Earnhardt, Jr., Kurt Busch, or even his own teammate Brad Keselowski. We could see some odd alliances in the next three races for that reason. 468. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.20.2013 - 6:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I did look up "acute renal failure" and that's BAD news. I will most certainly pray for him. Oh yeah. The kidneys are responsible for regulating so much more in your body than you realize. When I studied that in school, I was certainly surprised. And when they stop working, it has dire effects on the other organs including the heart and lungs. I was very sad to hear this and am praying as well. Medication and dialysis have come a long way, so hopefully he can maintain a good quality of life. But it will be tough. 469. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.20.2013 - 6:13 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) As funny as it might sound, the #48 team would actually want the #24 team to get into the Chase and would benefit by doing so. I'm telling you, he isn't being hamstrung by the 48, he isn't aggressive enough behind the scenes. He as truly allowed the 24 to become the new 25 car, something I NEVER thought I would see. He needs to go to the HMS brass and have some very unpleasant conversations. 470. DB1995 posted: 08.20.2013 - 6:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) came home from school to hear about Eric Mcclure, and its only bad news hes probably the nicest guy in NASCAR, is he a great driver? No, is he better than some? yes, he did at least know how to get his slow car out of the way, I really dont think we will see him back this sounds serious and hes to much of a family man to risk much more, i just hope Hefty stays and will Sponsor either cole whitt or Jeff Green in the ride, or even Hackenbracht, if Mcclure cant return 471. cjs3872 posted: 08.20.2013 - 6:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) DSFF, I'm certain that Jeff Gordon isn't being hamstrung by the #48 team, especially since they're no longer in the same shop. And as for your saying he isn't aggressive behind the scenes, he's never been that way because he doesn't have that personality. However, if you saw the interview he did which aired earlier today on Race Hub, then you'd know that what he said more or less confirmed what I said about him on high speed tracks. He said that ever since he crashed in qualifying at Kansas that he has not had trust or confidence in what his car was going to do when he qualifies, and I think that without actually saying it, he said that he unsure of what his car's going to do on the high-speed tracks and is not confident in what the car's going to do when he tries to run it hard for qualifying. If what he said about it going back to Kansas is true, then this goes back about three or four months, and his crew chief has not given him confidence that the car's going to stick when he qualifies or runs it hard. If that's true, then that's also what cost him the race at Pocono, which in turn may cost him a spot in the Chase, because if he wins that race, he would be just six points out of a Wild Card and not have to win a race, instead of being 26 points out of the top ten. If what he said is true, and I have no reason to believe it isn't, then he's suffering from a lack of confidence when he has to run hard, especially on faster tracks, a lack of confidence that his crew chief certainly isn't helping him with. In effect, he's right where Dale Earnhardt, Jr. was at the end of the 2010 season, where that's concerned. Now Dale, Jr.'s not winning any races, but he's usually up there in points, or has been since Steve Letarte became his crew chief, even battling for the lead last year, while Gordon has not gotten to a good start since Letarte was moved off his pit box, and it's probably going to catch up to him this year, as it frankly should have done last year. Gordon has a look of a beaten driver, but even worse, he's now admitted that he's no longer a confident driver when it comes to getting speed out of the car when he needs it, and he needs to have that confidence, as all drivers do, and he does not. To me, his saying that he doesn't have much confidence when he has to max the car out is about as damning a statement about a crew chief's ability to set up a car as it gets, and that to me is a direct shot across the bow of Alan Gustafson and those setting up his car, whether he realizes it or not. But what Gordon said in his interview just backs up the dejection seen in his interview after his crash at Watkins Glen, because you could almost see that Gordon's confidence was shot in that interview, and the interview that aired today seemingly backs that up. If he was driving for someone like Richard Childress or Jack Roush, and they saw that out of such an elite driver, I could almost guarantee there would be almost immediate changes, but Rick Hendrick has always seemed to be a "hands-off" owner to me, letting those beneath him make the racing-related decisions, so I don't think any changes would be made until after the season, unless Gustafson decided to leave on his own, much like Robbie Loomis did in 2005, the last time Gordon missed the Chase. 472. Eric posted: 08.20.2013 - 6:49 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) cjs3872, You should rule out Hamlin having a possibility to win at Bristol. Denny hasn't been right in the car since the Dover crash. I know Denny finished 8th at the first Pocono race, but he has been terrible in the car since the 1st Michigan race. The fact Denny finshed 21st at Loudon this year, tells us something about Denny. Loudon is one of Denny's strongest tracks. It is true that Denny and the 11 team started slow before the Auto Club crash, but the team really went downhill after the first Pocono race. The fact is when Denny return, He had 3 top 10's in 4 starts. Since than, Denny hasn't had a top 10 in 9 straight races. 473. Jim Davis posted: 08.20.2013 - 7:02 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) "He needs to go to the HMS brass and have some very unpleasant conversations." About what? This is how that unpleasant conversation would go: Gordon: "Rick, you're not giving me what I need to be competitive." Hendrick: "Jeff, what am I not giving you? What have I ever refused to give you in the last 20 years?" What do you imagine the HMS brass not doing that it should be doing? Or what is it doing that it should not be doing? Gordon is one of the highest paid drivers in the series. There is no way Hendrick is paying him that kind of money and not giving him what he thinks he needs to be competitive. That just makes no sense. It would be like Brady sitting on the bench while Tebow runs the offense. "I did look up "acute renal failure" and that's BAD news." Indeed, we all wish McClure the best. Could this possibly be a consequence of that crash last year that kept him out for a few weeks? 474. cjs3872 posted: 08.20.2013 - 7:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Eric, there's another factor involved in Denny's struggles this year that could have been foreseen before the season even started, and that was the addition of Matt Kenseth to the JGR team. Remember that any time JGR has tried to bolster one of it's teams, another has paid the price. It happened when Hamlin was brought to JGR in late 2005, with the #18 flagship car being affected. It happened again in 2008 when Gibbs revived his flagship #18 car when he hired Kyle Busch, with the #20 team paying the price. Remember that Tony Stewart had the worst season of his career until this year in 2008. And it happened yet again this year when Gibbs brought Matt Kenseth to bring the #20 team back. It did, but the #11 paid the price. Denny Hamlin was struggling even before his injuries at California. Sure he was sixth in points after Bristol, but only once had he managed a finish better than 14th, and only a gamble by Darian Grubb even gave him a chance at California, so Hamlin was struggling even before he got hurt, and I think that has to do with Gibbs bolstering the #20 car, because every time he's done that, another of his teams have paid the price. Frankly, I'm not sure Hamlin would be in Chase contention this year, even if he hadn't gotten hurt because of how he was struggling. Ironically, his two best races came in the two races after he returned. 475. murb posted: 08.20.2013 - 7:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I hope Eric McClure gets well soon. That's terrible. 476. Eric posted: 08.20.2013 - 7:21 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) cjs3872, There is a problem with your theory with Tony Stewart at JGR in 2008. Stewart wanted out of Gibbs in 2008 because Gibbs went to Toyota That means do we really know how much focus he had at JGR in 2008 since he didn't want to be there even before the start of the season. The fact is Stewart's race teams outside of NASCAR was supported by Chevy and Tony in 2008 also had a personal contract with GM. That put Stewart in 2008 was racing in an uncomfortable situation because has had in interest in 2008 to stay with GM because of his race teams outside of NASCAR use GM. When a driver wants out of a contract or in a lame duck season, that driver usually doesn't have their best season with that team. The fact is even without Kyle Busch, Stewart would have had his worst season at Gibbs due to the fact Stewart didn't want to be at Gibbs anymore thanks to Gibbs going to Toyota. 477. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.20.2013 - 9:04 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Having had relatives suffer from renal failure, I will keep Eric in my prayers. 478. The Long Shot posted: 08.20.2013 - 9:05 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) This is awful news about Eric McClure. I knew as soon as I saw "acute renal failure" that it had something to do with kidney failure, and my fears apparently have been confirmed. All I can say is that I desperately hope he can survive this potentially life-threatening episode. Get well soon, Eric. The 27th-place spot on the finishing order needs you. 479. The Long Shot posted: 08.20.2013 - 10:42 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Great news: McClure apparently is headed home from the hospital today. 480. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.21.2013 - 12:18 am Rate this comment: (2) (2) . He said that ever since he crashed in qualifying at Kansas that he has not had trust or confidence in what his car was going to do when he qualifies, and I think that without actually saying it, he said that he unsure of what his car's going to do on the high-speed tracks and is not confident in what the car's going to do when he tries to run it hard for qualifying. If what he said about it going back to Kansas is true, then this goes back about three or four months, and his crew chief has not given him confidence that That is because his cars are not being engineered properly. Look at Jimmie and Kasey. They are two classic "wheel holders" who have shown the most speed on the big tracks this year befause their cars are engineered to be super fast and stable. If Jeff, a wheel man, had those cars he'd make Nap Time and The Android look sick. And Jim Davis, as for the conversations he needs to be having, they need to be about changes to his team to get his car where the other 3 are (the 88 has also been fast, but Joon isn't even a wheel holder). Everytime the 48 or 5 has a dropped lugnut or twitches on the track, Chad and Kenny Francis have changes made by mid week. Jeff needs to demand another strong willed crew chief who won't let things keep falling behind, another Ray Evernham type. Remember, Chad is an Evernham disciple. 481. Jim Davis posted: 08.21.2013 - 1:04 am Rate this comment: (3) (0) "They are two classic "wheel holders" who have shown the most speed on the big tracks this year befause their cars are engineered to be super fast and stable." "Super fast and stable" is a contradiction. Stable means tight which means difficult to turn. And it is hard to get fast lap times with a car that plows through corners. "If Jeff, a wheel man, had those cars he'd make Nap Time and The Android look sick." Gordon can have those cars anytime he wants them. The problem is that he can't drive them. He has tried in the past. You have to let go of this notion that Johnson and Kahne are mediocre drivers. Nobody goes to the trouble and expense of building fast cars and sticks mediocre drivers in them. At this stage of their careers Johnson and Kahne are better drivers than Gordon. Johnson is one of the very best ever. It's hard to take people seriously when they denigrate his driving ability. My father hated Elvis Presley (I know I'm showing my age here) but he never claimed Presley couldn't sing. "Jeff needs to demand another strong willed crew chief who won't let things keep falling behind, another Ray Evernham type." Gordon can have another crew chief anytime he wants one. He just has to say the word to Hendrick and Gustavson will be reassigned and someone else will be atop the 24 pit box. But I don't think Gordon thinks that Gustavson is the problem. And I'm not too sure that at this stage in his career Gordon wants a perfectionist like Evernham or Knaus. Evernham or Knaus are very demanding of their drivers and I'm not sure Gordon wants to return to that type of micromanagement. He might accept Evernham if Evernham was willing to return to the pit box (unlikely in my opinion) but I can't see him towing the line for some guy in his 20s who learned his craft under Knaus. I think we all have to face the reality that Gordon is not the driver he once was. He doesn't suck; he's still a chase threat. Most drivers can't say that. He just isn't in the championship conversation every year like he used to be. 482. David posted: 08.21.2013 - 6:45 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Johnson is one of the very best ever. It's hard to take people seriously when they denigrate his driving ability." Considering that DSFF thinks that Johnson is better than Gordon overall (let's not start that debate /again/, please please pretty please??), I think he would say that Johnson is the best wheel-holder ever. "I think we all have to face the reality that Gordon is not the driver he once was. He doesn't suck; he's still a chase threat. Most drivers can't say that. He just isn't in the championship conversation every year like he used to be." Absolutely. I agree with that 100%. And the fact is, Gordon, at 42, is still among the upper echelon of drivers in the garage today. That's pretty amazing. "My father hated Elvis Presley (I know I'm showing my age here)" Haha, you're never too old for this site. Spen is living proof of that. 483. cjs3872 posted: 08.21.2013 - 9:29 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Let's just put it this way. I don't think Jeff's cars would this far out to lunch compared to his teammates if someone like Jimmy Fennig or Todd Parrott were his crew chief, nor do I think he'd have this "down" attitude if either one of those guys were his crew chief, because I seriously doubt they would let him have that kind of attitude. Those guys are leaders, unlike Jeff's current crew chief, and part of the job of a leader is to pick someone up when he's down, and apparently, that's something that Alan Gustafson can't do either, because if he could, Jeff wouldn't have the defeatist attitude he has now. Just look at how Fennig turned around the careers of Mark Martin and now he's done the same with Carl Edwards, and Parrott turned Marcos Ambrose and even Aric Almirola into drivers that could contend. They are examples of the leadership skills needed to be an elite-level crew chief. Jeff's current crew chief, Alan Gustafson, doesn't have that trait, or at least hasn't shown that he has that trait, nor does he seem to be a leader, and that to me is the biggest prerequisite to be a crew chief. 484. Anonymous posted: 08.21.2013 - 12:22 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) Jeff, at worst, will finish third among the Hendrick cars in points again this season. 485. 83andJoe posted: 08.21.2013 - 2:42 pm Rate this comment: (4) (0) Meanwhile, it's been announced that Trevor Bayne will be back in the #6 Nationwide car next year, with full-season Advocare sponsorship. 486. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.21.2013 - 2:43 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Jim Davis, we actually agree. That is what I'm saying, Jeff needs to go to the top and demand these things. I have no doubt he could get them if he wanted. But I do think it would take more than a "may I please have a real crew chief?". And obviously Jimmie and Kasey are good. Even to be a "wheel holder" you need talent to drive the car fast. But it takes something extra to be a "wheelman" where you can actually race others cars when the time comes (think Jimmie at Kentucky, he botched a restart and couldn't even make it to turn 2 without losing it all on his own and throwing the race away) and also give the car a little extra when it isn't just right (think Jimmie on the road courses this year). And that is why I can't stand Logano's steering wheel celebration. When he does that he is saying "I am a wheel man". He did a great job in this race, but he is no wheelman. When Dale did that at Sears Point '95, nothing could have been more perfect. He was THE wheelman. He could wheel a car just as good as classic wheelmen like Fireball, Junior, Buddy, Tim, and Ernie while still winning lots of races and championships. Which is why I have him #1 all time. I am actually more offended by Joey's celebrations than the #3 returning to Cul with a conservative driver. 487. murb posted: 08.21.2013 - 2:52 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Meanwhile, it's been announced that Trevor Bayne will be back in the #6 Nationwide car next year, with full-season Advocare sponsorship." I wish he could get a full time Cup ride. I feel like he's ready. But luckily there should be some good options for him for 2015. Biffle is a free agent after next year, so I could potentially see Trevor winding up in the 16 for 2015 if Biffle has a bad year and doesn't resign. 488. cjs3872 posted: 08.21.2013 - 2:55 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) How do you figure that, @484? If Jeff's the only Hendrick drier that misses the Chase, and I think he probably will be, he'll obviously be last among the Hendrick drivers and finish 13th-15th in points (I don't see him finishing any lower, even if he misses the Chase). I still think Dale, Jr. makes it, but just plain bad luck has made it much more difficult on him. The only reason he's in any danger of missing the Chase has to do with the mechanical problem that Marcos Ambrose had at Watkins Glen, which got him in a wreck, and a blown right front tire. That's nothing but just plain bad luck. If even one of those two things had not happened, he'd be solidly in the Chase, in my view. And can you believe what Steve Byrnes said in the lead-in to the segment on today's Race Hub on Ernie Irvan? He said that Irvan had 13 wins in a 15-year career. In fact, everyone should know that Irvan won 15 times, not 13. His Cup career lasted 13 seasons. You would think that someone who's been around NASCAR as long as Byrnes has would know that, and he didn't even correct himself at the end of the segment, or the program. The only thing that corrected him was a graphic shown at the end of the segment which correctly said he had 15 wins. If I was FOX, I would want someone that actually knows what he's talking about on the program, because that's pure maleficence. How could someone who was around NASCAR for Irvan's entire career (1987-'99) not even know how many races he won? 489. murb posted: 08.21.2013 - 2:57 pm Rate this comment: (0) (1) "And that is why I can't stand Logano's steering wheel celebration." Me neither. It really bothered me when he did an interview where he said, "Yeah, that's just a celebration that I came up with". Uh, no. Earnhardt was doing that when you were in diapers. 490. murb posted: 08.21.2013 - 3:03 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) lol, Looks like Roush spilled the beans about Austin Dillon moving to Cup next year. From their press release about Trevor/Advocare: "AdvoCare served as the sponsor on the #3 car of Austin Dillon the past two seasons. With Dillon making the move to full-time NASCAR Sprint Cup Series racing in 2014, the organization began the process of diligently seeking out its best option moving forward." 491. cjs3872 posted: 08.21.2013 - 3:06 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) And murb, let's also hope for Trevor's sake that Roush actually gives him competitive engines and a reputable teammate, because he currently has neither. Roush's de-tuning of his engines has again reared it's ugly head this year with the return of Penske to Ford, both in the Nationwide Series and the Cup Series, and Roush also needs to put someone in his second car that's actually capable of competing, because the driver he's currently got in that car has proven he can't. For all intents and purposes, Bayne's effectively driving for a single-car team in the Nationwide Series, and it's showing. Some have called his performances underachieving this year. Compared to the previous two years, that might be true, but considering all the circumstances, if anything, he might be overachieving in that car, considering his car is down on horsepower and he doesn't have a reputable teammate. And the loss of Matt Kenseth and the inability to replace him with someone with very much knowledge of the inner-workings of the car has hurt the entire Roush organization this year. And also, if Roush moves Trevor Bayne up in 2015, and I think it would be a big mistake for Trevor to stay with Roush much longer, and he ends up replacing Greg Biffle, I look for the number of the car to lose the "1" and become Roush's flagship #6. After all, there's a reason why Roush didn't give Ricky Stenhouse, Jr. that number and I believe we're all finding out why this year. To not have even a single top ten finish two-thirds of the way through the season in what was a championship-contending car (he's 0-for-23 in that regard). I think Roush had a feeling something like that might happen, which is why he didn't give him his flagship number. 492. MStall41 posted: 08.21.2013 - 3:52 pm Rate this comment: (4) (0) Yeah, Logano is super horrible for believing he is a great wheelman. How dare he have confidence in himself and his abilities! Oh the humanity! 493. DB1995 posted: 08.21.2013 - 4:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) My hope for the truck win tonight is: Brad keselowski, that way he can get his important to him Trucks win and never race a truck again 494. Jim Davis posted: 08.21.2013 - 5:56 pm Rate this comment: (2) (1) "...Jeff needs to go to the top and demand these things." What has Hendrick ever denied him? Gordon doesn't have to demand anything. "But it takes something extra to be a "wheelman"..." Wheelman: a driver DSFF likes. Wheelholder: a driver DSFF doesn't like. "...think Jimmie at Kentucky, he botched a restart and couldn't even make it to turn 2 without losing it all on his own and throwing the race away..." Or think Gordon at Watkins Glen a few weeks later. Citing single examples without context is useless. Johnson has been leading the points and has had a huge point lead for months now. He doesn't need to protect a lead; wins are the only results that carry over into the chase. Naturally, he takes more risks than Gordon who is hovering on the fringe of contention with no wins. Gordon has to play it safe. Nevertheless, he still spun out all by his lonesome on a *road course*. Babe Ruth and Hank Aaron struck out a lot. But they also hit a lot of home runs. I think Johnson has a better grasp of proper risk management than Gordon. If that makes him a "wheelholder" then Gordon should learn how to become one. 495. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.21.2013 - 7:04 pm Rate this comment: (1) (1) ""...Jeff needs to go to the top and demand these things." What has Hendrick ever denied him? Gordon doesn't have to demand anything. "But it takes something extra to be a "wheelman"..." Wheelman: a driver DSFF likes. Wheelholder: a driver DSFF doesn't like. "...think Jimmie at Kentucky, he botched a restart and couldn't even make it to turn 2 without losing it all on his own and throwing the race away..." Or think Gordon at Watkins Glen a few weeks later. Citing single examples without context is useless. Johnson has been leading the points and has had a huge point lead for months now. He doesn't need to protect a lead; wins are the only results that carry over into the chase. Naturally, he takes more risks than Gordon who is hovering on the fringe of contention with no wins. Gordon has to play it safe. Nevertheless, he still spun out all by his lonesome on a *road course*. Babe Ruth and Hank Aaron struck out a lot. But they also hit a lot of home runs. I think Johnson has a better grasp of proper risk management than Gordon. If that makes him a "wheelholder" then Gordon should learn how to become one. " Damn it, dude. You need to quit being so insulting in your arguments. Besides, Gordon's wreck was the result of aerodynamic flaws in the Gen-6 causing aero push, the same type of physical phenomenon that makes a plane crash. With all the crap happening here lately, we don't need people trying to start fights again. 496. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.21.2013 - 7:06 pm Rate this comment: (2) (1) It didn't post right. Jim Davis, we have already had that whole discussion, and agreement was that Jeff's wreck was the result of "aero push", which is the same phenomenon that makes planes wreck on runways in windy conditions. Calm down, dude. Quit trying to start fights here. We have had enough issues here lately, and if you're going to try to start some more fights maybe you need to take a few days and stay away. 497. Anonymous posted: 08.21.2013 - 8:51 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "The sport was made on fights. We should have more fights. I like fights," Kevin Harvick 498. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.22.2013 - 6:39 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) Geoff Bodine was a wheelman. Jim Davis, your theory just went straight to hell. And I am far from a member of Rainbow Nation. I spent a long time rooting like hell against Jeff. Just because I am finally willing to admit there is a lot I respect about him doesn't make him a driver I "like". But he is a legend, and currently a rare active legend. And I would like to see him win live at Martinsville one last time. For once, after one of his wins, I won't be making a mad rush out of the track. 499. cjs3872 posted: 08.22.2013 - 9:00 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) And also DSFF, the thing about Bodine that backs up your theory was that, even though he won just 18 times, most of those wins came on tougher tracks, such as North Wilkesboro, Martinsville, Pocono, Dover (I didn't know he had won there), and all three of the road courses, Riverside, Sonoma, and Watkins Glen. But then again, most of the top AND second-tier drivers, and Bodine was a second-tier driver in his era, were what you call "wheelmen", because they had to be. And also, the fact that he won three times at Pocono and on each of the three road courses show how versatile he was, a fact backed up by his 1987 IROC championship. Unfortunately, Bodine may also be partially remembered for the fact that two of his wins came in races that had tragic courses of events, the 1988 race at Pocono in which Bobby Allison nearly lost his life, and the 1994 race at Michigan where Ernie Irvan nearly lost his life with a championship within reach. And that's the one big difference between today's era and the era Bodine raced in. While the top-tier drivers of the two eras were of the same quality, the second-tier drivers of today, and you can name any number of them, can't even compare to the second-tier drivers of the era in which Bodine raced, which is why we both say that the era from 1985-2000 was the toughest in the sport's history, and it would have been even tougher if it wasn't for what happened to the likes of Irvan, Davey Allison, and Alan Kulwicki. In fact, with all the active drivers today with 20 or more victories, it's hard to imagine that at the end of 1996, there were only four active drivers with that many wins, Darrell Waltrip, Dale Earnhardt, Bill Elliott, and Rusty Wallace. But a number of others had between 14-19 wins, not to mention Davey Allison, who won 19 times, and Harry Gant and Neil Bonnett, who each won 18 times. 500. cjs3872 posted: 08.22.2013 - 9:10 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Here's some interesting news, and it could be bad news for Jimmie Johnson fans. Johnson's second child is due on the weekend of the first Chase race at Chicago. Hopefully, he won't get called back that weekend, particularly Saturday night, because it could cause him to miss the first race of the Chase. And even though that might make things more interesting where the championship is concerned, it might also taint the championship for whoever else might take advantage of that and win it. Let's hope that Johnson doesn't have to miss that race, because if there's any season in which he deserves to win the title, it's this season. If someone else beats him running all the Chase races, that's one thing, but if someone else wins the title just because he's off for more important business (the birth of his second child), then whoever else wins the title might as well have an asterisk by his mane for this year. And yes, I'd say that if another to contender had to miss a race for the same reason and Johnson won the title because of it. But it could also produce the scenario of having different driver's and owner's champions in the Cup Series this year, which would be fitting, as bizarre as this year has been so far. 501. Jared DiCarlo posted: 08.22.2013 - 10:22 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Where's the Donny Lia bucket when you need it? 502. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.22.2013 - 3:16 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Jimmie Johnson fans" Isn't that an oxymoron or something? All kidding aside, I have to wonder how he would be viewed if he took a Chase race off for the birth of his child. I'm sure a lot of the haters (or dislikers) would try to say he just can't handle the pressure so he's giving himself an excuse. Among NASCAR fans at large, he'd either gain a lot of sympathy similar to Hunter Mahan leaving the Canadian Open while leading, or he'd be viewed as not a real racer. Better yet, what if he took a race off and STILL won the championship? That's probably not very likely, but it's not impossible. If Johnson is beat, I'd like to see it happen on the track, and I'm sure the eventual champion would feel a lot more worthy that way also. Of course, I am sure they would also feel a lot more worthy if Tony Stewart was still in the car, but that can't be changed at this point. 503. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.22.2013 - 3:42 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) They can induce labor. Hell, Darrell had the same scenario happen way back in 1987 when he was expecting his first child. He said he was worrying himself sick, mostly because he and Stevie had the misfortune of several miscarraiges and now, as they were 40, they were finally having one go to term. But he also worried about stuff like "What if she is born this Sunday, I gotta be at Dover, or this Sunday I gotta be at Martinsville" to which he had a doctor reply "you guys have anything planned this Tuesday?". "In fact, with all the active drivers today with 20 or more victories, it's hard to imagine that at the end of 1996, there were only four active drivers with that many wins, Darrell Waltrip, Dale Earnhardt, Bill Elliott, and Rusty Wallace. But a number of others had between 14-19 wins, not to mention Davey Allison, who won 19 times, and Harry Gant and Neil Bonnett, who each won 18 times." That really hammers home the point of how stacked and competitive that era was. Also how you can't trust raw stats to tell the whole story. Another consideration for that era: from '85-'92 there were only 28 or 29 races on the schedule making wins harder to come by. In this stacked era, it only cracked 30 races in '93 when Loudon was added to the schedule, then 31 in '94 with The Brickyard. And as for Geoff his prime as a driver coincided EXACTLY with NASCAR's toughest era ('84-'96). Considering the amount of ride movement he did over that time as well as the fact he was almost always in inconsistent equipment which is why he never contended for a championship (the only exception was his two years with Junior Johnson including 1990 when he finished a career high 3rd) and he definitely was a wheelman. He may have been, and still is, a smart mouthed, know it all, condescending, dumbass yankee bastard, but he could drive a race car. 504. cjs3872 posted: 08.22.2013 - 7:05 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Another thing that made that particular era more difficult, DSFF, was the sheer number of organizations in the sport at that time. In fact, there were only two multi-car teams, Hendrick Motorsports and Junior Johnson's team, and Junior didn't always run two cars. But many of those teams could win, often when least expected. But today, car owners can actually control who contends for wins by stacking particular teams for that organization, because there are so few organizations that truly contend on a weekly basis. For instance, not only did 14 drivers win races, but 14 different teams/organizations won races that year. But so far, even though 13 drivers have won races this year, only nine organizations have won races, one of which was Front Row Motorsports' maiden win at Talladega, where literally anyone can win. In fact, there's no top-tier organization that hasn't won yet this year, and the only organization that hasn't yet won this year that I think possibly could is Chip Ganassi's organization. (Sorry, but Furniture Row just doesn't have the people to get it done in the pits.) That's the key difference between now and then. Car owners can actually pick and choose who they want to succeed, and everyone else struggles. 505. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.22.2013 - 7:28 pm Rate this comment: (4) (0) Admit, it, DSFF: if Geoff Bodine is one of your favorite drivers ever. 506. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.22.2013 - 8:42 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) ^No. I respect his ability behind the wheel, and that is about it. 507. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.22.2013 - 9:43 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Except for the gentle "smart mouth Yankee bastard" mentions you generally are positive about him. It's kind of like the love-hate that I have for Rusty. I hate him as a Jeff fan, but I love Rusty for being Rusty. 508. Baker posted: 08.22.2013 - 10:01 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Well my NASCAR predictions suck and I have a free minute tonight, so I am going to give my NFL predictions. Instead of giving a break down of each teams finishing record I am just going to rank each team where I believe they finish. It is impossible to predict those freak upsets and let downs, but at the end of the year the cream always rises to the top. 32. Oakland 31. Jacksonville 30. Buffalo 29. Arizona 28. Carolina 27. New York(J) 26. Philadelphia 25. Tennessee 24. Tampa Bay 23. Cleveland 22. San Diego 21. Detroit 20. Cincinnati 19. Washington 18. Minnesota 17. St. Louis 16. Pittsburgh 15. Miami 14. Chicago 13. Dallas(missing the playoffs again despite a 10-6 record) Now its time for the playoff teams. Wildcard losers 12. Indianapolis lost at Denver 11. Kansas City lost at Baltimore 10. New Orleans lost at New York(G) 9. Atlanta lost against San Francisco Divisional losers 8. Baltimore lost at New England 7. New York(G) lost at Green Bay 6. Houston lost against Denver 5. Seattle lost against San Francisco Championship losers 4. Green Bay lost against San Francisco 27-24 3. New England lost against Denver 37-35 Super Bowl San Francisco defeats Denver aka Peyton Manning and John Fox choke another one away. 509. Baker posted: 08.22.2013 - 10:20 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Top 10 best games to watch this up coming season :: 10. Baltimore at Denver -defending champs opening on the road against a Doom/Miller-less defense. 9. Denver at Houston - Peyton Manning has made a living shredding Houston but now we get to see if Houston is ready to come of age are they just another pretender? 8. New England at Atlanta -Tom Brady vs. the high flying affair of Ryan/Jones/White and Gonzo with newly added power back Jackson. Enjoy every Atlanta game you can as it will be the last 16-19 games we get to see the true greatness of Tony Gonzalez. 7. Green Bay at Baltimore -New look champs get a tough test at home when Aaron Rogers brings a hungry Packers team to town. I predict Rogers to carve up Suggs and the Lewis-less defense up to the tune of 30+ points and 450+ yards to put an end to the Baltimore/Pittsburgh dominance. 6. New England at Baltimore -Always seems to be a great game every year and some very bad blood between to two squads. Again, thought, I predict Tom Brad makes easy work of the once tough but not anymore Ravens squad. 5. New Orleans at New England - Dree Brees and Tom Brady on the field against 2 horrible defenses is going to be and offensive fans paradise for 60 minutes. Payton and Belichek will be hard at trying to out chess they other to prove their superiority and you know Drew Brees and Tom Brady will both be looking to out duel they other. I put the over/under at 9 touchdown passes. 4. San Francisco at Seattle. -We are in the early stages of what looks to be the next great rivalry between two teams with bad blood, bad attitudes and bad intentions toward each other on the field. Couple that with the intense atmosphere at Questfield and the 9ers are going to be in for a dog fight. I predict a very low scoring game that wouldn't entertain the causal fan, but have football junkies such as myself on the edge of my seat and drooling over the great defense. 3. Green Bay at San Francisco -I don't think we see Colin Kaepernick and the 49ers catch the Packers off guard the way they did last season. I believe the 49ers are the most well rounded and best team in football, however, when Aaron Rogers has something to prove I wouldn't bet against him. 2. Denver at New England -I only rank this game so highly because I am really excited to see how Peyton Manning, Wes Welker, and John Fox think they are going to out smart Brady and Beliechek just to get squashed. I like Peyton don't get me wrong, but he has proven time and time again he is not the man you want if you had 1 game to win. 1. Seattle at San Francisco -Seattle has always been a terrible road team until late last season when they starting winning some road contest. For the first time in franchise history they have the talent to be an upper echelon team and this game is going to signify a lot of where they are going in the near future. A well coached, competitive and creative team but they need to learn to win these tough games on the road. On the flip side San Francisco has clearly established themselves as the bully in the NFC and cannot afford to let that get away from them this early in their Super Bowl window. 510. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.23.2013 - 12:06 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) At #28, you may have my Panthers ranked too high. They have a brutal schedule, a team with little talent and depth, and Cam Newton. I'm not ruling out 3-13. I predict San Franciso beats the Texans in the Super Bowl. I look for the Broncos to have the best record in the league before Peyton gets his 9th playoff one and done. The combo of him, John Fox, and Wes Welker as the top receiver is a perfect recipe for playoff disaster. That would also be Peyton's 6th home playoff loss. To put that in perspective, Montana only had two home playoff "losses", one of which came when he was leading the Giants when Richard Marshall knocked him into the next millenium, then Steve Young did nothing, Roger Craig fumbled, and the defense gave up field goals. The other was in '87 when Joe just plain laid an egg against the underrated Vikings team of the 80's. It will also allow Peyton to beak the tie he holds with Favre for most playoff losses. Fitting. They have all the numbers, and the media slobbers all over both of them, but Eli and Big Ben each habe more Super Bowl rongs than them. Again, don't trust numbers alone. 511. The Long Shot posted: 08.23.2013 - 12:19 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "30. Buffalo" Too low. E.J. Manuel has looked better than expected this preseason, so if/when he acquires the starting job, the Bills' offense might actually be a bit of a threat. I could see this Buffalo team getting to 6-7 wins this year. "27. New York(J)" Too high. If it weren't for the sheer ineptitude of Oakland, the Jets would be the worst team in the league. "20. Cincinnati 19. Washington 18. Minnesota" Too low. All 3 teams have fairly good chances to make the playoffs this year, especially Cincinnati, which is almost guaranteed at least a wild card spot this year. "16. Pittsburgh" WAY too high. I can't see Pittsburgh getting more than 6 wins this year. Roethlisberger isn't what he used to be, the running game needs work, and their defense is rebuilding. I'll probably make my own season predictions within the next few days for my NFL blog, which apparently is now bi-weekly instead of weekly. Curse my ever-changing schedule. 512. 12345Dude posted: 08.23.2013 - 2:10 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) @ DSFF DSFF you have to stop with this "wheel holder stuff". I respect your opinions but this just seems so foolish. So your saying Jeff is a "wheel man" and Jimmie is a "wheel holder"? Then can you explain why Jimmie has done better than Jeff every single year he has been in the cup series? (Yes in 2002 Jeff did finish 1 spot better in the standings. But Jimmie was a rookie. And in your words DSFF from a while back you said that Jimmie had a better year because he lead the standings that year and Jeff didn't) And you guys say that Jimmie is getting the best equipment. There screwing Jeff over. Jeff needs to be more assertive and ask for better equipment. Well explain to me how Jimmie has done better than Jeff every single year he has been in Cup. You want me to believe that Rick was giving Jimmie better equipment than Jeff in 2002 & 2003. Before the 2002 season Jeff had won 50 of the last 197 races. And 4 of the last 7 championships. Yet you want me to accept that Rick was giving Jimmie definitely better equipment in 2002, & 2003. Jimmie was beating Jeff. And Jimmie was brand new to the Cup Series! And one last thing about this 'wheel man' vs. 'wheel holder' debate. Everyone talks about how Jeff Gordon needs to be more assertive behind the scenes. He needs to demand a better crew chief and equipment. Well ok let's pretend that Hendrick is screwing Jeff over and Jeff is letting them. Well don't you think if Jeff was so amazing (and a wheel man and not a wheel holder like Jimmie) then don't you think he could have ONE better season than Jimmie. He's current 0/12 513. 12345Dude posted: 08.23.2013 - 2:18 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Even with Hendrick screwing over Jeff and Jeff letting them don't you think that if Jeff was a wheelman and Jimmie was a wheelholder then don't you think Jeff could use his raw talent and better ability to muster up a way to have one better season? Even with him getting screwed over, he's such a better driver. He should, even with all these odds against him he still should find a way to have one better season. He's a wheel man not a wheel holder! /rant over 514. 83andJoe posted: 08.23.2013 - 2:51 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) #505/506: So DSFF is tsundere for Geoff Bodine? 515. 12345Dude posted: 08.23.2013 - 2:58 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I'm not getting my hopes up as a Bills fan. I've been a fan since 2001. I the only season I saw them have more wins than loses was 2004 where they were 9-7. We had a chance at the playoffs all rapped up. It's the last game of the season and were facing the Pittsburgh Steelers. The Steelers where playing their 2nd and 3rd string players as they had nothing to play for. We got KILLED. Also it's almost a none fact that the Bills will be leaving Buffalo in the near future. Probably to Los Angeles. So my question here is does anyone think we have a chance of making the playoffs? I'm not a very smart Football guy. I just like watching the Bills. 516. 12345Dude posted: 08.23.2013 - 2:59 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I think Manuel looks really good. And I think Spiller is a top 3 RB. And I think Fred Jackson is a top 10 RB. Plus I have heard that are D is really good this year. A lot better than last year. 517. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.23.2013 - 6:11 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) On Ryan Braun, am I the only person who reads everything about a med before use? I read the chemistry (since it's easy to read C8-H10-O5-N3), the directions, what it does, what the side effects are, etc. How convenient is it that every athlete in the history of sports who has used PEDs has never read a label. 518. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.23.2013 - 6:25 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Jimmie has repeatedly beat Jeff season wise for a number of reasons. I want to preface by saying I don't think HMS is screwing Jeff over. But if you say nothing, and Jeff hasn't, then you are not gonna get the team upgrades like the others. The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Jeff needs to squeak some more. He is just sitting there while the 24 has become the new 25. The biggest thing is Jeff's career long struggle in the Fall. Even in his glory years, even before the chase this hurt him. It cost him the '96 title and caused him to damn near blow HUGE late season point leads in '95 and '97. Jimmie, on the other hand, does great in the Fall. Even when he has been outraced down the stretch like in '04, '05, and '12 he still racked up wins. And secondly, being a wheelman as opposed ro a wheel holder doesn't automatically equal success. Buddy Baker, Ernie Irvan, Tim Richmond, and Greg Biffle are definitely wheelmen. Combined championship total for them: 0. 519. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.23.2013 - 7:30 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) Boy, I hope Michael McDowell can get some positive coverage this weekend. He's running a "Victory Junction" paint scheme. I've visited there to donate things several times, and that place is incredible complete with a speed limit of 4.5 mph. 520. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.23.2013 - 7:42 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) I need to visit VJC sometime. I've been meaning to. It is only about an hour from where I live. It is just so tough to see sick kids. I need to get over that, go over there, and donate. 521. NicoRosbergFan posted: 08.23.2013 - 8:08 am Rate this comment: (2) (0) "I need to visit VJC sometime. I've been meaning to. It is only about an hour from where I live. It is just so tough to see sick kids. I need to get over that, go over there, and donate. " Says the paramedic whose job includes helping people whose guts are on the ground, a true testament to just how heart-breaking childhood illness is and how beautiful a heart Adam Petty had. 522. The Long Shot posted: 08.23.2013 - 11:44 am Rate this comment: (0) (0) "a true testament to just how heart-breaking childhood illness is" It's the whole innocence factor that makes it so heart-breaking. Another example would be the Sandy Hook tragedy from last December. The reason there was more grief about that shooting than some of the other recent major ones (Columbine, Virginia Tech, Aurora) was simply because that the victims were mainly 5-6 year-old children. That doesn't make the other shootings any less sad, but there's more innocence associated with young children than with high school or college-age students, so it heightens the grief. 523. 83andJoe posted: 08.23.2013 - 12:49 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) > How convenient is it that every athlete in the history of sports who has used PEDs has never read a label. I think XKCD sums up my feelings on the whole "PED" thing nicely. http://xkcd.com/1173/ 524. JG24FanForever posted: 08.23.2013 - 1:07 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Jimmie was beating Jeff. And Jimmie was brand new to the Cup Series!" Jeff was weak from going through a hellish divorce, which he admitted to being his problems that year in his memoirs. "(Yes in 2002 Jeff did finish 1 spot better in the standings. But Jimmie was a rookie. And in your words DSFF from a while back you said that Jimmie had a better year because he lead the standings that year and Jeff didn't)" Gordon had a better year because he dominated the most races, and two of his three wins were the Bristol Night race and the Southern 500. "The biggest thing is Jeff's career long struggle in the Fall. Even in his glory years, even before the chase this hurt him. It cost him the '96 title and caused him to damn near blow HUGE late season point leads in '95 and '97." In 1995 he had 14 consecutive Top 8 finishes leading into the fall Charlotte race, a race where his drive-line broke. Then at Rockingham he was caught on pit-road twice when the caution came out, a race that Nascar threw a caution so Big E could get a lap back! He finished 5th sat Phoenix to virtually lock-up the Championship. At Atlanta he led lap 61 to lock-up the title, then took a break for the rest of the race. He didn't fade in 1995. Mechanical failures and bad-luck have nothing to do with a drivers mental state. In 1996, every conceivable form of bad-luck cost him the title. Remember the two laps he made up in the final race of the year, to lead 59 laps and finish third? It was only close in 1997 because Gordon had a blown engine at Atlanta, and a last place finish, a race that Jarrett won. And he was crashed out of the Bristol Night race while leading, a race also won by DJ. 525. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.23.2013 - 1:31 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) "Jeff was weak from going through a hellish divorce, which he admitted to being his problems that year in his memoirs." The divorce proceedings began in early 2002, so he was most likely having marital problems in 2001 when he won the championship. Unfortunately, Rodney Childers has announced he is leaving MWR and Brian Vickers, who he has known since Vickers was a kid, most likely to be crew chief for Kevin Harvick. I was really hoping he would choose that bond over the increased salary that SHR could offer, but I can't really blame him. 526. cjs3872 posted: 08.23.2013 - 1:47 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NicoRosbergFan (#519), you know that McDowell's effort is probably a start-and-park, so if you see that car at all during the race, it will be either as a result of an incident or him getting lapped before he parks it. And JG24FF, while you mentioned that Gordon came from two laps behind at Atlanta, you forgot to mention WHY he was two laps behind. And the reason for that was that his crew left a wheel loose prior to the start of the race, if I remember right. His team put him behind, and he had to fight his way back into contention. Remember that was before the free pass and wave-around, so he had to earn both laps back. But Terry Labonte finished high enough in that race that it didn't matter what Jeff did, but having younger brother Bobby dominate that race certainly was insurance for Terry that day. In fact, Jeff's team cracked under pressure late that season a lot more than Jeff did. And ill-prepared car at Rockingham and that loose wheel at Atlanta were signs that Jeff's team was coming unraveled at the seams, while Terry's team made no mistakes at all, and that was the difference in Terry winning the title in '96. In fact, I've often wondered if Jeff's late-season fades had more to do with the fact that his team became far more conservative, and for that matter, mistake-prone, than it was the driver. They got far too conservative after the engine failure at the fall race at Charlotte in '95, made key mistakes late in '96 and suffered through a comedy of errors in '97. Remember that Gordon, like Bill Elliott did in 1985, won the Winston Million, and just as Elliott's team did that year, they soon fell apart, but unlike Elliott's team, they hung on to win the title. It makes me wonder if the way Ray Evernham drove his team, which gave them a big advantage on the rest of the field most of the season, actually tired them out mentally and emotionally late in the season, which in turn, caused them to make errors they wouldn't ordinarily make, which was why the team faded late in each season. Maybe it's time to focus at least some of if not most of the blame for Gordon's late-season fades in the 90s on to Ray Evernham, because his style may have just wore his team out, and any time you're tired, you don't think straight, and if you don't think straight, you often make mistakes you don't usually make. 527. murb posted: 08.23.2013 - 1:52 pm Rate this comment: (1) (0) Have fun getting yelled at by Harvick, Childers. If I was him, I would much rather work for Vickers and also work at MWR. SHR is a mess right now, and probably will be next year too (especially if they expand again). 528. NoLongerAnonymous posted: 08.23.2013 - 2:17 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) I know it's just practice (yes, Allen, we're talking about practice) but Front Row Motorsports appears to have something figured out this weekend. David Ragan was the fastest in practice, while Jose Wise was 14th and David Gilliland was 17th. Casey Mears was also pretty fast with the 10th fastest time (he won pole for this event last year and led a substantial amount of laps early on) and Landon Cassill was 15th in Circle Sport's 2nd car. Meanwhile, Danica Patrick was 39th, behind even Mike Bliss. 529. cjs3872 posted: 08.23.2013 - 2:26 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) NLA, if I remember right, David Gilliland was very competitive in the spring race at Bristol. With that in mind, combined with how well David Ragan ran there with Roush (including a win in a Nationwide Series race there some years back), it shouldn't really be a surprise that Front Row's doing well so far this weekend, because they do seem to have something figured out about that track. And if it does rain, that would put Ragan on the pole the same way that Casey Mears got there in this race last year. And Mears was able to stay up there longer than anyone could have imagined, myself included. Mears led the first 26 laps of last year's night race at Bristol from the pole he got when qualifying was cancelled because he was the fastest in practice. 530. Chives5150 posted: 08.23.2013 - 2:36 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) That bumper music is really getting on my nerves now. 531. David posted: 08.23.2013 - 2:46 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Speaking of football, I saw a poster yesterday with these words on it: "People who switch to Geico sure are happy." "How happy Jimmy?" "Happier than a defense that knows they're facing Tony Romo." I thought of DSFF when I saw that, haha. 532. DaleSrFanForever posted: 08.23.2013 - 5:08 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) You can spin it any way you want, but a 20+ year career doesn't lie. With the exception of '98 Jeff neger maintained the pace in the Fall he does during the season. No matter who the crew chief, who the pit crew, who the wife, etc, the leaves turn colors and Jeff cools off comparatively. 533. Ched Little posted: 08.23.2013 - 5:25 pm Rate this comment: (2) (0) Can ya' cut the Gordon-Johnson shit? Wheelman, wheel holder, who gives a damn what they are? Enjoy the race! 534. Baker posted: 08.23.2013 - 10:18 pm Rate this comment: (0) (0) Bills fans are funny. I'm sorry, but my lowly Browns will turn it around before the Bills. 535. Mile501 posted: 06.30.2020 - 6:57 am Rate this comment: (1) (0) This is the only Cup Series race run at Michigan on August 18 that was not won by Dale Jarrett. All 4 such races were won by Ford, however. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ *Post a comment:* Your comment may not appear immediately - all comments must be approved by the moderator. Name: Comment: